FLBear5630 said:Oldbear83 said:FLBear5630 said:
That is not even worth responding.
Why not? You have something against the Amish?
No, because one group not being violent doesn't negate the point
There are many absolutes in Islamist nations, and is the choice of governance for hundreds of millions of Muslims.FLBear5630 said:
You are kidding right? One non-violent group makes all fundamentalist peaceful or only Christian fundamentalist? Right? You keep doing you..
Just curious why are you guys so into absolutes? There are no absolutes, there is always an outlier, always an exception. The world is gray, not black and white
FLBear5630 said:
You are kidding right? One non-violent group makes all fundamentalist peaceful or only Christian fundamentalist? Right? You keep doing you..
Just curious why are you guys so into absolutes? There are no absolutes, there is always an outlier, always an exception. The world is gray, not black and white
FLBear5630 said:Sam Lowry said:FLBear5630 said:hodedofome said:J.R. said:hodedofome said:Porteroso said:
Extremist rhetoric like that does need to be dealt with. It is threatening. But American Muslins are just not like that for the most part.
I know one family of Muslims, and they are very kind. They would get eaten alive by the zealots in the Middle East.
They are probably more agnostic than Muslim then.
And I don't know how you can speak for American Muslims by just knowing 1 family.
All you need is a very small, but vocal, and violent, minority of radical Muslims and they will rule over everyone else.
We can only speak from our own experiences . One of my best friends is Muslim (Muslim Lite as she says) is of Pakistani decent, but was raised in Calgary and Singapore. Came to Dallas to SMU for MBA. Undergrad McGill. She ended up being a c-suite executive a a little cosmetics company based in Dallas. All that to say is that she is one of the finest humans I know, irrespective of religion.
So let's give all the power to some crazy people following Satan into the end times because you know a nice lady.
Follow Satan????
These fundamentalists actually think Allah is the devil. One of many facts I've learned in this ideological funhouse of a forum.
Oh fundamentalist Christians. I thought fundamentalist Moslems! Well, same answer for either. The fringes are always extremist. The only problem is when they get in power, like Iran for Moslems and I will let you fill in the blank for Christians...
Sam Lowry said:FLBear5630 said:Sam Lowry said:FLBear5630 said:hodedofome said:J.R. said:hodedofome said:Porteroso said:
Extremist rhetoric like that does need to be dealt with. It is threatening. But American Muslins are just not like that for the most part.
I know one family of Muslims, and they are very kind. They would get eaten alive by the zealots in the Middle East.
They are probably more agnostic than Muslim then.
And I don't know how you can speak for American Muslims by just knowing 1 family.
All you need is a very small, but vocal, and violent, minority of radical Muslims and they will rule over everyone else.
We can only speak from our own experiences . One of my best friends is Muslim (Muslim Lite as she says) is of Pakistani decent, but was raised in Calgary and Singapore. Came to Dallas to SMU for MBA. Undergrad McGill. She ended up being a c-suite executive a a little cosmetics company based in Dallas. All that to say is that she is one of the finest humans I know, irrespective of religion.
So let's give all the power to some crazy people following Satan into the end times because you know a nice lady.
Follow Satan????
These fundamentalists actually think Allah is the devil. One of many facts I've learned in this ideological funhouse of a forum.
Oh fundamentalist Christians. I thought fundamentalist Moslems! Well, same answer for either. The fringes are always extremist. The only problem is when they get in power, like Iran for Moslems and I will let you fill in the blank for Christians...
Indeed, there is probably no religious group in the world more committed to ideological violence than fundamentalist Christians.
Oldbear83 said:FLBear5630 said:
You are kidding right? One non-violent group makes all fundamentalist peaceful or only Christian fundamentalist? Right? You keep doing you..
Just curious why are you guys so into absolutes? There are no absolutes, there is always an outlier, always an exception. The world is gray, not black and white
It's simple enough. 'Fundamentalist' cannot properly be used to equate to 'violent'.
Just use accurate definitions.
And yes, words do have specific meanings.
Oldbear83 said:
J.R. into bombing abortion clinics?
Did not expect that, even from him.
J.R. said:Oldbear83 said:
J.R. into bombing abortion clinics?
Did not expect that, even from him.
simply pointing out the Christian Hypocrisy . Bad when a muzzy or jew kills folks in the name of religion. I'd argue Christians can be just as bloodthirsty. all in the name of religion, Just pointing out what it seems you hard right christian folk think is justified. cuz...they killlllin babies. wah, wah. I know some fine Christian folk who live it. It know a lot of others "Christians" who are down right POS, particularly behind closed doors.
Mothra said:J.R. said:Oldbear83 said:
J.R. into bombing abortion clinics?
Did not expect that, even from him.
simply pointing out the Christian Hypocrisy . Bad when a muzzy or jew kills folks in the name of religion. I'd argue Christians can be just as bloodthirsty. all in the name of religion, Just pointing out what it seems you hard right christian folk think is justified. cuz...they killlllin babies. wah, wah. I know some fine Christian folk who live it. It know a lot of others "Christians" who are down right POS, particularly behind closed doors.
Problem is, there just isn't any evidence to support your moral equivalency argument.
Between 1979 and 2021, Islamist terrorist attacks caused at least 210,138 deaths globally. Around 23,000 were killed in 2023. IS remains the world's deadliest terrorist organization, responsible for 1,805 deaths across 22 countries. Boko Haram is a close second, followed by al-Qaeda. What's even more scary is that polls show at least 1/4 to 1/5 of the Muslim population agrees with their actions.
OTOH, there have been only 11 deaths by parties opposing abortion worldwide since 1993, Most of these occurred at the hands of two people, neither of which was a purported Christian. Indeed, the groups that engage in such tactics don't even do so in the name of Christianity, so I would be hesitant to call them Christian terrorists.
This is the extent of "Christian" terrorism in the world today, if you can even call it that. 233,138 deaths vs. 11.
FLBear5630 said:
Literal Definition, huh?
fundamentalist
[fndmntlst]
noun
adjective
fundamentalist (noun)
fundamentalists (plural noun)
[ol]a person who believes in the strict, literal interpretation of scripture in a religion: [/ol]
"religious fundamentalists"
- a person who adheres strictly to the basic principles of any subject or discipline:
"a free-market fundamentalist"
Why would ANYONE think that a fundamentalist Christian may be prone to violence?
2 Chronicles 15:12-13
And they entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and with all their soul, but that whoever would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, should be put to death, whether young or old, man or woman.
Matthew 10:34
"Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword.
Luke 19:27
But as for these enemies of mine, who did not want me to reign over them, bring them here and slaughter them before me.'"
Deuteronomy 17:1-20
"You shall not sacrifice to the Lord your God an ox or a sheep in which is a blemish, any defect whatever, for that is an abomination to the Lord your God. "If there is found among you, within any of your towns that the Lord your God is giving you, a man or woman who does what is evil in the sight of the Lord your God, in transgressing his covenant, and has gone and served other gods and worshiped them, or the sun or the moon or any of the host of heaven, which I have forbidden, and it is told you and you hear of it, then you shall inquire diligently, and if it is true and certain that such an abomination has been done in Israel, then you shall bring out to your gates that man or woman who has done this evil thing, and you shall stone that man or woman to death with stones. ...
Leviticus 20:10
"If a man commits adultery with the wife of his neighbor, both the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.
Leviticus 20:13
If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them.
Exodus 22:19
"Whoever lies with an animal shall be put to death.
Leviticus 20:27
"A man or a woman who is a medium or a necromancer shall surely be put to death. They shall be stoned with stones; their blood shall be upon them."
Romans 13:4
For he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer.
2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,
2 Chronicles 15:13
But that whoever would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, should be put to death, whether young or old, man or woman.
There are many more. I can't see how anyone would think Christians are anything but peaceful, especially those that LITERALLY (Fundamentalist) follow the Bible.
J.R. said:Mothra said:J.R. said:Oldbear83 said:
J.R. into bombing abortion clinics?
Did not expect that, even from him.
simply pointing out the Christian Hypocrisy . Bad when a muzzy or jew kills folks in the name of religion. I'd argue Christians can be just as bloodthirsty. all in the name of religion, Just pointing out what it seems you hard right christian folk think is justified. cuz...they killlllin babies. wah, wah. I know some fine Christian folk who live it. It know a lot of others "Christians" who are down right POS, particularly behind closed doors.
Problem is, there just isn't any evidence to support your moral equivalency argument.
Between 1979 and 2021, Islamist terrorist attacks caused at least 210,138 deaths globally. Around 23,000 were killed in 2023. IS remains the world's deadliest terrorist organization, responsible for 1,805 deaths across 22 countries. Boko Haram is a close second, followed by al-Qaeda. What's even more scary is that polls show at least 1/4 to 1/5 of the Muslim population agrees with their actions.
OTOH, there have been only 11 deaths by parties opposing abortion worldwide since 1993, Most of these occurred at the hands of two people, neither of which was a purported Christian. Indeed, the groups that engage in such tactics don't even do so in the name of Christianity, so I would be hesitant to call them Christian terrorists.
This is the extent of "Christian" terrorism in the world today, if you can even call it that. 233,138 deaths vs. 11.
not angling toward any moral equivalence as that is out of my lane. Just pointing out there are heretics in every religion. Diddlers too. I think a preacher man of some mega church just got out jail for diddling. Robert Morris , perhaps. Don't keep up with any TV or Megachurh preachers.
Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:
Literal Definition, huh?
fundamentalist
[fndmntlst]
noun
adjective
fundamentalist (noun)
fundamentalists (plural noun)
[ol]a person who believes in the strict, literal interpretation of scripture in a religion: [/ol]
"religious fundamentalists"
- a person who adheres strictly to the basic principles of any subject or discipline:
"a free-market fundamentalist"
Why would ANYONE think that a fundamentalist Christian may be prone to violence?
2 Chronicles 15:12-13
And they entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and with all their soul, but that whoever would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, should be put to death, whether young or old, man or woman.
Matthew 10:34
"Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword.
Luke 19:27
But as for these enemies of mine, who did not want me to reign over them, bring them here and slaughter them before me.'"
Deuteronomy 17:1-20
"You shall not sacrifice to the Lord your God an ox or a sheep in which is a blemish, any defect whatever, for that is an abomination to the Lord your God. "If there is found among you, within any of your towns that the Lord your God is giving you, a man or woman who does what is evil in the sight of the Lord your God, in transgressing his covenant, and has gone and served other gods and worshiped them, or the sun or the moon or any of the host of heaven, which I have forbidden, and it is told you and you hear of it, then you shall inquire diligently, and if it is true and certain that such an abomination has been done in Israel, then you shall bring out to your gates that man or woman who has done this evil thing, and you shall stone that man or woman to death with stones. ...
Leviticus 20:10
"If a man commits adultery with the wife of his neighbor, both the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.
Leviticus 20:13
If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them.
Exodus 22:19
"Whoever lies with an animal shall be put to death.
Leviticus 20:27
"A man or a woman who is a medium or a necromancer shall surely be put to death. They shall be stoned with stones; their blood shall be upon them."
Romans 13:4
For he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer.
2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,
2 Chronicles 15:13
But that whoever would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, should be put to death, whether young or old, man or woman.
There are many more. I can't see how anyone would think Christians are anything but peaceful, especially those that LITERALLY (Fundamentalist) follow the Bible.
So, I realize you have a narrative you're trying to perpetuate, but none of the NT verses you referenced advocated violence.
As for the OT, if you were a Christian you would know that we are under a New Covenant, which does not condone violence of any sort.
It's why as I pointed out above, there literally is no Christian terrorism in the world today from a statistical standpoint.
J.R. said:Oldbear83 said:
J.R. into bombing abortion clinics?
Did not expect that, even from him.
simply pointing out the Christian Hypocrisy . Bad when a muzzy or jew kills folks in the name of religion. I'd argue Christians can be just as bloodthirsty. all in the name of religion, Just pointing out what it seems you hard right christian folk think is justified. cuz...they killlllin babies. wah, wah. I know some fine Christian folk who live it. It know a lot of others "Christians" who are down right POS, particularly behind closed doors.
Oldbear83 said:J.R. said:Oldbear83 said:
J.R. into bombing abortion clinics?
Did not expect that, even from him.
simply pointing out the Christian Hypocrisy . Bad when a muzzy or jew kills folks in the name of religion. I'd argue Christians can be just as bloodthirsty. all in the name of religion, Just pointing out what it seems you hard right christian folk think is justified. cuz...they killlllin babies. wah, wah. I know some fine Christian folk who live it. It know a lot of others "Christians" who are down right POS, particularly behind closed doors.
Seems to me criminal behavior is the mark of a criminal, not a denomination. Like I said, you don't see Amish being violent, and there are other fundamentalist groups which eschew violence. The word doesn't automatically mean whatever you want it to say .
Bombers are psychos, people who believe different are not automatically psychos.
FLBear5630 said:
Ok, you believe they follow Satan based on your fundamental believes.
If we are going to discuss religion shouldn't it be from an objective spot? Your believes are fine for you.. Millions of Moslems disagree with your assessment.
hodedofome said:FLBear5630 said:
Ok, you believe they follow Satan based on your fundamental believes.
If we are going to discuss religion shouldn't it be from an objective spot? Your believes are fine for you.. Millions of Moslems disagree with your assessment.
No, it is based on both the bible and the quran. The Bible is very clear that an angel could appear and preach a different gospel than the one the disciples preached. That is what led both Muhammed and John Smith astray.
The bible is very clear in Revelation who the beast and the false prophet are.
In Islam, the Al-Mahdi is the beast aka antichrist, and he is assisted by the false prophet. You're a little off that millions of Muslims disagree with the facts. It is more like 2 billion who are deceived.
Anyone reading both the Bible and the Quran/Hadith can spot the original and the counterfeit (written 600 years later) pretty easily.
FLBear5630 said:hodedofome said:J.R. said:hodedofome said:Porteroso said:
Extremist rhetoric like that does need to be dealt with. It is threatening. But American Muslins are just not like that for the most part.
I know one family of Muslims, and they are very kind. They would get eaten alive by the zealots in the Middle East.
They are probably more agnostic than Muslim then.
And I don't know how you can speak for American Muslims by just knowing 1 family.
All you need is a very small, but vocal, and violent, minority of radical Muslims and they will rule over everyone else.
We can only speak from our own experiences . One of my best friends is Muslim (Muslim Lite as she says) is of Pakistani decent, but was raised in Calgary and Singapore. Came to Dallas to SMU for MBA. Undergrad McGill. She ended up being a c-suite executive a a little cosmetics company based in Dallas. All that to say is that she is one of the finest humans I know, irrespective of religion.
So let's give all the power to some crazy people following Satan into the end times because you know a nice lady.
Follow Satan????
FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:Sam Lowry said:FLBear5630 said:hodedofome said:J.R. said:hodedofome said:Porteroso said:
Extremist rhetoric like that does need to be dealt with. It is threatening. But American Muslins are just not like that for the most part.
I know one family of Muslims, and they are very kind. They would get eaten alive by the zealots in the Middle East.
They are probably more agnostic than Muslim then.
And I don't know how you can speak for American Muslims by just knowing 1 family.
All you need is a very small, but vocal, and violent, minority of radical Muslims and they will rule over everyone else.
We can only speak from our own experiences . One of my best friends is Muslim (Muslim Lite as she says) is of Pakistani decent, but was raised in Calgary and Singapore. Came to Dallas to SMU for MBA. Undergrad McGill. She ended up being a c-suite executive a a little cosmetics company based in Dallas. All that to say is that she is one of the finest humans I know, irrespective of religion.
So let's give all the power to some crazy people following Satan into the end times because you know a nice lady.
Follow Satan????
These fundamentalists actually think Allah is the devil. One of many facts I've learned in this ideological funhouse of a forum.
Oh fundamentalist Christians. I thought fundamentalist Moslems! Well, same answer for either. The fringes are always extremist. The only problem is when they get in power, like Iran for Moslems and I will let you fill in the blank for Christians...
I think you're missing a tiny little difference between fundamentalist Christians and fundamentalist Moslems. The former doesn't murder unbelievers.
Oh don't sell Christian short, we have a rather spectacular history of killing people that don't believe in what we do.
I suppose it depends on what you mean by fundamentalist Christian. I would submit that misguided people who claimed to be Christian violated Christ's commands several hundred years ago. But people who are true followers of Christ and adhere to his commands (i.e. fundamentalists) have not, and do not kill people.
Devout and fundamentalist Muslims, on the other hand, must do so, as that is what their religion commands.
Therein lies the difference. So your statement is just demonstrably false.
Yeah, but the Moslem's I know from Iran, Algeria and Saudi all say the same thing about those outliers. No where in the Quaran does it say to kill non-believers.
FLBear5630 said:Oldbear83 said:FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:Johnny Bear said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:Sam Lowry said:FLBear5630 said:hodedofome said:J.R. said:hodedofome said:Porteroso said:
Extremist rhetoric like that does need to be dealt with. It is threatening. But American Muslins are just not like that for the most part.
I know one family of Muslims, and they are very kind. They would get eaten alive by the zealots in the Middle East.
They are probably more agnostic than Muslim then.
And I don't know how you can speak for American Muslims by just knowing 1 family.
All you need is a very small, but vocal, and violent, minority of radical Muslims and they will rule over everyone else.
We can only speak from our own experiences . One of my best friends is Muslim (Muslim Lite as she says) is of Pakistani decent, but was raised in Calgary and Singapore. Came to Dallas to SMU for MBA. Undergrad McGill. She ended up being a c-suite executive a a little cosmetics company based in Dallas. All that to say is that she is one of the finest humans I know, irrespective of religion.
So let's give all the power to some crazy people following Satan into the end times because you know a nice lady.
Follow Satan????
These fundamentalists actually think Allah is the devil. One of many facts I've learned in this ideological funhouse of a forum.
Oh fundamentalist Christians. I thought fundamentalist Moslems! Well, same answer for either. The fringes are always extremist. The only problem is when they get in power, like Iran for Moslems and I will let you fill in the blank for Christians...
I think you're missing a tiny little difference between fundamentalist Christians and fundamentalist Moslems. The former doesn't murder unbelievers.
Oh don't sell Christian short, we have a rather spectacular history of killing people that don't believe in what we do.
I suppose it depends on what you mean by fundamentalist Christian. I would submit that misguided people who claimed to be Christian violated Christ's commands several hundred years ago. But people who are true followers of Christ and adhere to his commands (i.e. fundamentalists) have not, and do not kill people.
Devout and fundamentalist Muslims, on the other hand, must do so, as that is what their religion commands.
Therein lies the difference. So your statement is just demonstrably false.
His post is probably a reference to the Crusades and if it is, he has the incorrect view that a lot of people have been mis-educated to think, which is that the Crusades were all about the "evil" European Christians attacking and pillaging the poor peaceful Muslims who were just sitting there minding their own business. If anyone takes the time to actually study that history, it is clear they were defensive wars intended to keep Western Europe from being overrun by Muslims and forced to convert to Islam. Yes, a lot of savagery and violence happened on both sides (that's the way wars are) but it's crock that they were unprovoked wars of aggression on the part of European Christians.
Fundamentalism of ANY side is a problem.
This is where you err. Fundamentalist Christians were not the problem in the crusades. Fundamentalist Christians do not kill others.
Fundamentalist Moslems are commanded to do so.
That is the point you're missing, as I tried to explain above.
err? I didn't cast blame on either.
Do you know that the verse you cited in Luke was Jesus speaking in parable?
Context is lost on some.
You get the point. I am not debating Bible study. I am showing that context might be lost on the opposing side. You know it, do the Jews know it? Do the Moslems know it? Do our enemies know it? There are many confrontations over one side or the other not understanding context. As I said, I was not saying one side is right or wrong.
FLBear5630 said:
This is great for your Bible study or church group, but it is pretty difficult to deal with people drom the perspective that they are Satan worshippers because they dont believe what you do.
How do you negotiate or find any common ground when your position is one of moral superiority and you have to convert them? They believe you are from Satan just as much.
FLBear5630 said:
This is great for your Bible study or church group, but it is pretty difficult to deal with people drom the perspective that they are Satan worshippers because they dont believe what you do.
How do you negotiate or find any common ground when your position is one of moral superiority and you have to convert them? They believe you are from Satan just as much.
FLBear5630 said:hodedofome said:FLBear5630 said:
Ok, you believe they follow Satan based on your fundamental believes.
If we are going to discuss religion shouldn't it be from an objective spot? Your believes are fine for you.. Millions of Moslems disagree with your assessment.
No, it is based on both the bible and the quran. The Bible is very clear that an angel could appear and preach a different gospel than the one the disciples preached. That is what led both Muhammed and John Smith astray.
The bible is very clear in Revelation who the beast and the false prophet are.
In Islam, the Al-Mahdi is the beast aka antichrist, and he is assisted by the false prophet. You're a little off that millions of Muslims disagree with the facts. It is more like 2 billion who are deceived.
Anyone reading both the Bible and the Quran/Hadith can spot the original and the counterfeit (written 600 years later) pretty easily.
Right, that is your believe of it as a Christian. The Moslem doesn't look at it that way. Sort of hard to make any head way with people from the "I am right you are wrong" position. I am sure telling Moslems that 2B have been deceived is a great opener. Going to go full Cpt Cook, huh?
Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:
This is great for your Bible study or church group, but it is pretty difficult to deal with people drom the perspective that they are Satan worshippers because they dont believe what you do.
How do you negotiate or find any common ground when your position is one of moral superiority and you have to convert them? They believe you are from Satan just as much.
Who said we can't negotiate with them or even be allies with them? Nobody. We are friendly with plenty of countries that don't share our belief systems or Western values.
FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:
This is great for your Bible study or church group, but it is pretty difficult to deal with people drom the perspective that they are Satan worshippers because they dont believe what you do.
How do you negotiate or find any common ground when your position is one of moral superiority and you have to convert them? They believe you are from Satan just as much.
Who said we can't negotiate with them or even be allies with them? Nobody. We are friendly with plenty of countries that don't share our belief systems or Western values.
Ok, maybe starting iff with calling them Satan worshippers who wanted to kill all non-believers gave me the wrong idea, silly me.
Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:
This is great for your Bible study or church group, but it is pretty difficult to deal with people drom the perspective that they are Satan worshippers because they dont believe what you do.
How do you negotiate or find any common ground when your position is one of moral superiority and you have to convert them? They believe you are from Satan just as much.
Who said we can't negotiate with them or even be allies with them? Nobody. We are friendly with plenty of countries that don't share our belief systems or Western values.
Ok, maybe starting iff with calling them Satan worshippers who wanted to kill all non-believers gave me the wrong idea, silly me.
I would submit you have great difficulty understanding context. I attribute it to the fact you seem to jump into conversations midstream without reading prior posts.
From a Christian perspective, Muslims have indeed been led astray by Satan himself, just like any religion that separates man from God and leads people down a path toward destruction. That does not mean we can't interact and be friendly with them. Indeed, Christ calls us to do so. But that doesn't mean we cannot recognize that Satan is ultimately behind the deception.
FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:
This is great for your Bible study or church group, but it is pretty difficult to deal with people drom the perspective that they are Satan worshippers because they dont believe what you do.
How do you negotiate or find any common ground when your position is one of moral superiority and you have to convert them? They believe you are from Satan just as much.
Who said we can't negotiate with them or even be allies with them? Nobody. We are friendly with plenty of countries that don't share our belief systems or Western values.
Ok, maybe starting iff with calling them Satan worshippers who wanted to kill all non-believers gave me the wrong idea, silly me.
I would submit you have great difficulty understanding context. I attribute it to the fact you seem to jump into conversations midstream without reading prior posts.
From a Christian perspective, Muslims have indeed been led astray by Satan himself, just like any religion that separates man from God and leads people down a path toward destruction. That does not mean we can't interact and be friendly with them. Indeed, Christ calls us to do so. But that doesn't mean we cannot recognize that Satan is ultimately behind the deception.
Actually, not. Context? You are going cowboys and Moslems and telling them they have bee led astray by Satan. Even when you try to admonish me, it comes back to them being led astray by Satan no less. Be mice, but they are led by Satan.
How do you deal with someone to come to some level of understanding from that perspective? You are starting from an adversarial perspective, you are right they are wrong. They dont agree, they say you are led by Satan and quote their docs. You honestly dont see that opening with we are here to save you from Satan wont go over well? Read your posts or better yet have someone else and tell me who is out of context.
Oldbear83 said:FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:
This is great for your Bible study or church group, but it is pretty difficult to deal with people drom the perspective that they are Satan worshippers because they dont believe what you do.
How do you negotiate or find any common ground when your position is one of moral superiority and you have to convert them? They believe you are from Satan just as much.
Who said we can't negotiate with them or even be allies with them? Nobody. We are friendly with plenty of countries that don't share our belief systems or Western values.
Ok, maybe starting iff with calling them Satan worshippers who wanted to kill all non-believers gave me the wrong idea, silly me.
I would submit you have great difficulty understanding context. I attribute it to the fact you seem to jump into conversations midstream without reading prior posts.
From a Christian perspective, Muslims have indeed been led astray by Satan himself, just like any religion that separates man from God and leads people down a path toward destruction. That does not mean we can't interact and be friendly with them. Indeed, Christ calls us to do so. But that doesn't mean we cannot recognize that Satan is ultimately behind the deception.
Actually, not. Context? You are going cowboys and Moslems and telling them they have bee led astray by Satan. Even when you try to admonish me, it comes back to them being led astray by Satan no less. Be mice, but they are led by Satan.
How do you deal with someone to come to some level of understanding from that perspective? You are starting from an adversarial perspective, you are right they are wrong. They dont agree, they say you are led by Satan and quote their docs. You honestly dont see that opening with we are here to save you from Satan wont go over well? Read your posts or better yet have someone else and tell me who is out of context.
FLBear, let me ask you something:
According to the Quran, Isa - their Arabic name for Jesus - is called the Messiah all right, but not because He saved Humanity from their sins, but because He pointed everyone to Mohamed.
I kid you not, 'Isa' in the Quran specifically and only because Mohamed calls him a cheerleader for Team Islam.
So when anyone starts a conversation about Jesus with a Muslim, they have three choices:
1. Agree with the blasphemy in the Quran (not gonna happen);
2. Correct the facts by citing Scripture; or
3. This is where you come. What is the third option, please?
FLBear5630 said:Oldbear83 said:FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:
This is great for your Bible study or church group, but it is pretty difficult to deal with people drom the perspective that they are Satan worshippers because they dont believe what you do.
How do you negotiate or find any common ground when your position is one of moral superiority and you have to convert them? They believe you are from Satan just as much.
Who said we can't negotiate with them or even be allies with them? Nobody. We are friendly with plenty of countries that don't share our belief systems or Western values.
Ok, maybe starting iff with calling them Satan worshippers who wanted to kill all non-believers gave me the wrong idea, silly me.
I would submit you have great difficulty understanding context. I attribute it to the fact you seem to jump into conversations midstream without reading prior posts.
From a Christian perspective, Muslims have indeed been led astray by Satan himself, just like any religion that separates man from God and leads people down a path toward destruction. That does not mean we can't interact and be friendly with them. Indeed, Christ calls us to do so. But that doesn't mean we cannot recognize that Satan is ultimately behind the deception.
Actually, not. Context? You are going cowboys and Moslems and telling them they have bee led astray by Satan. Even when you try to admonish me, it comes back to them being led astray by Satan no less. Be mice, but they are led by Satan.
How do you deal with someone to come to some level of understanding from that perspective? You are starting from an adversarial perspective, you are right they are wrong. They dont agree, they say you are led by Satan and quote their docs. You honestly dont see that opening with we are here to save you from Satan wont go over well? Read your posts or better yet have someone else and tell me who is out of context.
FLBear, let me ask you something:
According to the Quran, Isa - their Arabic name for Jesus - is called the Messiah all right, but not because He saved Humanity from their sins, but because He pointed everyone to Mohamed.
I kid you not, 'Isa' in the Quran specifically and only because Mohamed calls him a cheerleader for Team Islam.
So when anyone starts a conversation about Jesus with a Muslim, they have three choices:
1. Agree with the blasphemy in the Quran (not gonna happen);
2. Correct the facts by citing Scripture; or
3. This is where you come. What is the third option, please?
Once again you guys are arguing your believes expecting it to make a difference with Moslems. They believe will all their heart you are wrong and need to come to islam.
We are going to be in a constant state of killing each other. That helps no one.
So the answer to your question what do you say to a Moslem, "Salam" is the proper greeting
Oldbear83 said:FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:
This is great for your Bible study or church group, but it is pretty difficult to deal with people drom the perspective that they are Satan worshippers because they dont believe what you do.
How do you negotiate or find any common ground when your position is one of moral superiority and you have to convert them? They believe you are from Satan just as much.
Who said we can't negotiate with them or even be allies with them? Nobody. We are friendly with plenty of countries that don't share our belief systems or Western values.
Ok, maybe starting iff with calling them Satan worshippers who wanted to kill all non-believers gave me the wrong idea, silly me.
I would submit you have great difficulty understanding context. I attribute it to the fact you seem to jump into conversations midstream without reading prior posts.
From a Christian perspective, Muslims have indeed been led astray by Satan himself, just like any religion that separates man from God and leads people down a path toward destruction. That does not mean we can't interact and be friendly with them. Indeed, Christ calls us to do so. But that doesn't mean we cannot recognize that Satan is ultimately behind the deception.
Actually, not. Context? You are going cowboys and Moslems and telling them they have bee led astray by Satan. Even when you try to admonish me, it comes back to them being led astray by Satan no less. Be mice, but they are led by Satan.
How do you deal with someone to come to some level of understanding from that perspective? You are starting from an adversarial perspective, you are right they are wrong. They dont agree, they say you are led by Satan and quote their docs. You honestly dont see that opening with we are here to save you from Satan wont go over well? Read your posts or better yet have someone else and tell me who is out of context.
FLBear, let me ask you something:
According to the Quran, Isa - their Arabic name for Jesus - is called the Messiah all right, but not because He saved Humanity from their sins, but because He pointed everyone to Mohamed.
I kid you not, 'Isa' in the Quran specifically and only because Mohamed calls him a cheerleader for Team Islam.
So when anyone starts a conversation about Jesus with a Muslim, they have three choices:
1. Agree with the blasphemy in the Quran (not gonna happen);
2. Correct the facts by citing Scripture; or
3. This is where you come. What is the third option, please?
Oldbear83 said:FLBear5630 said:Oldbear83 said:FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:Mothra said:FLBear5630 said:
This is great for your Bible study or church group, but it is pretty difficult to deal with people drom the perspective that they are Satan worshippers because they dont believe what you do.
How do you negotiate or find any common ground when your position is one of moral superiority and you have to convert them? They believe you are from Satan just as much.
Who said we can't negotiate with them or even be allies with them? Nobody. We are friendly with plenty of countries that don't share our belief systems or Western values.
Ok, maybe starting iff with calling them Satan worshippers who wanted to kill all non-believers gave me the wrong idea, silly me.
I would submit you have great difficulty understanding context. I attribute it to the fact you seem to jump into conversations midstream without reading prior posts.
From a Christian perspective, Muslims have indeed been led astray by Satan himself, just like any religion that separates man from God and leads people down a path toward destruction. That does not mean we can't interact and be friendly with them. Indeed, Christ calls us to do so. But that doesn't mean we cannot recognize that Satan is ultimately behind the deception.
Actually, not. Context? You are going cowboys and Moslems and telling them they have bee led astray by Satan. Even when you try to admonish me, it comes back to them being led astray by Satan no less. Be mice, but they are led by Satan.
How do you deal with someone to come to some level of understanding from that perspective? You are starting from an adversarial perspective, you are right they are wrong. They dont agree, they say you are led by Satan and quote their docs. You honestly dont see that opening with we are here to save you from Satan wont go over well? Read your posts or better yet have someone else and tell me who is out of context.
FLBear, let me ask you something:
According to the Quran, Isa - their Arabic name for Jesus - is called the Messiah all right, but not because He saved Humanity from their sins, but because He pointed everyone to Mohamed.
I kid you not, 'Isa' in the Quran specifically and only because Mohamed calls him a cheerleader for Team Islam.
So when anyone starts a conversation about Jesus with a Muslim, they have three choices:
1. Agree with the blasphemy in the Quran (not gonna happen);
2. Correct the facts by citing Scripture; or
3. This is where you come. What is the third option, please?
Once again you guys are arguing your believes expecting it to make a difference with Moslems. They believe will all their heart you are wrong and need to come to islam.
We are going to be in a constant state of killing each other. That helps no one.
So the answer to your question what do you say to a Moslem, "Salam" is the proper greeting
So your plan is to just not try to save Muslims.
