Harrison Bergeron said:
Do you think Democrats believe elections should be governed at the state level or the federal level?
I believe that Democrats think that elections should not be governed. Winning is their goal, and the ends justify the means.
Why Do Democrats Oppose Election Integrity Efforts
8,917 Views |
218 Replies |
Last: 2 days ago by BusyTarpDuster2017
I believe that Democrats think that elections should not be governed. Winning is their goal, and the ends justify the means.
Notice he didn't answer your question. "No no, I'm a Republican! I like Trump....but here is a list of things I hate about Trump!"Oldbear83 said:
FLBear going more and more Demodumb by trying to stick Epstein on Trump.
Despite everything we know now.
That's just sad, really.
Our vibrations were getting nasty. But why? I was puzzled, frustrated... Had we deteriorated to the level of dumb beasts?
The mouth breathers also like to ignore the context of normal Americans being kept from their dying loved ones, kept from working or traveling while forced to sit home and watch as all democrats cheered and funded over 500 riots all across America in the name of a criminal who overdosed while fighting a lawful arrest.BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Mitch Blood Green said:cowboycwr said:Mitch Blood Green said:
If I were gonna cheat in an election, it wouldn't be one vote at a time. I can't think of a less effective way to cheat. That's similar to robbing the bodega of 500 scratch-offs, then taking them to the lottery to cash in. I remember early on in the Texas lottery, a woman changed the number on the front of her ticket without understanding all of the validation and security measures in the barcoding.
When you do it one vote at a time with a few hundred people all filling in fake mail in ballots or going to get illegals to vote or however it is being done it quickly adds up.
It is like the question of $10,000 now or $100 invested for X years. (Or whatever the numbers are) that shows how people jump at the large number failing to realize the invested number generates much more money long term.
What you're suggesting is a horrible ROI. Let's assume you're in Waco and I get 100 illegal votes for a Dem candidate. (And I know criminals don't think like this) But what election do you know I can flip with200 illegal votes?
What saddens me is that these measures are more likely to disenfranchise 1000 voters than stop 10 illegal voters.
You guys, as usual, just don't get it. It's not only about stopping illegals from voting, it's to ensure overall election integrity so that we the people can trust in the electoral process again. With each person having to provide a unique identifier when voting, a random person won't be able to fill out multiple ballots in the place of the elderly, the infirm, and the homeless who have no idea that they voted. It isn't asking much for all citizens to get an ID. We need to stop catering to the lowest common denominator in our society at the expense of trust in our electoral process and start asking more from our citizens. "Disenfranchisement" not only isn't a road block, it actually doesn't happen when you look at what happened in states like Georgia. Our society can only prosper when we bring UP all citizens to standard, not bring DOWN our standards to the lowest citizens. And a country that doesn't trust its elections is a country that will get torn apart from within.
If you can't accept the fact that Biden won in 2020, no new laws are going to help. Trump and his ilk will keep finding ways to deceive you. That's what is tearing the country apart in terms of trust in the electoral process.
The tragedy in all this is that the truth is not unknowable. Many courts looked at the substantive issues, sometimes when they didn't have to, because they knew the importance of trust. Many of those judges were Republican appointees. Trump's claims simply weren't supported by the evidence. But Trump told you they were all thrown out by crooked judges, so that's what most here choose to believe.
Voter ID, no mass mail in ballots or 2AM dropoffs, and spot forensic examination of ballots would have gone a LONG way in preventing the post-election chaos, and you know it. Compromised election integrity was the lifeblood of the conservative distrust of the results, not Trump. I have no doubt whatsoever that if the tables were turned, and it was Trump who overcame a 100,000 defecit overnight as you slept and won the election, that it'd be you and your friends here making the exact same arguments we're making. You can make this about Trump all you want, but the inescapable fact is that 2020 election was complete CRAP when it came to integrity and trustworthiness, no matter who won. Voter ID is only the beginning of ensuring election integrity. I personally think every voter should be assigned a number and everyone's vote should be posted on a website so the public can check the accuracy of their vote as well as the overall count.
Trump deliberately chose not to challenge no-excuse mail-in voting and other controversial procedures until after the election. By using them as a basis for his false and exaggerated claims, he was able to create the chaos he wanted.
The chaos was created by the controversial procedures and all the usual voting rules being completely bypassed in an election which saw boxes of ballots being dropped off at 2 AM and a 100,000 vote surge overnight. Trump may have fanned the flames, but it's not like his claims were implausible. I'm not a J6'er, but I have NO trust in that 2020 election. People with TDS are trying to pretend like they wouldn't be arguing the exact same had Trump won in like manner. Why not prevent all this as much as possible by taking away all the controversy that fed it in the first place? It's like you guys just don't want to learn anything from 2020 and you just want to make it all about "orange man bad".
Our vibrations were getting nasty. But why? I was puzzled, frustrated... Had we deteriorated to the level of dumb beasts?
BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Mitch Blood Green said:cowboycwr said:Mitch Blood Green said:
If I were gonna cheat in an election, it wouldn't be one vote at a time. I can't think of a less effective way to cheat. That's similar to robbing the bodega of 500 scratch-offs, then taking them to the lottery to cash in. I remember early on in the Texas lottery, a woman changed the number on the front of her ticket without understanding all of the validation and security measures in the barcoding.
When you do it one vote at a time with a few hundred people all filling in fake mail in ballots or going to get illegals to vote or however it is being done it quickly adds up.
It is like the question of $10,000 now or $100 invested for X years. (Or whatever the numbers are) that shows how people jump at the large number failing to realize the invested number generates much more money long term.
What you're suggesting is a horrible ROI. Let's assume you're in Waco and I get 100 illegal votes for a Dem candidate. (And I know criminals don't think like this) But what election do you know I can flip with200 illegal votes?
What saddens me is that these measures are more likely to disenfranchise 1000 voters than stop 10 illegal voters.
You guys, as usual, just don't get it. It's not only about stopping illegals from voting, it's to ensure overall election integrity so that we the people can trust in the electoral process again. With each person having to provide a unique identifier when voting, a random person won't be able to fill out multiple ballots in the place of the elderly, the infirm, and the homeless who have no idea that they voted. It isn't asking much for all citizens to get an ID. We need to stop catering to the lowest common denominator in our society at the expense of trust in our electoral process and start asking more from our citizens. "Disenfranchisement" not only isn't a road block, it actually doesn't happen when you look at what happened in states like Georgia. Our society can only prosper when we bring UP all citizens to standard, not bring DOWN our standards to the lowest citizens. And a country that doesn't trust its elections is a country that will get torn apart from within.
If you can't accept the fact that Biden won in 2020, no new laws are going to help. Trump and his ilk will keep finding ways to deceive you. That's what is tearing the country apart in terms of trust in the electoral process.
The tragedy in all this is that the truth is not unknowable. Many courts looked at the substantive issues, sometimes when they didn't have to, because they knew the importance of trust. Many of those judges were Republican appointees. Trump's claims simply weren't supported by the evidence. But Trump told you they were all thrown out by crooked judges, so that's what most here choose to believe.
Voter ID, no mass mail in ballots or 2AM dropoffs, and spot forensic examination of ballots would have gone a LONG way in preventing the post-election chaos, and you know it. Compromised election integrity was the lifeblood of the conservative distrust of the results, not Trump. I have no doubt whatsoever that if the tables were turned, and it was Trump who overcame a 100,000 defecit overnight as you slept and won the election, that it'd be you and your friends here making the exact same arguments we're making. You can make this about Trump all you want, but the inescapable fact is that 2020 election was complete CRAP when it came to integrity and trustworthiness, no matter who won. Voter ID is only the beginning of ensuring election integrity. I personally think every voter should be assigned a number and everyone's vote should be posted on a website so the public can check the accuracy of their vote as well as the overall count.
Trump deliberately chose not to challenge no-excuse mail-in voting and other controversial procedures until after the election. By using them as a basis for his false and exaggerated claims, he was able to create the chaos he wanted.
The chaos was created by the controversial procedures and all the usual voting rules being completely bypassed in an election which saw boxes of ballots being dropped off at 2 AM and a 100,000 vote surge overnight. Trump may have fanned the flames, but it's not like his claims were implausible. I'm not a J6'er, but I have NO trust in that 2020 election. People with TDS are trying to pretend like they wouldn't be arguing the exact same had Trump won in like manner. Why not prevent all this as much as possible by taking away all the controversy that fed it in the first place? It's like you guys just don't want to learn anything from 2020 and you just want to make it all about "orange man bad".
Those vote surges were predictable and predicted. So was the record high turnout. Trump just created a huge media circus based on false claims. Do you not realize that he's a con artist? It's what he does.
Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Mitch Blood Green said:cowboycwr said:Mitch Blood Green said:
If I were gonna cheat in an election, it wouldn't be one vote at a time. I can't think of a less effective way to cheat. That's similar to robbing the bodega of 500 scratch-offs, then taking them to the lottery to cash in. I remember early on in the Texas lottery, a woman changed the number on the front of her ticket without understanding all of the validation and security measures in the barcoding.
When you do it one vote at a time with a few hundred people all filling in fake mail in ballots or going to get illegals to vote or however it is being done it quickly adds up.
It is like the question of $10,000 now or $100 invested for X years. (Or whatever the numbers are) that shows how people jump at the large number failing to realize the invested number generates much more money long term.
What you're suggesting is a horrible ROI. Let's assume you're in Waco and I get 100 illegal votes for a Dem candidate. (And I know criminals don't think like this) But what election do you know I can flip with200 illegal votes?
What saddens me is that these measures are more likely to disenfranchise 1000 voters than stop 10 illegal voters.
You guys, as usual, just don't get it. It's not only about stopping illegals from voting, it's to ensure overall election integrity so that we the people can trust in the electoral process again. With each person having to provide a unique identifier when voting, a random person won't be able to fill out multiple ballots in the place of the elderly, the infirm, and the homeless who have no idea that they voted. It isn't asking much for all citizens to get an ID. We need to stop catering to the lowest common denominator in our society at the expense of trust in our electoral process and start asking more from our citizens. "Disenfranchisement" not only isn't a road block, it actually doesn't happen when you look at what happened in states like Georgia. Our society can only prosper when we bring UP all citizens to standard, not bring DOWN our standards to the lowest citizens. And a country that doesn't trust its elections is a country that will get torn apart from within.
If you can't accept the fact that Biden won in 2020, no new laws are going to help. Trump and his ilk will keep finding ways to deceive you. That's what is tearing the country apart in terms of trust in the electoral process.
The tragedy in all this is that the truth is not unknowable. Many courts looked at the substantive issues, sometimes when they didn't have to, because they knew the importance of trust. Many of those judges were Republican appointees. Trump's claims simply weren't supported by the evidence. But Trump told you they were all thrown out by crooked judges, so that's what most here choose to believe.
Voter ID, no mass mail in ballots or 2AM dropoffs, and spot forensic examination of ballots would have gone a LONG way in preventing the post-election chaos, and you know it. Compromised election integrity was the lifeblood of the conservative distrust of the results, not Trump. I have no doubt whatsoever that if the tables were turned, and it was Trump who overcame a 100,000 defecit overnight as you slept and won the election, that it'd be you and your friends here making the exact same arguments we're making. You can make this about Trump all you want, but the inescapable fact is that 2020 election was complete CRAP when it came to integrity and trustworthiness, no matter who won. Voter ID is only the beginning of ensuring election integrity. I personally think every voter should be assigned a number and everyone's vote should be posted on a website so the public can check the accuracy of their vote as well as the overall count.
Trump deliberately chose not to challenge no-excuse mail-in voting and other controversial procedures until after the election. By using them as a basis for his false and exaggerated claims, he was able to create the chaos he wanted.
The chaos was created by the controversial procedures and all the usual voting rules being completely bypassed in an election which saw boxes of ballots being dropped off at 2 AM and a 100,000 vote surge overnight. Trump may have fanned the flames, but it's not like his claims were implausible. I'm not a J6'er, but I have NO trust in that 2020 election. People with TDS are trying to pretend like they wouldn't be arguing the exact same had Trump won in like manner. Why not prevent all this as much as possible by taking away all the controversy that fed it in the first place? It's like you guys just don't want to learn anything from 2020 and you just want to make it all about "orange man bad".
Those vote surges were predictable and predicted. So was the record high turnout. Trump just created a huge media circus based on false claims. Do you not realize that he's a con artist? It's what he does.
Yes, predictable because of severely compromised election security and integrity. It'd be like saying a surge in stealing is predictable if they force stores to remain unlocked after closing. And the "turnout" at those stores would be immense as well.
Whether or not Trump is a "con artist" has no relevance to the fact that the 2020 election was heavily compromised. Hate him all you want, he isn't wrong about that. And instead of fixing the problem, you just want to make it all about "Orange man bad". TDS is just so stupid.
BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Mitch Blood Green said:cowboycwr said:Mitch Blood Green said:
If I were gonna cheat in an election, it wouldn't be one vote at a time. I can't think of a less effective way to cheat. That's similar to robbing the bodega of 500 scratch-offs, then taking them to the lottery to cash in. I remember early on in the Texas lottery, a woman changed the number on the front of her ticket without understanding all of the validation and security measures in the barcoding.
When you do it one vote at a time with a few hundred people all filling in fake mail in ballots or going to get illegals to vote or however it is being done it quickly adds up.
It is like the question of $10,000 now or $100 invested for X years. (Or whatever the numbers are) that shows how people jump at the large number failing to realize the invested number generates much more money long term.
What you're suggesting is a horrible ROI. Let's assume you're in Waco and I get 100 illegal votes for a Dem candidate. (And I know criminals don't think like this) But what election do you know I can flip with200 illegal votes?
What saddens me is that these measures are more likely to disenfranchise 1000 voters than stop 10 illegal voters.
You guys, as usual, just don't get it. It's not only about stopping illegals from voting, it's to ensure overall election integrity so that we the people can trust in the electoral process again. With each person having to provide a unique identifier when voting, a random person won't be able to fill out multiple ballots in the place of the elderly, the infirm, and the homeless who have no idea that they voted. It isn't asking much for all citizens to get an ID. We need to stop catering to the lowest common denominator in our society at the expense of trust in our electoral process and start asking more from our citizens. "Disenfranchisement" not only isn't a road block, it actually doesn't happen when you look at what happened in states like Georgia. Our society can only prosper when we bring UP all citizens to standard, not bring DOWN our standards to the lowest citizens. And a country that doesn't trust its elections is a country that will get torn apart from within.
If you can't accept the fact that Biden won in 2020, no new laws are going to help. Trump and his ilk will keep finding ways to deceive you. That's what is tearing the country apart in terms of trust in the electoral process.
The tragedy in all this is that the truth is not unknowable. Many courts looked at the substantive issues, sometimes when they didn't have to, because they knew the importance of trust. Many of those judges were Republican appointees. Trump's claims simply weren't supported by the evidence. But Trump told you they were all thrown out by crooked judges, so that's what most here choose to believe.
Voter ID, no mass mail in ballots or 2AM dropoffs, and spot forensic examination of ballots would have gone a LONG way in preventing the post-election chaos, and you know it. Compromised election integrity was the lifeblood of the conservative distrust of the results, not Trump. I have no doubt whatsoever that if the tables were turned, and it was Trump who overcame a 100,000 defecit overnight as you slept and won the election, that it'd be you and your friends here making the exact same arguments we're making. You can make this about Trump all you want, but the inescapable fact is that 2020 election was complete CRAP when it came to integrity and trustworthiness, no matter who won. Voter ID is only the beginning of ensuring election integrity. I personally think every voter should be assigned a number and everyone's vote should be posted on a website so the public can check the accuracy of their vote as well as the overall count.
Trump deliberately chose not to challenge no-excuse mail-in voting and other controversial procedures until after the election. By using them as a basis for his false and exaggerated claims, he was able to create the chaos he wanted.
The chaos was created by the controversial procedures and all the usual voting rules being completely bypassed in an election which saw boxes of ballots being dropped off at 2 AM and a 100,000 vote surge overnight. Trump may have fanned the flames, but it's not like his claims were implausible. I'm not a J6'er, but I have NO trust in that 2020 election. People with TDS are trying to pretend like they wouldn't be arguing the exact same had Trump won in like manner. Why not prevent all this as much as possible by taking away all the controversy that fed it in the first place? It's like you guys just don't want to learn anything from 2020 and you just want to make it all about "orange man bad".
Those vote surges were predictable and predicted. So was the record high turnout. Trump just created a huge media circus based on false claims. Do you not realize that he's a con artist? It's what he does.
Yes, predictable because of severely compromised election security and integrity. It'd be like saying a surge in stealing is predictable if they force stores to remain unlocked after closing. And the "turnout" at those stores would be immense as well.
Whether or not Trump is a "con artist" has no relevance to the fact that the 2020 election was heavily compromised. Hate him all you want, he isn't wrong about that. And instead of fixing the problem, you just want to make it all about "Orange man bad". TDS is just so stupid.
So you were led to believe. If over 60 court cases won't change your mind, I know I won't either.
Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Mitch Blood Green said:cowboycwr said:Mitch Blood Green said:
If I were gonna cheat in an election, it wouldn't be one vote at a time. I can't think of a less effective way to cheat. That's similar to robbing the bodega of 500 scratch-offs, then taking them to the lottery to cash in. I remember early on in the Texas lottery, a woman changed the number on the front of her ticket without understanding all of the validation and security measures in the barcoding.
When you do it one vote at a time with a few hundred people all filling in fake mail in ballots or going to get illegals to vote or however it is being done it quickly adds up.
It is like the question of $10,000 now or $100 invested for X years. (Or whatever the numbers are) that shows how people jump at the large number failing to realize the invested number generates much more money long term.
What you're suggesting is a horrible ROI. Let's assume you're in Waco and I get 100 illegal votes for a Dem candidate. (And I know criminals don't think like this) But what election do you know I can flip with200 illegal votes?
What saddens me is that these measures are more likely to disenfranchise 1000 voters than stop 10 illegal voters.
You guys, as usual, just don't get it. It's not only about stopping illegals from voting, it's to ensure overall election integrity so that we the people can trust in the electoral process again. With each person having to provide a unique identifier when voting, a random person won't be able to fill out multiple ballots in the place of the elderly, the infirm, and the homeless who have no idea that they voted. It isn't asking much for all citizens to get an ID. We need to stop catering to the lowest common denominator in our society at the expense of trust in our electoral process and start asking more from our citizens. "Disenfranchisement" not only isn't a road block, it actually doesn't happen when you look at what happened in states like Georgia. Our society can only prosper when we bring UP all citizens to standard, not bring DOWN our standards to the lowest citizens. And a country that doesn't trust its elections is a country that will get torn apart from within.
If you can't accept the fact that Biden won in 2020, no new laws are going to help. Trump and his ilk will keep finding ways to deceive you. That's what is tearing the country apart in terms of trust in the electoral process.
The tragedy in all this is that the truth is not unknowable. Many courts looked at the substantive issues, sometimes when they didn't have to, because they knew the importance of trust. Many of those judges were Republican appointees. Trump's claims simply weren't supported by the evidence. But Trump told you they were all thrown out by crooked judges, so that's what most here choose to believe.
Voter ID, no mass mail in ballots or 2AM dropoffs, and spot forensic examination of ballots would have gone a LONG way in preventing the post-election chaos, and you know it. Compromised election integrity was the lifeblood of the conservative distrust of the results, not Trump. I have no doubt whatsoever that if the tables were turned, and it was Trump who overcame a 100,000 defecit overnight as you slept and won the election, that it'd be you and your friends here making the exact same arguments we're making. You can make this about Trump all you want, but the inescapable fact is that 2020 election was complete CRAP when it came to integrity and trustworthiness, no matter who won. Voter ID is only the beginning of ensuring election integrity. I personally think every voter should be assigned a number and everyone's vote should be posted on a website so the public can check the accuracy of their vote as well as the overall count.
Trump deliberately chose not to challenge no-excuse mail-in voting and other controversial procedures until after the election. By using them as a basis for his false and exaggerated claims, he was able to create the chaos he wanted.
The chaos was created by the controversial procedures and all the usual voting rules being completely bypassed in an election which saw boxes of ballots being dropped off at 2 AM and a 100,000 vote surge overnight. Trump may have fanned the flames, but it's not like his claims were implausible. I'm not a J6'er, but I have NO trust in that 2020 election. People with TDS are trying to pretend like they wouldn't be arguing the exact same had Trump won in like manner. Why not prevent all this as much as possible by taking away all the controversy that fed it in the first place? It's like you guys just don't want to learn anything from 2020 and you just want to make it all about "orange man bad".
Those vote surges were predictable and predicted. So was the record high turnout. Trump just created a huge media circus based on false claims. Do you not realize that he's a con artist? It's what he does.
Yes, predictable because of severely compromised election security and integrity. It'd be like saying a surge in stealing is predictable if they force stores to remain unlocked after closing. And the "turnout" at those stores would be immense as well.
Whether or not Trump is a "con artist" has no relevance to the fact that the 2020 election was heavily compromised. Hate him all you want, he isn't wrong about that. And instead of fixing the problem, you just want to make it all about "Orange man bad". TDS is just so stupid.
So you were led to believe. If over 60 court cases won't change your mind, I know I won't either.
How many of those court cases made it to the point of discovery?
The court case cover is no better than your claiming Biden admin's ministry of truth wasn't designed to curb free press.
EatMoreSalmon said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Mitch Blood Green said:cowboycwr said:Mitch Blood Green said:
If I were gonna cheat in an election, it wouldn't be one vote at a time. I can't think of a less effective way to cheat. That's similar to robbing the bodega of 500 scratch-offs, then taking them to the lottery to cash in. I remember early on in the Texas lottery, a woman changed the number on the front of her ticket without understanding all of the validation and security measures in the barcoding.
When you do it one vote at a time with a few hundred people all filling in fake mail in ballots or going to get illegals to vote or however it is being done it quickly adds up.
It is like the question of $10,000 now or $100 invested for X years. (Or whatever the numbers are) that shows how people jump at the large number failing to realize the invested number generates much more money long term.
What you're suggesting is a horrible ROI. Let's assume you're in Waco and I get 100 illegal votes for a Dem candidate. (And I know criminals don't think like this) But what election do you know I can flip with200 illegal votes?
What saddens me is that these measures are more likely to disenfranchise 1000 voters than stop 10 illegal voters.
You guys, as usual, just don't get it. It's not only about stopping illegals from voting, it's to ensure overall election integrity so that we the people can trust in the electoral process again. With each person having to provide a unique identifier when voting, a random person won't be able to fill out multiple ballots in the place of the elderly, the infirm, and the homeless who have no idea that they voted. It isn't asking much for all citizens to get an ID. We need to stop catering to the lowest common denominator in our society at the expense of trust in our electoral process and start asking more from our citizens. "Disenfranchisement" not only isn't a road block, it actually doesn't happen when you look at what happened in states like Georgia. Our society can only prosper when we bring UP all citizens to standard, not bring DOWN our standards to the lowest citizens. And a country that doesn't trust its elections is a country that will get torn apart from within.
If you can't accept the fact that Biden won in 2020, no new laws are going to help. Trump and his ilk will keep finding ways to deceive you. That's what is tearing the country apart in terms of trust in the electoral process.
The tragedy in all this is that the truth is not unknowable. Many courts looked at the substantive issues, sometimes when they didn't have to, because they knew the importance of trust. Many of those judges were Republican appointees. Trump's claims simply weren't supported by the evidence. But Trump told you they were all thrown out by crooked judges, so that's what most here choose to believe.
Voter ID, no mass mail in ballots or 2AM dropoffs, and spot forensic examination of ballots would have gone a LONG way in preventing the post-election chaos, and you know it. Compromised election integrity was the lifeblood of the conservative distrust of the results, not Trump. I have no doubt whatsoever that if the tables were turned, and it was Trump who overcame a 100,000 defecit overnight as you slept and won the election, that it'd be you and your friends here making the exact same arguments we're making. You can make this about Trump all you want, but the inescapable fact is that 2020 election was complete CRAP when it came to integrity and trustworthiness, no matter who won. Voter ID is only the beginning of ensuring election integrity. I personally think every voter should be assigned a number and everyone's vote should be posted on a website so the public can check the accuracy of their vote as well as the overall count.
Trump deliberately chose not to challenge no-excuse mail-in voting and other controversial procedures until after the election. By using them as a basis for his false and exaggerated claims, he was able to create the chaos he wanted.
The chaos was created by the controversial procedures and all the usual voting rules being completely bypassed in an election which saw boxes of ballots being dropped off at 2 AM and a 100,000 vote surge overnight. Trump may have fanned the flames, but it's not like his claims were implausible. I'm not a J6'er, but I have NO trust in that 2020 election. People with TDS are trying to pretend like they wouldn't be arguing the exact same had Trump won in like manner. Why not prevent all this as much as possible by taking away all the controversy that fed it in the first place? It's like you guys just don't want to learn anything from 2020 and you just want to make it all about "orange man bad".
Those vote surges were predictable and predicted. So was the record high turnout. Trump just created a huge media circus based on false claims. Do you not realize that he's a con artist? It's what he does.
Yes, predictable because of severely compromised election security and integrity. It'd be like saying a surge in stealing is predictable if they force stores to remain unlocked after closing. And the "turnout" at those stores would be immense as well.
Whether or not Trump is a "con artist" has no relevance to the fact that the 2020 election was heavily compromised. Hate him all you want, he isn't wrong about that. And instead of fixing the problem, you just want to make it all about "Orange man bad". TDS is just so stupid.
So you were led to believe. If over 60 court cases won't change your mind, I know I won't either.
How many of those court cases made it to the point of discovery?
The court case cover is no better than your claiming Biden admin's ministry of truth wasn't designed to curb free press.
As many as needed to in order for the cases to be resolved (likely few if any).
Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Sam Lowry said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Mitch Blood Green said:cowboycwr said:Mitch Blood Green said:
If I were gonna cheat in an election, it wouldn't be one vote at a time. I can't think of a less effective way to cheat. That's similar to robbing the bodega of 500 scratch-offs, then taking them to the lottery to cash in. I remember early on in the Texas lottery, a woman changed the number on the front of her ticket without understanding all of the validation and security measures in the barcoding.
When you do it one vote at a time with a few hundred people all filling in fake mail in ballots or going to get illegals to vote or however it is being done it quickly adds up.
It is like the question of $10,000 now or $100 invested for X years. (Or whatever the numbers are) that shows how people jump at the large number failing to realize the invested number generates much more money long term.
What you're suggesting is a horrible ROI. Let's assume you're in Waco and I get 100 illegal votes for a Dem candidate. (And I know criminals don't think like this) But what election do you know I can flip with200 illegal votes?
What saddens me is that these measures are more likely to disenfranchise 1000 voters than stop 10 illegal voters.
You guys, as usual, just don't get it. It's not only about stopping illegals from voting, it's to ensure overall election integrity so that we the people can trust in the electoral process again. With each person having to provide a unique identifier when voting, a random person won't be able to fill out multiple ballots in the place of the elderly, the infirm, and the homeless who have no idea that they voted. It isn't asking much for all citizens to get an ID. We need to stop catering to the lowest common denominator in our society at the expense of trust in our electoral process and start asking more from our citizens. "Disenfranchisement" not only isn't a road block, it actually doesn't happen when you look at what happened in states like Georgia. Our society can only prosper when we bring UP all citizens to standard, not bring DOWN our standards to the lowest citizens. And a country that doesn't trust its elections is a country that will get torn apart from within.
If you can't accept the fact that Biden won in 2020, no new laws are going to help. Trump and his ilk will keep finding ways to deceive you. That's what is tearing the country apart in terms of trust in the electoral process.
The tragedy in all this is that the truth is not unknowable. Many courts looked at the substantive issues, sometimes when they didn't have to, because they knew the importance of trust. Many of those judges were Republican appointees. Trump's claims simply weren't supported by the evidence. But Trump told you they were all thrown out by crooked judges, so that's what most here choose to believe.
Voter ID, no mass mail in ballots or 2AM dropoffs, and spot forensic examination of ballots would have gone a LONG way in preventing the post-election chaos, and you know it. Compromised election integrity was the lifeblood of the conservative distrust of the results, not Trump. I have no doubt whatsoever that if the tables were turned, and it was Trump who overcame a 100,000 defecit overnight as you slept and won the election, that it'd be you and your friends here making the exact same arguments we're making. You can make this about Trump all you want, but the inescapable fact is that 2020 election was complete CRAP when it came to integrity and trustworthiness, no matter who won. Voter ID is only the beginning of ensuring election integrity. I personally think every voter should be assigned a number and everyone's vote should be posted on a website so the public can check the accuracy of their vote as well as the overall count.
Trump deliberately chose not to challenge no-excuse mail-in voting and other controversial procedures until after the election. By using them as a basis for his false and exaggerated claims, he was able to create the chaos he wanted.
The chaos was created by the controversial procedures and all the usual voting rules being completely bypassed in an election which saw boxes of ballots being dropped off at 2 AM and a 100,000 vote surge overnight. Trump may have fanned the flames, but it's not like his claims were implausible. I'm not a J6'er, but I have NO trust in that 2020 election. People with TDS are trying to pretend like they wouldn't be arguing the exact same had Trump won in like manner. Why not prevent all this as much as possible by taking away all the controversy that fed it in the first place? It's like you guys just don't want to learn anything from 2020 and you just want to make it all about "orange man bad".
Those vote surges were predictable and predicted. So was the record high turnout. Trump just created a huge media circus based on false claims. Do you not realize that he's a con artist? It's what he does.
Yes, predictable because of severely compromised election security and integrity. It'd be like saying a surge in stealing is predictable if they force stores to remain unlocked after closing. And the "turnout" at those stores would be immense as well.
Whether or not Trump is a "con artist" has no relevance to the fact that the 2020 election was heavily compromised. Hate him all you want, he isn't wrong about that. And instead of fixing the problem, you just want to make it all about "Orange man bad". TDS is just so stupid.
So you were led to believe. If over 60 court cases won't change your mind, I know I won't either.
Why would those court cases change my mind?