President Trump announces military strikes on Iran: Operation Epic Fury

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In reply to D. C. Bear • 7:04p, 10/24/26
D. C. Bear said:
The_barBEARian said:


To be fair, the Brits declined to be much help in dealing with Iran.

Argentina isn't going to do anything.


So therefore you should actively attack them???

Zionists are insane... Israel already funded and supplied Morocco's invasion of Spanish territory with the help of that piece of **** Marco Rubio and the state department a few months ago.

How is attacking Spain or the UK in America's best interests???
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7:10p, 10/24/26
Jared Kushner sure does keep interesting company...



Billionaire Leon Black Sues Congress As He Skips Out On Testifying About Epstein


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In reply to D. C. Bear • 7:35p, 10/24/26
D. C. Bear said:
The_barBEARian said:


To be fair, the Brits declined to be much help in dealing with Iran.

Argentina isn't going to do anything.

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In reply to william • 7:40p, 10/24/26
william said:

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In reply to The_barBEARian • 7:50p, 10/24/26
The_barBEARian said:
D. C. Bear said:
The_barBEARian said:


To be fair, the Brits declined to be much help in dealing with Iran.

Argentina isn't going to do anything.

Why do you believe that?

They already fought one war over the islands.


They lack the military capacity to do so.
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In reply to D. C. Bear • 11:38p, 10/24/26
D. C. Bear said:
The_barBEARian said:
D. C. Bear said:
The_barBEARian said:


To be fair, the Brits declined to be much help in dealing with Iran.

Argentina isn't going to do anything.

Why do you believe that?

They already fought one war over the islands.


They lack the military capacity to do so.


Azerbaijan lacked the weapons to take Nagorno-Karabakh from the Christian Armenians until Israel gave them weapons American tax payers paid for.

What a great ally... arming Muslims to kill Christians...

Israeli weapons quietly helped Azerbaijan retake Nagorno-Karabakh
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6:29a, 10/25/26
late start - gotta see how the islamofascist riots and mayhem are progressing across the grobe........

- el UF

Viva Jimmy!!

{ sipping covfefe }

{ eating donut }

D!

>>
The supposed anti-poverty riots happening in France are reportedly being bankrolled and promoted by what some have described as a "Red-Green Alliance" of far-left communist agitators and radical Islamists.

At the center of this "alliance" is left-wing donor Neville Roy Singham, whom Asra Q. Nomani of Fox News has dubbed an "American-born Marxist tech tycoon" responsible for funding the group Tricontinental Ltd.

According to Just The News, groups like Tricontinental Ltd. "were central boosters" of the pro-Palestinian protests and riots that erupted across the United States after the Oct. 7, 2023, terror attack in Israel.

Years later, Tricontinental Ltd. and other groups linked to Singham -- including CodePink and BreakThrough News, which publishes pro-riot propaganda -- appear to now be openly fomenting riots in France.
pro ecclesia, pro javelina
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5:09p, 10/25/26
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2:50a, 10/26/26
Report: In 'unprecedented confrontation,' IDF chief resisting carrying out military action ordered by Netanyahu relating to Iran

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Sam Lowry
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In reply to EatMoreSalmon • 9:53a, 10/26/26
EatMoreSalmon said:
Sam Lowry said:
EatMoreSalmon said:
Sam Lowry said:
EatMoreSalmon said:
Sam Lowry said:
EatMoreSalmon said:
Sam Lowry said:
EatMoreSalmon said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.


Evacuation orders are just that. You choose to stay in the war zone after being alerted to an attack, you either become a combatant or you have been coerced into staying by your local leaders. It does not fit the definition of genocide that you want it to so badly.

"In its previous report the Commission has found that the Israeli security forces intended to target and attack Palestinian civilians, including children, women, persons with disabilities and older persons, during their evacuation, within the designated safe zones and in shelters."


Apparently it was so pervasive that a high percentage of the Palestinian population died. But wait…

And can you link the report you are quoting so we can read the whole thing for ourselves?
Not a summation, but the actual report with names signed to it.

At least 5 percent as of 2025. I would argue 10 percent or more by now.

https://www.mpg.de/25778228/gaza-study-reveals-unprecedented-losses-of-life-and-life-expectancy


Your article is more about a study of Gaza life expectancy using models in place of unattainable hard data. It protects itself by stating,
". As genocide is a very specific legal term, certain additional criteria must be met for it to be applicable. This was not the focus of this study."

If we use the higher educated guess through modeling of 100,000 deaths - the Gaza authorities don't even claim that many and most of their claimed population loss is by displacement even as their numbers don't add up well - that is still less than 5 percent of the best guess of 2.13 million living in the Gaza Strip presently. The study the article is about won't claim an Israeli genocide and even speaks to the problem of the legal definition of the term. The deaths are attributed to conflict, which means it must include Hamas purges along with the collateral loss from the conflict being mostly in the Gaza Strip. Gaza even now still has the highest birth rate among Palestinian controlled areas, even with all the reported loss of food security, hospital care, child education, and housing.

The reports that support any talk of genocide by Israel are relying heavily on stats from the Palestinian Central Bureau.

https://www.pcbs.gov.ps/en/post-details/?postId=23319

There are many articles about the genocide. This one is about depopulation, in response to your point above. It's worth mentioning even though it's not strictly relevant (genocide is defined by actions and intent, not necessarily results).

Genocide deniers object to the casualty estimates mainly on two grounds -- either they rely too heavily on numbers from the Gaza Ministry of Health, or they don't rely on them heavily enough. You've managed to incorporate both complaints into your post, so I'll address them one at a time.

1) The widely cited number of 75K was first released about 16 months into the war. Since then the ability of health authorities to keep accurate records has greatly diminished as a result of Israeli attacks, so even those reports are long out of date (which begs the question, if they were making up numbers all along, why they didn't just keep doing so). 2) We also know that the rate of civilian casualties in Gaza is astronomically high compared to other wars, so the argument that the deaths consist largely of Hamas militants is not plausible.

In the absence of complete data, we're left with a combination of available records, scientific models, and ongoing recovery efforts (for example, a funeral for 75 newly recovered victims was held a few days ago). This is what is to be expected if you're trying to get the best estimate possible under the circumstances. Finally, it should be noted that the figures in the article are not the highest educated guess. On the contrary, they represent a minimum based on available evidence.

1) The point is the widely cited numbers came from one side in the conflict, the Palestinian Central Bureau. Their reports read like a full on propaganda peace, but somehow their numbers - which don't match up with the current population numbers - are taken as plausible. History says Palestinian stats are overblown. History also says how much Hamas likes to put civilians in harms way to influence world opinion in their favor. People who swallow these numbers are enabling a weird sort of genocide that you aren't talking about.

2) This is not even close to true. Especially for urban war. Yet you still swallow it.

"During the anti-ISIS campaign, the battles of Mosul and Raqqa were considered some of the fiercest urban fighting since the Second World War. Afterwards, the UN declared that the cities were practically uninhabitable, with at least 80 percent of the city of Mosul almost entirely destroyed.

"Throughout the report, these two battles are used as points of comparison for the rates of harm in Gaza."


https://www.rand.org/nsrd/projects/when-isil-comes-to-town/case-studies/mosul.html

Population

"ISIL attempted to prevent residents of Mosul from fleeing its caliphate, with limited success. Researchers used the Oak Ridge National Laboratory's ORNL LandScan estimates of Mosul's population in 2008, 2015, and 2016 to explore the extent to which Mosul's population fluctuated in response to ISIL's takeover of the city. This analysis was restricted to the urban core of Mosul as opposed to its full environs, so total population figures might fall slightly below other published estimates.

Pre-ISIL estimates of Mosul's population show that nearly 1.2 million people inhabited the urban core of the city in 2008. By February 2015, we estimate, the city's population fell by more than 300,000 people after only a year of ISIL control over the city, or nearly 30 percent of its pre-ISIL population. Between mid-2015 and mid-2016, researchers estimate, an additional 220,000 people fled Mosul. Combined, our most-recent estimates suggest that Mosul's population was nearly cut in half under ISIL's reign, even before massive flows of internally displaced persons began during Mosul's liberation. It suggests that despite ISIL's efforts to limit population movements out of the city, Mosul's residents still fled in the hundreds of thousands while the group retained total control of the city."

Mosul and immediate suburbs district in 2016 had over 1900 square miles and estimates of 800,000 to 1.2 million in population. Core city population is estimated above, and dropped dramatically during the urban fighting. Compared to Gaza, the Mosul population was very dispersed into an accessible land area over 10 times the size.

The Gaza Strip has 140 square miles and in 2023 had 2.1 - 2.4 million estimated population in that small space, depending on the source. It now has an estimated…. 2.1 million people according to the Palestinian authorities.

While Mosul was brutal with around 10,000 civilian deaths, much of its population was able to flee the core city into the suburbs.
By comparison, Gaza's civilians could not get out of their core urban area as that's all they have. Plus Hamas had decades to place military infrastructure like their well known hardened tunnels under civilian buildings throughout the Gaza Strip.
Sadly, both Gaza and Mosul civilians sometimes faced execution from authorities if they did not stay put as human shields in areas prone to attack.

Also, the same groups claiming genocide in Gaza complained that the Iraqi coalition forces including the US were using too powerful weapons to attack ISYL, and were… you guessed it… purposely killing civilians placed as human shields.


Gaza's civilians were forced out of the cities in large numbers. Otherwise I'm not sure what your point is.
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Sam Lowry
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In reply to Porteroso • 9:54a, 10/26/26
Porteroso said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.

Im curious, so what would the IDF need to do then, to avoid your ire. As long as 1 civilian fails to evacuate, not fight back in a war clearly started by a horrendous, terrorist foe?

Stop intentionally killing civilians. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.
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D. C. Bear
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In reply to Sam Lowry • 10:26a, 10/26/26
Sam Lowry said:
Porteroso said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.

Im curious, so what would the IDF need to do then, to avoid your ire. As long as 1 civilian fails to evacuate, not fight back in a war clearly started by a horrendous, terrorist foe?

Stop intentionally killing civilians. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.


You only your Hamas boys would listen to your advice.

If the IDF was trying to intentionally kill civilians, they would not use the strategies they have used in Gaza.
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In reply to D. C. Bear • 10:28a, 10/26/26
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
Porteroso said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.

Im curious, so what would the IDF need to do then, to avoid your ire. As long as 1 civilian fails to evacuate, not fight back in a war clearly started by a horrendous, terrorist foe?

Stop intentionally killing civilians. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.


You only your Hamas boys would listen to your advice.

If the IDF was trying to intentionally kill civilians, they would not use the strategies they have used in Gaza.

A mountain of evidence says otherwise, but don't stop believin'.
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D. C. Bear
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In reply to Sam Lowry • 10:38a, 10/26/26
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
Porteroso said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.

Im curious, so what would the IDF need to do then, to avoid your ire. As long as 1 civilian fails to evacuate, not fight back in a war clearly started by a horrendous, terrorist foe?

Stop intentionally killing civilians. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.


You only your Hamas boys would listen to your advice.

If the IDF was trying to intentionally kill civilians, they would not use the strategies they have used in Gaza.

A mountain of evidence says otherwise, but don't stop believin'.


Is it your argument that the IDF has not, in fact, issued alerts to civilians in advance of strikes at Hamas through a variety of channels? I have read the reports that they have done this. Do you deny them? If they are true, then the "genocide" arguments ring very hollow indeed.

Of course, we know that your Hamas boys' entire strategy involves targeting civilians, both Israelis and also Arabs living in Gaza.
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In reply to D. C. Bear • 10:47a, 10/26/26
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
Porteroso said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.

Im curious, so what would the IDF need to do then, to avoid your ire. As long as 1 civilian fails to evacuate, not fight back in a war clearly started by a horrendous, terrorist foe?

Stop intentionally killing civilians. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.


You only your Hamas boys would listen to your advice.

If the IDF was trying to intentionally kill civilians, they would not use the strategies they have used in Gaza.

A mountain of evidence says otherwise, but don't stop believin'.


Is it your argument that the IDF has not, in fact, issued alerts to civilians in advance of strikes at Hamas through a variety of channels? I have read the reports that they have done this. Do you deny them? If they are true, then the "genocide" arguments ring very hollow indeed.

Of course, we know that your Hamas boys' entire strategy involves targeting civilians, both Israelis and also Arabs living in Gaza.

The UN has documented war crimes committed by Hamas as well. No one is saying they're innocent. To say it constitutes their entire strategy is odd, but whatever.

Issuing alerts to civilians while you relentlessly attack them is rather meaningless.
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The_barBEARian
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In reply to D. C. Bear • 11:19a, 10/26/26
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
Porteroso said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.

Im curious, so what would the IDF need to do then, to avoid your ire. As long as 1 civilian fails to evacuate, not fight back in a war clearly started by a horrendous, terrorist foe?

Stop intentionally killing civilians. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.


You only your Hamas boys would listen to your advice.

If the IDF was trying to intentionally kill civilians, they would not use the strategies they have used in Gaza.


Less than half of young Republicans have a favorable view of the Israeli people and only a quarter of young Republicans have a favorable view of the Israeli government.

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D. C. Bear
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In reply to Sam Lowry • 11:37a, 10/26/26
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
Porteroso said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.

Im curious, so what would the IDF need to do then, to avoid your ire. As long as 1 civilian fails to evacuate, not fight back in a war clearly started by a horrendous, terrorist foe?

Stop intentionally killing civilians. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.


You only your Hamas boys would listen to your advice.

If the IDF was trying to intentionally kill civilians, they would not use the strategies they have used in Gaza.

A mountain of evidence says otherwise, but don't stop believin'.


Is it your argument that the IDF has not, in fact, issued alerts to civilians in advance of strikes at Hamas through a variety of channels? I have read the reports that they have done this. Do you deny them? If they are true, then the "genocide" arguments ring very hollow indeed.

Of course, we know that your Hamas boys' entire strategy involves targeting civilians, both Israelis and also Arabs living in Gaza.

The UN has documented war crimes committed by Hamas as well. No one is saying they're innocent. To say it constitutes their entire strategy is odd, but whatever.

Issuing alerts to civilians while you relentlessly attack them is rather meaningless.


No, it's not "odd" to say Hamas' strategy is essentially killing civilians and not much else. Hamas has been lobbing missiles into Israel indiscriminately for a couple of decades. They also have a tendency to kill civilians in Gaza as a means of holding on to power. When you say "no one is saying they're innocent," that is a lie. There are plenty of people who justify and support their tactics.
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historian
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In reply to Sam Lowry • 2:14p, 10/26/26
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
Porteroso said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.

Im curious, so what would the IDF need to do then, to avoid your ire. As long as 1 civilian fails to evacuate, not fight back in a war clearly started by a horrendous, terrorist foe?

Stop intentionally killing civilians. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.


You only your Hamas boys would listen to your advice.

If the IDF was trying to intentionally kill civilians, they would not use the strategies they have used in Gaza.

A mountain of evidence says otherwise, but don't stop believin'.

Actually the overwhelming evidence proved his point: an entire mountain range. That, along with plenty of common sense and logic.

Bigotry is always irrational.
“Incline my heart to your testimonies, and not to selfish gain!”
Psalm 119:36
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historian
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In reply to Sam Lowry • 2:15p, 10/26/26
The UN is grossly antisemitic, regularly repeats terrorist propaganda (like most of the Left), and participated in October 7. They have zero credibility.
“Incline my heart to your testimonies, and not to selfish gain!”
Psalm 119:36
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Sam Lowry
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In reply to D. C. Bear • 2:28p, 10/26/26
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
Porteroso said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.

Im curious, so what would the IDF need to do then, to avoid your ire. As long as 1 civilian fails to evacuate, not fight back in a war clearly started by a horrendous, terrorist foe?

Stop intentionally killing civilians. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.


You only your Hamas boys would listen to your advice.

If the IDF was trying to intentionally kill civilians, they would not use the strategies they have used in Gaza.

A mountain of evidence says otherwise, but don't stop believin'.


Is it your argument that the IDF has not, in fact, issued alerts to civilians in advance of strikes at Hamas through a variety of channels? I have read the reports that they have done this. Do you deny them? If they are true, then the "genocide" arguments ring very hollow indeed.

Of course, we know that your Hamas boys' entire strategy involves targeting civilians, both Israelis and also Arabs living in Gaza.

The UN has documented war crimes committed by Hamas as well. No one is saying they're innocent. To say it constitutes their entire strategy is odd, but whatever.

Issuing alerts to civilians while you relentlessly attack them is rather meaningless.


No, it's not "odd" to say Hamas' strategy is essentially killing civilians and not much else. Hamas has been lobbing missiles into Israel indiscriminately for a couple of decades. They also have a tendency to kill civilians in Gaza as a means of holding on to power. When you say "no one is saying they're innocent," that is a lie. There are plenty of people who justify and support their tactics.

Hamas carries out many attacks on both military and civilian targets. I don't see anyone defending the latter.
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Sam Lowry
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In reply to historian • 2:30p, 10/26/26
historian said:
The UN is grossly antisemitic, regularly repeats terrorist propaganda (like most of the Left), and participated in October 7. They have zero credibility.

So the UN report on Hamas war crimes was false?
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D. C. Bear
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In reply to Sam Lowry • 2:32p, 10/26/26
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
Porteroso said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.

Im curious, so what would the IDF need to do then, to avoid your ire. As long as 1 civilian fails to evacuate, not fight back in a war clearly started by a horrendous, terrorist foe?

Stop intentionally killing civilians. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.


You only your Hamas boys would listen to your advice.

If the IDF was trying to intentionally kill civilians, they would not use the strategies they have used in Gaza.

A mountain of evidence says otherwise, but don't stop believin'.


Is it your argument that the IDF has not, in fact, issued alerts to civilians in advance of strikes at Hamas through a variety of channels? I have read the reports that they have done this. Do you deny them? If they are true, then the "genocide" arguments ring very hollow indeed.

Of course, we know that your Hamas boys' entire strategy involves targeting civilians, both Israelis and also Arabs living in Gaza.

The UN has documented war crimes committed by Hamas as well. No one is saying they're innocent. To say it constitutes their entire strategy is odd, but whatever.

Issuing alerts to civilians while you relentlessly attack them is rather meaningless.


No, it's not "odd" to say Hamas' strategy is essentially killing civilians and not much else. Hamas has been lobbing missiles into Israel indiscriminately for a couple of decades. They also have a tendency to kill civilians in Gaza as a means of holding on to power. When you say "no one is saying they're innocent," that is a lie. There are plenty of people who justify and support their tactics.

Hamas carries out many attacks on both military and civilian targets. I don't see anyone defending the latter.


You need to get out more.
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Sam Lowry
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In reply to D. C. Bear • 3:08p, 10/26/26
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
Porteroso said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.

Im curious, so what would the IDF need to do then, to avoid your ire. As long as 1 civilian fails to evacuate, not fight back in a war clearly started by a horrendous, terrorist foe?

Stop intentionally killing civilians. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.


You only your Hamas boys would listen to your advice.

If the IDF was trying to intentionally kill civilians, they would not use the strategies they have used in Gaza.

A mountain of evidence says otherwise, but don't stop believin'.


Is it your argument that the IDF has not, in fact, issued alerts to civilians in advance of strikes at Hamas through a variety of channels? I have read the reports that they have done this. Do you deny them? If they are true, then the "genocide" arguments ring very hollow indeed.

Of course, we know that your Hamas boys' entire strategy involves targeting civilians, both Israelis and also Arabs living in Gaza.

The UN has documented war crimes committed by Hamas as well. No one is saying they're innocent. To say it constitutes their entire strategy is odd, but whatever.

Issuing alerts to civilians while you relentlessly attack them is rather meaningless.


No, it's not "odd" to say Hamas' strategy is essentially killing civilians and not much else. Hamas has been lobbing missiles into Israel indiscriminately for a couple of decades. They also have a tendency to kill civilians in Gaza as a means of holding on to power. When you say "no one is saying they're innocent," that is a lie. There are plenty of people who justify and support their tactics.

Hamas carries out many attacks on both military and civilian targets. I don't see anyone defending the latter.


You need to get out more.

In any case, the vaunted alerts issued by the IDF are at best a fig leaf and at worst a tactic used to herd civilians out of their homes and into camps.
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boognish_bear
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8:10p, 10/26/26
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EatMoreSalmon
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In reply to Sam Lowry • 8:20p, 10/26/26
Sam Lowry said:
EatMoreSalmon said:
Sam Lowry said:
EatMoreSalmon said:
Sam Lowry said:
EatMoreSalmon said:
Sam Lowry said:
EatMoreSalmon said:
Sam Lowry said:
EatMoreSalmon said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.


Evacuation orders are just that. You choose to stay in the war zone after being alerted to an attack, you either become a combatant or you have been coerced into staying by your local leaders. It does not fit the definition of genocide that you want it to so badly.

"In its previous report the Commission has found that the Israeli security forces intended to target and attack Palestinian civilians, including children, women, persons with disabilities and older persons, during their evacuation, within the designated safe zones and in shelters."


Apparently it was so pervasive that a high percentage of the Palestinian population died. But wait…

And can you link the report you are quoting so we can read the whole thing for ourselves?
Not a summation, but the actual report with names signed to it.

At least 5 percent as of 2025. I would argue 10 percent or more by now.

https://www.mpg.de/25778228/gaza-study-reveals-unprecedented-losses-of-life-and-life-expectancy


Your article is more about a study of Gaza life expectancy using models in place of unattainable hard data. It protects itself by stating,
". As genocide is a very specific legal term, certain additional criteria must be met for it to be applicable. This was not the focus of this study."

If we use the higher educated guess through modeling of 100,000 deaths - the Gaza authorities don't even claim that many and most of their claimed population loss is by displacement even as their numbers don't add up well - that is still less than 5 percent of the best guess of 2.13 million living in the Gaza Strip presently. The study the article is about won't claim an Israeli genocide and even speaks to the problem of the legal definition of the term. The deaths are attributed to conflict, which means it must include Hamas purges along with the collateral loss from the conflict being mostly in the Gaza Strip. Gaza even now still has the highest birth rate among Palestinian controlled areas, even with all the reported loss of food security, hospital care, child education, and housing.

The reports that support any talk of genocide by Israel are relying heavily on stats from the Palestinian Central Bureau.

https://www.pcbs.gov.ps/en/post-details/?postId=23319

There are many articles about the genocide. This one is about depopulation, in response to your point above. It's worth mentioning even though it's not strictly relevant (genocide is defined by actions and intent, not necessarily results).

Genocide deniers object to the casualty estimates mainly on two grounds -- either they rely too heavily on numbers from the Gaza Ministry of Health, or they don't rely on them heavily enough. You've managed to incorporate both complaints into your post, so I'll address them one at a time.

1) The widely cited number of 75K was first released about 16 months into the war. Since then the ability of health authorities to keep accurate records has greatly diminished as a result of Israeli attacks, so even those reports are long out of date (which begs the question, if they were making up numbers all along, why they didn't just keep doing so). 2) We also know that the rate of civilian casualties in Gaza is astronomically high compared to other wars, so the argument that the deaths consist largely of Hamas militants is not plausible.

In the absence of complete data, we're left with a combination of available records, scientific models, and ongoing recovery efforts (for example, a funeral for 75 newly recovered victims was held a few days ago). This is what is to be expected if you're trying to get the best estimate possible under the circumstances. Finally, it should be noted that the figures in the article are not the highest educated guess. On the contrary, they represent a minimum based on available evidence.

1) The point is the widely cited numbers came from one side in the conflict, the Palestinian Central Bureau. Their reports read like a full on propaganda peace, but somehow their numbers - which don't match up with the current population numbers - are taken as plausible. History says Palestinian stats are overblown. History also says how much Hamas likes to put civilians in harms way to influence world opinion in their favor. People who swallow these numbers are enabling a weird sort of genocide that you aren't talking about.

2) This is not even close to true. Especially for urban war. Yet you still swallow it.

"During the anti-ISIS campaign, the battles of Mosul and Raqqa were considered some of the fiercest urban fighting since the Second World War. Afterwards, the UN declared that the cities were practically uninhabitable, with at least 80 percent of the city of Mosul almost entirely destroyed.

"Throughout the report, these two battles are used as points of comparison for the rates of harm in Gaza."


https://www.rand.org/nsrd/projects/when-isil-comes-to-town/case-studies/mosul.html

Population

"ISIL attempted to prevent residents of Mosul from fleeing its caliphate, with limited success. Researchers used the Oak Ridge National Laboratory's ORNL LandScan estimates of Mosul's population in 2008, 2015, and 2016 to explore the extent to which Mosul's population fluctuated in response to ISIL's takeover of the city. This analysis was restricted to the urban core of Mosul as opposed to its full environs, so total population figures might fall slightly below other published estimates.

Pre-ISIL estimates of Mosul's population show that nearly 1.2 million people inhabited the urban core of the city in 2008. By February 2015, we estimate, the city's population fell by more than 300,000 people after only a year of ISIL control over the city, or nearly 30 percent of its pre-ISIL population. Between mid-2015 and mid-2016, researchers estimate, an additional 220,000 people fled Mosul. Combined, our most-recent estimates suggest that Mosul's population was nearly cut in half under ISIL's reign, even before massive flows of internally displaced persons began during Mosul's liberation. It suggests that despite ISIL's efforts to limit population movements out of the city, Mosul's residents still fled in the hundreds of thousands while the group retained total control of the city."

Mosul and immediate suburbs district in 2016 had over 1900 square miles and estimates of 800,000 to 1.2 million in population. Core city population is estimated above, and dropped dramatically during the urban fighting. Compared to Gaza, the Mosul population was very dispersed into an accessible land area over 10 times the size.

The Gaza Strip has 140 square miles and in 2023 had 2.1 - 2.4 million estimated population in that small space, depending on the source. It now has an estimated…. 2.1 million people according to the Palestinian authorities.

While Mosul was brutal with around 10,000 civilian deaths, much of its population was able to flee the core city into the suburbs.
By comparison, Gaza's civilians could not get out of their core urban area as that's all they have. Plus Hamas had decades to place military infrastructure like their well known hardened tunnels under civilian buildings throughout the Gaza Strip.
Sadly, both Gaza and Mosul civilians sometimes faced execution from authorities if they did not stay put as human shields in areas prone to attack.

Also, the same groups claiming genocide in Gaza complained that the Iraqi coalition forces including the US were using too powerful weapons to attack ISYL, and were… you guessed it… purposely killing civilians placed as human shields.


Gaza's civilians were forced out of the cities in large numbers. Otherwise I'm not sure what your point is.


The point is that in Gaza, there is no "out of the cities".
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In reply to Sam Lowry • 8:36p, 10/26/26
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
Porteroso said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
D. C. Bear said:
Sam Lowry said:
historian said:
Ben Shapiro just dismantled the "genocide" argument masterfully

https://notthebee.com/takes/ben-shapiro-just-dismantled-the-genocide-argument-masterfully

On the idiotic accusation of genocide leveled at Israel:
Quote:
Is there any doubting that if given the same kind of advantages, Palestine's masters Hamas would not be so measured in their prosecution of the conflict? But leave speculation out of it, and the fact that Israel has sent its troops into dangerous urban combat rather than simply level buildings with civilians inside is all you need to know about these kinds of hyperbolic accusations.

Unfortunately, the antisemites and terrorist apologists won't accept the intelligence and logic of his arguments.

Bigotry is always irrational.

The type of argument that Shapiro's using is an old and easily recognizable one. It's called lying.


What particular facts did he assert that you believe are false?

Does Hamas not use "human shields?" They have a history of doing so according to just about everyone who has looked at it.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Does genocide not actually have a definition?

You don't have to think everything the IDF does is great to see that if they wanted to carry out a genocide in Gaza they would have used very different tactics. You can be an antisemitic Nazi and still concede that war and genocide are not the same thing.


Who are you calling an antisemitic Nazi?


No one. It is an example of how even someone who was an antisemitic Nazi might still be able to understand that not all war is genocide.

Well, the reason I use the term is precisely that it has been carefully defined, and the same authorities that defined it have documented it in the case of Gaza.

Shapiro's lie is that the IDF doesn't routinely level buildings with civilians inside. No one with any knowledge of their tactics can possibly believe that.


Civilians do die in wars independent of genocide. War, as said by someone who knew, is hell. However, a force committing genocide does not sent text messages, phone calls or voicemails, or drop leaflets, or engage in "roof knocking," in advance of attacks. Additionally, a force as powerful as the IDF would have no problem killing a hell of a lot more people if they were committing genocide.

Sometimes politics rather than clear analysis comes in to play in determining whether something is or is not genocide.

This has been thoroughly addressed, not only by the UN but also by Israeli human rights groups. Such warnings are ineffective when there's no safe place to go, no safe passage to get there, and you're being attacked every step of the way. The main purpose of the warnings wasn't to save lives but rather to help depopulate the cities and move more Palestinians into refugee camps (where the IDF didn't hesitate to bomb them again). Even if some lives were spared, at least temporarily, it doesn't excuse attacks on those who failed to evacuate.

Bottom line, there's a difference between issuing evacuation orders before entering urban combat according to accepted rules of war and issuing evacuation orders before engaging in indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Shapiro would have you believe Israel only does the former, but he knows that isn't true.

Im curious, so what would the IDF need to do then, to avoid your ire. As long as 1 civilian fails to evacuate, not fight back in a war clearly started by a horrendous, terrorist foe?

Stop intentionally killing civilians. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.


You only your Hamas boys would listen to your advice.

If the IDF was trying to intentionally kill civilians, they would not use the strategies they have used in Gaza.

A mountain of evidence says otherwise, but don't stop believin'.


Is it your argument that the IDF has not, in fact, issued alerts to civilians in advance of strikes at Hamas through a variety of channels? I have read the reports that they have done this. Do you deny them? If they are true, then the "genocide" arguments ring very hollow indeed.

Of course, we know that your Hamas boys' entire strategy involves targeting civilians, both Israelis and also Arabs living in Gaza.

The UN has documented war crimes committed by Hamas as well. No one is saying they're innocent. To say it constitutes their entire strategy is odd, but whatever.

Issuing alerts to civilians while you relentlessly attack them is rather meaningless.


No, it's not "odd" to say Hamas' strategy is essentially killing civilians and not much else. Hamas has been lobbing missiles into Israel indiscriminately for a couple of decades. They also have a tendency to kill civilians in Gaza as a means of holding on to power. When you say "no one is saying they're innocent," that is a lie. There are plenty of people who justify and support their tactics.

Hamas carries out many attacks on both military and civilian targets. I don't see anyone defending the latter.


You need to get out more.

In any case, the vaunted alerts issued by the IDF are at best a fig leaf and at worst a tactic used to herd civilians out of their homes and into camps.


What camps? Where were the camps? Civilians in Gaza fleeing the war could only go to the few places not occupied by their missile launching crews - which was almost no place in Gaza - which is where they were confined to because Egypt did not want them in Egypt. Even though Gaza was part of Egypt from 1947-67. No ships to evacuate them from the coast. Hamas attacked the US attempt to build a working pier for food aid. Hamas did what it could to block civilians from leaving.

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/hamas-tells-gaza-residents-stay-home-israel-ground-offensive-looms-2023-10-13/



You keep talking like Gaza is more than the land mass it is.
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Danielsjackson114
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In reply to EatMoreSalmon • 8:45p, 10/26/26
We do not call him Hamas Harry for nothing

Dude loves terrorist that use children as human shields
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In reply to boognish_bear • 10:05p, 10/26/26
boognish_bear said:

O ........ K .......
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The_barBEARian
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In reply to fubar • 11:59p, 10/26/26
fubar said:
boognish_bear said:

O ........ K .......

This bozo squandered a Republican controlled congress fighting wars for Israel... i'll never forgiven for that.
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12:38a, 10/27/26
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8:39p, 10/27/26
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In reply to EatMoreSalmon • 10:25p, 10/27/26
There have been hundreds of thousands of Gazans living in refugee camps for decades, and many more who are displaced (a majority of the population, in fact).
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12:09a, 10/28/26
What has the payoff been?

After Trump bombed Iran in June 2025 he said we "totally obliterated" their nuclear capability and set them back "decades."

What additional objectives have we accomplished after spending $47 billion of taxpayers money?

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12:15a, 10/28/26
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12:22a, 10/28/26
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