It's time to call for a new coach.

I disagree. What other schools are telling 400 recruits is that if you sign with BU Coach Hart won't be there much longer. He still got Wil London and barely missed out on some huge recruits like Michael Norman. It's time to land another stud like Wil in the next class.

No new coach can do any better with so little as the present coaches are doing. The current NCAA setup is stacked against private schools.

Track letterman chiming in here:

Both Stanford and USC are private schools who did fairly well this weekend, but yes, I agree that private schools get the short end of the stick in partial scholarship sports like track and baseball. However, the coaches know this and need to figure out the recruiting. It was no different for Clyde back in the 80's when I ran, but BU happened to have some salty teams.

Harbour did recruit Bromell who would still be winning NCAA meets had he not turned pro, but he's missed on some too. It doesn't help that aggy, tech and cougar high are concentrating in the sprint areas where we've excelled in the past, either, as a partial scholly at A&M goes much further towards costs than at Baylor. That being said, excuses are like a butt-- everyone has one and they all stink.

Like every sport and endeavor, do a post mortem at the end of the year. tied for 55th and praying we beat Liberty doesn't work. IF it wasn't for London, BU would've had ZERO points. Let that sink in for a moment. Baylor track with one of the best facilities and best histories blanked if it weren't for one kid. What does that say about the program? To me-- it says a lot. We are missing talent. The relay parts aren't interchangeable right now. We are missing talent in all the other events where we've scored in the past. And that goes to recruiting and identification of it.

Obviously, Rhodes had the conversation with Knoll and now it's time with Todd. They have to figure this out or we'll be trying to beat Liberty again next year.

...Baylor track with one of the best facilities and best histories blanked if it weren't for one kid. What does that say about the program? To me-- it says a lot. .....


Indeed. We have got to make a complete transition in our recruiting philosophy in men's track. But, it goes beyond that. We have other issues as well, and they seem to coincide with the change in our S&C program. Those issues are evident in the way we have closed our last two seasons, and especially on the women's side, where we have a greater talent pool. And there are plenty of coaching head-scratchers as well, though I would rather not speculate on those decisions.

The track program is without a doubt the most stable and successful athletic program in Baylor history. You'll find hardly another such program in all of the NCAA with the same continuity. Despite that, we have to get back to a higher plane of success. We have invested steadily in the program for decades to the point where we need to be making the kinds of strategic decisions in recruiting, coaching, training, scheduling and staffing that the program, the athletes, the university and the supporters deserve.

Speaking of the extreme success of USC and Stanford is it because of their use of academic endowments, better management of the scholarships allotted, or what? Some schools other than those I suspect "cheat" by getting great athletes qualified or accepted into school.

GarlandBear84 said:

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Speaking of the extreme success of USC and Stanford is it because of their use of academic endowments, better management of the scholarships allotted, or what? Some schools other than those I suspect "cheat" by getting great athletes qualified or accepted into school.

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It doesn't take a deep team to score well at the NCAAs. It takes using your scholarships on athletes that can score there, instead of splitting one scholarship on 4 guys that can't get 4 points together at the conference meet.

If we could recruit sprinters/hurdlers/middle distance runners and supplement with football players in the sprints, jumps and throws we could make noise at the NCAAs. The other option is to go all out in the middle distance/distances where you can build a good XC team while you're at it, although your ceiling on the track will be 10th-20th. Every scholarship/partial you give has to represent a potential point at the NCAAs, whether that is in an individual event or as a solid relay leg. If you are going to spend part of your allotment on a HJer, he had better be a 7'3" guy or you are wasting the resource. If you are going to spend part of your allotment on a PVer, he had better be an 18'5" guy or you are wasting the resource.

You get more bang for your buck on a guy who can run 46.0/1:46 than you do on a guy who can throw the JAV 220'. Same for a guy that can go 13.6 in the HH and run a solid leg on the 4X100. You don't have to score in every event, you have to score well in 4 or 5 or 6.

when was our last great 400IH guy? Kamani? Those guys are tough and can double in the 4x4 or open 400. Do we even have an IH'er on campus right now? We haven't had a intermediate hurdler make the NCAA meet since Kamani and Smith in 2001. RGIII got hurt in 2008 if I remember or he would've but he wasn't a Harbour recruit. He ran a 49.2 as a freshman on shear guts. I think he even led with the wrong leg.

Surf Oso said:

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when was our last great 400IH guy? Kamani? Those guys are tough and can double in the 4x4 or open 400. Do we even have an IH'er on campus right now? We haven't had a intermediate hurdler make the NCAA meet since Kamani and Smith in 2001. RGIII got hurt in 2008 if I remember or he would've but he wasn't a Harbour recruit. He ran a 49.2 as a freshman on shear guts. I think he even led with the wrong leg.

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We had a FR Jayson Baldridge this year that had the 15th fastest time in the nation, but he got hurt before the B12s and had to run gimpy the rest of the year. He also ran the lead-off leg on our fastest 4X400 of the year (3:04). JR Antwuan Musgrove ran the 19th fastest 400H in the nation, but was very inconsistent. Don't forget that the Bromell's class included TJ Holmes, a great intermediate hurdler who got homesick and transferred back home to Florida, went pro last year and was 5th at the World Championships. While he was at Baylor, he was 2nd in the 400H at the B12s, ran a leg on the B12 Champ 4X400, was 4th in the 400H at the NCAAs, won the USA Junior Nationals, and got the bronze medal at the World Junior Champs.

thanks Malbec. I was simply going down the list of performances on the track site at baylorbears.com . They must have not updated this year's times yet.

Don't knock IH'ers unless you are man enough to try it, and do it right.

This race separates the grain from the chafe; the men from the boys. And its even harder to run the IH race, and turn around in 15 minutes and run a decent leg on the 4 X 400.

La Porte has a kid that won the State 6A in the 3200 meters this year as a sophomore. He came in second as a freshman. My wife taught his uncle her first year out of Baylor, when he was in the fourth grade. My wife and I have kept up with him throughout the years. He was a stud football player and an All American offensive lineman at U of H.. His name is Todd Schoppe. He's the A.D. at La Porte now.

The kid's name is Ryan Schoppe. I've never met him or his Father, Russell. I called the Track office several weeks ago, and the lady said she would tell both Todd and Coach Hart, who I've known since I got to Baylor in '66. I've known Ryan's Grandfather for several years. He's been my exterminator the last few years.

Houston probably has the inside track on this kid, but I sure would like for him to consider Baylor.

Sic'em Bears!!

Buddy Moore