Baylor is getting more football recruits, they're just Temple quality,not Baylor tier

10,614 Views | 77 Replies | Last: 8 yr ago by Assassin
Kite23
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You cant even be happy about getting recruits period guys. Anyone who commits now is Temple tier. And from the USA Today no less. What a hatchet job!


http://usatodayhss.com/2017/baylor-is-getting-more-football-recruits-theyre-just-temple-quality-not-baylor-quality
Amy Pagitt
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"All of this fails to demonstrate what yeoman's work it has been for Rhule to keep the program level-headed and moving forward. It's been nothing short of a miracle for Rhule to both keep the program's head together and moving forward amidst the maelstrom created by each slow drip of information about the school's rape scandal."

Bad writing is bad. Also, HOT TAKES ARE PIPIN' HOT AND ALSO BAD.
Weston Rogers
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"Cameron Smith has spent more than 10 years covering prep and college sports across the east coast, reporting in Tennessee, Connecticut, Massachusetts, Washington D.C. and now New York. A former high school lacrosse and basketball player and college rower, he founded Yahoo Sports' Prep Rally blog before joining USA Today. He remains Loyal Forever to Austin High, and believes fervently that Texas is the next great hotbed of prep lacrosse."



That's a strange way to say UT
Doc Holliday
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We might get Bohanon for crying out loud along with the 2nd best recruiting class in the Big12.

This guy is an idiot lol
DoughboyDeluxe
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Kite23 said:

You cant even be happy about getting recruits period guys. Anyone who commits now is Temple tier. And from the USA Today no less. What a hatchet job!


http://usatodayhss.com/2017/baylor-is-getting-more-football-recruits-theyre-just-temple-quality-not-baylor-quality
That has to be one of the most obvious cases of a writer trying to force his bias on his readers that I have ever seen. He is from Austin originally in case you were wondering.

The whole time Briles was here he never got more than four 4 star or higher guys in a single class, and he only did that twice. Rhule has one 4 star guy and two that could get bumped to 4 star by the end of the recruiting season. Not to mention the possibility of Bush and Bohanon still out there. Just an absolutely terrible article.

I am going to make another post with the text of the article so that hack doesn't get any clicks from us.
DoughboyDeluxe
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Quote:

There's good news and bad news for Baylor football fans. First, the good news: After escaping (for now) a potential NCAA death penalty for truly deplorable Title IX violations amidst a purported (and pretty well-proven) series of rape cover-ups, Baylor and new coach Matt Rhule are successfully recruiting talent to the program again.
While still relatively early in the 2018 recruiting cycle, Rhule already has 18 commitments after the Tuesday pledges of Joseph Ogunbanjoand Connor Galvin. It's an encouraging start for Rhule's time in Waco on one hand, but on another it could serve as a concern for Bears fans, for one reason: So far, Baylor's Class of 2018 looks a lot more like a typical Temple recruiting class than an old school, Art Briles Baylor class.
As of August 1, Baylor has 18 commits but just one ranked as a four-star or better. That's Joshua Fleeks, a Cedar Hill (Texas) wide receiver who still holds scholarship offers from Georgia, Tennessee, UCLA and Texas Tech, among others. If you think any of those programs are giving up on Fleeks, think again.
The rest of Baylor's class is comprised entirely of current three-star recruits.
In fact, if one goes back to 2015, when Rhule was leading Temple and Baylor was at the peak of Art Briles' power, the Owls landed a class that was eerily similar to the one Rhule is putting together this year.
Meanwhile, Briles' 2015 class was far different than the current one heading to Baylor. Compared to Fleeks' lone status as an incoming four-star Baylor commit, the 2015 Baylor recruiting class included three four-star recruits, including star quarterback Jarrett Stidham.
Temple's 2015 class? It also featured 18 members. None of them were four stars.
That disparity between 2015 and 2018 Baylor underscores how hard it will be for the Bears to continue keeping pace. Compare Baylor's current class with the one sported by new Texas coach Tom Herman, which features a five-star, 10 four-star and three three-star recruits, and it's not hard to see how a talent disparity could emerge, and quickly.
All of this fails to demonstrate what yeoman's work it has been for Rhule to keep the program level-headed and moving forward. It's been nothing short of a miracle for Rhule to both keep the program's head together and moving forward amidst the maelstrom created by each slow drip of information about the school's rape scandal.
Still, it's not good enough to keep pace with the Longhorns of the world. It may have been effective to keep Temple near the top of the American Athletic Conference, but it will be difficult to continue treading water in the Big XII. Only time will show how Rhule adjusts.
90sBear
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I think I've read that same article (or some variation of it) every year for the last 119 years, give or take. "Baylor doesn't recruit well enough to compete against the UT's of the world", ad nauseam.
Johnny Bear
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DoughboyDeluxe said:

Kite23 said:

You cant even be happy about getting recruits period guys. Anyone who commits now is Temple tier. And from the USA Today no less. What a hatchet job!


http://usatodayhss.com/2017/baylor-is-getting-more-football-recruits-theyre-just-temple-quality-not-baylor-quality
That has to be one of the most obvious cases of a writer trying to force his bias on his readers that I have ever seen. He is from Austin originally in case you were wondering.

The whole time Briles was here he never got more than four 4 star or higher guys in a single class, and he only did that twice. Rhule has one 4 star guy and two that could get bumped to 4 star by the end of the recruiting season. Not to mention the possibility of Bush and Bohanon still out there. Just an absolutely terrible article.

I am going to make another post with the text of the article so that hack doesn't get any clicks from us.
Also, Briles won back to back Big 12 Titles with teams led by guys that came from weaker recruiting classes than the one Rhule is currently building for 2018. It certainly remains to be seen as to whether or not Rhule is going to be "Briles like" with his on the field success, but at this point it's hard to not be excited about what he's done and is doing from a recruiting standpoint and I agree that article is nothing more than a biased hit piece.
Kite23
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I dont understand how this guy spins three stars as a sign of weakness. For the majority of our Briles term, we lived and died by three stars. I dont even think our five stars panned out for us.
Assassin
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This is the old 'pick on church school, the state schools are better' bit.

The 800lb gorilla in the room should have been the focus of the story 'despite allegations, Rhule is still assembling a solid class'. Would have been a much better nationwide read instead of the one he wrote.
UniquelyUrsine
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One of the Austin faithful, here is an excerpt from another of his terribly written articles:


Quote:

As the Longhorns incoming class for 2018, the first under head coach Tom Herman, begins to take shape, Herman's past success as a quarterback guru, and his staff's track record for driving significant and rapid improvement across all offensive roles, has helped drive much of the nation's top talent toward Austin.
but don't let these articles hide the truth that on Saturday, November 19 at 3:30 PM

Something happened that hadn't happened since 1938, Bill Snyder wasn't even born yet.

Kansas Jay-hawks 24 - Texas Longhorns 21



- This was Kansas' first win against an FBS team in over two calendar years
- This was their first win over a Big 12 team besides Iowa State since the 2013 season
- This was Texas' biggest loss according to Vegas in over 20 years
- Texas will be paying Charlie Strong $10 million dollars this year to NOT coach



Oops.
tstuck
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After escaping (for now) a potential NCAA death penalty for truly deplorable Title IX violations amidst a purported (and pretty well-proven) series of rape cover-ups, Baylor and new coach Matt Rhule are successfully recruiting talent to the program again.

Not to get in an argument about what may or may not have happened. But the statement "and pretty well-proven" is nonsense. More like pretty well speculated by the media.
Kite23
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tstuck said:

After escaping (for now) a potential NCAA death penalty for truly deplorable Title IX violations amidst a purported (and pretty well-proven) series of rape cover-ups, Baylor and new coach Matt Rhule are successfully recruiting talent to the program again.

Not to get in an argument about what may or may not happen. But the statement "and pretty well-proven" is nonsense. More like pretty well speculated by the media.


And we have yet to see more than 2 convictions in criminal court.
Pale Rider
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Rubbish!
Assassin
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Pale Rider said:

Rubbish!
Glad you made it over here Frank!
UniquelyUrsine
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LBKBEAR
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Really dumb opinions aside, this guy has less than 2,000 followers on twitter. He is going to need a lot more dumb hot takes if he wants to catch up to @theaverageshark in followers. That twitter handle just posts 'swim swim swim swim' repeatedly and has almost 100,000 followers.
Kite23
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baylorgrad00 said:




Btfo
TommyCWood
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I see little difference. If Rhule can win with these types of classes, bigger names will start coming in. We started to see it at the end of Briles tenure so I guess we will have to wait and see.
S11
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Development and system fit matters just as much. Example?

Bill Snyder is 5-2 vs UT since 2010 despite getting annihilated on signing day when compared to Mack/Charlie.
JusHappy2BeHere
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All the Preseason top 25's are coming out now...


I really miss the days when we were a lock for top 25...usually top 15... deserving of top 10....



I really miss 2 years ago
"When I despair, I remember that all through history the ways of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants, and murderers, and for a time they can seem invincible, but in the end they always fall. Think of it--always."

Mahatma Gandhi
la1037
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Hmmmm... Maybe this makes some of you mad. I get that. But isn't there some truth to it? Briles had us heading to the upper tier in recruiting. Rhule is doing well all things considered, but he is taking kids Texas and OU don't really want.

We are doing well to keep a middle of the Big 12 pack status in recruiting. But its going to take a heck of a coach to get us back to the top. I hope so, but there is no way to know right now if Rhule has what it takes to get us there.

UniquelyUrsine
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la1037 said:

But isn't there some truth to it? Briles had us heading to the upper tier in recruiting. Rhule is doing well all things considered, but he is taking kids Texas and OU don't really want.

We are doing well to keep a middle of the Big 12 pack status in recruiting.
CMR has done all of this without coaching a single down at Baylor. Not one. CAB is not going to be coaching anywhere... ever again. So wherever he had us going is irrelevant. I will fondly remember some of the football days of yore but alas they are gone.

We will know more about our future in a few months.
Surf Oso
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Well, we'll just see how it pans out on the field. Surprisingly, Mr Smith fails to point out that Rhule, with a bunch of 2 stars and 3 stars with crappy facilities, won his conference and beat Herman which boasted new facilities and 3 star and 4 star players.

Krieg
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Just win and the recruiting will be fine. Lose and it won't be. It's really that simple.
Assassin
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baylorgrad00 said:

la1037 said:

But isn't there some truth to it? Briles had us heading to the upper tier in recruiting. Rhule is doing well all things considered, but he is taking kids Texas and OU don't really want.

We are doing well to keep a middle of the Big 12 pack status in recruiting.
CMR has done all of this without coaching a single down at Baylor. Not one. CAB is not going to be coaching anywhere... ever again. So wherever he had us going is irrelevant. I will fondly remember some of the football days of yore but alas they are gone.

We will know more about our future in a few months.
Thats what really bugs me about all of this. If they had just laid things out in the open, made the cuts that needed to be made AT ALL LEVELS, paid the price - whatever it was, we would be on the backend of this thing now and moving on.
snarebear55
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The crux of the ratings argument seems to be strictly number of 4 stars and number of 3 stars. There's a huge variance in 3 star players. Even if Rhule had a class of complete 3 stars at Temple and Baylor, his Baylor class could be MUCH better.

Using a ratings metric on a 100 pt scale (as previously shown) is a MUCH better indicator of how well a team is recruiting. That 'writer' is using numbers in a dubious, 'proofiness' way to support his argument.
BUGWBBear
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tstuck said:

After escaping (for now) a potential NCAA death penalty for truly deplorable Title IX violations amidst a purported (and pretty well-proven) series of rape cover-ups, Baylor and new coach Matt Rhule are successfully recruiting talent to the program again.


Not to get in an argument about what may or may not have happened. But the statement "and pretty well-proven" is nonsense. More like pretty well speculated by the media.


Death Penalty? Whoever the ghey boy in bondage was that wrote that needs to be reminded that no one gets the death penalty. And if anyone deserved to get it more over the past 40 years, it'd be UT and OU.
Texasjeremy
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Lets compare, shall we, here is the class ranking, as well as the top 5 recruits from each class:

TEMPLE
2014 (#69)
80.35 - AVERAGE RATING
80.59 - MEDIAN RATING
TOP 5
86.78 - Cequan Jefferson, CB (Fork Union, VA)
86.34 - Anthony Davis, CB (Monroeville, PA)
85.70 - Aaron Ruff, OL (Philadelphia, PA)
85.67 - Julio Derosier, DT (College of the Sequoias)
84.20 - Delvon Randall, S (Monroeville, PA)

2015 (#80)
80.12 - AVERAGE RATING
79.84 - MEDIAN RATING
TOP 5
87.39 - T.J. Simmons, RB (Lakeland, FL)
87.11 - Kareem Ali, CB (Sicklerville, NJ)
84.67 - Delvon Randall, S (Esat Coast Prep)
84.63 - Chapelle Russell, RB (Lakewood, NJ)
83.35 - Dana Levine, DE (Hallandale, FL)

2016 (#59)
81.58 - AVERAGE RATING
80.70 - MEDIAN RATING
TOP 5
92.63 - Karamo Dioubate, DT (Philadelphia, PA)
87.31 - Greg Webb, DT (Hutchinson CC)
85.84 - Anthony Russo, QB (Warminster, PA)
85.60 - Keyvone Bruton, S (Norfolk, VA)
85.10 - Tyliek Raynor, RB (Philadelphia, PA)

2017 (#119)
78.78 - AVERAGE RATING
78.56 - MEDIAN RATING
TOP 5
84.78 - Todd Centeio, QB (Palm Beach Gardens, FL)
82.07 - Griffin Sestili, TE (Wexford, PA)
80.33 - Arnold Ebiketie, LB (Kensington, MD)
79.93 - Audley Isaacs, LB (Wayne, PA)
79.32 - Jeremy Jennings, CB (Exton, PA)

2018 (#60)
80.88 - AVERAGE RATING
80.99 - MEDIAN RATING
TOP 5
86.15 - Sean Ryan, WR (Brooklyn, NY)
84.99 - David Martin-Robinson, ATH (Landisville, PA)
83.95 - Trad Beatty, QB (Columbia, SC)
83.33 - Amir Gillis, ATH (Philadelphia, PA)
83.14 - Kyle Dobbins, APB (Richland, NJ)

BAYLOR
2014 (#25)
85.39 - AVERAGE RATING
83.92 - MEDIAN RATING
TOP 5
98.54 - KD Cannon, WR (Mount Pleasant, TX)
97.53 - Davion Hall, ATH (Texarkana, TX)
90.79 - Terence Williams, ATH (Ennis, TX)
89.29 - T'Kevian Rockwell, LB (Wylie, TX)
88.34 - Ishmael Zamora, WR (Houston, TX)

2015 (#36)
85.20 - AVERAGE RATING
84.32 - MEDIAN
TOP 5
98.24 - Jarrett Stidham, QB (Stephenville, TX)
91.99 - Blake Lynch, WR (Gilmer, TX)
90.68 - JaMycal Hasty, RB (Longview, TX)
87.82 - Pooh Stricklin, WR (Waco, TX)
87.77 - J.W. Ketchum III, ATH (Houston, TX)

2016 (#40)
86.03 - AVERAGE RATING
86.14 - MEDIAN AVERAGE
TOP 5
89.13 - Bravvion Roy, DT (Spring, TX)
88.09 - Zach Smith, QB (Grandview, TX)
88.02 - B.J.Autry, OL (Coffeyville CC)
87.98 - Jeremy Faulk, DT (Garden City CC)
87.80 - Jared Atkinson, WR (Mesquite, TX)

2017 (#39)
84.62 - AVERAGE RATING
84.50 - MEDIAN RATING
TOP 5
89.28 - Xavier Newman, OL (Desoto, TX)
87.91 - Gavin Holmes, WR (Justin, TX)
87.86 - R.J. Sneed, WR (Cypress, TX)
87.72 - Trestan Ebner, ATH (Henderson, TX)
86.84 - Johnathan Lovett, ATH (Burlington, NJ)

2018 (#24)
85.76 - AVERAGE RATING
85.41 - MEDIAN RATING
TOP 5
90.69 - Joshua Fleeks, WR (Cedar Hill, TX)
88.63 - Kalon Barnes, WR (Silsbee, TX)
88.14 - Stanley Hackett, ATH (Pasadena, TX)
86.94 - Connor Galvin, OL (Katy, TX)
86.76 - Joshua Landry, DT (Houston, TX)
Kite23
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Man its always crazy to see the shift over the years in rankings.
Courtesy_Flush
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Rankings don't take into account the intangibles recruits have i.e. work ethic, leadership, etc. Rhule is doing a good job of looking at the kid as a whole, not just his athleticism and football skills.
Grumpy
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I remember when we used to celebrate 3 star recruits. It was really not too long ago!
BaylorProud77
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Assassin said:

Pale Rider said:

Rubbish!
Glad you made it over here Frank!
Already has August devotions up.
BUFan428
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recruiting media is a way to keep the clicks up. So every school and recruiter will inflate talents. Speculation is more fun because there aren't results and everyone becomes an expert.

The thing we all hope for is that Rhule does great with "average" recruits. Wins and losses at the end of the season matter, not the potential to be great.

Much like basic physics, potential just means you have just haven't met the bar you are capable of.
baylorfan59
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As you can recall Briles started with 2 and 3 star and developed them....We just have to see how Coach Rule does on the developing..
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