Alabama Abortion Ban

36,167 Views | 347 Replies | Last: 6 yr ago by Aliceinbubbleland
ScruffyD
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in your post downplaying the significance of this law and that it merely makes this an inconvenience, here is what you said:

"Might mean taking a road trip to New York, Illinois, or California."

And i pointed out that the Alabama law makes it illegal to take such a road trip.

Your take on New York law is also woefully inaccurate, as has been pointed out by others.
Jack and DP
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redfish961
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If this includes rape and incest, I can't go with that.

My view is those are acceptable situations where abortion should be considered.

That being said, it's not in my DNA to impose sanctions on others.

I don't agree with abortion in most cases, but I feel like Roe vs Wade is a compromise.

Both sides have went too extreme.

We know what the obvious solution is (abstinence until you are ready), but that is nowhere near practical and isn't feasible.
Iron Claw
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It's worth a double murder charge if a person kills a pregnant woman. It's not murder for that woman to kill the same unborn child.

Reconcile that.
redfish961
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Iron Claw said:

It's worth a double murder charge if a person kills a pregnant woman. It's not murder for that woman to kill the same unborn child.

Reconcile that.
You can't and that's the double standard.

I just don't think you can be all the way, one or the other.

I suppose it always comes back to what is deemed a child, but as you stated, it's crystal clear in another context.

Can't reconcile that in my mind, but I can see reasonable exceptions.

Even so, if it's one way or the other, still can't reconcile.
Sam Lowry
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Booray said:

The physical, emotional and financial burden of pregnancy, childbirth and adoption or child-rearing fall on women in a way that is wildly disproportionate to men.

If you want to reduce abortions, fix that problem. Far fewer women will want abortions.
It's largely because of abortion and contraception that men's share of the burden has been removed.
Sam Lowry
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ScruffyD said:

ScottS said:

ScruffyD said:

I wonder how many abortions Trump has paid for.

I would hazard to guess the number is greater than 0.


Think Slick Willie paid for some?
It wouldn't surprise me if he did. But he was in favor of choice so I don't see the blatant hypocrisy there. I just wonder how you reconcile that, a man who not 10 years ago was raw dogging a porn star while his wife is home with a newborn...has likely funded a handful of abortions, but you perhaps voted for him and would again.

While we are at the comparison game, I bet Obama paid for 0, yet the sight of him likely infuriates you.




Would you be more favorable toward the new law if Mike Pence or Ted Cruz were president?

Didn't think so.
redfish961
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Sam Lowry said:

Booray said:

The physical, emotional and financial burden of pregnancy, childbirth and adoption or child-rearing fall on women in a way that is wildly disproportionate to men.

If you want to reduce abortions, fix that problem. Far fewer women will want abortions.
It's largely because of abortion and contraception that men's share of the burden has been removed.
Was just thinking about this and I would agree.

My line of thinking has always been, I don't agree with abortion in my case, but I know how to prevent pregnancy in almost every case.

If males/females were more personally responsible, there might not be an abortion to consider.

I still see that as a pipe dream.
Waco1947
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What is happening in Alabama (and elsewhere) with abortion restrictions is misogyny masquerading as religion.
ATL Bear
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Waco1947 said:

What is happening in Alabama (and elsewhere) with abortion restrictions is misogyny masquerading as religion.
What's happening in clinics across the US is genocide masquerading as reproductive rights.
Oldbear83
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Waco1947 said:

What is happening in Alabama (and elsewhere) with abortion restrictions is misogyny masquerading as religion.
It's actually a reaction to the bloodlust in New York and Virginia.

Like your own contempt for innocent life, Waco.
ShooterTX
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Booray said:

Forest Bueller said:

Booray said:

Canada2017 said:

Will be surprised if the Alabama governor signs the anti abortion bill into law.

Would be shocked if the Supreme Court then overturned Roe vs Wade

Too many folks demand the 'right' to undisciplined behavior free of inconvenient consequences.
Like the right to impregnate a women and then leave her to deal with the consequences?

The Alabama GOP consciously decided not to include a rape/incest exclusion. How is a rape victim guilty of "undisciplined behavior?"
That was a very big mistake if you ask me.
The evangelicals have sold their soul to the devil; they want the golden fiddle.


I'm pretty sure that the devil is on the side that kills innocent babies.
ShooterTX
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Booray said:

The physical, emotional and financial burden of pregnancy, childbirth and adoption or child-rearing fall on women in a way that is wildly disproportionate to men.

If you want to reduce abortions, fix that problem. Far fewer women will want abortions.


So..... promote marriage & family. Not very popular with pro-abortion leftists.
BaylorFTW
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In other related news, U.S. Births Fell To A 32-Year Low In 2018; CDC Says Birthrate Is In Record Slump

"Not since 1986 has the U.S. seen so few babies born. And it's an ongoing slump: 2018 was the fourth consecutive year of birth declines, according to the provisional birthrate report from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

Birthrates fell for nearly all racial and age groups, with only slight gains for women in their late 30s and early 40s, the CDC says."

https://www.npr.org/2019/05/15/723518379/u-s-births-fell-to-a-32-year-low-in-2018-cdc-says-birthrate-is-at-record-level
Waco1947
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"Republican men with anti-abortion agendas have long taken a perverse kind of pleasure in their illiteracy on the very topics they harp on the most. They love to talk about the sanctity of motherhood and the milestones of fetal development; Chambliss, for instance, wore a pin on Tuesday night that he claimed was the size of a fetus's feet after 10 weeks of pregnancy. But when it comes to the nuts and bolts of biology that medical professionals, insurance companies, and patients will have to parse to determine what reproductive health care is legal and when, they plead ignorance.

This is not a strictly Alabamian phenomenon. Consider the comments of Ohio state Rep. John Becker, a Republican who proposed a bill that would curb insurance coverage of all abortion care provided under non-life-threatening circumstances. When journalists and health care practitioners noted that the bill would also ban coverage of contraception devices, including certain IUDs, that prevent the implantation of fertilized eggs, Becker seemed exasperated. "That's clearly not my area of expertise," he said. He then suggested that pharmaceutical companies could simply "reformulate" their contraceptives to work differently, somehow, to comply with his legislation. That legislation, by the way, included an exception to allow insurance coverage of a medical procedure Becker appears to have invented out of whole cloth. Under Becker's bill, if a woman experiences an ectopic pregnancya life-threatening event wherein a fertilized egg attaches somewhere other than inside the uterusinsurance companies would be permitted to cover a procedure to "reimplant the fertilized ovum into the pregnant woman's uterus." That procedure does not exist."
The Slate
Stupid and ignorant men making laws about women's bodies is ludicrous.

Waco1947
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ShooterTX said:

Booray said:

The physical, emotional and financial burden of pregnancy, childbirth and adoption or child-rearing fall on women in a way that is wildly disproportionate to men.

If you want to reduce abortions, fix that problem. Far fewer women will want abortions.


So..... promote marriage & family. Not very popular with pro-abortion leftists.
What the hell? That's stupid. It's ignorant. Assertion with no proof other than your stupid opinion.
Canada2017
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This bill will certainly be overturned in Federal Court.

Sooner the better .
GoneGirl
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Booray said:

Canada2017 said:

Will be surprised if the Alabama governor signs the anti abortion bill into law.

Would be shocked if the Supreme Court then overturned Roe vs Wade

Too many folks demand the 'right' to undisciplined behavior free of inconvenient consequences.
Like the right to impregnate a women and then leave her to deal with the consequences?

The Alabama GOP consciously decided not to include a rape/incest exclusion. How is a rape victim guilty of "undisciplined behavior?"
She was "asking for it."
GoneGirl
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ShooterTX said:

Booray said:

The physical, emotional and financial burden of pregnancy, childbirth and adoption or child-rearing fall on women in a way that is wildly disproportionate to men.

If you want to reduce abortions, fix that problem. Far fewer women will want abortions.


So..... promote marriage & family. Not very popular with pro-abortion leftists.
Sharia law solution: 13- or 14-year-old women are offered the opportunity to marry their rapists, because then the baby is legit. Unsurprisingly, most women don't like this solution.
GoneGirl
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ShooterTX said:

Booray said:

Forest Bueller said:

Booray said:

Canada2017 said:

Will be surprised if the Alabama governor signs the anti abortion bill into law.

Would be shocked if the Supreme Court then overturned Roe vs Wade

Too many folks demand the 'right' to undisciplined behavior free of inconvenient consequences.
Like the right to impregnate a women and then leave her to deal with the consequences?

The Alabama GOP consciously decided not to include a rape/incest exclusion. How is a rape victim guilty of "undisciplined behavior?"
That was a very big mistake if you ask me.
The evangelicals have sold their soul to the devil; they want the golden fiddle.


I'm pretty sure that the devil is on the side that kills innocent babies.
He's certainly on the side of rapists and fathers or siblings who commit incest.
GoneGirl
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Sam Lowry said:

Booray said:

The physical, emotional and financial burden of pregnancy, childbirth and adoption or child-rearing fall on women in a way that is wildly disproportionate to men.

If you want to reduce abortions, fix that problem. Far fewer women will want abortions.
It's largely because of abortion and contraception that men's share of the burden has been removed.
Men have never borne their share of the burden. Women just experienced more pregnancies before contraception that women could control was available. Lots more.
GoneGirl
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ScruffyD said:

the alabama law makes it illegal to leave the state for an abortion.
That's unconstitutional.
cinque
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Booray said:

Canada2017 said:

Will be surprised if the Alabama governor signs the anti abortion bill into law.

Would be shocked if the Supreme Court then overturned Roe vs Wade

Too many folks demand the 'right' to undisciplined behavior free of inconvenient consequences.
Like the right to impregnate a women and then leave her to deal with the consequences?

The Alabama GOP consciously decided not to include a rape/incest exclusion. How is a rape victim guilty of "undisciplined behavior?"
These people are perfectly fine with literally hundreds of 12 and 13 year old children being forced to bore the babies of their uncles and a rag tag assortment of other rapists and family members.
Make Racism Wrong Again
Oldbear83
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Jinx: "Men have never borne their share of the burden."

For well over 75% of men, that is a damnable lie.
Oldbear83
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Jinx 2 said:

ScruffyD said:

the alabama law makes it illegal to leave the state for an abortion.
That's unconstitutional.
It's also screaming to a judge "end me" in a voice that proves the guys behind it were not trying to solve anything.
Sam Lowry
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Jinx 2 said:

Sam Lowry said:

Booray said:

The physical, emotional and financial burden of pregnancy, childbirth and adoption or child-rearing fall on women in a way that is wildly disproportionate to men.

If you want to reduce abortions, fix that problem. Far fewer women will want abortions.
It's largely because of abortion and contraception that men's share of the burden has been removed.
Men have never borne their share of the burden. Women just experienced more pregnancies before contraception that women could control was available. Lots more.
The physical and emotional burdens fall mostly on women because that's how nature designed human beings. It's not a problem that can be fixed. We used to compensate for it by placing a heavier social and financial burden on men, but we've chosen to give women "reproductive choice" instead. Meaning that, in many cases, they can choose to abort or bear the burden more or less alone.
Sam Lowry
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ShooterTX said:

Booray said:

The physical, emotional and financial burden of pregnancy, childbirth and adoption or child-rearing fall on women in a way that is wildly disproportionate to men.

If you want to reduce abortions, fix that problem. Far fewer women will want abortions.


So..... promote marriage & family. Not very popular with pro-abortion leftists.
Exactly right.
Sam Lowry
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Oldbear83 said:

Jinx 2 said:

ScruffyD said:

the alabama law makes it illegal to leave the state for an abortion.
That's unconstitutional.
It's also screaming to a judge "end me" in a voice that proves the guys behind it were not trying to solve anything.
Don't forget about the presumption of severability.
MoneyBear
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Waco1947 said:

"Republican men with anti-abortion agendas have long taken a perverse kind of pleasure in their illiteracy on the very topics they harp on the most. They love to talk about the sanctity of motherhood and the milestones of fetal development; Chambliss, for instance, wore a pin on Tuesday night that he claimed was the size of a fetus's feet after 10 weeks of pregnancy. But when it comes to the nuts and bolts of biology that medical professionals, insurance companies, and patients will have to parse to determine what reproductive health care is legal and when, they plead ignorance.

This is not a strictly Alabamian phenomenon. Consider the comments of Ohio state Rep. John Becker, a Republican who proposed a bill that would curb insurance coverage of all abortion care provided under non-life-threatening circumstances. When journalists and health care practitioners noted that the bill would also ban coverage of contraception devices, including certain IUDs, that prevent the implantation of fertilized eggs, Becker seemed exasperated. "That's clearly not my area of expertise," he said. He then suggested that pharmaceutical companies could simply "reformulate" their contraceptives to work differently, somehow, to comply with his legislation. That legislation, by the way, included an exception to allow insurance coverage of a medical procedure Becker appears to have invented out of whole cloth. Under Becker's bill, if a woman experiences an ectopic pregnancya life-threatening event wherein a fertilized egg attaches somewhere other than inside the uterusinsurance companies would be permitted to cover a procedure to "reimplant the fertilized ovum into the pregnant woman's uterus." That procedure does not exist."
The Slate
Stupid and ignorant men making laws about women's bodies is ludicrous.




Just an FYI, he's a politician not a physician. His gender has very little to do with what he knows about women's health since about 1/5 OBs is male.

So men shouldn't get a vote on abortion? You know with regard to these aborted pregnancies: men contribute to 100% of conceptions and are the end result of 50% of the pregnancies, right? That's not to mention how many men support the children they father whether in the home or not.

My wife did an amazing thing carrying our 2 kids for 9 months...but I helped conceive them and I'll provide the majority of the financial support they will need for the next 18-25 years. You better believe I get a vote here.

And the cherry on top: a female governor signed the Alabama bill so that kinda blows up this argument too...
Sic'em
cinque
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ShooterTX said:

Booray said:

The physical, emotional and financial burden of pregnancy, childbirth and adoption or child-rearing fall on women in a way that is wildly disproportionate to men.

If you want to reduce abortions, fix that problem. Far fewer women will want abortions.


So..... promote marriage & family. Not very popular with pro-abortion leftists.
Didn't gay couples have to fight you tooth and nail for the right to marry and create their families?
Make Racism Wrong Again
Buddha Bear
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If that's what Alabama wants, let them do it. Everything should be done at the state level. We'd have less division in the US that way.

Should probably have women voting on that though rather than only men passing this law.
bearassnekkid
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Booray said:

EatMoreSalmon said:

Booray said:

Canada2017 said:

Will be surprised if the Alabama governor signs the anti abortion bill into law.

Would be shocked if the Supreme Court then overturned Roe vs Wade

Too many folks demand the 'right' to undisciplined behavior free of inconvenient consequences.
Like the right to impregnate a women and then leave her to deal with the consequences?

The Alabama GOP consciously decided not to include a rape/incest exclusion. How is a rape victim guilty of "undisciplined behavior?"
Child support laws should include "dads" of all kinds. Consequences for undisciplined behavior by men should be legally put upon their shoulders. Help make a baby - you have to support its upbringing whether you want to or not. Refuse? Get tossed into a work prison.
That would be a start. But even if a man contributes his fair share economically, he is free to live his live as he sees fit. A woman has a day-to-day responsibility.

The logical response is "adoption." If the Supreme Court completely guts Roe v. Wade, I will be interested to see the impact on the adoption process.
Why are you making this an issue about women? Men can get pregnant too. What about them? Keep up with the times, Boo.
bearassnekkid
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cinque said:

Booray said:

Canada2017 said:

Will be surprised if the Alabama governor signs the anti abortion bill into law.

Would be shocked if the Supreme Court then overturned Roe vs Wade

Too many folks demand the 'right' to undisciplined behavior free of inconvenient consequences.
Like the right to impregnate a women and then leave her to deal with the consequences?

The Alabama GOP consciously decided not to include a rape/incest exclusion. How is a rape victim guilty of "undisciplined behavior?"
These people are perfectly fine with literally hundreds of 12 and 13 year old children being forced to bore the babies of their uncles and a rag tag assortment of other rapists and family members.

What if the product of rape is a 6 week old baby? Ok to kill it then? How about a 2 year old? How long into a child's life does the decision to kill it stand as valid? You creating that arbitrary line?
Oldbear83
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Sam Lowry said:

Oldbear83 said:

Jinx 2 said:

ScruffyD said:

the alabama law makes it illegal to leave the state for an abortion.
That's unconstitutional.
It's also screaming to a judge "end me" in a voice that proves the guys behind it were not trying to solve anything.
Don't forget about the presumption of severability.
That provision is the strangest part. It makes a kind of sense for Alabama to say there is no part of the Constitution that dictates how Alabama may govern within its borders, including abortion. But that logic would also mean that Alabama would have to respect how other states governed within their borders, meaning Alabama could not assume a power to dictate what someone might do in another state.

I see a fed judge overturning the law and SCOTUS declining to hear this one.
TexasScientist
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Sam Lowry said:

Booray said:

The physical, emotional and financial burden of pregnancy, childbirth and adoption or child-rearing fall on women in a way that is wildly disproportionate to men.

If you want to reduce abortions, fix that problem. Far fewer women will want abortions.
It's largely because of abortion and contraception that men's share of the burden has been removed.
Abortion and contraception reduce the risk of burden on both the man and woman.
 
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