I agree. And UT caused all of that. Sooner they're gone the better, IMO. Deal with what's left after that.Aberzombie1892 said:It's unclear that they knew it was coming, however, even if they suspected as much, what could have been done? The remaining Big 12 programs were going to take a hit without UT and OU and there was nothing that could have been done to prevent that since no big name programs were coming to the Big 12 after the loss of Texas A&M and Nebraska.PartyBear said:
The Baylor administrations should have known this was coming by around the mid 20s at the latest since 2010. Hopefully we have been working on things over the past 11 years regarding weathering this.
Personally, I believe that the Big 12 was on borrowed time after (1) it lost 2 of the most valuable programs in all of college football - Texas A&M and Nebraska - and (2) it's already limited footprint lost the states of Colorado, Nebraska, and Missouri while also losing complete control of Texas. There had been some hope that UT and OU would have accepted lower payouts in exchange to an easier path, however, with the passing of the NIL rules and the new SEC deal it became much more difficult to stay with the current Big 12. At the end of the day, it is what it is.
Baylor AD Mack Rhoades comments on Texas
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Last: 2 yr ago by historian
A bit disappointed in Mack. Though I think he's weird, I have also been a supporter of his. Huge upgrade from our previous ADs. But 3 points:
1. If he didn't see this coming he was very naive. It was almost a certainty once the playoff was moved to 12 teams instead of 8. Big12 presidents who supported it going to 12, helped UT.
2. His priority should be Baylor. Alliances may serve a purpose, but if he can save Baylor, he needs to do it and fast.
3. Though I understand his comments were meant to move the legislature, ultimately they hurt Baylor recruiting now!
1. If he didn't see this coming he was very naive. It was almost a certainty once the playoff was moved to 12 teams instead of 8. Big12 presidents who supported it going to 12, helped UT.
2. His priority should be Baylor. Alliances may serve a purpose, but if he can save Baylor, he needs to do it and fast.
3. Though I understand his comments were meant to move the legislature, ultimately they hurt Baylor recruiting now!
Actually, THAT is the crux of the entire batch of issues with BU. There's too much of a small faction that really cares about Baylor and it's future and EVERYONE is aware, especially those in or who have power.. Every stat that has been put in print, twitter, Media has stressed that in some way. It's an uphill battle regardless of how you address it. It really doesn't matter if it's publicly addressed or not. It's no secret.Ewalker80 said:Ya I could tell the concern was very real. I guess I just questioned how it helps anything to express it publicly. Shouldn't he be the chief cheerleader arguing that we can get through this somehow and still be viable? What's the point of complaining to those powerless mostly incompetent board members that mostly (with some exceptions) don't have the slightest concern whether Baylor falls off the face of the earth?Aberzombie1892 said:It's glum because he's been through the process and he's right. Many lenders will likely want to wait and see what the next media deal looks like before lending significant amounts of money to the remaining Big 12 teams.Ewalker80 said:
Mack expressed serious concerns they can't borrow money for the basketball stadium without guaranteed P5 status. Also said he thought the coaches would leave. Dang that was depressing to hear. I'm not sure if he was saying it for persuasive value because it's not clear to me what the legislature is going to do to help anything at this point.
When questioned later on basketball funding he said that the lenders haven't contacted him yet, so he was really just speculating, but why so glum?
The more this unfolds and comes to light I'm more convinced she had prior "heads up" on everything. Hence, LSU WBB coach left, Kim was "contacted" and the expediency of how all was handled with her and LSU. Parties (SEC), wHorns, OU were cognizant,,, all but Rhoades and company.BUGWBBear said:Aliceinbubbleland said:So much for the debate about on campus or not lolgobears20 said:Baylor AD Mack Rhoades said the events of the last two weeks puts into question whether they'll have the ability to pursue new capital projects (like the new $125 million basketball arena Baylor is planning).
— Sam Khan Jr. (@skhanjr) August 2, 2021
Running off Kim was all in vain.
If you believe this then Kim was lying in her public statements about why she left and also hid the information from Baylor and Mack. I'm not aware of any reason not to take her at face value. Kim may have some faults but being afraid to speak the truth about how she is feeling is not one I have ever seen.BBWCBear said:The more this unfolds and comes to light I'm more convinced she had prior "heads up" on everything. Hence, LSU WBB coach left, Kim was "contacted" and the expediency of how all was handled with her and LSU. Parties (SEC), wHorns, OU were cognizant,,, all but Rhoades and company.BUGWBBear said:Aliceinbubbleland said:So much for the debate about on campus or not lolgobears20 said:Baylor AD Mack Rhoades said the events of the last two weeks puts into question whether they'll have the ability to pursue new capital projects (like the new $125 million basketball arena Baylor is planning).
— Sam Khan Jr. (@skhanjr) August 2, 2021
Running off Kim was all in vain.
Besides, even if she was tipped off about this she would have known she would likely be in big 12 for a few more years. Further, Big 12 is not a top tier conference in women's basketball --- Kim's success in recruiting was based on her 3 rings, the force of her personality, and baylor's investment in women's basketball. If Kim, who isn't prone to self-doubt, had wanted to stay, she would have had no fear that she couldn't continue to compete for championships.
I'm aware of absolutely no evidence supporting this theory and much to the contrary.
In my opinion, if Kim had known she likely would have shared it with Drew. Does anyone think that Drew knew?
I believe in Mulkey. Whatever she says, I take at face value. I was stunned when LSU ponied up the money to sign her up. LSU academic facilities are practically second world at best. Roofs leak, windows are broken and not replaced, books in the Library are stale and the school is basically bankrupt, somewhat akin to OU.
If they had any idea they were going to get even more funds from ESPN that could explain why they reached to the moon to hire her but I seriously disbelieve she cared one way or the other. She was ready to go home and the decision to move the new basketball facility probably paid some roll in her decision.
If they had any idea they were going to get even more funds from ESPN that could explain why they reached to the moon to hire her but I seriously disbelieve she cared one way or the other. She was ready to go home and the decision to move the new basketball facility probably paid some roll in her decision.
Barf
"When you take a job at The University of Texas, you are everybody's biggest game."#Texas HC Steve Sarkisian
— CJ Vogel (@CJVogel_TFB) August 5, 2021
Well that didn't take long to drink the Ewe T Kool-aid!
Well, what would you expect the guy to say....He barely finished with 2 winning seasons over his short coaching career. Texas paying him $5.2m per year.......It's great to be mediocre...
I don't believe he lasts with UT before they jump to SEC.....Hmnn..wonder If i can wager on that in Vegas..
I don't believe he lasts with UT before they jump to SEC.....Hmnn..wonder If i can wager on that in Vegas..
I do. I think they all knew. Drew knows you can win a Men's BB championship as a Mid-Major. Not so much in WBB. In the history of the tournament a non-power 5 school not named Connecticut has only won twice. LA Tech in 1982 and ODU in 1985. Partly that's about who has money to spend on WBB.Quote:
Does anyone think that Drew knew?
What I meant earlier is that both of Baylor's administrations (Baylor as an institution) knew or should have known since around 2010 this was highly probable by 2025 at the latest and that neither Texas nor OU would take us with them and we should have been cultivating relationships over the past 11 years to help our landing. Perhaps we have been though.
The truly surprised parties would probably be Tech and OSU (OSU especially) who both had reason to believe based on the situation in 2010 that they were packaged with Texas and OU respectively.
I did not mean Baylor should have somehow figured out that Texas and OU were specifically talking to the SEC over the past few months.
The truly surprised parties would probably be Tech and OSU (OSU especially) who both had reason to believe based on the situation in 2010 that they were packaged with Texas and OU respectively.
I did not mean Baylor should have somehow figured out that Texas and OU were specifically talking to the SEC over the past few months.
The issue is that there was nothing that seriously could have been done to have placed Baylor in a better position in the event that the power conferences ever consolidated their media value.PartyBear said:
What I meant earlier is that both of Baylor's administrations (Baylor as an institution) knew or should have known since around 2010 this was highly probable by 2025 at the latest and that neither Texas nor OU would take us with them and we should have been cultivating relationships over the past 11 years to help our landing. Perhaps we have been though.
The truly surprised parties would probably be Tech and OSU (OSU especially) who both had reason to believe based on the situation in 2010 that they were packaged with Texas and OU respectively.
I did not mean Baylor should have somehow figured out that Texas and OU were specifically talking to the SEC over the past few months.
Regardless of the consolidation of media value issue, the creation NIL rights framework and the large SEC/B1G media deals combined with the Big 12 media partners declining to talk to the conference earlier this year were all factors and none of them were truly predictable a decade ago. While it's true that it was predictable that no major P5 conference was going to join the Big 12 after Texas A&M and Nebraska left, it was not known that Texas and Oklahoma would abandon the conference since they had reasonable payouts and an easier path to the post season in the Big 12 versus the SEC.
I think they showed they had intention to leave in 2010 even though they ( or Texas) decided at the last minute remaining the the XII was more in their interest at that time. Also with Texas and OU leading the effort in refusing to even talk to inquirer such as Clemson and FSU about joining a couple of years later, it was clear then the intent was to keep the conference in a state such that it would be easier to kill when they decided to bolt.
The SEC just drew the Old Maid when they accepted Texas into the fold.
Texas was barely above average in the Big 12 post Brown. I can't see them being much better in the SEC unless they happen to draw some favorable scheduling.
Too bad they don't play a round robin in the SEC. That's the only way we'd know who was the SEC best.
ESPN's next move will probably be to demand schools only play P5 (P4?) non conference.
Too bad they don't play a round robin in the SEC. That's the only way we'd know who was the SEC best.
ESPN's next move will probably be to demand schools only play P5 (P4?) non conference.
CKM knew - guaranteed. Lots of people inside SEC and BigXII college athletics did - period. And, it was a factor in her decision.Aliceinbubbleland said:
I believe in Mulkey. Whatever she says, I take at face value. I was stunned when LSU ponied up the money to sign her up. LSU academic facilities are practically second world at best. Roofs leak, windows are broken and not replaced, books in the Library are stale and the school is basically bankrupt, somewhat akin to OU.
If they had any idea they were going to get even more funds from ESPN that could explain why they reached to the moon to hire her but I seriously disbelieve she cared one way or the other. She was ready to go home and the decision to move the new basketball facility probably paid some roll in her decision.
Like almost every single thing in business, when its put in the press that's the very last step in the process. The only people who are hearing it for the first time at that point are the ones who are outside of the business'.......the public.
The Big 12 staying together back then was a result of several things - (1) the creation of the longhorn network, (2) the Big 12 being overpaid for its first and second tier media rights, (3) the media partner's desire to maintain a power conference in the center part of the US, and (4) the perceived easier path for OU and UT to win a Power conference.PartyBear said:
I think they showed they had intention to leave in 2010 even though they ( or Texas) decided at the last minute remaining the the XII was more in their interest at that time. Also with Texas and OU leading the effort in refusing to even talk to inquirer such as Clemson and FSU about joining a couple of years later, it was clear then the intent was to keep the conference in a state such that it would be easier to kill when they decided to bolt.
It's unclear if FSU and Clemson were seriously on the table, and, if they were, it's unclear what prevented them from making the jump other than the ACC's 20 year GOR media deal that came about in 2016.
There is no way the additions of EweT and ZeroU were well known. It would have leaked months before the Chronicle spilled the rumor. Absolutely no one other than ESPN, EweT President and AD and ZeroU President and AD and Stankey talked about this, for months, before anyone knew.
It is possible Kim was informed but I doubt her AD even knew at the time. The raid on the Big 12 was handled very professionally compared to the plan breakup when aggy fled.
Either way, your thoughts or mine, Kim is a Champ and she knows how to win in negotiations. I wish her nothing but the best in her future.
It is possible Kim was informed but I doubt her AD even knew at the time. The raid on the Big 12 was handled very professionally compared to the plan breakup when aggy fled.
Either way, your thoughts or mine, Kim is a Champ and she knows how to win in negotiations. I wish her nothing but the best in her future.
— RedditCFB (@RedditCFB) August 7, 2021
So do you think we will lose our coaches?PartyBear said:
What I meant earlier is that both of Baylor's administrations (Baylor as an institution) knew or should have known since around 2010 this was highly probable by 2025 at the latest and that neither Texas nor OU would take us with them and we should have been cultivating relationships over the past 11 years to help our landing. Perhaps we have been though.
The truly surprised parties would probably be Tech and OSU (OSU especially) who both had reason to believe based on the situation in 2010 that they were packaged with Texas and OU respectively.
I did not mean Baylor should have somehow figured out that Texas and OU were specifically talking to the SEC over the past few months.
It's possible, and, if it happens, it likely won't happen until 2025 or 2026. It really hinges on (1) where Baylor ends up, (2) the next media deal Baylor will be subject to, (3) the quality of the membership of the post 2025 conference that Baylor ends up in, and (4) Baylor's institutional priorities in light of (1), (2), and (3).Wichitabear said:So do you think we will lose our coaches?PartyBear said:
What I meant earlier is that both of Baylor's administrations (Baylor as an institution) knew or should have known since around 2010 this was highly probable by 2025 at the latest and that neither Texas nor OU would take us with them and we should have been cultivating relationships over the past 11 years to help our landing. Perhaps we have been though.
The truly surprised parties would probably be Tech and OSU (OSU especially) who both had reason to believe based on the situation in 2010 that they were packaged with Texas and OU respectively.
I did not mean Baylor should have somehow figured out that Texas and OU were specifically talking to the SEC over the past few months.
I am so praying that it works out for us to keep our coaches. This would be devastating.Aberzombie1892 said:It's possible, and, if it happens, it likely won't happen until 2025 or 2026. It really hinges on (1) where Baylor ends up, (2) the next media deal Baylor will be subject to, (3) the quality of the membership of the post 2025 conference that Baylor ends up in, and (4) Baylor's institutional priorities in light of (1), (2), and (3).Wichitabear said:So do you think we will lose our coaches?PartyBear said:
What I meant earlier is that both of Baylor's administrations (Baylor as an institution) knew or should have known since around 2010 this was highly probable by 2025 at the latest and that neither Texas nor OU would take us with them and we should have been cultivating relationships over the past 11 years to help our landing. Perhaps we have been though.
The truly surprised parties would probably be Tech and OSU (OSU especially) who both had reason to believe based on the situation in 2010 that they were packaged with Texas and OU respectively.
I did not mean Baylor should have somehow figured out that Texas and OU were specifically talking to the SEC over the past few months.
Cincinnati has managed to pay their HC about 3.5 million and fight off at least one P5 from stealing him. Should we end up in a G5 situation income wise. I'm sure we could figure out how to budget for things like that just as Cincinnati has. I would also guess (but I do not know for certain) Cincinnati is not the only G5 that pays about P5 levels to their HCs.
Aliceinbubbleland said:
Texas was barely above average in the Big 12 post Brown. I can't see them being much better in the SEC unless they happen to draw some favorable scheduling.
Too bad they don't play a round robin in the SEC. That's the only way we'd know who was the SEC best.
ESPN's next move will probably be to demand schools only play P5 (P4?) non conference.
Nog going to happen. Too many of them like playing cupcakes: 1 in September & 1 in November. Aggies have done it every year since going over to the dark side. Bama has done it every year too, as have the Mississippi schools & others.
In that situation, you just have to prioritize your programs. We'd pay our football coach and pony up to keep Drew, but that would probably mean reassessing the budget for our other sports and "streamlining" where needed.PartyBear said:
Cincinnati has managed to pay their HC about 3.5 million and fight off at least one P5 from stealing him. Should we end up in a G5 situation income wise. I'm sure we could figure out how to budget for things like that just as Cincinnati has. I would also guess (but I do not know for certain) Cincinnati is not the only G5 that pays about P5 levels to their HCs.
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