Only if Putin somehow gets killed off.He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:Of course we did .....Biden called his shot and took it .RMF5630 said:Canada2017 said:None of which addresses the fundamental point.........RMF5630 said:Calm down. It was an Obama joke...Canada2017 said:RMF5630 said:No argument about Biden. Luckily, he is not calling the shots!Canada2017 said:whiterock said:Canada2017 said:
A. When in the last 4 'police actions ' has the United States ever been reimbursed by the country we have spent billions of dollars on ?
B . Our involvement in the Korean War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
C. Our involvement in the Vietnam War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
D. Our involvement with Afghanistan began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
E. Our involvement in WW2 began 'only ' with weapon deliveries .
F. Our involvement with Iraq began with ' only ' weapon deliveries.
Now you internet Rambo's are certainly aware of all this . Just as you simply MUST be aware our current Commander in Chief is hopelessly compromised by dementia and old age .
Yet you blissfully continue play your 'brinkmanship' games
As if all the previous disasters didn't happen and our current 'leadership ' has a fully functional brain .
Selection bias multiplied by slippery slope creates a straw man.
The list of conflicts to which we have provided the full range of assistance which did NOT result in direct involvement of US ground troops is 100x longer than the list you provided.
We have a 100% track record of such policy while avoiding direct conflict with the Russian Army.
Again. You are making an argument which does not fit the circumstances.
The circumstances are crystal clear .
Our dementia suffering Commander in Chief only recently completely botched the Afghanistan withdrawal leaving BILLIONS worth of weaponry to a terrorist organization.
Our Commander in Chief who simply can not even string together a series of lucid statements called for NATO membership for Ukraine even when Putin put 200,000 troops along the border .
Our Commander in Chief who is utilizing the DOJ and FBI to flagrantly attack political opponents openly threatened to blow up North Sea natural gas pipelines belonging to other countries . THEN DID IT.
And this is the guy you think NOW can successfully walk the thin line between ' supplying weapons ' and yet avoid escalating the war ?
Give me a freaking break .
If he talks like an idiot and acts like an idiot ……he's an idiot .
Well that is super re assuring .
Then exactly WHO is calling the 'shots ' ?
And did this same mystery guy/gal/it pull these other stunts ?
Good grief people ….connect the freaking dots .
He will have to give final permission. But I doubt he has much input in the strategy. The correct strategy doesn't change because Biden is an idiot. I am sure the Pentagon, NSA and others are being more careful in dealing with him.
WHOEVER is calling the shots...they have done an incredibly stupid body of work over the last 18 months.
Yet magically NOW we are supposed to blissfully trust this same bunch of cluster ****s to walk a razor thin line between supplying and fighting a proxy war ( against the world's largest owner of hydrogen bombs ) while not letting it escalate into WW3.
Mere weeks after blowing up natural gas pipelines in INTERNATIONAL waters. An act of war Biden literally and PUBLICALLY promised to do only a few months earlier .
Good grief fella ....take a step back ......and exam the insanity of this situation .
So we blew the Nordstrum line?
So far the only thing we have done is helped Ukraine. No troops, no military action, no air power.
You are freaking out over nothing. You really think Putin is going nuclear against the US over selling weapons?
As pointed out before .....we have gotten sucked in to at least 4-5 wars that all began with 'only' supplies.
No , Putin is just bluffing . Just like the 200,000 troops he placed on the border was a bluff .
This a strategic defeat for Russia.
Russia mobilizes
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Canada2017 said:Only if Putin somehow gets killed off.He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:Of course we did .....Biden called his shot and took it .RMF5630 said:Canada2017 said:None of which addresses the fundamental point.........RMF5630 said:Calm down. It was an Obama joke...Canada2017 said:RMF5630 said:No argument about Biden. Luckily, he is not calling the shots!Canada2017 said:whiterock said:Canada2017 said:
A. When in the last 4 'police actions ' has the United States ever been reimbursed by the country we have spent billions of dollars on ?
B . Our involvement in the Korean War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
C. Our involvement in the Vietnam War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
D. Our involvement with Afghanistan began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
E. Our involvement in WW2 began 'only ' with weapon deliveries .
F. Our involvement with Iraq began with ' only ' weapon deliveries.
Now you internet Rambo's are certainly aware of all this . Just as you simply MUST be aware our current Commander in Chief is hopelessly compromised by dementia and old age .
Yet you blissfully continue play your 'brinkmanship' games
As if all the previous disasters didn't happen and our current 'leadership ' has a fully functional brain .
Selection bias multiplied by slippery slope creates a straw man.
The list of conflicts to which we have provided the full range of assistance which did NOT result in direct involvement of US ground troops is 100x longer than the list you provided.
We have a 100% track record of such policy while avoiding direct conflict with the Russian Army.
Again. You are making an argument which does not fit the circumstances.
The circumstances are crystal clear .
Our dementia suffering Commander in Chief only recently completely botched the Afghanistan withdrawal leaving BILLIONS worth of weaponry to a terrorist organization.
Our Commander in Chief who simply can not even string together a series of lucid statements called for NATO membership for Ukraine even when Putin put 200,000 troops along the border .
Our Commander in Chief who is utilizing the DOJ and FBI to flagrantly attack political opponents openly threatened to blow up North Sea natural gas pipelines belonging to other countries . THEN DID IT.
And this is the guy you think NOW can successfully walk the thin line between ' supplying weapons ' and yet avoid escalating the war ?
Give me a freaking break .
If he talks like an idiot and acts like an idiot ……he's an idiot .
Well that is super re assuring .
Then exactly WHO is calling the 'shots ' ?
And did this same mystery guy/gal/it pull these other stunts ?
Good grief people ….connect the freaking dots .
He will have to give final permission. But I doubt he has much input in the strategy. The correct strategy doesn't change because Biden is an idiot. I am sure the Pentagon, NSA and others are being more careful in dealing with him.
WHOEVER is calling the shots...they have done an incredibly stupid body of work over the last 18 months.
Yet magically NOW we are supposed to blissfully trust this same bunch of cluster ****s to walk a razor thin line between supplying and fighting a proxy war ( against the world's largest owner of hydrogen bombs ) while not letting it escalate into WW3.
Mere weeks after blowing up natural gas pipelines in INTERNATIONAL waters. An act of war Biden literally and PUBLICALLY promised to do only a few months earlier .
Good grief fella ....take a step back ......and exam the insanity of this situation .
So we blew the Nordstrum line?
So far the only thing we have done is helped Ukraine. No troops, no military action, no air power.
You are freaking out over nothing. You really think Putin is going nuclear against the US over selling weapons?
As pointed out before .....we have gotten sucked in to at least 4-5 wars that all began with 'only' supplies.
No , Putin is just bluffing . Just like the 200,000 troops he placed on the border was a bluff .
This a strategic defeat for Russia.
It is already a strategic defeat. Their equipment is shown to be inferior. Russian material and personnel losses are tremendous. The loss of prestige and respect of other nations is terrible. They don't have a birthrate that will allow them to replace the tens of thousands lost. They are leaving Kherson right now. It is over for the Russian military and this is a terrible blow to Russian society.
Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
Geez, grow up. This is a policy discussion. No one on here has any say in what happens in Ukraine. Discuss the facts of the situation, playing emotional games is bush league. You got something to add, add it.
He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:Only if Putin somehow gets killed off.He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:Of course we did .....Biden called his shot and took it .RMF5630 said:Canada2017 said:None of which addresses the fundamental point.........RMF5630 said:Calm down. It was an Obama joke...Canada2017 said:RMF5630 said:No argument about Biden. Luckily, he is not calling the shots!Canada2017 said:whiterock said:Canada2017 said:
A. When in the last 4 'police actions ' has the United States ever been reimbursed by the country we have spent billions of dollars on ?
B . Our involvement in the Korean War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
C. Our involvement in the Vietnam War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
D. Our involvement with Afghanistan began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
E. Our involvement in WW2 began 'only ' with weapon deliveries .
F. Our involvement with Iraq began with ' only ' weapon deliveries.
Now you internet Rambo's are certainly aware of all this . Just as you simply MUST be aware our current Commander in Chief is hopelessly compromised by dementia and old age .
Yet you blissfully continue play your 'brinkmanship' games
As if all the previous disasters didn't happen and our current 'leadership ' has a fully functional brain .
Selection bias multiplied by slippery slope creates a straw man.
The list of conflicts to which we have provided the full range of assistance which did NOT result in direct involvement of US ground troops is 100x longer than the list you provided.
We have a 100% track record of such policy while avoiding direct conflict with the Russian Army.
Again. You are making an argument which does not fit the circumstances.
The circumstances are crystal clear .
Our dementia suffering Commander in Chief only recently completely botched the Afghanistan withdrawal leaving BILLIONS worth of weaponry to a terrorist organization.
Our Commander in Chief who simply can not even string together a series of lucid statements called for NATO membership for Ukraine even when Putin put 200,000 troops along the border .
Our Commander in Chief who is utilizing the DOJ and FBI to flagrantly attack political opponents openly threatened to blow up North Sea natural gas pipelines belonging to other countries . THEN DID IT.
And this is the guy you think NOW can successfully walk the thin line between ' supplying weapons ' and yet avoid escalating the war ?
Give me a freaking break .
If he talks like an idiot and acts like an idiot ……he's an idiot .
Well that is super re assuring .
Then exactly WHO is calling the 'shots ' ?
And did this same mystery guy/gal/it pull these other stunts ?
Good grief people ….connect the freaking dots .
He will have to give final permission. But I doubt he has much input in the strategy. The correct strategy doesn't change because Biden is an idiot. I am sure the Pentagon, NSA and others are being more careful in dealing with him.
WHOEVER is calling the shots...they have done an incredibly stupid body of work over the last 18 months.
Yet magically NOW we are supposed to blissfully trust this same bunch of cluster ****s to walk a razor thin line between supplying and fighting a proxy war ( against the world's largest owner of hydrogen bombs ) while not letting it escalate into WW3.
Mere weeks after blowing up natural gas pipelines in INTERNATIONAL waters. An act of war Biden literally and PUBLICALLY promised to do only a few months earlier .
Good grief fella ....take a step back ......and exam the insanity of this situation .
So we blew the Nordstrum line?
So far the only thing we have done is helped Ukraine. No troops, no military action, no air power.
You are freaking out over nothing. You really think Putin is going nuclear against the US over selling weapons?
As pointed out before .....we have gotten sucked in to at least 4-5 wars that all began with 'only' supplies.
No , Putin is just bluffing . Just like the 200,000 troops he placed on the border was a bluff .
This a strategic defeat for Russia.
It is already a strategic defeat. Their equipment is shown to be inferior. Russian material and personnel losses are tremendous. The loss of prestige and respect of other nations is terrible. They don't have a birthrate that will allow them to replace the tens of thousands lost. They are leaving Kherson right now. It is over for the Russian military and this is a terrible blow to Russian society.
https://www.defensenews.com/opinion/commentary/2022/10/20/russias-military-aircraft-exports-are-headed-for-a-nosedive/
They can't sell their jets that keep getting shot down either.
As much as I would love to believe all this .....history has repeatedly shown Russia fights long term wars .He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:Only if Putin somehow gets killed off.He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:Of course we did .....Biden called his shot and took it .RMF5630 said:Canada2017 said:None of which addresses the fundamental point.........RMF5630 said:Calm down. It was an Obama joke...Canada2017 said:RMF5630 said:No argument about Biden. Luckily, he is not calling the shots!Canada2017 said:whiterock said:Canada2017 said:
A. When in the last 4 'police actions ' has the United States ever been reimbursed by the country we have spent billions of dollars on ?
B . Our involvement in the Korean War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
C. Our involvement in the Vietnam War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
D. Our involvement with Afghanistan began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
E. Our involvement in WW2 began 'only ' with weapon deliveries .
F. Our involvement with Iraq began with ' only ' weapon deliveries.
Now you internet Rambo's are certainly aware of all this . Just as you simply MUST be aware our current Commander in Chief is hopelessly compromised by dementia and old age .
Yet you blissfully continue play your 'brinkmanship' games
As if all the previous disasters didn't happen and our current 'leadership ' has a fully functional brain .
Selection bias multiplied by slippery slope creates a straw man.
The list of conflicts to which we have provided the full range of assistance which did NOT result in direct involvement of US ground troops is 100x longer than the list you provided.
We have a 100% track record of such policy while avoiding direct conflict with the Russian Army.
Again. You are making an argument which does not fit the circumstances.
The circumstances are crystal clear .
Our dementia suffering Commander in Chief only recently completely botched the Afghanistan withdrawal leaving BILLIONS worth of weaponry to a terrorist organization.
Our Commander in Chief who simply can not even string together a series of lucid statements called for NATO membership for Ukraine even when Putin put 200,000 troops along the border .
Our Commander in Chief who is utilizing the DOJ and FBI to flagrantly attack political opponents openly threatened to blow up North Sea natural gas pipelines belonging to other countries . THEN DID IT.
And this is the guy you think NOW can successfully walk the thin line between ' supplying weapons ' and yet avoid escalating the war ?
Give me a freaking break .
If he talks like an idiot and acts like an idiot ……he's an idiot .
Well that is super re assuring .
Then exactly WHO is calling the 'shots ' ?
And did this same mystery guy/gal/it pull these other stunts ?
Good grief people ….connect the freaking dots .
He will have to give final permission. But I doubt he has much input in the strategy. The correct strategy doesn't change because Biden is an idiot. I am sure the Pentagon, NSA and others are being more careful in dealing with him.
WHOEVER is calling the shots...they have done an incredibly stupid body of work over the last 18 months.
Yet magically NOW we are supposed to blissfully trust this same bunch of cluster ****s to walk a razor thin line between supplying and fighting a proxy war ( against the world's largest owner of hydrogen bombs ) while not letting it escalate into WW3.
Mere weeks after blowing up natural gas pipelines in INTERNATIONAL waters. An act of war Biden literally and PUBLICALLY promised to do only a few months earlier .
Good grief fella ....take a step back ......and exam the insanity of this situation .
So we blew the Nordstrum line?
So far the only thing we have done is helped Ukraine. No troops, no military action, no air power.
You are freaking out over nothing. You really think Putin is going nuclear against the US over selling weapons?
As pointed out before .....we have gotten sucked in to at least 4-5 wars that all began with 'only' supplies.
No , Putin is just bluffing . Just like the 200,000 troops he placed on the border was a bluff .
This a strategic defeat for Russia.
It is already a strategic defeat. Their equipment is shown to be inferior. Russian material and personnel losses are tremendous. The loss of prestige and respect of other nations is terrible. They don't have a birthrate that will allow them to replace the tens of thousands lost. They are leaving Kherson right now. It is over for the Russian military and this is a terrible blow to Russian society.
Don't expect them to quit this early on just because outside media sources think they should .
Canada2017 said:As much as I would love to believe all this .....history has repeatedly shown Russia fights long term wars .He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:Only if Putin somehow gets killed off.He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:Of course we did .....Biden called his shot and took it .RMF5630 said:Canada2017 said:None of which addresses the fundamental point.........RMF5630 said:Calm down. It was an Obama joke...Canada2017 said:RMF5630 said:No argument about Biden. Luckily, he is not calling the shots!Canada2017 said:whiterock said:Canada2017 said:
A. When in the last 4 'police actions ' has the United States ever been reimbursed by the country we have spent billions of dollars on ?
B . Our involvement in the Korean War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
C. Our involvement in the Vietnam War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
D. Our involvement with Afghanistan began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
E. Our involvement in WW2 began 'only ' with weapon deliveries .
F. Our involvement with Iraq began with ' only ' weapon deliveries.
Now you internet Rambo's are certainly aware of all this . Just as you simply MUST be aware our current Commander in Chief is hopelessly compromised by dementia and old age .
Yet you blissfully continue play your 'brinkmanship' games
As if all the previous disasters didn't happen and our current 'leadership ' has a fully functional brain .
Selection bias multiplied by slippery slope creates a straw man.
The list of conflicts to which we have provided the full range of assistance which did NOT result in direct involvement of US ground troops is 100x longer than the list you provided.
We have a 100% track record of such policy while avoiding direct conflict with the Russian Army.
Again. You are making an argument which does not fit the circumstances.
The circumstances are crystal clear .
Our dementia suffering Commander in Chief only recently completely botched the Afghanistan withdrawal leaving BILLIONS worth of weaponry to a terrorist organization.
Our Commander in Chief who simply can not even string together a series of lucid statements called for NATO membership for Ukraine even when Putin put 200,000 troops along the border .
Our Commander in Chief who is utilizing the DOJ and FBI to flagrantly attack political opponents openly threatened to blow up North Sea natural gas pipelines belonging to other countries . THEN DID IT.
And this is the guy you think NOW can successfully walk the thin line between ' supplying weapons ' and yet avoid escalating the war ?
Give me a freaking break .
If he talks like an idiot and acts like an idiot ……he's an idiot .
Well that is super re assuring .
Then exactly WHO is calling the 'shots ' ?
And did this same mystery guy/gal/it pull these other stunts ?
Good grief people ….connect the freaking dots .
He will have to give final permission. But I doubt he has much input in the strategy. The correct strategy doesn't change because Biden is an idiot. I am sure the Pentagon, NSA and others are being more careful in dealing with him.
WHOEVER is calling the shots...they have done an incredibly stupid body of work over the last 18 months.
Yet magically NOW we are supposed to blissfully trust this same bunch of cluster ****s to walk a razor thin line between supplying and fighting a proxy war ( against the world's largest owner of hydrogen bombs ) while not letting it escalate into WW3.
Mere weeks after blowing up natural gas pipelines in INTERNATIONAL waters. An act of war Biden literally and PUBLICALLY promised to do only a few months earlier .
Good grief fella ....take a step back ......and exam the insanity of this situation .
So we blew the Nordstrum line?
So far the only thing we have done is helped Ukraine. No troops, no military action, no air power.
You are freaking out over nothing. You really think Putin is going nuclear against the US over selling weapons?
As pointed out before .....we have gotten sucked in to at least 4-5 wars that all began with 'only' supplies.
No , Putin is just bluffing . Just like the 200,000 troops he placed on the border was a bluff .
This a strategic defeat for Russia.
It is already a strategic defeat. Their equipment is shown to be inferior. Russian material and personnel losses are tremendous. The loss of prestige and respect of other nations is terrible. They don't have a birthrate that will allow them to replace the tens of thousands lost. They are leaving Kherson right now. It is over for the Russian military and this is a terrible blow to Russian society.
Don't expect them to quit this early on just because outside media sources think they should .
Historically, they did not have an aged population whose birthrate was below replacement rate. It is over.
He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:As much as I would love to believe all this .....history has repeatedly shown Russia fights long term wars .He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:Only if Putin somehow gets killed off.He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:Of course we did .....Biden called his shot and took it .RMF5630 said:Canada2017 said:None of which addresses the fundamental point.........RMF5630 said:Calm down. It was an Obama joke...Canada2017 said:RMF5630 said:No argument about Biden. Luckily, he is not calling the shots!Canada2017 said:whiterock said:Canada2017 said:
A. When in the last 4 'police actions ' has the United States ever been reimbursed by the country we have spent billions of dollars on ?
B . Our involvement in the Korean War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
C. Our involvement in the Vietnam War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
D. Our involvement with Afghanistan began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
E. Our involvement in WW2 began 'only ' with weapon deliveries .
F. Our involvement with Iraq began with ' only ' weapon deliveries.
Now you internet Rambo's are certainly aware of all this . Just as you simply MUST be aware our current Commander in Chief is hopelessly compromised by dementia and old age .
Yet you blissfully continue play your 'brinkmanship' games
As if all the previous disasters didn't happen and our current 'leadership ' has a fully functional brain .
Selection bias multiplied by slippery slope creates a straw man.
The list of conflicts to which we have provided the full range of assistance which did NOT result in direct involvement of US ground troops is 100x longer than the list you provided.
We have a 100% track record of such policy while avoiding direct conflict with the Russian Army.
Again. You are making an argument which does not fit the circumstances.
The circumstances are crystal clear .
Our dementia suffering Commander in Chief only recently completely botched the Afghanistan withdrawal leaving BILLIONS worth of weaponry to a terrorist organization.
Our Commander in Chief who simply can not even string together a series of lucid statements called for NATO membership for Ukraine even when Putin put 200,000 troops along the border .
Our Commander in Chief who is utilizing the DOJ and FBI to flagrantly attack political opponents openly threatened to blow up North Sea natural gas pipelines belonging to other countries . THEN DID IT.
And this is the guy you think NOW can successfully walk the thin line between ' supplying weapons ' and yet avoid escalating the war ?
Give me a freaking break .
If he talks like an idiot and acts like an idiot ……he's an idiot .
Well that is super re assuring .
Then exactly WHO is calling the 'shots ' ?
And did this same mystery guy/gal/it pull these other stunts ?
Good grief people ….connect the freaking dots .
He will have to give final permission. But I doubt he has much input in the strategy. The correct strategy doesn't change because Biden is an idiot. I am sure the Pentagon, NSA and others are being more careful in dealing with him.
WHOEVER is calling the shots...they have done an incredibly stupid body of work over the last 18 months.
Yet magically NOW we are supposed to blissfully trust this same bunch of cluster ****s to walk a razor thin line between supplying and fighting a proxy war ( against the world's largest owner of hydrogen bombs ) while not letting it escalate into WW3.
Mere weeks after blowing up natural gas pipelines in INTERNATIONAL waters. An act of war Biden literally and PUBLICALLY promised to do only a few months earlier .
Good grief fella ....take a step back ......and exam the insanity of this situation .
So we blew the Nordstrum line?
So far the only thing we have done is helped Ukraine. No troops, no military action, no air power.
You are freaking out over nothing. You really think Putin is going nuclear against the US over selling weapons?
As pointed out before .....we have gotten sucked in to at least 4-5 wars that all began with 'only' supplies.
No , Putin is just bluffing . Just like the 200,000 troops he placed on the border was a bluff .
This a strategic defeat for Russia.
It is already a strategic defeat. Their equipment is shown to be inferior. Russian material and personnel losses are tremendous. The loss of prestige and respect of other nations is terrible. They don't have a birthrate that will allow them to replace the tens of thousands lost. They are leaving Kherson right now. It is over for the Russian military and this is a terrible blow to Russian society.
Don't expect them to quit this early on just because outside media sources think they should .
It is over.
Time will tell .
But according to the BBC Russian missile and drone attacks have destroyed 30% of Ukraines power stations and other energy generating facilities within the last ten days .
That is not the actions of a defeated military .
RMF5630 said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
Geez, grow up. This is a policy discussion. No one on here has any say in what happens in Ukraine. Discuss the facts of the situation, playing emotional games is bush league. You got something to add, add it.
So we will order you feathers.
He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:As much as I would love to believe all this .....history has repeatedly shown Russia fights long term wars .He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:Only if Putin somehow gets killed off.He Hate Me said:Canada2017 said:Of course we did .....Biden called his shot and took it .RMF5630 said:Canada2017 said:None of which addresses the fundamental point.........RMF5630 said:Calm down. It was an Obama joke...Canada2017 said:RMF5630 said:No argument about Biden. Luckily, he is not calling the shots!Canada2017 said:whiterock said:Canada2017 said:
A. When in the last 4 'police actions ' has the United States ever been reimbursed by the country we have spent billions of dollars on ?
B . Our involvement in the Korean War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
C. Our involvement in the Vietnam War began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
D. Our involvement with Afghanistan began with 'only' weapon deliveries .
E. Our involvement in WW2 began 'only ' with weapon deliveries .
F. Our involvement with Iraq began with ' only ' weapon deliveries.
Now you internet Rambo's are certainly aware of all this . Just as you simply MUST be aware our current Commander in Chief is hopelessly compromised by dementia and old age .
Yet you blissfully continue play your 'brinkmanship' games
As if all the previous disasters didn't happen and our current 'leadership ' has a fully functional brain .
Selection bias multiplied by slippery slope creates a straw man.
The list of conflicts to which we have provided the full range of assistance which did NOT result in direct involvement of US ground troops is 100x longer than the list you provided.
We have a 100% track record of such policy while avoiding direct conflict with the Russian Army.
Again. You are making an argument which does not fit the circumstances.
The circumstances are crystal clear .
Our dementia suffering Commander in Chief only recently completely botched the Afghanistan withdrawal leaving BILLIONS worth of weaponry to a terrorist organization.
Our Commander in Chief who simply can not even string together a series of lucid statements called for NATO membership for Ukraine even when Putin put 200,000 troops along the border .
Our Commander in Chief who is utilizing the DOJ and FBI to flagrantly attack political opponents openly threatened to blow up North Sea natural gas pipelines belonging to other countries . THEN DID IT.
And this is the guy you think NOW can successfully walk the thin line between ' supplying weapons ' and yet avoid escalating the war ?
Give me a freaking break .
If he talks like an idiot and acts like an idiot ……he's an idiot .
Well that is super re assuring .
Then exactly WHO is calling the 'shots ' ?
And did this same mystery guy/gal/it pull these other stunts ?
Good grief people ….connect the freaking dots .
He will have to give final permission. But I doubt he has much input in the strategy. The correct strategy doesn't change because Biden is an idiot. I am sure the Pentagon, NSA and others are being more careful in dealing with him.
WHOEVER is calling the shots...they have done an incredibly stupid body of work over the last 18 months.
Yet magically NOW we are supposed to blissfully trust this same bunch of cluster ****s to walk a razor thin line between supplying and fighting a proxy war ( against the world's largest owner of hydrogen bombs ) while not letting it escalate into WW3.
Mere weeks after blowing up natural gas pipelines in INTERNATIONAL waters. An act of war Biden literally and PUBLICALLY promised to do only a few months earlier .
Good grief fella ....take a step back ......and exam the insanity of this situation .
So we blew the Nordstrum line?
So far the only thing we have done is helped Ukraine. No troops, no military action, no air power.
You are freaking out over nothing. You really think Putin is going nuclear against the US over selling weapons?
As pointed out before .....we have gotten sucked in to at least 4-5 wars that all began with 'only' supplies.
No , Putin is just bluffing . Just like the 200,000 troops he placed on the border was a bluff .
This a strategic defeat for Russia.
It is already a strategic defeat. Their equipment is shown to be inferior. Russian material and personnel losses are tremendous. The loss of prestige and respect of other nations is terrible. They don't have a birthrate that will allow them to replace the tens of thousands lost. They are leaving Kherson right now. It is over for the Russian military and this is a terrible blow to Russian society.
Don't expect them to quit this early on just because outside media sources think they should .
Historically, they did not have an aged population whose birthrate was below replacement rate. It is over.
Fertility rates/birth rates are one of those unsung and very little commented on geopolitical issues that will be of major importance by 2050.
Half of all the countries on earth now have below replacement level rates.
And that list of countries will only continue to grow as the century goes on.
Gonna have massive implications for economies and militaries the world over.
Reliving 3rd grade again, are you?Harrison Bergeron said:RMF5630 said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
Geez, grow up. This is a policy discussion. No one on here has any say in what happens in Ukraine. Discuss the facts of the situation, playing emotional games is bush league. You got something to add, add it.
So we will order you feathers.
That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier
"If the fighting escalates or there's any attack on NATO," US airborne troops are "fully prepared to cross the border into Ukraine."
HISTORIC DEPLOYMENT: CBS News has been given exclusive access to the Army’s 101st Airborne Division as they are deployed to Europe for the first time since the last World War. They are now the closest U.S. forces to the fight in Ukraine. pic.twitter.com/61sAvrCeVf
— CBS Evening News (@CBSEveningNews) October 21, 2022
CBS gets an exclusive sneak peak: "The US Army's 101st Airborne is practicing for war with Russia just miles from Ukraine's border"
— Michael Tracey (@mtracey) October 22, 2022
"It's not just about defending NATO territory," correspondent @charliecbs reports. "They're fully prepared to cross over into Ukrainian territory" pic.twitter.com/XE2OfHZV4o
Insanity.
Indeed.Sam Lowry said:
Insanity.
I was told this wasn't going to happen.
Just assume they know what they're doing…it's not like they've ever been wrong.Doc Holliday said:Indeed.Sam Lowry said:
Insanity.
I was told this wasn't going to happen.
Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
You really come across as incredibly stupid with comments like this. As has already been pointed out numerous times, no one on this thread is suggesting the US send anything but weapons to the Ukraine. We are nothing more or less than arms dealers, selling to the winning side of an unjust war.
If you'd like to retain any credibility you have, stop schtuping your dumbass straw man.
Help me out here.........Golem said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
You really come across as incredibly stupid with comments like this. As has already been pointed out numerous times, no one on this thread is suggesting the US send anything but weapons to the Ukraine. We are nothing more or less than arms dealers, selling to the winning side of an unjust war.
If you'd like to retain any credibility you have, stop schtuping your dumbass straw man.
Why all of a sudden do we trust the abilities of a dementia stricken old man to walk to the very edge of WW3 without triggering it ?
Do we now have a different president than the one who went PUBLIC with the promise to blow up those natural gas pipelines ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who left BILLIONS of dollars worth of weapons to the Taliban ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who has screwed up almost every single aspect of the US economy in the last 18 months ? Who has unleashed the DOJ and FBI on Christians ? Who has opened the US borders to millions of illegals ?
( and BTW a single division of paratroopers .....in this case the 101st airborne ....are little more than a glorified ' trip wire '. As airborne divisions sacrifice large units of armor and heavy artillery ...for mobility . A 'trip wire' that can do little more on its own than get the US directly involved in still another ground war. )
Yet here we are....blindly trusting the dumbest...most mentally crippled president since Woodrow Wilson to fight this obvious proxy war.......without escalating it into WW3.
Blindly trusting the most inept / woke administration in US history to provide billions of dollars worth of weapons to a country we don't even have a defense treaty with . Weapons that are being used to kill thousands of Russian troops . As if those same Russians will passively tolerate such aid ....such losses...... indefinitely . As if Putin will passively allow still another US attempt at regime change .
So please educate me........why do we NOW trust these Dem morons with the most dangerous geo political situation since Kennedy navigated the Cuban Missel Crisis ?
Canada2017 said:Help me out here.........Golem said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
You really come across as incredibly stupid with comments like this. As has already been pointed out numerous times, no one on this thread is suggesting the US send anything but weapons to the Ukraine. We are nothing more or less than arms dealers, selling to the winning side of an unjust war.
If you'd like to retain any credibility you have, stop schtuping your dumbass straw man.
Why all of a sudden do we trust the abilities of a dementia stricken old man to walk to the very edge of WW3 without triggering it ?
Do we now have a different president than the one who went PUBLIC with the promise to blow up those natural gas pipelines ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who left BILLIONS of dollars worth of weapons to the Taliban ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who has screwed up almost every single aspect of the US economy in the last 18 months ? Who has unleashed the DOJ and FBI on Christians ? Who has opened the US borders to millions of illegals ?
( and BTW a single division of paratroopers .....in this case the 101st airborne ....are little more than a glorified ' trip wire '. As airborne divisions sacrifice large units of armor and heavy artillery ...for mobility . A 'trip wire' that can do little more on its own than get the US directly involved in still another ground war. )
Yet here we are....blindly trusting the dumbest...most mentally crippled president since Woodrow Wilson to fight this obvious proxy war.......without escalating it into WW3.
Blindly trusting the most inept / woke administration in US history to provide billions of dollars worth of weapons to a country we don't even have a defense treaty with . Weapons that are being used to kill thousands of Russian troops . As if those same Russians will passively tolerate such aid ....such losses...... indefinitely . As if Putin will passively allow still another US attempt at regime change .
So please educate me........why do we NOW trust these Dem morons with the most dangerous geo political situation since Kennedy navigated the Cuban Missel Crisis ?
Not every choice needs to be controversial. Some things are even hard for a democrat to mess up. Arms deals to an attacked nation are just transactions. Only a fool claims we are proposing sending troops when we aren't. Straw men are pointless.
Golem said:Canada2017 said:Help me out here.........Golem said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
You really come across as incredibly stupid with comments like this. As has already been pointed out numerous times, no one on this thread is suggesting the US send anything but weapons to the Ukraine. We are nothing more or less than arms dealers, selling to the winning side of an unjust war.
If you'd like to retain any credibility you have, stop schtuping your dumbass straw man.
Why all of a sudden do we trust the abilities of a dementia stricken old man to walk to the very edge of WW3 without triggering it ?
Do we now have a different president than the one who went PUBLIC with the promise to blow up those natural gas pipelines ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who left BILLIONS of dollars worth of weapons to the Taliban ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who has screwed up almost every single aspect of the US economy in the last 18 months ? Who has unleashed the DOJ and FBI on Christians ? Who has opened the US borders to millions of illegals ?
( and BTW a single division of paratroopers .....in this case the 101st airborne ....are little more than a glorified ' trip wire '. As airborne divisions sacrifice large units of armor and heavy artillery ...for mobility . A 'trip wire' that can do little more on its own than get the US directly involved in still another ground war. )
Yet here we are....blindly trusting the dumbest...most mentally crippled president since Woodrow Wilson to fight this obvious proxy war.......without escalating it into WW3.
Blindly trusting the most inept / woke administration in US history to provide billions of dollars worth of weapons to a country we don't even have a defense treaty with . Weapons that are being used to kill thousands of Russian troops . As if those same Russians will passively tolerate such aid ....such losses...... indefinitely . As if Putin will passively allow still another US attempt at regime change .
So please educate me........why do we NOW trust these Dem morons with the most dangerous geo political situation since Kennedy navigated the Cuban Missel Crisis ?
Not every choice needs to be controversial. Some things are even hard for a democrat to mess up. Arms deals to an attacked nation are just transactions. Only a fool claims we are proposing sending troops when we aren't. Straw men are pointless.
You are too intelligent for such generalizations.
Educate me .
This president is an obvious dementia sufferer . Yet we trust such a man to fight a proxy war ?
This administration has literally screwed up everything it has touched since it took power .
Yet we now blindly allow this same bunch to determine whether or not we enter WW3 ?
How did this president ….this administration…..earn our blind trust to walk such a razor thin line ?
Why is an under equipped airborne division now within a relatively short distance from the Ukrainian border ?
Only a fool would think it is anything more than a 'trip wire' .
Sam Lowry said:Just assume they know what they're doing…it's not like they've ever been wrong.Doc Holliday said:Indeed.Sam Lowry said:
Insanity.
I was told this wasn't going to happen.
Put yer skirts down, girls and google up "reforger exercise,"
Military exercises are what (good) militaries do. Often, they are diplomatic statements of intent. In this case, the intent is to let Russia know we will dot their eyes if they cast a shadow on a NATO border.
whiterock said:Sam Lowry said:Just assume they know what they're doing…it's not like they've ever been wrong.Doc Holliday said:Indeed.Sam Lowry said:
Insanity.
I was told this wasn't going to happen.
Put yer skirts down, girls and google up "reforger exercise,"
Military exercises are what (good) militaries do. Often, they are diplomatic statements of intent. In this case, the intent is to let Russia know we will dot their eyes if they cast a shadow on a NATO border.
So you now trust Biden's judgment in such matters ?
A man approaching 80 years old who literally can't string together 5 coherent sentences ?
A man you have been ( justifiably) blasting for months for one continual screw up after another is suddenly dead on with placing an under equipped airborne division relatively close to a war zone ?
How did Biden's mental capacity magically improve ….Jesus ?
Sam Lowry said:I don't think Russia ever stated any goal to remove parts of NATO. Maintaining a neutral buffer in Ukraine is a good idea. Unfortunately it's not consistent with our stated goal of admitting Ukraine to NATO.whiterock said:Both of those are not true because that part in bold is a straw man.Sam Lowry said:You and WR talk as if the United States:Quote:so, do you believe the strategy can only be used against one adversary?Quote:That's the point. We achieved our goal.Quote:Perhaps you missed the little blurb in the news about the collapse of the Soviet Union.Quote:Cool. So why are we still fighting them?Quote:Quote:The Domino theory was wrong.Quote:Quote:Quote:
Bingo. The weak underbelly of Canada's position, and that of most of the more vocal power geopolitics school theoreticians who are so critical of our current Ukraine policy, is that it implicitly presumes that Ukraine is for Russia to dispose of as it sees fit. Once we accept the premise that Russia has the right to dominate the shatterzones around it, then there is no competition.....they just drive their tanks up to our border with the shatterzone and start revving engines every time they want something.
If Russia ends up owning the shatterzone, fine. We'll deal with it. But you do not just let them have it for nothing. Make them pay for it. Dearly. Make them take centuries to do it. And the time between then and now is called "peace." It's a time when their kids and our kids are not looking at one another eyeball to eyeball across fields of razor wire. That's the way the power geopolitics game is actually played. It is a "Great Game" and it goes on forever. The only question is on which squares it is played.
Right now, we're playing it on the Ukrainian square, with Ukranian troops, who are begging and pleading for more ammo. Piss-poor gamesmanship not to send them most of what they ask for.
We're not trying to collapse Russia.
We're trying to get Russia to stop.
or pay dearly to keep going.
And if Russia does collapse....
If the Russian Federation as we know it does collapse....
Ukraine's 55m people become the beating heart of the Eastern Slavic world.
That would be a history-changer.
To our benefit.
For a century or three.
Think, boys.
THINK!
Think indeed .
Similar propaganda to the old ' Domino Theory ' that we were sold involving Vietnam.
People only realized it was all a lie 50,000 + dead US servicemen later . Billions of dollars wasted .
Ukraine is not worth the death of a single American.
Defending Ukraine is not in the strategic interests of the United States .
Period
You are simply wrong here. White Rock and ATL are 100% correct. The Domino theory wasn't wrong either. The Soviet Union fell because it couldn't keep up militarily. Had we sat back and let it continue its march for global communism, it would have had decades longer to gain ground and perhaps figure out the Chinese model.
No one is proposing sending a single live American to the Ukraine. Given that, there will be no single dead ones there either (unless they go themselves). Spending money to bankrupt the violent unprovoked Russian expansion is and always will be money VERY well spent.
"a Cold War policy that suggested a communist government in one nation would quickly lead to communist takeovers in neighboring states, each falling like a perfectly aligned row of dominos"
The Fall of China to communism did not lead to the fall of Japan to communism. The fall of Vietnam to communism did not lead to the fall of Thailand. The fall of Angola to communism did not lead to the fall of South Africa. The fall of Cuba did not lead to the fall of Colombia or Mexico. The fall of Czechoslovakia to communism did not lead to the fall of Austria.
We were right to resist and assist anti-communist movements world wide. But the idea that every battle for every State had to be won was simply not true. Each country had its own unique internal political and cultural issues that made it more or less susceptible to communist take over.
The Domino theory stuff is why we wasted more than a decade on heavy combat in Vietnam, and 60,000 dead, when we should have cut bait and re-entrenched in a more stable anti-Communist Southeast Asian nation.
Or, perhaps the plain events of history tell the opposite story: that we were right to fight them everywhere, to make them pay dearly for every inch gained, thereby ensuring their system collapsed before ours did.
Signed, an old Cold Warrior
By your own admission, "we achieved our goal" against that adversary. We now have a new adversary that grew up from the old. As evidenced by all the internal problems with supplies, desertions, mysterious deaths of Putin allies and enemies alike, the strategy is working…. again.
A. Won the great ideological battle against Soviet communism; and
B. Is still fighting a great ideological battle against Soviet communism.
Both of those things can't be true. If we caused the Soviet "system" to collapse, as WR argues, that begs the question of what system we're fighting now, whether we're just fighting Russia because they're Russia, and whether that may have been the case all along.
We are not fighting a great ideological battle against Soviet Communism. That collapsed, because we resisted it everywhere and we were stronger than they were. Today, we are fighting plain old Russian imperialism. That, too, will collapse, because we are stronger than they are (assuming we are wise enough to resist them to their end). No question that garden variety Russian imperialism was a constituent part of Soviet world-wide communism. That does not mean we should not resist garden variety Russian imperialism whenever such impacts our security interests.
If Russia wants to win the shatter zone all the way thru Central Asia up to the borders of China and India, fine. It's not really terribly interesting to us, so long as no one has hegemony. We can ally with China or india as needed to ensure balance. But when Russia moves west as part of a stated goal of removing parts of Nato and attaching them to a Russian security zone.....we have a big problem. And we should not cede them an inch on such a policy agendz. Not one. Make them pay for it, and defeat them if we can. That includes inflicting strategic disadvantages from the status quo ante. There must be a Pavlovian lesson to Russian aggression - you invade neutral neighbors, you can expect those neighbors to no longer be neutral.
We have the same overriding goal for the Eurasian land mass that Britain had in the Napoleonic Age: We have no interesting in dominating that space; our interest is to makes sure one one else dominates that space. We ally with whomever we need to ally to keep the balance. And right now, the proper balance is an intact, sovereign, neutral Ukraine. If that cannot be maintained, then fine....find some alternative solution which does not involve Ukraine becoming a Russian puppet state.
Russia does not have a right to be a hegemon.
Countries EARN the right to be a hegemon.
We have.
Russia hasn't.
They need to make peace with that and do a lot of homework.
Until they do, we need to keep reminding them that they have a lot homework to do.
We didn't fight the Russians in Afghanistan just because they were there. We fought them because we knowingly drew them there, and we justified it as part of an existential struggle. We're doing the same kind of thing in Ukraine, but the rationale is no longer clear. If all we're doing is resisting garden variety imperialism, there are other ways of doing that. There's no need to invite conflict in order to incapacitate the military or change the regime of a country we're not at war with.
Don't be a Russian apologist.
https://www.inquirer.com/opinion/ukraine-putin-russia-nato-20220111.html?outputType=amp
Put has made numerous statements over the years that he wants to reconstitute a Russian security zone comparable to the Warsaw Pact. Indeed, the power-geopolitics critique of current Ukraine policy - that NATO forced Russia into this war - is in no small part premised on those statement.
If you're going to level the critique, it would be wise to understand it's foundations.
whiterock said:Sam Lowry said:I don't think Russia ever stated any goal to remove parts of NATO. Maintaining a neutral buffer in Ukraine is a good idea. Unfortunately it's not consistent with our stated goal of admitting Ukraine to NATO.whiterock said:Both of those are not true because that part in bold is a straw man.Sam Lowry said:You and WR talk as if the United States:Quote:so, do you believe the strategy can only be used against one adversary?Quote:That's the point. We achieved our goal.Quote:Perhaps you missed the little blurb in the news about the collapse of the Soviet Union.Quote:Cool. So why are we still fighting them?Quote:Quote:The Domino theory was wrong.Quote:Quote:Quote:
Bingo. The weak underbelly of Canada's position, and that of most of the more vocal power geopolitics school theoreticians who are so critical of our current Ukraine policy, is that it implicitly presumes that Ukraine is for Russia to dispose of as it sees fit. Once we accept the premise that Russia has the right to dominate the shatterzones around it, then there is no competition.....they just drive their tanks up to our border with the shatterzone and start revving engines every time they want something.
If Russia ends up owning the shatterzone, fine. We'll deal with it. But you do not just let them have it for nothing. Make them pay for it. Dearly. Make them take centuries to do it. And the time between then and now is called "peace." It's a time when their kids and our kids are not looking at one another eyeball to eyeball across fields of razor wire. That's the way the power geopolitics game is actually played. It is a "Great Game" and it goes on forever. The only question is on which squares it is played.
Right now, we're playing it on the Ukrainian square, with Ukranian troops, who are begging and pleading for more ammo. Piss-poor gamesmanship not to send them most of what they ask for.
We're not trying to collapse Russia.
We're trying to get Russia to stop.
or pay dearly to keep going.
And if Russia does collapse....
If the Russian Federation as we know it does collapse....
Ukraine's 55m people become the beating heart of the Eastern Slavic world.
That would be a history-changer.
To our benefit.
For a century or three.
Think, boys.
THINK!
Think indeed .
Similar propaganda to the old ' Domino Theory ' that we were sold involving Vietnam.
People only realized it was all a lie 50,000 + dead US servicemen later . Billions of dollars wasted .
Ukraine is not worth the death of a single American.
Defending Ukraine is not in the strategic interests of the United States .
Period
You are simply wrong here. White Rock and ATL are 100% correct. The Domino theory wasn't wrong either. The Soviet Union fell because it couldn't keep up militarily. Had we sat back and let it continue its march for global communism, it would have had decades longer to gain ground and perhaps figure out the Chinese model.
No one is proposing sending a single live American to the Ukraine. Given that, there will be no single dead ones there either (unless they go themselves). Spending money to bankrupt the violent unprovoked Russian expansion is and always will be money VERY well spent.
"a Cold War policy that suggested a communist government in one nation would quickly lead to communist takeovers in neighboring states, each falling like a perfectly aligned row of dominos"
The Fall of China to communism did not lead to the fall of Japan to communism. The fall of Vietnam to communism did not lead to the fall of Thailand. The fall of Angola to communism did not lead to the fall of South Africa. The fall of Cuba did not lead to the fall of Colombia or Mexico. The fall of Czechoslovakia to communism did not lead to the fall of Austria.
We were right to resist and assist anti-communist movements world wide. But the idea that every battle for every State had to be won was simply not true. Each country had its own unique internal political and cultural issues that made it more or less susceptible to communist take over.
The Domino theory stuff is why we wasted more than a decade on heavy combat in Vietnam, and 60,000 dead, when we should have cut bait and re-entrenched in a more stable anti-Communist Southeast Asian nation.
Or, perhaps the plain events of history tell the opposite story: that we were right to fight them everywhere, to make them pay dearly for every inch gained, thereby ensuring their system collapsed before ours did.
Signed, an old Cold Warrior
By your own admission, "we achieved our goal" against that adversary. We now have a new adversary that grew up from the old. As evidenced by all the internal problems with supplies, desertions, mysterious deaths of Putin allies and enemies alike, the strategy is working…. again.
A. Won the great ideological battle against Soviet communism; and
B. Is still fighting a great ideological battle against Soviet communism.
Both of those things can't be true. If we caused the Soviet "system" to collapse, as WR argues, that begs the question of what system we're fighting now, whether we're just fighting Russia because they're Russia, and whether that may have been the case all along.
We are not fighting a great ideological battle against Soviet Communism. That collapsed, because we resisted it everywhere and we were stronger than they were. Today, we are fighting plain old Russian imperialism. That, too, will collapse, because we are stronger than they are (assuming we are wise enough to resist them to their end). No question that garden variety Russian imperialism was a constituent part of Soviet world-wide communism. That does not mean we should not resist garden variety Russian imperialism whenever such impacts our security interests.
If Russia wants to win the shatter zone all the way thru Central Asia up to the borders of China and India, fine. It's not really terribly interesting to us, so long as no one has hegemony. We can ally with China or india as needed to ensure balance. But when Russia moves west as part of a stated goal of removing parts of Nato and attaching them to a Russian security zone.....we have a big problem. And we should not cede them an inch on such a policy agendz. Not one. Make them pay for it, and defeat them if we can. That includes inflicting strategic disadvantages from the status quo ante. There must be a Pavlovian lesson to Russian aggression - you invade neutral neighbors, you can expect those neighbors to no longer be neutral.
We have the same overriding goal for the Eurasian land mass that Britain had in the Napoleonic Age: We have no interesting in dominating that space; our interest is to makes sure one one else dominates that space. We ally with whomever we need to ally to keep the balance. And right now, the proper balance is an intact, sovereign, neutral Ukraine. If that cannot be maintained, then fine....find some alternative solution which does not involve Ukraine becoming a Russian puppet state.
Russia does not have a right to be a hegemon.
Countries EARN the right to be a hegemon.
We have.
Russia hasn't.
They need to make peace with that and do a lot of homework.
Until they do, we need to keep reminding them that they have a lot homework to do.
We didn't fight the Russians in Afghanistan just because they were there. We fought them because we knowingly drew them there, and we justified it as part of an existential struggle. We're doing the same kind of thing in Ukraine, but the rationale is no longer clear. If all we're doing is resisting garden variety imperialism, there are other ways of doing that. There's no need to invite conflict in order to incapacitate the military or change the regime of a country we're not at war with.
Don't be a Russian apologist.
https://www.inquirer.com/opinion/ukraine-putin-russia-nato-20220111.html?outputType=amp
Put has made numerous statements over the years that he wants to reconstitute a Russian security zone comparable to the Warsaw Pact. Indeed, the power-geopolitics critique of current Ukraine policy - that NATO forced Russia into this war - is in no small part premised on those statement.
If you're going to level the critique, it would be wise to understand it's foundations.
So for decades the US accepted Ukraine as part of the Soviet Union …..that Ukraine was obviously within Russia's sphere of influence ( as it has been for centuries ) .
But now this Biden led administration is spending billions of dollars, blowing up international pipelines , and sending troops within drone range of a war zone ….to insure Ukraine's new desire to join NATO.
All of a sudden Ukraine has magically become of vital strategic interest to the United States. One worth risking WW3 .
A dementia suffering Biden more clear visioned than FDR , Kennedy, Nixon , Reagan , Clinton and Trump .
Who knew ?
Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Help me out here.........Golem said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
You really come across as incredibly stupid with comments like this. As has already been pointed out numerous times, no one on this thread is suggesting the US send anything but weapons to the Ukraine. We are nothing more or less than arms dealers, selling to the winning side of an unjust war.
If you'd like to retain any credibility you have, stop schtuping your dumbass straw man.
Why all of a sudden do we trust the abilities of a dementia stricken old man to walk to the very edge of WW3 without triggering it ?
Do we now have a different president than the one who went PUBLIC with the promise to blow up those natural gas pipelines ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who left BILLIONS of dollars worth of weapons to the Taliban ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who has screwed up almost every single aspect of the US economy in the last 18 months ? Who has unleashed the DOJ and FBI on Christians ? Who has opened the US borders to millions of illegals ?
( and BTW a single division of paratroopers .....in this case the 101st airborne ....are little more than a glorified ' trip wire '. As airborne divisions sacrifice large units of armor and heavy artillery ...for mobility . A 'trip wire' that can do little more on its own than get the US directly involved in still another ground war. )
Yet here we are....blindly trusting the dumbest...most mentally crippled president since Woodrow Wilson to fight this obvious proxy war.......without escalating it into WW3.
Blindly trusting the most inept / woke administration in US history to provide billions of dollars worth of weapons to a country we don't even have a defense treaty with . Weapons that are being used to kill thousands of Russian troops . As if those same Russians will passively tolerate such aid ....such losses...... indefinitely . As if Putin will passively allow still another US attempt at regime change .
So please educate me........why do we NOW trust these Dem morons with the most dangerous geo political situation since Kennedy navigated the Cuban Missel Crisis ?
Not every choice needs to be controversial. Some things are even hard for a democrat to mess up. Arms deals to an attacked nation are just transactions. Only a fool claims we are proposing sending troops when we aren't. Straw men are pointless.
You are too intelligent for such generalizations.
Educate me .
This president is an obvious dementia sufferer . Yet we trust such a man to fight a proxy war ?
This administration has literally screwed up everything it has touched since it took power .
Yet we now blindly allow this same bunch to determine whether or not we enter WW3 ?
How did this president ….this administration…..earn our blind trust to walk such a razor thin line ?
Why is an under equipped airborne division now within a relatively short distance from the Ukrainian border ?
Only a fool would think it is anything more than a 'trip wire' .
The US is the largest arms dealer on earth. It's not a razor thin anything.
Golem said:Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Help me out here.........Golem said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
You really come across as incredibly stupid with comments like this. As has already been pointed out numerous times, no one on this thread is suggesting the US send anything but weapons to the Ukraine. We are nothing more or less than arms dealers, selling to the winning side of an unjust war.
If you'd like to retain any credibility you have, stop schtuping your dumbass straw man.
Why all of a sudden do we trust the abilities of a dementia stricken old man to walk to the very edge of WW3 without triggering it ?
Do we now have a different president than the one who went PUBLIC with the promise to blow up those natural gas pipelines ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who left BILLIONS of dollars worth of weapons to the Taliban ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who has screwed up almost every single aspect of the US economy in the last 18 months ? Who has unleashed the DOJ and FBI on Christians ? Who has opened the US borders to millions of illegals ?
( and BTW a single division of paratroopers .....in this case the 101st airborne ....are little more than a glorified ' trip wire '. As airborne divisions sacrifice large units of armor and heavy artillery ...for mobility . A 'trip wire' that can do little more on its own than get the US directly involved in still another ground war. )
Yet here we are....blindly trusting the dumbest...most mentally crippled president since Woodrow Wilson to fight this obvious proxy war.......without escalating it into WW3.
Blindly trusting the most inept / woke administration in US history to provide billions of dollars worth of weapons to a country we don't even have a defense treaty with . Weapons that are being used to kill thousands of Russian troops . As if those same Russians will passively tolerate such aid ....such losses...... indefinitely . As if Putin will passively allow still another US attempt at regime change .
So please educate me........why do we NOW trust these Dem morons with the most dangerous geo political situation since Kennedy navigated the Cuban Missel Crisis ?
Not every choice needs to be controversial. Some things are even hard for a democrat to mess up. Arms deals to an attacked nation are just transactions. Only a fool claims we are proposing sending troops when we aren't. Straw men are pointless.
You are too intelligent for such generalizations.
Educate me .
This president is an obvious dementia sufferer . Yet we trust such a man to fight a proxy war ?
This administration has literally screwed up everything it has touched since it took power .
Yet we now blindly allow this same bunch to determine whether or not we enter WW3 ?
How did this president ….this administration…..earn our blind trust to walk such a razor thin line ?
Why is an under equipped airborne division now within a relatively short distance from the Ukrainian border ?
Only a fool would think it is anything more than a 'trip wire' .
The US is the largest arms dealer on earth. It's not a razor thin anything.
Not razor thin to….
provide billions of dollars of free weapons to only one antagonist in a war.
blow up other countries natural gas lines in international waters
Send the 101st airborne division within air range of a war zone
Come on guy .
You know better .
This is the exact same kind of **** that got us involved in WW2, Korea, Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan.
Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Help me out here.........Golem said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
You really come across as incredibly stupid with comments like this. As has already been pointed out numerous times, no one on this thread is suggesting the US send anything but weapons to the Ukraine. We are nothing more or less than arms dealers, selling to the winning side of an unjust war.
If you'd like to retain any credibility you have, stop schtuping your dumbass straw man.
Why all of a sudden do we trust the abilities of a dementia stricken old man to walk to the very edge of WW3 without triggering it ?
Do we now have a different president than the one who went PUBLIC with the promise to blow up those natural gas pipelines ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who left BILLIONS of dollars worth of weapons to the Taliban ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who has screwed up almost every single aspect of the US economy in the last 18 months ? Who has unleashed the DOJ and FBI on Christians ? Who has opened the US borders to millions of illegals ?
( and BTW a single division of paratroopers .....in this case the 101st airborne ....are little more than a glorified ' trip wire '. As airborne divisions sacrifice large units of armor and heavy artillery ...for mobility . A 'trip wire' that can do little more on its own than get the US directly involved in still another ground war. )
Yet here we are....blindly trusting the dumbest...most mentally crippled president since Woodrow Wilson to fight this obvious proxy war.......without escalating it into WW3.
Blindly trusting the most inept / woke administration in US history to provide billions of dollars worth of weapons to a country we don't even have a defense treaty with . Weapons that are being used to kill thousands of Russian troops . As if those same Russians will passively tolerate such aid ....such losses...... indefinitely . As if Putin will passively allow still another US attempt at regime change .
So please educate me........why do we NOW trust these Dem morons with the most dangerous geo political situation since Kennedy navigated the Cuban Missel Crisis ?
Not every choice needs to be controversial. Some things are even hard for a democrat to mess up. Arms deals to an attacked nation are just transactions. Only a fool claims we are proposing sending troops when we aren't. Straw men are pointless.
You are too intelligent for such generalizations.
Educate me .
This president is an obvious dementia sufferer . Yet we trust such a man to fight a proxy war ?
This administration has literally screwed up everything it has touched since it took power .
Yet we now blindly allow this same bunch to determine whether or not we enter WW3 ?
How did this president ….this administration…..earn our blind trust to walk such a razor thin line ?
Why is an under equipped airborne division now within a relatively short distance from the Ukrainian border ?
Only a fool would think it is anything more than a 'trip wire' .
The US is the largest arms dealer on earth. It's not a razor thin anything.
Not razor thin to….
provide billions of dollars of free weapons to only one antagonist in a war.
blow up other countries natural gas lines in international waters
Send the 101st airborne division within air range of a war zone
Come on guy .
You know better .
This is the exact same kind of **** that got us involved in WW2, Korea, Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan.
No. It's not razor thin anything. We've shown so much weakness to this point that it's actually amazing we haven't been attacked. Showing strength and arming allies is not an act of war.
Speak softly and carry a big stick. Just relax. We aren't going to war.
Harrison Bergeron said:RMF5630 said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
Geez, grow up. This is a policy discussion. No one on here has any say in what happens in Ukraine. Discuss the facts of the situation, playing emotional games is bush league. You got something to add, add it.
So we will order you feathers.
I don't know where you live. But in the US we cannot enlist our kids. You in Bejing?
Retreating and attacking civilian targets are not the acts of a victorious conqueror. Ivan is getting rolled and it is going to get worse for him.
AmazingGolem said:Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Help me out here.........Golem said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
You really come across as incredibly stupid with comments like this. As has already been pointed out numerous times, no one on this thread is suggesting the US send anything but weapons to the Ukraine. We are nothing more or less than arms dealers, selling to the winning side of an unjust war.
If you'd like to retain any credibility you have, stop schtuping your dumbass straw man.
Why all of a sudden do we trust the abilities of a dementia stricken old man to walk to the very edge of WW3 without triggering it ?
Do we now have a different president than the one who went PUBLIC with the promise to blow up those natural gas pipelines ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who left BILLIONS of dollars worth of weapons to the Taliban ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who has screwed up almost every single aspect of the US economy in the last 18 months ? Who has unleashed the DOJ and FBI on Christians ? Who has opened the US borders to millions of illegals ?
( and BTW a single division of paratroopers .....in this case the 101st airborne ....are little more than a glorified ' trip wire '. As airborne divisions sacrifice large units of armor and heavy artillery ...for mobility . A 'trip wire' that can do little more on its own than get the US directly involved in still another ground war. )
Yet here we are....blindly trusting the dumbest...most mentally crippled president since Woodrow Wilson to fight this obvious proxy war.......without escalating it into WW3.
Blindly trusting the most inept / woke administration in US history to provide billions of dollars worth of weapons to a country we don't even have a defense treaty with . Weapons that are being used to kill thousands of Russian troops . As if those same Russians will passively tolerate such aid ....such losses...... indefinitely . As if Putin will passively allow still another US attempt at regime change .
So please educate me........why do we NOW trust these Dem morons with the most dangerous geo political situation since Kennedy navigated the Cuban Missel Crisis ?
Not every choice needs to be controversial. Some things are even hard for a democrat to mess up. Arms deals to an attacked nation are just transactions. Only a fool claims we are proposing sending troops when we aren't. Straw men are pointless.
You are too intelligent for such generalizations.
Educate me .
This president is an obvious dementia sufferer . Yet we trust such a man to fight a proxy war ?
This administration has literally screwed up everything it has touched since it took power .
Yet we now blindly allow this same bunch to determine whether or not we enter WW3 ?
How did this president ….this administration…..earn our blind trust to walk such a razor thin line ?
Why is an under equipped airborne division now within a relatively short distance from the Ukrainian border ?
Only a fool would think it is anything more than a 'trip wire' .
The US is the largest arms dealer on earth. It's not a razor thin anything.
Not razor thin to….
provide billions of dollars of free weapons to only one antagonist in a war.
blow up other countries natural gas lines in international waters
Send the 101st airborne division within air range of a war zone
Come on guy .
You know better .
This is the exact same kind of **** that got us involved in WW2, Korea, Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan.
No. It's not razor thin anything. We've shown so much weakness to this point that it's actually amazing we haven't been attacked. Showing strength and arming allies is not an act of war.
Speak softly and carry a big stick. Just relax. We aren't going to war.
Blissfully following the choices of the oldest president in American history .A man clearly suffering from dementia. And few find this unusual .
Risking still another war...this time in support of a country the US has no defense treaty with . A country the United States has recognized as within the Russian sphere of influence since at least the 1930's. Yet few question such a dramatic change in US foreign policy .
The POTUS publicly threatened to blow up natural gas lines of other countries in international waters.
They get destroyed a few months later.
Predictably, we have now placed thousands of ground troops within striking range of the war zone.
Few seem to notice.
81 million 'votes' for Joe Biden .............................put us straight into this mess.
Canada2017 said:AmazingGolem said:Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Help me out here.........Golem said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
You really come across as incredibly stupid with comments like this. As has already been pointed out numerous times, no one on this thread is suggesting the US send anything but weapons to the Ukraine. We are nothing more or less than arms dealers, selling to the winning side of an unjust war.
If you'd like to retain any credibility you have, stop schtuping your dumbass straw man.
Why all of a sudden do we trust the abilities of a dementia stricken old man to walk to the very edge of WW3 without triggering it ?
Do we now have a different president than the one who went PUBLIC with the promise to blow up those natural gas pipelines ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who left BILLIONS of dollars worth of weapons to the Taliban ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who has screwed up almost every single aspect of the US economy in the last 18 months ? Who has unleashed the DOJ and FBI on Christians ? Who has opened the US borders to millions of illegals ?
( and BTW a single division of paratroopers .....in this case the 101st airborne ....are little more than a glorified ' trip wire '. As airborne divisions sacrifice large units of armor and heavy artillery ...for mobility . A 'trip wire' that can do little more on its own than get the US directly involved in still another ground war. )
Yet here we are....blindly trusting the dumbest...most mentally crippled president since Woodrow Wilson to fight this obvious proxy war.......without escalating it into WW3.
Blindly trusting the most inept / woke administration in US history to provide billions of dollars worth of weapons to a country we don't even have a defense treaty with . Weapons that are being used to kill thousands of Russian troops . As if those same Russians will passively tolerate such aid ....such losses...... indefinitely . As if Putin will passively allow still another US attempt at regime change .
So please educate me........why do we NOW trust these Dem morons with the most dangerous geo political situation since Kennedy navigated the Cuban Missel Crisis ?
Not every choice needs to be controversial. Some things are even hard for a democrat to mess up. Arms deals to an attacked nation are just transactions. Only a fool claims we are proposing sending troops when we aren't. Straw men are pointless.
You are too intelligent for such generalizations.
Educate me .
This president is an obvious dementia sufferer . Yet we trust such a man to fight a proxy war ?
This administration has literally screwed up everything it has touched since it took power .
Yet we now blindly allow this same bunch to determine whether or not we enter WW3 ?
How did this president ….this administration…..earn our blind trust to walk such a razor thin line ?
Why is an under equipped airborne division now within a relatively short distance from the Ukrainian border ?
Only a fool would think it is anything more than a 'trip wire' .
The US is the largest arms dealer on earth. It's not a razor thin anything.
Not razor thin to….
provide billions of dollars of free weapons to only one antagonist in a war.
blow up other countries natural gas lines in international waters
Send the 101st airborne division within air range of a war zone
Come on guy .
You know better .
This is the exact same kind of **** that got us involved in WW2, Korea, Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan.
No. It's not razor thin anything. We've shown so much weakness to this point that it's actually amazing we haven't been attacked. Showing strength and arming allies is not an act of war.
Speak softly and carry a big stick. Just relax. We aren't going to war.
Blissfully following the choices of the oldest president in American history .A man clearly suffering from dementia. And few find this unusual .
Risking still another war...this time in support of a country the US has no defense treaty with . A country the United States has recognized as within the Russian sphere of influence since at least the 1930's. Yet few question such a dramatic change in US foreign policy .
The POTUS publicly threatened to blow up natural gas lines of other countries in international waters.
They get destroyed a few months later.
Predictably, we have now placed thousands of ground troops within striking range of the war zone.
Few seem to notice.
81 million 'votes' for Joe Biden .............................put us straight into this mess.
Stow it, chicken little. The right thing doesn't change based on who is in charge.
Golem said:Canada2017 said:AmazingGolem said:Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Help me out here.........Golem said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
You really come across as incredibly stupid with comments like this. As has already been pointed out numerous times, no one on this thread is suggesting the US send anything but weapons to the Ukraine. We are nothing more or less than arms dealers, selling to the winning side of an unjust war.
If you'd like to retain any credibility you have, stop schtuping your dumbass straw man.
Why all of a sudden do we trust the abilities of a dementia stricken old man to walk to the very edge of WW3 without triggering it ?
Do we now have a different president than the one who went PUBLIC with the promise to blow up those natural gas pipelines ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who left BILLIONS of dollars worth of weapons to the Taliban ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who has screwed up almost every single aspect of the US economy in the last 18 months ? Who has unleashed the DOJ and FBI on Christians ? Who has opened the US borders to millions of illegals ?
( and BTW a single division of paratroopers .....in this case the 101st airborne ....are little more than a glorified ' trip wire '. As airborne divisions sacrifice large units of armor and heavy artillery ...for mobility . A 'trip wire' that can do little more on its own than get the US directly involved in still another ground war. )
Yet here we are....blindly trusting the dumbest...most mentally crippled president since Woodrow Wilson to fight this obvious proxy war.......without escalating it into WW3.
Blindly trusting the most inept / woke administration in US history to provide billions of dollars worth of weapons to a country we don't even have a defense treaty with . Weapons that are being used to kill thousands of Russian troops . As if those same Russians will passively tolerate such aid ....such losses...... indefinitely . As if Putin will passively allow still another US attempt at regime change .
So please educate me........why do we NOW trust these Dem morons with the most dangerous geo political situation since Kennedy navigated the Cuban Missel Crisis ?
Not every choice needs to be controversial. Some things are even hard for a democrat to mess up. Arms deals to an attacked nation are just transactions. Only a fool claims we are proposing sending troops when we aren't. Straw men are pointless.
You are too intelligent for such generalizations.
Educate me .
This president is an obvious dementia sufferer . Yet we trust such a man to fight a proxy war ?
This administration has literally screwed up everything it has touched since it took power .
Yet we now blindly allow this same bunch to determine whether or not we enter WW3 ?
How did this president ….this administration…..earn our blind trust to walk such a razor thin line ?
Why is an under equipped airborne division now within a relatively short distance from the Ukrainian border ?
Only a fool would think it is anything more than a 'trip wire' .
The US is the largest arms dealer on earth. It's not a razor thin anything.
Not razor thin to….
provide billions of dollars of free weapons to only one antagonist in a war.
blow up other countries natural gas lines in international waters
Send the 101st airborne division within air range of a war zone
Come on guy .
You know better .
This is the exact same kind of **** that got us involved in WW2, Korea, Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan.
No. It's not razor thin anything. We've shown so much weakness to this point that it's actually amazing we haven't been attacked. Showing strength and arming allies is not an act of war.
Speak softly and carry a big stick. Just relax. We aren't going to war.
Blissfully following the choices of the oldest president in American history .A man clearly suffering from dementia. And few find this unusual .
Risking still another war...this time in support of a country the US has no defense treaty with . A country the United States has recognized as within the Russian sphere of influence since at least the 1930's. Yet few question such a dramatic change in US foreign policy .
The POTUS publicly threatened to blow up natural gas lines of other countries in international waters.
They get destroyed a few months later.
Predictably, we have now placed thousands of ground troops within striking range of the war zone.
Few seem to notice.
81 million 'votes' for Joe Biden .............................put us straight into this mess.
Stow it, chicken little. The right thing doesn't change based on who is in charge.
That Ukraine has always been part of the Russian sphere of influence ....a reality that has been accepted by every president from FDR to Bush....... is indisputable .
That the oldest president in US history has dementia ....should be obvious to anyone who has seen him.
So exactly why do you believe such a dramatic change in US foreign policy should be entrusted to this particular administration ?
Why is such a foreign policy change suddenly worth the thousands of lives lost . the millions displaced and the billions of US dollars spent ?
And for God's sake why put an under equipped airborne division within easy reach of an 'incident ' ?
You're a smart guy .....let's see some specific rational reasons .
We are in agreement here. Biden put us in this mess. No argument.Canada2017 said:AmazingGolem said:Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Help me out here.........Golem said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
You really come across as incredibly stupid with comments like this. As has already been pointed out numerous times, no one on this thread is suggesting the US send anything but weapons to the Ukraine. We are nothing more or less than arms dealers, selling to the winning side of an unjust war.
If you'd like to retain any credibility you have, stop schtuping your dumbass straw man.
Why all of a sudden do we trust the abilities of a dementia stricken old man to walk to the very edge of WW3 without triggering it ?
Do we now have a different president than the one who went PUBLIC with the promise to blow up those natural gas pipelines ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who left BILLIONS of dollars worth of weapons to the Taliban ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who has screwed up almost every single aspect of the US economy in the last 18 months ? Who has unleashed the DOJ and FBI on Christians ? Who has opened the US borders to millions of illegals ?
( and BTW a single division of paratroopers .....in this case the 101st airborne ....are little more than a glorified ' trip wire '. As airborne divisions sacrifice large units of armor and heavy artillery ...for mobility . A 'trip wire' that can do little more on its own than get the US directly involved in still another ground war. )
Yet here we are....blindly trusting the dumbest...most mentally crippled president since Woodrow Wilson to fight this obvious proxy war.......without escalating it into WW3.
Blindly trusting the most inept / woke administration in US history to provide billions of dollars worth of weapons to a country we don't even have a defense treaty with . Weapons that are being used to kill thousands of Russian troops . As if those same Russians will passively tolerate such aid ....such losses...... indefinitely . As if Putin will passively allow still another US attempt at regime change .
So please educate me........why do we NOW trust these Dem morons with the most dangerous geo political situation since Kennedy navigated the Cuban Missel Crisis ?
Not every choice needs to be controversial. Some things are even hard for a democrat to mess up. Arms deals to an attacked nation are just transactions. Only a fool claims we are proposing sending troops when we aren't. Straw men are pointless.
You are too intelligent for such generalizations.
Educate me .
This president is an obvious dementia sufferer . Yet we trust such a man to fight a proxy war ?
This administration has literally screwed up everything it has touched since it took power .
Yet we now blindly allow this same bunch to determine whether or not we enter WW3 ?
How did this president ….this administration…..earn our blind trust to walk such a razor thin line ?
Why is an under equipped airborne division now within a relatively short distance from the Ukrainian border ?
Only a fool would think it is anything more than a 'trip wire' .
The US is the largest arms dealer on earth. It's not a razor thin anything.
Not razor thin to….
provide billions of dollars of free weapons to only one antagonist in a war.
blow up other countries natural gas lines in international waters
Send the 101st airborne division within air range of a war zone
Come on guy .
You know better .
This is the exact same kind of **** that got us involved in WW2, Korea, Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan.
No. It's not razor thin anything. We've shown so much weakness to this point that it's actually amazing we haven't been attacked. Showing strength and arming allies is not an act of war.
Speak softly and carry a big stick. Just relax. We aren't going to war.
Blissfully following the choices of the oldest president in American history .A man clearly suffering from dementia. And few find this unusual .
Risking still another war...this time in support of a country the US has no defense treaty with . A country the United States has recognized as within the Russian sphere of influence since at least the 1930's. Yet few question such a dramatic change in US foreign policy .
The POTUS publicly threatened to blow up natural gas lines of other countries in international waters.
They get destroyed a few months later.
Predictably, we have now placed thousands of ground troops within striking range of the war zone.
Few seem to notice.
81 million 'votes' for Joe Biden .............................put us straight into this mess.
A strong President and Putin doesn't go further than Crimea, which he got under Obama. No Afghanistan disaster, so China doesn't believe we are incompetent and threatens Taiwan more.
Say what you will about Trump, Russia and China did not move like they are now.
Funny, they say Trump loves Putin. Yet, undr Obidem both Russia and China hasve been able to expand much more.
Stop acting like Obama/Biden bent over to take it from Russia like Trump did. Obama had Russia bleeding on multiple fronts to try and hold on to a reduced amount of influence in countries that they already held as satellites (Ukraine and Syria). Ukraine is probably now out from under the Russian thumb for good (Let's go Brandon!), a big chunk of Syria was too until Trump retreated and gave it back. Trump was the one arguing to just forget about 2014 and let Russia back into the G8 for nothing, while he gleefully accepted their help in our elections.
Biden just hobbled the entire Chinese chip fabrication industry, Trump had us losing a trade war to them and then made a "deal" that they upheld basically none of while he lied to conceal his secret Chinese bank account and got favors from them. Biden is forming a new anti-Chinese alliance in the pacific, Trump's biggest contribution was killing the major trade deal Obama negotiated that was aimed at countering China.
Biden just hobbled the entire Chinese chip fabrication industry, Trump had us losing a trade war to them and then made a "deal" that they upheld basically none of while he lied to conceal his secret Chinese bank account and got favors from them. Biden is forming a new anti-Chinese alliance in the pacific, Trump's biggest contribution was killing the major trade deal Obama negotiated that was aimed at countering China.
Faults and all Trump....... was no warmonger .RMF5630 said:We are in agreement here. Biden put us in this mess. No argument.Canada2017 said:AmazingGolem said:Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Golem said:Canada2017 said:Help me out here.........Golem said:Harrison Bergeron said:
Can any of the Chicken Hawks on this thread post a picture of their son or grandson's enlistment papers and willingness to die in Ukriane?
You really come across as incredibly stupid with comments like this. As has already been pointed out numerous times, no one on this thread is suggesting the US send anything but weapons to the Ukraine. We are nothing more or less than arms dealers, selling to the winning side of an unjust war.
If you'd like to retain any credibility you have, stop schtuping your dumbass straw man.
Why all of a sudden do we trust the abilities of a dementia stricken old man to walk to the very edge of WW3 without triggering it ?
Do we now have a different president than the one who went PUBLIC with the promise to blow up those natural gas pipelines ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who left BILLIONS of dollars worth of weapons to the Taliban ?
Do we have a different president / administration than the one who has screwed up almost every single aspect of the US economy in the last 18 months ? Who has unleashed the DOJ and FBI on Christians ? Who has opened the US borders to millions of illegals ?
( and BTW a single division of paratroopers .....in this case the 101st airborne ....are little more than a glorified ' trip wire '. As airborne divisions sacrifice large units of armor and heavy artillery ...for mobility . A 'trip wire' that can do little more on its own than get the US directly involved in still another ground war. )
Yet here we are....blindly trusting the dumbest...most mentally crippled president since Woodrow Wilson to fight this obvious proxy war.......without escalating it into WW3.
Blindly trusting the most inept / woke administration in US history to provide billions of dollars worth of weapons to a country we don't even have a defense treaty with . Weapons that are being used to kill thousands of Russian troops . As if those same Russians will passively tolerate such aid ....such losses...... indefinitely . As if Putin will passively allow still another US attempt at regime change .
So please educate me........why do we NOW trust these Dem morons with the most dangerous geo political situation since Kennedy navigated the Cuban Missel Crisis ?
Not every choice needs to be controversial. Some things are even hard for a democrat to mess up. Arms deals to an attacked nation are just transactions. Only a fool claims we are proposing sending troops when we aren't. Straw men are pointless.
You are too intelligent for such generalizations.
Educate me .
This president is an obvious dementia sufferer . Yet we trust such a man to fight a proxy war ?
This administration has literally screwed up everything it has touched since it took power .
Yet we now blindly allow this same bunch to determine whether or not we enter WW3 ?
How did this president ….this administration…..earn our blind trust to walk such a razor thin line ?
Why is an under equipped airborne division now within a relatively short distance from the Ukrainian border ?
Only a fool would think it is anything more than a 'trip wire' .
The US is the largest arms dealer on earth. It's not a razor thin anything.
Not razor thin to….
provide billions of dollars of free weapons to only one antagonist in a war.
blow up other countries natural gas lines in international waters
Send the 101st airborne division within air range of a war zone
Come on guy .
You know better .
This is the exact same kind of **** that got us involved in WW2, Korea, Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan.
No. It's not razor thin anything. We've shown so much weakness to this point that it's actually amazing we haven't been attacked. Showing strength and arming allies is not an act of war.
Speak softly and carry a big stick. Just relax. We aren't going to war.
Blissfully following the choices of the oldest president in American history .A man clearly suffering from dementia. And few find this unusual .
Risking still another war...this time in support of a country the US has no defense treaty with . A country the United States has recognized as within the Russian sphere of influence since at least the 1930's. Yet few question such a dramatic change in US foreign policy .
The POTUS publicly threatened to blow up natural gas lines of other countries in international waters.
They get destroyed a few months later.
Predictably, we have now placed thousands of ground troops within striking range of the war zone.
Few seem to notice.
81 million 'votes' for Joe Biden .............................put us straight into this mess.
A strong President and Putin doesn't go further than Crimea, which he got under Obama. No Afghanistan disaster, so China doesn't believe we are incompetent and threatens Taiwan more.
Say what you will about Trump, Russia and China did not move like they are now.
Funny, they say Trump loves Putin. Yet, undr Obidem both Russia and China hasve been able to expand much more.
This current administration seems determined to destroy the United States in every conceivable way.
Absolutely surreal .
And 90% of the media plays along .
Are you kidding me? He wasnt' even in office a year and gave into Putin on missile shield sales to Poland and Czech. He stood by and sent blankets to Uraine! Not to mention a plane full of cash to Iran. Went on a world tour apologizing for the US. Remember the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty, basically letting everyone else develop nuclear weapons and crippling our development he wanted? He even ignored Russia's START violations. Iraq failure to negotiate US troop presence beyond 2011, leaving a potential mess? Obama literally mocked Romney for him saying Russa was out enemy!HuMcK said:
Stop acting like Obama/Biden bent over to take it from Russia like Trump did. Obama had Russia bleeding on multiple fronts to try and hold on to a reduced amount of influence in countries that they already held as satellites (Ukraine and Syria). Ukraine is probably now out from under the Russian thumb for good (Let's go Brandon!), a big chunk of Syria was too until Trump retreated and gave it back. Trump was the one arguing to just forget about 2014 and let Russia back into the G8 for nothing, while he gleefully accepted their help in our elections.
Biden just hobbled the entire Chinese chip fabrication industry, Trump had us losing a trade war to them and then made a "deal" that they upheld basically none of while he lied to conceal his secret Chinese bank account and got favors from them. Biden is forming a new anti-Chinese alliance in the pacific, Trump's biggest contribution was killing the major trade deal Obama negotiated that was aimed at countering China.
Real tough legacy Sent a real message of better watch yourself, unless you are Islamic terrorists, Iranians, Russians or Chinese... Everyone else better watch out for Obiden.
Biden and China???? You really want to go there? "China isn't our enemy?" Remember the Big Guy's comments on China?? Do you really need me to go there?
The only legitimate genius I know is a graduate of Baylor and MIT .RMF5630 said:Are you kidding me? He wasnt' even in office a year and gave into Putin on missile shield sales to Poland and Czech. He stood by and sent blankets to Uraine! Not to mention a plane full of cash to Iran. Went on a world tour apologizing for the US. Remember the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty, basically letting everyone else develop nuclear weapons and crippling our development he wanted? He even ignored Russia's START violations. Iraq failure to negotiate US troop presence beyond 2011, leaving a potential mess? Obama literally mocked Romney for him saying Russa was out enemy!HuMcK said:
Stop acting like Obama/Biden bent over to take it from Russia like Trump did. Obama had Russia bleeding on multiple fronts to try and hold on to a reduced amount of influence in countries that they already held as satellites (Ukraine and Syria). Ukraine is probably now out from under the Russian thumb for good (Let's go Brandon!), a big chunk of Syria was too until Trump retreated and gave it back. Trump was the one arguing to just forget about 2014 and let Russia back into the G8 for nothing, while he gleefully accepted their help in our elections.
Biden just hobbled the entire Chinese chip fabrication industry, Trump had us losing a trade war to them and then made a "deal" that they upheld basically none of while he lied to conceal his secret Chinese bank account and got favors from them. Biden is forming a new anti-Chinese alliance in the pacific, Trump's biggest contribution was killing the major trade deal Obama negotiated that was aimed at countering China.
Real tough legacy Sent a real message of better watch yourself, unless you are Islamic terrorists, Iranians, Russians or Chinese... Everyone else better watch out for Obiden.
Biden and China???? You really want to go there? "China isn't our enemy?" Remember the Big Guy's comments on China?? Do you really need me to go there?
Hates Trump with a dry wit, but has spent years working in China developing all kinds of advanced technologies. .
Told me straight out that Biden would beat Trump in the 2020 election due to the hatred many women and younger voters felt for him .
But also emphasized that Trump was still 100% correct about China. How its China , not Russia who is the biggest threat to the United States .
" We are already at war with China " he said . " Its just a different kind of war involving different kinds of weapons and methods of attack ".