TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Everyone falls short of Christ's commands, Christian's included. We are all still sinners.

Once again you miss the point: nothing in Christ's teachings advocate, promote, or condone socialism in any form. It's a tired old propaganda technique to misuse an authority you do not believe, God's word, to advocate something reprehensible to God's teachings and His morality.

---

I think you miss the point. The Gospels, including Paul's and John's teachings, are replete with instructions to give up your wealth, not to store treasure on earth, but in heaven. The early church practiced communal living.

It's convenient for today's Christians and preachers to ignore or gloss over what the NT really says about accumulating wealth. Clearly what the NT literally says couldn't be right, that would be too costly.

---

First off, you're an atheist and you're absolutely pushing for socialism despite your denial. You're making foundational socialist claims.

An atheist appealing to Jesus' teachings to push socialism is like someone who rejects the Constitution arguing policy based on "what the Founding Fathers really wanted". It's inherently inconsistent. Yet suddenly you want to use Christian authority to argue for your politics. If you reject the source, you don't get to use it as a moral cudgel.

Christ's commands about wealth: give to the poor, sell possessions, store treasure in heaven, are moral commands to individuals and communities, not instructions for governments to seize and redistribute wealth.

Use some common sense. If everything is owned by the state (socialism), you cannot give sacrificially

The entire discussion is another example of how the Gaystapo has completely changed the way left-wing extremist Christians view Scripture. It was not too long ago that LWNJ Christians loved to quote Amos and loved to talk about being "Red-letter Christians." However, the "inconvenient" OT Scripture and Jesus teachings on marriage sort of made them quietly walk away and forget being "Red-letter Christians" and quoting the OT.

Doc Holliday said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Everyone falls short of Christ's commands, Christian's included. We are all still sinners.

Once again you miss the point: nothing in Christ's teachings advocate, promote, or condone socialism in any form. It's a tired old propaganda technique to misuse an authority you do not believe, God's word, to advocate something reprehensible to God's teachings and His morality.

---

I think you miss the point. The Gospels, including Paul's and John's teachings, are replete with instructions to give up your wealth, not to store treasure on earth, but in heaven. The early church practiced communal living.

It's convenient for today's Christians and preachers to ignore or gloss over what the NT really says about accumulating wealth. Clearly what the NT literally says couldn't be right, that would be too costly.

---

First off, you're an atheist and you're absolutely pushing for socialism despite your denial. You're making foundational socialist claims.

An atheist appealing to Jesus' teachings to push socialism is like someone who rejects the Constitution arguing policy based on "what the Founding Fathers really wanted". It's inherently inconsistent. Yet suddenly you want to use Christian authority to argue for your politics. If you reject the source, you don't get to use it as a moral cudgel.

Christ's commands about wealth: give to the poor, sell possessions, store treasure in heaven, are moral commands to individuals and communities, not instructions for governments to seize and redistribute wealth.

Use some common sense. If everything is owned by the state (socialism), you cannot give sacrificially

---

Impeccable. Thank you.

Guy Noir said:

---

I do not believe that gifts to the needy should apply to the government funds.
It is also important that the government should not give out more than it takes in.

I have an emergency assistance guide that is distributed by "Now Forward" formally called "North Dallas Shared Ministries". It lists over 103 organizations that help all peoples with financial, dental, medical, food, clothes, and taxes. "Now Forward" has a 98% pass through of donations to service of the people. There is a lot of great charitable work done in our communities. Whereas a many government programs are ineffective.

---

Charities are not perfect but by and large do a better job of helping the poor than the government. By and large Christian charities are filled with good people really focused on helping others while the government really is largely a Ponzi scheme designed to enrich Democrat special interest groups and voters.

This is what government charity gets us.

Millions of dollars in taxpayer money stolen as part of a series of massive Minnesota welfare fraud schemes may have been funneled to Somalia-based terror group al-Shabab, according to a report.
The radical Islamic terror group, which is a longstanding ally of al Qaeda and considered a threat to US interests, has likely been the beneficiary of money stolen in a spate of scams and sent to Somalia by the criminals defrauding the North Star State, City Journal reported Wednesday, citing federal counterterrorism sources.
"This is a third-rail conversation, but the largest funder of al-Shabab is the Minnesota taxpayer," a source who worked on a federal investigation into Minnesotans attempting to join overseas terror groups, told the outlet.
"There is an issue here that is real, and if there is ever an event that is traceable back to these funds, or to people from this area, then this situation will take on a whole new set of optics," the source warned.

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Christian's generally do follow Christian principles in terms of generosity

Socialists, on the other hand, tend to be the greediest. They are always obsessed about what others have and always coming up with ways to steal it. Materialists have little respect for human life since it has little to no meaning.

---

In terms of following Christ's admonitions, they fall far short.

I'm not going to defend socialists, since that is a political philosophy that I don't adhere to. Most Christians I know are materialists. Especially clergy.

---

I'd say the key is what you use to define 'Christian'.

Jesus spoke to tens of thousands, but only a handful stayed with Him throughout His work on Earth. Many who would have said they liked Jesus and believed in Him, dispersed when asked to follow through in action. The Book of Revelation warns that there were churches even in the Apostolic Age which were false or lukewarm.

History shows countless popes, kings and emperors who claimed to be Christian but acted in selfish, sinful ways. And of course we are painfully aware of all the megachurches today which generate a lot of money but don't serve Christ in truth.


That said, there are - and have always been - individual churches and individual people who hear the Lord, love Him and obey. You have to look for them, because they don't boast on themselves, they tend to be smaller churches and Satan tries hard to hide them from discovery, since such people and congregations make many more believers.

You need to look for faith in action, and ignore the loud and arrogant.

---

I can agree a lot with what you said. There really isn't a clear cut definition of a "Christian". Christianity has evolved in diverse ways from the initial core group of followers.

I would add to your list excessive salaries to pastors of regular churches. It would seem to me, that if you believe you are called to the ministry, you would lead by example of not seeking 'earthly' treasure.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Far more than you, I'm quite sure.

Flat Earth fits within your denial of science. That's why so many of you QAon followers are Flat Earthers, vax deniers etc.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Quite a bit actually, and I'm sure far more than you Flat Earth boy.

---

Money you printed in crayon does not count. So you are back at zero, TS.

---

Is that the best you have DB?

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Christian's generally do follow Christian principles in terms of generosity

Socialists, on the other hand, tend to be the greediest. They are always obsessed about what others have and always coming up with ways to steal it. Materialists have little respect for human life since it has little to no meaning.

---

In terms of following Christ's admonitions, they fall far short.

I'm not going to defend socialists, since that is a political philosophy that I don't adhere to. Most Christians I know are materialists. Especially clergy.

---

I'd say the key is what you use to define 'Christian'.

Jesus spoke to tens of thousands, but only a handful stayed with Him throughout His work on Earth. Many who would have said they liked Jesus and believed in Him, dispersed when asked to follow through in action. The Book of Revelation warns that there were churches even in the Apostolic Age which were false or lukewarm.

History shows countless popes, kings and emperors who claimed to be Christian but acted in selfish, sinful ways. And of course we are painfully aware of all the megachurches today which generate a lot of money but don't serve Christ in truth.


That said, there are - and have always been - individual churches and individual people who hear the Lord, love Him and obey. You have to look for them, because they don't boast on themselves, they tend to be smaller churches and Satan tries hard to hide them from discovery, since such people and congregations make many more believers.

You need to look for faith in action, and ignore the loud and arrogant.

---

I can agree a lot with what you said. There really isn't a clear cut definition of a "Christian". Christianity has evolved in diverse ways from the initial core group of followers.

I would add to your list excessive salaries to pastors of regular churches. It would seem to me, that if you believe you are called to the ministry, you would lead by example of not seeking 'earthly' treasure.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Far more than you, I'm quite sure.

Flat Earth fits within your denial of science. That's why so many of you QAon followers are Flat Earthers, vax deniers etc.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Quite a bit actually, and I'm sure far more than you Flat Earth boy.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Substantially more than you Flat Earth Boy. My guess is you didn't give anything.

Doc Holliday said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Everyone falls short of Christ's commands, Christian's included. We are all still sinners.

Once again you miss the point: nothing in Christ's teachings advocate, promote, or condone socialism in any form. It's a tired old propaganda technique to misuse an authority you do not believe, God's word, to advocate something reprehensible to God's teachings and His morality.

---

I think you miss the point. The Gospels, including Paul's and John's teachings, are replete with instructions to give up your wealth, not to store treasure on earth, but in heaven. The early church practiced communal living.

It's convenient for today's Christians and preachers to ignore or gloss over what the NT really says about accumulating wealth. Clearly what the NT literally says couldn't be right, that would be too costly.

---

First off, you're an atheist and you're absolutely pushing for socialism despite your denial. You're making foundational socialist claims. Nowhere have I said I'm for socialism. I'm not. What I'm pointing out is that most professing Christians ingnore what the NT states are the teachings of Jesus. They don't follow Christ. Jesus admonished to help the poor and needy. He didn't advocate accumlation of wealth, and essentially warned against it.

An atheist appealing to Jesus' teachings to push socialism is like someone who rejects the Constitution arguing policy based on "what the Founding Fathers really wanted". It's inherently inconsistent. Yet suddenly you want to use Christian authority to argue for your politics. If you reject the source, you don't get to use it as a moral cudgel. It's not about politics or socialism. It's about professing Christians being unwilling to follow Christ's reported teachings because it's too much for them to give up and follow him. Yet, they assert moral authority when they ignore and don't follow the basic teachings of Christ.

Christ's commands about wealth: give to the poor, sell possessions, store treasure in heaven, are moral commands to individuals and communities, not instructions for governments to seize and redistribute wealth. I don't advocate the government seizing and redistributing wealth. I do advocate for professing Christians to quit practicing pietism and hypocricy, and to follow Christ's admonitions of giving to the poor and needy.

Use some common sense. If everything is owned by the state (socialism), you cannot give sacrificially I don't want everything to be owned by the state. If Christians didn't fail at following Jesus' teachings, then there would be no need for the government to step in with a safety net for the poor. Do you agree there needs to be a minimal safety net for the impoverished since Christianity is failing?

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Christian's generally do follow Christian principles in terms of generosity

Socialists, on the other hand, tend to be the greediest. They are always obsessed about what others have and always coming up with ways to steal it. Materialists have little respect for human life since it has little to no meaning.

---

In terms of following Christ's admonitions, they fall far short.

I'm not going to defend socialists, since that is a political philosophy that I don't adhere to. Most Christians I know are materialists. Especially clergy.

---

I'd say the key is what you use to define 'Christian'.

Jesus spoke to tens of thousands, but only a handful stayed with Him throughout His work on Earth. Many who would have said they liked Jesus and believed in Him, dispersed when asked to follow through in action. The Book of Revelation warns that there were churches even in the Apostolic Age which were false or lukewarm.

History shows countless popes, kings and emperors who claimed to be Christian but acted in selfish, sinful ways. And of course we are painfully aware of all the megachurches today which generate a lot of money but don't serve Christ in truth.


That said, there are - and have always been - individual churches and individual people who hear the Lord, love Him and obey. You have to look for them, because they don't boast on themselves, they tend to be smaller churches and Satan tries hard to hide them from discovery, since such people and congregations make many more believers.

You need to look for faith in action, and ignore the loud and arrogant.

---

I can agree a lot with what you said. There really isn't a clear cut definition of a "Christian". Christianity has evolved in diverse ways from the initial core group of followers.

I would add to your list excessive salaries to pastors of regular churches. It would seem to me, that if you believe you are called to the ministry, you would lead by example of not seeking 'earthly' treasure.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Far more than you, I'm quite sure.

Flat Earth fits within your denial of science. That's why so many of you QAon followers are Flat Earthers, vax deniers etc.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Quite a bit actually, and I'm sure far more than you Flat Earth boy.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Substantially more than you Flat Earth Boy. My guess is you didn't give anything.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Christian's generally do follow Christian principles in terms of generosity

Socialists, on the other hand, tend to be the greediest. They are always obsessed about what others have and always coming up with ways to steal it. Materialists have little respect for human life since it has little to no meaning.

---

In terms of following Christ's admonitions, they fall far short.

I'm not going to defend socialists, since that is a political philosophy that I don't adhere to. Most Christians I know are materialists. Especially clergy.

---

I'd say the key is what you use to define 'Christian'.

Jesus spoke to tens of thousands, but only a handful stayed with Him throughout His work on Earth. Many who would have said they liked Jesus and believed in Him, dispersed when asked to follow through in action. The Book of Revelation warns that there were churches even in the Apostolic Age which were false or lukewarm.

History shows countless popes, kings and emperors who claimed to be Christian but acted in selfish, sinful ways. And of course we are painfully aware of all the megachurches today which generate a lot of money but don't serve Christ in truth.


That said, there are - and have always been - individual churches and individual people who hear the Lord, love Him and obey. You have to look for them, because they don't boast on themselves, they tend to be smaller churches and Satan tries hard to hide them from discovery, since such people and congregations make many more believers.

You need to look for faith in action, and ignore the loud and arrogant.

---

I can agree a lot with what you said. There really isn't a clear cut definition of a "Christian". Christianity has evolved in diverse ways from the initial core group of followers.

I would add to your list excessive salaries to pastors of regular churches. It would seem to me, that if you believe you are called to the ministry, you would lead by example of not seeking 'earthly' treasure.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Far more than you, I'm quite sure.

Flat Earth fits within your denial of science. That's why so many of you QAon followers are Flat Earthers, vax deniers etc.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Quite a bit actually, and I'm sure far more than you Flat Earth boy.

---

Money you printed in crayon does not count. So you are back at zero, TS.

---

Is that the best you have DB?

---

I admit it's not my best work, yet it still notes that you are making claims on no evidence, more than a little against what authentic scientists do.

You wanna brag on your charity, then it's on you to prove it in amounts and where.

Some folks, just as an example, will toss off a hundy to a political cause and pretend it beats a couple K to the Salvation Army by the other guy.

Back up your claims, shut up, or brace for ridicule you deserve.

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Everyone falls short of Christ's commands, Christian's included. We are all still sinners.

Once again you miss the point: nothing in Christ's teachings advocate, promote, or condone socialism in any form. It's a tired old propaganda technique to misuse an authority you do not believe, God's word, to advocate something reprehensible to God's teachings and His morality.

---

I think you miss the point. The Gospels, including Paul's and John's teachings, are replete with instructions to give up your wealth, not to store treasure on earth, but in heaven. The early church practiced communal living.

It's convenient for today's Christians and preachers to ignore or gloss over what the NT really says about accumulating wealth. Clearly what the NT literally says couldn't be right, that would be too costly.

---

You are missing the point: Christ has commanded people to give of themselves. But this is to be done voluntarily, not from coercion. The government has no role in this. Allowing a govt to take over this responsibility is a cop out and trusting corrupt and incompetent politicians and bureaucrats to do what we as individuals should be doing. There is nothing compassionate or generous about it.
I agree to a point. There has to be a safety net or you'll have chaos. Clearly the Church or Christian's have failed to follow Jesus's teachings and example. Most professing Christians are unwilling to take up their "cross" and follow Jesus.

On the other hand, Christ never condemned the acquisition of wealth. He opposed the worship of money. This condemnation of greed and idolatry is a consistent theme throughout the Bible repeatedly. That's correct. He didn't advocate the accumulation of wealth either. The context of his supposed teachings was the opposite of accumulating wealth. Read Matthew 6. He didn't expect his followers to accumulate great wealth, but called for them to give to the needy M. 6:1-2, M 25:31-46, M 5:42, M 19:21

As a practical matter, socialism never works: it is always produced gross inefficiencies & tyranny, rewards poor choices, and harms the people supposedly intended as beneficiaries. Socialism is slavery. I agree. That doesn't excuse Christian failures to follow Jesus reported teachings.

---

---

The only "safety net" of consequence is private charity. The government messes up everything it touches and every government social program designed to help [fill in the blank] makes things worse for that group and everyone else. Most of them, if not all, are so fraudulent as to be dangerous and they are probably designed by the Leftists to be slush funds for them and their friends.

It's possible for someone to accumulate wealth while contributing greatly to society (many of the great industrialists of the past did this and quite a few today) and also giving huge sums to the poor and other worthy causes. This is also well documented historically and contemporaneously.

Everyone fails to follow Christ's teachings completely, even Christians. They are excellent aspirations, though, and the two are not incompatible. One need not be a pauper to follow that command. Also, it's easy for us to judge someone else's generosity without knowing the details of what they actually do. Again, historically and contemporaneously plenty of wealthy people have also been very generous with their money.

I'm not really sure what your point is. Do you expect every wealthy person to give away everything they own and become paupers? That is not realistic and I don't think Christ expects that. In scripture, he only told one person to do that: the rich young ruler who all but worshipped his wealth. It wasn't the great amount of his wealth, it was his putting it above everything else.

TexasScientist said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Everyone falls short of Christ's commands, Christian's included. We are all still sinners.

Once again you miss the point: nothing in Christ's teachings advocate, promote, or condone socialism in any form. It's a tired old propaganda technique to misuse an authority you do not believe, God's word, to advocate something reprehensible to God's teachings and His morality.

---

I think you miss the point. The Gospels, including Paul's and John's teachings, are replete with instructions to give up your wealth, not to store treasure on earth, but in heaven. The early church practiced communal living.

It's convenient for today's Christians and preachers to ignore or gloss over what the NT really says about accumulating wealth. Clearly what the NT literally says couldn't be right, that would be too costly.

---

First off, you're an atheist and you're absolutely pushing for socialism despite your denial. You're making foundational socialist claims. Nowhere have I said I'm for socialism. I'm not. What I'm pointing out is that most professing Christians ingnore what the NT states are the teachings of Jesus. They don't follow Christ. Jesus admonished to help the poor and needy. He didn't advocate accumlation of wealth, and essentially warned against it.

An atheist appealing to Jesus' teachings to push socialism is like someone who rejects the Constitution arguing policy based on "what the Founding Fathers really wanted". It's inherently inconsistent. Yet suddenly you want to use Christian authority to argue for your politics. If you reject the source, you don't get to use it as a moral cudgel. It's not about politics or socialism. It's about professing Christians being unwilling to follow Christ's reported teachings because it's too much for them to give up and follow him. Yet, they assert moral authority when they ignore and don't follow the basic teachings of Christ.

Christ's commands about wealth: give to the poor, sell possessions, store treasure in heaven, are moral commands to individuals and communities, not instructions for governments to seize and redistribute wealth. I don't advocate the government seizing and redistributing wealth. I do advocate for professing Christians to quit practicing pietism and hypocricy, and to follow Christ's admonitions of giving to the poor and needy.

Use some common sense. If everything is owned by the state (socialism), you cannot give sacrificially I don't want everything to be owned by the state. If Christians didn't fail at following Jesus' teachings, then there would be no need for the government to step in with a safety net for the poor. Do you agree there needs to be a minimal safety net for the impoverished since Christianity is failing?

---

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

Waco1947 said:

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4th and Inches said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

canoso said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

Another passage the Evangelicals will ignore because they can't justify their judgmental views of poverty.
Deuteronomy 15:7 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money.
8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need.
9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty.
107 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money. 8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need. 9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty. 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do.
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them. (The Distribution Part)
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them.

---

We need to see where in Scripture people were obligated (read "forced," as through taxation) to do these things. Ready, set, GO!

---

The Deut passage is from the mouth of God. It is a commandment by God, which is "forcing" you unless you don't believe in God's commandment, then take it up with God. Deut. 15: 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do. Taxation, or paying out of your pocket, does not matter. Give to the poor by taxation, or your local food pantry, or Habitat for Humanity. God does not care.
It's a silly canard always brought up by Conservative Christians. God says give to the poor whether personally or through taxation. It is simple: "Give to the poor happily."

---

God says give them what they need, it doesn't say give them all your money.. I did not say that and neither does the text.

---

---

So your good then if states don't allow the purchase of food from fast food restaurants using food stamp/EBT cards?

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

4th and Inches said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

canoso said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

Another passage the Evangelicals will ignore because they can't justify their judgmental views of poverty.
Deuteronomy 15:7 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money.
8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need.
9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty.
107 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money. 8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need. 9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty. 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do.
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them. (The Distribution Part)
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them.

---

We need to see where in Scripture people were obligated (read "forced," as through taxation) to do these things. Ready, set, GO!

---

The Deut passage is from the mouth of God. It is a commandment by God, which is "forcing" you unless you don't believe in God's commandment, then take it up with God. Deut. 15: 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do. Taxation, or paying out of your pocket, does not matter. Give to the poor by taxation, or your local food pantry, or Habitat for Humanity. God does not care.
It's a silly canard always brought up by Conservative Christians. God says give to the poor whether personally or through taxation. It is simple: "Give to the poor happily."

---

God says give them what they need, it doesn't say give them all your money.. I did not say that and neither does the text.

---

---

So your good then if states don't allow the purchase of food from fast food restaurants using food stamp/EBT cards?

---

An invalid assumption

GrowlTowel said:

---

---

And millions died.

Waco1947 said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

4th and Inches said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

canoso said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

Another passage the Evangelicals will ignore because they can't justify their judgmental views of poverty.
Deuteronomy 15:7 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money.
8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need.
9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty.
107 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money. 8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need. 9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty. 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do.
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them. (The Distribution Part)
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them.

---

We need to see where in Scripture people were obligated (read "forced," as through taxation) to do these things. Ready, set, GO!

---

The Deut passage is from the mouth of God. It is a commandment by God, which is "forcing" you unless you don't believe in God's commandment, then take it up with God. Deut. 15: 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do. Taxation, or paying out of your pocket, does not matter. Give to the poor by taxation, or your local food pantry, or Habitat for Humanity. God does not care.
It's a silly canard always brought up by Conservative Christians. God says give to the poor whether personally or through taxation. It is simple: "Give to the poor happily."

---

God says give them what they need, it doesn't say give them all your money.. I did not say that and neither does the text.

---

---

So your good then if states don't allow the purchase of food from fast food restaurants using food stamp/EBT cards?

---

An invalid assumption

---

Maybe the problem is in how you define "need".

"You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do."

Does the 350lb woman on disability need a BigMac.

Do those grandkids of hers need a happy meal?

Does the televangelist need a G-VI

Forest Bueller_bf said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

EatMoreSalmon said:

---

What's your scripture that says ignore the pool.

---

---

Job 31:1 since we are using the Old Testament.

NLT

"I made a covenant with my eyes not to look with lust at a young woman.

---

Why am I seeing something attributed to me in this post that I did not type?

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

4th and Inches said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

canoso said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

Another passage the Evangelicals will ignore because they can't justify their judgmental views of poverty.
Deuteronomy 15:7 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money.
8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need.
9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty.
107 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money. 8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need. 9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty. 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do.
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them. (The Distribution Part)
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them.

---

We need to see where in Scripture people were obligated (read "forced," as through taxation) to do these things. Ready, set, GO!

---

The Deut passage is from the mouth of God. It is a commandment by God, which is "forcing" you unless you don't believe in God's commandment, then take it up with God. Deut. 15: 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do. Taxation, or paying out of your pocket, does not matter. Give to the poor by taxation, or your local food pantry, or Habitat for Humanity. God does not care.
It's a silly canard always brought up by Conservative Christians. God says give to the poor whether personally or through taxation. It is simple: "Give to the poor happily."

---

God says give them what they need, it doesn't say give them all your money.. I did not say that and neither does the text.

---

---

So your good then if states don't allow the purchase of food from fast food restaurants using food stamp/EBT cards?

---

An invalid assumption

---

Maybe the problem is in how you define "need".

"You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do."

Does the 350lb woman on disability need a BigMac.Probably not. But it is a a great red herring.

Do those grandkids of hers need a happy meal? When I was hungry you gave someting to eat.

Does the televangelist need a G-VI Immaterial to our discussion of the poor.

---

God doesn't make those distinctions. "When I was hungry, you gave me something to eat."

EatMoreSalmon said:

---

Forest Bueller_bf said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

EatMoreSalmon said:

---

What's your scripture that says ignore the pool.

---

---

Job 31:1 since we are using the Old Testament.

NLT

"I made a covenant with my eyes not to look with lust at a young woman.

---

Why am I seeing something attributed to me in this post that I did not type?

---

Interesting? I was copying something that 47 had missspelled in his post.

I will get rid of it. Sorry.

Forest Bueller_bf said:

---

EatMoreSalmon said:

---

Forest Bueller_bf said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

EatMoreSalmon said:

---

What's your scripture that says ignore the pool.

---

---

Job 31:1 since we are using the Old Testament.

NLT

"I made a covenant with my eyes not to look with lust at a young woman.

---

Why am I seeing something attributed to me in this post that I did not type?

---

Interesting? I was copying something that 47 had missspelled in his post.

I will get rid of it. Sorry.

---

No problem. Thanks.

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Christian's generally do follow Christian principles in terms of generosity

Socialists, on the other hand, tend to be the greediest. They are always obsessed about what others have and always coming up with ways to steal it. Materialists have little respect for human life since it has little to no meaning.

---

In terms of following Christ's admonitions, they fall far short.

I'm not going to defend socialists, since that is a political philosophy that I don't adhere to. Most Christians I know are materialists. Especially clergy.

---

I'd say the key is what you use to define 'Christian'.

Jesus spoke to tens of thousands, but only a handful stayed with Him throughout His work on Earth. Many who would have said they liked Jesus and believed in Him, dispersed when asked to follow through in action. The Book of Revelation warns that there were churches even in the Apostolic Age which were false or lukewarm.

History shows countless popes, kings and emperors who claimed to be Christian but acted in selfish, sinful ways. And of course we are painfully aware of all the megachurches today which generate a lot of money but don't serve Christ in truth.


That said, there are - and have always been - individual churches and individual people who hear the Lord, love Him and obey. You have to look for them, because they don't boast on themselves, they tend to be smaller churches and Satan tries hard to hide them from discovery, since such people and congregations make many more believers.

You need to look for faith in action, and ignore the loud and arrogant.

---

I can agree a lot with what you said. There really isn't a clear cut definition of a "Christian". Christianity has evolved in diverse ways from the initial core group of followers.

I would add to your list excessive salaries to pastors of regular churches. It would seem to me, that if you believe you are called to the ministry, you would lead by example of not seeking 'earthly' treasure.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Far more than you, I'm quite sure.

Flat Earth fits within your denial of science. That's why so many of you QAon followers are Flat Earthers, vax deniers etc.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Quite a bit actually, and I'm sure far more than you Flat Earth boy.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Substantially more than you Flat Earth Boy. My guess is you didn't give anything.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

More than you Flat Earth Boy.

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Everyone falls short of Christ's commands, Christian's included. We are all still sinners.

Once again you miss the point: nothing in Christ's teachings advocate, promote, or condone socialism in any form. It's a tired old propaganda technique to misuse an authority you do not believe, God's word, to advocate something reprehensible to God's teachings and His morality.

---

I think you miss the point. The Gospels, including Paul's and John's teachings, are replete with instructions to give up your wealth, not to store treasure on earth, but in heaven. The early church practiced communal living.

It's convenient for today's Christians and preachers to ignore or gloss over what the NT really says about accumulating wealth. Clearly what the NT literally says couldn't be right, that would be too costly.

---

First off, you're an atheist and you're absolutely pushing for socialism despite your denial. You're making foundational socialist claims. Nowhere have I said I'm for socialism. I'm not. What I'm pointing out is that most professing Christians ingnore what the NT states are the teachings of Jesus. They don't follow Christ. Jesus admonished to help the poor and needy. He didn't advocate accumlation of wealth, and essentially warned against it.

An atheist appealing to Jesus' teachings to push socialism is like someone who rejects the Constitution arguing policy based on "what the Founding Fathers really wanted". It's inherently inconsistent. Yet suddenly you want to use Christian authority to argue for your politics. If you reject the source, you don't get to use it as a moral cudgel. It's not about politics or socialism. It's about professing Christians being unwilling to follow Christ's reported teachings because it's too much for them to give up and follow him. Yet, they assert moral authority when they ignore and don't follow the basic teachings of Christ.

Christ's commands about wealth: give to the poor, sell possessions, store treasure in heaven, are moral commands to individuals and communities, not instructions for governments to seize and redistribute wealth. I don't advocate the government seizing and redistributing wealth. I do advocate for professing Christians to quit practicing pietism and hypocricy, and to follow Christ's admonitions of giving to the poor and needy.

Use some common sense. If everything is owned by the state (socialism), you cannot give sacrificially I don't want everything to be owned by the state. If Christians didn't fail at following Jesus' teachings, then there would be no need for the government to step in with a safety net for the poor. Do you agree there needs to be a minimal safety net for the impoverished since Christianity is failing?

---

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

I sure you didn't give anything, so my donations exponentially exceed yours.

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Christian's generally do follow Christian principles in terms of generosity

Socialists, on the other hand, tend to be the greediest. They are always obsessed about what others have and always coming up with ways to steal it. Materialists have little respect for human life since it has little to no meaning.

---

In terms of following Christ's admonitions, they fall far short.

I'm not going to defend socialists, since that is a political philosophy that I don't adhere to. Most Christians I know are materialists. Especially clergy.

---

I'd say the key is what you use to define 'Christian'.

Jesus spoke to tens of thousands, but only a handful stayed with Him throughout His work on Earth. Many who would have said they liked Jesus and believed in Him, dispersed when asked to follow through in action. The Book of Revelation warns that there were churches even in the Apostolic Age which were false or lukewarm.

History shows countless popes, kings and emperors who claimed to be Christian but acted in selfish, sinful ways. And of course we are painfully aware of all the megachurches today which generate a lot of money but don't serve Christ in truth.


That said, there are - and have always been - individual churches and individual people who hear the Lord, love Him and obey. You have to look for them, because they don't boast on themselves, they tend to be smaller churches and Satan tries hard to hide them from discovery, since such people and congregations make many more believers.

You need to look for faith in action, and ignore the loud and arrogant.

---

I can agree a lot with what you said. There really isn't a clear cut definition of a "Christian". Christianity has evolved in diverse ways from the initial core group of followers.

I would add to your list excessive salaries to pastors of regular churches. It would seem to me, that if you believe you are called to the ministry, you would lead by example of not seeking 'earthly' treasure.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Far more than you, I'm quite sure.

Flat Earth fits within your denial of science. That's why so many of you QAon followers are Flat Earthers, vax deniers etc.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Quite a bit actually, and I'm sure far more than you Flat Earth boy.

---

Money you printed in crayon does not count. So you are back at zero, TS.

---

Is that the best you have DB?

---

I admit it's not my best work, yet it still notes that you are making claims on no evidence, more than a little against what authentic scientists do.

You wanna brag on your charity, then it's on you to prove it in amounts and where.

Some folks, just as an example, will toss off a hundy to a political cause and pretend it beats a couple K to the Salvation Army by the other guy.

Back up your claims, shut up, or brace for ridicule you deserve.

---

I'll be happy to share my donations right after you. Y'all are the ones who started down this path. Post your amounts.

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Christian's generally do follow Christian principles in terms of generosity

Socialists, on the other hand, tend to be the greediest. They are always obsessed about what others have and always coming up with ways to steal it. Materialists have little respect for human life since it has little to no meaning.

---

In terms of following Christ's admonitions, they fall far short.

I'm not going to defend socialists, since that is a political philosophy that I don't adhere to. Most Christians I know are materialists. Especially clergy.

---

I'd say the key is what you use to define 'Christian'.

Jesus spoke to tens of thousands, but only a handful stayed with Him throughout His work on Earth. Many who would have said they liked Jesus and believed in Him, dispersed when asked to follow through in action. The Book of Revelation warns that there were churches even in the Apostolic Age which were false or lukewarm.

History shows countless popes, kings and emperors who claimed to be Christian but acted in selfish, sinful ways. And of course we are painfully aware of all the megachurches today which generate a lot of money but don't serve Christ in truth.


That said, there are - and have always been - individual churches and individual people who hear the Lord, love Him and obey. You have to look for them, because they don't boast on themselves, they tend to be smaller churches and Satan tries hard to hide them from discovery, since such people and congregations make many more believers.

You need to look for faith in action, and ignore the loud and arrogant.

---

I can agree a lot with what you said. There really isn't a clear cut definition of a "Christian". Christianity has evolved in diverse ways from the initial core group of followers.

I would add to your list excessive salaries to pastors of regular churches. It would seem to me, that if you believe you are called to the ministry, you would lead by example of not seeking 'earthly' treasure.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Far more than you, I'm quite sure.

Flat Earth fits within your denial of science. That's why so many of you QAon followers are Flat Earthers, vax deniers etc.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Quite a bit actually, and I'm sure far more than you Flat Earth boy.

---

Money you printed in crayon does not count. So you are back at zero, TS.

---

Is that the best you have DB?

---

I admit it's not my best work, yet it still notes that you are making claims on no evidence, more than a little against what authentic scientists do.

You wanna brag on your charity, then it's on you to prove it in amounts and where.

Some folks, just as an example, will toss off a hundy to a political cause and pretend it beats a couple K to the Salvation Army by the other guy.

Back up your claims, shut up, or brace for ridicule you deserve.

---

I'll be happy to share my donations right after you. Y'all are the ones who started down this path. Post your amounts.

---

You are wrong yet again, FakeScientist. I never brought up charity, just called you on your brags. You, ever consistent, ran away and reverted to your inner second-grader when called to support your claims.

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Christian's generally do follow Christian principles in terms of generosity

Socialists, on the other hand, tend to be the greediest. They are always obsessed about what others have and always coming up with ways to steal it. Materialists have little respect for human life since it has little to no meaning.

---

In terms of following Christ's admonitions, they fall far short.

I'm not going to defend socialists, since that is a political philosophy that I don't adhere to. Most Christians I know are materialists. Especially clergy.

---

I'd say the key is what you use to define 'Christian'.

Jesus spoke to tens of thousands, but only a handful stayed with Him throughout His work on Earth. Many who would have said they liked Jesus and believed in Him, dispersed when asked to follow through in action. The Book of Revelation warns that there were churches even in the Apostolic Age which were false or lukewarm.

History shows countless popes, kings and emperors who claimed to be Christian but acted in selfish, sinful ways. And of course we are painfully aware of all the megachurches today which generate a lot of money but don't serve Christ in truth.


That said, there are - and have always been - individual churches and individual people who hear the Lord, love Him and obey. You have to look for them, because they don't boast on themselves, they tend to be smaller churches and Satan tries hard to hide them from discovery, since such people and congregations make many more believers.

You need to look for faith in action, and ignore the loud and arrogant.

---

I can agree a lot with what you said. There really isn't a clear cut definition of a "Christian". Christianity has evolved in diverse ways from the initial core group of followers.

I would add to your list excessive salaries to pastors of regular churches. It would seem to me, that if you believe you are called to the ministry, you would lead by example of not seeking 'earthly' treasure.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Far more than you, I'm quite sure.

Flat Earth fits within your denial of science. That's why so many of you QAon followers are Flat Earthers, vax deniers etc.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Quite a bit actually, and I'm sure far more than you Flat Earth boy.

---

Money you printed in crayon does not count. So you are back at zero, TS.

---

Is that the best you have DB?

---

I admit it's not my best work, yet it still notes that you are making claims on no evidence, more than a little against what authentic scientists do.

You wanna brag on your charity, then it's on you to prove it in amounts and where.

Some folks, just as an example, will toss off a hundy to a political cause and pretend it beats a couple K to the Salvation Army by the other guy.

Back up your claims, shut up, or brace for ridicule you deserve.

---

I'll be happy to share my donations right after you. Y'all are the ones who started down this path. Post your amounts.

---

You are wrong yet again, FakeScientist. I never brought up charity, just called you on your brags. You, ever consistent, ran away and reverted to your inner second-grader when called to support your claims.

---

Dotage Bear, you're distancing from your sole mate HB?

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Christian's generally do follow Christian principles in terms of generosity

Socialists, on the other hand, tend to be the greediest. They are always obsessed about what others have and always coming up with ways to steal it. Materialists have little respect for human life since it has little to no meaning.

---

In terms of following Christ's admonitions, they fall far short.

I'm not going to defend socialists, since that is a political philosophy that I don't adhere to. Most Christians I know are materialists. Especially clergy.

---

I'd say the key is what you use to define 'Christian'.

Jesus spoke to tens of thousands, but only a handful stayed with Him throughout His work on Earth. Many who would have said they liked Jesus and believed in Him, dispersed when asked to follow through in action. The Book of Revelation warns that there were churches even in the Apostolic Age which were false or lukewarm.

History shows countless popes, kings and emperors who claimed to be Christian but acted in selfish, sinful ways. And of course we are painfully aware of all the megachurches today which generate a lot of money but don't serve Christ in truth.


That said, there are - and have always been - individual churches and individual people who hear the Lord, love Him and obey. You have to look for them, because they don't boast on themselves, they tend to be smaller churches and Satan tries hard to hide them from discovery, since such people and congregations make many more believers.

You need to look for faith in action, and ignore the loud and arrogant.

---

I can agree a lot with what you said. There really isn't a clear cut definition of a "Christian". Christianity has evolved in diverse ways from the initial core group of followers.

I would add to your list excessive salaries to pastors of regular churches. It would seem to me, that if you believe you are called to the ministry, you would lead by example of not seeking 'earthly' treasure.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Far more than you, I'm quite sure.

Flat Earth fits within your denial of science. That's why so many of you QAon followers are Flat Earthers, vax deniers etc.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Quite a bit actually, and I'm sure far more than you Flat Earth boy.

---

Money you printed in crayon does not count. So you are back at zero, TS.

---

Is that the best you have DB?

---

I admit it's not my best work, yet it still notes that you are making claims on no evidence, more than a little against what authentic scientists do.

You wanna brag on your charity, then it's on you to prove it in amounts and where.

Some folks, just as an example, will toss off a hundy to a political cause and pretend it beats a couple K to the Salvation Army by the other guy.

Back up your claims, shut up, or brace for ridicule you deserve.

---

I'll be happy to share my donations right after you. Y'all are the ones who started down this path. Post your amounts.

---

You are wrong yet again, FakeScientist. I never brought up charity, just called you on your brags. You, ever consistent, ran away and reverted to your inner second-grader when called to support your claims.

---

Dotage Bear, you're distancing from your sole mate HB?

---

So you're doubling down on 'second-grader'. Good luck with that!

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Christian's generally do follow Christian principles in terms of generosity

Socialists, on the other hand, tend to be the greediest. They are always obsessed about what others have and always coming up with ways to steal it. Materialists have little respect for human life since it has little to no meaning.

---

In terms of following Christ's admonitions, they fall far short.

I'm not going to defend socialists, since that is a political philosophy that I don't adhere to. Most Christians I know are materialists. Especially clergy.

---

I'd say the key is what you use to define 'Christian'.

Jesus spoke to tens of thousands, but only a handful stayed with Him throughout His work on Earth. Many who would have said they liked Jesus and believed in Him, dispersed when asked to follow through in action. The Book of Revelation warns that there were churches even in the Apostolic Age which were false or lukewarm.

History shows countless popes, kings and emperors who claimed to be Christian but acted in selfish, sinful ways. And of course we are painfully aware of all the megachurches today which generate a lot of money but don't serve Christ in truth.


That said, there are - and have always been - individual churches and individual people who hear the Lord, love Him and obey. You have to look for them, because they don't boast on themselves, they tend to be smaller churches and Satan tries hard to hide them from discovery, since such people and congregations make many more believers.

You need to look for faith in action, and ignore the loud and arrogant.

---

I can agree a lot with what you said. There really isn't a clear cut definition of a "Christian". Christianity has evolved in diverse ways from the initial core group of followers.

I would add to your list excessive salaries to pastors of regular churches. It would seem to me, that if you believe you are called to the ministry, you would lead by example of not seeking 'earthly' treasure.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Far more than you, I'm quite sure.

Flat Earth fits within your denial of science. That's why so many of you QAon followers are Flat Earthers, vax deniers etc.

---

How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

---

Quite a bit actually, and I'm sure far more than you Flat Earth boy.

---

Money you printed in crayon does not count. So you are back at zero, TS.

---

Is that the best you have DB?

---

I admit it's not my best work, yet it still notes that you are making claims on no evidence, more than a little against what authentic scientists do.

You wanna brag on your charity, then it's on you to prove it in amounts and where.

Some folks, just as an example, will toss off a hundy to a political cause and pretend it beats a couple K to the Salvation Army by the other guy.

Back up your claims, shut up, or brace for ridicule you deserve.

---

I'll be happy to share my donations right after you. Y'all are the ones who started down this path. Post your amounts.

---

You are wrong yet again, FakeScientist. I never brought up charity, just called you on your brags. You, ever consistent, ran away and reverted to your inner second-grader when called to support your claims.

---

Dotage Bear, you're distancing from your sole mate HB?

---

So you're doubling down on 'second-grader'. Good luck with that!

---

I'll leave grade school to you.

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

historian said:

---

Christian's generally do follow Christian principles in terms of generosity

Socialists, on the other hand, tend to be the greediest. They are always obsessed about what others have and always coming up with ways to steal it. Materialists have little respect for human life since it has little to no meaning.

---

In terms of following Christ's admonitions, they fall far short.

I'm not going to defend socialists, since that is a political philosophy that I don't adhere to. Most Christians I know are materialists. Especially clergy.

---

I'd say the key is what you use to define 'Christian'.

Jesus spoke to tens of thousands, but only a handful stayed with Him throughout His work on Earth. Many who would have said they liked Jesus and believed in Him, dispersed when asked to follow through in action. The Book of Revelation warns that there were churches even in the Apostolic Age which were false or lukewarm.

History shows countless popes, kings and emperors who claimed to be Christian but acted in selfish, sinful ways. And of course we are painfully aware of all the megachurches today which generate a lot of money but don't serve Christ in truth.


That said, there are - and have always been - individual churches and individual people who hear the Lord, love Him and obey. You have to look for them, because they don't boast on themselves, they tend to be smaller churches and Satan tries hard to hide them from discovery, since such people and congregations make many more believers.

You need to look for faith in action, and ignore the loud and arrogant.

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I can agree a lot with what you said. There really isn't a clear cut definition of a "Christian". Christianity has evolved in diverse ways from the initial core group of followers.

I would add to your list excessive salaries to pastors of regular churches. It would seem to me, that if you believe you are called to the ministry, you would lead by example of not seeking 'earthly' treasure.

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How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

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Far more than you, I'm quite sure.

Flat Earth fits within your denial of science. That's why so many of you QAon followers are Flat Earthers, vax deniers etc.

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How much did you donate the charity this year Flat Earth?

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Quite a bit actually, and I'm sure far more than you Flat Earth boy.

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Money you printed in crayon does not count. So you are back at zero, TS.

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Is that the best you have DB?

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I admit it's not my best work, yet it still notes that you are making claims on no evidence, more than a little against what authentic scientists do.

You wanna brag on your charity, then it's on you to prove it in amounts and where.

Some folks, just as an example, will toss off a hundy to a political cause and pretend it beats a couple K to the Salvation Army by the other guy.

Back up your claims, shut up, or brace for ridicule you deserve.

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I'll be happy to share my donations right after you. Y'all are the ones who started down this path. Post your amounts.

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You are wrong yet again, FakeScientist. I never brought up charity, just called you on your brags. You, ever consistent, ran away and reverted to your inner second-grader when called to support your claims.

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Dotage Bear, you're distancing from your sole mate HB?

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So you're doubling down on 'second-grader'. Good luck with that!

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I'll leave grade school to you.

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I left grade school before you were born. Hope you graduate!

Waco1947 said:

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LIB,MR BEARS said:

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Waco1947 said:

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LIB,MR BEARS said:

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Waco1947 said:

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4th and Inches said:

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Waco1947 said:

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canoso said:

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Waco1947 said:

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Another passage the Evangelicals will ignore because they can't justify their judgmental views of poverty.
Deuteronomy 15:7 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money.
8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need.
9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty.
107 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money. 8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need. 9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty. 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do.
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them. (The Distribution Part)
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them.

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We need to see where in Scripture people were obligated (read "forced," as through taxation) to do these things. Ready, set, GO!

---

The Deut passage is from the mouth of God. It is a commandment by God, which is "forcing" you unless you don't believe in God's commandment, then take it up with God. Deut. 15: 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do. Taxation, or paying out of your pocket, does not matter. Give to the poor by taxation, or your local food pantry, or Habitat for Humanity. God does not care.
It's a silly canard always brought up by Conservative Christians. God says give to the poor whether personally or through taxation. It is simple: "Give to the poor happily."

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God says give them what they need, it doesn't say give them all your money.. I did not say that and neither does the text.

---

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So your good then if states don't allow the purchase of food from fast food restaurants using food stamp/EBT cards?

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An invalid assumption

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Maybe the problem is in how you define "need".

"You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do."

Does the 350lb woman on disability need a BigMac.Probably not. But it is a a great red herring.

Do those grandkids of hers need a happy meal? When I was hungry you gave someting to eat.

Does the televangelist need a G-VI Immaterial to our discussion of the poor.

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God doesn't make those distinctions. "When I was hungry, you gave me something to eat."

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Jesus did say "you", not "the government". Relying on the government to fulfill your obligations to the poor or anyone else is a cop out. Jesus also said something about visiting people in prison. The warden and guards do not absolve anyone of that responsibility. The same is true even for clothing people, visiting the sick, etc.

Nothing in scripture promoted socialism. The opposite is true. Socialism is evil.

So here's the real question: Does socialism create cheerful givers?

Oh, and another thing. Is socialism the gospel, or "another gospel," aka "anathema"?

Asking fruitful questions is way more important than giving right answers to sterile questions.

historian said:

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Waco1947 said:

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LIB,MR BEARS said:

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Waco1947 said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

4th and Inches said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

canoso said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

Another passage the Evangelicals will ignore because they can't justify their judgmental views of poverty.
Deuteronomy 15:7 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money.
8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need.
9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty.
107 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money. 8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need. 9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty. 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do.
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them. (The Distribution Part)
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them.

---

We need to see where in Scripture people were obligated (read "forced," as through taxation) to do these things. Ready, set, GO!

---

The Deut passage is from the mouth of God. It is a commandment by God, which is "forcing" you unless you don't believe in God's commandment, then take it up with God. Deut. 15: 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do. Taxation, or paying out of your pocket, does not matter. Give to the poor by taxation, or your local food pantry, or Habitat for Humanity. God does not care.
It's a silly canard always brought up by Conservative Christians. God says give to the poor whether personally or through taxation. It is simple: "Give to the poor happily."

---

God says give them what they need, it doesn't say give them all your money.. I did not say that and neither does the text.

---

---

So your good then if states don't allow the purchase of food from fast food restaurants using food stamp/EBT cards?

---

An invalid assumption

---

Maybe the problem is in how you define "need".

"You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do."

Does the 350lb woman on disability need a BigMac.Probably not. But it is a a great red herring.

Do those grandkids of hers need a happy meal? When I was hungry you gave someting to eat.

Does the televangelist need a G-VI Immaterial to our discussion of the poor.

---

God doesn't make those distinctions. "When I was hungry, you gave me something to eat."

---

Jesus did say "you", not "the government". Relying on the government to fulfill your obligations to the poor or anyone else is a cop out. Jesus also said something about visiting people in prison. The warden and guards do not absolve anyone of that responsibility. The same is true even for clothing people, visiting the sick, etc.

Nothing in scripture promoted socialism. The opposite is true. Socialism is evil.

---

The community was responsible for the widow and the orphan (see Paul). You are so mean-spirited and miserly, Scrooge.

canoso said:

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So here's the real question: Does socialism create cheerful givers?

Oh, and another thing. Is socialism the gospel, or "another gospel," aka "anathema"?

Asking fruitful questions is way more important than giving right answers to sterile questions.

---

So what are your answers?

Waco1947 said:

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historian said:

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Waco1947 said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

4th and Inches said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

canoso said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

Another passage the Evangelicals will ignore because they can't justify their judgmental views of poverty.
Deuteronomy 15:7 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money.
8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need.
9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty.
107 After the Lord your God gives land to each of you, there may be poor Israelites in the town where you live. If there are, then don't be mean and selfish with your money. 8 Instead, be kind and lend them what they need. 9 Be careful! Don't say to yourself, "Soon it will be the seventh year, and then I won't be able to get my money back." It would be horrible for you to think that way and to be so selfish that you refuse to help the poor. They are your relatives, and if you don't help them, they may ask the Lord to decide whether you have done wrong. And he will say that you are guilty. 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do.
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them. (The Distribution Part)
11 There will always be some Israelites who are poor and needy. That's why I am commanding you to be generous with them.

---

We need to see where in Scripture people were obligated (read "forced," as through taxation) to do these things. Ready, set, GO!

---

The Deut passage is from the mouth of God. It is a commandment by God, which is "forcing" you unless you don't believe in God's commandment, then take it up with God. Deut. 15: 10 You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do. Taxation, or paying out of your pocket, does not matter. Give to the poor by taxation, or your local food pantry, or Habitat for Humanity. God does not care.
It's a silly canard always brought up by Conservative Christians. God says give to the poor whether personally or through taxation. It is simple: "Give to the poor happily."

---

God says give them what they need, it doesn't say give them all your money.. I did not say that and neither does the text.

---

---

So your good then if states don't allow the purchase of food from fast food restaurants using food stamp/EBT cards?

---

An invalid assumption

---

Maybe the problem is in how you define "need".

"You should be happy to give the poor what they need, because then the Lord will make you successful in everything you do."

Does the 350lb woman on disability need a BigMac.Probably not. But it is a a great red herring.

Do those grandkids of hers need a happy meal? When I was hungry you gave someting to eat.

Does the televangelist need a G-VI Immaterial to our discussion of the poor.

---

God doesn't make those distinctions. "When I was hungry, you gave me something to eat."

---

Jesus did say "you", not "the government". Relying on the government to fulfill your obligations to the poor or anyone else is a cop out. Jesus also said something about visiting people in prison. The warden and guards do not absolve anyone of that responsibility. The same is true even for clothing people, visiting the sick, etc.

Nothing in scripture promoted socialism. The opposite is true. Socialism is evil.

---

You are so mean-spirited and miserly, Scrooge.

---

Always the hypocrite.

You take much and give exceedingly little.