Oldbear83 said:

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You shouldn't post while drinking

---

Hell, you do it all the time. I limit it to weekends, you should try it.

FLBear5630 said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

You shouldn't post while drinking

---

Hell, you do it all the time. I limit it to weekends, you should try it.

---

I see you are projecting again. I have not had a drink since 2006, when I got my cancer diagnosis.

Oldbear83 said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Anything to excuse the hypocrisy. Got it

---

You really think that Trump did nothing wrong? No matter what they say they have, you are putting your fingers in your ears and yelling so you don't have to listen? So, no matter what the evidence shows.

You also think Biden should be charged while a sitting President?

---

I really think, on the evidence, that all you care about is "getting" Trump.


Nothing about the lawfare, the abuse of power by prosecutors, the cherry-picked venues, etc. matters to you because it's going after Trump.


For the record, I want Trump to be held accountable for his actions, but only in the same manner and to the same degree as all his predecessors.

ALL Presidents keep documents for research and personal interest.,

ALL former Presidents have unique standing because they were President.

ALL cases of fraud have - before now - required evidence of real harm to a victim

ALL accusations of rape used to need evidence of guilt beyond doubt in a criminal case

You are happy with abandoning all precedent, just so you can get Trump on something.

---

Post of the Month

Well done.

Oldbear83 said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Oldbear83 said:

---

You shouldn't post while drinking

---

Hell, you do it all the time. I limit it to weekends, you should try it.

---

I see you are projecting again. I have not had a drink since 2006, when I got my cancer diagnosis.

---

Glad to see you survived. Figured you approved since you thought nothing of accusing me of posting drunk. But I take it you live in a town of all one way streets.

We going with personal stuff on here? You really want to bring personal stuff to guilt people on a message board?

FLBear5630 said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

You shouldn't post while drinking

---

Hell, you do it all the time. I limit it to weekends, you should try it.

---

I see you are projecting again. I have not had a drink since 2006, when I got my cancer diagnosis.

---

Glad to see you survived. Figured you approved since you thought nothing of accusing me of posting drunk. But I take it you live in a town of all one way streets.

We going with personal stuff on here? You really want to bring personal stuff to guilt people on a message board?

---

I apologize, you have popped off quite a few shots at Trump, so it seemed your metier.

I see you do not like receiving what you shoot out.

Oldbear83 said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

You shouldn't post while drinking

---

Hell, you do it all the time. I limit it to weekends, you should try it.

---

I see you are projecting again. I have not had a drink since 2006, when I got my cancer diagnosis.

---

Glad to see you survived. Figured you approved since you thought nothing of accusing me of posting drunk. But I take it you live in a town of all one way streets.

We going with personal stuff on here? You really want to bring personal stuff to guilt people on a message board?

---

I apologize, you have popped off quite a few shots at Trump, so it seemed your metier.

I see you do not like receiving what you shoot out.

---

You are related to Trump and take it personally? I apologize. I didn't know you were so vested in Donald. I view him as a Presidential Candidate and as such is fair game.

Just didn't want to get into personal ***** You said I was drinking, thought it was fair play. But, I was wrong.

4th and Inches said:

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J.R. said:

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Bank fraud is bank fraud, don't care what state. His level of fraud is just a piece of his make up. Ya, just can't inflate and defeat assets like has always done. It is criminal.

---

it wasnt bank fraud..

---

Really, dude you are giving little Johnny and old 83 for dumbass posts. It sure as hell was fraud and many, many levels. Tell me about your banking experience. Tell us all why it wasn't fraud. Wow.

You are no Raul Julia

J.R. said:

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4th and Inches said:

---

J.R. said:

---

Bank fraud is bank fraud, don't care what state. His level of fraud is just a piece of his make up. Ya, just can't inflate and defeat assets like has always done. It is criminal.

---

it wasnt bank fraud..

---

Really, dude you are giving little Johnny and old 83 for dumbass posts. It sure as hell was fraud and many, many levels. Tell me about your banking experience. Tell us all why it wasn't fraud. Wow.

---

oh yeah, i forgot you sat on the board of some local bank until it got bought out by a tiny regional bank chain..

Go swim in your money scrooge mcduck

J.R. said:

---

4th and Inches said:

---

J.R. said:

---

Bank fraud is bank fraud, don't care what state. His level of fraud is just a piece of his make up. Ya, just can't inflate and defeat assets like has always done. It is criminal.

---

it wasnt bank fraud..

---

Really, dude you are giving little Johnny and old 83 for dumbass posts. It sure as hell was fraud and many, many levels. Tell me about your banking experience. Tell us all why it wasn't fraud. Wow.

---

It was fraud, he was tried and found guilty. This wasnt inflating his worth for a Forbes or Rolling Stone article. He used those values to obtain financing. Taking his own advice, never use your own money, put other people's money at risk. Let's hear what Donald has to say on the subject in the Art of the Deal Rule #3- use other people's resources...

Using other people's resources: Trump advises utilizing other people's money, time, and expertise whenever possible. By leveraging the resources and skills of others, you can achieve more while minimizing your own investment. Why do everything ourselves when we can have other people do it for us?

He is politicking himself to more power...

When you hate Trump no matter what, you can easily ignore all kinds of Reality.

Notice how these guys never really mind Biden's crimes?

Oldbear83 said:

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When you hate Trump no matter what, you can easily ignore all kinds of Reality.

Notice how these guys never really mind Biden's crimes?

---

Who ever said that? If I remember correctly it has been said numerous times that he is a sitting President so let's see what happens after he is out. Nobody brought criminal charges against Trump while in office.

Second, where the hell is the GOP? Where is Gaetz and his merry band? They seem eager enough to attack Republicans yet nothing on Biden. Are they going to wait until his last month to impeach???

Since you are personally in with Trump, as any banging on Trump is taking as a personal verbal assault, where is MAGA? No impeachment, we are literally in year 4....

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

I agree with you. Every valuation I have ever seen used for financing is either supported by an Appraisal or identifies why the valuation is higher based on comps. Also, the particulars are pretty solid, such as square footage or limitations to future development, both items Trump "fudged" on by a large degree.

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

The biggest issue to me is selective prosecution.

Should be the biggest issue to everyone regardless of your political persuasion.

Biden held documents ….gets a pass.

His wife has seen her net worth go from 18 million to over 80 million dollars in only 5 years. . An increase of 1230 %. And no one asks how.

KaiBear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

The biggest issue to me is selective prosecution.

Should be the biggest issue to everyone regardless of your political persuasion.

Biden held documents ….gets a pass.

His wife has seen her net worth go from 18 million to over 80 million dollars in only 5 years. . An increase of 1230 %. And no one asks how.

---

How many sitting Presidents were charged with crimes like this while they were in office?

Even the Dems didn't charge Trump while he was a sitting President. They used Impeachment, a political process.

So, I am reserving judgement on whether Biden is brought to justice, just like Donald.

Now, I DO AGREE where he hell is the Impeachment??? GOP is supposed to have the majority. We are in year 4 and Biden has gotten a pass from Congress.

IF Biden is impeached, I agree charge away. But, first thing is first. He either is impeached or we have to wait until Feb next year.

KaiBear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

The biggest issue to me is selective prosecution.

Should be the biggest issue to everyone regardless of your political persuasion.

Biden held documents ….gets a pass.

His wife has seen her net worth go from 18 million to over 80 million dollars in only 5 years. . An increase of 1230 %. And no one asks how.

---

Trump was never going to be charged on the documents alone. Feds gave him every chance. It was Trump's response. You just can't flaunt federal subpoenas. If you can point to others who have gotten away with that, I will gladly jump on the selective prosecution train.

Plenty of folks have asked how, and continue to do so, but so far, the GOP and its investigators have overpromised and underperformed.

4th and Inches said:

---

J.R. said:

---

4th and Inches said:

---

J.R. said:

---

Bank fraud is bank fraud, don't care what state. His level of fraud is just a piece of his make up. Ya, just can't inflate and defeat assets like has always done. It is criminal.

---

it wasnt bank fraud..

---

Really, dude you are giving little Johnny and old 83 for dumbass posts. It sure as hell was fraud and many, many levels. Tell me about your banking experience. Tell us all why it wasn't fraud. Wow.

---

oh yeah, i forgot you sat on the board of some local bank until it got bought out by a tiny regional bank chain..

Go swim in your money scrooge mcduck

---

You didn't answer the question. Actually, we took it public. Thanks , though.

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

The biggest issue to me is selective prosecution.

Should be the biggest issue to everyone regardless of your political persuasion.

Biden held documents ….gets a pass.

His wife has seen her net worth go from 18 million to over 80 million dollars in only 5 years. . An increase of 1230 %. And no one asks how.

---

Trump was never going to be charged on the documents alone. Feds gave him every chance. It was Trump's response. You just can't flaunt federal subpoenas. If you can point to others who have gotten away with that, I will gladly jump on the selective prosecution train.

Plenty of folks have asked how, and continue to do so, but so far, the GOP and its investigators have overpromised and underperformed.

---

None of which addresses Biden's obvious illegal storage of secret documents ….for years.

I do not like Donald Trump.

However it should be obvious to any open minded individual that he has been targeted.

Good grief the impeachments against him were openly discussed by Dems before Trump even took office and as presented were a total joke.

Using such criteria every president since John Adam's should have been impeached .

Unfortunately there is now zero chance for going back to responsible; civil governmental leadership.

24 hr news and social media will make sure of it.

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

The biggest issue to me is selective prosecution.

Should be the biggest issue to everyone regardless of your political persuasion.

Biden held documents ….gets a pass.

His wife has seen her net worth go from 18 million to over 80 million dollars in only 5 years. . An increase of 1230 %. And no one asks how.

---

Trump was never going to be charged on the documents alone. Feds gave him every chance. It was Trump's response. You just can't flaunt federal subpoenas. If you can point to others who have gotten away with that, I will gladly jump on the selective prosecution train.

Plenty of folks have asked how, and continue to do so, but so far, the GOP and its investigators have overpromised and underperformed.

---

None of which addresses Biden's obvious illegal storage of secret documents ….for years.

I do not like Donald Trump.

However it should be obvious to any open minded individual that he has been targeted.

Good grief the impeachments against him were openly discussed by Dems before Trump even took office and as presented were a total joke.

Using such criteria every president since John Adam's should have been impeached .

Unfortunately there is now zero chance for going back to responsible; civil governmental leadership.

24 hr news and social media will make sure of it.

---

Do you arrest a sitting President? How do you do what you are saying? If Congress won't impeach, DOJ sends the FBI to the White House to arrest the President? In Year 4, 7 months to an election?

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

The biggest issue to me is selective prosecution.

Should be the biggest issue to everyone regardless of your political persuasion.

Biden held documents ….gets a pass.

His wife has seen her net worth go from 18 million to over 80 million dollars in only 5 years. . An increase of 1230 %. And no one asks how.

---

Trump was never going to be charged on the documents alone. Feds gave him every chance. It was Trump's response. You just can't flaunt federal subpoenas. If you can point to others who have gotten away with that, I will gladly jump on the selective prosecution train.

Plenty of folks have asked how, and continue to do so, but so far, the GOP and its investigators have overpromised and underperformed.

---

None of which addresses Biden's obvious illegal storage of secret documents ….for years.

I do not like Donald Trump.

However it should be obvious to any open minded individual that he has been targeted.

Good grief the impeachments against him were openly discussed by Dems before Trump even took office and as presented were a total joke.

Using such criteria every president since John Adam's should have been impeached .

Unfortunately there is now zero chance for going back to responsible; civil governmental leadership.

24 hr news and social media will make sure of it.

---

Of course Trump has been targeted, from the very beginning. Most of it has been dead wrong. Some of it is legit.

Yes, I did address Biden's documents by saying Trump would not have been charged on the docs alone.

Agree there is no going back, but that's not just Trump. The parties have attacked each other since well before Trump. Think Reagan, Clintons, Trump calling to lock up Hillary, and many more.

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

Then ask yourself this . . . had Donald Trump not run for (and won) president, would the State of New York have investigated him? Would the DA have run a campaign on getting Donlad Trump?

The honest answer to those questions is No and it should scare the hell out of any business and person in New York - step out of line, watch your back.

This is a banana republic and clearlly a two-tierd justice system.

GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

Then ask yourself this . . . had Donald Trump not run for (and won) president, would the State of New York have investigated him? Would the DA have run a campaign on getting Donlad Trump?

The honest answer to those questions is No and it should scare the hell out of any business and person in New York - step out of line, watch your back.

This is a banana republic and clearlly a two-tierd justice system.

---

100% obviously correct .

GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

Then ask yourself this . . . had Donald Trump not run for (and won) president, would the State of New York have investigated him? Would the DA have run a campaign on getting Donlad Trump?

The honest answer to those questions is No and it should scare the hell out of any business and person in New York - step out of line, watch your back.

This is a banana republic and clearlly a two-tierd justice system.

---

Of course the answer is no. Would Clintons have been investigated for Whitewater? Hunter Biden for his business dealings? President Biden? All the Senators/House from both parties who have been investigated?

The answer to all of these is no. Politicians are targets and that has been happening since before Rome . . . .

sombear said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

Then ask yourself this . . . had Donald Trump not run for (and won) president, would the State of New York have investigated him? Would the DA have run a campaign on getting Donlad Trump?

The honest answer to those questions is No and it should scare the hell out of any business and person in New York - step out of line, watch your back.

This is a banana republic and clearlly a two-tierd justice system.

---

Of course the answer is no. Would Clintons have been investigated for Whitewater? Hunter Biden for his business dealings? President Biden? All the Senators/House from both parties who have been investigated?

The answer to all of these is no. Politicians are targets and that has been happening since before Rome . . . .

---

The persecution of ex president Trump is unprecedented.

And should give pause to all Americans.

sombear said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

Then ask yourself this . . . had Donald Trump not run for (and won) president, would the State of New York have investigated him? Would the DA have run a campaign on getting Donlad Trump?

The honest answer to those questions is No and it should scare the hell out of any business and person in New York - step out of line, watch your back.

This is a banana republic and clearlly a two-tierd justice system.

---

Of course the answer is no. Would Clintons have been investigated for Whitewater? Hunter Biden for his business dealings? President Biden? All the Senators/House from both parties who have been investigated?

The answer to all of these is no. Politicians are targets and that has been happening since before Rome . . . .

---

Investigation by political bodies is politics. Investigation by States is not.

This event has effectively ended any chance of a dem rising from a Red State or a republican coming from a Blue State.


The precedent of this will be long lasting.

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

Then ask yourself this . . . had Donald Trump not run for (and won) president, would the State of New York have investigated him? Would the DA have run a campaign on getting Donlad Trump?

The honest answer to those questions is No and it should scare the hell out of any business and person in New York - step out of line, watch your back.

This is a banana republic and clearlly a two-tierd justice system.

---

Of course the answer is no. Would Clintons have been investigated for Whitewater? Hunter Biden for his business dealings? President Biden? All the Senators/House from both parties who have been investigated?

The answer to all of these is no. Politicians are targets and that has been happening since before Rome . . . .

---

The persecution of ex president Trump is unprecedented.

And should give pause to all Americans.

---

Agree, but he's done himself no favors, and some charges seem legitimate.

GrowlTowel said:

---

sombear said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

Then ask yourself this . . . had Donald Trump not run for (and won) president, would the State of New York have investigated him? Would the DA have run a campaign on getting Donlad Trump?

The honest answer to those questions is No and it should scare the hell out of any business and person in New York - step out of line, watch your back.

This is a banana republic and clearlly a two-tierd justice system.

---

Of course the answer is no. Would Clintons have been investigated for Whitewater? Hunter Biden for his business dealings? President Biden? All the Senators/House from both parties who have been investigated?

The answer to all of these is no. Politicians are targets and that has been happening since before Rome . . . .

---

Investigation by political bodies is politics. Investigation by States is not.

This event has effectively ended any chance of a dem rising from a Red State or a republican coming from a Blue State.


The precedent of this will be long lasting.

---

Fed investigated both Clintons and both Bidens.

sombear said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

sombear said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

Then ask yourself this . . . had Donald Trump not run for (and won) president, would the State of New York have investigated him? Would the DA have run a campaign on getting Donlad Trump?

The honest answer to those questions is No and it should scare the hell out of any business and person in New York - step out of line, watch your back.

This is a banana republic and clearlly a two-tierd justice system.

---

Of course the answer is no. Would Clintons have been investigated for Whitewater? Hunter Biden for his business dealings? President Biden? All the Senators/House from both parties who have been investigated?

The answer to all of these is no. Politicians are targets and that has been happening since before Rome . . . .

---

Investigation by political bodies is politics. Investigation by States is not.

This event has effectively ended any chance of a dem rising from a Red State or a republican coming from a Blue State.


The precedent of this will be long lasting.

---

Fed investigated both Clintons and both Bidens.

---

After evidence of a crime, right? They were not investigated just for being democrats.

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

From my perspective, with no victim I just don't see the foul. That being the case, I don't see any reason for a fine because I don't see any damage.

This would apply in my eyes from Trump to anyone else and really doesn't matter.

The real kicker is the lender is responsible for their own due diligence and agreed to lend the funds. They didn't have to.

Granted, no deep dive from me. Just looking at it from a layman's perspective.

Wangchung said:

---

sombear said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

sombear said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

Then ask yourself this . . . had Donald Trump not run for (and won) president, would the State of New York have investigated him? Would the DA have run a campaign on getting Donlad Trump?

The honest answer to those questions is No and it should scare the hell out of any business and person in New York - step out of line, watch your back.

This is a banana republic and clearlly a two-tierd justice system.

---

Of course the answer is no. Would Clintons have been investigated for Whitewater? Hunter Biden for his business dealings? President Biden? All the Senators/House from both parties who have been investigated?

The answer to all of these is no. Politicians are targets and that has been happening since before Rome . . . .

---

Investigation by political bodies is politics. Investigation by States is not.

This event has effectively ended any chance of a dem rising from a Red State or a republican coming from a Blue State.


The precedent of this will be long lasting.

---

Fed investigated both Clintons and both Bidens.

---

After evidence of a crime, right? They were not investigated just for being democrats.

---

There's ample evidence that Trump obstructed justice and unlawfully attempted to undo the election. Both warranted investigation. The real debate is whether they warranted indictments and ultimately conviction. The others are civil cases.

sombear said:

---

Wangchung said:

---

sombear said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

sombear said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

---

The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

---

The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

---

Then ask yourself this . . . had Donald Trump not run for (and won) president, would the State of New York have investigated him? Would the DA have run a campaign on getting Donlad Trump?

The honest answer to those questions is No and it should scare the hell out of any business and person in New York - step out of line, watch your back.

This is a banana republic and clearlly a two-tierd justice system.

---

Of course the answer is no. Would Clintons have been investigated for Whitewater? Hunter Biden for his business dealings? President Biden? All the Senators/House from both parties who have been investigated?

The answer to all of these is no. Politicians are targets and that has been happening since before Rome . . . .

---

Investigation by political bodies is politics. Investigation by States is not.

This event has effectively ended any chance of a dem rising from a Red State or a republican coming from a Blue State.


The precedent of this will be long lasting.

---

Fed investigated both Clintons and both Bidens.

---

After evidence of a crime, right? They were not investigated just for being democrats.

---

There's ample evidence that Trump obstructed justice and unlawfully attempted to undo the election. Both warranted investigation. The real debate is whether they warranted indictments and ultimately conviction. The others are civil cases.

---

That's always the deflection when pressed about the NY real estate fraud case...

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

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sombear said:

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Last week I spent some time on a long flight reviewing the decision and related documents in this case.

Qualifier: Of all the areas of business, finance, etc., I know less about CE than all others.

But I was struck by the discrepancies in Trump's valuations. For example, there were several instances where Trump sought and received legitimate 3rd-party appraisals, then shortly thereafter provided banks valuations that were double, triple, or more the appraisals - and failed to disclose the appraisals.

The case is not about Mar-a-Lago, which is a common talking point and is more complex that advertised given the building restrictions involved. It's about numerous examples of systematic eye-opening discrepancies.

Now, I have not talked to my colleagues or other CE/banking experts about their thoughts. But I'm guessing most folks on both sides have not actually reviewed the facts.

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The biggest fact is a fine of over 260 million dollars involving a case of ZERO damages .

Clearly a violation of the 8th amendment.

These kinds of of pseudo legal persecutions need to be stopped.

Regardless how one feels about Donald Trump.

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The amount of the fine will be reduced to a reasonable number. You are caught up on the fine, I am more interested in his guilt. Everyone keeps talking about everything around the fact that he did it and was found guilty. So far the only defenses have been:

1 - Everyone does it.
2 - Witch Hunt he shouldn't be charged, even if he did do it.
3 - Fine is too big. This has to stop

It will be the same with the classified documents. He has the documents. He didn't give them back. Watch we will hear:

1 - Witch Hunt, FBI was wrong
2 - Three years is not enough time
3 - Others haven't been prosecuted
4 - He was negotiating
5 - He mind-melded them all de-classified with a thought

Everything except the fact that he has them. Didn't turn them over when asked.

Guilt doesn't matter with Donald. Bannon has done his job well...

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Then ask yourself this . . . had Donald Trump not run for (and won) president, would the State of New York have investigated him? Would the DA have run a campaign on getting Donlad Trump?

The honest answer to those questions is No and it should scare the hell out of any business and person in New York - step out of line, watch your back.

This is a banana republic and clearlly a two-tierd justice system.

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Of course the answer is no. Would Clintons have been investigated for Whitewater? Hunter Biden for his business dealings? President Biden? All the Senators/House from both parties who have been investigated?

The answer to all of these is no. Politicians are targets and that has been happening since before Rome . . . .

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The persecution of ex president Trump is unprecedented.

And should give pause to all Americans.

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Agree, but he's done himself no favors, and some charges seem legitimate.

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The conduct of ex President Trump is unprecedented and that gives pause to me