I'll chime in before the "Moral Victory Warriors" make an appearance.

But in a nutshell - Yes.


From my seat in the arena, there appeared to be several times during the game where this was quite obvious, and I'll just name a few.

#1 - TCU's 'Glue' Guard (Donovyn Hunter) picked up her 3rd foul 3 minutes into the 2nd qtr. With TCU Coach Mark Campbell electing to stick with Hunter, there is NO reason we shouldn't have been going at her constantly throughout that 2nd qtr to get foul #4 on her. If she picks up #4, that likely blows up TCU's game plan. Instead, not only did we not attack her, she ends up finishing the game with 32 minutes and leading all players in assists.

#2 - We didn't shoot nearly as many open 3's as we should have. I'm ok with missing 3's early on and adjusting as the game progresses. But we only had 12 attempts all game long, and by not taking those shots when they became available, we weren't able to spread the floor better and loosen up the TCU interior defense.

#3 - Substitution patterns were questionable throughout the game, but especially at the midway point in the 4th. Given the situation, you could not afford to sub out Vonleh with Prince still in the game and trailing by 6. Call one of your 4 timeouts at that point if you have to. But her absence led to TCU getting a clean look for a three that pushed their lead to 9 with 4:29 left, and that was effectively the dagger.

#4 - Perimeter defense was atrocious in the 4th, and resulted in 3 wide-open looks that led to our demise. With as well as Vonley played against Prince, you could afford to do less switching and just trust your team to play solid, straight-up defense. If TCU hits tight, contested 3-point shots, then so be it.


Going into the half, I thought to myself that this would be the biggest half of Nicki's career here at Baylor, and would determine whether we'd finally turned the corner in this new era.

Well, sadly, it looks like there is still a bit of work to be done. And assuming she is going to be here for the long haul, then I really hope she can be successful.

But we shouldn't be making any excuses. We led late in the 3rd, Vonley had basically neutralized Prince with her own stellar play, and it was only a 2-point game heading into the 4th qtr.

So we had TCU right where we wanted them, but didn't get it done. And a big part of that is directly tied to coaching.

We can spin this however we want, but once you neutralize Prince (which Vonley did), then you have to take advantage and put your team in the best position to win.

And imo, that didn't happen last night.

I don't understand why some look at always blaming Coach C. It is always easy to coach and second guess from one's seat.

LTBear19 said:

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I'll chime in before the "Moral Victory Warriors" make an appearance.

But in a nutshell - Yes.


From my seat in the arena, there appeared to be several times during the game where this was quite obvious, and I'll just name a few.

#1 - TCU's 'Glue' Guard (Donovyn Hunter) picked up her 3rd foul 3 minutes into the 2nd qtr. With TCU Coach Mark Campbell electing to stick with Hunter, there is NO reason we shouldn't have been going at her constantly throughout that 2nd qtr to get foul #4 on her. If she picks up #4, that likely blows up TCU's game plan. Instead, not only did we not attack her, she ends up finishing the game with 32 minutes and leading all players in assists.

#2 - We didn't shoot nearly as many open 3's as we should have. I'm ok with missing 3's early on and adjusting as the game progresses. But we only had 12 attempts all game long, and by not taking those shots when they became available, we weren't able to spread the floor better and loosen up the TCU interior defense.

#3 - Substitution patterns were questionable throughout the game, but especially at the midway point in the 4th. Given the situation, you could not afford to sub out Vonleh with Prince still in the game and trailing by 6. Call one of your 4 timeouts at that point if you have to. But her absence led to TCU getting a clean look for a three that pushed their lead to 9 with 4:29 left, and that was effectively the dagger.

#4 - Perimeter defense was atrocious in the 4th, and resulted in 3 wide-open looks that led to our demise. With as well as Vonley played against Prince, you could afford to do less switching and just trust your team to play solid, straight-up defense. If TCU hits tight, contested 3-point shots, then so be it.


Going into the half, I thought to myself that this would be the biggest half of Nicki's career here at Baylor, and would determine whether we'd finally turned the corner in this new era.

Well, sadly, it looks like there is still a bit of work to be done. And assuming she is going to be here for the long haul, then I really hope she can be successful.

But we shouldn't be making any excuses. We led late in the 3rd, Vonley had basically neutralized Prince with her own stellar play, and it was only a 2-point game heading into the 4th qtr.

So we had TCU right where we wanted them, but didn't get it done. And a big part of that is directly tied to coaching.

We can spin this however we want, but once you neutralize Prince (which Vonley did), then you have to take advantage and put your team in the best position to win.

And imo, that didn't happen last night.

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No way we were out coached. Defense was great. That was great effort from the players and great coaching. We missed too many shots and layups. That is not on coaching.

This is from someone who hasn't watched many games. I thought the thing that kept them in the game was effort and coaching. The game plan was tremendous. Show hard on the pick and roll on the lefty, attack and get to the free throw line and get it to the big girl down low. Coaching and effort did plenty to win this game. We couldn't make a shot and they hit some big ones.

NO WE WERE NOT OUTCOACHED. !!!! Game plan and in game coaching was very good.

Outcoached? No. Outshot? Yes. Some days, your shot doesn't fall.

What happen with Andrew's? I did not expect her to have one point.

LTBear19 said:

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I'll chime in before the "Moral Victory Warriors" make an appearance.

But in a nutshell - Yes.


From my seat in the arena, there appeared to be several times during the game where this was quite obvious, and I'll just name a few.

#1 - TCU's 'Glue' Guard (Donovyn Hunter) picked up her 3rd foul 3 minutes into the 2nd qtr. With TCU Coach Mark Campbell electing to stick with Hunter, there is NO reason we shouldn't have been going at her constantly throughout that 2nd qtr to get foul #4 on her. If she picks up #4, that likely blows up TCU's game plan. Instead, not only did we not attack her, she ends up finishing the game with 32 minutes and leading all players in assists.

#2 - We didn't shoot nearly as many open 3's as we should have. I'm ok with missing 3's early on and adjusting as the game progresses. But we only had 12 attempts all game long, and by not taking those shots when they became available, we weren't able to spread the floor better and loosen up the TCU interior defense.

#3 - Substitution patterns were questionable throughout the game, but especially at the midway point in the 4th. Given the situation, you could not afford to sub out Vonleh with Prince still in the game and trailing by 6. Call one of your 4 timeouts at that point if you have to. But her absence led to TCU getting a clean look for a three that pushed their lead to 9 with 4:29 left, and that was effectively the dagger.

#4 - Perimeter defense was atrocious in the 4th, and resulted in 3 wide-open looks that led to our demise. With as well as Vonley played against Prince, you could afford to do less switching and just trust your team to play solid, straight-up defense. If TCU hits tight, contested 3-point shots, then so be it.


Going into the half, I thought to myself that this would be the biggest half of Nicki's career here at Baylor, and would determine whether we'd finally turned the corner in this new era.

Well, sadly, it looks like there is still a bit of work to be done. And assuming she is going to be here for the long haul, then I really hope she can be successful.

But we shouldn't be making any excuses. We led late in the 3rd, Vonley had basically neutralized Prince with her own stellar play, and it was only a 2-point game heading into the 4th qtr.

So we had TCU right where we wanted them, but didn't get it done. And a big part of that is directly tied to coaching.

We can spin this however we want, but once you neutralize Prince (which Vonley did), then you have to take advantage and put your team in the best position to win.

And imo, that didn't happen last night.

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I disagree. For this game we were outmanned.

Sometimes you give credit to the other team. TCU held us to shooting 26.7% from the field, 16.7% from the three point line, outrebounded us by 8 and held us to 48 points. They did it on the road with our biggest crowd ever in the new arena. We were not outcoached.

TCU does have a very good coach.

DFW Bill said:

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Sometimes you give credit to the other team. TCU held us to shooting 26.7% from the field, 16.7% from the three point line, outrebounded us by 8 and held us to 48 points. They did it on the road with our biggest crowd ever in the new arena. We were not outcoached.

TCU does have a very good coach.

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It will be interesting to see what he can accomplish next year without his 6th and 7th year rented veterans that were 60% of his offense.

For those grizzled oldtimers who have been around here awhile, TCU reminds me a bit of the Nebraska women who won the conference in 2010. That year OU had just lost the Paris twins, and Griner et al were freshmen still trying to figure it out, and Nebraska came out of nowhere with a bunch of big burly seniors, improving from 6-10 in conference and 15-16 overall in 2009 to 16-0 and an undefeated regular season in 2010, enough to be a 1 seed in the NCAAs. But they got blown out by Aggy in the conference semis, then lost in the Sweet Sixteen to finish 32-2. Meanwhile, both OU and BU made the Final Four in 2010. In 2011, Nebraska finished 3-13 and 13-18, last in the Big12.

whitetrash said:

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DFW Bill said:

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Sometimes you give credit to the other team. TCU held us to shooting 26.7% from the field, 16.7% from the three point line, outrebounded us by 8 and held us to 48 points. They did it on the road with our biggest crowd ever in the new arena. We were not outcoached.

TCU does have a very good coach.

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It will be interesting to see what he can accomplish next year without his 6th and 7th year rented veterans that were 60% of his offense.

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Prince is what made it work. Van Lith is good, but there are many teams that have someone that is really good. What they don't have is the piece that forces teams to not be able to concentrate on the really good player. Replace Prince with a good post who doesn't have such length and it dramatically alters, IMO, how someone like Van Lith can operate.

So, for TCU the question becomes who he can get to not only replace that 60%, but who can he find that can allow 2/3 of that 60% to be able to operate to full potential and more because the inside is basically locked down. There aren't many of those around that are going to come to a Big XII team. Prince was probably a special case that I will assume some teams did not want to risk the baggage. TCU got away with it. We would never have (ESPN would have been all over us), nor would I have wanted to try.

And even with his rented players as you put it we almost beat them being down one of the best rebounders in the league. On the eye-test TCU looks really good, but other teams out there have more size and depth in the middle than do we that may take away the effectiveness of that piece in the middle and in turn reduce the effectiveness of someone like HVL. And if we do play them again on Sunday, I would not bet the farm on TCU. Hope we get the chance to see.

LOL no way. We were without our top scorer/rebounder, shot less than 25% and still were within two possessions of winning. It was an incredible job of coaching. It was just unfortunate that all of our guards and forwards shot very poorly.

LTBear19 said:

---

I'll chime in before the "Moral Victory Warriors" make an appearance.

But in a nutshell - Yes.


From my seat in the arena, there appeared to be several times during the game where this was quite obvious, and I'll just name a few.

#1 - TCU's 'Glue' Guard (Donovyn Hunter) picked up her 3rd foul 3 minutes into the 2nd qtr. With TCU Coach Mark Campbell electing to stick with Hunter, there is NO reason we shouldn't have been going at her constantly throughout that 2nd qtr to get foul #4 on her. If she picks up #4, that likely blows up TCU's game plan. Instead, not only did we not attack her, she ends up finishing the game with 32 minutes and leading all players in assists.

#2 - We didn't shoot nearly as many open 3's as we should have. I'm ok with missing 3's early on and adjusting as the game progresses. But we only had 12 attempts all game long, and by not taking those shots when they became available, we weren't able to spread the floor better and loosen up the TCU interior defense.

#3 - Substitution patterns were questionable throughout the game, but especially at the midway point in the 4th. Given the situation, you could not afford to sub out Vonleh with Prince still in the game and trailing by 6. Call one of your 4 timeouts at that point if you have to. But her absence led to TCU getting a clean look for a three that pushed their lead to 9 with 4:29 left, and that was effectively the dagger.

#4 - Perimeter defense was atrocious in the 4th, and resulted in 3 wide-open looks that led to our demise. With as well as Vonley played against Prince, you could afford to do less switching and just trust your team to play solid, straight-up defense. If TCU hits tight, contested 3-point shots, then so be it.


Going into the half, I thought to myself that this would be the biggest half of Nicki's career here at Baylor, and would determine whether we'd finally turned the corner in this new era.

Well, sadly, it looks like there is still a bit of work to be done. And assuming she is going to be here for the long haul, then I really hope she can be successful.

But we shouldn't be making any excuses. We led late in the 3rd, Vonley had basically neutralized Prince with her own stellar play, and it was only a 2-point game heading into the 4th qtr.

So we had TCU right where we wanted them, but didn't get it done. And a big part of that is directly tied to coaching.

We can spin this however we want, but once you neutralize Prince (which Vonley did), then you have to take advantage and put your team in the best position to win.

And imo, that didn't happen last night.

---

Apparently you had access to the coaches notes and mindset. Good for you because you are clearly able to see that it was coaching and not poor execution by the players. I was sitting in the arena last night as well but didnt have access to the coaches notes and mindset and came away with the view that the Baylor players let the game get to big for them and struggled to execute thus limiting the game plan and forcing CNC to shuffle lineups and strategy. Thanks for clearing it up since you clearly have some deep insight that i dont have access to.

Harrison Bergeron said:

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Maybe. But we missed way to many easy buckets.

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And free throws...

We didn't get out-coached. The girls played hard, and our coaches had a good game plan. Great crowd too! TCU is a good team who plays tough D. We just couldn't make our shots, and we were missing our leading scorer and rebounder.

On an administrative level, we didn't get out-coached at all. The game plan was excellent and we executed it well. We just couldn't get shots to fall, and much of that was having to deal with Prince's unique physical abilities.

With that said, it could be argued that we were defeated by a superior NIL machine.

blueeyedbear said:

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Big12Fan2024 said:

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Oftentimes a loss can be attributed to the fact that the other team is just better. That's what we have here. It didn't have anything to do with Nicki. TCU is just a better team, and proved it on their court and then on our's. No reason to blame anyone or make any excuses. Shake their hands and move on to the next game.

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On this night they were better !! AND LUCKIER !! But that is why its called a game.
There is a basket at each end for a reason and it's not for decoration
Basketball is a simple game at its core - whoever puts the orange ball through the basket the most times wins the game.
BU just had too many missed layups, free throws and I can not remember seeing that many rim in and out shots in a game before and I have seen a lot of BB games in my days.
For whatever reason it just was not to be last night - it hurts but we are still alive and in 2 + weeks Bella will be healed up (I have seen only one comment on either board has how far from 100.0% she was last night - she was a profile in courage and guts to play as hard as she did in obvious pain) DLB will be back in the starting lineup and Jada will be 100.0% as well .... Netty gained a lot of confidence last night (only let Prince speed her up a couple of times and yes, they ended up being crucial missed attempts, but she now knows she can go toe to toe with Prince - Big, BIG) and I predict she will be even better next time she and Prince go at it. That is the team I can't wait to see play come Tournament time.
I still have hope that with KSU loss to ISU and we win the Big 12 Tourney (against TCU) The committee will take into account the injuries and BU can host first two rounds.

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I get that we all want to win but don't be the standard whiney Baylor fan making excuses. Show some sportsmanship and give the other team credit.

1 time may be a fluke. This wasn't the first time. We played them twice. They beat us twice. That would be like any team we beat twice claiming they were better than us. That sounds silly.

We are a good team. Maybe we'll get a third shot in the tournament? It's tough to beat a good team three times as even some of our best national championship contending teams over the years found out.

The defensive intensity was awesome. That likely had a lot to do with the poor shooting. They were literally outmanned. If we had all our players healthy it would likely have been a different game. There would have been people to bring in to help. Hopefully Littlepage-Buggs will be back, we certainly could have used her rebounding and scoring yesterday. At the end of the day, sometimes you just lose to a better team. I hate TCU! Hopefully we will have another opportunity in the tournament, and have a different outcome!

85bear said:

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I agree with this analysis. I would add that late in the 4th quarter on a play where Bella had the ball and was ultimately tied up CNC was just watching from the sidelines. She should have been wildly asking for a timeout to save the possession and keep the possession arrow from going to TCU. When every possession is critical this was a moment that may have made a difference in the outcome of the game.

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Which means we would not have had a final timeout in the under 2 to advance the ball which allowed us to score quickly or to have timeouts in your pocket for when you can't get the ball in-bounded. You don't call a timeout every time there is a tie-up. Very few coaches ever do that unless it is with just seconds to go. And with the tie-up it means the next one is yours that can be very important in the last couple of minutes. The last thing you want is to be limited in timeouts the last 2 minutes of the game. It wasn't possessions that cost us the game. It was missing shots we usually make.

85bear said:

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At that point in the game it looked like we were not going to be in at the end of the game especially how we were shooting. I have been critical of how CNC manages the game and I haven't seen a willingness by her to adapt. Her snarky comment about saving timeouts in her press conference for next season was unprofessional.

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There was nothing snarky about her comment about saving timeouts !!! Self-deprecating humor - I find refreshing - you should try it sometime. Your comment coming from someone who's BB IQ is suspect at best .... pathetic !
29 posts since 2017 !!! So you post your hit job on CNC after a loss but not a peep from you during a 25 win season or the 9 game win streak ??