President Trump announces military strikes on Iran: Operation Epic Fury

179,543 Views | 3825 Replies | Last: 39 min ago by FLBear5630
Johnny Bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Realitybites said:

Johnny Bear said:

Realitybites said:

J.R. said:

Ok, let's cut through all the Trumpy Admin's lies and BS relative to his war of choice and see where we are:

1) No Nuclear Weapons. They are already back enriching- Strike 1

2) Regime Change-Strike 2

3) Wipe out Ballistic Capabilities. They still have half of their missiles and a chit ton of drones. Strike 3

That would be 0-3 for yall scoring at home. What a disaster.

oh, and the worse swing and a miss. Straight of Hourmuz shut down again. Viva la Donnie!

Face it. Sure Piggy destroyed some stuff, but make NO mistake we a losing by every metric. Sad but true.

This is a war we cannot win. Which is why every previous president did not go racing into it.

Even with ground forces, we cannot effect regime change in a civilizational state 6x as large as Iraq with 4x the population with an army 1/2 the size of the one we had during the Iraq war.

What a defeatist attitude. Sad. Glad that unlike '21 though '24 we have bold and smart leaders that don't agree.


Defeatist attitude?

No. An attitude born of wearing the ACUs of that Army that was 2x as large as this one for 8 years.

First of all, thank you for your service.

And I respect your informed opinion, but it kind of reminds me of the "mutually assured destruction" attitude during the Cold War that held that it is impossible for the USA and the West in general to ever bring down the Soviet Union and our only option is to insure the Soviets believe that any attempt to destroy us - even if successful - will at best also result in their destruction as well. And multiple US POTUS's adhered to this belief which among other things insured a never ending arms race with the constant possibility that one side or the other could make a lethal mistake and trigger that "mutual destruction". Then we got a really different POTUS named Ronald Reagan, who rejected that premise and believed that yes, the Soviet Union can be brought down. And the rest is history.

Today, we have another different kind of POTUS named Donald Trump that believes the enormous threat of a nuclear Iran can actually be eliminated. Yes, things still have to play out with respect to this military action designed to do so, but at a minimum things are at least on schedule less than a month and a half in.
Mitch Blood Green
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:



D. C. Bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Realitybites said:

Quote:


That's a very simplistic and poorly supported view. Our interests happen to coincide in some measure with Israel's. Are we the proxy of the various gulf states who also share those interests? Is Israel the proxy of Saudi Arabia?


Our relationship with the GCC countries is going to be fundamentally different after this.

"But depending on the outcome of this conflict, some Gulf countries may develop concerns about US reliability as an economic and security partner. Gulf leaders might, for example, fault Washington for an inability to control the conflict or for failing to find an off-ramp at an appropriate time. If this happens, some GCC countries might then choose to reinforce their partnership options beyond the United States by strengthening ties with Russia and Chinaperhaps economically at first, but potentially also strategically. This in turn could make it more difficult for the United States to pursue its interests in the region, not only in terms of its security goals and Iran policy, but also longer-term strategic partnerships on issues as varied as advanced technology, artificial intelligence, and nuclear energy.

Gulf countries have long proven that they maintain their own relationships with Iran and other groups to advance their own interests, much in the same way that many European countries do. These channels have proven useful to convey messages over the years, but the Trump administration should not underestimate Gulf countries' ability to use the same channels to take steps with Iran that might undercut US interests and long-term goals if Washington is unable to find a suitable off-ramp that serves GCC interests. Similarly, Iran might try to take advantage of its relationships with China, Russia, and the GCC in ways that run counter to US interests, even if the current conflict has created suspicion in Iran's relationship with its neighbors.

Mitigating these potential end states will be a long-term project that will require the focused attention of the Trump administration even after a resolution to the immediate conflict."

That's from the establishmentarian Atlantic Council.

The interests of the US and the GCC are increasingly diverging as we serve as Israel's proxy. Our interests vis-a-vis Iran have never been the same as Israel's. We want national security - no nukes on ICBMs and an open Strait of Hormuz. Israel wants Iran dismantled like Amalek (Bibi's own words).


Seems like the United States is primarily focused on Iran's nuclear and missile capability. That would not go along with being Israel's "proxy," according to your own analysis.
The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
D. C. Bear said:

FLBear5630 said:

The Pentagon summoned the Pope's ambassador, told him the United States has the military power to do "whatever it wants,"


This is a problem. Whiterock will say that Trump is just saying what we always imply. The difference is when you fo say it we become the problem in the world. Trump is using the US military and ICE as his own personal armies.

who is next? In Trump world NATO and Denmark are as bad as China and Cuba. As Gaetz says I hope Bibi doesn't say the Vatican is 2 weeks from a nuke. He will have Trump invade the Vatican. Jared Kushner, Trumps bag man, will go to extort what he wants. We have become the mob, Trump is governing based on 1970's mob movies.

We are Bibi's proxy...


That's a very simplistic and poorly supported view. Our interests happen to coincide in some measure with Israel's. Are we the proxy of the various gulf states who also share those interests? Is Israel the proxy of Saudi Arabia?

Pray tell what is America's interest in the Greater Israel project?

boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Does Kharg Island have resort potential?

FLBear5630
How long do you want to ignore this user?
D. C. Bear said:

FLBear5630 said:

The Pentagon summoned the Pope's ambassador, told him the United States has the military power to do "whatever it wants,"


This is a problem. Whiterock will say that Trump is just saying what we always imply. The difference is when you fo say it we become the problem in the world. Trump is using the US military and ICE as his own personal armies.

who is next? In Trump world NATO and Denmark are as bad as China and Cuba. As Gaetz says I hope Bibi doesn't say the Vatican is 2 weeks from a nuke. He will have Trump invade the Vatican. Jared Kushner, Trumps bag man, will go to extort what he wants. We have become the mob, Trump is governing based on 1970's mob movies.

We are Bibi's proxy...


That's a very simplistic and poorly supported view. Our interests happen to coincide in some measure with Israel's. Are we the proxy of the various gulf states who also share those interests? Is Israel the proxy of Saudi Arabia?

Our interests align? Why? How? We don't need the ME. Why do we HAVE to follow Israel? Good point on Saudi, who isn't fighting. So by your logic, we both are the proxy of Saudi. Makes it much better, huh?

You prepared to have your kids or grandkids drafted to fight for the ME?
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Can we get a miracle

trey3216
How long do you want to ignore this user?
The_barBEARian said:

So glad Assad is no longer around!...


you want things done in the Middle East, but hate when things are done in the Middle East. Maybe your buddy Putin can handle Assad
Mr. Treehorn treats objects like women, man.
D. C. Bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
The_barBEARian said:

D. C. Bear said:

FLBear5630 said:

The Pentagon summoned the Pope's ambassador, told him the United States has the military power to do "whatever it wants,"


This is a problem. Whiterock will say that Trump is just saying what we always imply. The difference is when you fo say it we become the problem in the world. Trump is using the US military and ICE as his own personal armies.

who is next? In Trump world NATO and Denmark are as bad as China and Cuba. As Gaetz says I hope Bibi doesn't say the Vatican is 2 weeks from a nuke. He will have Trump invade the Vatican. Jared Kushner, Trumps bag man, will go to extort what he wants. We have become the mob, Trump is governing based on 1970's mob movies.

We are Bibi's proxy...


That's a very simplistic and poorly supported view. Our interests happen to coincide in some measure with Israel's. Are we the proxy of the various gulf states who also share those interests? Is Israel the proxy of Saudi Arabia?

Pray tell what is America's interest in the Greater Israel project?




Unsurprisingly, the enemy of my friend also happens to be my enemy independent of my friend. Nothing to do with Israel.
EatMoreSalmon
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:

Can we get a miracle



Would be great, but can anyone be confident that Lebanon even has the ability to disarm Hezbollah?
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:

Can we get a miracle




Eh...

boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
FLBear5630
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:

boognish_bear said:

Can we get a miracle




Eh...



This is for your own good. The people are so happy we are doing this and bombing them. Hugs, Bibi...
D. C. Bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
FLBear5630 said:

D. C. Bear said:

FLBear5630 said:

The Pentagon summoned the Pope's ambassador, told him the United States has the military power to do "whatever it wants,"


This is a problem. Whiterock will say that Trump is just saying what we always imply. The difference is when you fo say it we become the problem in the world. Trump is using the US military and ICE as his own personal armies.

who is next? In Trump world NATO and Denmark are as bad as China and Cuba. As Gaetz says I hope Bibi doesn't say the Vatican is 2 weeks from a nuke. He will have Trump invade the Vatican. Jared Kushner, Trumps bag man, will go to extort what he wants. We have become the mob, Trump is governing based on 1970's mob movies.

We are Bibi's proxy...


That's a very simplistic and poorly supported view. Our interests happen to coincide in some measure with Israel's. Are we the proxy of the various gulf states who also share those interests? Is Israel the proxy of Saudi Arabia?

Our interests align? Why? How? We don't need the ME. Why do we HAVE to follow Israel? Good point on Saudi, who isn't fighting. So by your logic, we both are the proxy of Saudi. Makes it much better, huh?

You prepared to have your kids or grandkids drafted to fight for the ME?


Israel is interested in survival.
Iran is interested in Israel not existing.

Iran, by their choice, is our enemy.
We have an interest in their power being constrained.
Ideally, with an end to the Islamic Republic.

Thus, there is some degree of overlap in our interests.

It is unlikely that the United States will ever have a draft again, but my hope that this action against Iran may make it unnecessary for my grandkids to fight in South Korea or Japan, not just the Middle East.
The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
D. C. Bear said:

FLBear5630 said:

D. C. Bear said:

FLBear5630 said:

The Pentagon summoned the Pope's ambassador, told him the United States has the military power to do "whatever it wants,"


This is a problem. Whiterock will say that Trump is just saying what we always imply. The difference is when you fo say it we become the problem in the world. Trump is using the US military and ICE as his own personal armies.

who is next? In Trump world NATO and Denmark are as bad as China and Cuba. As Gaetz says I hope Bibi doesn't say the Vatican is 2 weeks from a nuke. He will have Trump invade the Vatican. Jared Kushner, Trumps bag man, will go to extort what he wants. We have become the mob, Trump is governing based on 1970's mob movies.

We are Bibi's proxy...


That's a very simplistic and poorly supported view. Our interests happen to coincide in some measure with Israel's. Are we the proxy of the various gulf states who also share those interests? Is Israel the proxy of Saudi Arabia?

Our interests align? Why? How? We don't need the ME. Why do we HAVE to follow Israel? Good point on Saudi, who isn't fighting. So by your logic, we both are the proxy of Saudi. Makes it much better, huh?

You prepared to have your kids or grandkids drafted to fight for the ME?


Israel is interested in survival.
Iran is interested in Israel not existing.

Iran, by their choice, is our enemy.
We have an interest in their power being constrained.
Ideally, with an end to the Islamic Republic.

Thus, there is some degree of overlap in our interests.

It is unlikely that the United States will ever have a draft again, but my hope that this action against Iran may make it unnecessary for my grandkids to fight in South Korea or Japan, not just the Middle East.


Unfortunately you are setting up a future for your grandkids to get their heads caved in by an illegal Haitian in a 7-11 parking lot bcs you put Israel First over America First... Republicans could have held congress in the midterms if they had told Israel to **** off.

boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
If they have zero leverage why do we even need to negotiate?

The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:




Why do we have two Israelis negotiating on our behalf?
EatMoreSalmon
How long do you want to ignore this user?
The_barBEARian said:

boognish_bear said:




Why do we have two Israelis negotiating on our behalf?

Because Stephen A. Smith and Denzel Washington couldn't fit it into their schedule.
FLBear5630
How long do you want to ignore this user?
D. C. Bear said:

FLBear5630 said:

D. C. Bear said:

FLBear5630 said:

The Pentagon summoned the Pope's ambassador, told him the United States has the military power to do "whatever it wants,"


This is a problem. Whiterock will say that Trump is just saying what we always imply. The difference is when you fo say it we become the problem in the world. Trump is using the US military and ICE as his own personal armies.

who is next? In Trump world NATO and Denmark are as bad as China and Cuba. As Gaetz says I hope Bibi doesn't say the Vatican is 2 weeks from a nuke. He will have Trump invade the Vatican. Jared Kushner, Trumps bag man, will go to extort what he wants. We have become the mob, Trump is governing based on 1970's mob movies.

We are Bibi's proxy...


That's a very simplistic and poorly supported view. Our interests happen to coincide in some measure with Israel's. Are we the proxy of the various gulf states who also share those interests? Is Israel the proxy of Saudi Arabia?

Our interests align? Why? How? We don't need the ME. Why do we HAVE to follow Israel? Good point on Saudi, who isn't fighting. So by your logic, we both are the proxy of Saudi. Makes it much better, huh?

You prepared to have your kids or grandkids drafted to fight for the ME?


Israel is interested in survival.
Iran is interested in Israel not existing.

Iran, by their choice, is our enemy.
We have an interest in their power being constrained.
Ideally, with an end to the Islamic Republic.

Thus, there is some degree of overlap in our interests.

It is unlikely that the United States will ever have a draft again, but my hope that this action against Iran may make it unnecessary for my grandkids to fight in South Korea or Japan, not just the Middle East.

You made a very good case for Israel to fight Iran.
FLBear5630
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:



Why is Kushner and Witkoff at the table? Two real estate developers? Anyone else find this strange?
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
D. C. Bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
FLBear5630 said:

boognish_bear said:



Why is Kushner and Witkoff at the table? Two real estate developers? Anyone else find this strange?


Given that Kushner successfully negotiated the Abraham Accords and that Trump appointed Witkoff as a special envoy to the Middle East before he took office in his second term, no, I do not find it particularly strange. Then again, I don't find much that Trump does strange because I don't expect him to behave like a normal president.
D. C. Bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
FLBear5630 said:

D. C. Bear said:

FLBear5630 said:

D. C. Bear said:

FLBear5630 said:

The Pentagon summoned the Pope's ambassador, told him the United States has the military power to do "whatever it wants,"


This is a problem. Whiterock will say that Trump is just saying what we always imply. The difference is when you fo say it we become the problem in the world. Trump is using the US military and ICE as his own personal armies.

who is next? In Trump world NATO and Denmark are as bad as China and Cuba. As Gaetz says I hope Bibi doesn't say the Vatican is 2 weeks from a nuke. He will have Trump invade the Vatican. Jared Kushner, Trumps bag man, will go to extort what he wants. We have become the mob, Trump is governing based on 1970's mob movies.

We are Bibi's proxy...


That's a very simplistic and poorly supported view. Our interests happen to coincide in some measure with Israel's. Are we the proxy of the various gulf states who also share those interests? Is Israel the proxy of Saudi Arabia?

Our interests align? Why? How? We don't need the ME. Why do we HAVE to follow Israel? Good point on Saudi, who isn't fighting. So by your logic, we both are the proxy of Saudi. Makes it much better, huh?

You prepared to have your kids or grandkids drafted to fight for the ME?


Israel is interested in survival.
Iran is interested in Israel not existing.

Iran, by their choice, is our enemy.
We have an interest in their power being constrained.
Ideally, with an end to the Islamic Republic.

Thus, there is some degree of overlap in our interests.

It is unlikely that the United States will ever have a draft again, but my hope that this action against Iran may make it unnecessary for my grandkids to fight in South Korea or Japan, not just the Middle East.

You made a very good case for Israel to fight Iran.


Iran makes a very good case for us to fight them.
Redbrickbear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:




The guy who help run interference against Trump during the BLM riots

Was determined to change the name of military bases for social justice points.

And wrote a book about how "honorable" he was to gain currency the DC liberal elite.

Yea…not taking anything he says at face value





ATL Bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
D. C. Bear said:

Realitybites said:

Quote:


That's a very simplistic and poorly supported view. Our interests happen to coincide in some measure with Israel's. Are we the proxy of the various gulf states who also share those interests? Is Israel the proxy of Saudi Arabia?


Our relationship with the GCC countries is going to be fundamentally different after this.

"But depending on the outcome of this conflict, some Gulf countries may develop concerns about US reliability as an economic and security partner. Gulf leaders might, for example, fault Washington for an inability to control the conflict or for failing to find an off-ramp at an appropriate time. If this happens, some GCC countries might then choose to reinforce their partnership options beyond the United States by strengthening ties with Russia and Chinaperhaps economically at first, but potentially also strategically. This in turn could make it more difficult for the United States to pursue its interests in the region, not only in terms of its security goals and Iran policy, but also longer-term strategic partnerships on issues as varied as advanced technology, artificial intelligence, and nuclear energy.

Gulf countries have long proven that they maintain their own relationships with Iran and other groups to advance their own interests, much in the same way that many European countries do. These channels have proven useful to convey messages over the years, but the Trump administration should not underestimate Gulf countries' ability to use the same channels to take steps with Iran that might undercut US interests and long-term goals if Washington is unable to find a suitable off-ramp that serves GCC interests. Similarly, Iran might try to take advantage of its relationships with China, Russia, and the GCC in ways that run counter to US interests, even if the current conflict has created suspicion in Iran's relationship with its neighbors.

Mitigating these potential end states will be a long-term project that will require the focused attention of the Trump administration even after a resolution to the immediate conflict."

That's from the establishmentarian Atlantic Council.

The interests of the US and the GCC are increasingly diverging as we serve as Israel's proxy. Our interests vis-a-vis Iran have never been the same as Israel's. We want national security - no nukes on ICBMs and an open Strait of Hormuz. Israel wants Iran dismantled like Amalek (Bibi's own words).


Seems like the United States is primarily focused on Iran's nuclear and missile capability. That would not go along with being Israel's "proxy," according to your own analysis.
If that were the focus, we'd be leaving.
D. C. Bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
ATL Bear said:

D. C. Bear said:

Realitybites said:

Quote:


That's a very simplistic and poorly supported view. Our interests happen to coincide in some measure with Israel's. Are we the proxy of the various gulf states who also share those interests? Is Israel the proxy of Saudi Arabia?


Our relationship with the GCC countries is going to be fundamentally different after this.

"But depending on the outcome of this conflict, some Gulf countries may develop concerns about US reliability as an economic and security partner. Gulf leaders might, for example, fault Washington for an inability to control the conflict or for failing to find an off-ramp at an appropriate time. If this happens, some GCC countries might then choose to reinforce their partnership options beyond the United States by strengthening ties with Russia and Chinaperhaps economically at first, but potentially also strategically. This in turn could make it more difficult for the United States to pursue its interests in the region, not only in terms of its security goals and Iran policy, but also longer-term strategic partnerships on issues as varied as advanced technology, artificial intelligence, and nuclear energy.

Gulf countries have long proven that they maintain their own relationships with Iran and other groups to advance their own interests, much in the same way that many European countries do. These channels have proven useful to convey messages over the years, but the Trump administration should not underestimate Gulf countries' ability to use the same channels to take steps with Iran that might undercut US interests and long-term goals if Washington is unable to find a suitable off-ramp that serves GCC interests. Similarly, Iran might try to take advantage of its relationships with China, Russia, and the GCC in ways that run counter to US interests, even if the current conflict has created suspicion in Iran's relationship with its neighbors.

Mitigating these potential end states will be a long-term project that will require the focused attention of the Trump administration even after a resolution to the immediate conflict."

That's from the establishmentarian Atlantic Council.

The interests of the US and the GCC are increasingly diverging as we serve as Israel's proxy. Our interests vis-a-vis Iran have never been the same as Israel's. We want national security - no nukes on ICBMs and an open Strait of Hormuz. Israel wants Iran dismantled like Amalek (Bibi's own words).


Seems like the United States is primarily focused on Iran's nuclear and missile capability. That would not go along with being Israel's "proxy," according to your own analysis.
If that were the focus, we'd be leaving.


What makes you think we aren't?
ATL Bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
D. C. Bear said:

ATL Bear said:

D. C. Bear said:

Realitybites said:

Quote:


That's a very simplistic and poorly supported view. Our interests happen to coincide in some measure with Israel's. Are we the proxy of the various gulf states who also share those interests? Is Israel the proxy of Saudi Arabia?


Our relationship with the GCC countries is going to be fundamentally different after this.

"But depending on the outcome of this conflict, some Gulf countries may develop concerns about US reliability as an economic and security partner. Gulf leaders might, for example, fault Washington for an inability to control the conflict or for failing to find an off-ramp at an appropriate time. If this happens, some GCC countries might then choose to reinforce their partnership options beyond the United States by strengthening ties with Russia and Chinaperhaps economically at first, but potentially also strategically. This in turn could make it more difficult for the United States to pursue its interests in the region, not only in terms of its security goals and Iran policy, but also longer-term strategic partnerships on issues as varied as advanced technology, artificial intelligence, and nuclear energy.

Gulf countries have long proven that they maintain their own relationships with Iran and other groups to advance their own interests, much in the same way that many European countries do. These channels have proven useful to convey messages over the years, but the Trump administration should not underestimate Gulf countries' ability to use the same channels to take steps with Iran that might undercut US interests and long-term goals if Washington is unable to find a suitable off-ramp that serves GCC interests. Similarly, Iran might try to take advantage of its relationships with China, Russia, and the GCC in ways that run counter to US interests, even if the current conflict has created suspicion in Iran's relationship with its neighbors.

Mitigating these potential end states will be a long-term project that will require the focused attention of the Trump administration even after a resolution to the immediate conflict."

That's from the establishmentarian Atlantic Council.

The interests of the US and the GCC are increasingly diverging as we serve as Israel's proxy. Our interests vis-a-vis Iran have never been the same as Israel's. We want national security - no nukes on ICBMs and an open Strait of Hormuz. Israel wants Iran dismantled like Amalek (Bibi's own words).


Seems like the United States is primarily focused on Iran's nuclear and missile capability. That would not go along with being Israel's "proxy," according to your own analysis.
If that were the focus, we'd be leaving.


What makes you think we aren't?
Military movement, diplomatic inanity, and the words and actions of both parties.
cms186
How long do you want to ignore this user?
I'm the English Guy
FLBear5630
How long do you want to ignore this user?
D. C. Bear said:

FLBear5630 said:

boognish_bear said:



Why is Kushner and Witkoff at the table? Two real estate developers? Anyone else find this strange?


Given that Kushner successfully negotiated the Abraham Accords and that Trump appointed Witkoff as a special envoy to the Middle East before he took office in his second term, no, I do not find it particularly strange. Then again, I don't find much that Trump does strange because I don't expect him to behave like a normal president.


interesting point.
Sam Lowry
How long do you want to ignore this user?
FLBear5630 said:

boognish_bear said:



Why is Kushner and Witkoff at the table? Two real estate developers? Anyone else find this strange?

Almost as strange as their strongly pro-Zionist views. No one negotiating on behalf of the United States should have any loyalty to any country other than the United States.
J.R.
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Jack Bauer said:

Now I've seen everything





Now, what branch of the service did Queen Lindsey serve? This guy needs to move along. He is one of the few overt Trump Cheerleaders. I thought Texas had a clown show in the Senate. Queen Lindsey is an embarrassment to the great state of SC. Glad my tuition $ went to a private institution in SC.
EatMoreSalmon
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Sam Lowry said:

FLBear5630 said:

boognish_bear said:



Why is Kushner and Witkoff at the table? Two real estate developers? Anyone else find this strange?

Almost as strange as their strongly pro-Zionist views. No one negotiating on behalf of the United States should have any loyalty to any country other than the United States.

That sounds downright stereotyped MAGA.
First Page Last Page
Page 107 of 110
 
×
subscribe Verify your student status
See Subscription Benefits
Trial only available to users who have never subscribed or participated in a previous trial.