I have given you the answer before. Maybe, maybe not.BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Don't play games. Clearly we were talking about the threat to kill someone in five years, not the "Death to America" chant. An accomplished lawyer should not have lost track so easily.Frank Galvin said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:That's what I'm asking you - do YOU, Frank Galvin, think that speech should be legal and protected?Frank Galvin said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:It isn't evil to want to restrain and punish speech that promotes or incites violence. Anyone who is honest knows that "Death to America" and "Death to Israel" is speech that has been acted on many times before, leading to the violent deaths of Americans and Israelis.Quote:
I have repeatedly said there should be arrests for actual crimes, whether that be unlawful assemnby, trespass, assault, etc. And that has happened. Its just that speech is not one of those crimes.
As far as the evil left, you might note that it all conservatives on this thread who want to restrain and punish speech.
I still want an answer to my previous question: do you believe that if someone says they will kill another person on a future date five years from now (so, not imminently) that it should be legal to say, and should be protected speech?
First, I said "imminent" is judged by juries on the facts of each case. Because there is no hard and fast rule, there could be circumstances under which the threat you described is criminal.
Second, to the extent the threat is not imminent I said it is legal and protected, not that it should be.
Do you believe that ANY threat to someone's life, regardless of the timeframe they put on it (imminence), should be illegal, and considered unprotected speech?
I don't think chanting Death to America by itself should be illegal. Just like burning the American flag should not be illegal.
I'll ask again: do you believe it should be perfectly legal to threaten to kill someone on a future date, and that it should be protected speech?
I agree. Hamas contends that Palestine should self-rule the territory. It does not contend that all Jews should die.Wangchung said:
The "From the river to the sea" chant is about wiping Israel off the map.
My recollection is that the countries surrounding Israel aren't too fond of them, either...Frank Galvin said:I agree. That is not the same as the people that live there. Hamas contends that Palestine should self-rule the territory. It does not cotned that all Jews should die.Wangchung said:
The "From the river to the sea" chant is about wiping Israel off the map.
Wangchung said:My recollection is that the countries surrounding Israel aren't too fond of them, either...Frank Galvin said:I agree. That is not the same as the people that live there. Hamas contends that Palestine should self-rule the territory. It does not cotned that all Jews should die.Wangchung said:
The "From the river to the sea" chant is about wiping Israel off the map.
Its irrelevant because it is not going to happen.Wangchung said:My recollection is that the countries surrounding Israel aren't too fond of them, either...Frank Galvin said:I agree. That is not the same as the people that live there. Hamas contends that Palestine should self-rule the territory. It does not cotned that all Jews should die.Wangchung said:
The "From the river to the sea" chant is about wiping Israel off the map.
But will they try again? Or just keep using Hamas to do their dirty work through terrorism and propaganda wars?Frank Galvin said:Its irrelevant because it is not going to happen.Wangchung said:My recollection is that the countries surrounding Israel aren't too fond of them, either...Frank Galvin said:I agree. That is not the same as the people that live there. Hamas contends that Palestine should self-rule the territory. It does not cotned that all Jews should die.Wangchung said:
The "From the river to the sea" chant is about wiping Israel off the map.
Watch this guide UT released "in celebration of Free Speech Week" 6 months ago.
— Ryan Chandler (@RyanChandlerTV) April 25, 2024
They explain the campus is open for the public to demonstrate - student or not - and the university can impose content-neutral time/place/manner limits.
The video is unlisted now, comments off pic.twitter.com/1ZpcyduTRF
My personal opinion is that Hamas chose now to start the war in part because it did not like the thawing of Israel's relatinonship witht he rest of the Arab world. It needed to provoke Israel to kill more Arabs.Wangchung said:But will they try again? Or just keep using Hamas to do their dirty work through terrorism and propaganda wars?Frank Galvin said:Its irrelevant because it is not going to happen.Wangchung said:My recollection is that the countries surrounding Israel aren't too fond of them, either...Frank Galvin said:I agree. That is not the same as the people that live there. Hamas contends that Palestine should self-rule the territory. It does not cotned that all Jews should die.Wangchung said:
The "From the river to the sea" chant is about wiping Israel off the map.
A reasonable assumption. IMHO we have funded/allowed Iran access to $16,000,000,000 between Obama and Biden(not the opinion part yet) and that money has funded everything from the newly well armed Houthis to the newly invigorated Palestinians(Opinion). Similar to how this administration told Putin that a minor incursion into Ukraine would see a limited US response but now we are funding Ukraine's full scale war.Frank Galvin said:My personal opinion is that Hamas chose now to start the war in part because it did not like the thawing of Israel's relatinonship witht he rest of the Arab world. It needed to provoke Israel to kill more Arabs.Wangchung said:But will they try again? Or just keep using Hamas to do their dirty work through terrorism and propaganda wars?Frank Galvin said:Its irrelevant because it is not going to happen.Wangchung said:My recollection is that the countries surrounding Israel aren't too fond of them, either...Frank Galvin said:I agree. That is not the same as the people that live there. Hamas contends that Palestine should self-rule the territory. It does not cotned that all Jews should die.Wangchung said:
The "From the river to the sea" chant is about wiping Israel off the map.
pull that tin foil hat up from your eyes, son.The_barBEARian said:Redbrickbear said:For years, conservative students, speakers, and activists nationwide have been enduring the brunt of leftist assaults!
— Lauren Chen (@TheLaurenChen) April 25, 2024
Where the hell was the GOP epiphany then? https://t.co/r2I75taPbs
Mike Johnson is positioning himself well as the Uniparty, Globalist, Zionist candidate in 2028
please explain how Merca is under ZOG? That is a new one on me. Do tell. However, you are not good at explaining yourself when called out. Specifically, I asked you numerous times to detail when you said "people like me are leading this country into the abyss", Please explain both amazing statements.The_barBEARian said:Redbrickbear said:Republicans continued to fund these universities during Black Lives Matter. They continued to fund them during the DEI revolution. They continued to fund them as academic "defund the police" theories became public policy.
— Nate Hochman (@njhochman) April 25, 2024
As @America_2100 says: This did not start six months ago. https://t.co/Yz9BIOlsj1
Do we really have to keep up this charade that America isn't under a Zionist Occupied Government, aka ZOG.
I wouldn't even mind it if they actually cared about anyone but themselves...
It goes a ways towards it, though. From the 1988 Hamas Covenant:Frank Galvin said:I agree. Hamas contends that Palestine should self-rule the territory. It does not contend that all Jews should die.Wangchung said:
The "From the river to the sea" chant is about wiping Israel off the map.
Quote:
"The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, (evidently a certain kind of tree) would not do that because it is one of the trees of the Jews." (related by al-Bukhari and Moslem)."
Assume it is a credible threat. We are isolating the concept of "imminence" here. If everything about the threat is real and credible, then what say you?Frank Galvin said:I have given you the answer before. Maybe, maybe not.BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Don't play games. Clearly we were talking about the threat to kill someone in five years, not the "Death to America" chant. An accomplished lawyer should not have lost track so easily.Frank Galvin said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:That's what I'm asking you - do YOU, Frank Galvin, think that speech should be legal and protected?Frank Galvin said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:It isn't evil to want to restrain and punish speech that promotes or incites violence. Anyone who is honest knows that "Death to America" and "Death to Israel" is speech that has been acted on many times before, leading to the violent deaths of Americans and Israelis.Quote:
I have repeatedly said there should be arrests for actual crimes, whether that be unlawful assemnby, trespass, assault, etc. And that has happened. Its just that speech is not one of those crimes.
As far as the evil left, you might note that it all conservatives on this thread who want to restrain and punish speech.
I still want an answer to my previous question: do you believe that if someone says they will kill another person on a future date five years from now (so, not imminently) that it should be legal to say, and should be protected speech?
First, I said "imminent" is judged by juries on the facts of each case. Because there is no hard and fast rule, there could be circumstances under which the threat you described is criminal.
Second, to the extent the threat is not imminent I said it is legal and protected, not that it should be.
Do you believe that ANY threat to someone's life, regardless of the timeframe they put on it (imminence), should be illegal, and considered unprotected speech?
I don't think chanting Death to America by itself should be illegal. Just like burning the American flag should not be illegal.
I'll ask again: do you believe it should be perfectly legal to threaten to kill someone on a future date, and that it should be protected speech?
It is a case by case basis because the issue is whether it is a credible threat.
If a twelve-year old says it? If a drunk says it? If it is an obvious joke?
Read it here https://t.co/rcUfAdOpzk pic.twitter.com/EIr8pM6osa
— Kat Rosenfield (@katrosenfield) April 26, 2024
In December he told the Higher Education Coordinating: "You have a leadership responsibility, to ensure that there is no one on your campuses that are advocating for genocide or antisemitism.”
— Jeremy Wallace (@JeremySWallace) April 25, 2024
I haven't seen anyone point to specific antisemitic actions that triggered Abbott yesterday, but he has in the past cited a popular chant at the rallies “from the river to the sea, Palestine will be free” in his executive order as an example of calling for the destruction of…
— Jeremy Wallace (@JeremySWallace) April 25, 2024
🚨#BREAKING: Snipers have been spotted on top of roofs at Ohio and Indiana universities as pro-Palestine protests causing a uproar ⁰⁰📌#Ohio | #Indiana
— R A W S A L E R T S (@rawsalerts) April 26, 2024
As dozens of protests break out across the United States at numerous universities, students and protesters have reported… pic.twitter.com/q8kAj9KkJP
NEW: In texts with lawmaker, UT President Jay Hartzell fully acknowledges calling DPS to campus because “our police force couldn’t do it alone.”
— Tony Plohetski (@tplohetski) April 25, 2024
“We asked for help, Senator.”
The exchange is between Sen. Sarah Eckhardt, Hartzell and UT System Chancellor J.B. Milliken. pic.twitter.com/HxZtWUFlFL
🚨#BREAKING: University Southern California has just announced that it will be canceling its main stage graduation ceremony that is traditionally attended by 65,000 people due amid ongoing campus unrest and safety concerns pic.twitter.com/fD5WoJyCGM
— R A W S A L E R T S (@rawsalerts) April 25, 2024
NEW: George Washington University Law School Dean Dayna Matthew announces their decision to move final exams to an undisclosed location due to the encampment next to the building: pic.twitter.com/2WkIrOT5fz
— Steve McGuire (@sfmcguire79) April 25, 2024
Hezbollah flags at Princeton University.
— Visegrád 24 (@visegrad24) April 25, 2024
Hezbollah is considered a terrorist organization by at least 26 countries, including the European Union and by most member states of the Arab League.
📸 @MylesJMcKnight pic.twitter.com/BZMQetYVcH
The organizers of this protest, Palestinian Solidarity Committee, reads a list of “campus demands,” including financial divestment from Israeli interests and resignation of UT President Jay Hartzell
— Ryan Chandler (@RyanChandlerTV) April 25, 2024
“Hartzell out” chant rings not far from his office in the tower pic.twitter.com/6tA6nb4rM3
Soaking up every last moment of the spring.#SicEm 🐻💚🫶 pic.twitter.com/WQWqMgWSXE
— Baylor University (@Baylor) April 25, 2024
At least our snowflakes are smart enough to not go all out Jihad. If UT doesn't squash this terrorist rhetoric, I hope they get bulldozed.boognish_bear said:
Meanwhile in Waco…Soaking up every last moment of the spring.#SicEm 🐻💚🫶 pic.twitter.com/WQWqMgWSXE
— Baylor University (@Baylor) April 25, 2024
Have to find a way to BLAME TRUMP!Frank Galvin said:My personal opinion is that Hamas chose now to start the war in part because it did not like the thawing of Israel's relatinonship witht he rest of the Arab world. It needed to provoke Israel to kill more Arabs.Wangchung said:But will they try again? Or just keep using Hamas to do their dirty work through terrorism and propaganda wars?Frank Galvin said:Its irrelevant because it is not going to happen.Wangchung said:My recollection is that the countries surrounding Israel aren't too fond of them, either...Frank Galvin said:I agree. That is not the same as the people that live there. Hamas contends that Palestine should self-rule the territory. It does not cotned that all Jews should die.Wangchung said:
The "From the river to the sea" chant is about wiping Israel off the map.
BearN said:This is absurd. BLM riots were nothing like what we are seeing now.The_barBEARian said:BearN said:
Whites make up over 70% of the population in this country, and have never been seriously threatened with bodily harm en masse in this country. Christians (not talking about inter-denomination fights early in our history) have not been seriously threatened with bodily harm en masse in this country.
Jews are a minority. They make up less than 3% of our population, and are being threatened with bodily harm all over this country. Hundreds of thousands of protestors in this country are calling for mass extinction of the Jews.
This is something quite different.
Totally false.
BLM riots were much worse and they were not pro-black, they were anti-white riots.
Normal white people were assaulted and even a few were killed. Haven't seen these anti-zionist riots get anywhere close to the "summer of love"
Fair ... just the ones in Israel.Frank Galvin said:I agree. Hamas contends that Palestine should self-rule the territory. It does not contend that all Jews should die.Wangchung said:
The "From the river to the sea" chant is about wiping Israel off the map.
boognish_bear said:
Meanwhile in Waco…Soaking up every last moment of the spring.#SicEm 🐻💚🫶 pic.twitter.com/WQWqMgWSXE
— Baylor University (@Baylor) April 25, 2024
Redbrickbear said:boognish_bear said:
Meanwhile in Waco…Soaking up every last moment of the spring.#SicEm 🐻💚🫶 pic.twitter.com/WQWqMgWSXE
— Baylor University (@Baylor) April 25, 2024
Don't get to comfortable with the normality triumphalism
There are people in our administration and our faculty who would love to make Baylor like ut-Austin.
And over the past 8 years they have made some serious inroads
NEW: UT Austin released "protest rules" that say "individuals may not come to campus without authorization," which is in direct contradiction to a video they published 6 months ago that says members of the public can "come to campus at any time and engage in demonstrations." pic.twitter.com/7ppXAknHzQ
— steven monacelli (@stevanzetti) April 25, 2024
Harrison Bergeron said:Have to find a way to BLAME TRUMP!Frank Galvin said:My personal opinion is that Hamas chose now to start the war in part because it did not like the thawing of Israel's relatinonship witht he rest of the Arab world. It needed to provoke Israel to kill more Arabs.Wangchung said:But will they try again? Or just keep using Hamas to do their dirty work through terrorism and propaganda wars?Frank Galvin said:Its irrelevant because it is not going to happen.Wangchung said:My recollection is that the countries surrounding Israel aren't too fond of them, either...Frank Galvin said:I agree. That is not the same as the people that live there. Hamas contends that Palestine should self-rule the territory. It does not cotned that all Jews should die.Wangchung said:
The "From the river to the sea" chant is about wiping Israel off the map.
Just for you and to help keep this thread from getting derailed because that's rude to everyone else who wants to stay on topic:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:He is saying I'm right only because I "say so". So I'm reminding him of a past debate where I asked him: "if a hypothetical scenario contains "x", then is it absolute truth that the hypothetical scenario contains 'x'?"D. C. Bear said:BusyTarpDuster2017 said:It's a ONE WORD answer. So it required even less words than what you just posted right here. Nice try.90sBear said:Oh well. I offered.BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Likely excuse. In lesser words than what you just posted, you could have easily answered it. I don't need to create a whole other thread for it, the question is right before you now. You balked. I've proven my point.90sBear said:I won't because I'm not going to derail this thread. However, if you would like I will create another thread later where I will respond to that question.BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Right, that's why you couldn't answer the question there, just as you are completely unable to answer them here. If you disagree, then prove me wrong - answer it: if a certain hypothetical scenario contains "x", then is it absolute truth that the hypothetical scenario contains "x"?90sBear said:Yeah you quoted logic in that thread about as well as you quoted law in this one. But I remember you won! (Because you said so).BusyTarpDuster2017 said:Yes, yes, I'm SO wrong, that you are completely unable to argue why.90sBear said:Yes, yes, you are right (because you say so). Even though you don't cite any laws and say other people are lying when they do.BusyTarpDuster2017 said:I've asked you repeatedly - did I have sufficient cause for it, or no?90sBear said:
Go back to accusing people of lying since you don't want to talk about thread topic anymore.
The fact that you won't answer says it all, and that your argument against me has failed. Go away.
Toodles.
"Toodles" is exactly what you said when you argued with me for 2 pages about absolute vs. relative truth and later realized you had been proven wrong.
You won't, and we all will know why.
What exactly was the question?
The only correct answer is "yes". The above is a tautology. Logically, tautologies are always true no matter what, therefore they are absolute truths. His answer, however, was that it is a relative truth. I'm demonstrating how he was clearly wrong, and I was clearly right, and it was based on logic and reason, NOT simply "because I said so".
The_barBEARian said:Redbrickbear said:boognish_bear said:
Meanwhile in Waco…Soaking up every last moment of the spring.#SicEm 🐻💚🫶 pic.twitter.com/WQWqMgWSXE
— Baylor University (@Baylor) April 25, 2024
Don't get to comfortable with the normality triumphalism
There are people in our administration and our faculty who would love to make Baylor like ut-Austin.
And over the past 8 years they have made some serious inroads
Is Malcom Foley still being paid by Baylor to spread anti-whiteism?
I was being slightly tongue in cheek ... realize completely lost online.Frank Galvin said:Harrison Bergeron said:Have to find a way to BLAME TRUMP!Frank Galvin said:My personal opinion is that Hamas chose now to start the war in part because it did not like the thawing of Israel's relatinonship witht he rest of the Arab world. It needed to provoke Israel to kill more Arabs.Wangchung said:But will they try again? Or just keep using Hamas to do their dirty work through terrorism and propaganda wars?Frank Galvin said:Its irrelevant because it is not going to happen.Wangchung said:My recollection is that the countries surrounding Israel aren't too fond of them, either...Frank Galvin said:I agree. That is not the same as the people that live there. Hamas contends that Palestine should self-rule the territory. It does not cotned that all Jews should die.Wangchung said:
The "From the river to the sea" chant is about wiping Israel off the map.
Huh?
Why would that be Trump's fault? I give him props for his Mideast work while being uncomfortable with his celebrating the Saudi's given their brutality on human rights issues.
