FLBear5630 said:

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Trump needs to throw out more than theye statements. How is going to do that? As you said, States can't run deficits.

So, it should not be on employers. It shouldn't be Fed. It shouldn't be State. My wifes leg surgery cost 52k, we are still getting bills 2 years later. The average person is supposed to pay for that out of pocket.

That is half of a nurses annual salary, so Porteseo doesnt have to pay Medicare over 188k a year? Lets cut capital gains too. If we just applied the same rates to 400k it would bridge the gap. You guys keep talking of this more efficient private system, where? Who has it? Every Nation with high quality or living, health care and life expectancy is some form of single payer Federal system.

But, it is better the cashier at the grocery store, pay 15k to have kids tonsils removed. And she cant fall behind on daycare either, which takes up 21% of her income. Call in sick for her kid more than twice and she is bounced. But Porteso pay 1.45% on income over 188k is heresy??? You guys really push a great system, if you are a have. Very Calvinistic.

I know, none are connected. All are separate. Sorry, there are certain things the Fed needs to deal with that may not have been an issue in 1775. Maybe a more holistic approach is needed. More important than protecting the 1.45% of income of you high performers making above 188k.

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Why do you believe that the Medicare tax is capped at 188k a year? It isn't. The Social Security tax is capped at $184,500 for 2026.

An employee pays 1.45% and his employer pays 1.45% on all wages. Once an unmarried employee goes over $200k for the year, he pays an additional 0.9% on his wages ($250k for married filing jointly / $125k for married filing separately). A self-employed person pays the full 2.9% and also the additional 0.9% over the thresholds.

If Porteseo, as an unmarried employee, makes $400k in 2026 (excluding credits, deductions, and other tax reduction mechanisms), he will pay $7,600 in Medicare taxes. Factor in what his employer paid to Medicare instead of wages to Porteso and it is $13,400.

And while we are spending Porteseo's money, how much more do you want him to pay to fund your vision for health care?

FLBear5630 said:

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Is it a fee or a tax? If a fee there is a set price. If a tax, it is a rate against income.

Why should a 75k person have to pay on 100% of their income and you only pay on 20% of yours? The burden is shifted to the lowest income, the group that can least afford it. Of course you are against progressive taxation, you get a free ride on the bulk of your income.

You do realize that this no taxation thing is a recent phenomenon and most of our history had up to 90% tax rates.

But it works for you. So, I get it, you get to keep yours. What's not to like?

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You are making way to many assumptions. People pay flat costs on most things, because the wealth of an individual has nothing to do with how much a roll of paper towels costs to manufacture, transport, and retail. The second you say that rich people should pay more for paper towels, and poor people less, you are arguing against capitalism, and for the redistribution of wealth.

We already have a progressive tax system. I'm not sure why you act like we don't. I am fully on board and have advocated with new tax brackets at $5m, and $50m. Maybe stop with all the assumptions that make me out to be a boogey man so you dont have to defend your Marxism.

We have not had 90% tax rates for most of our history. Did I read that right?

Lastly, health insurance is already a way to socialize health care within the framework of capitalism. You are wrong to advocate that the fix is socialism. We all know it's broken. What about making it affordable again? It is only recently that the poor cannot afford health care, you realize that right? Or, gasp, making sure the poor have a lifeline out of poverty. You know, the American Dream?

Your position is that we shouldn't fix the system. We should blow it up and start a new system, socialism. Can you defend that? Specifically, if we start with the common ground that basic health care should he affordable for all, why would paper towels at a hospital need to be cheaper for soneone making 75k, than someone making 150k?

whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Trump needs to throw out more than theye statements. How is going to do that? As you said, States can't run deficits.

So, it should not be on employers. It shouldn't be Fed. It shouldn't be State. My wifes leg surgery cost 52k, we are still getting bills 2 years later. The average person is supposed to pay for that out of pocket.

That is half of a nurses annual salary, so Porteseo doesnt have to pay Medicare over 188k a year? Lets cut capital gains too. If we just applied the same rates to 400k it would bridge the gap. You guys keep talking of this more efficient private system, where? Who has it? Every Nation with high quality or living, health care and life expectancy is some form of single payer Federal system.

But, it is better the cashier at the grocery store, pay 15k to have kids tonsils removed. And she cant fall behind on daycare either, which takes up 21% of her income. Call in sick for her kid more than twice and she is bounced. But Porteso pay 1.45% on income over 188k is heresy??? You guys really push a great system, if you are a have. Very Calvinistic.

I know, none are connected. All are separate. Sorry, there are certain things the Fed needs to deal with that may not have been an issue in 1775. Maybe a more holistic approach is needed. More important than protecting the 1.45% of income of you high performers making above 188k.

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Dude. You've already run out of other peoples' money.
https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/latest-federal-income-tax-data-2025/

the top 10% of wage earners (which includes almost everyone here) pay 72% of all income taxes paid. Poor people do not pay a significant share capital gains taxes, either.

We have to grow the pie.

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We agree there! The pie has to grow, but we disagree on how. The new markets and tech we are on the same page. I may bust chops on DCs and AI, but that is the future. I think space water mining is going to be big, new areas. I even have no problem with the Gullf and CA, if the existing limitations are in place.