I have to agree with this. We aren't a serious country. The average US IQ is only 98.

DeSantis is an INTJ. Great at governing. Less good at the fake chuckle chuckle game. (Senator Kennedy of Louisiana is rare - high IQ + sociable.)

This country doesn’t want intellectuals or book readers like Blake Mastes. That’s why I can’t see anyone but Trump winning primary.

— Cernovich (@Cernovich) June 1, 2023

Mothra said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Mothra said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Mothra said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Mothra said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

"He's a war hero because he was captured. I like people that weren't captured".About McCain, coming from a draft dodger.

"You could see blood coming out of her wherever" re; Megyn Kelly

Mocking Serge Kovaleski.

The purpose of my retort to you was to simply say those you dislike (AOC, Warren, Biden) never ever make such stupid insults but they apparently appeal to a lot of people with similar beliefs.

He lost his re-election because of his big mouth.

---

"RACIST!!!!"

The other side is even worse. It's politics. Get tougher.

---

Perhaps, but they don't come across as 7th grade schoolyard bullies when they do it. You don't typically hear the Dems attacking a Republican's looks or weight. While you are correct they will play the race card, you don't typically hear them making fun of a Republican's name or heritage. You don't typically hear then attacking the looks of Republican's' spouses or questioning the patriotism of their parents. And one thing you never hear them engage in is scathing attacks on each other. They don't shoot members of their own team.

I'm other words, they're not like Trump.

---

or you.

---

I can't recall making fun of someone's weight or looks or race or heritage or spouse or parents on this board. I don't even recall ever doing that in middle school either, but if you have evidence to the contrary, please feel free to post. We know how much you love the 7th grade taunts.

---

Politics is a tough & tumble game. One should learn in the primaries not to take offense at the things others say or do, because those others might be needed as allies not very far down
the road. That is easier said than done, for sure. Better to watch & listen & analyze the why/when/how aspects of the attacks. No question Trump's attacks are sharper than any GOP candidate I've seen heretofore, although no meaner than the things Dems call Republicans all the time. One would think at some point, Trump's sharp elbows would cost him. So far….not. He is getting a bit of blowback over his comments re McEnaney, though. We will see if it signals a reversal in his support.

---

Can you point me to specific examples of Democrat politicians making fun of a Republican's weight, looks, race, heritage, spouse or parents? I am sure there might be a few outliers, but I don't recall any off the top of my head, and certainly none with the consistency with which Trump does it.
Why would they bother with those trivial things you listed when they can get by with calling us white supremacists or worse?

Trump's attacks won't cost him with his base. They would vote for him if he murdered a family of 4. But it will continue to turn off the moderates and independents he needs to win another election. And I would argue it already cost him in 2020 and 2022.
That is an assessment not entirely supported by polling. I suspect the more reasonable assessment would be that a decisive number of voters will end up deciding that Biden is even worse & has to go, no matter who we put on the ticket.

---

If you were to ask me am I surprised that Trump can get by doing what he's doing and have success in ANY electorate, I would say yes. My first synapse at literally all of his most objectionable actions is "aw, crap, again?...." but then, experience has taught me to watch & wait. Almost always, the ensuing furor has little impact on his support. As often as not it actually bumps him a bit. and then whatever concerns I might have about what he does are overcome by curiosity....what on earth could be causing this man's enduring support? Just look at his polling increases in both primary and general in the last 6 months. How could that happen? Democrats are purposefully working to string him up on an insurrection charge, and it's helping him. What part of Kansas are we no longer in?

I have some theories on all that which I'm pretty sure are clustered closer to the center of the dartboard than not. (and they tend to augur to Trump's favor). But more to the point, res ipsa loquitur. It IS working. Like it or not. So I'm going to watch & wait some more & see where things go. He may crater due to sheer voter fatigue with his schtick. More likely not. But we'll see. If he gets beat, I'm pretty confident it will be on other things. He was wrong in the first skirmish (Disney) in the "War on Wokeness" and has now pivoted 180. (HINT: you should be talking about that rather than electability or ungentlemanly behavior).

But one thing I know for sure: Whoever wins the primary is going to be our best shot at the general. I will be there no matter what. No virtue posture here. Just sharpen up the sword, get in shape, and give it another go. Democrats have to be stopped. They're going to slime every Republican on the ballot and not as Christian Nationalists (whatever that is) intent on putting POCs in chains and women in a harem. So I'll cut my nominee a little slack if he/she draws blood from innocent bystanders.

If the soldiers have to overcome the generalship, when then that's what it has to be. We just gotta win.

---

When your attacks make you look like a 7th grade bully, I would submit that turns off voters outside of the base which, in the grand scheme of things, is a small minority. And yes, we did indeed see that in the 2020 election. And we will see it again in 2024. Watch and see. So, while I agree that those petty put downs are red meat to his base, more people are turned off by them. It gives them yet another reason to never vote for Trump.

Let's be honest - Trump caught lightning in a bottle in 2020. He squeaked by and lost the popular vote to one of the worst candidates in modern history, and hasn't won anything since - losing to one of the least inspiring candidates in 2020, and losing the midterms. When push comes to shove, Americans will turn out and pull the trigger for Biden, despite how uninspiring he is, given the alternative.

If Trump is the candidate, which I fully expect he will be, watch for a repeat of 2020. Trump cannot win.

---

Every vote for Trump during the Republican primaries; is a vote for Biden during the general election.

KaiBear said:

---

Mothra said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Mothra said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Mothra said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Mothra said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

"He's a war hero because he was captured. I like people that weren't captured".About McCain, coming from a draft dodger.

"You could see blood coming out of her wherever" re; Megyn Kelly

Mocking Serge Kovaleski.

The purpose of my retort to you was to simply say those you dislike (AOC, Warren, Biden) never ever make such stupid insults but they apparently appeal to a lot of people with similar beliefs.

He lost his re-election because of his big mouth.

---

"RACIST!!!!"

The other side is even worse. It's politics. Get tougher.

---

Perhaps, but they don't come across as 7th grade schoolyard bullies when they do it. You don't typically hear the Dems attacking a Republican's looks or weight. While you are correct they will play the race card, you don't typically hear them making fun of a Republican's name or heritage. You don't typically hear then attacking the looks of Republican's' spouses or questioning the patriotism of their parents. And one thing you never hear them engage in is scathing attacks on each other. They don't shoot members of their own team.

I'm other words, they're not like Trump.

---

or you.

---

I can't recall making fun of someone's weight or looks or race or heritage or spouse or parents on this board. I don't even recall ever doing that in middle school either, but if you have evidence to the contrary, please feel free to post. We know how much you love the 7th grade taunts.

---

Politics is a tough & tumble game. One should learn in the primaries not to take offense at the things others say or do, because those others might be needed as allies not very far down
the road. That is easier said than done, for sure. Better to watch & listen & analyze the why/when/how aspects of the attacks. No question Trump's attacks are sharper than any GOP candidate I've seen heretofore, although no meaner than the things Dems call Republicans all the time. One would think at some point, Trump's sharp elbows would cost him. So far….not. He is getting a bit of blowback over his comments re McEnaney, though. We will see if it signals a reversal in his support.

---

Can you point me to specific examples of Democrat politicians making fun of a Republican's weight, looks, race, heritage, spouse or parents? I am sure there might be a few outliers, but I don't recall any off the top of my head, and certainly none with the consistency with which Trump does it.
Why would they bother with those trivial things you listed when they can get by with calling us white supremacists or worse?

Trump's attacks won't cost him with his base. They would vote for him if he murdered a family of 4. But it will continue to turn off the moderates and independents he needs to win another election. And I would argue it already cost him in 2020 and 2022.
That is an assessment not entirely supported by polling. I suspect the more reasonable assessment would be that a decisive number of voters will end up deciding that Biden is even worse & has to go, no matter who we put on the ticket.

---

If you were to ask me am I surprised that Trump can get by doing what he's doing and have success in ANY electorate, I would say yes. My first synapse at literally all of his most objectionable actions is "aw, crap, again?...." but then, experience has taught me to watch & wait. Almost always, the ensuing furor has little impact on his support. As often as not it actually bumps him a bit. and then whatever concerns I might have about what he does are overcome by curiosity....what on earth could be causing this man's enduring support? Just look at his polling increases in both primary and general in the last 6 months. How could that happen? Democrats are purposefully working to string him up on an insurrection charge, and it's helping him. What part of Kansas are we no longer in?

I have some theories on all that which I'm pretty sure are clustered closer to the center of the dartboard than not. (and they tend to augur to Trump's favor). But more to the point, res ipsa loquitur. It IS working. Like it or not. So I'm going to watch & wait some more & see where things go. He may crater due to sheer voter fatigue with his schtick. More likely not. But we'll see. If he gets beat, I'm pretty confident it will be on other things. He was wrong in the first skirmish (Disney) in the "War on Wokeness" and has now pivoted 180. (HINT: you should be talking about that rather than electability or ungentlemanly behavior).

But one thing I know for sure: Whoever wins the primary is going to be our best shot at the general. I will be there no matter what. No virtue posture here. Just sharpen up the sword, get in shape, and give it another go. Democrats have to be stopped. They're going to slime every Republican on the ballot and not as Christian Nationalists (whatever that is) intent on putting POCs in chains and women in a harem. So I'll cut my nominee a little slack if he/she draws blood from innocent bystanders.

If the soldiers have to overcome the generalship, when then that's what it has to be. We just gotta win.

---

When your attacks make you look like a 7th grade bully, I would submit that turns off voters outside of the base which, in the grand scheme of things, is a small minority. And yes, we did indeed see that in the 2020 election. And we will see it again in 2024. Watch and see. So, while I agree that those petty put downs are red meat to his base, more people are turned off by them. It gives them yet another reason to never vote for Trump.

Let's be honest - Trump caught lightning in a bottle in 2020. He squeaked by and lost the popular vote to one of the worst candidates in modern history, and hasn't won anything since - losing to one of the least inspiring candidates in 2020, and losing the midterms. When push comes to shove, Americans will turn out and pull the trigger for Biden, despite how uninspiring he is, given the alternative.

If Trump is the candidate, which I fully expect he will be, watch for a repeat of 2020. Trump cannot win.

---

Every vote for Trump during the Republican primaries; is a vote for Biden during the general election.

---

Pretty much.

This is a total home run answer, and the most succinct and powerful clip thusfar of DeSantis making his case. https://t.co/Nd3D4eUviS

— David Reaboi, Late Republic Nonsense (@davereaboi) June 1, 2023

Cobretti said:

---

This is a total home run answer, and the most succinct and powerful clip thusfar of DeSantis making his case. https://t.co/Nd3D4eUviS

— David Reaboi, Late Republic Nonsense (@davereaboi) June 1, 2023

---

If you listen to what RDS says he makes sense. His comment on being mission oriented and not being distracted is what we need in DC and that it will take 2 terms to fix the mess we are in. Make alot of sense. You can tell the military influence in his discussions of being mission oriented. You do not have to be a combat troop to learn how to be mission oriented. Most of the people I talk to that is what they get out of the military - discipline and mission oriented. I like him talking about that as part of his answers.

Cobretti said:

---

This is a total home run answer, and the most succinct and powerful clip thusfar of DeSantis making his case. https://t.co/Nd3D4eUviS

— David Reaboi, Late Republic Nonsense (@davereaboi) June 1, 2023

---

DeSantis nailed it.

RMF5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Mothra said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Mothra said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Mothra said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Mothra said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

"He's a war hero because he was captured. I like people that weren't captured".About McCain, coming from a draft dodger.

"You could see blood coming out of her wherever" re; Megyn Kelly

Mocking Serge Kovaleski.

The purpose of my retort to you was to simply say those you dislike (AOC, Warren, Biden) never ever make such stupid insults but they apparently appeal to a lot of people with similar beliefs.

He lost his re-election because of his big mouth.

---

"RACIST!!!!"

The other side is even worse. It's politics. Get tougher.

---

Perhaps, but they don't come across as 7th grade schoolyard bullies when they do it. You don't typically hear the Dems attacking a Republican's looks or weight. While you are correct they will play the race card, you don't typically hear them making fun of a Republican's name or heritage. You don't typically hear then attacking the looks of Republican's' spouses or questioning the patriotism of their parents. And one thing you never hear them engage in is scathing attacks on each other. They don't shoot members of their own team.

I'm other words, they're not like Trump.

---

or you.

---

I can't recall making fun of someone's weight or looks or race or heritage or spouse or parents on this board. I don't even recall ever doing that in middle school either, but if you have evidence to the contrary, please feel free to post. We know how much you love the 7th grade taunts.

---

Politics is a tough & tumble game. One should learn in the primaries not to take offense at the things others say or do, because those others might be needed as allies not very far down
the road. That is easier said than done, for sure. Better to watch & listen & analyze the why/when/how aspects of the attacks. No question Trump's attacks are sharper than any GOP candidate I've seen heretofore, although no meaner than the things Dems call Republicans all the time. One would think at some point, Trump's sharp elbows would cost him. So far….not. He is getting a bit of blowback over his comments re McEnaney, though. We will see if it signals a reversal in his support.

---

Can you point me to specific examples of Democrat politicians making fun of a Republican's weight, looks, race, heritage, spouse or parents? I am sure there might be a few outliers, but I don't recall any off the top of my head, and certainly none with the consistency with which Trump does it.
Why would they bother with those trivial things you listed when they can get by with calling us white supremacists or worse?

Trump's attacks won't cost him with his base. They would vote for him if he murdered a family of 4. But it will continue to turn off the moderates and independents he needs to win another election. And I would argue it already cost him in 2020 and 2022.
That is an assessment not entirely supported by polling. I suspect the more reasonable assessment would be that a decisive number of voters will end up deciding that Biden is even worse & has to go, no matter who we put on the ticket.

---

If you were to ask me am I surprised that Trump can get by doing what he's doing and have success in ANY electorate, I would say yes. My first synapse at literally all of his most objectionable actions is "aw, crap, again?...." but then, experience has taught me to watch & wait. Almost always, the ensuing furor has little impact on his support. As often as not it actually bumps him a bit. and then whatever concerns I might have about what he does are overcome by curiosity....what on earth could be causing this man's enduring support? Just look at his polling increases in both primary and general in the last 6 months. How could that happen? Democrats are purposefully working to string him up on an insurrection charge, and it's helping him. What part of Kansas are we no longer in?

I have some theories on all that which I'm pretty sure are clustered closer to the center of the dartboard than not. (and they tend to augur to Trump's favor). But more to the point, res ipsa loquitur. It IS working. Like it or not. So I'm going to watch & wait some more & see where things go. He may crater due to sheer voter fatigue with his schtick. More likely not. But we'll see. If he gets beat, I'm pretty confident it will be on other things. He was wrong in the first skirmish (Disney) in the "War on Wokeness" and has now pivoted 180. (HINT: you should be talking about that rather than electability or ungentlemanly behavior).

But one thing I know for sure: Whoever wins the primary is going to be our best shot at the general. I will be there no matter what. No virtue posture here. Just sharpen up the sword, get in shape, and give it another go. Democrats have to be stopped. They're going to slime every Republican on the ballot and not as Christian Nationalists (whatever that is) intent on putting POCs in chains and women in a harem. So I'll cut my nominee a little slack if he/she draws blood from innocent bystanders.

If the soldiers have to overcome the generalship, when then that's what it has to be. We just gotta win.

---

When your attacks make you look like a 7th grade bully, I would submit that turns off voters outside of the base which, in the grand scheme of things, is a small minority. And yes, we did indeed see that in the 2020 election. And we will see it again in 2024. Watch and see. So, while I agree that those petty put downs are red meat to his base, more people are turned off by them. It gives them yet another reason to never vote for Trump.

Let's be honest - Trump caught lightning in a bottle in 2020. He squeaked by and lost the popular vote to one of the worst candidates in modern history, and hasn't won anything since - losing to one of the least inspiring candidates in 2020, and losing the midterms. When push comes to shove, Americans will turn out and pull the trigger for Biden, despite how uninspiring he is, given the alternative.

If Trump is the candidate, which I fully expect he will be, watch for a repeat of 2020. Trump cannot win.

---

Problem is, if we apply that same analysis to Biden, we end up at the same conclusion - Biden cannot win. And the trends of the last 6 months are all against Biden (and Desantis) and for Trump. That could change, for sure.

It's early. We'll have a better idea what is possible or not 8 months from now. In the meantime, we have an old bull who is capable being challenged by a younger bull who might be better. But we won't know until they start butting heads.

---

I am starting to think we need someone to be drafted into the race. Been hearing rumblings of Jaimie Dimon of Chase. They don't know if he would run as a Democrat or Republican, I can go for that! We need an adult that is not a professional politician. The guy has more money than God, so he wouldn't be padding the pockets. Wonder how he would do. It would be fun to see him in a debate with Trump.

---

That won't happen on our side. Might on Dem side, though.

MUST WATCH: Crowd goes wild as @RonDeSantis ROASTS an enraged leftist who disrupted his speech.

“We're not gonna let you impose an agenda on our kids. We're gonna stand up for our kids! .... Those people like that in Florida are the people we beat EVERY SINGLE DAY” pic.twitter.com/pZHXkARZxK

— DeSantis War Room 🐊 (@DeSantisWarRoom) June 2, 2023

Trump talked tough to Putin:

"He knew that there was going to be problem. I said things that were very bad, very nasty. He said, 'You don't mean that!' It had to do with Moscow." pic.twitter.com/ampeLny1Pc

— Citizen Free Press (@CitizenFreePres) June 2, 2023

Cobretti said:

---

MUST WATCH: Crowd goes wild as @RonDeSantis ROASTS an enraged leftist who disrupted his speech.

“We're not gonna let you impose an agenda on our kids. We're gonna stand up for our kids! .... Those people like that in Florida are the people we beat EVERY SINGLE DAY” pic.twitter.com/pZHXkARZxK

— DeSantis War Room 🐊 (@DeSantisWarRoom) June 2, 2023

---

RDS will do 90% of what he says. He may not be the smoothest politician. But I would rather have that than a Trump that does 10% of what he says but puts on a good show. This is not reality TV.

Fat Hitler expected to announce his candidacy next week

The Republican Presidential Candidates (declared so far):
Orange Hitler
Florida Hitler
Black Hitler
The other Black Hitler
Indian Hitler
Indian Woman Hitler
Redneck Hitler

— Andrew @ Don’t Walk, RUN! (@DontWalkRUN) May 28, 2023

Did idiot Trump really say this?

ATL Bear said:

---

Did idiot Trump really say this?

---

Yeah, that's who we want to team up with...

He is criticizing NATO, but N Korea is who he is congratulating? This has to be a hack.

Jack Bauer said:

---

Fat Hitler expected to announce his candidacy next week

The Republican Presidential Candidates (declared so far):
Orange Hitler
Florida Hitler
Black Hitler
The other Black Hitler
Indian Hitler
Indian Woman Hitler
Redneck Hitler

— Andrew @ Don’t Walk, RUN! (@DontWalkRUN) May 28, 2023

---

That guy has apparently never heard of Godwin's Law.

whiterock said:

---

Jack Bauer said:

---

Fat Hitler expected to announce his candidacy next week

The Republican Presidential Candidates (declared so far):
Orange Hitler
Florida Hitler
Black Hitler
The other Black Hitler
Indian Hitler
Indian Woman Hitler
Redneck Hitler

— Andrew @ Don’t Walk, RUN! (@DontWalkRUN) May 28, 2023

---

That guy has apparently never heard of Godwin's Law.

---

It's a satire account (I know its hard to tell anymore)

A message for rational Republicans. A plea.

From Peggy Noonan

Chris Christie and the Republican Party's Peril:

In some ways he's a match for Trump, whose third nomination would mark the end of the GOP.

If the party chooses Trump in 2024 it will mean it has changed its essential nature and meaning, and that it is split in a way that can't be resolved by time. Republicans of the suburbs, of the more educated and affluent places, won't agree to be the official Trump Forever Party. They just won't. They will leave. Some will go third-party and try to build something there. Some will blend into the Democratic Party and hope they can improve things there.

But there will be no Republican Party after a Trump '24 race, which, again, means the vehicle of conservative thought and policy will be gone.

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

A message for rational Republicans. A plea.

From Peggy Noonan

Chris Christie and the Republican Party's Peril:

In some ways he's a match for Trump, whose third nomination would mark the end of the GOP.

If the party chooses Trump in 2024 it will mean it has changed its essential nature and meaning, and that it is split in a way that can't be resolved by time. Republicans of the suburbs, of the more educated and affluent places, won't agree to be the official Trump Forever Party. They just won't. They will leave. Some will go third-party and try to build something there. Some will blend into the Democratic Party and hope they can improve things there.

But there will be no Republican Party after a Trump '24 race, which, again, means the vehicle of conservative thought and policy will be gone.

---

Bull.

Whatever happens, there will be a Republican party after 2024.

And frankly, for all his warts we need Trump far more than we need Peggy Noonan.

Oldbear83 said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

A message for rational Republicans. A plea.

From Peggy Noonan

Chris Christie and the Republican Party's Peril:

In some ways he's a match for Trump, whose third nomination would mark the end of the GOP.

If the party chooses Trump in 2024 it will mean it has changed its essential nature and meaning, and that it is split in a way that can't be resolved by time. Republicans of the suburbs, of the more educated and affluent places, won't agree to be the official Trump Forever Party. They just won't. They will leave. Some will go third-party and try to build something there. Some will blend into the Democratic Party and hope they can improve things there.

But there will be no Republican Party after a Trump '24 race, which, again, means the vehicle of conservative thought and policy will be gone.

---

Bull.

Whatever happens, there will be a Republican party after 2024.

And frankly, for all his warts we need Trump far more than we need Peggy Noonan.

---

We need Trump like we need a hole in the head.

Mothra said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

A message for rational Republicans. A plea.

From Peggy Noonan

Chris Christie and the Republican Party's Peril:

In some ways he's a match for Trump, whose third nomination would mark the end of the GOP.

If the party chooses Trump in 2024 it will mean it has changed its essential nature and meaning, and that it is split in a way that can't be resolved by time. Republicans of the suburbs, of the more educated and affluent places, won't agree to be the official Trump Forever Party. They just won't. They will leave. Some will go third-party and try to build something there. Some will blend into the Democratic Party and hope they can improve things there.

But there will be no Republican Party after a Trump '24 race, which, again, means the vehicle of conservative thought and policy will be gone.

---

Bull.

Whatever happens, there will be a Republican party after 2024.

And frankly, for all his warts we need Trump far more than we need Peggy Noonan.

---

We need Trump like we need a hole in the head.

---

1. He's still far more important and necessary to the GOP than Peggy "HateTrump" ever will be.

2. You do know that the mouth, ears, and nostrils are 'holes in the head' but very important for all of that.

3. Trump is only ahead of Pence in Republican candidates I would support in the primaries, but allowing Democrats another term just to spite Trump would be downright criminal.

Are you saying you'd support Trump over Pence?

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

Are you saying you'd support Trump over Pence?

---

Any sane person would.

Pence is a fine person, and well-qualified to be a Bible Study teacher or a school teacher.

He is not qualified to be President of the United States.

Trump, for all his flaws, basically did a good job when he was in the Oval Office.

Now that's not to say I want him back. I'd rather see DeSantis or Scott, for example.


But if it's Trump or Biden, no question a rational voter should choose Trump.

I just wanted to clarify since you said it would be "criminal". The definition of a criminal. It's Trump.

Oldbear83 said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

Are you saying you'd support Trump over Pence?

---

Any sane person would.

Pence is a fine person, and well-qualified to be a Bible Study teacher or a school teacher.

He is not qualified to be President of the United States.

Trump, for all his flaws, basically did a good job when he was in the Oval Office.

Now that's not to say I want him back. I'd rather see DeSantis or Scott, for example.


But if it's Trump or Biden, no question a rational voter should choose Trump.

---

Dangit Oldbear. You and I must be brothers from another mother. Agree 100 percent with your post. My preferences for Prez are:

1. DeSantis (For his overall leadership and success in Florida and policies)
2. Tim Scott (For his positive message)
3. Donald Trump (He is an ass but has good policies. And Presidential experience)

Pence is a good and moral man, but just not Presidential.

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

I just wanted to clarify since you said it would be "criminal". The definition of a criminal. It's Trump.

---

No, when we talk 'criminal', that's going to be 'Biden' or 'Clinton' looooooooooong before it gets to Trump.

Spoken like a true Gen Z'er.

paramore have brought congressman Maxwell Frost of FL onstage for miz biz, calling out Desantis once again - “fuck Ron Desantis” 🗣️ pic.twitter.com/4SFngxzXCG

— jen (@YELYAHG00N) June 3, 2023

RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

Are you saying you'd support Trump over Pence?

---

Any sane person would.

Pence is a fine person, and well-qualified to be a Bible Study teacher or a school teacher.

He is not qualified to be President of the United States.

Trump, for all his flaws, basically did a good job when he was in the Oval Office.

Now that's not to say I want him back. I'd rather see DeSantis or Scott, for example.


But if it's Trump or Biden, no question a rational voter should choose Trump.

---

Dangit Oldbear. You and I must be brothers from another mother. Agree 100 percent with your post. My preferences for Prez are:

1. DeSantis (For his overall leadership and success in Florida and policies)
2. Tim Scott (For his positive message)
3. Donald Trump (He is an ass but has good policies. And Presidential experience)

Pence is a good and moral man, but just not Presidential.

---

Yup, it just makes sense.

I have a feeling that Trump has seen his apogee of support. If DeSantis, Scott and the other serious candidates just focus on policy and the issues, they will catch up and pass The Donald by this winter, and all the media noise won't keep Donald in first place.

Oldbear83 said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

Are you saying you'd support Trump over Pence?

---

Trump, for all his flaws, basically did a good job when he was in the Oval Office.

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I have always maintained Trump is far superior to whomever the Dems throw out. But let's not pretend Trump's presidency wasn't a VERY mixed bag, especially his last two years in office. There was some good. Some bad. And some REALLY bad.

He spent like a drunken sailor, failed miserably on his border wall, and his COVID policy and vaccine rollout? Oy vey.

Mothra said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Aliceinbubbleland said:

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Are you saying you'd support Trump over Pence?

---

Trump, for all his flaws, basically did a good job when he was in the Oval Office.

---

I have always maintained Trump is far superior to whomever the Dems throw out. But let's not pretend Trump's presidency wasn't a VERY mixed bag, especially his last two years in office. There was some good. Some bad. And some REALLY bad.

He spent like a drunken sailor, failed miserably on his border wall, and his COVID policy and vaccine rollout? Oy vey.

---

There were two Presidencies. First 2 years and Second. Trump in first two years was serious about governing. No issues at all with him.

Second two years, were a disaster. He turned into a vindictive clown. I agree, not all his fault. But it was a very divisive and ineffective time. Sadly, that is who is running in 24 on steroids! Not the guy that came down the escalator. Trumps personality will not let him move on. He is about revenge and sadly being authoritative.

Mothra said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Aliceinbubbleland said:

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Are you saying you'd support Trump over Pence?

---

Trump, for all his flaws, basically did a good job when he was in the Oval Office.

---

I have always maintained Trump is far superior to whomever the Dems throw out. But let's not pretend Trump's presidency wasn't a VERY mixed bag, especially his last two years in office. There was some good. Some bad. And some REALLY bad.

He spent like a drunken sailor, failed miserably on his border wall, and his COVID policy and vaccine rollout? Oy vey.

---

You might want to go back and check what he actually did. Spending starts with Congress, for example, and the 'last two years' the Democrats controlled Congress and used every tool available to harass him .

I don't like his style of argument sometimes, and yes he made mistakes (but fewer than either Bush and let's not even pretend his mistakes add up to any of the damage done by Clinton or Obama), and yes I don't want him to be the GOP nominee.

But trashing Trump's foreign policy, his trade negotiations, or his common sense attitude in rolling back Obama's policies, that goes after things we should be supporting and should be protecting against the Left.

God help us if we get Jeb Bush or Marco Rubio or someone like Mitch McConnell to lead our nation.

Oldbear83 said:

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Mothra said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

Are you saying you'd support Trump over Pence?

---

Trump, for all his flaws, basically did a good job when he was in the Oval Office.

---

I have always maintained Trump is far superior to whomever the Dems throw out. But let's not pretend Trump's presidency wasn't a VERY mixed bag, especially his last two years in office. There was some good. Some bad. And some REALLY bad.

He spent like a drunken sailor, failed miserably on his border wall, and his COVID policy and vaccine rollout? Oy vey.

---

You might want to go back and check what he actually did. Spending starts with Congress, for example, and the 'last two years' the Democrats controlled Congress and used every tool available to harass him .

I don't like his style of argument sometimes, and yes he made mistakes (but fewer than either Bush and let's not even pretend his mistakes add up to any of the damage done by Clinton or Obama), and yes I don't want him to be the GOP nominee.

But trashing Trump's foreign policy, his trade negotiations, or his common sense attitude in rolling back Obama's policies, that goes after things we should be supporting and should be protecting against the Left.

God help us if we get Jeb Bush or Marco Rubio or someone like Mitch McConnell to lead our nation.

---

Trump was good in first two years. He was effective and just as you say common sense. I thought he made mistakes not getting people that were in his camp for his cabinet. Kelly, Mattis, Tillerson, Bolton etc, all good people, but they didn't believe in what Trump believed. I thought that Mnuchkin, Pompeo, Haley, Carson and a few others were on board. The others were like Ryan, there to make sure he didn't do what he said. Trump went along too much, was too trusting and believed that everyone wanted to solve problems.

Then, his personality flaws came out and he went full "Donald", which you can't have in a Chief Executive. Unfortunately, he has stayed "Full Donald".

Trump is a problem, no two ways about it.

Oldbear83 said:

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Mothra said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

Are you saying you'd support Trump over Pence?

---

Trump, for all his flaws, basically did a good job when he was in the Oval Office.

---

I have always maintained Trump is far superior to whomever the Dems throw out. But let's not pretend Trump's presidency wasn't a VERY mixed bag, especially his last two years in office. There was some good. Some bad. And some REALLY bad.

He spent like a drunken sailor, failed miserably on his border wall, and his COVID policy and vaccine rollout? Oy vey.

---

You might want to go back and check what he actually did. Spending starts with Congress, for example, and the 'last two years' the Democrats controlled Congress and used every tool available to harass him .

I don't like his style of argument sometimes, and yes he made mistakes (but fewer than either Bush and let's not even pretend his mistakes add up to any of the damage done by Clinton or Obama), and yes I don't want him to be the GOP nominee.

But trashing Trump's foreign policy, his trade negotiations, or his common sense attitude in rolling back Obama's policies, that goes after things we should be supporting and should be protecting against the Left.

God help us if we get Jeb Bush or Marco Rubio or someone like Mitch McConnell to lead our nation.

---

I don't disagree with you about his foreign policy, his trade negotiations (somewhat), or his rolling back Obama's policies, save and except of course Obamacare. As I said, I liked his first two years in office.

However, spending isn't all on Congress. He's the President with veto power. His own spending policies were akin to a liberal Democrat. So, you simply cannot give him a pass because Congress was Democrat.

Mothra said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Mothra said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

Are you saying you'd support Trump over Pence?

---

Trump, for all his flaws, basically did a good job when he was in the Oval Office.

---

I have always maintained Trump is far superior to whomever the Dems throw out. But let's not pretend Trump's presidency wasn't a VERY mixed bag, especially his last two years in office. There was some good. Some bad. And some REALLY bad.

He spent like a drunken sailor, failed miserably on his border wall, and his COVID policy and vaccine rollout? Oy vey.

---

You might want to go back and check what he actually did. Spending starts with Congress, for example, and the 'last two years' the Democrats controlled Congress and used every tool available to harass him .

I don't like his style of argument sometimes, and yes he made mistakes (but fewer than either Bush and let's not even pretend his mistakes add up to any of the damage done by Clinton or Obama), and yes I don't want him to be the GOP nominee.

But trashing Trump's foreign policy, his trade negotiations, or his common sense attitude in rolling back Obama's policies, that goes after things we should be supporting and should be protecting against the Left.

God help us if we get Jeb Bush or Marco Rubio or someone like Mitch McConnell to lead our nation.

---

I don't disagree with you about his foreign policy, his trade negotiations (somewhat), or his rolling back Obama's policies, save and except of course Obamacare. As I said, I liked his first two years in office.

However, spending isn't all on Congress. He's the President with veto power. His own spending policies were akin to a liberal Democrat. So, you simply cannot give him a pass because Congress was Democrat.

---

but you could give him a partial pass if there was a world wide pandemic which accounts for the mass of his late office spending. Pretty much Everybody got COVID wrong..

4th and Inches said:

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Mothra said:

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Oldbear83 said:

---

Mothra said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

Are you saying you'd support Trump over Pence?

---

Trump, for all his flaws, basically did a good job when he was in the Oval Office.

---

I have always maintained Trump is far superior to whomever the Dems throw out. But let's not pretend Trump's presidency wasn't a VERY mixed bag, especially his last two years in office. There was some good. Some bad. And some REALLY bad.

He spent like a drunken sailor, failed miserably on his border wall, and his COVID policy and vaccine rollout? Oy vey.

---

You might want to go back and check what he actually did. Spending starts with Congress, for example, and the 'last two years' the Democrats controlled Congress and used every tool available to harass him .

I don't like his style of argument sometimes, and yes he made mistakes (but fewer than either Bush and let's not even pretend his mistakes add up to any of the damage done by Clinton or Obama), and yes I don't want him to be the GOP nominee.

But trashing Trump's foreign policy, his trade negotiations, or his common sense attitude in rolling back Obama's policies, that goes after things we should be supporting and should be protecting against the Left.

God help us if we get Jeb Bush or Marco Rubio or someone like Mitch McConnell to lead our nation.

---

I don't disagree with you about his foreign policy, his trade negotiations (somewhat), or his rolling back Obama's policies, save and except of course Obamacare. As I said, I liked his first two years in office.

However, spending isn't all on Congress. He's the President with veto power. His own spending policies were akin to a liberal Democrat. So, you simply cannot give him a pass because Congress was Democrat.

---

but you could give him a partial pass if there was a world wide pandemic which accounts for the mass of his late office spending. Pretty much Everybody got COVID wrong..

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RDS didn't...

RMF5630 said:

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4th and Inches said:

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Mothra said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

Mothra said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

Aliceinbubbleland said:

---

Are you saying you'd support Trump over Pence?

---

Trump, for all his flaws, basically did a good job when he was in the Oval Office.

---

I have always maintained Trump is far superior to whomever the Dems throw out. But let's not pretend Trump's presidency wasn't a VERY mixed bag, especially his last two years in office. There was some good. Some bad. And some REALLY bad.

He spent like a drunken sailor, failed miserably on his border wall, and his COVID policy and vaccine rollout? Oy vey.

---

You might want to go back and check what he actually did. Spending starts with Congress, for example, and the 'last two years' the Democrats controlled Congress and used every tool available to harass him .

I don't like his style of argument sometimes, and yes he made mistakes (but fewer than either Bush and let's not even pretend his mistakes add up to any of the damage done by Clinton or Obama), and yes I don't want him to be the GOP nominee.

But trashing Trump's foreign policy, his trade negotiations, or his common sense attitude in rolling back Obama's policies, that goes after things we should be supporting and should be protecting against the Left.

God help us if we get Jeb Bush or Marco Rubio or someone like Mitch McConnell to lead our nation.

---

I don't disagree with you about his foreign policy, his trade negotiations (somewhat), or his rolling back Obama's policies, save and except of course Obamacare. As I said, I liked his first two years in office.

However, spending isn't all on Congress. He's the President with veto power. His own spending policies were akin to a liberal Democrat. So, you simply cannot give him a pass because Congress was Democrat.

---

but you could give him a partial pass if there was a world wide pandemic which accounts for the mass of his late office spending. Pretty much Everybody got COVID wrong..

---

RDS didn't...

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He got less wrong than most, but even DeSantis made mistakes. It was months before anyone realized Fauci and his lackeys were lying to us about so much of the COVID problem.