TechDawgMc said:

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90sBear said:

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Assassin said:

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Sometimes you just run out of things to say. Been looking at my screen for several months now on another project. Its still mostly blank

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I don't think that's his problem.

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I think it's partly his problem. He's written himself into a position, I suspect, where he's developed this story that's so big he's not sure he can land it. It was supposed to be a trilogy. Then he kept expanding as he wrote. Now he's got all these things going and he's not sure he can get to his ending smoothly. (he'd have a much better chance if he had an editor; he's way too self-indulgent in his writing).

He's trying to write a perfect story and that's a sure starter for procrastination. And he's done that better than most college students. All the crap he's written when he should have been writing GoT is a great example. So, yes, distractions are a problem (I'm guessing that's what you mean) but they are the distractions of someone stuck in perfectionism is my guess.

Still, the original point -- that he has no one to blame but himself for not finishing the story -- is quite valid. Eight years between books is just stupid.

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The perfectionism and everything else you mention I believe. I also remember reading that he was upset when people figured out who Jon Snow's parents are. He seems the type that might be tempted to thumb his nose at the readers and writers of the TV series and completely do his own thing out of spite but re-doing things he set in motion takes a lot of effort. Or, as you alluded to, he is a perfectionist and might be trying to outdo the TV show.

But none of that is "running out of things to say." I think he has a lot of things to say, he just doesn't know how to clean it up or is worried after all this time and the TV show that it won't deliver.

I'm also curious if he intentionally waited until after the show ended to release the final books so that there would not be as many comparisons. If he waits until next year the casual fans will have moved on so only the book invested readers, who tend to prefer written material anyway, will be reading.

So I'm not sure whether the ending of Infinity War or the ending of this series is going to turn out to be more annoying.

I saw the literal definition of "Deus Ex Machina".

Cersi's greatest ally is the writers. They have this lube tech from Jiffy Lube leading a fleet of boats. Those boats have acquired exocet missiles. In one pass over the fleet, somehow never seeing the enemy boats despite an outrageously high perch, Dani watches in horror as one dragon is ripped apart by cartoonishly high powered bolts.

Enraged, her own dragon overflies the enemy fleet and engulfs it in a mighty fireball, thus ending this farce once and for all.

Sorry. That didn't happen. she flew off to fret. That way, we get to have tension, a prisoner, and another standoff.

I'll see this out because there's two episodes left and I've got nothing much else to do Sunday evenings. I thought last week's episode looked suspiciously like "The Walking Dead" with the wights gaining extraordinary speed and strength that they previously didn't have. Now, my suspicions are confirmed. I was worried that they didn't have time to wrap up the series in 8 episodes. Turns out now, they had TOO MUCH time.

TechDawgMc said:

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So I'm not sure whether the ending of Infinity War or the ending of this series is going to turn out to be more annoying.

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Let me guess, you are also super optimistic and positive about Star Wars too, right?

I love it!! But I'm crushed one of the dragons got killed last night!!!

Knight Bear said:

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TechDawgMc said:

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So I'm not sure whether the ending of Infinity War or the ending of this series is going to turn out to be more annoying.

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Let me guess, you are also super optimistic and positive about Star Wars too, right?

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Not a terrible guess, but for different reasons.

With SW, the last movie might be great (after all, Rogue one was very good) but it's already set in a universe where the Rebellion failed, and I find that very disappointing.

The other two are clearly about contrivances. Cheap plot twists to built drama. Tulip mentions that GoT is a classic Deux es Machina. In fact, it would be hard to find something more clearly fitting this "a plot device whereby a seemingly unsolvable problem in a story is suddenly and abruptly resolved by an unexpected and seemingly unlikely occurrence, typically so much as to seem contrived" Leaping hundreds of years forward in anti-ship technology in a couple of weeks clearly qualifies there.

if they wanted to kill a dragon, they could have just hired the Nightking's much eviler twin brothe....oops, did I give away the 2024 movie ending? Sorry

My daughter commented this afternoon.

"So, uh, when Cersi was just standing there with every powerful enemy in the world standing right in front of her, why didn't she just tell her archers to slaughter them all?"

Mr Tulip said:

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My daughter commented this afternoon.

"So, uh, when Cersi was just standing there with every powerful enemy in the world standing right in front of her, why didn't she just tell her archers to slaughter them all?"

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Out of the mouth of babes...

Well, she took her last final this afternoon and will graduate high school in a couple of weeks, but yeah...

she will always be barely out of the tulipian crib, eh?

That would be too easy. Lolol

Last night was weak on so many different fronts. The Jamie/brianne thing was unwatchable. Sansa breaking her "solemn oath" 3 minutes after making it. Destroying 8 years of Dany's character development in 1-2 episodes. Jon ditching the Wolf. Dany parking the last dragon 200 yards from the missile launchers. Ready for it to be over.

Mr Tulip said:

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My daughter commented this afternoon.

"So, uh, when Cersi was just standing there with every powerful enemy in the world standing right in front of her, why didn't she just tell her archers to slaughter them all?"

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I wondered about that considering that she has no morals. I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt that the group was out of range of standard archers, but if those scorpion launchers can hit a flying dragon from a moving ship, they out to be able to put a bolt in Dany without much problem.

notbubbleboy said:

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Last night was weak on so many different fronts. The Jamie/brianne thing was unwatchable. Sansa breaking her "solemn oath" 3 minutes after making it. Destroying 8 years of Dany's character development in 1-2 episodes. Jon ditching the Wolf. Dany parking the last dragon 200 yards from the missile launchers. Ready for it to be over.

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It'd be perfectly possible, and likely, for an idealistic but powerless hopeful ruler like early Dany to be dedicated to making the world a better place, but then slowly slide into the despotic "the world is better when I'm in charge, and some innocent people will have to sacrifice themselves for that greater good" vibe.

Where I have the problem is that the writers have known the end of the series was a firm stop for 3 years. They had plenty of time to write an arc that got us there. It can't be a 3 episode character assassination.

Buffy the Vampire Slayer was canceled 3 times. Each time, the writers had to conclude the series - only to reboot it when it got picked up. The Sopranos was only supposed to last 3 seasons. They had to graft into their own plots to keep it going - unsure of when it would stop. The GoT guys were fortunate enough to have a full two season lead in. It seems like they goofed off until the night before the project was due, then wrote it from the Cliff's Notes.

Queen of the North and a Texas kid...

Joe Jonas of the Jonas Brothers married Game of Thrones star Sophie Turner Wednesday night in a surprise Vegas ceremony after the Billboard Music Awards, reports People magazine. This was one day after the Jonas Brothers announced their new 40-city tour that includes a Dallas date in September.

Saw them at the Met Gala. Thanks for that report from People's magazine. Lol

Not the most encouraging reactions by the show's stars...
https://streamable.com/tanow

HuMcK said:

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Not the most encouraging reactions by the show's stars...
https://streamable.com/tanow

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Disappointing.

episode recap from Sunday

"the mad queen"

and I dont mean Cersi

I guess the show did what it had to do last night. They're out of time, so they gotta resolve some of these questions.

After a long redemption arc, Jaime got stuck in traffic, arrived late to the meeting, and got squashed cuddling his sister in the basement.

After a lifetime of never saying anything to anyone, Varys spends the last 3 episodes complaining to anyone and everyone about how weird Dany is. Dragons are surprisingly pinpoint with the firebolts.

Turns out, Dany really is weird. She looks like she's been on a 2 week bender, tries cuddling Jon (who may have been hesitant for like 6 different reasons - none having anything to do with the Throne thingummy but more questions of sanity and/or hygiene), and then pulls off the Drogon Triple Lindy stunt that should have happened at the 30 minute mark of last episode. To her credit, she eventually sticks the landing.

The Hound and Arya try to at least inject some type of literacy into the episode.

It'll be interesting to see how we say Au Revoir in the last episode without it being 6 hours long.

Mr Tulip said:

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I guess the show did what it had to do last night. They're out of time, so they gotta resolve some of these questions.

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The showrunners have said in an interview that HBO offered them whatever resources they needed to do things right several years back, and it was the showrunners (Benioff and Weiss) who wanted to wrap things up quick and dirty with the abbreviated seasons stopping at 8 (HBO wanted 10). It's honestly baffling to me, they turned down the opportunity to do justice to the story, then they took 2yrs to produce this last season which has turned out to be the laziest and most rushed one yet.

They left a damn coffee cup in a shot and got a major character's name wrong (leaving out the nerdy explanation for why, the name should have been Gendry Storm or Waters, not Gendry Rivers) in the last episode, both of which to me are indicative of a careless approach to things. Then we have the all powerful Ballista/crossbow things that killed a dragon last episode inexplicably not working after Dany figures out she can just dodge them. I swear Euron even looked into the camera as he said his last lines.

It's just not the same kind of show it used to be, and I'm not even sure these events are happening in the same order as the author of the books intends them to. I'd also put long odds on GRRM ever finishing the books so we can find out.

I won't spoil anything here, but the final plot points have evidently (they've been accurate the last few episodes) already leaked, and I don't expect things to get much better in the last episode. I had been holding out hope for some misinformation-type false leaks to hide some surprises, but it's mostly (85%+) been right so far.

HuMcK said:

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Mr Tulip said:

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I guess the show did what it had to do last night. They're out of time, so they gotta resolve some of these questions.

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The showrunners have said in an interview that HBO offered them whatever resources they needed to do things right several years back, and it was the showrunners (Benioff and Weiss) who wanted to wrap things up quick and dirty with the abbreviated seasons stopping at 8 (HBO wanted 10). It's honestly baffling to me, they turned down the opportunity to do justice to the story, then they took 2yrs to produce this last season which has turned out to be the laziest and most rushed one yet.

They left a damn coffee cup in a shot and got a major character's name wrong (leaving out the nerdy explanation for why, the name should have been Gendry Storm or Waters, not Gendry Rivers) in the last episode, both of which to me are indicative of a careless approach to things. Then we have the all powerful Ballista/crossbow things that killed a dragon last episode inexplicably not working after Dany figures out she can just dodge them. I swear Euron even looked into the camera as he said his last lines.

It's just not the same kind of show it used to be, and I'm not even sure these events are happening in the same order as the author of the books intends them to. I'd also put long odds on GRRM ever finishing the books so we can find out.

I won't spoil anything here, but the final plot points have evidently (they've been accurate the last few episodes) already leaked, and I don't expect things to get much better in the last episode. I had been holding out hope for some misinformation-type false leaks to hide some surprises, but it's mostly (85%+) been right so far.

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The events are good storytelling, but it's rushed.

We need the intensity from more dialogue and hopelessness to build up these epic events. You have to give your audience time.

It would work better if this was 7-8 episodes.

The Mad Queen arc needed the full season to play out, or her action at King's Landing needed a push to be believable...Wildfire Grey Worm or the Dothraki and then Dany can somewhat justify the rage-fueled attack on innocents.

The only other excuse I'll buy is that it wasn't entirely rage-fueled, but was instead a strategic move to prevent anyone from questioning her rule. Dragons are scary, but dragons that reduce cities and an entire populace to ash are terrifying. No one, including Sansa Stark up north will step out of line now. She even says "fear it is" while talking to Jon, insinuating that the act may have been planned from that moment. But who am I kidding...they'll probably just stick with the "duh, she's mad" schtick.

I didn't mind Jamie's arc because I never really believed he could rid himself from Cersei, no matter how bad she was for him. Seemed inevitable that he'd end up with her at the end. I hate that they humanized Cersei in this episode while demonizing Dany, but it's such a Game of Thrones thing to do.

If not for Dany's rapid descent into darkness, I'd say the worst example of rushing it was Varys. The guy survived five or six Kings and then decides he's gonna go from covert to overt action in a single episode? Not buying it. He basically commits suicide when he confronts Jon on the beach. No way he's so reckless. But I guess he had die and they ran out of time.

Oh well. I guess Dany has to die now. What an unfortunate ending. Or they could go totally Game of Thrones and end with Dany flaming Jon and then flying Drogon to Winterfell to end Sansa and the north as it cuts to black.

Her descent into madness happened rather quickly although one could argue it was precipitated by the loss of her dragons and trusted advisors. Each loss building on the last and pushing her to a breaking point. I'm glad the bells rung and she made the decision to kill the innocent people only in that I wanted her to go bad for the sake of the story line. Varys dying right before Jon and Tyrion realize how truly mad Dany is seems to fit with the way things tend to work in GoT. Tyrion was already torn up about ratting out his best friend in the world, now within 24 hours he learns Varys was right all along and he has to live with that.

My biggest issue was Cersei not suffering. I wanted her to die a horrible drawn out death at the hands of someone we care about (Sansa would have been fitting). I wanted her to be defiant until the end, not crying like a victim while hugging the man she "loves" and dealt a quick death by falling debris. Over 8 seasons she has been built up as one of the most despised characters of all time. She deserved a better, more satisfying death for those that hate her. I was betting on Jamie killing her, the ultimate betrayal in her eyes. So much for that.

This was all foreshadowed in previous seasons

"When my dragons are grown, we will take back what was stolen from me and destroy those who have wronged me. We will lay waste to armies and burn cities to the ground."

https://www.bustle.com/p/11-times-dany-burning-kings-landing-down-was-foreshadowed-on-game-of-thrones-17868220

I thought for sure Arya was going to take Jamies face, slide up to Cersi and slide the Needle right through her.

Thought the old building crashes down on Cersi and Jamie was pretty weak. Too quick for all the seasons of buildup. At least wall them up in a tomb where they die in each others arms, a slow painful death until Jamie tells Cersi to go ahead and eat him to survive. Cersi the cannibal emerges unscathed as tons of boulders are moved for the new city, Dragon's Landing.

Thats worth at least another season

Dany's great-great-great-<whatever> grandad united the 7 kingdoms by dracarys-ing up a few cities. In the end, he asked if they could all live peaceably, or if further experimentation were warranted. Dany may have simply been laying the groundwork for some outreach diplomacy.

GRRM is an astute student of history. Many of these battles and strategies parallel real-world events that I'm not educated enough to recall. One of his major themes is that whatever the political question may be or no matter how heroic or noble the cause, it's the small people who end up suffering. Arya witnessed a little girl melted into her mothers arms while they screamed in the street. The Hound begged her not to follow his path of hatred and revenge, even as he walked that road towards what knew to be a stupidly pointless confrontation with his own brother.

Those two scenes almost combine to make a literary point.

And now what happens?

I havent read anything yet - so I will take a 'stab'...

Arya infiltrates the court by taking Grey Worm face and dispatches the Dragon Queen with her Needle.

Drogon goes bezerk, spewing fire across the board until we find out that he's not really upset, or a he at all. He is actually Drogona, a she, and is pregnant with several new dragons. The bezerker mode is quite common for pregnant dragons.

John Snow brings Drogona home to meet the family.

Bran instantly bonds with the baby dragons and John builds him a harness so he can fly high without getting all white-eyed

John Snow is now King of the World. Tryien becomes his hand. John is furious with Sansa for her part in driving Danryes mad and strips of rank, title of send her to the Lord of Light convent where she disappears into the walls never to be seen again.

Meanwhile in the north, the son of the Nightking begans his recruitment of bodies and souls

Bran Stark completes his morph into the Three Eyed Raven.

Under that guise, he reunites with The Bloodraven (the three-eyed crow). He inhabits Drogon and levels the Kings Landing Court. As Fire and Ice, Bran and Brynden (The Three Eyed Raven and Three Eyed Crow) balance the world between Kings Landing and Cave Beyond the Wall. Nothing makes sense, and a million fans wish they'd spent more time playing outside.

Those predictions are better than what we got/will get.

HuMcK said:

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Those predictions are better than what we got/will get.

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the worse thing is that this has been a masterful series up until Season 8. There is a time I would have put the writing up there with Breaking Bad.

Assassin said:

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HuMcK said:

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Those predictions are better than what we got/will get.

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the worse thing is that this has been a masterful series up until Season 8. There is a time I would have put the writing up there with Breaking Bad.

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I don't mind the story arcs and the acting has been top notch. The problem is that they shoved two storylines (Night King and Mad Queen) for what should have been two full seasons of content into six episodes. No way they do the arcs justice in that time.