Canada Has Reached New Lows

2,568 Views | 55 Replies | Last: 3 mo ago by Aliceinbubbleland
BaylorFTW
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Limited IQ Redneck in PU
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Why in hell would a man grandstand his kids like that? If you dont like Canadas rules go somewhere else.
I have found theres only two ways to go:
Living fast or dying slow.
I dont want to live forever.
But I will live while I'm here.
Doc Holliday
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Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

Why in hell would a man grandstand his kids like that? If you dont like Canadas rules go somewhere else.
Shame on you.
Redbrickbear
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The modern West is becoming tyrannical.
Canon
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Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

Why in hell would a man grandstand his kids like that? If you dont like Canadas rules go somewhere else.


Thanks for giving us the view of "The World". Now let's get Christ's view:

The World Hates the Disciples

18 "If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first. 19 If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you. 20 Remember what I told you: 'A servant is not greater than his master.'[a] If they persecuted me, they will persecute you also. If they obeyed my teaching, they will obey yours also. 21 They will treat you this way because of my name, for they do not know the one who sent me. 22 If I had not come and spoken to them, they would not be guilty of sin; but now they have no excuse for their sin. 23 Whoever hates me hates my Father as well.
LIB,MR BEARS
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Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

Why in hell would a man grandstand his kids like that? If you dont like Canadas rules go somewhere else.
in 33,34,35 Germany, what advice would you have given the Jews?

Why do you feel the need to live up to your monicker here but not expect a this Canadian to live up to his pastor monicker?
Redbrickbear
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Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

Why in hell would a man grandstand his kids like that? If you dont like Canadas rules go somewhere else.
Please....for all we know this guy is a multi-generational Canadian.

If he has Anglo roots his family might have been in the country since the 1700s. If he has French roots since the 1600s. If aboriginal roots then going back thousands of years.

He should just flee abroad because the modern government in Ottawa has decided to impose draconian Soviet/Fascistic polices around freedom of movement and association?

This past year has been eye opening about how many government bootlickers are around today.
LIB,MR BEARS
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Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

Why in hell would a man grandstand his kids like that? If you dont like Canadas rules go somewhere else.
his kids in his house, in his yard, in his driveway. Damn kids had no right to follow dad out to the cop car.

die Offiziere befolgten nur Befehle.
Porteroso
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Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
LIB,MR BEARS
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Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
Ein braunes Hemd Gre 2XL. Vielen Dank.
bear2be2
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Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
LIB,MR BEARS
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bear2be2 said:

Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
Why do you hate Rosa Parks?
bear2be2
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LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
Why do you hate Rosa Parks?
Rosa Parks was fighting actual injustice. This guy's just a selfish ***** trying to score points with those in his tribe.

And Rosa Parks and other peaceful protestors during the civil rights movement didn't cry when they were arrested. They expected to be and accepted that as a consequence of their civil disobedience.
Canon
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For everyone's reference and to demonstrate the gestapo like tactics employed by Canada....they hunted down this peaceful OUTDOOR service using a helicopter. They are stalking this man and his congregation because of their faith.


"A police helicopter was deployed to search for and detect this gathering, and to collect evidence against Pastor Stephens of non-compliance with public health restrictions," according to a press release from the Calgary-based Justice Centre for Constitutional Freedoms, which is legally representing Stephens and other Canadian pastors being prosecuted by provincial governments. Stephens was imprisoned before in May until his legal counsel argued that the court order under which he had been arrested did not apply to him.

After first claiming in a press release that the illegal service had been held inside the locked church building, Calgary Police Service and Alberta Health Services issued a correction stating the gathering was outside but still failed to comply with current COVID-19 restrictions, according to Global News.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/give-unto-caesar-alberta-pastor-jailed-again-after-police-helicopter-finds-secret-church-gathering-officer-quotes-jesus-to-justify-arrest
LIB,MR BEARS
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bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
Why do you hate Rosa Parks?
Rosa Parks was fighting actual injustice. This guy's just a selfish ***** trying to score points with those in his tribe.

And Rosa Parks and other peaceful protestors during the civil rights movement didn't cry when they were arrested. They expected to be and accepted that as a consequence of their civil disobedience.
"actual injustice " equates to "nothing is bad enough to protest until I say it's bad enough to protest."

Damned uppitty Christians.

Limited IQ Redneck in PU
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2nd time in two weeks. He knew it was coming. Why would his kids react that way to something they expected?

Comparing the preacher with a Jew in Nazi Germany is wrong.

Canada has rules. They should apply to everyone. If you dont like the rules there are several options. Defying the rules is one option and we will see how it works out. I have defied the rules to a certain extent and attended services in both the UAE and China.

In the UAE there was a group of Christians that met in an apartment on Saturday nights. I felt they were sincere and attended several time and tithed there. i am not sure of the legal status but the group did not advertise their existence.

I attended a church in China one time. It was led by a teacher I met at a seminar. I think he was using his church to create controversy and never went back.

Tim Stevens knew this was coming and couldnt have been surprised. He either must not have told his children what to expect or they knew and were acting. Not the way I or I bet most of you would have handled it.
I have found theres only two ways to go:
Living fast or dying slow.
I dont want to live forever.
But I will live while I'm here.
whitetrash
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Canon said:

For everyone's reference and to demonstrate the gestapo like tactics employed by Canada....they hunted down this peaceful OUTDOOR service using a helicopter. They are stalking this man and his congregation because of their faith.


"A police helicopter was deployed to search for and detect this gathering, and to collect evidence against Pastor Stephens of non-compliance with public health restrictions," according to a press release from the Calgary-based Justice Centre for Constitutional Freedoms, which is legally representing Stephens and other Canadian pastors being prosecuted by provincial governments. Stephens was imprisoned before in May until his legal counsel argued that the court order under which he had been arrested did not apply to him.

After first claiming in a press release that the illegal service had been held inside the locked church building, Calgary Police Service and Alberta Health Services issued a correction stating the gathering was outside but still failed to comply with current COVID-19 restrictions, according to Global News.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/give-unto-caesar-alberta-pastor-jailed-again-after-police-helicopter-finds-secret-church-gathering-officer-quotes-jesus-to-justify-arrest
bear2be2
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LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
Why do you hate Rosa Parks?
Rosa Parks was fighting actual injustice. This guy's just a selfish ***** trying to score points with those in his tribe.

And Rosa Parks and other peaceful protestors during the civil rights movement didn't cry when they were arrested. They expected to be and accepted that as a consequence of their civil disobedience.
"actual injustice " equates to "nothing is bad enough to protest until I say it's bad enough to protest."

Damned uppitty Christians.


In this particular case, it was one damned uppity Christian. It looks like just about everyone else managed to navigate this order without making a spectacle of themselves.

But a temporary order that applies to all groups does not equal established discriminatory law based on race, ethnicity or religion. And it won't no matter how hard some you try to equate the two.

This wasn't persecution. It was a political protest. And when your protest puts you at odds with the law, you should expect to face legal consequences.
LIB,MR BEARS
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bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
Why do you hate Rosa Parks?
Rosa Parks was fighting actual injustice. This guy's just a selfish ***** trying to score points with those in his tribe.

And Rosa Parks and other peaceful protestors during the civil rights movement didn't cry when they were arrested. They expected to be and accepted that as a consequence of their civil disobedience.
"actual injustice " equates to "nothing is bad enough to protest until I say it's bad enough to protest."

Damned uppitty Christians.


In this particular case, it was one damned uppity Christian. It looks like just about everyone else managed to navigate this order without making a spectacle of themselves.

But a temporary order that applies to all groups does not equal established discriminatory law based on race, ethnicity or religion. And it won't no matter how hard some you try to equate the two.

This wasn't persecution. It was a political protest. And when your protest puts you at odds with the law, you should expect to face legal consequences.
why is enforcement not equal?
Forest Bueller_bf
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With a per capita death rate of .000685 in Canada and now 61% of Canadians being partially vaccinated and 71% of those 12 and over this is just stupid at this point.

Absolutely government overreach.

The service was outside, there would be virtually a 0% chance of spreading the illness in that setting.

Yea, I'm all for following the law. Not stupid meaningless laws.

Let each individual at this point determine the amount of risk they wish to take. Nobody is being forced to attend services. It seem to be voluntary. Don't feel safe, don't go. Feel safe go.
Doc Holliday
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bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
Why do you hate Rosa Parks?
Rosa Parks was fighting actual injustice. This guy's just a selfish ***** trying to score points with those in his tribe.

And Rosa Parks and other peaceful protestors during the civil rights movement didn't cry when they were arrested. They expected to be and accepted that as a consequence of their civil disobedience.
"actual injustice " equates to "nothing is bad enough to protest until I say it's bad enough to protest."

Damned uppitty Christians.


In this particular case, it was one damned uppity Christian. It looks like just about everyone else managed to navigate this order without making a spectacle of themselves.

But a temporary order that applies to all groups does not equal established discriminatory law based on race, ethnicity or religion. And it won't no matter how hard some you try to equate the two.

This wasn't persecution. It was a political protest. And when your protest puts you at odds with the law, you should expect to face legal consequences.
This law is not justified, nor based on data and is harmful to society. That was enough for our forefathers, civil rights and virtually every advance towards freedom.

Is there any point where law/government is too extreme for you, or do you lick the boot for any decree?
bear2be2
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Doc Holliday said:

bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
Why do you hate Rosa Parks?
Rosa Parks was fighting actual injustice. This guy's just a selfish ***** trying to score points with those in his tribe.

And Rosa Parks and other peaceful protestors during the civil rights movement didn't cry when they were arrested. They expected to be and accepted that as a consequence of their civil disobedience.
"actual injustice " equates to "nothing is bad enough to protest until I say it's bad enough to protest."

Damned uppitty Christians.


In this particular case, it was one damned uppity Christian. It looks like just about everyone else managed to navigate this order without making a spectacle of themselves.

But a temporary order that applies to all groups does not equal established discriminatory law based on race, ethnicity or religion. And it won't no matter how hard some you try to equate the two.

This wasn't persecution. It was a political protest. And when your protest puts you at odds with the law, you should expect to face legal consequences.
This law is not justified, nor based on data and is harmful to society. That was enough for our forefathers, civil rights and virtually every advance towards freedom.

Is there any point where law/government is too extreme for you, or do you lick the boot for any decree?
If you disagree with a law or order, there are avenues through which to address that.

But disagreeing with a law or order doesn't give one license to ignore/break it with impunity.

If this guy thinks the law is unjust and wants to protest it out of principle, that's fine. But there are consequences that come with that. Believing or pretending you're above those consequences or that the law shouldn't apply to you because you disagree with it is absurd. If everyone treated laws they disagreed with the same way, it would be chaos.
bear2be2
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Forest Bueller_bf said:

With a per capita death rate of .000685 in Canada and now 61% of Canadians being partially vaccinated and 71% of those 12 and over this is just stupid at this point.

Absolutely government overreach.

The service was outside, there would be virtually a 0% chance of spreading the illness in that setting.

Yea, I'm all for following the law. Not stupid meaningless laws.

Let each individual at this point determine the amount of risk they wish to take. Nobody is being forced to attend services. It seem to be voluntary. Don't feel safe, don't go. Feel safe go.

I don't necessarily disagree with the justification of this particular order at this point, but the law is the law.

Until it's lifted/loosened, you either follow it or accept the consequences of not following it.

This dude was warned not to violate the order and knew the consequences of violating it. When you knowingly break the rules, even rules you disagree with, you should expect to face the consequences. Choosing to cry persecution when you're held to the same standards most others would be is weak sauce.
J.B.Katz
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bear2be2 said:

Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
And if this clown has been a Muslim and pulled this stunt, who would the outrage be directed at?
LIB,MR BEARS
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bear2be2 said:

Forest Bueller_bf said:

With a per capita death rate of .000685 in Canada and now 61% of Canadians being partially vaccinated and 71% of those 12 and over this is just stupid at this point.

Absolutely government overreach.

The service was outside, there would be virtually a 0% chance of spreading the illness in that setting.

Yea, I'm all for following the law. Not stupid meaningless laws.

Let each individual at this point determine the amount of risk they wish to take. Nobody is being forced to attend services. It seem to be voluntary. Don't feel safe, don't go. Feel safe go.

I don't necessarily disagree with the justification of this particular order at this point, but the law is the law.

Until it's lifted/loosened, you either follow it or accept the consequences of not following it.

This dude was warned not to violate the order and knew the consequences of violating it. When you knowingly break the rules, even rules you disagree with, you should expect to face the consequences. Choosing to cry persecution when you're held to the same standards most others would be is weak sauce.
I'm confused. Was it weak sauce for Rosa or not? Is it only weak sauce for this guy? Is it wrong to protest while things are still minor or should people wait until many are in jail, many are on back of the bus, many are aborted, many are enslaved? You see all of these items fall/fell within the law and all of these items, in my opinion, are wrong.
LIB,MR BEARS
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J.B.Katz said:

bear2be2 said:

Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
And if this clown has been a Muslim and pulled this stunt, who would the outrage be directed at?
from me, at the Canadian government. It doesn't take a legal scholar to understand that anything used against one group can be used against another at the whim of those in power.

My body, my choice is a great example of why situational ethics sucks. Pro choice libs love it when it's used for pro-choice but hate it when it's used for vaccines.
J.B.Katz
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LIB,MR BEARS said:

J.B.Katz said:

bear2be2 said:

Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
And if this clown has been a Muslim and pulled this stunt, who would the outrage be directed at?
from me, at the Canadian government. It doesn't take a legal scholar to understand that anything used against one group can be used against another at the whim of those in power.

My body, my choice is a great example of why situational ethics sucks. Pro choice libs love it when it's used for pro-choice but hate it when it's used for vaccines.
Vaccines and abortion are apples and oranges-inconvenient for both sides of the debate over both.

Vaccines have a clear public health benefit.

The antivax movement has brought back measles and now threatens our ability to bounce back from COVID.

What a woman does about an unintended pregnancy may offend your religious scrupals if she wants to get an abortion instead of carrying to term. The question is whether your religious scrupals should be imposed on her with the full force of the law to force her to carry to term.

Re: vaccines: We have long tradition of requiring them in public and private schools because of the obvious public health benefits. My kids attended both, and none of the schools they attended, public or private, would even let them in the building without an up-to-date vaccination card. The private school refunded the tuition of parents who didn't want their kids vaxxed. Maybe there was an opt-out for kids who couldnt take vaccines for whatever reason, but "I don't believe in them" wasn't an accepted excuse. I remember getting one of the first polio vaccines in elementary school on a sugar cube in 1962. They gave it at school to make sure every kid got vaccinated. Our parents were ecstatic that they no longer had to coop us up in the summer while pools and parks were shut down because of a polio outbreak.

Outbreaks of measles, mumps and chicken pox and stunts like KY former gov Matt Bevins purposely infecting his 9 kids with chicken pox make it clear that plenty of people are no longer interesting in cooperating on basics like vaccines for the common good. If we keep going down that road we're going to be at a serious distadvantage compared with societies like China where resistance is futile. I wouldn't want to live under a govt as dominating as the Chinese but I sure do wish we had leaders who would work together on basics like vaccination. New Mexico is a case study of good policy and good leadership. Most other states across the Southern half of the US, not so much.
Doc Holliday
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bear2be2 said:

Doc Holliday said:

bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
Why do you hate Rosa Parks?
Rosa Parks was fighting actual injustice. This guy's just a selfish ***** trying to score points with those in his tribe.

And Rosa Parks and other peaceful protestors during the civil rights movement didn't cry when they were arrested. They expected to be and accepted that as a consequence of their civil disobedience.
"actual injustice " equates to "nothing is bad enough to protest until I say it's bad enough to protest."

Damned uppitty Christians.


In this particular case, it was one damned uppity Christian. It looks like just about everyone else managed to navigate this order without making a spectacle of themselves.

But a temporary order that applies to all groups does not equal established discriminatory law based on race, ethnicity or religion. And it won't no matter how hard some you try to equate the two.

This wasn't persecution. It was a political protest. And when your protest puts you at odds with the law, you should expect to face legal consequences.
This law is not justified, nor based on data and is harmful to society. That was enough for our forefathers, civil rights and virtually every advance towards freedom.

Is there any point where law/government is too extreme for you, or do you lick the boot for any decree?
Believing or pretending you're above those consequences or that the law shouldn't apply to you because you disagree with it is absurd.
That's EXACTLY what took place during the civil rights era.
BaylorFTW
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J.B.Katz said:


Vaccines have a clear public health benefit.

This has not been proven with regard to the so called COVID "vaccine."

J.B.Katz said:


The antivax movement has brought back measles and now threatens our ability to bounce back from COVID.



No that was unregulated immigration policies. The antivaxxers have always been around.
bear2be2
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LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

Forest Bueller_bf said:

With a per capita death rate of .000685 in Canada and now 61% of Canadians being partially vaccinated and 71% of those 12 and over this is just stupid at this point.

Absolutely government overreach.

The service was outside, there would be virtually a 0% chance of spreading the illness in that setting.

Yea, I'm all for following the law. Not stupid meaningless laws.

Let each individual at this point determine the amount of risk they wish to take. Nobody is being forced to attend services. It seem to be voluntary. Don't feel safe, don't go. Feel safe go.

I don't necessarily disagree with the justification of this particular order at this point, but the law is the law.

Until it's lifted/loosened, you either follow it or accept the consequences of not following it.

This dude was warned not to violate the order and knew the consequences of violating it. When you knowingly break the rules, even rules you disagree with, you should expect to face the consequences. Choosing to cry persecution when you're held to the same standards most others would be is weak sauce.
I'm confused. Was it weak sauce for Rosa or not? Is it only weak sauce for this guy? Is it wrong to protest while things are still minor or should people wait until many are in jail, many are on back of the bus, many are aborted, many are enslaved? You see all of these items fall/fell within the law and all of these items, in my opinion, are wrong.

You're clearly failing to grasp a fairly obvious distinction here. Ignoring completely the causes (and the fairly wide disparity in justification between them IMO), Rosa Parks and those like her didn't cry victim when faced with the consequences of their protests. They weighed that into their decision to protest and decided their cause was worth the personal sacrifice.

That this guy wants to protest by violating the order isn't the issue. If he feels strongly enough about it, fine. I think he's being melodramatic, but that's beside the point. The issue is that he wants to violate the order without any of the consequences that come with that. He's acting like an entitled child and trying to pass himself off as a victim.

Rosa Parks didn't need to broadcast that she was a victim of injustice to be accepted by contemporaries and eventually history as one. Her cause and actions spoke for themselves. This guy likely thinks this is his Rosa Parks moment, but he's sadly mistaken.
Doc Holliday
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LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

Forest Bueller_bf said:

With a per capita death rate of .000685 in Canada and now 61% of Canadians being partially vaccinated and 71% of those 12 and over this is just stupid at this point.

Absolutely government overreach.

The service was outside, there would be virtually a 0% chance of spreading the illness in that setting.

Yea, I'm all for following the law. Not stupid meaningless laws.

Let each individual at this point determine the amount of risk they wish to take. Nobody is being forced to attend services. It seem to be voluntary. Don't feel safe, don't go. Feel safe go.

I don't necessarily disagree with the justification of this particular order at this point, but the law is the law.

Until it's lifted/loosened, you either follow it or accept the consequences of not following it.

This dude was warned not to violate the order and knew the consequences of violating it. When you knowingly break the rules, even rules you disagree with, you should expect to face the consequences. Choosing to cry persecution when you're held to the same standards most others would be is weak sauce.
I'm confused. Was it weak sauce for Rosa or not? Is it only weak sauce for this guy? Is it wrong to protest while things are still minor or should people wait until many are in jail, many are on back of the bus, many are aborted, many are enslaved? You see all of these items fall/fell within the law and all of these items, in my opinion, are wrong.
I don't think he's capable of drawing a red line in regards to law.

He bends the rules depending on his views. It's ok to break the law during civil rights, but not if you're a white preacher in 2021, even though both laws are not held by data or common sense.
bear2be2
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Doc Holliday said:

bear2be2 said:

Doc Holliday said:

bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
Why do you hate Rosa Parks?
Rosa Parks was fighting actual injustice. This guy's just a selfish ***** trying to score points with those in his tribe.

And Rosa Parks and other peaceful protestors during the civil rights movement didn't cry when they were arrested. They expected to be and accepted that as a consequence of their civil disobedience.
"actual injustice " equates to "nothing is bad enough to protest until I say it's bad enough to protest."

Damned uppitty Christians.


In this particular case, it was one damned uppity Christian. It looks like just about everyone else managed to navigate this order without making a spectacle of themselves.

But a temporary order that applies to all groups does not equal established discriminatory law based on race, ethnicity or religion. And it won't no matter how hard some you try to equate the two.

This wasn't persecution. It was a political protest. And when your protest puts you at odds with the law, you should expect to face legal consequences.
This law is not justified, nor based on data and is harmful to society. That was enough for our forefathers, civil rights and virtually every advance towards freedom.

Is there any point where law/government is too extreme for you, or do you lick the boot for any decree?
Believing or pretending you're above those consequences or that the law shouldn't apply to you because you disagree with it is absurd.
That's EXACTLY what took place during the civil rights era.

No it's not. Civil rights activists knew and accepted that they'd be punished according to the existing law. They determined that that sacrifice was justified in their effort to change laws they felt were unjust.

To steal a line from a song I enjoy, this guy wants the glory without the work -- the scars and story without the hurt.

If you want to protest, fine. Don't cry when it's time to face the consequences of your actions and realize most just think you're acting like a twat.
BaylorFTW
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bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

Forest Bueller_bf said:

With a per capita death rate of .000685 in Canada and now 61% of Canadians being partially vaccinated and 71% of those 12 and over this is just stupid at this point.

Absolutely government overreach.

The service was outside, there would be virtually a 0% chance of spreading the illness in that setting.

Yea, I'm all for following the law. Not stupid meaningless laws.

Let each individual at this point determine the amount of risk they wish to take. Nobody is being forced to attend services. It seem to be voluntary. Don't feel safe, don't go. Feel safe go.

I don't necessarily disagree with the justification of this particular order at this point, but the law is the law.

Until it's lifted/loosened, you either follow it or accept the consequences of not following it.

This dude was warned not to violate the order and knew the consequences of violating it. When you knowingly break the rules, even rules you disagree with, you should expect to face the consequences. Choosing to cry persecution when you're held to the same standards most others would be is weak sauce.
I'm confused. Was it weak sauce for Rosa or not? Is it only weak sauce for this guy? Is it wrong to protest while things are still minor or should people wait until many are in jail, many are on back of the bus, many are aborted, many are enslaved? You see all of these items fall/fell within the law and all of these items, in my opinion, are wrong.

You're clearly failing to grasp a fairly obvious distinction here. Ignoring completely the causes (and the fairly wide disparity in justification between them IMO), Rosa Parks and those like her didn't cry victim when faced with the consequences of their protests. They weighed that into their decision to protest and decided their cause was worth the personal sacrifice.

That this guy wants to protest by violating the order isn't the issue. If he feels strongly enough about it, fine. I think he's being melodramatic, but that's beside the point. The issue is that he wants to violate the order without any of the consequences that come with that. He's acting like an entitled child and trying to pass himself off as a victim.

Rosa Parks didn't need to broadcast that she was a victim of injustice to be accepted by contemporaries and eventually history as one. Her cause and actions spoke for themselves. This guy likely thinks this is his Rosa Parks moment, but he's sadly mistaken.
Maybe you don't appreciate the value and importance of worship for practicing Christians? Are you a practicing Christian?
Doc Holliday
How long do you want to ignore this user?
bear2be2 said:

Doc Holliday said:

bear2be2 said:

Doc Holliday said:

bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

bear2be2 said:

Porteroso said:

Violate the law, and you usually get consequences.

A lot of people think they can break the law to serve a higher purpose, and that higher purpose is usually their own pride. If the pastor would be willing to take in a leper at his home church, I would concede maybe he is truly seeking to obey the "gather in my name" literally. But I bet he just doesn't think covid was a big enough deal to pause his in person meetings.
And this was basically a stunt anyway. The story says he knew he was in violation of the order and decided to hold the service in direct violation of the order anyway.

If you feel the order is unlawful, there are avenues through which to address that. But when you violate the law, you face the consequences. That's not anything new or unique to this pastor.

And comparing this to 30s Germany is utterly idiotic and an insult to those who experienced real persecution for their faith/ethnicity by the Nazis. This is a temporary order made in direct response to a once-in-a-century pandemic that applies to all such gatherings equally. This man wasn't persecuted for his beliefs. He's a political protestor trying to pass himself off as a religious martyr.
Why do you hate Rosa Parks?
Rosa Parks was fighting actual injustice. This guy's just a selfish ***** trying to score points with those in his tribe.

And Rosa Parks and other peaceful protestors during the civil rights movement didn't cry when they were arrested. They expected to be and accepted that as a consequence of their civil disobedience.
"actual injustice " equates to "nothing is bad enough to protest until I say it's bad enough to protest."

Damned uppitty Christians.


In this particular case, it was one damned uppity Christian. It looks like just about everyone else managed to navigate this order without making a spectacle of themselves.

But a temporary order that applies to all groups does not equal established discriminatory law based on race, ethnicity or religion. And it won't no matter how hard some you try to equate the two.

This wasn't persecution. It was a political protest. And when your protest puts you at odds with the law, you should expect to face legal consequences.
This law is not justified, nor based on data and is harmful to society. That was enough for our forefathers, civil rights and virtually every advance towards freedom.

Is there any point where law/government is too extreme for you, or do you lick the boot for any decree?
Believing or pretending you're above those consequences or that the law shouldn't apply to you because you disagree with it is absurd.
That's EXACTLY what took place during the civil rights era.

No it's not. Civil rights activists knew and accepted that they'd be punished according to the existing law. They determined that that sacrifice was justified in their effort to change laws they felt were unjust.
This preacher knew he'd be punished by existing COVID law.

He determined his sacrifice was justified in his effort to change COVID law he feels is unjust.

It's the same thing.
Sam Lowry
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What's sad is that Canada is reaching new lows on a regular basis, but it has nothing to do with Covid. This pastor and others like him are counterproductive and a distraction from the very real injustices faced by Christians today.
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