Aberzombie1892 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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Aberzombie1892 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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Aberzombie1892 said:

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Wicked_Wombat said:

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Fit the SEC profile better...? UVA and UNC are highly-rated academic institutions where academics trump sports. They are more like Vanderbilt than any other school currently in the SEC...and Vandy is not your typical SEC school.

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They are logical B1G fits, and it would shock the landscape if they chose the SEC over the B1G for one of many reasons - higher annual conference payouts in the B1G, better research/academic institutions in the B1G, more national exposure in the B1G, etc.

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And the Big Ten seems more determined to add than the SEC does. The SEC really doesn't need to expand. It may feel that need at some point. But the additions of Texas and OU pretty much ensured that it will not only be competitive in the areas it truly cares about, but will remain dominant in those areas -- even at 16 schools.

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It's a complicated comparison. The SEC is currently pound for pound the better conference on the field, although the B1G will improve and get closer over the next few years with the impact of its addition and filtering out of some legacy competition. In contrast though, the SEC's biggest weakness relative to the B1G is its limited major media markets, and SEC could address that to the extent that it can with pursuing UVA and UNC.

That would of course leave the ball in UNC's and UVA's hands, and it would be fascinating if they by-passed the opportunity to be in a conference with Michigan, USC, UCLA, Washington, Northwestern, Illinois, Ohio State, Purdue, Wisconsin, Rutgers and Maryland (i.e. top 50 US News) to be in a conference with Florida, Texas, Georgia, and Texas A&M (top 50 US News) - this is especially true with the potential for a Notre Dame/Stanford package deal to the B1G, which would add two more top 50 schools.

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Major markets don't matter as much in college football as legacy brands. And the SEC is full of legacy brands. The Big Ten made some pretty major mistakes chasing markets. That's how they ended up with Rutgers, Maryland and UCLA, which either already are or will be long-term leeches on the league.

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If markets didn't matter, the B1G wouldn't be more valuable to media than the SEC. Agree?

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The Big Ten is valuable because of its brands. That league is full of blue bloods, too.

Ann Arbor, Mich., University Park, Pa., and Lincoln, Neb. aren't large markets. Those schools are among the league's biggest draws because of their brands.

Columbus, Ohio, is a big city, but most of the Big Ten's biggest draws are located in college towns, and their massive alumni bases watch their games from all over the country.

Aliceinbubbleland said:

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When I think deep south I think of Louisiana east to South Carolina. I never considered UVA and UNC deep south. Just deeply southern .

I still think the networks, not the Presidents, control who goes where at this stage of the game in football.

UCLA, Washington, Nebraska, Iowa, Purdue, Indiana, Illinois, Northwestern, Rutgers, Maryland Presidents will do as told by networks and tOSU folks.

Everyone in SEC is just giddy to be lucky enough to have a solid home. There could be termoil in B1G but not SEC.

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Historically and geographically, Virginia & NC are middle or upper south. However, they are below the Mason-Dixon Line which only means they are in the South.

I've been to Clemson once many years ago. It's a beautiful area but I don't remember a lot of development. But we did not downs any time in the city or near campus, only passing through. I know this observation isn't worth much.

bear2be2 said:

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BearFan33 said:

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Who could the SEC and B10 add that doesn't decrease (on a per school average) the next TV deal. Who adds enough value to increase the bottom line. Those are the impt questions.

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Notre Dame. And that's it. It's a one-school list.

The Irish are the last whale in the ocean.

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And they will remain independent

historian said:

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bear2be2 said:

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BearFan33 said:

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Who could the SEC and B10 add that doesn't decrease (on a per school average) the next TV deal. Who adds enough value to increase the bottom line. Those are the impt questions.

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Notre Dame. And that's it. It's a one-school list.

The Irish are the last whale in the ocean.

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And they will remain independent

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As long as they possibly can.

There may come a time when they're forced to join a conference. But I'm sure the SEC will work with them to remain independent/continue to push for accommodations for them because an independent Notre Dame is better from the SEC's perspective than having Notre Dame as a member of the Big Ten.

IIRC, the leadership made similar comments about the Pac 12 shortly before their demise. No doubt the ACC has much better leadership but it doesn't get much worse than what the Pac 12 had.

historian said:

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IIRC, the leadership made similar comments about the Pac 12 shortly before their demise. No doubt the ACC has much better leadership but it doesn't get much worse than what the Pac 12 had.

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They were kind of 'holier than thou' the way I remember it

Will be interesting to see if NILs let any team compete with the SEC and B1G. Might knock a few birds off their perches...

bear2be2 said:

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Aberzombie1892 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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Aberzombie1892 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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Aberzombie1892 said:

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Wicked_Wombat said:

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Fit the SEC profile better...? UVA and UNC are highly-rated academic institutions where academics trump sports. They are more like Vanderbilt than any other school currently in the SEC...and Vandy is not your typical SEC school.

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They are logical B1G fits, and it would shock the landscape if they chose the SEC over the B1G for one of many reasons - higher annual conference payouts in the B1G, better research/academic institutions in the B1G, more national exposure in the B1G, etc.

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And the Big Ten seems more determined to add than the SEC does. The SEC really doesn't need to expand. It may feel that need at some point. But the additions of Texas and OU pretty much ensured that it will not only be competitive in the areas it truly cares about, but will remain dominant in those areas -- even at 16 schools.

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It's a complicated comparison. The SEC is currently pound for pound the better conference on the field, although the B1G will improve and get closer over the next few years with the impact of its addition and filtering out of some legacy competition. In contrast though, the SEC's biggest weakness relative to the B1G is its limited major media markets, and SEC could address that to the extent that it can with pursuing UVA and UNC.

That would of course leave the ball in UNC's and UVA's hands, and it would be fascinating if they by-passed the opportunity to be in a conference with Michigan, USC, UCLA, Washington, Northwestern, Illinois, Ohio State, Purdue, Wisconsin, Rutgers and Maryland (i.e. top 50 US News) to be in a conference with Florida, Texas, Georgia, and Texas A&M (top 50 US News) - this is especially true with the potential for a Notre Dame/Stanford package deal to the B1G, which would add two more top 50 schools.

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Major markets don't matter as much in college football as legacy brands. And the SEC is full of legacy brands. The Big Ten made some pretty major mistakes chasing markets. That's how they ended up with Rutgers, Maryland and UCLA, which either already are or will be long-term leeches on the league.

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If markets didn't matter, the B1G wouldn't be more valuable to media than the SEC. Agree?

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The Big Ten is valuable because of its brands. That league is full of blue bloods, too.

Ann Arbor, Mich., University Park, Pa., and Lincoln, Neb. aren't large markets. Those schools are among the league's biggest draws because of their brands.

Columbus, Ohio, is a big city, but most of the Big Ten's biggest draws are located in college towns, and their massive alumni bases watch their games from all over the country.

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To be clear here: no one is saying the B1G doesn't have brands. What's being said is that the markets are what distinguishes the B1G over the SEC at the end of the day.

What you recall is accurate. Beautiful area, nice campus, nothing around it.

Oregon and Washington didn't have much of a choice. Big12 or Big10? SEC and Big10 make comparable money. Factor in travel and I'd park my butt in the SEC if I were UNC and UVA. If it's about the money then it isn't about the academics and "fit". Does anyone really think Oregon is a Big10 fit? Rutgers?

First words of the Clemson Alma Mater:

"Where the Blue Ridge Yawns"

Aberzombie1892 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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Aberzombie1892 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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Aberzombie1892 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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Aberzombie1892 said:

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Wicked_Wombat said:

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Fit the SEC profile better...? UVA and UNC are highly-rated academic institutions where academics trump sports. They are more like Vanderbilt than any other school currently in the SEC...and Vandy is not your typical SEC school.

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They are logical B1G fits, and it would shock the landscape if they chose the SEC over the B1G for one of many reasons - higher annual conference payouts in the B1G, better research/academic institutions in the B1G, more national exposure in the B1G, etc.

---

And the Big Ten seems more determined to add than the SEC does. The SEC really doesn't need to expand. It may feel that need at some point. But the additions of Texas and OU pretty much ensured that it will not only be competitive in the areas it truly cares about, but will remain dominant in those areas -- even at 16 schools.

---

It's a complicated comparison. The SEC is currently pound for pound the better conference on the field, although the B1G will improve and get closer over the next few years with the impact of its addition and filtering out of some legacy competition. In contrast though, the SEC's biggest weakness relative to the B1G is its limited major media markets, and SEC could address that to the extent that it can with pursuing UVA and UNC.

That would of course leave the ball in UNC's and UVA's hands, and it would be fascinating if they by-passed the opportunity to be in a conference with Michigan, USC, UCLA, Washington, Northwestern, Illinois, Ohio State, Purdue, Wisconsin, Rutgers and Maryland (i.e. top 50 US News) to be in a conference with Florida, Texas, Georgia, and Texas A&M (top 50 US News) - this is especially true with the potential for a Notre Dame/Stanford package deal to the B1G, which would add two more top 50 schools.

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Major markets don't matter as much in college football as legacy brands. And the SEC is full of legacy brands. The Big Ten made some pretty major mistakes chasing markets. That's how they ended up with Rutgers, Maryland and UCLA, which either already are or will be long-term leeches on the league.

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If markets didn't matter, the B1G wouldn't be more valuable to media than the SEC. Agree?

---

The Big Ten is valuable because of its brands. That league is full of blue bloods, too.

Ann Arbor, Mich., University Park, Pa., and Lincoln, Neb. aren't large markets. Those schools are among the league's biggest draws because of their brands.

Columbus, Ohio, is a big city, but most of the Big Ten's biggest draws are located in college towns, and their massive alumni bases watch their games from all over the country.

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To be clear here: no one is saying the B1G doesn't have brands. What's being said is that the markets are what distinguishes the B1G over the SEC at the end of the day.

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Distinguishes it in what way? The SEC is better and stronger in any way that actually matters competitively and makes plenty of money without ever shopping its rights past ESPN. While the Big Ten is fighting for every dollar and bragging about nominal differences in payout figures, the SEC is dominating it on the field and court in virtually every sport.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/40617735/acc-boss-fight-clemson-fsu-lawsuits-long-takes

Aliceinbubbleland said:

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https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/40617735/acc-boss-fight-clemson-fsu-lawsuits-long-takes

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That will endear him to FSU and Clemson and the other teams that want to leave

Good point. Pac 12 arrogance was a big part of their downfall and why some didn't mourn their passing. ACC are not at quite the same level necessarily but they have plenty of time to get there!

boykin_spaniel said:

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What you recall is accurate. Beautiful area, nice campus, nothing around it.

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It's a vague memory from long ago

https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/40584309/acc-cal-smu-stanford-logistics

Good discussion on travel costs for Stanford, Cal and SMU. Stanford says ACC travel costs could double.