$6 Gas

33,855 Views | 473 Replies | Last: 3 yr ago by FLBear5630
GrowlTowel
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C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Wow. You couldn't be more wrong. He campaigned on increasing gas prices.

Tell us your a ****ing idiot without telling us you are a ****ing idiot.
Wrecks Quan Dough
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RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!
whitetrash
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Amal Shuq-Up said:

RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!

I could have sworn they were powered by fairy dust and unicorn farts!
cowboycwr
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Amal Shuq-Up said:

RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!

95% coal.... which is much dirtier than gas engines.
Doc Holliday
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cowboycwr said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!

95% coal.... which is much dirtier than gas engines.
Topics like these are too complex for the vast majority of people to understand.

Electric cars will cause the demand for natural gas to skyrocket. Nat Gas being +460% higher in cost means WAY higher fertilizer and food prices already.

There's so many variables at play.
Canada2017
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C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.


Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.



The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Totally absurd .

Totally absurd .




I ordered an electric Ford Mustang last November . Still hasn't even been built yet. Hoping now for an August delivery .

$ 57,000 plus tax.


If you think most Americans can afford such a price tag while waiting almost a year for delivery .............you are again being totally absurd .
Forest Bueller_bf
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C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Maybe and maybe not, if we were energy independent, which we easily could be, we might be more like these countries. We certainly do have the natural resources.

7. Kuwait
An oil-rich country whose GDP is bolstered by their fuel exports. The Kuwaitis pay $1.31 per gallon.
8. Russia
The oil industry is big in the Russian economy, and gasoline costs $1.41 per gallon.

This is right now. So your domestic production does affect your fuel cost. From day one Biden has been a hinderance to domestic production. It has had an affect on our prices.
4th and Inches
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cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
about 300 million cars in US.. no chance in hades that we go all green energy cars
“The Internet is just a world passing around notes in a classroom.”

Jon Stewart
Forest Bueller_bf
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RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!
There are 276 million REGISTERED vehicles in the Unites States. The bulk of which will likely never be electric vehicles.

We have found the perfect source of energy for running vehicles. Emissions of these vehicles are 99% better than in 1970. The world just has to have something to be angry about. Nothing wrong with a combustion engine.
Forest Bueller_bf
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Forest Bueller_bf said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Maybe and maybe not, if we were energy independent, which we easily could be, we might be more like these countries. We certainly do have the natural resources.

7. Kuwait
An oil-rich country whose GDP is bolstered by their fuel exports. The Kuwaitis pay $1.31 per gallon.
8. Russia
The oil industry is big in the Russian economy, and gasoline costs $1.41 per gallon.

This is right now. So your domestic production does affect your fuel cost. From day one Biden has been a hinderance to domestic production. It has had an affect on our prices.
Yes, nobody wants to live in Iran who is from the US, that is not the point. The point is control your own oil production, control your own energy prices. We have allowed this to be taken away from us. We are paying the price.

3. Iran

Another oil-rich country- clearly, there is a trend. Logically, the countries with the most oil reserves pay the least. The Iranians, with huge oil reserves of their own, charge $0.19 per gallon.
Cobretti
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C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Cobretti
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Canada2017
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Forest Bueller_bf said:

RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!
There are 276 million REGISTERED vehicles in the Unites States. The bulk of which will likely never be electric vehicles.

We have found the perfect source of energy for running vehicles. Emissions of these vehicles are 99% better than in 1970. The world just has to have something to be angry about. Nothing wrong with a combustion engine.
My wife and I are trying to do our part with the Ford Mustang Mach E.

But , honestly, I don't believe the current electric car technology is the answer.

Advances need to somehow be made with the batteries and production costs have to be much lower.

Or its all just a pipe dream .

FLBear5630
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4th and Inches said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
30 million cars in US.. no chance in hades that we go all green energy cars
Thank you. These people have no idea of the impacts of what they are behind. EVs are not that clean, they use a ton of rare earth metals, batteries are toxic, to build requires just as much petroleum and the energy to charge them is still petro-fuels.

We are being pushed into a paradigm shift not because they outperform ICE vehicles or that the market determined them the winner, but because of politics. Not gonna end well. We are not even sure if
A- Carbon is the problem
B - All these measures will make a difference
nein51
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Title it and turn around and sell it. The Mach E's are selling used for 70k+. 60k is crazy for one, 70k is out of your damned mind. I can get you a pretty nice used Ferrari for just over 100k.
Canada2017
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nein51 said:

Title it and turn around and sell it. The Mach E's are selling used for 70k+. 60k is crazy for one, 70k is out of your damned mind. I can get you a pretty nice used Ferrari for just over 100k.
I'm just hoping the dealer doesn't try to raise the price once it finally shows up.
nein51
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Canada2017 said:

nein51 said:

Title it and turn around and sell it. The Mach E's are selling used for 70k+. 60k is crazy for one, 70k is out of your damned mind. I can get you a pretty nice used Ferrari for just over 100k.
I'm just hoping the dealer doesn't try to raise the price once it finally shows up.

If you ordered through Ford they can't. If you have a printed order from that dealer you should be fine. If they even hint at trying to add to sticker I would raise holy hell.

If it was just a pre order not really sure what their obligations are.
Canada2017
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nein51 said:

Canada2017 said:

nein51 said:

Title it and turn around and sell it. The Mach E's are selling used for 70k+. 60k is crazy for one, 70k is out of your damned mind. I can get you a pretty nice used Ferrari for just over 100k.
I'm just hoping the dealer doesn't try to raise the price once it finally shows up.

If you ordered through Ford they can't. If you have a printed order from that dealer you should be fine. If they even hint at trying to add to sticker I would raise holy hell.

If it was just a pre order not really sure what their obligations are.
Ordered through my local dealer with only a $ 500 deposit . But we also bought 2 other new vehicles within the last 12 months from them so hopefully no games will be played .
Baylorbears111
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cowboycwr said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!

95% coal.... which is much dirtier than gas engines.


Except you can more easily switch the production from coal to renewables or nuclear than you could individually swap out each and every ICE.
Cobretti
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quash
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Doc Holliday said:

cowboycwr said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!

95% coal.... which is much dirtier than gas engines.
Topics like these are too complex for the vast majority of people to understand.

Electric cars will cause the demand for natural gas to skyrocket. Nat Gas being +460% higher in cost means WAY higher fertilizer and food prices already.

There's so many variables at play.

Do you think 95% of our electricity comes from coal?
“Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” (The Law, p.6) Frederic Bastiat
Doc Holliday
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quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

cowboycwr said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!

95% coal.... which is much dirtier than gas engines.
Topics like these are too complex for the vast majority of people to understand.

Electric cars will cause the demand for natural gas to skyrocket. Nat Gas being +460% higher in cost means WAY higher fertilizer and food prices already.

There's so many variables at play.

Do you think 95% of our electricity comes from coal?

About 60% of electricity in the US is derived from fossil fuels. Nuclear and solar/wind account for a portion as well.
Wrecks Quan Dough
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Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

cowboycwr said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!

95% coal.... which is much dirtier than gas engines.
Topics like these are too complex for the vast majority of people to understand.

Electric cars will cause the demand for natural gas to skyrocket. Nat Gas being +460% higher in cost means WAY higher fertilizer and food prices already.

There's so many variables at play.

Do you think 95% of our electricity comes from coal?

About 60% of electricity in the US is derived from fossil fuels. Nuclear and solar/wind account for a portion as well.
I am excited to see if the windmills work as good in August when the wind does not blow as they do in a fairly serious winter storm when they ice up.
Doc Holliday
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Amal Shuq-Up said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

cowboycwr said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!

95% coal.... which is much dirtier than gas engines.
Topics like these are too complex for the vast majority of people to understand.

Electric cars will cause the demand for natural gas to skyrocket. Nat Gas being +460% higher in cost means WAY higher fertilizer and food prices already.

There's so many variables at play.

Do you think 95% of our electricity comes from coal?

About 60% of electricity in the US is derived from fossil fuels. Nuclear and solar/wind account for a portion as well.
I am excited to see if the windmills work as good in August when the wind does not blow as they do in a fairly serious winter storm when they ice up.
Windmill and Solar aren't reliable.
Wrecks Quan Dough
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Doc Holliday said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

cowboycwr said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!

95% coal.... which is much dirtier than gas engines.
Topics like these are too complex for the vast majority of people to understand.

Electric cars will cause the demand for natural gas to skyrocket. Nat Gas being +460% higher in cost means WAY higher fertilizer and food prices already.

There's so many variables at play.

Do you think 95% of our electricity comes from coal?

About 60% of electricity in the US is derived from fossil fuels. Nuclear and solar/wind account for a portion as well.
I am excited to see if the windmills work as good in August when the wind does not blow as they do in a fairly serious winter storm when they ice up.
Windmill and Solar aren't reliable.
Precisely.
FLBear5630
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Doc Holliday said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

cowboycwr said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!

95% coal.... which is much dirtier than gas engines.
Topics like these are too complex for the vast majority of people to understand.

Electric cars will cause the demand for natural gas to skyrocket. Nat Gas being +460% higher in cost means WAY higher fertilizer and food prices already.

There's so many variables at play.

Do you think 95% of our electricity comes from coal?

About 60% of electricity in the US is derived from fossil fuels. Nuclear and solar/wind account for a portion as well.
I am excited to see if the windmills work as good in August when the wind does not blow as they do in a fairly serious winter storm when they ice up.
Windmill and Solar aren't reliable.
I am with you Doc. Most have no idea what this entails and the externalities that will come from it.


Wind, Solar, Geothermal, Tidal, Rivers all have a place in the energy puzzle. But, non nor the combination can handle the whole load reliably. They are great in certain locations and should be used, but we cannot just shut off fossil fuels. Fossil fuels are movable, you can ship fossil fuels and earth resources where needed. The others are limited by external variable. It is like toll roads. Tolls work great to fund infrastructure in certain locations, but they will fail in others.

It is curious to me how hard this concept of needing ALL of the above is to get not only in energy but other areas, I see elected officials every day push 1 solution to highly complex, fluid problems. Frustrating. No one is saying don't build windmills for use in certain areas or use solar. But don't cover the whole nation in solar panels to get the same amount of energy 1/20th the amount of LNG will generate.
nein51
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If your energy discussion does not include nuclear power then you're not having a real energy discussion. Rather you're having an energy wish.
ATL Bear
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nein51 said:

If your energy discussion does not include nuclear power then you're not having a real energy discussion. Rather you're having an energy wish.
Absolute truth. As far as the electric grid, nuclear would be the best option with the most capacity upside (raw power generation ability).
FLBear5630
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ATL Bear said:

nein51 said:

If your energy discussion does not include nuclear power then you're not having a real energy discussion. Rather you're having an energy wish.
Absolute truth. As far as the electric grid, nuclear would be the best option with the most capacity upside (raw power generation ability).
Yup. But that is considered off the table.

Funny, raping the earth scouring and strip mining for rare earth minerals is OK to get EVs.

Nuclear, not allowed.
ATL Bear
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RMF5630 said:

ATL Bear said:

nein51 said:

If your energy discussion does not include nuclear power then you're not having a real energy discussion. Rather you're having an energy wish.
Absolute truth. As far as the electric grid, nuclear would be the best option with the most capacity upside (raw power generation ability).
Yup. But that is considered off the table.

Funny, raping the earth scouring and strip mining for rare earth minerals is OK to get EVs.

Nuclear, not allowed.
Another factor is the land area required for wind farms to create an equivalent amount of energy as a nuclear power plant is 360 times greater than nuclear plant requirements. For solar its 75 times greater.

The US has significant Uranium reserves, but we import the majority used for reactors, including from Russia. Would need to work the economics out, but we could become more self sufficient there also.
nein51
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ATL Bear said:

RMF5630 said:

ATL Bear said:

nein51 said:

If your energy discussion does not include nuclear power then you're not having a real energy discussion. Rather you're having an energy wish.
Absolute truth. As far as the electric grid, nuclear would be the best option with the most capacity upside (raw power generation ability).
Yup. But that is considered off the table.

Funny, raping the earth scouring and strip mining for rare earth minerals is OK to get EVs.

Nuclear, not allowed.
Another factor is the land area required for wind farms to create an equivalent amount of energy as a nuclear power plant is 360 times greater than nuclear plant requirements. For solar its 75 times greater.

The US has significant Uranium reserves, but we import the majority used for reactors, including from Russia. Would need to work the economics out, but we could become more self sufficient there also.
When you see on a map how many windmills are required to produce the same amount of power as a corresponding nuclear facility it's shocking. You could put a windmill up where every power pole exists in the entire world and im not sure they would provide as much energy as 30-50 nuclear facilities.

I also think the windmills are a massive eyesore but thats neither here nor there.
Doc Holliday
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RMF5630 said:

Doc Holliday said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

cowboycwr said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!

95% coal.... which is much dirtier than gas engines.
Topics like these are too complex for the vast majority of people to understand.

Electric cars will cause the demand for natural gas to skyrocket. Nat Gas being +460% higher in cost means WAY higher fertilizer and food prices already.

There's so many variables at play.

Do you think 95% of our electricity comes from coal?

About 60% of electricity in the US is derived from fossil fuels. Nuclear and solar/wind account for a portion as well.
I am excited to see if the windmills work as good in August when the wind does not blow as they do in a fairly serious winter storm when they ice up.
Windmill and Solar aren't reliable.
I am with you Doc. Most have no idea what this entails and the externalities that will come from it.


Wind, Solar, Geothermal, Tidal, Rivers all have a place in the energy puzzle. But, non nor the combination can handle the whole load reliably. They are great in certain locations and should be used, but we cannot just shut off fossil fuels. Fossil fuels are movable, you can ship fossil fuels and earth resources where needed. The others are limited by external variable. It is like toll roads. Tolls work great to fund infrastructure in certain locations, but they will fail in others.

It is curious to me how hard this concept of needing ALL of the above is to get not only in energy but other areas, I see elected officials every day push 1 solution to highly complex, fluid problems. Frustrating. No one is saying don't build windmills for use in certain areas or use solar. But don't cover the whole nation in solar panels to get the same amount of energy 1/20th the amount of LNG will generate.

Well said. It's been decades of everyone trying to envision this green energy society and a lot of morons talking about half truths they know nothing about it. Too many people are convinced that an impossible future is possible.
Forest Bueller_bf
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Canada2017 said:

nein51 said:

Canada2017 said:

nein51 said:

Title it and turn around and sell it. The Mach E's are selling used for 70k+. 60k is crazy for one, 70k is out of your damned mind. I can get you a pretty nice used Ferrari for just over 100k.
I'm just hoping the dealer doesn't try to raise the price once it finally shows up.

If you ordered through Ford they can't. If you have a printed order from that dealer you should be fine. If they even hint at trying to add to sticker I would raise holy hell.

If it was just a pre order not really sure what their obligations are.
Ordered through my local dealer with only a $ 500 deposit . But we also bought 2 other new vehicles within the last 12 months from them so hopefully no games will be played .
They would be idiots to mess around with a good customer. I doubt they try anything. Sure hope not.
Forest Bueller_bf
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Cobretti said:


But you get a free small coffee.
FLBear5630
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Doc Holliday said:

RMF5630 said:

Doc Holliday said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

cowboycwr said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

RMF5630 said:

cowboycwr said:

C. Jordan said:

RMF5630 said:

This is getting ridiculous. We hit $5.50 or even $5 the discretionary economy shuts down. Biden has to be one of the worst Presidents.

Even if this is a strategy to get off fossil field, the Biden Administration is managing this backwards. You have to have an option for people to migrate.
Interesting, but Biden had nothing to do with it.

It's global issue, spurred by recovery from COVID. Gas is high globally.

Gas would be just as high if Trump were still president.

I've also heard zero practical solutions from Republicans other than blaming Biden for it.

The only good thing is that it will make more switch to electric cars, which is good for everybody.


Switching to electric cars is NOT good for everybody. I have already seen news reports for over a month from at least 3 states about possible rolling blackouts because of heat and too many people running their AC high.

Now add in thousands more cars being charged and the blackouts will increase.
Funny, I was at a Auto Conference and spoke with some people from power companies. No one spoke to them about how the grid could handle an influx of EVs/ Couple of hundred thousand nationwide is one thing, total switch over at scale is another! I swear that "scale" is the most ignored word, people have no idea of the scale of the transportation industry. You think once a dynamic mass of EVs hit the road that it will be cheap to operate? Electric will become the new gas and we will burn more carbon in LNG power plants to support these "clean" cars. Musk is the P.T. Barnum, Steve Jobs of our time, great salesman!

95% coal.... which is much dirtier than gas engines.
Topics like these are too complex for the vast majority of people to understand.

Electric cars will cause the demand for natural gas to skyrocket. Nat Gas being +460% higher in cost means WAY higher fertilizer and food prices already.

There's so many variables at play.

Do you think 95% of our electricity comes from coal?

About 60% of electricity in the US is derived from fossil fuels. Nuclear and solar/wind account for a portion as well.
I am excited to see if the windmills work as good in August when the wind does not blow as they do in a fairly serious winter storm when they ice up.
Windmill and Solar aren't reliable.
I am with you Doc. Most have no idea what this entails and the externalities that will come from it.


Wind, Solar, Geothermal, Tidal, Rivers all have a place in the energy puzzle. But, non nor the combination can handle the whole load reliably. They are great in certain locations and should be used, but we cannot just shut off fossil fuels. Fossil fuels are movable, you can ship fossil fuels and earth resources where needed. The others are limited by external variable. It is like toll roads. Tolls work great to fund infrastructure in certain locations, but they will fail in others.

It is curious to me how hard this concept of needing ALL of the above is to get not only in energy but other areas, I see elected officials every day push 1 solution to highly complex, fluid problems. Frustrating. No one is saying don't build windmills for use in certain areas or use solar. But don't cover the whole nation in solar panels to get the same amount of energy 1/20th the amount of LNG will generate.

Well said. It's been decades of everyone trying to envision this green energy society and a lot of morons talking about half truths they know nothing about it. Too many people are convinced that an impossible future is possible.
It may be possible, but it will take numerous energy sources, cooperation we have not seen, inventions of both energy sources, vehicles, machinery and education we do not have and several generations to get there.

There is a reason the internal combustion engine changed the world and spurred the industrial revolution. Fossil fuels are so versatile, mobile and efficient that it allowed it do happen. You think people weren't looking before finding crude in PA?

IF climate change is truly going to result in actionable changes, not informational, we need to focus on that to protect infrastructure rather than this change society stuff. Changing behavior does not work.

Example:
Informational Change - 3 inches of water rise over 50 years in vulnerable locations
Actionable Change - 3 feet of water rise over 50 years in vulnerable locations


 
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