This is not apples to apples by any means. Bohanon had the home game and Shapen had the tough road assignment. Bohanon had more established and seasoned offensive weapons at his disposal.

But….I was curious to compare stat lines. It's interesting that their attempts and completions were identical….yet Bohanon threw for almost 100 more yards than Shapen. He was obviously able to connect on more downfield passes. Seems ironic since that was the whole reason for making Shapen QB1.

Shapen did not have any completions over 20 yards. Bohanon had 3 over 20 yards (Thorton 45, Sims 27, Sneed 24).

I'm not out on Shapen by any means. That was a very tough assignment last night and he didn't seem to be getting much help from the OL or WRs. It just seemed like last night we were running an offense more suited for Bohanon than Shapen.

Bohanon 18 for 28 for 231 yards, 1 TD, 1 INT
0 sacks

Shapen 18 for 28 for 137 yards, 1 TD, 0 INT
4 sacks for -22 yards

I keep hearing that Shapen is a better passer

How much better is he really?

Was it wise to replace a winning QB with a guy who is not the next RG3 or Bryce Petty

How would we know what Blake really has? We don't let him do anything besides turn around and hand the ball off 50 times. I'm not saying he's this huge upgrade from Gerry. But their reasoning was they wanted to have a more explosive passing game. That's hard to do when you don't let your QB throw.

robby44 said:

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I keep hearing that Shapen is a better passer

How much better is he really?

Was it wise to replace a winning QB with a guy who is not the next RG3 or Bryce Petty

---

Last year after going 17/17 to start the big12 championship game, Grimes mentioned that he has the same size and skill set that Zach Wilson had when he first got to BYU. That doesn't mean Shapen will develop into a #2 pick, but that was his comparison, and as the coach that helped develop him into a #2 pick, he seems like a guy to trust.

Shapen had a bad game, but I'm convinced 1 of 2 things happened in the second half last night:

1) (most likely) Shapen got hit weird on his shoulder and has some kind of injury. This was such a fluky set of play calls in the second half it's the only logical answer
2) wide receivers got 0 separation on base coverage. Given how open the TE were consistently able to get in the first half and early second half, this seems less likely. To not even attempt a screen or TE seem play seems completely insane if Shapen had any velocity on his passes.

I get it. We sucked last night and play calling was a huge problem. But be serious, Shapen is a much better passer than Gerry. For whatever reason last night he as just as conservative as Gerry was all season. Pressure is a little different when you are the guy instead of the backup. All those damn handoffs don't help guys establish a rhythm. I said it before the game. We don't have a standout WR. I like Monterrey but he is not a number one at that size. I see the high stars on the recruiting list but none of those guys have that dog in them

Very interesting. Everyone is caught on Grimes when the coach who actually had the worse game was Matteos. BYU did a masterful job disguising stunts and blitzes all night that left our offensive linemen clueless and grabbing for jersey, hence a lot of those penalties. Matteos was never able to adjust his blocking schemes or his players weren't listening to him. In fact, his unit looked discombobulated last week against a really weak and really small FCS team until the 2nd half.

Shapen is not injured. He was just a deer in headlights. People need to stop thinking he's some 4th year senior with 30 career starts. He hasn't even started the equivalent of half a season yet. He was dazed and confused by the looks BYU was giving him, which left him completely unsure of what to do. He appears almost fearful to make a mistake, which is not what we saw in the first half of the Big 12 championship game. But, that just goes back to the the aforementioned fact he's not even started the equivalent of half a season yet. Expect some rawness until the kid gets experience. It's not his fault some of you were ready to put him in the College Football Hall of Fame because of one half of one game.

DanaDane said:

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Very interesting. Everyone is caught on Grimes when the coach who actually had the worse game was Matteos. BYU did a masterful job disguising stunts and blitzes all night that left our offensive linemen clueless and grabbing for jersey, hence a lot of those penalties. Matteos was never able to adjust his blocking schemes or his players weren't listening to him. In fact, his unit looked discombobulated last week against a really weak and really small FCS team until the 2nd half.

Shapen is not injured. He was just a deer in headlights. People need to stop thinking he's some 4th year senior with 30 career starts. He hasn't even started the equivalent of half a season yet. He was dazed and confused by the looks BYU was giving him, which left him completely unsure of what to do. He appears almost fearful to make a mistake, which is not what we saw in the first half of the Big 12 championship game. But, that just goes back to the the aforementioned fact he's not even started the equivalent of half a season yet. Expect some rawness until the kid gets experience. It's not his fault some of you were ready to put him in the College Football Hall of Fame because of one half of one game.

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#expectations

Guy could still be great. Has upside. Potential. Can't go mental like Chuck Knoblauch

robby44 said:

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I keep hearing that Shapen is a better passer

How much better is he really?

Was it wise to replace a winning QB with a guy who is not the next RG3 or Bryce Petty

---

The problem is that we have only a limited sample size. It's probably too early for us to judge his passing ability. On the other hand, the coaches made their decision upon the games & the practices. They saw something they liked. I'm certainly not going to discount that based upon one game in which Blake wasn't terrible. He just wasn't particularly great either. It was a road game in a very difficult environment.

At least he still hasn't thrown an INT in just collegiate career.

Shapen was throwing darts in the third quarter threading needles zinging the ball, he throws the ball down field when call to do so Bohannon floats the ball there's a big difference.

Watching the game back I'm more and more convinced that Grimes absolutely called the worst offensive game of his career. I'm not saying Shapen was great either, but the number of designed runs and the absolute lack of any ingenuity in pass calls to get Shapen into a flow was all too obvious.

Shapen's stat line actually isn't that bad - no turnovers, decent completion %, a TD - with one glaring exception: 4.9 yards per completion. That's scheme. YAC is all about play design and engineering space. We just did almost nothing creative in the playcalling space.

Again, Shapen was not perfect, and was too cautious at times. But the OC needs to playcall the QB into a rhythm, and we just did not even try do that well. It looked like we were holding back half the playbook for another game.

Agree with all of this. Have now watched it 3 times. Other thing I'll add is the more I watch it the worse the o line looks. Wish we could skip this week and fast forward tov@ISU I'm really intrigued to see if they adjust and throw more

For those that have rewatched the game: there's a point in the late third quarter or early fourth where we go to exclusive runs. Did Shapen have any runs where he got tackled in the third or fourth that might be an injury?

Noticed Shapen not stepping into his throws late in the game. He wasn't throwing off his back foot, but was throwing off his lead foot while leaning back and not getting any forward momentum into his throws.

That said what a wild atmosphere to play in and he had no help whatsoever for the most part, but his throws didn't look right pretty often because of this. Someone needs to address that, I don't think there was anything wrong physically.

Shapen was a missed PAT away from a win against a team that will be top 10 and competing for a playoff spot if they dont have a mental lapse. On their home field.

This loss was on Grimes.

So much talk about Shapen. Not enough talk about his receivers failing to get open. The talent at the position from last year just isn't there but I expect them to improve over the course of the season.

Dman said:

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Shapen was a missed PAT away from a win against a team that will be top 10 and competing for a playoff spot if they dont have a mental lapse. On their home field.

This loss was on Grimes.

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It was a team effort. The line was bad, Shapen was bad, the play-calling was bad. The offense, in general, was just plain bad. It felt more like 2020 than last season.

What happened to the O-line? He was running for his life way too much.

That last throw out of the end zone will be his equivalent to Gerry's TCU interception.

Bears2Canes said:

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So much talk about Shapen. Not enough talk about his receivers failing to get open. The talent at the position from last year just isn't there but I expect them to improve over the course of the season.

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It's not a talent issue with our wideouts IMO. It's an experience issue. We talk about this being just Shapen's fourth college start. None of these receivers had ever started a college game before this year. That group is going to take some time to mature into the roles they're being thrown into right now. And there's no veteran playmaker around to help take pressure off them as they do.

bear2be2 said:

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Bears2Canes said:

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So much talk about Shapen. Not enough talk about his receivers failing to get open. The talent at the position from last year just isn't there but I expect them to improve over the course of the season.

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It's not a talent issue with our wideouts IMO. It's an experience issue. We talk about this being just Shapen's fourth college start. None of these receivers had ever started a college game before this year. That group is going to take some time to mature into the roles they're being thrown into right now. And there's no veteran playmaker around to help take pressure off them as they do.

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You're not wrong ... but BYU had a 17-year-old kid barely on the depth chart that almost single handedly beat us.

Drew Estrada was such a solid portal pick up last year. It was helpful to be able to bring in a seasoned WR to add to the group.

Harrison Bergeron said:

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What happened to the O-line? He was running for his life way too much.

That last throw out of the end zone will be his equivalent to Gerry's TCU interception.

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I'm wondering how much were really missing Abram Smith and Trestan Ebner from a Blocking perspective. A good blocking RB is invaluable providing extra time for the QB when the OL lets someone through. The young backs might not have that skill.

Poor comparison. One played at home, one played in BYU. Secondly, BYU has a much better defense this year.

Give me Shapen every single game over GB.

robby44 said:

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I keep hearing that Shapen is a better passer

How much better is he really?

Was it wise to replace a winning QB with a guy who is not the next RG3 or Bryce Petty

---

Rewatch the Sugar Bowl. One of the worst passing performances I have ever seen. I think we should have just gone wild cat.

JP1037 said:

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robby44 said:

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I keep hearing that Shapen is a better passer

How much better is he really?

Was it wise to replace a winning QB with a guy who is not the next RG3 or Bryce Petty

---

Rewatch the Sugar Bowl. One of the worst passing performances I have ever seen. I think we should have just gone wild cat.

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It wasn't a good passing performance but wins are what counts. Gerry is the only Bear QB to win a New Years day bowl since whomever quarterbacked the 1957 Sugar Bowl
I'll take the W every time

Bakersdozen said:

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Poor comparison. One played at home, one played in BYU. Secondly, BYU has a much better defense this year.

Give me Shapen every single game over GB.

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What is the goal? To win games or to have a guy who maybe a better passer

If you replace a winner then replacement has to be great not just average

JP1037 said:

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robby44 said:

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I keep hearing that Shapen is a better passer

How much better is he really?

Was it wise to replace a winning QB with a guy who is not the next RG3 or Bryce Petty

---

Rewatch the Sugar Bowl. One of the worst passing performances I have ever seen. I think we should have just gone wild cat.

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robby44 said:

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JP1037 said:

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robby44 said:

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I keep hearing that Shapen is a better passer

How much better is he really?

Was it wise to replace a winning QB with a guy who is not the next RG3 or Bryce Petty

---

Rewatch the Sugar Bowl. One of the worst passing performances I have ever seen. I think we should have just gone wild cat.

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It wasn't a good passing performance but wins are what counts. Gerry is the only Bear QB to win a New Years day bowl since whomever quarterbacked the 1957 Sugar Bowl
I'll take the W every time

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Flawed argument. Defense and Monoray Baldwin and Abram Smith/Ebner and Oline won that game despite Bohannon. I don't recall a worse qb performance.

JP1037 said:

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robby44 said:

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JP1037 said:

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robby44 said:

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I keep hearing that Shapen is a better passer

How much better is he really?

Was it wise to replace a winning QB with a guy who is not the next RG3 or Bryce Petty

---

Rewatch the Sugar Bowl. One of the worst passing performances I have ever seen. I think we should have just gone wild cat.

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It wasn't a good passing performance but wins are what counts. Gerry is the only Bear QB to win a New Years day bowl since whomever quarterbacked the 1957 Sugar Bowl
I'll take the W every time

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Flawed argument. Defense and Monoray Baldwin and Abram Smith/Ebner and Oline won that game despite Bohannon. I don't recall a worse qb performance.

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Got it.
Worst QB performance in a new years day bowl game that resulted in a victory. You know who had a worse performance. The ole miss QB

Does Gerry get credit for contributing to the teams regular season success and making it to the Sugar Bowl

robby44 said:

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JP1037 said:

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robby44 said:

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I keep hearing that Shapen is a better passer

How much better is he really?

Was it wise to replace a winning QB with a guy who is not the next RG3 or Bryce Petty

---

Rewatch the Sugar Bowl. One of the worst passing performances I have ever seen. I think we should have just gone wild cat.

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It wasn't a good passing performance but wins are what counts. Gerry is the only Bear QB to win a New Years day bowl since whomever quarterbacked the 1957 Sugar Bowl
I'll take the W every time

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Quarterback Bobby Jones

If Gerry plays last Saturday for us we win.

Go look at the starting offensive line for the BYU game and compare it to the bowl game.

I saw the problems in the first few drives.

BUMBA1 said:

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If Gerry plays last Saturday for us we win.

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That is laughable, to me.

Not sure it's that far fetched, go re watch the game and count the number of times Blake could have pulled the ball for monster gains but didn't. The DEs crashed hard all night. No way in hell they could have done that with Gerry at QB. Not saying we win but our running would have been much harder for them to defend

IowaBear said:

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Not sure it's that far fetched, go re watch the game and count the number of times Blake could have pulled the ball for monster gains but didn't. The DEs crashed hard all night. No way in hell they could have done that with Gerry at QB. Not saying we win but our running would have been much harder for them to defend

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Thank you. This is what so many continue to miss while they're bashing Gerry's passing ability -- his enormous impact on the running game.

These same people give everyone but Gerry credit for the rushing success we had last year, ignoring the fact that those same players had way less success moving the ball on the ground every time Shapen played last year.

I'm not arguing that Gerry is a better college quarterback than Blake is. But our running game was consistently and demonstrably better when he was behind center. It wasn't even close.

If we don't have a dynamic passing game this year with Shapen (and we certainly didn't on Saturday), our offense will be worse than it was last year. Because statistics say we're not going to be able to run the ball nearly as well.

Last year we had three great rushers: Smith, Ebner & Bohanon. They made things very difficult for opposing defenses. The option for Gerry to tuck & run resulted in many first downs or touchdowns.

But that was also made possible by an outstanding OL. For both games this season, the OL seems to have regressed. If the coaches can fix that it would help solve our offensive problems even if it is only one area of concern.