I think Biden will move to the center-left, ala Slick Willy if and only if the Repubs win 1 in Georgia. That will help him blunt the crazy left.

Porteroso said:

---

Carlos Safety said:

---

bear2be2 said:

---

Carlos Safety said:

---

Any benefits the Democrats have received as a result of selling out to Obama were temporary and incidental. He doesn't give a **** about that party or its values. And he'll have no problem tearing it down now that he is out.

---

Except this isn't actually true. And Obama and Trump are in no way similar.

---

Obama did no favors for the Democrat party. He is part of the leftward lurch that is going to cost the Dems big in 2022.

---

Obama was rather centrist compared to current progressives. To a radical conservative, anything left of extreme right must be shocking, I know.

---

I actually think that was the genius of Obama. He is not a centrist but politically he is excellent at managing the message and the media was more than willing to help. He is much closer to the leftist (not the crazies in Portland) but the leftist in the party. Your point is more accurate for Bill Clinton. Trump is horrible at the political side because he is such a narcissist. Great at marketing and being a PT Barnum which created energy and excitement but Trump did not understand politics nor did he care. Some people liked that and voted for him because of that. Obama was great at saying the things politically that make him seem like he was not the elite academic liberal who associated with radical left eliminates prior to running for congress. If Trump had even a small portion of Obama's political instincts, he would would have won 2020. However, I doubt he wins 2016 even against the 2nd worst presidential candidate in Hilary Clinton. Too hard to shift for him between what worked in 2016 and what did not work for him in 2020. He is who he is.

blackie said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

blackie said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

bear2be2 said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

"I'll pretend for a second that every biden vote was cast be a real life legal American - and only once in one state."

Unless you have evidence otherwise you would be pretending to think anything else.

---

So you're pretending there's no evidence? Not unexpected from you.

---

Is not pretending to follow the testimony of every entity that has actually done a non-partisan investigation into the matter.

Present the substantive evidence that no one of import has been able to find or move on. Those are the only two choices.

---

I say we do a full audit and verification in every state.

---

If you have evidence you should dial up President Trumps crack team of high priced lawyers. They havent done anything.. Trump called the last presidential election a landslide even though he lost the popular vote. Dementia Joe won the EC and the pop vote and you are demanding an audit.

Good luck. Pretending usually doesnt work well compared to reality and facts.

---

I should've been clear... Instead of wasting money on 40 million bogus investigations or stacking up pallets of cash for foreign countries that hate you, me and America and throwing money away on crap like the NEA....

We should audit and verify votes on EVERY federal election now and in the future. Hard to argue that when our gov't spends money like it's going out of style, some of it should be used to assure we have a free and fair election - everytime.

---

Thing is over my long lifetime there has been no evidence that we don't have free and fair elections where the results could have been changed. Republican election reviewers like Ben Ginsberg will tell you the same. No reason to spend money we don't have for something we don't need just because a losing side lost an election and can't handle the fact that the majority of voters wanted a change and especially where the losses were over 10000 votes and more. I suspect that if we did do what you suggest Trump would still question it and his cult would contend that the review was corrupt.

---

I consider the integrity of our elections more important that half the crap the gov't wastes on a daily basis. Certainly more important that the $150 million we send for the national endowment for the arts.

If assuring election integrity is less important to you than making sure some guy can get a grant to paint all day... well, then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

---

You know it doesn't work that way. If we spent the $150 million (I think it would take way more) to "insure" the election, we would still be spending on the arts. It would be an addition verses a substitution. But it still wouldn't make a difference to the loser's side stalwarts. I don't know about you....I don't know you, but I am certain there are a few on this board that no matter what you did and it found nothing of consequence, as it would, they would still sound loud and clear the "stolen election" mantra....including the head embarrassment himself. The only thing stolen in this election is the sense of integrity of the tens of thousands people, many volunteers, who put themselves in risk to allow us to hold elections, and the image of this country being something other than a banana republic.

---

Just because the gov't refuses to cut spending and "it currently doesn't work that way".... doesn't mean it shouldn't work that way. My position hasn't changed.

Rawhide said:

---

blackie said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

blackie said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

bear2be2 said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

"I'll pretend for a second that every biden vote was cast be a real life legal American - and only once in one state."

Unless you have evidence otherwise you would be pretending to think anything else.

---

So you're pretending there's no evidence? Not unexpected from you.

---

Is not pretending to follow the testimony of every entity that has actually done a non-partisan investigation into the matter.

Present the substantive evidence that no one of import has been able to find or move on. Those are the only two choices.

---

I say we do a full audit and verification in every state.

---

If you have evidence you should dial up President Trumps crack team of high priced lawyers. They havent done anything.. Trump called the last presidential election a landslide even though he lost the popular vote. Dementia Joe won the EC and the pop vote and you are demanding an audit.

Good luck. Pretending usually doesnt work well compared to reality and facts.

---

I should've been clear... Instead of wasting money on 40 million bogus investigations or stacking up pallets of cash for foreign countries that hate you, me and America and throwing money away on crap like the NEA....

We should audit and verify votes on EVERY federal election now and in the future. Hard to argue that when our gov't spends money like it's going out of style, some of it should be used to assure we have a free and fair election - everytime.

---

Thing is over my long lifetime there has been no evidence that we don't have free and fair elections where the results could have been changed. Republican election reviewers like Ben Ginsberg will tell you the same. No reason to spend money we don't have for something we don't need just because a losing side lost an election and can't handle the fact that the majority of voters wanted a change and especially where the losses were over 10000 votes and more. I suspect that if we did do what you suggest Trump would still question it and his cult would contend that the review was corrupt.

---

I consider the integrity of our elections more important that half the crap the gov't wastes on a daily basis. Certainly more important that the $150 million we send for the national endowment for the arts.

If assuring election integrity is less important to you than making sure some guy can get a grant to paint all day... well, then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

---

You know it doesn't work that way. If we spent the $150 million (I think it would take way more) to "insure" the election, we would still be spending on the arts. It would be an addition verses a substitution. But it still wouldn't make a difference to the loser's side stalwarts. I don't know about you....I don't know you, but I am certain there are a few on this board that no matter what you did and it found nothing of consequence, as it would, they would still sound loud and clear the "stolen election" mantra....including the head embarrassment himself. The only thing stolen in this election is the sense of integrity of the tens of thousands people, many volunteers, who put themselves in risk to allow us to hold elections, and the image of this country being something other than a banana republic.

---

Just because the gov't refuses to cut spending and "it currently doesn't work that way".... doesn't mean it shouldn't work that way. My position hasn't changed.

---

I don't expect it to, but you won't find many who don't buy into conspiracy theories agreeing with you.

J.R. said:

---

I think Biden will move to the center-left, ala Slick Willy if and only if the Repubs win 1 in Georgia. That will help him blunt the crazy left.

---

Nope.

blackie said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

blackie said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

blackie said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

bear2be2 said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

"I'll pretend for a second that every biden vote was cast be a real life legal American - and only once in one state."

Unless you have evidence otherwise you would be pretending to think anything else.

---

So you're pretending there's no evidence? Not unexpected from you.

---

Is not pretending to follow the testimony of every entity that has actually done a non-partisan investigation into the matter.

Present the substantive evidence that no one of import has been able to find or move on. Those are the only two choices.

---

I say we do a full audit and verification in every state.

---

If you have evidence you should dial up President Trumps crack team of high priced lawyers. They havent done anything.. Trump called the last presidential election a landslide even though he lost the popular vote. Dementia Joe won the EC and the pop vote and you are demanding an audit.

Good luck. Pretending usually doesnt work well compared to reality and facts.

---

I should've been clear... Instead of wasting money on 40 million bogus investigations or stacking up pallets of cash for foreign countries that hate you, me and America and throwing money away on crap like the NEA....

We should audit and verify votes on EVERY federal election now and in the future. Hard to argue that when our gov't spends money like it's going out of style, some of it should be used to assure we have a free and fair election - everytime.

---

Thing is over my long lifetime there has been no evidence that we don't have free and fair elections where the results could have been changed. Republican election reviewers like Ben Ginsberg will tell you the same. No reason to spend money we don't have for something we don't need just because a losing side lost an election and can't handle the fact that the majority of voters wanted a change and especially where the losses were over 10000 votes and more. I suspect that if we did do what you suggest Trump would still question it and his cult would contend that the review was corrupt.

---

I consider the integrity of our elections more important that half the crap the gov't wastes on a daily basis. Certainly more important that the $150 million we send for the national endowment for the arts.

If assuring election integrity is less important to you than making sure some guy can get a grant to paint all day... well, then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

---

You know it doesn't work that way. If we spent the $150 million (I think it would take way more) to "insure" the election, we would still be spending on the arts. It would be an addition verses a substitution. But it still wouldn't make a difference to the loser's side stalwarts. I don't know about you....I don't know you, but I am certain there are a few on this board that no matter what you did and it found nothing of consequence, as it would, they would still sound loud and clear the "stolen election" mantra....including the head embarrassment himself. The only thing stolen in this election is the sense of integrity of the tens of thousands people, many volunteers, who put themselves in risk to allow us to hold elections, and the image of this country being something other than a banana republic.

---

Just because the gov't refuses to cut spending and "it currently doesn't work that way".... doesn't mean it shouldn't work that way. My position hasn't changed.

---

I don't expect it to, but you won't find many who don't buy into conspiracy theories agreeing with you.

---

Glad to know that it's conspiratorial to want all our elections audited and verified

J.B.Katz said:

---

Trump is planning a visit to Georgia. That should be interesting.

---

He's headed to Valdosta.

Southern GA has a higher population demographic of less educated, lower income, pro nationalism groups. Trump plays well there.

Note the more affluent, college educated, suburbs are being avoided as Trump polls poorly there, especially with women in Augusta, Atlanta and Athens.

Rawhide said:

---

blackie said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

blackie said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

blackie said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

bear2be2 said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

"I'll pretend for a second that every biden vote was cast be a real life legal American - and only once in one state."

Unless you have evidence otherwise you would be pretending to think anything else.

---

So you're pretending there's no evidence? Not unexpected from you.

---

Is not pretending to follow the testimony of every entity that has actually done a non-partisan investigation into the matter.

Present the substantive evidence that no one of import has been able to find or move on. Those are the only two choices.

---

I say we do a full audit and verification in every state.

---

If you have evidence you should dial up President Trumps crack team of high priced lawyers. They havent done anything.. Trump called the last presidential election a landslide even though he lost the popular vote. Dementia Joe won the EC and the pop vote and you are demanding an audit.

Good luck. Pretending usually doesnt work well compared to reality and facts.

---

I should've been clear... Instead of wasting money on 40 million bogus investigations or stacking up pallets of cash for foreign countries that hate you, me and America and throwing money away on crap like the NEA....

We should audit and verify votes on EVERY federal election now and in the future. Hard to argue that when our gov't spends money like it's going out of style, some of it should be used to assure we have a free and fair election - everytime.

---

Thing is over my long lifetime there has been no evidence that we don't have free and fair elections where the results could have been changed. Republican election reviewers like Ben Ginsberg will tell you the same. No reason to spend money we don't have for something we don't need just because a losing side lost an election and can't handle the fact that the majority of voters wanted a change and especially where the losses were over 10000 votes and more. I suspect that if we did do what you suggest Trump would still question it and his cult would contend that the review was corrupt.

---

I consider the integrity of our elections more important that half the crap the gov't wastes on a daily basis. Certainly more important that the $150 million we send for the national endowment for the arts.

If assuring election integrity is less important to you than making sure some guy can get a grant to paint all day... well, then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

---

You know it doesn't work that way. If we spent the $150 million (I think it would take way more) to "insure" the election, we would still be spending on the arts. It would be an addition verses a substitution. But it still wouldn't make a difference to the loser's side stalwarts. I don't know about you....I don't know you, but I am certain there are a few on this board that no matter what you did and it found nothing of consequence, as it would, they would still sound loud and clear the "stolen election" mantra....including the head embarrassment himself. The only thing stolen in this election is the sense of integrity of the tens of thousands people, many volunteers, who put themselves in risk to allow us to hold elections, and the image of this country being something other than a banana republic.

---

Just because the gov't refuses to cut spending and "it currently doesn't work that way".... doesn't mean it shouldn't work that way. My position hasn't changed.

---

I don't expect it to, but you won't find many who don't buy into conspiracy theories agreeing with you.

---

Glad to know that it's conspiratorial to want all our elections audited and verified

---

Where were you in 2016 when the vote went against most pollsters? I dont remember any Rawhide complaining. This election went as expected but you dont like the results so you give life to every crazy website someone throws up looking for proof.

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

blackie said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

blackie said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

blackie said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

bear2be2 said:

---

Rawhide said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

"I'll pretend for a second that every biden vote was cast be a real life legal American - and only once in one state."

Unless you have evidence otherwise you would be pretending to think anything else.

---

So you're pretending there's no evidence? Not unexpected from you.

---

Is not pretending to follow the testimony of every entity that has actually done a non-partisan investigation into the matter.

Present the substantive evidence that no one of import has been able to find or move on. Those are the only two choices.

---

I say we do a full audit and verification in every state.

---

If you have evidence you should dial up President Trumps crack team of high priced lawyers. They havent done anything.. Trump called the last presidential election a landslide even though he lost the popular vote. Dementia Joe won the EC and the pop vote and you are demanding an audit.

Good luck. Pretending usually doesnt work well compared to reality and facts.

---

I should've been clear... Instead of wasting money on 40 million bogus investigations or stacking up pallets of cash for foreign countries that hate you, me and America and throwing money away on crap like the NEA....

We should audit and verify votes on EVERY federal election now and in the future. Hard to argue that when our gov't spends money like it's going out of style, some of it should be used to assure we have a free and fair election - everytime.

---

Thing is over my long lifetime there has been no evidence that we don't have free and fair elections where the results could have been changed. Republican election reviewers like Ben Ginsberg will tell you the same. No reason to spend money we don't have for something we don't need just because a losing side lost an election and can't handle the fact that the majority of voters wanted a change and especially where the losses were over 10000 votes and more. I suspect that if we did do what you suggest Trump would still question it and his cult would contend that the review was corrupt.

---

I consider the integrity of our elections more important that half the crap the gov't wastes on a daily basis. Certainly more important that the $150 million we send for the national endowment for the arts.

If assuring election integrity is less important to you than making sure some guy can get a grant to paint all day... well, then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

---

You know it doesn't work that way. If we spent the $150 million (I think it would take way more) to "insure" the election, we would still be spending on the arts. It would be an addition verses a substitution. But it still wouldn't make a difference to the loser's side stalwarts. I don't know about you....I don't know you, but I am certain there are a few on this board that no matter what you did and it found nothing of consequence, as it would, they would still sound loud and clear the "stolen election" mantra....including the head embarrassment himself. The only thing stolen in this election is the sense of integrity of the tens of thousands people, many volunteers, who put themselves in risk to allow us to hold elections, and the image of this country being something other than a banana republic.

---

Just because the gov't refuses to cut spending and "it currently doesn't work that way".... doesn't mean it shouldn't work that way. My position hasn't changed.

---

I don't expect it to, but you won't find many who don't buy into conspiracy theories agreeing with you.

---

Glad to know that it's conspiratorial to want all our elections audited and verified

---

Where were you in 2016 when the vote went against most pollsters? I dont remember any Rawhide complaining. This election went as expected but you dont like the results so you give life to every crazy website someone throws up looking for proof.

---

2016 should've been audited an verified as well.

What's so hard for you snowflakes to understand that having our elections audited and verified is a good thing?

But by all means, keep making my position election integrity all about Trump even though it hasn't zero to do with him.

Are you all that triggered and stuck on Trump's dick?

You are the one with knee pads. I think both elections were fine