Thoughts?

Will Viola Davis play George Washington?

Harrison Bergeron said:

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Will Viola Davis play George Washington?

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Speaking of voices I liked Paul Giamatti as John Adams

Since I had already liked him (gotten used to him) in the role of Adams in the HBO mini-series show.

Harrison Bergeron said:

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Will Viola Davis play George Washington?

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Oprah Winfrey.

BellCountyBear said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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Will Viola Davis play George Washington?

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Oprah Winfrey.

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I all seriousness ... I am sure every episode will focus on the blek soldiers and slaves and claim the entire reason for the Revolution was to oppress the bleks ... it would be like crediting all Mooslum innovation to the Janissaries.

I took two wonderful semesters of American history with Dr. Armitstead. No book or movie will surpass his inspiration.

Harrison Bergeron said:

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BellCountyBear said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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Will Viola Davis play George Washington?

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Oprah Winfrey.

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I all seriousness ... I am sure every episode will focus on the blek soldiers and slaves and claim the entire reason for the Revolution was to oppress the bleks ... it would be like crediting all Mooslum innovation to the Janissaries.

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Well God forgive me but I sure do enjoy Ken Burns story telling. Which we have to realize it's not history Ken is teaching it's story telling with a historical backdrop and overarching theme.

And in fact every episode has so far had a strong slavery component (for good or bad).

Philip J. Deloria does also voiced out loud in episode one that the desire of White colonists for Indians lands beyond the Appalachian mountains (and the refusal of the British authorities to allow that movement into the Ohio valley country) is to him the main driving cause of the American revolution.

That goes of course unchallenged by any of the other historians Ken Burns has decided to promote.

Interesting….

Vietnam was well done. This not so much

Redbrickbear said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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BellCountyBear said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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"Will Viola Davis play George Washington?

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Oprah Winfrey.

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I all seriousness ... I am sure every episode will focus on the blek soldiers and slaves and claim the entire reason for the Revolution was to oppress the bleks ... it would be like crediting all Mooslum innovation to the Janissaries.

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Well God forgive me but I sure do enjoy Ken Burns story telling. Which we have to realize it's not history Ken is teaching it's story telling with a historical backdrop and overarching theme.

And in fact every episode has so far had a strong slavery component (for good or bad).

Philip J. Deloria does also voiced out loud in episode one that the desire of White colonists for Indians lands beyond the Appalachian mountains (and the refusal of the British authorities to allow that movement into the Ohio valley country) is to him the main driving cause of the American revolution.

That goes of course unchallenged by any of the other historians Ken Burns has decided to promote.

Interesting….

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Since the overdose of Saint George Floyd we have to pretend that everything in America and Texas revolved around slavery and bleks secretly are responsible for everything good in 'Murica but were silenced by whitey.

Not surprising on the "historians." The Academy loves diversity as long as it is not of thought.

I'm enjoying it

Redbrickbear said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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BellCountyBear said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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Will Viola Davis play George Washington?

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Oprah Winfrey.

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I all seriousness ... I am sure every episode will focus on the blek soldiers and slaves and claim the entire reason for the Revolution was to oppress the bleks ... it would be like crediting all Mooslum innovation to the Janissaries.

---

Well God forgive me but I sure do enjoy Ken Burns story telling. Which we have to realize it's not history Ken is teaching it's story telling with a historical backdrop and overarching theme.

And in fact every episode has so far had a strong slavery component (for good or bad).

Philip J. Deloria does also voiced out loud in episode one that the desire of White colonists for Indians lands beyond the Appalachian mountains (and the refusal of the British authorities to allow that movement into the Ohio valley country) is to him the main driving cause of the American revolution.

That goes of course unchallenged by any of the other historians Ken Burns has decided to promote.

Interesting….

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it's an interesting take on the prohibition of immigration into the Ohio Valley as a cause of the revolution. I had not heard that before; it's an novel take

Osodecentx said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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BellCountyBear said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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Will Viola Davis play George Washington?

---

Oprah Winfrey.

---

I all seriousness ... I am sure every episode will focus on the blek soldiers and slaves and claim the entire reason for the Revolution was to oppress the bleks ... it would be like crediting all Mooslum innovation to the Janissaries.

---

Well God forgive me but I sure do enjoy Ken Burns story telling. Which we have to realize it's not history Ken is teaching it's story telling with a historical backdrop and overarching theme.

And in fact every episode has so far had a strong slavery component (for good or bad).

Philip J. Deloria does also voiced out loud in episode one that the desire of White colonists for Indians lands beyond the Appalachian mountains (and the refusal of the British authorities to allow that movement into the Ohio valley country) is to him the main driving cause of the American revolution.

That goes of course unchallenged by any of the other historians Ken Burns has decided to promote.

Interesting….

---

it's an interesting take on the prohibition of immigration into the Ohio Valley as a cause of the revolution. I had not heard that before; it's an novel take

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A few observations (I'm through episode 3 so far):

1. Episode 1 gave some good insight on why the British set up their ill-advised tax schemes on the colonies. The government and the East India Company were badly in debt, and they had pretty much maxed out on taxing the locals in Britain. Fateful consequences to think that the colonies were an easy source of new tax revenue.

2. Apparently the British prohibited settlements west of the Appalachians to avoid provoking the Indians (having fresh memories of the Indians siding with the French in the French & Indian War 1756-63), which directly conflicted with more and more colonists moving in and wanting more and more fresh land on which to start a new life. Prohibition on settlements may not necessarily start a war, but it easily swayed the colonists into favoring independence (as an aside, this somewhat comports with what I know of my family genealogy: most of my ancestors were in VA and NC before and during the Revolution, but most moved to TN and KY by the end of the 18th Century).

3. For a people with no written language and little interaction with other cultures, there have been a lot of very specific quotes from Indians. Curious as to the source where these may have come from.

4. Anyone of that era who may have had an unpleasant encounter with Indians would likely have no qualms at continuing to move them out of the picture. A bit surprised that Episode 3 went into as much detail about the tribe whose leader insisted on attacking white settlers, even at the insistence of other tribal leaders to avoid doing so. And soon thereafter he FAFO'd big time.

5. The obligatory 10 minutes per hour about slavery, complete with commentary from the young historian with a scowl who looks like Hakeem Jeffries without his sombrero, and the older historian with the straggly silver dreadlocks, and the other female ones. Included was a totally unnecessary detour into a thwarted slave rebellion in Jamaica going on at the same time.

6. It's done a good job so far of setting a background that may explain Benedict Arnold's later turncoat actions.

7. British General Howe several times had Washington nearly cornered and backed off or quit pursuing him. One of those "what if" moments in tactical military history.

Ken Burns skill really comes out on the battles and the stories around them.

In Episode 4, He talks about the Battle of Bennington (in new York)....800 British Regulars, Germans, Loyalists, and Iroquois under Lt. Gen. Friedrich Baum (Brunswick German commander)...they move into the town essentially looking for food since they are running out of supplies during Gen. John Burgoyne's campaign to try and take Albany.

They run into close to 2,000 Patriots and a fierce battle takes place.

Lt. Gen.Baum is killed and his regulars and German troops get over run on one side of the battlefield. Loyalist John Peters and his Canadians (French- Quebecers), loyalist Americans, and Iroquois hold out on a defensive position.

Gen. John Stark and the Patriot Americans keep coming.

During the fighting loyalist Col. John Peters sees a man shooting at him...as the man comes up on him and yells out:

"Peters you damn tory, I've got you!"

He saw that it was a Patriot Captain named Jeremiah Post. A old school friend and childhood playmate...and a cousin of Peters own wife (actual kinfolk of his)

The man rushes on Peters and bayonet's him in the left part of Peter's chest (but the blade is turned by the bones in his chest)...Peters looks him in the face and thinks..."though his blade was in my body I felt regret at having to destroy him". Peters then kills him

https://www.pbs.org/video/the-american-revolution-episode-4-conquer-by-a-drawn-game/

minute 45 mark

Ken knowns how to tell a story and really comes through on the battles. He makes you feel them.

Osodecentx said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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BellCountyBear said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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Will Viola Davis play George Washington?

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Oprah Winfrey.

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I all seriousness ... I am sure every episode will focus on the blek soldiers and slaves and claim the entire reason for the Revolution was to oppress the bleks ... it would be like crediting all Mooslum innovation to the Janissaries.

---

Well God forgive me but I sure do enjoy Ken Burns story telling. Which we have to realize it's not history Ken is teaching it's story telling with a historical backdrop and overarching theme.

And in fact every episode has so far had a strong slavery component (for good or bad).

Philip J. Deloria does also voiced out loud in episode one that the desire of White colonists for Indians lands beyond the Appalachian mountains (and the refusal of the British authorities to allow that movement into the Ohio valley country) is to him the main driving cause of the American revolution.

That goes of course unchallenged by any of the other historians Ken Burns has decided to promote.

Interesting….

---

it's an interesting take on the prohibition of immigration into the Ohio Valley as a cause of the revolution. I had not heard that before; it's an novel take

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Its got some legs and must be listed....it was one reason for the revolution and the general estrangement of the Colonists with Britain

But its really out there to say....as that professor did...that he thinks its "the cause of the American revolution"

Its probably not even a top 15 grievance

Redbrickbear said:

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Thoughts?

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Heard interview on CSPAN on the research. Is this on yet? I wanted to watch it.

FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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Thoughts?

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Heard interview on CSPAN on the research. Is this on yet? I wanted to watch it.

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Yep

Its on PBS now

https://www.pbs.org/kenburns/the-american-revolution

Observation on episode 4 of Burns docu on American Revolution.

Benjamin Franklin - at the age of 70 - was sent to France to ask for help against Britain in 1777. The French were reserved, wanted news of success.

Franklin was worried thought about it. But how did he think? He…

— FischerKing (@FischerKing64) November 21, 2025

Redbrickbear said:

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Observation on episode 4 of Burns docu on American Revolution.

Benjamin Franklin - at the age of 70 - was sent to France to ask for help against Britain in 1777. The French were reserved, wanted news of success.

Franklin was worried thought about it. But how did he think? He…

— FischerKing (@FischerKing64) November 21, 2025

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The contribution of the American Revolution to the French Revolution is a good piece of history.

"Ken Burns has set himself the impossible task of retelling a national origin story that all Americans will embrace as their own. He began work on the resulting six-part, twelve-hour series, The American Revolution, nearly a decade ago, just as the so-called Great Awokening got going. The years 2015-2025 have been energizing and inspiring for culture warriors and historical polemicists. But Burns is neither. His craft consists in conveying, intelligently, artfully and respectfully, the mainstream historical consensus. And that consensus has become so politicized it no longer meaningfully exists. Burns's earnest effort to reconjure it merely results in incoherence."

In his piece for compact, @adamrowe82 has artfully encapsulated what is wrong (and right) with Ken Burns's American Revolution documentary. https://t.co/H9VkahCZoe

— Dr. Alexander S. Burns (@KKriegeBlog) December 4, 2025

BellCountyBear said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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Will Viola Davis play George Washington?

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Oprah Winfrey.

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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Observation on episode 4 of Burns docu on American Revolution.

Benjamin Franklin - at the age of 70 - was sent to France to ask for help against Britain in 1777. The French were reserved, wanted news of success.

Franklin was worried thought about it. But how did he think? He…

— FischerKing (@FischerKing64) November 21, 2025

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The contribution of the American Revolution to the French Revolution is a good piece of history.

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Great catch.

A direct line effect on France.



However American historians usually underplay France's contribution to beating the British.


For without the French navy, army and especially money / supplies there is little chance we would have won the war.

The part where he tries to say that the Iroquois Confederacy structure deeply influenced that colonists in choosing a form of government is just not accurate at all. Sorry. It was a deliberative body, but that's where the similarities end.

Bruisers Burner Phone said:

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The part where he tries to say that the Iroquois Confederacy structure deeply influenced that colonists in choosing a form of government is just not accurate at all. Sorry. It was a deliberative body, but that's where the similarities end.

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Yeah, they seem to try to interject Benjamin Franklin's thoughts and Albany Plan into the Constitution discussions. Franklin was a fan and so was George Washington (or at least he was familiar), but the rest were all educated in the Classics, correct? They were all Greek and Roman idea based.

I can see the Articles of Confederation maybe resembling the Great Law of Peace.

One of the things that the New York School System in the 60's and 70's did well was teach the Iroquois history, mythology and interactions with the Colonists really well. I remember learning all this in 5th and 7th Grade. But, they did not claim the Constitution was based on the Iroquois form of Government.

FLBear5630 said:

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Bruisers Burner Phone said:

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The part where he tries to say that the Iroquois Confederacy structure deeply influenced that colonists in choosing a form of government is just not accurate at all. Sorry. It was a deliberative body, but that's where the similarities end.

---

Yeah, they seem to try to interject Benjamin Franklin's thoughts and Albany Plan into the Constitution discussions. Franklin was a fan and so was George Washington (or at least he was familiar), but the rest were all educated in the Classics, correct? They were all Greek and Roman idea based.

I can see the Articles of Confederation maybe resembling the Great Law of Peace.

One of the things that the New York School System in the 60's and 70's did well was teach the Iroquois history, mythology and interactions with the Colonists really well. I remember learning all this in 5th and 7th Grade. But, they did not claim the Constitution was based on the Iroquois form of Government.

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That's where the Woke Ideology differs from the traditional, liberal bias of the Academy.

Awesome to highlight to great (and terrible) things about American Indians, slavery, etc. However, just to feel like Didn't Earn It is a license to just make up history to pretend "oppressed" groups played an outsize role in X, Y, Z is the legacy of Woke.

Harrison Bergeron said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Bruisers Burner Phone said:

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The part where he tries to say that the Iroquois Confederacy structure deeply influenced that colonists in choosing a form of government is just not accurate at all. Sorry. It was a deliberative body, but that's where the similarities end.

---

Yeah, they seem to try to interject Benjamin Franklin's thoughts and Albany Plan into the Constitution discussions. Franklin was a fan and so was George Washington (or at least he was familiar), but the rest were all educated in the Classics, correct? They were all Greek and Roman idea based.

I can see the Articles of Confederation maybe resembling the Great Law of Peace.

One of the things that the New York School System in the 60's and 70's did well was teach the Iroquois history, mythology and interactions with the Colonists really well. I remember learning all this in 5th and 7th Grade. But, they did not claim the Constitution was based on the Iroquois form of Government.

---

That's where the Woke Ideology differs from the traditional, liberal bias of the Academy.

Awesome to highlight to great (and terrible) things about American Indians, slavery, etc. However, just to feel like Didn't Earn It is a license to just make up history to pretend "oppressed" groups played an outsize role in X, Y, Z is the legacy of Woke.

---

No doubt Burns feel obligated to placate his social circle.

Beginning with his wife.

Ken Burns has distorted the Founding Fathers by suggesting that they were of “different religions.” This is easily proved wrong…
They were clearly ALL CHRISTIANS! https://t.co/Xbl8obdzbR

— Rob Schneider 🇺🇸 (@RobSchneider) December 14, 2025

Redbrickbear said:

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Ken Burns has distorted the Founding Fathers by suggesting that they were of “different religions.” This is easily proved wrong…
They were clearly ALL CHRISTIANS! https://t.co/Xbl8obdzbR

— Rob Schneider 🇺🇸 (@RobSchneider) December 14, 2025

---

So Lutheran and Methodist are the same? Ever try to go to communion in a Lutheran Church? See if they let you.

There were numerous Protestants, Catholics, Deists and they were very wary of the Pennsylvania Dutch. I don't think any would consider themselves the same as William Penn and his crowd.

I think there is a bit of nit-picking going on.

FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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Ken Burns has distorted the Founding Fathers by suggesting that they were of “different religions.” This is easily proved wrong…
They were clearly ALL CHRISTIANS! https://t.co/Xbl8obdzbR

— Rob Schneider 🇺🇸 (@RobSchneider) December 14, 2025

---

So Lutheran and Methodist are the same? Ever try to go to communion in a Lutheran Church? See if they let you.

There were numerous Protestants, Catholics, Deists and they were very wary of the Pennsylvania Dutch. I don't think any would consider themselves the same as William Penn and his crowd.

I think there is a bit of nit-picking going on.

---

Less nit-picketing than demanding some basic accuracy in a documentary that will be shown to millions of school children and included in the library of Congress one day

The founding fathers were in fact NOT followers of different religions…they were members of different denominations of the same religion

If Ken wants to go into the conflicting issues/
antagonisms within those different denominations…no one would complain….just don't let one of your interviewees say something this factually wrong on screen without challenge

Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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Ken Burns has distorted the Founding Fathers by suggesting that they were of “different religions.” This is easily proved wrong…
They were clearly ALL CHRISTIANS! https://t.co/Xbl8obdzbR

— Rob Schneider 🇺🇸 (@RobSchneider) December 14, 2025

---

So Lutheran and Methodist are the same? Ever try to go to communion in a Lutheran Church? See if they let you.

There were numerous Protestants, Catholics, Deists and they were very wary of the Pennsylvania Dutch. I don't think any would consider themselves the same as William Penn and his crowd.

I think there is a bit of nit-picking going on.

---

Less nit-picketing than demanding some basic accuracy in a documentary that will be shown to millions of school children and included in the library of Congress one day

The founding fathers were in fact NOT followers of different religions…they were members of different denominations of the same religion

If Ken wants to go into the conflicting issues/
antagonisms within those different denominations…no one would complain….just don't let one of your interviewees say something this factually wrong on screen without challenge

---

Do you want to go into Deists and their non-Christian beliefs? Jefferson, Franklin, Paine, and even Madison and Washington were more into Deist than Christianity. Or, does that not count.

Geez, Paine called Christianity a fable. Franklin was about reason and definitely no fan of religion. Jefferson wrote his own version of how he thought Jesus's lessons fit in, no miracles, and questioned Jesus divinity.

These are not minor players, these are the heavy hitters of the Founding Fathers. I can see why Burns left it at diverse.

As I said, you are nit-picking.

FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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Ken Burns has distorted the Founding Fathers by suggesting that they were of “different religions.” This is easily proved wrong…
They were clearly ALL CHRISTIANS! https://t.co/Xbl8obdzbR

— Rob Schneider 🇺🇸 (@RobSchneider) December 14, 2025

---

So Lutheran and Methodist are the same? Ever try to go to communion in a Lutheran Church? See if they let you.

There were numerous Protestants, Catholics, Deists and they were very wary of the Pennsylvania Dutch. I don't think any would consider themselves the same as William Penn and his crowd.

I think there is a bit of nit-picking going on.

---

Less nit-picketing than demanding some basic accuracy in a documentary that will be shown to millions of school children and included in the library of Congress one day

The founding fathers were in fact NOT followers of different religions…they were members of different denominations of the same religion

If Ken wants to go into the conflicting issues/
antagonisms within those different denominations…no one would complain….just don't let one of your interviewees say something this factually wrong on screen without challenge

---

Do you want to go into Deists and their non-Christian beliefs? Jefferson, Franklin, Paine, and even Madison and Washington were more into Deist than Christianity. Or, does that not count.

Geez, Paine called Christianity a fable. Franklin was about reason and definitely no fan of religion. Jefferson wrote his own version of how he thought Jesus's lessons fit in, no miracles, and questioned Jesus divinity.

These are not minor players, these are the heavy hitters of the Founding Fathers. I can see why Burns left it at diverse.

As I said, you are nit-picking.

---

Again…back to the actual Ken Burn documentary

She is taking about the first Continental Congress meeting. (Thomas Pain is not a Founding father or member of the Continental Congress or the later Congresses of the USA)

[Fifty-six delegates from twelve of the thirteen colonies attended the First Continental Congress, which convened at Carpenters' Hall in Philadelphia from September 5 to October 26, 1774. Georgia was the only colony that did not send representatives.]

Of these 56 delegates all are know members of the Christian religion and have historic church memberships. (Their exact personal beliefs on all theological matters are of course open for debate)

But they were not members of "different religions" as per the interviewee.

If she wanted to emphasize the religious diversity of this group….then she should be accurate and just say they were members of different Christian denominations & Churches with different theological interpretations of the faith.


[A large number of Southern delegates were members of the Church of England (Anglican), which later became the Episcopal Church in America. This included a majority of the Virginia delegation, such as George Washington, Peyton Randolph, and Patrick Henry. Maryland delegates like Samuel Chase were also Episcopalian.
Congregationalist: This was the dominant denomination among the New England delegates, the spiritual heirs of the Puritans. Key figures included John Adams and Samuel Adams of Massachusetts.
Presbyterian: This denomination was well-represented across several colonies and generally supportive of the revolutionary cause. Delegates such as William Floyd, Philip Livingston, and James Wilson were Presbyterians.
Quaker (Society of Friends): A few delegates, especially from Pennsylvania and New Jersey, were Quakers. James Kinsey of New Jersey and the chair maker Joseph Henzey were Quakers.
Lutheran: John Morton of Pennsylvania is an example of a delegate who was a Lutheran.]

Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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Ken Burns has distorted the Founding Fathers by suggesting that they were of “different religions.” This is easily proved wrong…
They were clearly ALL CHRISTIANS! https://t.co/Xbl8obdzbR

— Rob Schneider 🇺🇸 (@RobSchneider) December 14, 2025

---

So Lutheran and Methodist are the same? Ever try to go to communion in a Lutheran Church? See if they let you.

There were numerous Protestants, Catholics, Deists and they were very wary of the Pennsylvania Dutch. I don't think any would consider themselves the same as William Penn and his crowd.

I think there is a bit of nit-picking going on.

---

Less nit-picketing than demanding some basic accuracy in a documentary that will be shown to millions of school children and included in the library of Congress one day

The founding fathers were in fact NOT followers of different religions…they were members of different denominations of the same religion

If Ken wants to go into the conflicting issues/
antagonisms within those different denominations…no one would complain….just don't let one of your interviewees say something this factually wrong on screen without challenge

---

Do you want to go into Deists and their non-Christian beliefs? Jefferson, Franklin, Paine, and even Madison and Washington were more into Deist than Christianity. Or, does that not count.

Geez, Paine called Christianity a fable. Franklin was about reason and definitely no fan of religion. Jefferson wrote his own version of how he thought Jesus's lessons fit in, no miracles, and questioned Jesus divinity.

These are not minor players, these are the heavy hitters of the Founding Fathers. I can see why Burns left it at diverse.

As I said, you are nit-picking.

---

Again…back to the actual Ken Burn documentary

She is taking about the first Continental Congress meeting. (Thomas Pain is not a Founding father or member of the Continental Congress or the later Congresses of the USA)

[Fifty-six delegates from twelve of the thirteen colonies attended the First Continental Congress, which convened at Carpenters' Hall in Philadelphia from September 5 to October 26, 1774. Georgia was the only colony that did not send representatives.]

Of these 56 delegates all are know members of the Christian religion and have historic church memberships. (Their exact personal beliefs on all theological matters are of course open for debate)

But they were not members of "different religions" as per the interviewee.

If she wanted to emphasize the religious diversity of this group….then she should be accurate and just say they were members of different Christian denominations & Churches with different theological interpretations of the faith.


[A large number of Southern delegates were members of the Church of England (Anglican), which later became the Episcopal Church in America. This included a majority of the Virginia delegation, such as George Washington, Peyton Randolph, and Patrick Henry. Maryland delegates like Samuel Chase were also Episcopalian.
Congregationalist: This was the dominant denomination among the New England delegates, the spiritual heirs of the Puritans. Key figures included John Adams and Samuel Adams of Massachusetts.
Presbyterian: This denomination was well-represented across several colonies and generally supportive of the revolutionary cause. Delegates such as William Floyd, Philip Livingston, and James Wilson were Presbyterians.
Quaker (Society of Friends): A few delegates, especially from Pennsylvania and New Jersey, were Quakers. James Kinsey of New Jersey and the chair maker Joseph Henzey were Quakers.
Lutheran: John Morton of Pennsylvania is an example of a delegate who was a Lutheran.]

---

If it was Trump, you would say "you know what he meant" and it is not literal. Someone you don't like, it is literal to the period and comma. I have never seen people craft things the way the want them to be like this room.

The Nation was supposed to have separation of church and state because there were so many denominations and they left Europe to escape just what you are doing.

FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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Ken Burns has distorted the Founding Fathers by suggesting that they were of “different religions.” This is easily proved wrong…
They were clearly ALL CHRISTIANS! https://t.co/Xbl8obdzbR

— Rob Schneider 🇺🇸 (@RobSchneider) December 14, 2025

---

So Lutheran and Methodist are the same? Ever try to go to communion in a Lutheran Church? See if they let you.

There were numerous Protestants, Catholics, Deists and they were very wary of the Pennsylvania Dutch. I don't think any would consider themselves the same as William Penn and his crowd.

I think there is a bit of nit-picking going on.

---

Less nit-picketing than demanding some basic accuracy in a documentary that will be shown to millions of school children and included in the library of Congress one day

The founding fathers were in fact NOT followers of different religions…they were members of different denominations of the same religion

If Ken wants to go into the conflicting issues/
antagonisms within those different denominations…no one would complain….just don't let one of your interviewees say something this factually wrong on screen without challenge

---

Do you want to go into Deists and their non-Christian beliefs? Jefferson, Franklin, Paine, and even Madison and Washington were more into Deist than Christianity. Or, does that not count.

Geez, Paine called Christianity a fable. Franklin was about reason and definitely no fan of religion. Jefferson wrote his own version of how he thought Jesus's lessons fit in, no miracles, and questioned Jesus divinity.

These are not minor players, these are the heavy hitters of the Founding Fathers. I can see why Burns left it at diverse.

As I said, you are nit-picking.

---

Again…back to the actual Ken Burn documentary

She is taking about the first Continental Congress meeting. (Thomas Pain is not a Founding father or member of the Continental Congress or the later Congresses of the USA)

[Fifty-six delegates from twelve of the thirteen colonies attended the First Continental Congress, which convened at Carpenters' Hall in Philadelphia from September 5 to October 26, 1774. Georgia was the only colony that did not send representatives.]

Of these 56 delegates all are know members of the Christian religion and have historic church memberships. (Their exact personal beliefs on all theological matters are of course open for debate)

But they were not members of "different religions" as per the interviewee.

If she wanted to emphasize the religious diversity of this group….then she should be accurate and just say they were members of different Christian denominations & Churches with different theological interpretations of the faith.


[A large number of Southern delegates were members of the Church of England (Anglican), which later became the Episcopal Church in America. This included a majority of the Virginia delegation, such as George Washington, Peyton Randolph, and Patrick Henry. Maryland delegates like Samuel Chase were also Episcopalian.
Congregationalist: This was the dominant denomination among the New England delegates, the spiritual heirs of the Puritans. Key figures included John Adams and Samuel Adams of Massachusetts.
Presbyterian: This denomination was well-represented across several colonies and generally supportive of the revolutionary cause. Delegates such as William Floyd, Philip Livingston, and James Wilson were Presbyterians.
Quaker (Society of Friends): A few delegates, especially from Pennsylvania and New Jersey, were Quakers. James Kinsey of New Jersey and the chair maker Joseph Henzey were Quakers.
Lutheran: John Morton of Pennsylvania is an example of a delegate who was a Lutheran.]

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If it was Trump, you would say "you know what he meant" and it is not literal. Someone you don't like, it is literal to the period and comma. I have never seen people craft things the way the want them to be like this room.
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Well Trump is not doing a historical documentary for PBS that will end up in the library of Congress and taught to millions of school children.

At the least we can all admit it's strange framing.

"different religions"…instead of the more obviously accurate statement of "different denominations of the same religion"

Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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Ken Burns has distorted the Founding Fathers by suggesting that they were of “different religions.” This is easily proved wrong…
They were clearly ALL CHRISTIANS! https://t.co/Xbl8obdzbR

— Rob Schneider 🇺🇸 (@RobSchneider) December 14, 2025

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So Lutheran and Methodist are the same? Ever try to go to communion in a Lutheran Church? See if they let you.

There were numerous Protestants, Catholics, Deists and they were very wary of the Pennsylvania Dutch. I don't think any would consider themselves the same as William Penn and his crowd.

I think there is a bit of nit-picking going on.

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Less nit-picketing than demanding some basic accuracy in a documentary that will be shown to millions of school children and included in the library of Congress one day

The founding fathers were in fact NOT followers of different religions…they were members of different denominations of the same religion

If Ken wants to go into the conflicting issues/
antagonisms within those different denominations…no one would complain….just don't let one of your interviewees say something this factually wrong on screen without challenge

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Do you want to go into Deists and their non-Christian beliefs? Jefferson, Franklin, Paine, and even Madison and Washington were more into Deist than Christianity. Or, does that not count.

Geez, Paine called Christianity a fable. Franklin was about reason and definitely no fan of religion. Jefferson wrote his own version of how he thought Jesus's lessons fit in, no miracles, and questioned Jesus divinity.

These are not minor players, these are the heavy hitters of the Founding Fathers. I can see why Burns left it at diverse.

As I said, you are nit-picking.

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Again…back to the actual Ken Burn documentary

She is taking about the first Continental Congress meeting. (Thomas Pain is not a Founding father or member of the Continental Congress or the later Congresses of the USA)

[Fifty-six delegates from twelve of the thirteen colonies attended the First Continental Congress, which convened at Carpenters' Hall in Philadelphia from September 5 to October 26, 1774. Georgia was the only colony that did not send representatives.]

Of these 56 delegates all are know members of the Christian religion and have historic church memberships. (Their exact personal beliefs on all theological matters are of course open for debate)

But they were not members of "different religions" as per the interviewee.

If she wanted to emphasize the religious diversity of this group….then she should be accurate and just say they were members of different Christian denominations & Churches with different theological interpretations of the faith.


[A large number of Southern delegates were members of the Church of England (Anglican), which later became the Episcopal Church in America. This included a majority of the Virginia delegation, such as George Washington, Peyton Randolph, and Patrick Henry. Maryland delegates like Samuel Chase were also Episcopalian.
Congregationalist: This was the dominant denomination among the New England delegates, the spiritual heirs of the Puritans. Key figures included John Adams and Samuel Adams of Massachusetts.
Presbyterian: This denomination was well-represented across several colonies and generally supportive of the revolutionary cause. Delegates such as William Floyd, Philip Livingston, and James Wilson were Presbyterians.
Quaker (Society of Friends): A few delegates, especially from Pennsylvania and New Jersey, were Quakers. James Kinsey of New Jersey and the chair maker Joseph Henzey were Quakers.
Lutheran: John Morton of Pennsylvania is an example of a delegate who was a Lutheran.]

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If it was Trump, you would say "you know what he meant" and it is not literal. Someone you don't like, it is literal to the period and comma. I have never seen people craft things the way the want them to be like this room.
.

---

Well Trump is not doing a historical documentary for PBS that will end up in the library of Congress and taught to millions of school children.

At the least we can all admit it's strange framing.

"different religions"…instead of the more obviously accurate statement of "different denominations of the same religion"

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I get you. But, for a TV show and the US TV watching market? I get what they said and having watched a lot of Ken Burns stuff I have a hard time believing he is pushing an political agenda.