How would the 2021 Baylor team have done against auburn week one. This is a team that beat a bad Texas state team 28-21. I would predict it would have lost to that auburn team something like 24-10 give or take, and it ended up having the best season in Baylor history. Just another reason I remain optimistic about the potential for the season I would still rather have our 2025 team with its offensive firepower over that team because I believe the defense can improve and can become a more well rounded team. Time will tell of course and injuries are huge for college football outcomes.

If our QB could just run.

Ewalker80 said:

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How would the 2021 Baylor team have done against auburn week one. This is a team that beat a bad Texas state team 29-20. I would predict it would have lost to that auburn team something like 24-10 give or take, and it ended up having the best season in Baylor history. Just another reason I remain optimistic about the potential for the season I would still rather have our 2025 team with its offensive firepower over that team because I believe the defense can improve and can become a more well rounded team. Time will tell of course and injuries are huge for college football outcomes.

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My benchmark for Baylor football isn't 2021. It's 2010-2015.

Realitybites said:

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My benchmark for Baylor football isn't 2021. It's 2010-2015.

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We were on the precipice of greatness and annual national relevance. That can't be the standard, unless you want to always be disappointed.

Realitybites said:

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My benchmark for Baylor football isn't 2021. It's 2010-2015.

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That was a blink of the eye moment brought about by a unicorn coach. It's come & gone, never coming back. Be thankful that we got to experience it, but you're in for endless disappointment waiting for that to return.

Realitybites said:

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My benchmark for Baylor football isn't 2021. It's 2010-2015.

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We went 7-6 and 8-5 for two of those seasons.

It wasn't until 2013 that we were clearly an elite program.

Karab said:

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Realitybites said:

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My benchmark for Baylor football isn't 2021. It's 2010-2015.

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We went 7-6 and 8-5 for two of those seasons.

It wasn't until 2013 that we were clearly an elite program.

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And even that "elite program" got its ass beat by UCF and couldn't move either line against Michigan State.

Baylor was really good under Briles, but we were closer to 2024 Indiana than we were to winning a national title.

We actively avoided competition in nonconference, played two- or three-game schedules, beat up on dregs and lost the big one virtually every season.

bear2be2 said:

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Karab said:

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Realitybites said:

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My benchmark for Baylor football isn't 2021. It's 2010-2015.

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We went 7-6 and 8-5 for two of those seasons.

It wasn't until 2013 that we were clearly an elite program.

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And even that "elite program" got its ass beat by UCF and couldn't move either line against Michigan State.

Baylor was really good under Briles, but we were closer to 2024 Indiana than we were to winning a national title.

We actively avoided competition in nonconference, played two- or three-game schedules, beat up on dregs and lost the big one virtually every season.

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Ding ding ding.

Robert Wilson said:

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We were on the precipice of greatness and annual national relevance. That can't be the standard, unless you want to always be disappointed.

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That is the standard for other small private Universities like Notre Dame, Miami, and USC.

There's absolutely no reason why Baylor cannot aspire to and achieve that level of greatness and annual national relevance. It was one thing during the lost decade in the Big 12, when the fan base basically accepted that we were going to be the Vanderbilt of the Big 12.

Then Art Briles came along and proved that a dominant program could be built in Waco just as easily as it could in South Bend.

To accept less is a failure and lack of vision on the part of university leadership.

Realitybites said:

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Robert Wilson said:

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We were on the precipice of greatness and annual national relevance. That can't be the standard, unless you want to always be disappointed.

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That is the standard for other small private Universities like Notre Dame, Miami, and USC.

There's absolutely no reason why Baylor cannot aspire to and achieve that level of greatness and annual national relevance. It was one thing during the lost decade in the Big 12, when the fan base basically accepted that we were going to be the Vanderbilt of the Big 12.

Then Art Briles came along and proved that a dominant program could be built in Waco just as easily as it could in South Bend.

To accept less is a failure and lack of vision on the part of university leadership.

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Bolded your last sentence. That's the issue. As an institution/community, we just don't care that much. We're quite content winning 6-8 games a year. It *might* even be the case that winning more than that and being disruptive / nationally relevant would make some of our folks uncomfortable.

bear2be2 said:

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Karab said:

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Realitybites said:

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My benchmark for Baylor football isn't 2021. It's 2010-2015.

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We went 7-6 and 8-5 for two of those seasons.

It wasn't until 2013 that we were clearly an elite program.

---

And even that "elite program" got its ass beat by UCF and couldn't move either line against Michigan State.

Baylor was really good under Briles, but we were closer to 2024 Indiana than we were to winning a national title.

We actively avoided competition in nonconference, played two- or three-game schedules, beat up on dregs and lost the big one virtually every season.

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But remember now……..that commuter school beat down by UCF and the embarrassing collapse to an average Michigan State team did NOT count and you simply cannot attribute that to Baylor and her "elite" coaching.

Pay no attention to that little man behind the curtain!

What does not "accepting" being less than Alabama mean? Firing our coach every year he isn't clearly progressing towards a national championship? The reality is that a new school hasn't won their first national championship since 1996! Florida's first. Think about that. That's before most people on this board were alive. If that is our standard for enjoying Baylor football it's going to cause more disappointment than joy.

Here's the reality. We have potentially a very good team and could potentially have one of our best season's ever. Let's sit back and enjoy it for what it is.

Baylor football can be a really fun hobby but it's a lousy god. Trust me I've been there. And the same is true for Alabama football. You can win 13 natty's but the next year you might lose to an unranked team and if that was your source of meaning in life, you will be disappointed and down in the dumps.

And to be clear I'm preaching to myself here, not down on anyone. But if you have a distorted view of what this team was in the 2010s and what it is now then that's a major red flag to me that you might be putting hope in a dream of Baylor football that never was or will be, exactly where I have been and can still go with finding too much meaning in Baylor football results.

I believe that our university leadership should have a desire for Baylor to have an outstanding football team that represents the university well also. However Notre Dame, USC, and Miami have a lot of built in recruiting advantages that Baylor does not have. Notre Dame has the legendary football history of Knute Rockne, the four horsemen, multiple national championships, and many, many Catholic kids grow up dreaming of playing for Notre Dame. Miami is in Miami and USC is in Southern California. Waco can't compete with those places in terms of being very desirable places to live. I agree that many people are satisfied with 6-8 wins per year rather than be a conference championship contender most every year which should be our goal. Nationally, much easier for a school like Baylor to compete for national championships in basketball than football.

6 wins sucks. I would rather eliminate or drastically reduce our NIL program and drop down to CUSA or Sunbelt than for six wins in the modern big 12 (a shadow of what it used to be by the way) to become what is considered the benchmark for success at Baylor

Youre a clown said:

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6 wins sucks. I would rather eliminate or drastically reduce our NIL program and drop down to CUSA or Sunbelt than for six wins in the modern big 12 (a shadow of what it used to be by the way) to become what is considered the benchmark for success at Baylor

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Glad some of you aren't the AD or we would be looking at seasons that would make the Steele years look like Saban.

Bear8084 said:

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Youre a clown said:

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6 wins sucks. I would rather eliminate or drastically reduce our NIL program and drop down to CUSA or Sunbelt than for six wins in the modern big 12 (a shadow of what it used to be by the way) to become what is considered the benchmark for success at Baylor

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Glad some of you aren't the AD or we would be looking at seasons that would make the Steele years look like Saban.

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What an odd statement. I can't imagine spending Sunday of Labor Day weekend on a message board trying to convince myself with my two or three buddies that six wins is a great season. Gayest thing I've ever seen. Have a nice day

PapaBear2458 said:

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I believe that our university leadership should have a desire for Baylor to have an outstanding football team that represents the university well also. However Notre Dame, USC, and Miami have a lot of built in recruiting advantages that Baylor does not have. Notre Dame has the legendary football history of Knute Rockne, the four horsemen, multiple national championships, and many, many Catholic kids grow up dreaming of playing for Notre Dame. Miami is in Miami and USC is in Southern California. Waco can't compete with those places in terms of being very desirable places to live. I agree that many people are satisfied with 6-8 wins per year rather than be a conference championship contender most every year which should be our goal. Nationally, much easier for a school like Baylor to compete for national championships in basketball than football.

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It's really mostly just coaching. I'm including recruiting within that of course. Miami was a complete joke until Schnellenberger got there and built a culture.

Miami has advantages that we don't have, but we also have advantages that Miami does not have.

Briles had a level of momentum that showed us what was possible. It's just really tough to catch lightning in a bottle with a coach like that. Then there's also the issue that Baylor has a completely different image that it wants to project. There is no way we would even accept becoming what Miami was when they were dominant. It simply could not happen here. We would rather be what we are right now.

Bear8084 said:

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Youre a clown said:

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6 wins sucks. I would rather eliminate or drastically reduce our NIL program and drop down to CUSA or Sunbelt than for six wins in the modern big 12 (a shadow of what it used to be by the way) to become what is considered the benchmark for success at Baylor

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Glad some of you aren't the AD or we would be looking at seasons that would make the Steele years look like Saban.

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Steele went from Baylor back to a coordinate type role and won Natty's at Alabama. Dave is NOT a head coach. That's the frustration on this board and the majority of the fans. If we are gonna lose games, then I'd rather lose with a real head coach. He can't make adjustments quickly enough during the games and shows ZERO emotion when you need your ****ing coach to yell/scream enough to get a 15 yard flag. The guy is a *****.

BluesBear said:

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Bear8084 said:

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Youre a clown said:

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6 wins sucks. I would rather eliminate or drastically reduce our NIL program and drop down to CUSA or Sunbelt than for six wins in the modern big 12 (a shadow of what it used to be by the way) to become what is considered the benchmark for success at Baylor

---

Glad some of you aren't the AD or we would be looking at seasons that would make the Steele years look like Saban.

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Steele went from Baylor back to a coordinate type role and won Natty's at Alabama. Dave is NOT a head coach. That's the frustration on this board and the majority of the fans. If we are gonna lose games, then I'd rather lose with a real head coach. He can't make adjustments quickly enough during the games and shows ZERO emotion when you need your ****ing coach to yell/scream enough to get a 15 yard flag. The guy is a *****.

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LOL No. But the rage is cute.

BluesBear said:

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Bear8084 said:

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Youre a clown said:

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6 wins sucks. I would rather eliminate or drastically reduce our NIL program and drop down to CUSA or Sunbelt than for six wins in the modern big 12 (a shadow of what it used to be by the way) to become what is considered the benchmark for success at Baylor

---

Glad some of you aren't the AD or we would be looking at seasons that would make the Steele years look like Saban.

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Steele went from Baylor back to a coordinate type role and won Natty's at Alabama. Dave is NOT a head coach. That's the frustration on this board and the majority of the fans. If we are gonna lose games, then I'd rather lose with a real head coach. He can't make adjustments quickly enough during the games and shows ZERO emotion when you need your ****ing coach to yell/scream enough to get a 15 yard flag. The guy is a *****.

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But he will never be too brash and embarrass us, which at Baylor is extremely important.

The case for optimism rests with the offense and the fact that the Bears will face few tests going forward equal to the one they just did. I also thought a couple of the transfers on defense popped, like Fobbs-White and Jackson. Need a NT to step up, but I think that's more hope/wish than optimism.

The amount of posters who complain about the Briles years is so damm weird to me. Dude won tons of big games

IowaBear said:

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The amount of posters who complain about the Briles years is so damm weird to me. Dude won tons of big games

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We didn't win a single big out-of-conference game under Briles. Nobody outside of the teams playing in them cares about the Alamo, Holliday or Russell Athletic Bowls.

We were afraid to play anyone with a pulse before conference and lost the only two big bowl games we ever played.

Briles was a great football coach and did a lot of impressive things at Baylor. But this idea that he had us on the precipice of national relevance and championship seasons is Baylor fan fiction. It's mythology.

Karab said:

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Realitybites said:

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My benchmark for Baylor football isn't 2021. It's 2010-2015.

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We went 7-6 and 8-5 for two of those seasons.

It wasn't until 2013 that we were clearly an elite program.

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Briles:
2010: 7-6
2011: 10-3
2012: 8-5
2013: 11-2
22014:11-2

Yoda:
2021: 12-2 / Briles' players
2022: 6-7
2023: 3-9
2024: 8-5

This is basically year Five, what's your boy Yoda gonna do?

I still think we can have a good season and I have optimism for this team...but there's a decent chance we are gonna start 0-2.

That wouldn't mean the sky is falling losing to 2 good teams (assuming they both turn out to be "good")...but it would be a downer start for a team I have high hopes of having an 8+ win season.

Bear8084 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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Karab said:

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Realitybites said:

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My benchmark for Baylor football isn't 2021. It's 2010-2015.

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We went 7-6 and 8-5 for two of those seasons.

It wasn't until 2013 that we were clearly an elite program.

---

And even that "elite program" got its ass beat by UCF and couldn't move either line against Michigan State.

Baylor was really good under Briles, but we were closer to 2024 Indiana than we were to winning a national title.

We actively avoided competition in nonconference, played two- or three-game schedules, beat up on dregs and lost the big one virtually every season.

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Ding ding ding.

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It seems like a dream.

Baylor was as relevant as ever during the last several Briles years. What the **** are you talking about? Dude had back to back 11-1 years. And those years included several big conference wins. I don't care about the non conference. 95% of the country plays weak ass non cons. What did we gain by playing Auburn? Other than an 0-1 record. The lengths you and others go to discredit his teams are ridiculous. Dude had BU firmly on the map. The 15 team goes to the playoffs if Russell stays healthy. That's as relevant as one can get.

Realitybites said:

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My benchmark for Baylor football isn't 2021. It's 2010-2015.

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I suspect some potential BU NIL heavyweights are right there with you. The question is whether they'll ever "be back" regarding BU football. I mean, we aren't an "institution of football."

bear2be2 said:

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IowaBear said:

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The amount of posters who complain about the Briles years is so damm weird to me. Dude won tons of big games

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We didn't win a single big out-of-conference game under Briles. Nobody outside of the teams playing in them cares about the Alamo, Holliday or Russell Athletic Bowls.

We were afraid to play anyone with a pulse before conference and lost the only two big bowl games we ever played.

Briles was a great football coach and did a lot of impressive things at Baylor. But this idea that he had us on the precipice of national relevance and championship seasons is Baylor fan fiction. It's mythology.

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The only response I can give to this is two years Briles had us in the National picture plus we literally had a chance to make Final Four (ranked 5or6), but there was NO way CFP/ESPN would allow that. I take solace in that because I will never see anything better from BU football.

One thing is for sure now with the set up of the Two Big Conferences, ESPN, Corporate Sponsors-schools, etc Baylor will Never, Ever, Ever have a chance PERIOD! Everyone can argue the point about the universities commitment / $$$$$$, etc. Baylor NEVER showed any real interest until they almost got kicked to the curb, ie. (PAC12) when aggy told TX to f' off and move to the SEC.
In seventy+ years Baylor has ALWAYS been reactive never proactive. It's just a mega Baptist Church with inexperienced deacons. ND, Miami, and USC went a different path in history and Baylor never even drove to the train station. Hence, here we are same song Seventieth Plus verse. Hope for the occasional weakest conference championship and a lower tier Bowl until realignment and we slide to a Sunbelt or CUSA.

IowaBear said:

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Baylor was as relevant as ever during the last several Briles years. What the **** are you talking about? Dude had back to back 11-1 years. And those years included several big conference wins. I don't care about the non conference. 95% of the country plays weak ass non cons. What did we gain by playing Auburn? Other than an 0-1 record. The lengths you and others go to discredit his teams are ridiculous. Dude had BU firmly on the map. The 15 team goes to the playoffs if Russell stays healthy. That's as relevant as one can get.

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Yep

The culture warriors don't like Briles (bear2be)

And the Baylor company men don't like Briles (most of the paid board)

Those two groups love to re write that history and cherry pick things out of context to pretend we weren't as good as we were

Hard for them to admit what we did to ourselves

I'm 100% with you here. That 2015 was a contender that was killed by injuries. They were better than OU.. and way better than Tex or TCU (their 3 losses) when decently healthy.

The program was on the cusp with real defensive talent finally coming in too. Would have been OU and BU's league for years into the future and I bet some significant OOC wins were coming. Never know now but I think your view is closer to reality than not.

It seems like we are locked in perpetual Gundy mode these days. Show some signs, have a good year now and then, but not tooooo good, have rebuilding years half the time, never really big time expectatons.

Just kinda seems like that sort of loop happening.

We'll see.

Dia del DougO said:

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It seems like we are locked in perpetual Gundy mode these days. Show some signs, have a good year now and then, but not tooooo good, have rebuilding years half the time, never really big time expectatons.

Just kinda seems like that sort of loop happening.

We'll see.

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yup. And you don't need to have a crystal ball to predict next year to be a down year or 'rebuilding' year if we want to be positive about it. Would expect the over/under to be about five wins. I am past the point of ever expecting the defense to be a strength under Aranda, and we lose ~9 starters on offense next year including the best quarterback and running back we've had in years

bear2be2 said:

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Karab said:

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Realitybites said:

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My benchmark for Baylor football isn't 2021. It's 2010-2015.

---

We went 7-6 and 8-5 for two of those seasons.

It wasn't until 2013 that we were clearly an elite program.

---

And even that "elite program" got its ass beat by UCF and couldn't move either line against Michigan State.

Baylor was really good under Briles, but we were closer to 2024 Indiana than we were to winning a national title.

We actively avoided competition in nonconference, played two- or three-game schedules, beat up on dregs and lost the big one virtually every season.

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Bull. 2015 Baylor before Seth gets injured goes to the national championship. We had a good defense with NFL talent, and the most balanced and dangerous offense in the country.

We were getting recruits that UT and Ohio State wanted on both sides of the ball. We were about to be a dynasty.