BaylorFTW said:

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Just call it a "F Trump Protest" and everything is ok.

I cannot find an order banning home bible studies in California. Can you provide a link?

fubar said:

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I cannot find an order banning home bible studies in California. Can you provide a link?

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This is the source he included in the video: https://covid19.ca.gov/stay-home-except-for-essential-needs/

Let me guess, in home gatherings of large numbers are banned, and since bibles studies tend to have such numbers, they fall under this umbrella.

What about orgies? Are they also being unfairly discriminated against?

Perhaps you ought to read what is linked. From that:

"On May 25, 2020, in an effort to balance First Amendment interests with public health, the State Public Health Officer created an exception to the prohibition against mass gatherings for faith-based services and cultural ceremonies as well as protests. Those types of gatherings are now permitted indoors so long as they do not exceed 100 attendees or 25% of the capacity of the space in which the gathering is held, whichever is lower. State public health directives now do not prohibit in-person outdoor faith-based services or protests as long as face coverings are worn and physical distancing of 6 feet between persons or groups of persons from different households is maintained at all times."

Username checks out said:

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What about orgies? Are they also being unfairly discriminated against?

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AckAckAckAckAck!!!! I think this is the first time you've ever made me laugh.

fubar said:

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Perhaps you ought to read what is linked. From that:

"On May 25, 2020, in an effort to balance First Amendment interests with public health, the State Public Health Officer created an exception to the prohibition against mass gatherings for faith-based services and cultural ceremonies as well as protests. Those types of gatherings are now permitted indoors so long as they do not exceed 100 attendees or 25% of the capacity of the space in which the gathering is held, whichever is lower. State public health directives now do not prohibit in-person outdoor faith-based services or protests as long as face coverings are worn and physical distancing of 6 feet between persons or groups of persons from different households is maintained at all times."

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That is interesting, but there seems to be more to it: For starters, your directive is on May 25th. It looks like another directive was issued maybe on July 13th or so. Anyway, some churches are suing as of a few days ago.

A multicampus church has filed a complaint in federal court against California Gov. Gavin Newsom's COVID-19 executive order that it believes effectively bans church members from holding Bible studies and other small group meetings in their homes.

The new lawsuit was filed last Saturday on behalf of the Pasadena-based Harvest Rock Church, which has campuses throughout the state, and Harvest International Ministries, a nonprofit corporation with 162 member churches statewide and over 65,000 affiliates worldwide.

Rest of article: https://www.christianpost.com/news/churches-sue-california-gov-newsom-over-covid-19-order-banning-in-home-bible-studies.html

And elsewhere:

https://www.christianheadlines.com/contributors/michael-foust/californias-ban-on-in-home-bible-studies-sparks-lawsuit-by-church.html

https://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/us/2020/july/ca-gov-bans-home-bible-studies-the-governor-is-not-the-high-priest-over-all-religions

https://www.foxnews.com/us/california-church-newsom-coronavirus-worship-ban

Here, looks like a pretty good breakdown of the timeline from the law firm that is representing the Church bringing the suit:

https://lc.org/newsroom/details/071820-ban-on-worship-and-home-bible-studies-faces-legal-challenge-1

What you linked was updated July 23rd. Thursday. Printed clearly at the top. I do not see a BAN on BIBLE studies, in home or elsewhere, anywhere. That was your claim.

We are in the middle of a pandemic, and California is seeing a steep rise in cases. There are competing interests here, as there will be in such times. It looks to me like California is trying its best to balance those claims. Will it satisfy everybody? No.

Has it BANned in-home BIBLE studies? Not according to what you linked.

It's kind of hard to find common ground when people simply lie about the other side.

But keep up the good work.

fubar said:

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What you linked was updated July 23rd. Thursday. Printed clearly at the top. I do not see a BAN on BIBLE studies, in home or elsewhere, anywhere. That was your claim.

We are in the middle of a pandemic, and California is seeing a steep rise in cases. There are competing interests here, as there will be in such times. It looks to me like California is trying its best to balance those claims. Will it satisfy everybody? No.

Has it BANned in-home BIBLE studies? Not according to what you linked.

It's kind of hard to find common ground when people simply lie about the other side.

But keep up the good work.

---

You seem to be overly defensive here. I feel like you had already made up your mind before any information was given. In other words, you were unwilling to set aside your bias.

As to your opinion, obviously, some of the churches don't agree with your assessment or they wouldn't have brought the lawsuit. And it is not a lie that Gavin showed support for public protesting which undermines any claim about the importance of health. My experience is that people don't like it when people play favorites and they aren't the favorites. If you want to find common ground, start by blasting Newsom for playing favorites.

BaylorFTW said:

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fubar said:

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What you linked was updated July 23rd. Thursday. Printed clearly at the top. I do not see a BAN on BIBLE studies, in home or elsewhere, anywhere. That was your claim.

We are in the middle of a pandemic, and California is seeing a steep rise in cases. There are competing interests here, as there will be in such times. It looks to me like California is trying its best to balance those claims. Will it satisfy everybody? No.

Has it BANned in-home BIBLE studies? Not according to what you linked.

It's kind of hard to find common ground when people simply lie about the other side.

But keep up the good work.

---

You seem to be overly defensive here. I feel like you had already made up your mind before any information was given. In other words, you were unwilling to set aside your bias.

As to your opinion, obviously, some of the churches don't agree with your assessment or they wouldn't have brought the lawsuit. And it is not a lie that Gavin showed support for public protesting which undermines any claim about the importance of health. My experience is that people don't like it when people play favorites and they aren't the favorites. If you want to find common ground, start by blasting Newsom for playing favorites.

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I'm not being defensive at all. I asked you to provide a link to support your claim that California has banned in-home Bible studies. The link you provided utterly failed to do that, and, in fact, stated the opposite.

It is you, not me, who is unwilling to set set aside his bias in the face of actual facts.

What you posted was false.

Own it.

fubar said:

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BaylorFTW said:

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fubar said:

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What you linked was updated July 23rd. Thursday. Printed clearly at the top. I do not see a BAN on BIBLE studies, in home or elsewhere, anywhere. That was your claim.

We are in the middle of a pandemic, and California is seeing a steep rise in cases. There are competing interests here, as there will be in such times. It looks to me like California is trying its best to balance those claims. Will it satisfy everybody? No.

Has it BANned in-home BIBLE studies? Not according to what you linked.

It's kind of hard to find common ground when people simply lie about the other side.

But keep up the good work.

---

You seem to be overly defensive here. I feel like you had already made up your mind before any information was given. In other words, you were unwilling to set aside your bias.

As to your opinion, obviously, some of the churches don't agree with your assessment or they wouldn't have brought the lawsuit. And it is not a lie that Gavin showed support for public protesting which undermines any claim about the importance of health. My experience is that people don't like it when people play favorites and they aren't the favorites. If you want to find common ground, start by blasting Newsom for playing favorites.

---

I'm not being defensive at all. I asked you to provide a link to support your claim that California has banned in-home Bible studies. The link you provided utterly failed to do that, and, in fact, stated the opposite.

It is you, not me, who is unwilling to set set aside his bias in the face of actual facts.

What you posted was false.

Own it.

---

Lol, it is ok to admit you were wrong. You making bombastic statements doesn't hide your misstep.

Username checks out said:

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Let me guess, in home gatherings of large numbers are banned, and since bibles studies tend to have such numbers, they fall under this umbrella.

What about orgies? Are they also being unfairly discriminated against?

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No, orgies are essential meetings for liberals

As are Antifa and BLM meetings

You have to meet the "essential" standard to continue to exist

You scumwads can carry on as you were

fubar said:

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BaylorFTW said:

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fubar said:

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What you linked was updated July 23rd. Thursday. Printed clearly at the top. I do not see a BAN on BIBLE studies, in home or elsewhere, anywhere. That was your claim.

We are in the middle of a pandemic, and California is seeing a steep rise in cases. There are competing interests here, as there will be in such times. It looks to me like California is trying its best to balance those claims. Will it satisfy everybody? No.

Has it BANned in-home BIBLE studies? Not according to what you linked.

It's kind of hard to find common ground when people simply lie about the other side.

But keep up the good work.

---

You seem to be overly defensive here. I feel like you had already made up your mind before any information was given. In other words, you were unwilling to set aside your bias.

As to your opinion, obviously, some of the churches don't agree with your assessment or they wouldn't have brought the lawsuit. And it is not a lie that Gavin showed support for public protesting which undermines any claim about the importance of health. My experience is that people don't like it when people play favorites and they aren't the favorites. If you want to find common ground, start by blasting Newsom for playing favorites.

---

I'm not being defensive at all. I asked you to provide a link to support your claim that California has banned in-home Bible studies. The link you provided utterly failed to do that, and, in fact, stated the opposite.

It is you, not me, who is unwilling to set set aside his bias in the face of actual facts.

What you posted was false.

Own it.

---

From one of the links. Do you interpret the language in bold to prohibit gathering in a home for the purpose of studying the Bible?

In the Q&A section posted on the California government website, COVID19.CA.GOV, under the "Are gatherings permitted" section, it states:

"State public health directives prohibit professional, social and community gatherings. Gatherings are defined as meetings or other events that bring together persons from multiple households at the same time for a shared or group experience in a single room, space, or place such as an auditorium, stadium, arena, large conference room, meeting hall, or other indoor or outdoor space Crowds and limited physical distancing increase the risk for COVID-19.
https://lc.org/newsroom/details/071820-ban-on-worship-and-home-bible-studies-faces-legal-challenge-1

Osodecentx said:

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fubar said:

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BaylorFTW said:

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fubar said:

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What you linked was updated July 23rd. Thursday. Printed clearly at the top. I do not see a BAN on BIBLE studies, in home or elsewhere, anywhere. That was your claim.

We are in the middle of a pandemic, and California is seeing a steep rise in cases. There are competing interests here, as there will be in such times. It looks to me like California is trying its best to balance those claims. Will it satisfy everybody? No.

Has it BANned in-home BIBLE studies? Not according to what you linked.

It's kind of hard to find common ground when people simply lie about the other side.

But keep up the good work.

---

You seem to be overly defensive here. I feel like you had already made up your mind before any information was given. In other words, you were unwilling to set aside your bias.

As to your opinion, obviously, some of the churches don't agree with your assessment or they wouldn't have brought the lawsuit. And it is not a lie that Gavin showed support for public protesting which undermines any claim about the importance of health. My experience is that people don't like it when people play favorites and they aren't the favorites. If you want to find common ground, start by blasting Newsom for playing favorites.

---

I'm not being defensive at all. I asked you to provide a link to support your claim that California has banned in-home Bible studies. The link you provided utterly failed to do that, and, in fact, stated the opposite.

It is you, not me, who is unwilling to set set aside his bias in the face of actual facts.

What you posted was false.

Own it.

---

From one of the links. Do you interpret the language in bold to prohibit gathering in a home for the purpose of studying the Bible?

In the Q&A section posted on the California government website, COVID19.CA.GOV, under the "Are gatherings permitted" section, it states:

"State public health directives prohibit professional, social and community gatherings. Gatherings are defined as meetings or other events that bring together persons from multiple households at the same time for a shared or group experience in a single room, space, or place such as an auditorium, stadium, arena, large conference room, meeting hall, or other indoor or outdoor space Crowds and limited physical distancing increase the risk for COVID-19.
https://lc.org/newsroom/details/071820-ban-on-worship-and-home-bible-studies-faces-legal-challenge-1

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Bingo!

Osodecentx said:

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fubar said:

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BaylorFTW said:

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fubar said:

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What you linked was updated July 23rd. Thursday. Printed clearly at the top. I do not see a BAN on BIBLE studies, in home or elsewhere, anywhere. That was your claim.

We are in the middle of a pandemic, and California is seeing a steep rise in cases. There are competing interests here, as there will be in such times. It looks to me like California is trying its best to balance those claims. Will it satisfy everybody? No.

Has it BANned in-home BIBLE studies? Not according to what you linked.

It's kind of hard to find common ground when people simply lie about the other side.

But keep up the good work.

---

You seem to be overly defensive here. I feel like you had already made up your mind before any information was given. In other words, you were unwilling to set aside your bias.

As to your opinion, obviously, some of the churches don't agree with your assessment or they wouldn't have brought the lawsuit. And it is not a lie that Gavin showed support for public protesting which undermines any claim about the importance of health. My experience is that people don't like it when people play favorites and they aren't the favorites. If you want to find common ground, start by blasting Newsom for playing favorites.

---

I'm not being defensive at all. I asked you to provide a link to support your claim that California has banned in-home Bible studies. The link you provided utterly failed to do that, and, in fact, stated the opposite.

It is you, not me, who is unwilling to set set aside his bias in the face of actual facts.

What you posted was false.

Own it.

---

From one of the links. Do you interpret the language in bold to prohibit gathering in a home for the purpose of studying the Bible?

In the Q&A section posted on the California government website, COVID19.CA.GOV, under the "Are gatherings permitted" section, it states:

"State public health directives prohibit professional, social and community gatherings. Gatherings are defined as meetings or other events that bring together persons from multiple households at the same time for a shared or group experience in a single room, space, or place such as an auditorium, stadium, arena, large conference room, meeting hall, or other indoor or outdoor space Crowds and limited physical distancing increase the risk for COVID-19.
https://lc.org/newsroom/details/071820-ban-on-worship-and-home-bible-studies-faces-legal-challenge-1

---

I do not. The specific language I cited trumps the general language here. It's not that difficult. California has carved out exceptions to the stay at home order for exercise of First Amendment activities. It's littered throughout the Q&A.

People want to be butt hurt, I get it, and California would seem to be an easy target (at least on this board). I'm also aware that I'll convince literally nobody who wants to be butt hurt that there isn't reason to be ... at least not on this point. So by all means, soldier on butt hurt babies.

But for people who think the claim (BIBLE studies are BANned!) sounded dubious, all you have to do this time is ask for a source and then read said source.

fubar said:

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Osodecentx said:

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fubar said:

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BaylorFTW said:

---

fubar said:

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What you linked was updated July 23rd. Thursday. Printed clearly at the top. I do not see a BAN on BIBLE studies, in home or elsewhere, anywhere. That was your claim.

We are in the middle of a pandemic, and California is seeing a steep rise in cases. There are competing interests here, as there will be in such times. It looks to me like California is trying its best to balance those claims. Will it satisfy everybody? No.

Has it BANned in-home BIBLE studies? Not according to what you linked.

It's kind of hard to find common ground when people simply lie about the other side.

But keep up the good work.

---

You seem to be overly defensive here. I feel like you had already made up your mind before any information was given. In other words, you were unwilling to set aside your bias.

As to your opinion, obviously, some of the churches don't agree with your assessment or they wouldn't have brought the lawsuit. And it is not a lie that Gavin showed support for public protesting which undermines any claim about the importance of health. My experience is that people don't like it when people play favorites and they aren't the favorites. If you want to find common ground, start by blasting Newsom for playing favorites.

---

I'm not being defensive at all. I asked you to provide a link to support your claim that California has banned in-home Bible studies. The link you provided utterly failed to do that, and, in fact, stated the opposite.

It is you, not me, who is unwilling to set set aside his bias in the face of actual facts.

What you posted was false.

Own it.

---

From one of the links. Do you interpret the language in bold to prohibit gathering in a home for the purpose of studying the Bible?

In the Q&A section posted on the California government website, COVID19.CA.GOV, under the "Are gatherings permitted" section, it states:

"State public health directives prohibit professional, social and community gatherings. Gatherings are defined as meetings or other events that bring together persons from multiple households at the same time for a shared or group experience in a single room, space, or place such as an auditorium, stadium, arena, large conference room, meeting hall, or other indoor or outdoor space Crowds and limited physical distancing increase the risk for COVID-19.
https://lc.org/newsroom/details/071820-ban-on-worship-and-home-bible-studies-faces-legal-challenge-1

---

I do not. The specific language I cited trumps the general language here. It's not that difficult. California has carved out exceptions to the stay at home order for exercise of First Amendment activities. It's littered throughout the Q&A.

People want to be butt hurt, I get it, and California would seem to be an easy target (at least on this board). I'm also aware that I'll convince literally nobody who wants to be butt hurt that there isn't reason to be ... at least not on this point. So by all means, soldier on butt hurt babies.

But for people who think the claim (BIBLE studies are BANned!) sounded dubious, all you have to do this time is ask for a source and then read said source.

---

You may be correct, but your mere statement won't convince me. I posted a link with language I felt applicable.
Link, please.

Can I practice my religious faith?

Yes. Practicing your faith is a constitutionally-protected activity and may manifest in many different forms.

..................................

What conditions must be met to resume religious services ...?

Places of worship must therefore limit indoor attendance to 25% of building capacity or a maximum of 100 attendees, whichever is lower ....

fubar said:

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Can I practice my religious faith?

Yes. Practicing your faith is a constitutionally-protected activity and may manifest in many different forms.

..................................

What conditions must be met to resume religious services ...?

Places of worship must therefore limit indoor attendance to 25% of building capacity or a maximum of 100 attendees, whichever is lower ....

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You have been fighting this awful hard. So let's set aside the language discussion aside for a moment. What if it was clear to you Gavin did ban in-home bible studies, what would that mean to you? Would that change anything for you? For example, would you still support Californian leadership or change your political allegiances? I am wondering if you actually do have a line that can't be crossed or are you getting sucked into political pom pom waiving?

fubar said:

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Can I practice my religious faith?

Yes. Practicing your faith is a constitutionally-protected activity and may manifest in many different forms.

..................................

What conditions must be met to resume religious services ...?

Places of worship must therefore limit indoor attendance to 25% of building capacity or a maximum of 100 attendees, whichever is lower ....

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That order is out of date. The new one is here:

Quote:

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Counties on the County Monitoring List for three or more consecutive days - currently 29 counties accounting for 80 percent of the state's population - must close indoor operations for additional activities including:

• Gyms and Fitness Centers
• Places of Worship
• Indoor Protests
• Offices for Non-Critical Infrastructure Sectors as identified at covid19.ca.gov
• Personal Care Services (including nail salons, massage parlors, and tattoo parlors)
• Hair Salons and Barbershops
• Malls

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Although I am a leftist radical who wants to see America fall so that the one world government can be instituted under the rule of Bill Gates, Barack Obama and Oprah Winfrey...I will say that all of the "second lock downs" while ignoring massive street gatherings are pretty dumb. You either lock down or you don't; exceptions to gather by the thousands for any cause are nonsensical, particularly where those gatherings are leading to violence on top of the Covid risk. Same was true when the protests were anti-lock down protests.

We have got to get our s--t together.

Booray said:

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Although I am a leftist radical who wants to see America fall so that the one world government can be instituted under the rule of Bill Gates, Barack Obama and Oprah Winfrey...I will say that all of the "second lock downs" while ignoring massive street gatherings are pretty dumb. You either lock down or you don't; exceptions to gather by the thousands for any cause are nonsensical, particularly where those gatherings are leading to violence on top of the Covid risk. Same was true when the protests were anti-lock down protests.

We have got to get our s--t together.

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Ask China to stop

Booray said:

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Although I am a leftist radical who wants to see America fall so that the one world government can be instituted under the rule of Bill Gates, Barack Obama and Oprah Winfrey...I will say that all of the "second lock downs" while ignoring massive street gatherings are pretty dumb. You either lock down or you don't; exceptions to gather by the thousands for any cause are nonsensical, particularly where those gatherings are leading to violence on top of the Covid risk. Same was true when the protests were anti-lock down protests.

We have got to get our s--t together.

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Different example in Texas. My wife was on a call with other school leaders and the McLennan County health director that issued last week's order delaying the start of in-person school until September. 8.

Apparently he pulled back a little. No, kids cannot go to school. But they can practice football.

We have got to get our s--t together.

Booray said:

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Booray said:

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Although I am a leftist radical who wants to see America fall so that the one world government can be instituted under the rule of Bill Gates, Barack Obama and Oprah Winfrey...I will say that all of the "second lock downs" while ignoring massive street gatherings are pretty dumb. You either lock down or you don't; exceptions to gather by the thousands for any cause are nonsensical, particularly where those gatherings are leading to violence on top of the Covid risk. Same was true when the protests were anti-lock down protests.

We have got to get our s--t together.

---

Different example in Texas. My wife was on a call with other school leaders and the McLennan County health director that issued last weeks order delaying the start of in-person school until September. 8.

Apparently he pulled back a little. No kids cannot go to school. But they can practice football.

We have got to get our s--t together.

---

Not sure what to think about football practice.
Won't there be a surge of new cases when kids go back to school? If they go back August 15, there will be a surge of cases in the 1st week of Sept.
If they go back Sept 15, there will be a surge of cases the 1st week of October.

There will be a surge of cases about 3 weeks after children go back to school whenever that is. No healthy child will be at serious risk of dying.

There will be more deaths (vulnerable family members & teachers) about 1 month after kids go back to school.