Yes this season is a wash. If we can get one of carr and tounde to stay that would be awesome. Build around that and really spend in the portal. Bring in mingo and the other freshman. get bodo bodo back and the team next year is looking pretty dang solid

Based on the NBA rookie salaries....they would be better to stay in College as long as possible.

I was really hoping to keep Williams, but your point is valid. Probably not happening now.

Iowa, this has been discussed for a while, and I get not building your whole team around a one and done, but I don't really blame tounde, keynote, walter, vj, etc for our issues.

but the overall strategy isn't great

Which reinforces how dumb CSD strategy is. B2B said it best. Drew is obsessed with shiny toys. It probably makes me a bad fan but I could care less if Mingo comes here. It's not going to change the program trajectory

It's tough. I would understand if it would save us a lot of money to spend elsewhere, but I think overall they haven't been a hinderance to the team. Something needs to change though obviously

How they're being used is the true hindrance imo. Walter and Keyonte were given the lead role on squads they had zero business being the lead dawg on. But again, that ties into the whole player freedom that CSD is known for. Look at Dampsons freshmsn at Houston. HUGE difference.

No I 100% agree. If they're just another 5 star (like not cam boozer) then they shouldn't be given th lead. This year, it's obviously tounde and cam, but i get what you're saying. We need to be able to retain GOOD veterans. i think that's the key. name one good player who's been kept multiple years (since 23). There isn't. We need continuity

Everyone, including me, keeps counting Bodo Bodo as if it's automatic he's gonna be able to take on the top big guys in the Big 12 and excel, but pardon me if I have some reservations after what I've seen this year. The fact is that in 2 years at High Point he played all of 2 games against P5 opponents. He did great in one and so-so in the other. I'm sure I'm just experiencing post Agbim/Rataj syndrome where they also looked great against lower level competition and are just average guys who have been easily taken out by elite Big 12 teams. But, there are no guarantees in my eyes until I see him take the floor against someone like a JT Toppin.

Bearsalwayswin said:

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It's tough. I would understand if it would save us a lot of money to spend elsewhere, but I think overall they haven't been a hinderance to the team. Something needs to change though obviously

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The problem with freshmen is they're almost never good enough to play the roles they think they should be playing. And Drew isn't the type of coach that will right-size their roles to match what is best for the team.

So you end up with players who aren't nearly as good as they think they are (at this stage of their development) doing a bunch of **** that hurts you as much as it helps you.

And bragging about draft picks after ducking out of the tournament in the first weekend just isn't my thing. I couldn't possibly care less how many former players we have in the NBA. I don't even watch the NBA, and in the one-and-done/transfer portal era, I have very little attachment to most of those guys in the first place.

I get not playing them in the center role, but overall the 5 stars have been good. the scheme around them might not be but i don't see how they arent

Big12Fan2024 said:

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Everyone, including me, keeps counting Bodo Bodo as if it's automatic he's gonna be able to take on the top big guys in the Big 12 and excel, but pardon me if I have some reservations after what I've seen this year. The fact is that in 2 years at High Point he played all of 2 games against P5 opponents. He did great in one and so-so in the other. I'm sure I'm just experiencing post Agbim/Rataj syndrome where they also looked great against lower level competition and are just average guys who have been easily taken out by elite Big 12 teams. But, there are no guarantees in my eyes until I see him take the floor against someone like a JT Toppin.

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Post players will make that jump much easier than others because of what we ask them to do in our program. Bodo Bodo has all the tools to excel in the role Scott Drew wants his post players playing.

He can protect the rim and crash the offensive glass. Just don't expect much offense out of him.

The problems are varied but bottom line the talent evaluation in the portal era has been hit or miss, mostly miss. The swing and misses on Obi and Rataj have been devastating. CSD has been unable to adjust to the NIL / transfer portal era. No ability to establish roster continuity.

Doesn't Tommy Lloyd at Arizona start 5 freshmen?

Rhetorical question.. but has he already surpassed Drew as a coach?

Starts 3 true freshman. The difference imo is they're surrounded by talented veterans who've been in the program.

Stefano DiMera said:

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Doesn't Tommy Lloyd at Arizona start 5 freshmen?

Rhetorical question.. but has he already surpassed Drew as a coach?

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I hate to say it, but the list of coaches in the Big 12 who have passed Drew (in current effectiveness, not past accomplishment) is longer than those who haven't.

Baylor is truly an also-ran in this league. We might as well be Arizona State or Colorado at this stage.

bear2be2 said:

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Stefano DiMera said:

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Doesn't Tommy Lloyd at Arizona start 5 freshmen?

Rhetorical question.. but has he already surpassed Drew as a coach?

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I hate to say it, but the list of coaches in the Big 12 who have passed Drew (in current effectiveness, not past accomplishment) is longer than those who haven't.

Baylor is truly an also-ran in this league. We might as well be Arizona State or Colorado at this stage.

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Until we see them play those teams, they may already be ASU or CU. I have watched little of the men this year...primarily watch the women. But with the storm and nothing else to do, we watched some of last night' game against TCU. This team is just not good at all.

Bearsalwayswin said:

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Yes this season is a wash. If we can get one of carr and tounde to stay that would be awesome. Build around that and really spend in the portal. Bring in mingo and the other freshman. get bodo bodo back and the team next year is looking pretty dang solid

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Drew keeps creating the worst of all possiblities. I'm assuming they lost yesterday (can't watch nonsense). But Tounde and Carr are still mocking 1st round (although that is falling) while doing it on a terrible team. So no continuity and no added benefit in season from the guys getting drafted.. brilliant.

To be clear, I do not blame the players for that turnstyle situation. The staff continues to decide on who they will take and how they will structure this roster.

Yes, there have been some terrible breaks but Drew is getting schooled in this era.. just the facts. No other conclusion to draw. At this point, benefit of the doubt is over. Its all prove it from here on out.

Look he gave us a Natty, I love him forever. But he is not a great coach, and even then, we won because of 3-4 special players who just fit together and decided amongst themselves that they could really win if they stayed another year.

It won't happen that way again. Drew will have to address his major shortcomings for us to ever get another conference title. That or somehow get superstar freshmen to commit.

I think Drew can make us a top 10 team again. We need the right combination of players and most importantly we need a return to consistently good defense.

This team has a lot of talent and bursts of offense but really struggles on defense. We are also turnover prone, esp at the worst times.

Drew has earned my respect and patience.

boykin_spaniel said:

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Drew was a great coach. He took over the biggest of dumpster fires and made it respectable and then won a natty. He perfected building rosters right before NIL where transferring was increasing but there wasn't legal money flowing. He convinced almost all the dudes on the natty team and the year before that could've also made a run to redshirt. No small feat. The issue is now it's a free for all and there is no sitting out a year and people get paid to leave. Drew has pivoted back to one and done guys and it's not working. To be fair some guys were meant to be around 2-3 years and left but the idea is a cohesive roster with an Edgecombe mixed in. Drew has earned the right to keep trying for as long as he wants as painful as it might be to watch.

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This just isn't how college sports work anymore. These are pro sports -- Drew says so himself. No serious organization gives a coach carte blanche to suck.

College coaching has always been a performance-based business. That's never been more than the case than it is today because the stakes are higher than they've ever been.

Either Scott Drew gets this figured out, or he will -- and should -- be replaced. His past performance has earned him a ton of goodwill and some extra time to get things turned around. But that time isn't infinite.

And if you don't believe me, just wait and see how short his leash gets when Foster is 20 percent full every game and the department's bottom line starts taking a hit.

Hopefully, it never comes to that point. But another year or two like this one and we'll be drawing flies to our games.

We have hit rock bottom and no one, especially Drew, is happy with this season's results. He will figure out how to right the ship or he will walk away himself. He doesn't need anyone giving him any leash to hang onto a job he no longer has passion for. I only wonder if he has the energy and the desire to do what is necessary for a compete rebuild as opposed to another half-hearted, band-aid approach with another group of one-year rentals.