FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

the tie breaker? Enact your program. Make your opponent spend his own political capital to undo it. So pass your own health care fix without a single Dem vote if necessary. Pass voter ID laws. Make election day be election day. Outlaw spending of student loan proceeds on anything other than STEM courses (to gut all the marxist "studies" programs. REQUIRE universities to enforce viewpoint diversity in all aspect of operations. Make it illegal for local law enforcement to interfere with federal law enforcement efforts. REQUIRE the census to inquire about citizenship status. Make it illegal to use illegal immigrant totals in apportionment. ( could go on for quite a while with this list).

Enact a revolutionary agenda and make the Democrats spend the next decade trying to undo it. Make them spend all their time undoing your agenda, rather than enacting their own. That's what they do. They did it with Obamacare. And look at how it has hamstrung us for over a decade. it's a massive failure, and yet the table is set in such a way that we bear the obligation to fix it rather than trash it.

(Bushies go apoplectic in 3...2....1....)

This particular line of thinking is where moderates are so out of touch with reality that they are arguably the worst part of the problem. They'll let Dems do anything, and then prevent conservatives from doing anything.

---

Yeah, they added 2 states and packed the SC last time? Need to stop operating drom a position of fear. Just govern and take the normal person into consideration, not just big business and the wealthy.

---

They walked right up to the threshold, then BIden publicly announced he would not sign the bill.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/supreme-court/democrats-introduce-bill-expand-supreme-court-9-13-justices-n1264132

He even formed a commission to study "reforms."
https://verdict.justia.com/2024/07/30/joe-bidens-court-reform-journey-still-stops-short-of-court-packing

The idea that Democrats would never do it is beyond unserious.

---

So, let's discuss. Ok, the Filibuster is gone. Are we doing away with elections so we don't have to worry about the Dems anymore? Changing the voting so the GOP will always win? How are you going to ensure when the Dems get in power they just undo everything and do their thing?

It is a no win. Neither side should do away with the Filibuster. It is there for a reason. Your whole post leaves out one little fact, they DIDN'T. Biden didn't sign it. The Commission didn't recommend it. They didn't pack the Supreme Court. All those things didn't happen. But, that warrants the GOP to blow it up?

Actually, one could make the arguement that McConnell and Trump packed the Supreme Court more than the Dems did.

---

Past results are not indicative of future results.

Why is that phrase a required disclosure?

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

the tie breaker? Enact your program. Make your opponent spend his own political capital to undo it. So pass your own health care fix without a single Dem vote if necessary. Pass voter ID laws. Make election day be election day. Outlaw spending of student loan proceeds on anything other than STEM courses (to gut all the marxist "studies" programs. REQUIRE universities to enforce viewpoint diversity in all aspect of operations. Make it illegal for local law enforcement to interfere with federal law enforcement efforts. REQUIRE the census to inquire about citizenship status. Make it illegal to use illegal immigrant totals in apportionment. ( could go on for quite a while with this list).

Enact a revolutionary agenda and make the Democrats spend the next decade trying to undo it. Make them spend all their time undoing your agenda, rather than enacting their own. That's what they do. They did it with Obamacare. And look at how it has hamstrung us for over a decade. it's a massive failure, and yet the table is set in such a way that we bear the obligation to fix it rather than trash it.

(Bushies go apoplectic in 3...2....1....)

This particular line of thinking is where moderates are so out of touch with reality that they are arguably the worst part of the problem. They'll let Dems do anything, and then prevent conservatives from doing anything.

---

Yeah, they added 2 states and packed the SC last time? Need to stop operating drom a position of fear. Just govern and take the normal person into consideration, not just big business and the wealthy.

---

They walked right up to the threshold, then BIden publicly announced he would not sign the bill.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/supreme-court/democrats-introduce-bill-expand-supreme-court-9-13-justices-n1264132

He even formed a commission to study "reforms."
https://verdict.justia.com/2024/07/30/joe-bidens-court-reform-journey-still-stops-short-of-court-packing

The idea that Democrats would never do it is beyond unserious.

---

So, let's discuss. Ok, the Filibuster is gone. Are we doing away with elections so we don't have to worry about the Dems anymore? Changing the voting so the GOP will always win? How are you going to ensure when the Dems get in power they just undo everything and do their thing?

It is a no win. Neither side should do away with the Filibuster. It is there for a reason. Your whole post leaves out one little fact, they DIDN'T. Biden didn't sign it. The Commission didn't recommend it. They didn't pack the Supreme Court. All those things didn't happen. But, that warrants the GOP to blow it up?

Actually, one could make the arguement that McConnell and Trump packed the Supreme Court more than the Dems did.

---

Past results are not indicative of future results.

Why is that phrase a required disclosure?

---

It works both ways. It is not a given they will try again either, right?

Fear of someone else doing something is not a reason to make a bad decision.

FLBear5630 said:

---

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

the tie breaker? Enact your program. Make your opponent spend his own political capital to undo it. So pass your own health care fix without a single Dem vote if necessary. Pass voter ID laws. Make election day be election day. Outlaw spending of student loan proceeds on anything other than STEM courses (to gut all the marxist "studies" programs. REQUIRE universities to enforce viewpoint diversity in all aspect of operations. Make it illegal for local law enforcement to interfere with federal law enforcement efforts. REQUIRE the census to inquire about citizenship status. Make it illegal to use illegal immigrant totals in apportionment. ( could go on for quite a while with this list).

Enact a revolutionary agenda and make the Democrats spend the next decade trying to undo it. Make them spend all their time undoing your agenda, rather than enacting their own. That's what they do. They did it with Obamacare. And look at how it has hamstrung us for over a decade. it's a massive failure, and yet the table is set in such a way that we bear the obligation to fix it rather than trash it.

(Bushies go apoplectic in 3...2....1....)

This particular line of thinking is where moderates are so out of touch with reality that they are arguably the worst part of the problem. They'll let Dems do anything, and then prevent conservatives from doing anything.

---

Yeah, they added 2 states and packed the SC last time? Need to stop operating drom a position of fear. Just govern and take the normal person into consideration, not just big business and the wealthy.

---

They walked right up to the threshold, then BIden publicly announced he would not sign the bill.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/supreme-court/democrats-introduce-bill-expand-supreme-court-9-13-justices-n1264132

He even formed a commission to study "reforms."
https://verdict.justia.com/2024/07/30/joe-bidens-court-reform-journey-still-stops-short-of-court-packing

The idea that Democrats would never do it is beyond unserious.

---

So, let's discuss. Ok, the Filibuster is gone. Are we doing away with elections so we don't have to worry about the Dems anymore? Changing the voting so the GOP will always win? How are you going to ensure when the Dems get in power they just undo everything and do their thing?

It is a no win. Neither side should do away with the Filibuster. It is there for a reason. Your whole post leaves out one little fact, they DIDN'T. Biden didn't sign it. The Commission didn't recommend it. They didn't pack the Supreme Court. All those things didn't happen. But, that warrants the GOP to blow it up?

Actually, one could make the arguement that McConnell and Trump packed the Supreme Court more than the Dems did.

---

Past results are not indicative of future results.

Why is that phrase a required disclosure?

---

It works both ways. It is not a given they will try again either, right?

Fear of someone else doing something is not a reason to make a bad decision.

---

Nonsense much like your Free Trade opinions.
Note: free trade doesn't exist unless all parties abide by the rules

The USA no longer exists in an Era of Civil Disagreements between Civil People. It is a blood war. The only takeaway is to throw the first 100 punches and never stop swinging.

Disagree? Sanders, AOC, Crockett, Waters, etc can simply flex and the D establishment cowers.

The Ds are facing an Existential Crisis…..between the Rs getting serious about responding to D gerrymandering, the upcoming death of VRA mandated racial gerrymandering of the South, the brutal reality of population shift as it will play out in the 2030 census, Rs litigating census sampling methodology, and Rs litigating census counting illegals for reapportionment purposes……Ds are on the ropes like never before. One item alone (a new R Solid South) is terrifying to them. They remember holding the HOR for fifty years (1944-1994) due to a D Solid South. The shoe being on the other foot terrifies them. Not guessing. They are quite open about the problems they face and the need for a new SCOTUS to save them.

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

the tie breaker? Enact your program. Make your opponent spend his own political capital to undo it. So pass your own health care fix without a single Dem vote if necessary. Pass voter ID laws. Make election day be election day. Outlaw spending of student loan proceeds on anything other than STEM courses (to gut all the marxist "studies" programs. REQUIRE universities to enforce viewpoint diversity in all aspect of operations. Make it illegal for local law enforcement to interfere with federal law enforcement efforts. REQUIRE the census to inquire about citizenship status. Make it illegal to use illegal immigrant totals in apportionment. ( could go on for quite a while with this list).

Enact a revolutionary agenda and make the Democrats spend the next decade trying to undo it. Make them spend all their time undoing your agenda, rather than enacting their own. That's what they do. They did it with Obamacare. And look at how it has hamstrung us for over a decade. it's a massive failure, and yet the table is set in such a way that we bear the obligation to fix it rather than trash it.

(Bushies go apoplectic in 3...2....1....)

This particular line of thinking is where moderates are so out of touch with reality that they are arguably the worst part of the problem. They'll let Dems do anything, and then prevent conservatives from doing anything.

---

Yeah, they added 2 states and packed the SC last time? Need to stop operating drom a position of fear. Just govern and take the normal person into consideration, not just big business and the wealthy.

---

They walked right up to the threshold, then BIden publicly announced he would not sign the bill.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/supreme-court/democrats-introduce-bill-expand-supreme-court-9-13-justices-n1264132

He even formed a commission to study "reforms."
https://verdict.justia.com/2024/07/30/joe-bidens-court-reform-journey-still-stops-short-of-court-packing

The idea that Democrats would never do it is beyond unserious.

---

So, let's discuss. Ok, the Filibuster is gone. Are we doing away with elections so we don't have to worry about the Dems anymore? Changing the voting so the GOP will always win? How are you going to ensure when the Dems get in power they just undo everything and do their thing?

It is a no win. Neither side should do away with the Filibuster. It is there for a reason. Your whole post leaves out one little fact, they DIDN'T. Biden didn't sign it. The Commission didn't recommend it. They didn't pack the Supreme Court. All those things didn't happen. But, that warrants the GOP to blow it up?

Actually, one could make the arguement that McConnell and Trump packed the Supreme Court more than the Dems did.

---

Past results are not indicative of future results.

Why is that phrase a required disclosure?

---

It works both ways. It is not a given they will try again either, right?

Fear of someone else doing something is not a reason to make a bad decision.

---

Nonsense much like your Free Trade opinions.
Note: free trade doesn't exist unless all parties abide by the rules

The USA no longer exists in an Era of Civil Disagreements between Civil People. It is a blood war. The only takeaway is to throw the first 100 punches and never stop swinging.

Disagree? Sanders, AOC, Crockett, Waters, etc can simply flex and the D establishment cowers.

The Ds are facing an Existential Crisis…..between the Rs getting serious about responding to D gerrymandering, the upcoming death of VRA mandated racial gerrymandering of the South, the brutal reality of population shift as it will play out in the 2030 census, Rs litigating census sampling methodology, and Rs litigating census counting illegals for reapportionment purposes……Ds are on the ropes like never before. One item alone (a new R Solid South) is terrifying to them. They remember holding the HOR for fifty years (1944-1994) due to a D Solid South. The shoe being on the other foot terrifies them. Not guessing. They are quite open about the problems they face and the need for a new SCOTUS to save them.

---

So, you get your way. Filibuster gone. Now what? Next time the Dems get the House, they undo it all and pass their agenda. Which may happen in 1 year. What is the big plan? How do you prevent it be used against you?

Doc Holliday said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

The new fight for progressives is not whether it is not the right but rather the top, the oligarchy, Big Corporations. That is our fight. The working, small business, and middle class are tired of all the money flowing to the top in a system rigged by big money in politics to send it to the top. Look at the group at the WH today - oligarchs making policy over which we, the people, have no control that hurts wages, education, and healthcare.

---

Corporate oligarchs have made their largest gains using big government to destroy their competition.

---

No argument from me. You are right

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

The new fight for progressives is not whether it is not the right but rather the top, the oligarchy, Big Corporations. That is our fight. The working, small business, and middle class are tired of all the money flowing to the top in a system rigged by big money in politics to send it to the top. Look at the group at the WH today - oligarchs making policy over which we, the people, have no control that hurts wages, education, and healthcare.

---

The Far Left only fights for one thing. Control. The creation of a caste system with their members permanently on top.

USSR, PRC, Lefty America…..the formula never changes.

---

What does Right want? Say it with me Control

FLBear5630 said:

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Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

the tie breaker? Enact your program. Make your opponent spend his own political capital to undo it. So pass your own health care fix without a single Dem vote if necessary. Pass voter ID laws. Make election day be election day. Outlaw spending of student loan proceeds on anything other than STEM courses (to gut all the marxist "studies" programs. REQUIRE universities to enforce viewpoint diversity in all aspect of operations. Make it illegal for local law enforcement to interfere with federal law enforcement efforts. REQUIRE the census to inquire about citizenship status. Make it illegal to use illegal immigrant totals in apportionment. ( could go on for quite a while with this list).

Enact a revolutionary agenda and make the Democrats spend the next decade trying to undo it. Make them spend all their time undoing your agenda, rather than enacting their own. That's what they do. They did it with Obamacare. And look at how it has hamstrung us for over a decade. it's a massive failure, and yet the table is set in such a way that we bear the obligation to fix it rather than trash it.

(Bushies go apoplectic in 3...2....1....)

This particular line of thinking is where moderates are so out of touch with reality that they are arguably the worst part of the problem. They'll let Dems do anything, and then prevent conservatives from doing anything.

---

Yeah, they added 2 states and packed the SC last time? Need to stop operating drom a position of fear. Just govern and take the normal person into consideration, not just big business and the wealthy.

---

They walked right up to the threshold, then BIden publicly announced he would not sign the bill.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/supreme-court/democrats-introduce-bill-expand-supreme-court-9-13-justices-n1264132

He even formed a commission to study "reforms."
https://verdict.justia.com/2024/07/30/joe-bidens-court-reform-journey-still-stops-short-of-court-packing

The idea that Democrats would never do it is beyond unserious.

---

So, let's discuss. Ok, the Filibuster is gone. Are we doing away with elections so we don't have to worry about the Dems anymore? Changing the voting so the GOP will always win? How are you going to ensure when the Dems get in power they just undo everything and do their thing?

It is a no win. Neither side should do away with the Filibuster. It is there for a reason. Your whole post leaves out one little fact, they DIDN'T. Biden didn't sign it. The Commission didn't recommend it. They didn't pack the Supreme Court. All those things didn't happen. But, that warrants the GOP to blow it up?

Actually, one could make the arguement that McConnell and Trump packed the Supreme Court more than the Dems did.

---

Past results are not indicative of future results.

Why is that phrase a required disclosure?

---

It works both ways. It is not a given they will try again either, right?

Fear of someone else doing something is not a reason to make a bad decision.

---

Nonsense much like your Free Trade opinions.
Note: free trade doesn't exist unless all parties abide by the rules

The USA no longer exists in an Era of Civil Disagreements between Civil People. It is a blood war. The only takeaway is to throw the first 100 punches and never stop swinging.

Disagree? Sanders, AOC, Crockett, Waters, etc can simply flex and the D establishment cowers.

The Ds are facing an Existential Crisis…..between the Rs getting serious about responding to D gerrymandering, the upcoming death of VRA mandated racial gerrymandering of the South, the brutal reality of population shift as it will play out in the 2030 census, Rs litigating census sampling methodology, and Rs litigating census counting illegals for reapportionment purposes……Ds are on the ropes like never before. One item alone (a new R Solid South) is terrifying to them. They remember holding the HOR for fifty years (1944-1994) due to a D Solid South. The shoe being on the other foot terrifies them. Not guessing. They are quite open about the problems they face and the need for a new SCOTUS to save them.

---

So, you get your way. Filibuster gone. Now what? Next time the Dems get the House, they undo it all and pass their agenda. Which may happen in 1 year. What is the big plan? How do you prevent it be used against you?

---

If you think that the Filibuster relates to the HOR, wow…….no discussion will help.
it is a Senate procedural rule,

and if you think the Ds are taking the Senate without basically overwhelming every layer of government, yikes.
Rs only have one senate seat in a Blue state (Ds zero in a red state). Ds already control 10 of 14 senate seats in purple states. To get Senate control they have to win the presidency, flip Maine, and then win two of four from NC, NC, WI and PA (some not on ballot for years) while not losing ANY of their purple state senate seats.

Explain how they accomplish those tasks.

Waco1947 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

The new fight for progressives is not whether it is not the right but rather the top, the oligarchy, Big Corporations. That is our fight. The working, small business, and middle class are tired of all the money flowing to the top in a system rigged by big money in politics to send it to the top. Look at the group at the WH today - oligarchs making policy over which we, the people, have no control that hurts wages, education, and healthcare.

---

Corporate oligarchs have made their largest gains using big government to destroy their competition.

---

No argument from me. You are right

---

Yeah but democrats promising to use big government to end crony capitalism have and will continue to pull the rug out from under everyone and work in favor of the corporations and against the people.

This is what they did with the ACA. They will lie and pretend its good when its actually racketeering.

Waco1947 said:

---

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

The new fight for progressives is not whether it is not the right but rather the top, the oligarchy, Big Corporations. That is our fight. The working, small business, and middle class are tired of all the money flowing to the top in a system rigged by big money in politics to send it to the top. Look at the group at the WH today - oligarchs making policy over which we, the people, have no control that hurts wages, education, and healthcare.

---

The Far Left only fights for one thing. Control. The creation of a caste system with their members permanently on top.

USSR, PRC, Lefty America…..the formula never changes.

---

What does Right want? Say it with me Control

---

LMFAO……

Right……free market health care.
Left…….government controlled health care

Right……states rights except fed issues
Left……fed controlled healthy unless it is illegal immigration

Right……1st and 2nd Amendments
Left………Hate speech, Cancel culture, etc.

care to try another lie?

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

the tie breaker? Enact your program. Make your opponent spend his own political capital to undo it. So pass your own health care fix without a single Dem vote if necessary. Pass voter ID laws. Make election day be election day. Outlaw spending of student loan proceeds on anything other than STEM courses (to gut all the marxist "studies" programs. REQUIRE universities to enforce viewpoint diversity in all aspect of operations. Make it illegal for local law enforcement to interfere with federal law enforcement efforts. REQUIRE the census to inquire about citizenship status. Make it illegal to use illegal immigrant totals in apportionment. ( could go on for quite a while with this list).

Enact a revolutionary agenda and make the Democrats spend the next decade trying to undo it. Make them spend all their time undoing your agenda, rather than enacting their own. That's what they do. They did it with Obamacare. And look at how it has hamstrung us for over a decade. it's a massive failure, and yet the table is set in such a way that we bear the obligation to fix it rather than trash it.

(Bushies go apoplectic in 3...2....1....)

This particular line of thinking is where moderates are so out of touch with reality that they are arguably the worst part of the problem. They'll let Dems do anything, and then prevent conservatives from doing anything.

---

Yeah, they added 2 states and packed the SC last time? Need to stop operating drom a position of fear. Just govern and take the normal person into consideration, not just big business and the wealthy.

---

They walked right up to the threshold, then BIden publicly announced he would not sign the bill.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/supreme-court/democrats-introduce-bill-expand-supreme-court-9-13-justices-n1264132

He even formed a commission to study "reforms."
https://verdict.justia.com/2024/07/30/joe-bidens-court-reform-journey-still-stops-short-of-court-packing

The idea that Democrats would never do it is beyond unserious.

---

So, let's discuss. Ok, the Filibuster is gone. Are we doing away with elections so we don't have to worry about the Dems anymore? Changing the voting so the GOP will always win? How are you going to ensure when the Dems get in power they just undo everything and do their thing?

It is a no win. Neither side should do away with the Filibuster. It is there for a reason. Your whole post leaves out one little fact, they DIDN'T. Biden didn't sign it. The Commission didn't recommend it. They didn't pack the Supreme Court. All those things didn't happen. But, that warrants the GOP to blow it up?

Actually, one could make the arguement that McConnell and Trump packed the Supreme Court more than the Dems did.

---

Past results are not indicative of future results.

Why is that phrase a required disclosure?

---

It works both ways. It is not a given they will try again either, right?

Fear of someone else doing something is not a reason to make a bad decision.

---

Nonsense much like your Free Trade opinions.
Note: free trade doesn't exist unless all parties abide by the rules

The USA no longer exists in an Era of Civil Disagreements between Civil People. It is a blood war. The only takeaway is to throw the first 100 punches and never stop swinging.

Disagree? Sanders, AOC, Crockett, Waters, etc can simply flex and the D establishment cowers.

The Ds are facing an Existential Crisis…..between the Rs getting serious about responding to D gerrymandering, the upcoming death of VRA mandated racial gerrymandering of the South, the brutal reality of population shift as it will play out in the 2030 census, Rs litigating census sampling methodology, and Rs litigating census counting illegals for reapportionment purposes……Ds are on the ropes like never before. One item alone (a new R Solid South) is terrifying to them. They remember holding the HOR for fifty years (1944-1994) due to a D Solid South. The shoe being on the other foot terrifies them. Not guessing. They are quite open about the problems they face and the need for a new SCOTUS to save them.

---

So, you get your way. Filibuster gone. Now what? Next time the Dems get the House, they undo it all and pass their agenda. Which may happen in 1 year. What is the big plan? How do you prevent it be used against you?

---

If you think that the Filibuster relates to the HOR, wow…….no discussion will help.
it is a Senate procedural rule,

and if you think the Ds are taking the Senate without basically overwhelming every layer of government, yikes.
Rs only have one senate seat in a Blue state (Ds zero in a red state). Ds already control 10 of 14 senate seats in purple states. To get Senate control they have to win the presidency, flip Maine, and then win two of four from NC, NC, WI and PA (some not on ballot for years) while not losing ANY of their purple state senate seats.

Explain how they accomplish those tasks.

---

Yeah, focus on that. You know it was a typo.

Who held the Senate from 2021 to 25? If you think that the Dems have not held the Senate recently, wow…….no discussion will help.

Dems are sustaining and escalating the rhetoric about packing the courts, about statehood for DC and PR, about nuking the filibuster, etc.... That's how you move the Overton Window.....you message and message and you fire up your base some more and they get excited and...pretty soon, it looks inevitable. It looks, well, normal. They did it with Obamacare. They did it with climate change policy, with the EV mandates, with.....and on and on.

Mind numbingly dense to suggest that, in spite of all we know about how they act and how they are talking that they are not serious about doing any of those things they're threatening to do. This Democrat Party turned J6 into an insurrection, and went hog-assed wild about investigating Republicans & conservatives. They arrested and prosecuted a former POTUS who had broken no laws. Democrats are the proximate threat to liberty. THEY blew this up. Not us. Our job is to fix it, come hell or high water.

AP is echoing what I've been telling you for a long, long time. Social contract as we know it is dead. Dems and Republicans do not agree on anything, not even something as ostensibly obvious as the definition of what is a boy and what is a girl. There is no middle ground anymore. There is only the question of who wins and who loses. Dems just forced a government shut down that will hit GDP by 1.5% THIS QUARTER. They did it so that when the disappointing Q4 numbers come out early next year, they will cite the softness as evidence that everything Trump has done is destroying the country. In reality, Dems are willing to destroy the country in order to stop the agenda the American people voted for in 2024.

Democrats understand clearly where they are - in an existential fight for what they believe in. Trump admin gets it, too. The moderate GOP not so much. They're Chip Diller reincarnated, thinking they can stop the melee that will flatten them first.

FLBear5630 said:

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Adriacus Peratuun said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Adriacus Peratuun said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Adriacus Peratuun said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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whiterock said:

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Osodecentx said:

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whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

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Aliceinbubbleland said:

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I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

the tie breaker? Enact your program. Make your opponent spend his own political capital to undo it. So pass your own health care fix without a single Dem vote if necessary. Pass voter ID laws. Make election day be election day. Outlaw spending of student loan proceeds on anything other than STEM courses (to gut all the marxist "studies" programs. REQUIRE universities to enforce viewpoint diversity in all aspect of operations. Make it illegal for local law enforcement to interfere with federal law enforcement efforts. REQUIRE the census to inquire about citizenship status. Make it illegal to use illegal immigrant totals in apportionment. ( could go on for quite a while with this list).

Enact a revolutionary agenda and make the Democrats spend the next decade trying to undo it. Make them spend all their time undoing your agenda, rather than enacting their own. That's what they do. They did it with Obamacare. And look at how it has hamstrung us for over a decade. it's a massive failure, and yet the table is set in such a way that we bear the obligation to fix it rather than trash it.

(Bushies go apoplectic in 3...2....1....)

This particular line of thinking is where moderates are so out of touch with reality that they are arguably the worst part of the problem. They'll let Dems do anything, and then prevent conservatives from doing anything.

---

Yeah, they added 2 states and packed the SC last time? Need to stop operating drom a position of fear. Just govern and take the normal person into consideration, not just big business and the wealthy.

---

They walked right up to the threshold, then BIden publicly announced he would not sign the bill.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/supreme-court/democrats-introduce-bill-expand-supreme-court-9-13-justices-n1264132

He even formed a commission to study "reforms."
https://verdict.justia.com/2024/07/30/joe-bidens-court-reform-journey-still-stops-short-of-court-packing

The idea that Democrats would never do it is beyond unserious.

---

So, let's discuss. Ok, the Filibuster is gone. Are we doing away with elections so we don't have to worry about the Dems anymore? Changing the voting so the GOP will always win? How are you going to ensure when the Dems get in power they just undo everything and do their thing?

It is a no win. Neither side should do away with the Filibuster. It is there for a reason. Your whole post leaves out one little fact, they DIDN'T. Biden didn't sign it. The Commission didn't recommend it. They didn't pack the Supreme Court. All those things didn't happen. But, that warrants the GOP to blow it up?

Actually, one could make the arguement that McConnell and Trump packed the Supreme Court more than the Dems did.

---

Past results are not indicative of future results.

Why is that phrase a required disclosure?

---

It works both ways. It is not a given they will try again either, right?

Fear of someone else doing something is not a reason to make a bad decision.

---

Nonsense much like your Free Trade opinions.
Note: free trade doesn't exist unless all parties abide by the rules

The USA no longer exists in an Era of Civil Disagreements between Civil People. It is a blood war. The only takeaway is to throw the first 100 punches and never stop swinging.

Disagree? Sanders, AOC, Crockett, Waters, etc can simply flex and the D establishment cowers.

The Ds are facing an Existential Crisis…..between the Rs getting serious about responding to D gerrymandering, the upcoming death of VRA mandated racial gerrymandering of the South, the brutal reality of population shift as it will play out in the 2030 census, Rs litigating census sampling methodology, and Rs litigating census counting illegals for reapportionment purposes……Ds are on the ropes like never before. One item alone (a new R Solid South) is terrifying to them. They remember holding the HOR for fifty years (1944-1994) due to a D Solid South. The shoe being on the other foot terrifies them. Not guessing. They are quite open about the problems they face and the need for a new SCOTUS to save them.

---

So, you get your way. Filibuster gone. Now what? Next time the Dems get the House, they undo it all and pass their agenda. Which may happen in 1 year. What is the big plan? How do you prevent it be used against you?

---

If you think that the Filibuster relates to the HOR, wow…….no discussion will help.
it is a Senate procedural rule,

and if you think the Ds are taking the Senate without basically overwhelming every layer of government, yikes.
Rs only have one senate seat in a Blue state (Ds zero in a red state). Ds already control 10 of 14 senate seats in purple states. To get Senate control they have to win the presidency, flip Maine, and then win two of four from NC, NC, WI and PA (some not on ballot for years) while not losing ANY of their purple state senate seats.

Explain how they accomplish those tasks.

---

Yeah, focus on that. You know it was a typo.

Who held the Senate from 2021 to 25? If you think that the Dems have not held the Senate recently, wow…….no discussion will help.

---

Senate typed "Henate" is a typo. Senate typed HOR is a mistake of understanding. We see you.

Ds lost Senate seats in Ohio & Montana with incumbents running and West Virginia.
Exactly how do they recover those seats? Answer: only in a landslide where the change is so massive that items like the filibuster no longer matter.

The filibuster was once useful to build consensus. Those days are gone. It now only serves as an impediment to ruling. When it is used to stop an innocuous one month funding bill, people should know it's life span has exceeded its usefulness.

You pine for the old days…..they are gone and not returning.

FLBear5630 said:

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TinFoilHatPreacherBear said:

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whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

the tie breaker? Enact your program. Make your opponent spend his own political capital to undo it. So pass your own health care fix without a single Dem vote if necessary. Pass voter ID laws. Make election day be election day. Outlaw spending of student loan proceeds on anything other than STEM courses (to gut all the marxist "studies" programs. REQUIRE universities to enforce viewpoint diversity in all aspect of operations. Make it illegal for local law enforcement to interfere with federal law enforcement efforts. REQUIRE the census to inquire about citizenship status. Make it illegal to use illegal immigrant totals in apportionment. ( could go on for quite a while with this list).

Enact a revolutionary agenda and make the Democrats spend the next decade trying to undo it. Make them spend all their time undoing your agenda, rather than enacting their own. That's what they do. They did it with Obamacare. And look at how it has hamstrung us for over a decade. it's a massive failure, and yet the table is set in such a way that we bear the obligation to fix it rather than trash it.

(Bushies go apoplectic in 3...2....1....)

This particular line of thinking is where moderates are so out of touch with reality that they are arguably the worst part of the problem. They'll let Dems do anything, and then prevent conservatives from doing anything.

---

Whiterock, you are spot on. We have to pass the laws that we can, and generally speaking they will be popular with working Americans. If they undo them, then they will need to spend the political capital to do so. And we know that if conservatives are blocking the lib agenda, the libs will do away with the filibuster - why, because the damage the left intends to do cannot be easily undone. There is no coming back from amnesty, insecure elections, additional left leaning states, additional justices, etc.

Moderates always fight to lose in the name of being level headed. The truth is they are scared. They should be, but it's not Maga they should fear. The choice for sane America is to fight to win long term, or to stall and lose near term.

Moderates will always choose to lose to the Dems ... the real reason is they are programmed by the same people programming the leftists. They feel better calling themselves moderate. Makes them feel enlightened, and they just can't think through this issue reasonably. It's also why most are suffering from TDS to varying degrees.

---

No, it is the people that think politics are a "win or lose" game that are the problem. Knee-jerk reactions with no thought of future ramifications to "win". Emotional policy makers are the most dangerous, to top it off you guys are usually the loudest. You keep forgetting that the other 50% are American's too and their opinions and votes count just as much as yours, even if you disagree. There is no winning or losing, it is getting things done that need to be done.

Get off the political spectrum addiction, there are no left, no right only Americans. We need health care solved just like with need the border resolved. The problem doesn't go away because it is left or right. In other words, grow up. Solve the f-ing problems and quit with the name calling

---

You're opening argument suggests you are detached from reality and making decisions based on politics that doesn't exist in our country, the Left is too far gone to reason with. You intellectually know this but your media programming makes you play pretend.

Doc Holliday said:

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Waco1947 said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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Waco1947 said:

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The new fight for progressives is not whether it is not the right but rather the top, the oligarchy, Big Corporations. That is our fight. The working, small business, and middle class are tired of all the money flowing to the top in a system rigged by big money in politics to send it to the top. Look at the group at the WH today - oligarchs making policy over which we, the people, have no control that hurts wages, education, and healthcare.

---

Corporate oligarchs have made their largest gains using big government to destroy their competition.

---

No argument from me. You are right

---

Yeah but democrats promising to use big government to end crony capitalism have and will continue to pull the rug out from under everyone and work in favor of the corporations and against the people.

This is what they did with the ACA. They will lie and pretend its good when its actually racketeering.

---

Say more about how Big Government will be used to end crony capitalism?

Adriacus Peratuun said:

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Waco1947 said:

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Adriacus Peratuun said:

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Waco1947 said:

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The new fight for progressives is not whether it is not the right but rather the top, the oligarchy, Big Corporations. That is our fight. The working, small business, and middle class are tired of all the money flowing to the top in a system rigged by big money in politics to send it to the top. Look at the group at the WH today - oligarchs making policy over which we, the people, have no control that hurts wages, education, and healthcare.

---

The Far Left only fights for one thing. Control. The creation of a caste system with their members permanently on top.

USSR, PRC, Lefty America…..the formula never changes.

---

What does Right want? Say it with me Control

---

LMFAO……

Right……free market health care.gouges people
Left…….government controlled health care Govt sets limits.

Right……states rights except fed issues In racist states the federal government needs to step in.
Left……fed controlled healthy unless it is illegal immigration You mispoke

Right……1st and 2nd Amendments Hate speech as DT saying at "I hate Democrats at a memorial no less when the consistent message was love and forgiveness. Hate meme by DT of him droppping poop on American citizens during the no kings protests.
Left………Hate speech, Cancel culture, etc. Hate speech? An invalid opion. Whose culture are we canceling?

care to try another lie?

---

Waco1947 said:

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Doc Holliday said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

The new fight for progressives is not whether it is not the right but rather the top, the oligarchy, Big Corporations. That is our fight. The working, small business, and middle class are tired of all the money flowing to the top in a system rigged by big money in politics to send it to the top. Look at the group at the WH today - oligarchs making policy over which we, the people, have no control that hurts wages, education, and healthcare.

---

Corporate oligarchs have made their largest gains using big government to destroy their competition.

---

No argument from me. You are right

---

Yeah but democrats promising to use big government to end crony capitalism have and will continue to pull the rug out from under everyone and work in favor of the corporations and against the people.

This is what they did with the ACA. They will lie and pretend its good when its actually racketeering.

---

Say more about how Big Government will be used to end crony capitalism?

---

Did you not understand?

Big government will perpetuate crony capitalism.

Adriacus Peratuun said:

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Osodecentx said:

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Adriacus Peratuun said:

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Osodecentx said:

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whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

Explain how the D's get control of the Senate.

Rs have 1 Senator from a Blue State while D's already have 9 of 14 Senators from swing states. Even rolling back the 1 senator, Ds would need to take two more Senate seats from swing states when they are already close to a historical high (% based) of swing Senate seats.

historically, Ds are more likely to lose one or two Senate seats than gain one or two.

your thinking is borderline crazy.
the entire premise of gaining power is the ability to use it, not to do as little as possible in hope of preserving it.
Ds understand that item. Obamacare being a prime example.

---

Dems had control of the Senate 3 years ago. They will have control again sometime in the future

---

And then they lost every seat they had in Red states……Ohio, Montana, West Virginia……tell us Oh Great Prognosticator which of those seats they win back in this environment.

Surely your great pronouncements have details in support.

---

Guess sarcasm is your love language.
My point is the Democrats at some point in the future will gain control of the Senate. The filibuster makes it more difficult to pass laws. I've seen a lot more bills I did not want to pass than pass. The filibuster makes the Senate more deliberative. I like that.

whiterock said:

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Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

that is not debatable. The issue is, are they going to do it anyway? There is is a lot of evidence that they will, and not much beyond wishful thinking that they wont. At whatever point one concludes a high percentage chance they are going to do it no matter what, it becomes incumbent on us doing it first. to get our stuff done. Yes, they CAN undo it all, but that will take time and political capital. Why would we do nothing and just let them go first?......let them put all their stuff in place, requiring us to use our political capital to undo it all.

That is the question. Do you think they will do it? If not, upon what do you base that assumption?

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

that is not debatable. The issue is, are they going to do it anyway? There is is a lot of evidence that they will, and not much beyond wishful thinking that they wont. At whatever point one concludes a high percentage chance they are going to do it no matter what, it becomes incumbent on us doing it first. to get our stuff done. Yes, they CAN undo it all, but that will take time and political capital. Why would we do nothing and just let them go first?......let them put all their stuff in place, requiring us to use our political capital to undo it all.

That is the question. Do you think they will do it? If not, upon what do you base that assumption?

---

I say the answer is no. They won't. Why? They didn't when they had the opportunity with Biden. Also, the Senate leadership doesn't want it gone for all the reasons we discuss. Will they saber-rattle? Yes, just like Trump is now. Do they want to pull the trigger? No. They have had several opportunities. In the end, they know it is a nightmare. I say they look at what Harry Reid did when he broke the Senate rules, it has not worked in the Democrats favor.

To take it one step further, I think they want the GOP to try it. Then you will hear even more about Trump making himself an Emperor. And will have MORE Congressional investigations. Hegseth (sp) might as well set up a cot...

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

that is not debatable. The issue is, are they going to do it anyway? There is is a lot of evidence that they will, and not much beyond wishful thinking that they wont. At whatever point one concludes a high percentage chance they are going to do it no matter what, it becomes incumbent on us doing it first. to get our stuff done. Yes, they CAN undo it all, but that will take time and political capital. Why would we do nothing and just let them go first?......let them put all their stuff in place, requiring us to use our political capital to undo it all.

That is the question. Do you think they will do it? If not, upon what do you base that assumption?

---

Based on history, no I don't think they will do away with the filibuster. The filibuster has been around for close to 200 years.

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

why on earth do you think they wouldn't do it anyway? The left is not the party of restraint.

If removing the filibuster makes it so that the Dems have control for the next 50 years, they will. Amnesty will happen, open borders will happen. It's not a question at this point. It's naivety more than anything. The Dems are controlled by progressive globalists, Canada and the UK are their model. Crazy "moderate" repubs want to play make believe with who they really are controlled by.

TinFoilHatPreacherBear said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

why on earth do you think they wouldn't do it anyway? The left is not the party of restraint.

If removing the filibuster makes it so that the Dems have control for the next 50 years, they will. Amnesty will happen, open borders will happen. It's not a question at this point. It's naivety more than anything. The Dems are controlled by progressive globalists, Canada and the UK are their model. Crazy "moderate" repubs want to play make believe with who they really are controlled by.

---

Make believe? Both Parties have done things. Reid did the Cabinets, McConnell did the Supreme Court Judges. McConnell also denied the Dems a Supreme Court designee. The GOP is just as bad as the Democrats.

Your argument that the GOP has to do it before the Dems do because of history is BS. The Democrats have just as much to fear from the GOP. Probably more, as the GOP has actually followed through twice in the last 10 years with changing the Supreme Court vote and preventing Obama from selecting a Justice. Under Biden, they didn't do anything.

FLBear5630 said:

---

TinFoilHatPreacherBear said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

why on earth do you think they wouldn't do it anyway? The left is not the party of restraint.

If removing the filibuster makes it so that the Dems have control for the next 50 years, they will. Amnesty will happen, open borders will happen. It's not a question at this point. It's naivety more than anything. The Dems are controlled by progressive globalists, Canada and the UK are their model. Crazy "moderate" repubs want to play make believe with who they really are controlled by.

---

Make believe? Both Parties have done things. Reid did the Cabinets, McConnell did the Supreme Court Judges. McConnell also denied the Dems a Supreme Court designee. The GOP is just as bad as the Democrats.

Your argument that the GOP has to do it before the Dems do because of history is BS. The Democrats have just as much to fear from the GOP. Probably more, as the GOP has actually followed through twice in the last 10 years with changing the Supreme Court vote and preventing Obama from selecting a Justice. Under Biden, they didn't do anything.

---

Man, no they don't have as much to fear. If they get control back, they will definitely do amnesty and the Supreme Court if it looks like it'll get in the way. You've been been wrong about most things to date. Why do you keep insisting on being wrong yet again. Repubs, I'd they had any backbone would do what needed to be done to secure our country and elections. Repubs stand a great chance with just those two items getting done.

TinFoilHatPreacherBear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

TinFoilHatPreacherBear said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I don't hate anyone. I just disagree

---

I think you missed the question:

What is the mindset of MAGA? Can you share?

I feel like it is one of those bogeymen that you can use as a strawman but really cannot define.

BTW - so you can disagree with someone and it does not mean you "hate" them? Interesting ...

---

I will take a shot...


My issue with MAGA Democrats is that their actions seem to reflect:

1 - the "ends justifies the means",
2 - might makes right, and teamed with
3 - an Authoritarian approach, they can do what they want no checks, no balances

That is what bothers me, just watch Bannon and listen to Stephen Miller or Pam Bondi any of them.

---

FIFY

Democrats call anyone who disagrees with them fascists, enemies of democracy, etc.....

---

Yawn...

Do away with the Filibuster. Kill ACA. Follow Trump's lead on killing all Govt assistance. Pack the Court. See how that works out for the GOP.

Trump demands voting changes hours after major Democratic wins - Newsweek

Yeah, doesn't fit MAGA. Better warm up, gonna need it for gymnastics you are going to have to do to make this stuff kosher for the average American.

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

why on earth do you think they wouldn't do it anyway? The left is not the party of restraint.

If removing the filibuster makes it so that the Dems have control for the next 50 years, they will. Amnesty will happen, open borders will happen. It's not a question at this point. It's naivety more than anything. The Dems are controlled by progressive globalists, Canada and the UK are their model. Crazy "moderate" repubs want to play make believe with who they really are controlled by.

---

Make believe? Both Parties have done things. Reid did the Cabinets, McConnell did the Supreme Court Judges. McConnell also denied the Dems a Supreme Court designee. The GOP is just as bad as the Democrats.

Your argument that the GOP has to do it before the Dems do because of history is BS. The Democrats have just as much to fear from the GOP. Probably more, as the GOP has actually followed through twice in the last 10 years with changing the Supreme Court vote and preventing Obama from selecting a Justice. Under Biden, they didn't do anything.

---

Man, no they don't have as much to fear. If they get control back, they will definitely do amnesty and the Supreme Court if it looks like it'll get in the way. You've been been wrong about most things to date. Why do you keep insisting on being wrong yet again. Repubs, I'd they had any backbone would do what needed to be done to secure our country and elections. Repubs stand a great chance with just those two items getting done.

---

Wrong? Who keeps score on a message board? You would have to be a pretty f-ed up individual to keep score on political discussions. A real self-absorbed a-hole. I mean anyone that tracks conversations on message boards, I feel sorry for the wife. (if any women would stick around).

Know anyone like that on this board?

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

that is not debatable. The issue is, are they going to do it anyway? There is is a lot of evidence that they will, and not much beyond wishful thinking that they wont. At whatever point one concludes a high percentage chance they are going to do it no matter what, it becomes incumbent on us doing it first. to get our stuff done. Yes, they CAN undo it all, but that will take time and political capital. Why would we do nothing and just let them go first?......let them put all their stuff in place, requiring us to use our political capital to undo it all.

That is the question. Do you think they will do it? If not, upon what do you base that assumption?

---

I say the answer is no. They won't. Why? They didn't when they had the opportunity with Biden. Also, the Senate leadership doesn't want it gone for all the reasons we discuss. Will they saber-rattle? Yes, just like Trump is now. Do they want to pull the trigger? No. They have had several opportunities. In the end, they know it is a nightmare. I say they look at what Harry Reid did when he broke the Senate rules, it has not worked in the Democrats favor.

To take it one step further, I think they want the GOP to try it. Then you will hear even more about Trump making himself an Emperor. And will have MORE Congressional investigations. Hegseth (sp) might as well set up a cot...

---

They didn't do it because Biden said no. Will Newsome say no? I lean that he would. But what about AOC? If she is their nominee (could be) and got elected POTUS (could be).....can we count on her? Don't count her out. Who woulda thought Obama could have defeated Hillary? and t2028 will not be 2008. The Dems hae no moderates. The progressives own the party.

Trusting Dems not to abandon the filibuster is like trusting Iran not to build a nuke.
Never trust people who form crowds and threaten to destroy you.

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

that is not debatable. The issue is, are they going to do it anyway? There is is a lot of evidence that they will, and not much beyond wishful thinking that they wont. At whatever point one concludes a high percentage chance they are going to do it no matter what, it becomes incumbent on us doing it first. to get our stuff done. Yes, they CAN undo it all, but that will take time and political capital. Why would we do nothing and just let them go first?......let them put all their stuff in place, requiring us to use our political capital to undo it all.

That is the question. Do you think they will do it? If not, upon what do you base that assumption?

---

Based on history, no I don't think they will do away with the filibuster. The filibuster has been around for close to 200 years.

---

The sunk cost aspect does not help your argument, but you might be right. But if you're wrong, the problem becomes existential. Dems will pack the whole system to ensure they never lose another election.

Or, we can stack up a long list of stuff that will take them a couple of years to undo, giving us a chance to stop it the mid-terms.


The weak point in my argument, of course, is that it would require Republicans to actually pass their platform into law.

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

that is not debatable. The issue is, are they going to do it anyway? There is is a lot of evidence that they will, and not much beyond wishful thinking that they wont. At whatever point one concludes a high percentage chance they are going to do it no matter what, it becomes incumbent on us doing it first. to get our stuff done. Yes, they CAN undo it all, but that will take time and political capital. Why would we do nothing and just let them go first?......let them put all their stuff in place, requiring us to use our political capital to undo it all.

That is the question. Do you think they will do it? If not, upon what do you base that assumption?

---

I say the answer is no. They won't. Why? They didn't when they had the opportunity with Biden. Also, the Senate leadership doesn't want it gone for all the reasons we discuss. Will they saber-rattle? Yes, just like Trump is now. Do they want to pull the trigger? No. They have had several opportunities. In the end, they know it is a nightmare. I say they look at what Harry Reid did when he broke the Senate rules, it has not worked in the Democrats favor.

To take it one step further, I think they want the GOP to try it. Then you will hear even more about Trump making himself an Emperor. And will have MORE Congressional investigations. Hegseth (sp) might as well set up a cot...

---

They didn't do it because Biden said no. Will Newsome say no? I lean that he would. But what about AOC? If she is their nominee (could be) and got elected POTUS (could be).....can we count on her? Don't count her out. Who woulda thought Obama could have defeated Hillary? and t2028 will not be 2008. The Dems hae no moderates. The progressives own the party.

Trusting Dems not to abandon the filibuster is like trusting Iran not to build a nuke.
Never trust people who form crowds and threaten to destroy you.

---

GOP does away with the filibuster and we have done their work for them. Because if you are right and an AOC can win. She can win with or without the filibuster.

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

that is not debatable. The issue is, are they going to do it anyway? There is is a lot of evidence that they will, and not much beyond wishful thinking that they wont. At whatever point one concludes a high percentage chance they are going to do it no matter what, it becomes incumbent on us doing it first. to get our stuff done. Yes, they CAN undo it all, but that will take time and political capital. Why would we do nothing and just let them go first?......let them put all their stuff in place, requiring us to use our political capital to undo it all.

That is the question. Do you think they will do it? If not, upon what do you base that assumption?

---

Based on history, no I don't think they will do away with the filibuster. The filibuster has been around for close to 200 years.

---

The sunk cost aspect does not help your argument, but you might be right. But if you're wrong, the problem becomes existential. Dems will pack the whole system to ensure they never lose another election.

Or, we can stack up a long list of stuff that will take them a couple of years to undo, giving us a chance to stop it the mid-terms.


The weak point in my argument, of course, is that it would require Republicans to actually pass their platform into law.

---

The weak point in your argument is that you are assuming the worst possible election results and the worst post election actions, things that have never happened. Dems had 60 votes in the senate in Obama's first term. They left the filibuster alone.
If Repubs scuttle the filibuster and pass an aggressive agenda it gives the Dems cover for undoing everything in that agenda and then all of the bad stuff you fear.

Leave the filibuster alone. Repubs will need it some day.

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

that is not debatable. The issue is, are they going to do it anyway? There is is a lot of evidence that they will, and not much beyond wishful thinking that they wont. At whatever point one concludes a high percentage chance they are going to do it no matter what, it becomes incumbent on us doing it first. to get our stuff done. Yes, they CAN undo it all, but that will take time and political capital. Why would we do nothing and just let them go first?......let them put all their stuff in place, requiring us to use our political capital to undo it all.

That is the question. Do you think they will do it? If not, upon what do you base that assumption?

---

Based on history, no I don't think they will do away with the filibuster. The filibuster has been around for close to 200 years.

---

The sunk cost aspect does not help your argument, but you might be right. But if you're wrong, the problem becomes existential. Dems will pack the whole system to ensure they never lose another election.

Or, we can stack up a long list of stuff that will take them a couple of years to undo, giving us a chance to stop it the mid-terms.


The weak point in my argument, of course, is that it would require Republicans to actually pass their platform into law.

---

The weak point in your argument is that you are assuming the worst possible election results and the worst post election actions, things that have never happened. Dems had 60 votes in the senate in Obama's first term. They left the filibuster alone.
If Repubs scuttle the filibuster and pass an aggressive agenda it gives the Dems cover for undoing everything in that agenda and then all of the bad stuff you fear.

Leave the filibuster alone. Repubs will need it some day.

---

In 2008 the Ds thought they were beginning a new era of controlling all three branches of government for decades. The filibuster wasn't even on their mind.

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

that is not debatable. The issue is, are they going to do it anyway? There is is a lot of evidence that they will, and not much beyond wishful thinking that they wont. At whatever point one concludes a high percentage chance they are going to do it no matter what, it becomes incumbent on us doing it first. to get our stuff done. Yes, they CAN undo it all, but that will take time and political capital. Why would we do nothing and just let them go first?......let them put all their stuff in place, requiring us to use our political capital to undo it all.

That is the question. Do you think they will do it? If not, upon what do you base that assumption?

---

Based on history, no I don't think they will do away with the filibuster. The filibuster has been around for close to 200 years.

---

The sunk cost aspect does not help your argument, but you might be right. But if you're wrong, the problem becomes existential. Dems will pack the whole system to ensure they never lose another election.

Or, we can stack up a long list of stuff that will take them a couple of years to undo, giving us a chance to stop it the mid-terms.


The weak point in my argument, of course, is that it would require Republicans to actually pass their platform into law.

---

The weak point in your argument is that you are assuming the worst possible election results and the worst post election actions, things that have never happened. Dems had 60 votes in the senate in Obama's first term. They left the filibuster alone.
If Repubs scuttle the filibuster and pass an aggressive agenda it gives the Dems cover for undoing everything in that agenda and then all of the bad stuff you fear.

Leave the filibuster alone. Repubs will need it some day.

---

In 2008 the Ds thought they were beginning a new era of controlling all three branches of government for decades. The filibuster wasn't even on their mind.

---

Do you believe the Democrats will never control the US Senate again?

Osodecentx said:

---

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

---

I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

---

the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

---

I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

---

not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

---

If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

---

that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

---

If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

---

that is not debatable. The issue is, are they going to do it anyway? There is is a lot of evidence that they will, and not much beyond wishful thinking that they wont. At whatever point one concludes a high percentage chance they are going to do it no matter what, it becomes incumbent on us doing it first. to get our stuff done. Yes, they CAN undo it all, but that will take time and political capital. Why would we do nothing and just let them go first?......let them put all their stuff in place, requiring us to use our political capital to undo it all.

That is the question. Do you think they will do it? If not, upon what do you base that assumption?

---

Based on history, no I don't think they will do away with the filibuster. The filibuster has been around for close to 200 years.

---

The sunk cost aspect does not help your argument, but you might be right. But if you're wrong, the problem becomes existential. Dems will pack the whole system to ensure they never lose another election.

Or, we can stack up a long list of stuff that will take them a couple of years to undo, giving us a chance to stop it the mid-terms.


The weak point in my argument, of course, is that it would require Republicans to actually pass their platform into law.

---

The weak point in your argument is that you are assuming the worst possible election results and the worst post election actions, things that have never happened. Dems had 60 votes in the senate in Obama's first term. They left the filibuster alone.
If Repubs scuttle the filibuster and pass an aggressive agenda it gives the Dems cover for undoing everything in that agenda and then all of the bad stuff you fear.

Leave the filibuster alone. Repubs will need it some day.

---

In 2008 the Ds thought they were beginning a new era of controlling all three branches of government for decades. The filibuster wasn't even on their mind.

---

Do you believe the Democrats will never control the US Senate again?

---

60 vote control without adding new states?

No, not within the next five decades. The math needed is not reasonably possible.

Doc Holliday said:

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Waco1947 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

The new fight for progressives is not whether it is not the right but rather the top, the oligarchy, Big Corporations. That is our fight. The working, small business, and middle class are tired of all the money flowing to the top in a system rigged by big money in politics to send it to the top. Look at the group at the WH today - oligarchs making policy over which we, the people, have no control that hurts wages, education, and healthcare.

---

Corporate oligarchs have made their largest gains using big government to destroy their competition.

---

No argument from me. You are right

---

Yeah but democrats promising to use big government to end crony capitalism have and will continue to pull the rug out from under everyone and work in favor of the corporations and against the people.

This is what they did with the ACA. They will lie and pretend its good when its actually racketeering.

---

Say more about how Big Government will be used to end crony capitalism?

---

Did you not understand?

Big government will perpetuate crony capitalism.How do you see that process? Campaigning tool? Full of hot air?

---

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

Adriacus Peratuun said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the filibuster now, given that a super-majority of Dems are demanding it. Would be a pre-emptive move.

It's not unreasonable to propose killing the ACA, given that it is an utter failure, i.e. it takes subsidies of several thousand dollars PER PERSON to keep it alive. You pose elsewhere as a deficit hawk, so how can you suport the ACA?

It's not unreasonable to follow law on SNAP payments during a shutdown, to include not providing funds to illegal aliens. It's the Dems who've played fast & loose on this (and so many more) issue.

It's not unreasonable to talk about packing SCOTUS as long as Democrats support doing it and half-assed tried to do it last go around.

I'm not on bord for most of that, but I can at least see they are important questions of the day. You would too, if you'c come join us in the real world.

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I agree. None of it is unreasonable. IF there are replacements for the people to actually do better. But, there isn't. It is crickets, except how bad things are and we are going to make them either more expensive or kill em. So, it is back to the ER for healthcare. That is not an answer, not matter how reasonable you think it is. It is a loser.

Killing the Filibuster would be a disaster. It would open the flood gates to packing the courts, huge swings in policy, and take away any check or balance. It is a horrible short sighted "solution"

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the point is, Dems threatened to do it under Biden, and are threatening to do it again at first opportunity. Yes, threats are sometimes just pandering. But if you pander long enough and hard enough, you find boys showering with girls in public schools, conservatives being shot for daring to be debate with progressives, and Marxists winning elections in NYC. At. Some. Point. a party has to attend to the expectations of its base. It'd be very wise to take them at their word. As Elwood Blues would say, they're on a mission from God.

Under this plan laid out by Carville -- After they pack the Supreme Court and add 2 new states and 4 new Democrat Senators -- they will pass mass amnesty and citizenship for all 30 million Illegal Aliens.

We have to end the Filibuster rule now.pic.twitter.com/AYilWBxwPB

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) November 10, 2025

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I get it. They already went nuclear once in the Senate.

So far, there does not seem to be an appetite on either side to do it. IMO, the Filibuster is one of the last things keeping us from being a Banana Republic.

We do agree on their mission. GOP has a choice. Do they keep beating the down with clubs or offer an alternative. At least in Florida, the alternative is winning. Areas that have been blue for decades have gone red in South Florida. The Healthcare issue is going to be the new abortion if the GOP doesn't come up with something. Lectures aren't going to do it.

There will have to be some move to a tiered approach of mixed open to taxpayers and pay for premium service. Maybe not socialized, but similar to SS or Medicare for families. It is getting bad, we have too many not getting medical care when it can be inexpensive to treat and then showing up in the ER with full blown disease. It is just good politics to have an alternative before killing an existing program, even a bad program.

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not sure your assessment about Dem appetite is correct. I recently saw (but did not retain link to) a collage photo of all the social media posts by Dem Senators calling to end the filibuster. They're approaching, if not beyond, a majority of their caucus. And their political base is united behind the idea.

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If GOP does away with the filibuster, what laws could they pass that Democrats couldn't repeal as soon as they take charge?
Keep the filibuster

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that is the countervailing argument. But it has flaws as well - chiefly that we accomplish little, then Dems dump it and add 2 states (4 Dem Senate seats) pack the court, etc.....and rule forever.

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If there is no filibuster the Dems can do all of that the next time they are in power. At that time they could undo (repeal ) all of the good government laws Reps may pass when/if they do away with the filibuster.

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that is not debatable. The issue is, are they going to do it anyway? There is is a lot of evidence that they will, and not much beyond wishful thinking that they wont. At whatever point one concludes a high percentage chance they are going to do it no matter what, it becomes incumbent on us doing it first. to get our stuff done. Yes, they CAN undo it all, but that will take time and political capital. Why would we do nothing and just let them go first?......let them put all their stuff in place, requiring us to use our political capital to undo it all.

That is the question. Do you think they will do it? If not, upon what do you base that assumption?

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Based on history, no I don't think they will do away with the filibuster. The filibuster has been around for close to 200 years.

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The sunk cost aspect does not help your argument, but you might be right. But if you're wrong, the problem becomes existential. Dems will pack the whole system to ensure they never lose another election.

Or, we can stack up a long list of stuff that will take them a couple of years to undo, giving us a chance to stop it the mid-terms.


The weak point in my argument, of course, is that it would require Republicans to actually pass their platform into law.

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The weak point in your argument is that you are assuming the worst possible election results and the worst post election actions, things that have never happened. Dems had 60 votes in the senate in Obama's first term. They left the filibuster alone.
If Repubs scuttle the filibuster and pass an aggressive agenda it gives the Dems cover for undoing everything in that agenda and then all of the bad stuff you fear.

Leave the filibuster alone. Repubs will need it some day.

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In 2008 the Ds thought they were beginning a new era of controlling all three branches of government for decades. The filibuster wasn't even on their mind.

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Do you believe the Democrats will never control the US Senate again?

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60 vote control without adding new states?

No, not within the next five decades. The math needed is not reasonably possible.

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It takes 51 votes to change senate rules

Waco1947 said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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Waco1947 said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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Waco1947 said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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Waco1947 said:

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The new fight for progressives is not whether it is not the right but rather the top, the oligarchy, Big Corporations. That is our fight. The working, small business, and middle class are tired of all the money flowing to the top in a system rigged by big money in politics to send it to the top. Look at the group at the WH today - oligarchs making policy over which we, the people, have no control that hurts wages, education, and healthcare.

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Corporate oligarchs have made their largest gains using big government to destroy their competition.

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No argument from me. You are right

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Yeah but democrats promising to use big government to end crony capitalism have and will continue to pull the rug out from under everyone and work in favor of the corporations and against the people.

This is what they did with the ACA. They will lie and pretend its good when its actually racketeering.

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Say more about how Big Government will be used to end crony capitalism?

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Did you not understand?

Big government will perpetuate crony capitalism.How do you see that process? Campaigning tool? Full of hot air?

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How is that different than right now? Crony Capitalism? This is just as bad as Biden in that request and Trump's handpicked people are controlling and cancelling contracts. Some of those making decisions are getting those contracts and cutting their competition or oversight agencies. This isn't Crony Capitalism????