Will Dallas step up?

5,788 Views | 130 Replies | Last: 4 yr ago by curtpenn
Osodecentx
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Dallas ISD preparing to ask voters for largest school district bond in state history

District officials are considering a range of $2.7 billion to $3.7 billion for the next bond package, expected to be sent to voters in November.
RD2WINAGNBEAR86
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Osodecentx said:

Dallas ISD preparing to ask voters for largest school district bond in state history

District officials are considering a range of $2.7 billion to $3.7 billion for the next bond package, expected to be sent to voters in November.


"It's all for the kids" elections rarely fail. Old folks can vote "Yes" and don't have to worry about their tax burden going up.
"Never underestimate Joe's ability to **** things up!"

-- Barack Obama
Osodecentx
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$3.7 billion?

Let's see
Bearitto
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They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
contrario
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Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
quash
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contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.
Osodecentx
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quash said:

contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.
I like the idea, but won't that give us X numbers of new administrators?
contrario
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quash said:

contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.
I don't live in Dallas, so i don't know the details, but what were the characteristics of the schools closing? Were they older schools that it didn't make sense to renovate? Were they in areas that didn't need the schools? I need context to draw a conclusion from "they were closing schools a few years ago." There is likely good reasons those schools were closed and new ones need to be built, one of which might be the immobility of real estate.
quash
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Osodecentx said:

quash said:

contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.
I like the idea, but won't that give us X numbers of new administrators?

quash
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Osodecentx said:

quash said:

contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.
I like the idea, but won't that give us X numbers of new administrators?
Smaller districts can serve more students with less administrators. Large districts put a layer of Asst Admin in between faculty and top administrator.
curtpenn
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quash said:

Osodecentx said:

quash said:

contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.
I like the idea, but won't that give us X numbers of new administrators?
Smaller districts can serve more students with less administrators. Large districts put a layer of Asst Admin in between faculty and top administrator.
Fun fact: Fewer than 50% of DISD staff are teachers.

https://docs.google.com/viewerng/viewer?url=https://www.dallasisd.org//cms/lib/TX01001475/Centricity/Domain/17649/2018-2019_facts_sheet_final.pdf
quash
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contrario said:

quash said:

contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.
I don't live in Dallas, so i don't know the details, but what were the characteristics of the schools closing? Were they older schools that it didn't make sense to renovate? Were they in areas that didn't need the schools? I need context to draw a conclusion from "they were closing schools a few years ago." There is likely good reasons those schools were closed and new ones need to be built, one of which might be the immobility of real estate.
Students at lower performing schools are allowed to transfer without regard to the usual restraints. Several lower performing schools lost a big chunk of their student population and DISD eventually moved to close those schools. In those particular situations there wasn't a shift in where students lived, just in where they were transferred. And those transfers still need bus routes that get them to their chosen schools. Those kind of headaches are why it is better to try and improve the school. How to do that? If I knew I'd sell it and get rich.
Redbrickbear
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Most large city ISD's don't have a funding problem....they have a spending problem & and a student/parent problem.
J.R.
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As life long Dallas native, Dallas's govt/schools don't do a lot right.
BaylorFTW
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quash said:

contrario said:

quash said:

contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.
I don't live in Dallas, so i don't know the details, but what were the characteristics of the schools closing? Were they older schools that it didn't make sense to renovate? Were they in areas that didn't need the schools? I need context to draw a conclusion from "they were closing schools a few years ago." There is likely good reasons those schools were closed and new ones need to be built, one of which might be the immobility of real estate.
Students at lower performing schools are allowed to transfer without regard to the usual restraints. Several lower performing schools lost a big chunk of their student population and DISD eventually moved to close those schools. In those particular situations there wasn't a shift in where students lived, just in where they were transferred. And those transfers still need bus routes that get them to their chosen schools. Those kind of headaches are why it is better to try and improve the school. How to do that? If I knew I'd sell it and get rich.
This is consistent from what I remember growing up in DISD. I had friends who did just this. Of course, that results in a brain drain where the schools they leave behind are hurt more. Plus, we had the TAG (talented and gifted) schools which took even more kids away from these other schools.

And on the flip side it was hard to get good teachers to want to go to those other schools. They would even pay them more but the environments were often not conducive to learning. There were many liberal white women who had dreams of becoming the next Michelle Pfieffer in Dangerous Games only to run up against the reality of classrooms where some students would not tolerate being taught by a white woman. In addition, there is an issue where teachers are forced to deal with disruptive kids and violent children as the administration does not help them. The result is many of those do gooder liberal white women end up taking the first chance they can to teach in the suburbs or elsewhere for less pay.

So you have a few different issues going on. You have a racial bias/prejudice problem. You have a disruptive student problem. And you sometimes have a money problem. Ideally, you could mitigate the racial problem somewhat by getting more POC teachers but there just aren't enough and a number of them aren't even interested in teaching in those schools. Usually good schools happen in part because the community of parents ensure the school is not neglected as they want their kids to have the best. But the problem here is the active parents who could mobilize the school in this way see it as easier to just send their kids to another school. And they are right. So I don't see anything changing unless they change those rules on transfers which they won't likely do because it receives a lot of blowback from those same parents.

Also, my two predictions on such a bond are:
1. It will be approved because of the demographics and voting patterns in Dallas
2. It will largely be wasted and not have the impact they would hope.


Canada2017
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Voters get to decide but only property owners get to pay .
D. C. Bear
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quash said:

contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.


One might expect many smaller districts to have more administrators than one larger one.
RD2WINAGNBEAR86
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Canada2017 said:

Voters get to decide but only property owners get to pay .
Exactly. Renters have no skin in the game and old folks have their taxes capped. Does not quite seem fair to the majority of homeowners that pay taxes under the age of 65. This is not just a Dallas problem. It occurs in the whole state of Texas.
"Never underestimate Joe's ability to **** things up!"

-- Barack Obama
RD2WINAGNBEAR86
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Yes, Texas is praised and considered desirable because of no state income tax. But property taxes in our state are absolutely HORRIBLE! Not quite Illinois level horrible, but we are getting there quickly.
"Never underestimate Joe's ability to **** things up!"

-- Barack Obama
Canada2017
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RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

Canada2017 said:

Voters get to decide but only property owners get to pay .
Exactly. Renters have no skin in the game and old folks have their taxes capped. Does not quite seem fair to the majority of homeowners that pay taxes under the age of 65. This is not just a Dallas problem. It occurs in the whole state of Texas.


In 25 years of owning investing property ...only on this message board have I ever heard the ludicrous theory that tenants pay property taxes through their rent.

Well I spend money on the products from dozens of corporations ....such spending doesn't entitle me to vote on their corporate boards .
quash
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D. C. Bear said:

quash said:

contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.


One might expect many smaller districts to have more administrators than one larger one.
Depends on how small you make them. Twenty new districts means twenty new superintendents and asst sup. But four means 3 more super and 3 more asst supers. But they can handle a district one fourth the size of Dallas. What you don't have is a dozen or more between the asst sup and the classroom.
quash
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Canada2017 said:

RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

Canada2017 said:

Voters get to decide but only property owners get to pay .
Exactly. Renters have no skin in the game and old folks have their taxes capped. Does not quite seem fair to the majority of homeowners that pay taxes under the age of 65. This is not just a Dallas problem. It occurs in the whole state of Texas.


In 25 years of owning investing property ...only on this message board have I ever heard the ludicrous theory that tenants pay property taxes through their rent.

Well I spend money on the products from dozens of corporations ....such spending doesn't entitle me to vote on their corporate boards .
LOL. Renters pay taxes through their rent. Any landlord that fails to collect what he pays in taxes will be out of business.
Canada2017
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quash said:

Canada2017 said:

RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

Canada2017 said:

Voters get to decide but only property owners get to pay .
Exactly. Renters have no skin in the game and old folks have their taxes capped. Does not quite seem fair to the majority of homeowners that pay taxes under the age of 65. This is not just a Dallas problem. It occurs in the whole state of Texas.


In 25 years of owning investing property ...only on this message board have I ever heard the ludicrous theory that tenants pay property taxes through their rent.

Well I spend money on the products from dozens of corporations ....such spending doesn't entitle me to vote on their corporate boards .
LOL. Renters pay taxes through their rent. Any landlord that fails to collect what he pays in taxes will be out of business.



You are the only renter I've ever heard this from .

By your rationale I should have a vote on the board of Ford Motors since I spent my money on one of their F-150's.

Ridiculous.



D. C. Bear
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Canada2017 said:

quash said:

Canada2017 said:

RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

Canada2017 said:

Voters get to decide but only property owners get to pay .
Exactly. Renters have no skin in the game and old folks have their taxes capped. Does not quite seem fair to the majority of homeowners that pay taxes under the age of 65. This is not just a Dallas problem. It occurs in the whole state of Texas.


In 25 years of owning investing property ...only on this message board have I ever heard the ludicrous theory that tenants pay property taxes through their rent.

Well I spend money on the products from dozens of corporations ....such spending doesn't entitle me to vote on their corporate boards .
LOL. Renters pay taxes through their rent. Any landlord that fails to collect what he pays in taxes will be out of business.



You are the only renter I've ever heard this from .

By your rationale I should have a vote on the board of Ford Motors since I spent my money on one of their F-150's.

Ridiculous.






As a landlord, where do you get the money to pay property taxes?
curtpenn
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BaylorFTW said:

quash said:

contrario said:

quash said:

contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.
I don't live in Dallas, so i don't know the details, but what were the characteristics of the schools closing? Were they older schools that it didn't make sense to renovate? Were they in areas that didn't need the schools? I need context to draw a conclusion from "they were closing schools a few years ago." There is likely good reasons those schools were closed and new ones need to be built, one of which might be the immobility of real estate.
Students at lower performing schools are allowed to transfer without regard to the usual restraints. Several lower performing schools lost a big chunk of their student population and DISD eventually moved to close those schools. In those particular situations there wasn't a shift in where students lived, just in where they were transferred. And those transfers still need bus routes that get them to their chosen schools. Those kind of headaches are why it is better to try and improve the school. How to do that? If I knew I'd sell it and get rich.
This is consistent from what I remember growing up in DISD. I had friends who did just this. Of course, that results in a brain drain where the schools they leave behind are hurt more. Plus, we had the TAG (talented and gifted) schools which took even more kids away from these other schools.

And on the flip side it was hard to get good teachers to want to go to those other schools. They would even pay them more but the environments were often not conducive to learning. There were many liberal white women who had dreams of becoming the next Michelle Pfieffer in Dangerous Games only to run up against the reality of classrooms where some students would not tolerate being taught by a white woman. In addition, there is an issue where teachers are forced to deal with disruptive kids and violent children as the administration does not help them. The result is many of those do gooder liberal white women end up taking the first chance they can to teach in the suburbs or elsewhere for less pay.

So you have a few different issues going on. You have a racial bias/prejudice problem. You have a disruptive student problem. And you sometimes have a money problem. Ideally, you could mitigate the racial problem somewhat by getting more POC teachers but there just aren't enough and a number of them aren't even interested in teaching in those schools. Usually good schools happen in part because the community of parents ensure the school is not neglected as they want their kids to have the best. But the problem here is the active parents who could mobilize the school in this way see it as easier to just send their kids to another school. And they are right. So I don't see anything changing unless they change those rules on transfers which they won't likely do because it receives a lot of blowback from those same parents.

Also, my two predictions on such a bond are:
1. It will be approved because of the demographics and voting patterns in Dallas
2. It will largely be wasted and not have the impact they would hope.



We've lived in DISD (East Dallas) since '84. Started a family in '89. Our 2 kids went to private schools PreK -12th. DISD was never even a real consideration. And that's really sad; my mother is a retired teacher from San Antonio ISD and my wife and I both grew up in public schools. It always angered me that our property taxes went up so much and so often all these years, yet we paid private school tuition on top of that. We've always voted against every school bond, consequently. Had there been some relief during our tuition paying years, I might be more supportive of public schools. As it is, DISD spends over $13,000 per year per student. I think they need to learn to manage more efficiently.

Somewhat off topic: we've protested property taxes at least 10-12 times over the last 25 years or so. Don't always win, but we've managed to keep our taxes lower than most of our neighbors. The cumulative impact is significant over time. I turn 65 next month and am determined to keep costs down once able to retire. The sad truth is our insurance and property tax payments will actually exceed our original total initial mortgage payment. A lot of you youngsters need to really think about that. I encourage everyone to protest their taxes often.
Canada2017
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D. C. Bear said:

Canada2017 said:

quash said:

Canada2017 said:

RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

Canada2017 said:

Voters get to decide but only property owners get to pay .
Exactly. Renters have no skin in the game and old folks have their taxes capped. Does not quite seem fair to the majority of homeowners that pay taxes under the age of 65. This is not just a Dallas problem. It occurs in the whole state of Texas.


In 25 years of owning investing property ...only on this message board have I ever heard the ludicrous theory that tenants pay property taxes through their rent.

Well I spend money on the products from dozens of corporations ....such spending doesn't entitle me to vote on their corporate boards .
LOL. Renters pay taxes through their rent. Any landlord that fails to collect what he pays in taxes will be out of business.



You are the only renter I've ever heard this from .

By your rationale I should have a vote on the board of Ford Motors since I spent my money on one of their F-150's.

Ridiculous.






As a landlord, where do you get the money to pay property taxes?


Since Ford uses my cash to pay their corporate loans....do I get to vote on their board ?
fadskier
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curtpenn said:

quash said:

Osodecentx said:

quash said:

contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.
I like the idea, but won't that give us X numbers of new administrators?
Smaller districts can serve more students with less administrators. Large districts put a layer of Asst Admin in between faculty and top administrator.
Fun fact: Fewer than 50% of DISD staff are teachers.

https://docs.google.com/viewerng/viewer?url=https://www.dallasisd.org//cms/lib/TX01001475/Centricity/Domain/17649/2018-2019_facts_sheet_final.pdf
That would make sense. Other people then just teachers are required for schools to run effectively.
fadskier
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Canada2017 said:

quash said:

Canada2017 said:

RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

Canada2017 said:

Voters get to decide but only property owners get to pay .
Exactly. Renters have no skin in the game and old folks have their taxes capped. Does not quite seem fair to the majority of homeowners that pay taxes under the age of 65. This is not just a Dallas problem. It occurs in the whole state of Texas.


In 25 years of owning investing property ...only on this message board have I ever heard the ludicrous theory that tenants pay property taxes through their rent.

Well I spend money on the products from dozens of corporations ....such spending doesn't entitle me to vote on their corporate boards .
LOL. Renters pay taxes through their rent. Any landlord that fails to collect what he pays in taxes will be out of business.



You are the only renter I've ever heard this from .

By your rationale I should have a vote on the board of Ford Motors since I spent my money on one of their F-150's.

Ridiculous.




Renters do pay property taxes via rent.

When I was a landlord, if my taxes went up, so did rent.
D. C. Bear
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Canada2017 said:

D. C. Bear said:

Canada2017 said:

quash said:

Canada2017 said:

RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

Canada2017 said:

Voters get to decide but only property owners get to pay .
Exactly. Renters have no skin in the game and old folks have their taxes capped. Does not quite seem fair to the majority of homeowners that pay taxes under the age of 65. This is not just a Dallas problem. It occurs in the whole state of Texas.


In 25 years of owning investing property ...only on this message board have I ever heard the ludicrous theory that tenants pay property taxes through their rent.

Well I spend money on the products from dozens of corporations ....such spending doesn't entitle me to vote on their corporate boards .
LOL. Renters pay taxes through their rent. Any landlord that fails to collect what he pays in taxes will be out of business.



You are the only renter I've ever heard this from .

By your rationale I should have a vote on the board of Ford Motors since I spent my money on one of their F-150's.

Ridiculous.






As a landlord, where do you get the money to pay property taxes?


Since Ford uses my cash to pay their corporate loans....do I get to vote on their board ?


No. Now answer the question. Where do you, as a landlord, get the money to pay property taxes?
curtpenn
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Obviously more than just teachers are necessary, but more than half? Ridiculous. Perfect example of bloated bureaucracy. Nothing spends like someone else's money.
BaylorFTW
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curtpenn said:

BaylorFTW said:

quash said:

contrario said:

quash said:

contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.
I don't live in Dallas, so i don't know the details, but what were the characteristics of the schools closing? Were they older schools that it didn't make sense to renovate? Were they in areas that didn't need the schools? I need context to draw a conclusion from "they were closing schools a few years ago." There is likely good reasons those schools were closed and new ones need to be built, one of which might be the immobility of real estate.
Students at lower performing schools are allowed to transfer without regard to the usual restraints. Several lower performing schools lost a big chunk of their student population and DISD eventually moved to close those schools. In those particular situations there wasn't a shift in where students lived, just in where they were transferred. And those transfers still need bus routes that get them to their chosen schools. Those kind of headaches are why it is better to try and improve the school. How to do that? If I knew I'd sell it and get rich.
This is consistent from what I remember growing up in DISD. I had friends who did just this. Of course, that results in a brain drain where the schools they leave behind are hurt more. Plus, we had the TAG (talented and gifted) schools which took even more kids away from these other schools.

And on the flip side it was hard to get good teachers to want to go to those other schools. They would even pay them more but the environments were often not conducive to learning. There were many liberal white women who had dreams of becoming the next Michelle Pfieffer in Dangerous Games only to run up against the reality of classrooms where some students would not tolerate being taught by a white woman. In addition, there is an issue where teachers are forced to deal with disruptive kids and violent children as the administration does not help them. The result is many of those do gooder liberal white women end up taking the first chance they can to teach in the suburbs or elsewhere for less pay.

So you have a few different issues going on. You have a racial bias/prejudice problem. You have a disruptive student problem. And you sometimes have a money problem. Ideally, you could mitigate the racial problem somewhat by getting more POC teachers but there just aren't enough and a number of them aren't even interested in teaching in those schools. Usually good schools happen in part because the community of parents ensure the school is not neglected as they want their kids to have the best. But the problem here is the active parents who could mobilize the school in this way see it as easier to just send their kids to another school. And they are right. So I don't see anything changing unless they change those rules on transfers which they won't likely do because it receives a lot of blowback from those same parents.

Also, my two predictions on such a bond are:
1. It will be approved because of the demographics and voting patterns in Dallas
2. It will largely be wasted and not have the impact they would hope.



We've lived in DISD (East Dallas) since '84. Started a family in '89. Our 2 kids went to private schools PreK -12th. DISD was never even a real consideration. And that's really sad; my mother is a retired teacher from San Antonio ISD and my wife and I both grew up in public schools. It always angered me that our property taxes went up so much and so often all these years, yet we paid private school tuition on top of that. We've always voted against every school bond, consequently. Had there been some relief during our tuition paying years, I might be more supportive of public schools. As it is, DISD spends over $13,000 per year per student. I think they need to learn to manage more efficiently.

Somewhat off topic: we've protested property taxes at least 10-12 times over the last 25 years or so. Don't always win, but we've managed to keep our taxes lower than most of our neighbors. The cumulative impact is significant over time. I turn 65 next month and am determined to keep costs down once able to retire. The sad truth is our insurance and property tax payments will actually exceed our original total initial mortgage payment. A lot of you youngsters need to really think about that. I encourage everyone to protest their taxes often.
You are not the only one. A lot of people feel the same way. You have this weird thing going on where the schools don't reflect the neighborhood demographics. For example, Woodrow Wilson is now 66% hispanic while East Dallas is 65.8% white. And it is that way in the school I grew up in as well. When I went to school in the 90s, you could still get a good education if you were in the honors classes and the diversity was something like 1/3 1/3 1/3 between black/white/hispanic. It was also a good school to go to if you wanted to play multiple sports something you couldn't really do if went to say Plano ISD. The level of education wouldn't be near as good as you would get at say St. Marks but as far as I could tell was similar to other private schools in the area in the honors classes. But nowadays, I doubt this is still the case. DISD has received a greater influx of Hispanic and other immigrant children in recent times. This means they are forced to do more ESL and it takes away from training other students.

And you are absolutely right about the property taxes. It will make a difference.
quash
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BaylorFTW said:

curtpenn said:

BaylorFTW said:

quash said:

contrario said:

quash said:

contrario said:

Bearitto said:

They need to build new schools because the new schools they have aren't new enough new schools.
Or they don't have enough schools. Growing communities have a growing need for public services.
They were closing schools just a few years ago.

Dallas needs to be broken up into smaller districts. If that means a couple of layers of administrators lose their jobs, oh well.
I don't live in Dallas, so i don't know the details, but what were the characteristics of the schools closing? Were they older schools that it didn't make sense to renovate? Were they in areas that didn't need the schools? I need context to draw a conclusion from "they were closing schools a few years ago." There is likely good reasons those schools were closed and new ones need to be built, one of which might be the immobility of real estate.
Students at lower performing schools are allowed to transfer without regard to the usual restraints. Several lower performing schools lost a big chunk of their student population and DISD eventually moved to close those schools. In those particular situations there wasn't a shift in where students lived, just in where they were transferred. And those transfers still need bus routes that get them to their chosen schools. Those kind of headaches are why it is better to try and improve the school. How to do that? If I knew I'd sell it and get rich.
This is consistent from what I remember growing up in DISD. I had friends who did just this. Of course, that results in a brain drain where the schools they leave behind are hurt more. Plus, we had the TAG (talented and gifted) schools which took even more kids away from these other schools.

And on the flip side it was hard to get good teachers to want to go to those other schools. They would even pay them more but the environments were often not conducive to learning. There were many liberal white women who had dreams of becoming the next Michelle Pfieffer in Dangerous Games only to run up against the reality of classrooms where some students would not tolerate being taught by a white woman. In addition, there is an issue where teachers are forced to deal with disruptive kids and violent children as the administration does not help them. The result is many of those do gooder liberal white women end up taking the first chance they can to teach in the suburbs or elsewhere for less pay.

So you have a few different issues going on. You have a racial bias/prejudice problem. You have a disruptive student problem. And you sometimes have a money problem. Ideally, you could mitigate the racial problem somewhat by getting more POC teachers but there just aren't enough and a number of them aren't even interested in teaching in those schools. Usually good schools happen in part because the community of parents ensure the school is not neglected as they want their kids to have the best. But the problem here is the active parents who could mobilize the school in this way see it as easier to just send their kids to another school. And they are right. So I don't see anything changing unless they change those rules on transfers which they won't likely do because it receives a lot of blowback from those same parents.

Also, my two predictions on such a bond are:
1. It will be approved because of the demographics and voting patterns in Dallas
2. It will largely be wasted and not have the impact they would hope.



We've lived in DISD (East Dallas) since '84. Started a family in '89. Our 2 kids went to private schools PreK -12th. DISD was never even a real consideration. And that's really sad; my mother is a retired teacher from San Antonio ISD and my wife and I both grew up in public schools. It always angered me that our property taxes went up so much and so often all these years, yet we paid private school tuition on top of that. We've always voted against every school bond, consequently. Had there been some relief during our tuition paying years, I might be more supportive of public schools. As it is, DISD spends over $13,000 per year per student. I think they need to learn to manage more efficiently.

Somewhat off topic: we've protested property taxes at least 10-12 times over the last 25 years or so. Don't always win, but we've managed to keep our taxes lower than most of our neighbors. The cumulative impact is significant over time. I turn 65 next month and am determined to keep costs down once able to retire. The sad truth is our insurance and property tax payments will actually exceed our original total initial mortgage payment. A lot of you youngsters need to really think about that. I encourage everyone to protest their taxes often.
You are not the only one. A lot of people feel the same way. You have this weird thing going on where the schools don't reflect the neighborhood demographics. For example, Woodrow Wilson is now 66% hispanic while East Dallas is 65.8% white. And it is that way in the school I grew up in as well. When I went to school in the 90s, you could still get a good education if you were in the honors classes and the diversity was something like 1/3 1/3 1/3 between black/white/hispanic. It was also a good school to go to if you wanted to play multiple sports something you couldn't really do if went to say Plano ISD. The level of education wouldn't be near as good as you would get at say St. Marks but as far as I could tell was similar to other private schools in the area in the honors classes. But nowadays, I doubt this is still the case. DISD has received a greater influx of Hispanic and other immigrant children in recent times. This means they are forced to do more ESL and it takes away from training other students.

And you are absolutely right about the property taxes. It will make a difference.
When my kid was in 3d grade at our neighborhood DISD school they had finally built a new campus after we used up the last of the playground for portables. Turns out there was some self segregating in the local apartment complexes and the new school was predominantly black, leaving our campus so dominantly Hispanic that of the 5 sections of 3d grade classes 3 were taught by teachers who had to get an ESL waiver from the state. There were 4 white kids in 3d grade that year, so my kid was the token white kid for his class, but one class had to go without. We were lucky to have a part time aide who did a pull out group for enrichment; she got my kid to complete a portfolio that got him into the Vanguard/Academy magnet. My neighborhood had 2500 homeowners but very few attended DISD schools.

Just north of our neighborhood RISD began. Homes that were otherwise identical to mine went for an extra $6-7000 just for being in RISD. Same thing over on the border between Dan D. Rogers and Mockingbird Elem.
Canada2017
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D. C. Bear said:

Canada2017 said:

D. C. Bear said:

Canada2017 said:

quash said:

Canada2017 said:

RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

Canada2017 said:

Voters get to decide but only property owners get to pay .
Exactly. Renters have no skin in the game and old folks have their taxes capped. Does not quite seem fair to the majority of homeowners that pay taxes under the age of 65. This is not just a Dallas problem. It occurs in the whole state of Texas.


In 25 years of owning investing property ...only on this message board have I ever heard the ludicrous theory that tenants pay property taxes through their rent.

Well I spend money on the products from dozens of corporations ....such spending doesn't entitle me to vote on their corporate boards .
LOL. Renters pay taxes through their rent. Any landlord that fails to collect what he pays in taxes will be out of business.



You are the only renter I've ever heard this from .

By your rationale I should have a vote on the board of Ford Motors since I spent my money on one of their F-150's.

Ridiculous.






As a landlord, where do you get the money to pay property taxes?


Since Ford uses my cash to pay their corporate loans....do I get to vote on their board ?


No. Now answer the question. Where do you, as a landlord, get the money to pay property taxes?


If the money I spend on transportation via a Ford truck doesn't entitle me to vote on the corporate board ....

money spent by others on rent shouldn't entitle them to vote on my property taxes .

No other way to spin it .
quash
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Canada2017 said:

D. C. Bear said:

Canada2017 said:

D. C. Bear said:

Canada2017 said:

quash said:

Canada2017 said:

RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

Canada2017 said:

Voters get to decide but only property owners get to pay .
Exactly. Renters have no skin in the game and old folks have their taxes capped. Does not quite seem fair to the majority of homeowners that pay taxes under the age of 65. This is not just a Dallas problem. It occurs in the whole state of Texas.


In 25 years of owning investing property ...only on this message board have I ever heard the ludicrous theory that tenants pay property taxes through their rent.

Well I spend money on the products from dozens of corporations ....such spending doesn't entitle me to vote on their corporate boards .
LOL. Renters pay taxes through their rent. Any landlord that fails to collect what he pays in taxes will be out of business.



You are the only renter I've ever heard this from .

By your rationale I should have a vote on the board of Ford Motors since I spent my money on one of their F-150's.

Ridiculous.






As a landlord, where do you get the money to pay property taxes?


Since Ford uses my cash to pay their corporate loans....do I get to vote on their board ?


No. Now answer the question. Where do you, as a landlord, get the money to pay property taxes?


If the money I spend on transportation via a Ford truck doesn't entitle me to vote on the corporate board ....

money spent by others on rent shouldn't entitle them to vote on my property taxes .

No other way to spin it .
You are welcome to argue that tenants should not get to vote on bond issues. But the idea that tenants don't pay the tax is off.
Limited IQ Redneck in PU
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I rent out my house in Texas. When taxes go up rent goes up. Seems simple.
I have found theres only two ways to go:
Living fast or dying slow.
I dont want to live forever.
But I will live while I'm here.
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