Malbec said:

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4th and Inches said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

Mr. President, I know what my I saw at the debate. We cannot afford that kind of freezing up with business people, labor, Congress, and diplomacy. I know with my eyes saw

---

glad you can see the truth..

---

I don't know what he said with that last sentence, and I don't think he does either.

---

Similar issue.

Forest Bueller_bf said:

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ScottS said:

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If there is a replacement, will it be one of these......Hillary Clinton, Jill Biden, Michael Obama, Hunter Biden, Gov Newsom, Gov Witmer, Schumer, Bernie Sanders?

---

Jill Biden and Michelle Obama have literally no qualifications to run for president. Yea they are over 35 so they CAN run, but they have done nothing to qualify them for the job besides exist.

---

I beg your pardon, Sir!!! Michelle Obama,was without a doubt the greatest Cafeteria Czar in the history of our country! That is good enough for most Libs.

RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

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Forest Bueller_bf said:

---

ScottS said:

---

If there is a replacement, will it be one of these......Hillary Clinton, Jill Biden, Michael Obama, Hunter Biden, Gov Newsom, Gov Witmer, Schumer, Bernie Sanders?

---

Jill Biden and Michelle Obama have literally no qualifications to run for president. Yea they are over 35 so they CAN run, but they have done nothing to qualify them for the job besides exist.

---

I beg your pardon, Sir!!! Michelle Obama,was without a doubt the greatest Cafeteria Czar in the history of our country!

---

yes! Her my plate design gives kids a lifetime of health issues to deal with..

Oldbear83 said:

---

Here is the situation. The Democrats have four options:

(1) Keep Biden as the nominee.
(2) Dump Biden for Harris as the nominee.
(3) Dump both Biden and Harris and run one of the known 'big' names
(4) Dump Biden and Harris and run a young relatively unknown candidate in hopes of reincarnating Bill Clinton

The problem with (1) is what we have seen over the past month. The Democrats could only win if they find a way to win over Independents from supporting Trump.

The problem with (2), is that Jill and Joe Biden will fight like hell to keep Joe as the nominee, plus the fact that Harris can't beat Trump in the polls, plus the fact that as much as Joe comes across as a doddering old man who can't tell what day it is, Harris often comes off as bat-crap crazy and cannot even blame that on age.

The problem with (3), is first, the FEC will only allow Joe's $240 million war chest to be spent by Biden or Harris, the only two names listed with the FEC at the time of donations, so the new nominee will have start with $0, both Biden and Harris will try to undercut the nominee for at least part of the remaining campaign, and the polling so far does not show that brand name Democrats fare better against Trump than does Biden.

The problem with (4) is the same as (3), except that the new nominee will have no polling track record, and while the nominee might be the next Bill Clinton, he/she is statistically more likely to be the next Paul Tsongas.

Put it all together, and the Democrats will roll the dice and hope their attack machine finally costs Trump support and lets Biden - once again - pull out a win with no credible skills or visible effort.

---

pretty much that, with proliferating legal hurdles for ballot changes as you work down that list, unless, Biden is removed as POTUS for health reasons, (which theoretically side-steps a lot of the legal issues). Most state laws will have a clear pathway for late ballot changes in case of "death" or "incapacitation" but few will allow a ballot change just because "oops, we picked a guy who can't win."

So there may be no big moment....just a transition into a campaign where they make Joe the notional figurehead and let Kamala loose to go out and do the hard campaigning. She's going to be his replacement, very shortly, anyway (should they succeed), so it would be less disingenuous that what they're doing with Joe now.


So it really is up to Joe. He can agree to step aside per 25th Amendment, or they're stuck with him.

whiterock said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

Here is the situation. The Democrats have four options:

(1) Keep Biden as the nominee.
(2) Dump Biden for Harris as the nominee.
(3) Dump both Biden and Harris and run one of the known 'big' names
(4) Dump Biden and Harris and run a young relatively unknown candidate in hopes of reincarnating Bill Clinton

The problem with (1) is what we have seen over the past month. The Democrats could only win if they find a way to win over Independents from supporting Trump.

The problem with (2), is that Jill and Joe Biden will fight like hell to keep Joe as the nominee, plus the fact that Harris can't beat Trump in the polls, plus the fact that as much as Joe comes across as a doddering old man who can't tell what day it is, Harris often comes off as bat-crap crazy and cannot even blame that on age.

The problem with (3), is first, the FEC will only allow Joe's $240 million war chest to be spent by Biden or Harris, the only two names listed with the FEC at the time of donations, so the new nominee will have start with $0, both Biden and Harris will try to undercut the nominee for at least part of the remaining campaign, and the polling so far does not show that brand name Democrats fare better against Trump than does Biden.

The problem with (4) is the same as (3), except that the new nominee will have no polling track record, and while the nominee might be the next Bill Clinton, he/she is statistically more likely to be the next Paul Tsongas.

Put it all together, and the Democrats will roll the dice and hope their attack machine finally costs Trump support and lets Biden - once again - pull out a win with no credible skills or visible effort.

---

pretty much that, with proliferating legal hurdles for ballot changes as you work down that list, unless, Biden is removed as POTUS for health reasons, (which theoretically side-steps a lot of the legal issues). Most state laws will have a clear pathway for late ballot changes in case of "death" or "incapacitation" but few will allow a ballot change just because "oops, we picked a guy who can't win."

So there may be no big moment....just a transition into a campaign where they make Joe the notional figurehead and let Kamala loose to go out and do the hard campaigning. She's going to be his replacement, very shortly, anyway (should they succeed), so it would be less disingenuous that what they're doing with Joe now.


So it really is up to Joe. He can agree to step aside per 25th Amendment, or they're stuck with him.

---

I admit I'm on thin ice but ...
Biden isn't the Democrat Party nominee yet, at least not legally. The Democrat Party will nominate their candidate at their convention and that is the candidate who goes on the ballot. If Biden releases his delegates they are free to choose whomever they wish.

In the meantime, Biden isn't withdrawing from the race for health reasons (I know, that's a fiction). Therefore from a legal POV the 25th Amendment is not applicable. The 25th A may be implicated later, but withdrawing from the race in August doesn't mean he can't serve out his term.

Regarding the money given to the Biden campaign, I have no idea who can direct it where or when they can direct it. If Harris is their nominee, I assume her campaign would be the beneficiary. If it is someone else, I suspect they would be the beneficiary (but I really don't know).

This article is from NYTimes. Harris campaign would have $91 million of the $240 million raised by the Biden Harris campaign.

If Biden Drops Out, What Happens to His Money?
If Kamala Harris took his place, she could easily tap into their campaign's cash. Someone like Gretchen Whitmer or Gavin Newsom? It would get trickier.
President Biden and Vice President Kamala Harris have spent years raising money for their re-election campaign, and if he were to step aside which he says he will not do her potential bid would have little financial interruption.
President Biden forcefully says he isn't withdrawing from the presidential race. But if he does, there's a reason or two that many leaders of his party think the next nominee would be Vice President Kamala Harris.
There's the built-in Democratic base. There's the easier logistics. There's the history to be made.
And yes, there's the money.
If Democrats carried out a stunning switch at the top of their ticket, what happens next would have no modern precedent including in the campaign finance realm. But we do know a few things:
Kamala Harris would have a $91 million (or so) edge.
Over the last two years, Mr. Biden and Ms. Harris have together raised hundreds of millions of dollars for their re-election bid. That money has been split across the Biden campaign, the Democratic National Committee, almost every state Democratic Party, and various joint-fund-raising committees that cycle cash among all of those entities.
As of June 30, all of those groups had about $240 million in cash on hand. Most of that money say, the stockpile at the Democratic National Committee wouldn't be affected by a change of nominee.

But the most important money is in the accounts held by the Biden-Harris campaign committee: $91 million as of May 30. (The campaign hasn't disclosed how much it had as of June 30.) That money has been raised by the Biden-Harris ticket, and belongs to the Biden-Harris ticket. The only people whom that money follows are, you guessed it, Mr. Biden and Ms. Harris.

So if Mr. Biden were to cede his role and Ms. Harris were to be officially nominated (with a new No. 2), her new ticket would have almost no interruption financially. She would have immediate access to the $91 million or so in cash on hand, an important consideration given how former President Donald J. Trump and Republicans have rapidly caught up to the Democrats in fund-raising.
Whitmer, Newsom or someone else would be more complicated.
What if the new nominee were not Ms. Harris, but someone like Gov. Gretchen Whitmer of Michigan or Gov. Gavin Newsom of California?
In that case, almost all of the $91 million in the campaign account would have to be refunded to donors, a pretty remote outcome. (One caveat: The money that is designated for the primary election, as opposed to the general election, could be used by anybody up until the Democratic National Convention next month.)
But there is a catch, one that has been informed by recent precedent. If someone other than Ms. Harris were to lead the ticket, the Biden-Harris campaign could certainly transfer that $91 million to a federal super PAC, which could spend it on advertising for the new Democratic ticket.

That would be suboptimal, because money at an outside group can't be controlled directly by the campaign, and super PACs have to pay higher rates for advertising time. But the money would not go to total waste.

There is, however, an alternative way for a new, non-Harris presidential candidate to benefit from the money in the campaign account, one that savvy Democrats would almost certainly explore.

When Michael R. Bloomberg withdrew from the 2020 Democratic presidential primary race, his campaign account had $18 million or so left over. He was eventually able to transfer all of that money directly to the Democratic National Committee.
That $18 million well exceeded the contribution limits for individual donors, and Mr. Bloomberg's transfer was controversial because his presidential campaign was almost entirely self-funded.

While federal campaigns can send leftover money to whatever group they want in unlimited amounts, critics argued that Mr. Bloomberg's transfer had essentially allowed someone to avoid contribution limits by (briefly) running for president. Campaign-finance watchdogs cried foul, but the Federal Election Commission last year effectively blessed the move.

That precedent could be instructive here. Perhaps the Democrats would try to transfer that $91 million directly to the D.N.C. making for a cash-flush party committee that could make up for the fact that an entirely new candidate's campaign would start at pretty close to $0.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/09/us/politics/biden-harris-money.html

Malbec said:

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4th and Inches said:

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Waco1947 said:

---

Mr. President, I know what my I saw at the debate. We cannot afford that kind of freezing up with business people, labor, Congress, and diplomacy. I know with my eyes saw

---

glad you can see the truth..

---

I don't know what he said with that last sentence, and I don't think he does either.

---

So you make sense out Trump gibberish but can read a simple mistake in typing?

Hollywood turns on Joe

George Clooney: I Love Joe Biden. But We Need a New Nominee.
I love Joe Biden. As a senator. As a vice president and as president. I consider him a friend, and I believe in him. Believe in his character. Believe in his morals. In the last four years, he's won many of the battles he's faced.
But the one battle he cannot win is the fight against time. None of us can. It's devastating to say it, but the Joe Biden I was with three weeks ago at the fund-raiser was not the Joe "big F-ing deal" Biden of 2010. He wasn't even the Joe Biden of 2020. He was the same man we all witnessed at the debate.
Was he tired? Yes. A cold? Maybe. But our party leaders need to stop telling us that 51 million people didn't see what we just saw. We're all so terrified by the prospect of a second Trump term that we've opted to ignore every warning sign. The George Stephanopoulos interview only reinforced what we saw the week before. As Democrats, we collectively hold our breath or turn down the volume whenever we see the president, whom we respect, walk off Air Force One or walk back to a mic to answer an unscripted question.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/10/opinion/joe-biden-democratic-nominee.html

https://babylonbee.com/news/in-new-oceans-14-george-clooney-pulls-off-30-million-heist-by-tricking-people-into-giving-money-to-politician-before-revealing-hes-demented

Rob Reiner turns

"My friend George Clooney has clearly expressed what many of us have been saying," Reiner wrote. "We love and respect Joe Biden. We acknowledge all he has done for our country. But Democracy is facing an existential threat. We need someone younger to fight back. Joe Biden must step aside."

Having Exhausted All Other Options, Obama Invites Biden Paddle Boarding https://t.co/hHYZsu3GSd pic.twitter.com/Cwc7SBxo0i

— The Babylon Bee (@TheBabylonBee) July 9, 2024

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

Hollywood turns on Joe

George Clooney: I Love Joe Biden. But We Need a New Nominee.
I love Joe Biden. As a senator. As a vice president and as president. I consider him a friend, and I believe in him. Believe in his character. Believe in his morals. In the last four years, he's won many of the battles he's faced.
But the one battle he cannot win is the fight against time. None of us can. It's devastating to say it, but the Joe Biden I was with three weeks ago at the fund-raiser was not the Joe "big F-ing deal" Biden of 2010. He wasn't even the Joe Biden of 2020. He was the same man we all witnessed at the debate.
Was he tired? Yes. A cold? Maybe. But our party leaders need to stop telling us that 51 million people didn't see what we just saw. We're all so terrified by the prospect of a second Trump term that we've opted to ignore every warning sign. The George Stephanopoulos interview only reinforced what we saw the week before. As Democrats, we collectively hold our breath or turn down the volume whenever we see the president, whom we respect, walk off Air Force One or walk back to a mic to answer an unscripted question.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/10/opinion/joe-biden-democratic-nominee.html

---

"51 million people didn't see what we just saw."

Dems can admit they've been lied to but it means nothing to them because orange man bad.

They talk about Joe's morals but their good with being lied to. Joe's running this circus and the clowns just keep spilling out of the car.

---

Its wild that they can't figure out why they're being lied to.

Never in a million years would they consider they're the baddies.

Doc Holliday said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

Hollywood turns on Joe

George Clooney: I Love Joe Biden. But We Need a New Nominee.
I love Joe Biden. As a senator. As a vice president and as president. I consider him a friend, and I believe in him. Believe in his character. Believe in his morals. In the last four years, he's won many of the battles he's faced.
But the one battle he cannot win is the fight against time. None of us can. It's devastating to say it, but the Joe Biden I was with three weeks ago at the fund-raiser was not the Joe "big F-ing deal" Biden of 2010. He wasn't even the Joe Biden of 2020. He was the same man we all witnessed at the debate.
Was he tired? Yes. A cold? Maybe. But our party leaders need to stop telling us that 51 million people didn't see what we just saw. We're all so terrified by the prospect of a second Trump term that we've opted to ignore every warning sign. The George Stephanopoulos interview only reinforced what we saw the week before. As Democrats, we collectively hold our breath or turn down the volume whenever we see the president, whom we respect, walk off Air Force One or walk back to a mic to answer an unscripted question.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/10/opinion/joe-biden-democratic-nominee.html

---

"51 million people didn't see what we just saw."

Dems can admit they've been lied to but it means nothing to them because orange man bad.

They talk about Joe's morals but their good with being lied to. Joe's running this circus and the clowns just keep spilling out of the car.

---

Its wild that they can't figure out why they're being lied to.

Never in a million years would they consider they're the baddies.

---

Other Hollywood players who have lost faith in Biden include CBS "Late Show" host Stephen Colbert, Netflix co-founder Reed Hastings, filmmaker Michael Moore, actor John Cusack and author Stephen King.

I am awaiting the acknowledgment from trump supporters are gods with insurrectionist. We Al saw J6. Why are y'all not on board with his removal?

Would they bring on Hillary to give him the Vince Foster?

Waco1947 said:

---

Malbec said:

---

4th and Inches said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

Mr. President, I know what my I saw at the debate. We cannot afford that kind of freezing up with business people, labor, Congress, and diplomacy. I know with my eyes saw

---

glad you can see the truth..

---

I don't know what he said with that last sentence, and I don't think he does either.

---

So you make sense out Trump gibberish but can read a simple mistake in typing?

---

Sorry Waco, but absolutely no one is buying the notion that Trump is impaired to anything remotely like Biden's level of dementia.

I understand Denial is the first stage, but you need to move on now, Biden is non compos mentis, and everyone knows it. Trump is limited to mean tweets and bloviation, not even Schumer-level mental issues at this time.

Waco1947 said:

---

I am awaiting the acknowledgment from trump supporters are gods with insurrectionist. We Al saw J6. Why are y'all not on board with his removal?

---

I am waiting for you to finally admit exactly where you got your 'theology degree'.

You must be incredibly embarrassed about where ( or if ) after all your hiding.

4th and Inches said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

I am awaiting the acknowledgment from trump supporters are gods with insurrectionist. We Al saw J6. Why are y'all not on board with his removal?

---

"we" didnt see what you saw..

The sitting head of state cant overthrow the govt.

The people protested and it turned into a riot. There were multiple(more than 25) fed agents in the capital crowd. Pelosi acknowledged she messed up and understaffed the security. Social media blocked Trumps tweets to be peaceful.

You saw what they wanted you to see.. they immediately used J6 to get access to Trumps potus records ahead of normal time since Biden cant access unless active investigation going on..

The media has been lying for Biden and manipulating what you have been seeing for at least the last 10 years.

Trump is the result of the rot in govt and the resistance response by the people.

---

Trump sat on his hands. Trump called them together. It was an insurrection when they crossed into the house and senate chambers. Congress people were running for their lives.

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

Here is the situation. The Democrats have four options:

(1) Keep Biden as the nominee.
(2) Dump Biden for Harris as the nominee.
(3) Dump both Biden and Harris and run one of the known 'big' names
(4) Dump Biden and Harris and run a young relatively unknown candidate in hopes of reincarnating Bill Clinton

The problem with (1) is what we have seen over the past month. The Democrats could only win if they find a way to win over Independents from supporting Trump.

The problem with (2), is that Jill and Joe Biden will fight like hell to keep Joe as the nominee, plus the fact that Harris can't beat Trump in the polls, plus the fact that as much as Joe comes across as a doddering old man who can't tell what day it is, Harris often comes off as bat-crap crazy and cannot even blame that on age.

The problem with (3), is first, the FEC will only allow Joe's $240 million war chest to be spent by Biden or Harris, the only two names listed with the FEC at the time of donations, so the new nominee will have start with $0, both Biden and Harris will try to undercut the nominee for at least part of the remaining campaign, and the polling so far does not show that brand name Democrats fare better against Trump than does Biden.

The problem with (4) is the same as (3), except that the new nominee will have no polling track record, and while the nominee might be the next Bill Clinton, he/she is statistically more likely to be the next Paul Tsongas.

Put it all together, and the Democrats will roll the dice and hope their attack machine finally costs Trump support and lets Biden - once again - pull out a win with no credible skills or visible effort.

---

pretty much that, with proliferating legal hurdles for ballot changes as you work down that list, unless, Biden is removed as POTUS for health reasons, (which theoretically side-steps a lot of the legal issues). Most state laws will have a clear pathway for late ballot changes in case of "death" or "incapacitation" but few will allow a ballot change just because "oops, we picked a guy who can't win."

So there may be no big moment....just a transition into a campaign where they make Joe the notional figurehead and let Kamala loose to go out and do the hard campaigning. She's going to be his replacement, very shortly, anyway (should they succeed), so it would be less disingenuous that what they're doing with Joe now.


So it really is up to Joe. He can agree to step aside per 25th Amendment, or they're stuck with him.

---

I admit I'm on thin ice but ...
Biden isn't the Democrat Party nominee yet, at least not legally. The Democrat Party will nominate their candidate at their convention and that is the candidate who goes on the ballot. If Biden releases his delegates they are free to choose whomever they wish.

In the meantime, Biden isn't withdrawing from the race for health reasons (I know, that's a fiction). Therefore from a legal POV the 25th Amendment is not applicable. The 25th A may be implicated later, but withdrawing from the race in August doesn't mean he can't serve out his term.

Regarding the money given to the Biden campaign, I have no idea who can direct it where or when they can direct it. If Harris is their nominee, I assume her campaign would be the beneficiary. If it is someone else, I suspect they would be the beneficiary (but I really don't know).

---

If Biden is formally nominated, the road gets a LOT harder. And given the number of delegates he controls, he's in a position where it would be quite hard to force him to release them against his will. If he continues to hold firm and becomes the nominee, state laws on ballot changes govern things. "Death" is pretty much an automatic. Courts are going to do backwards handsprings to try to get a live body on the ballot. Although there might be some quibbling over the definition of "incapacitation," I don't think many courts are going to rule that a POTUS who resigned over 25th amendment issues would not qualify as incapacitated, so I'm pretty sure that would grease skids as well.

All that means: he will be the candidate if he wants to be.
The escalating drumbeat to replace him this week has not been anything like what it needs to be to bring pressure on him. so far at least.

And underneath all of this is the constant tension of grassroots vs elites. Biden himself used the word "elites" in passing reference. The Clintonista and donor classes are all wanting a change. The Squad and progressive alliances are all staunchly pro-Biden. Same split to a lesser degree over the replacement - elites are less enthusiastic about Harris (noting her weaker polling vs Trump) but the grassroots see her as an ally.

So Dems have cloudy issues legally and politically thru which there still is not a sharp ray of sunlight to dart for. It's the old "run away from something vs run TO something." Right now, Dems don't have anything to run TO....just away from ol' Joe. So it's hard to see a clear risk/return.

GOP position should be that if Joe is incapable of being a candidate, he is incapable of being a POTUS and should resign from office.

Laughing Kamala will save us. Orange man bad.

Look at Biden's face...

Biden welcomed UK PM to the White House yesterday: pic.twitter.com/0tbs9z5EKF

— Daily Caller (@DailyCaller) July 11, 2024

4th and Inches said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

I am awaiting the acknowledgment from trump supporters are gods with insurrectionist. We Al saw J6. Why are y'all not on board with his removal?

---

"we" didnt see what you saw..

The sitting head of state cant overthrow the govt.

The people protested and it turned into a riot. There were multiple(more than 25) fed agents in the capital crowd. Pelosi acknowledged she messed up and understaffed the security. Social media blocked Trumps tweets to be peaceful.

You saw what they wanted you to see.. they immediately used J6 to get access to Trumps potus records ahead of normal time since Biden cant access unless active investigation going on..

The media has been lying for Biden and manipulating what you have been seeing for at least the last 10 years.

Trump is the result of the rot in govt and the resistance response by the people.

---

There are always more than 25 Federal Agents in a Capitol crowd. That's like making a statement that there are people watching cameras in the casino.

Realitybites said:

---

The Bidens are digging in, daring the democrat establishment to 25th amendment him. That would probably require the DOJ to come forward with the testimony they have been hiding.

---

The Biden's are cleverly forcing the Democratic mega donors to increase their offer for a Biden 'retirement'.

They are going to get at least 15 million.

Petty cash for the really rich Dem power brokers.

But Harris is going to want her cut as well .
Otherwise she will hammer the eventual Dem nominee with her black constituents.

whiterock said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

Here is the situation. The Democrats have four options:

(1) Keep Biden as the nominee.
(2) Dump Biden for Harris as the nominee.
(3) Dump both Biden and Harris and run one of the known 'big' names
(4) Dump Biden and Harris and run a young relatively unknown candidate in hopes of reincarnating Bill Clinton

The problem with (1) is what we have seen over the past month. The Democrats could only win if they find a way to win over Independents from supporting Trump.

The problem with (2), is that Jill and Joe Biden will fight like hell to keep Joe as the nominee, plus the fact that Harris can't beat Trump in the polls, plus the fact that as much as Joe comes across as a doddering old man who can't tell what day it is, Harris often comes off as bat-crap crazy and cannot even blame that on age.

The problem with (3), is first, the FEC will only allow Joe's $240 million war chest to be spent by Biden or Harris, the only two names listed with the FEC at the time of donations, so the new nominee will have start with $0, both Biden and Harris will try to undercut the nominee for at least part of the remaining campaign, and the polling so far does not show that brand name Democrats fare better against Trump than does Biden.

The problem with (4) is the same as (3), except that the new nominee will have no polling track record, and while the nominee might be the next Bill Clinton, he/she is statistically more likely to be the next Paul Tsongas.

Put it all together, and the Democrats will roll the dice and hope their attack machine finally costs Trump support and lets Biden - once again - pull out a win with no credible skills or visible effort.

---

pretty much that, with proliferating legal hurdles for ballot changes as you work down that list, unless, Biden is removed as POTUS for health reasons, (which theoretically side-steps a lot of the legal issues). Most state laws will have a clear pathway for late ballot changes in case of "death" or "incapacitation" but few will allow a ballot change just because "oops, we picked a guy who can't win."

So there may be no big moment....just a transition into a campaign where they make Joe the notional figurehead and let Kamala loose to go out and do the hard campaigning. She's going to be his replacement, very shortly, anyway (should they succeed), so it would be less disingenuous that what they're doing with Joe now.


So it really is up to Joe. He can agree to step aside per 25th Amendment, or they're stuck with him.

---

I admit I'm on thin ice but ...
Biden isn't the Democrat Party nominee yet, at least not legally. The Democrat Party will nominate their candidate at their convention and that is the candidate who goes on the ballot. If Biden releases his delegates they are free to choose whomever they wish.

In the meantime, Biden isn't withdrawing from the race for health reasons (I know, that's a fiction). Therefore from a legal POV the 25th Amendment is not applicable. The 25th A may be implicated later, but withdrawing from the race in August doesn't mean he can't serve out his term.

Regarding the money given to the Biden campaign, I have no idea who can direct it where or when they can direct it. If Harris is their nominee, I assume her campaign would be the beneficiary. If it is someone else, I suspect they would be the beneficiary (but I really don't know).

---

If Biden is formally nominated, the road gets a LOT harder. And given the number of delegates he controls, he's in a position where it would be quite hard to force him to release them against his will. If he continues to hold firm and becomes the nominee, state laws on ballot changes govern things. "Death" is pretty much an automatic. Courts are going to do backwards handsprings to try to get a live body on the ballot. Although there might be some quibbling over the definition of "incapacitation," I don't think many courts are going to rule that a POTUS who resigned over 25th amendment issues would not qualify as incapacitated, so I'm pretty sure that would grease skids as well.

All that means: he will be the candidate if he wants to be.
The escalating drumbeat to replace him this week has not been anything like what it needs to be to bring pressure on him. so far at least.

And underneath all of this is the constant tension of grassroots vs elites. Biden himself used the word "elites" in passing reference. The Clintonista and donor classes are all wanting a change. The Squad and progressive alliances are all staunchly pro-Biden. Same split to a lesser degree over the replacement - elites are less enthusiastic about Harris (noting her weaker polling vs Trump) but the grassroots see her as an ally.

So Dems have cloudy issues legally and politically thru which there still is not a sharp ray of sunlight to dart for. It's the old "run away from something vs run TO something." Right now, Dems don't have anything to run TO....just away from ol' Joe. So it's hard to see a clear risk/return.

GOP position should be that if Joe is incapable of being a candidate, he is incapable of being a POTUS and should resign from office.

---

Mostly agree, but withdrawing from an election isn't a 25th A removal. I don't think Biden is up to the job through January.

Think Biden wears adult diapers?

ScottS said:

---

Think Biden wears adult diapers?

---

depends

trey3216 said:

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4th and Inches said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

I am awaiting the acknowledgment from trump supporters are gods with insurrectionist. We Al saw J6. Why are y'all not on board with his removal?

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"we" didnt see what you saw..

The sitting head of state cant overthrow the govt.

The people protested and it turned into a riot. There were multiple(more than 25) fed agents in the capital crowd. Pelosi acknowledged she messed up and understaffed the security. Social media blocked Trumps tweets to be peaceful.

You saw what they wanted you to see.. they immediately used J6 to get access to Trumps potus records ahead of normal time since Biden cant access unless active investigation going on..

The media has been lying for Biden and manipulating what you have been seeing for at least the last 10 years.

Trump is the result of the rot in govt and the resistance response by the people.

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There are always more than 25 Federal Agents in a Capitol crowd. That's like making a statement that there are people watching cameras in the casino.

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https://revolver.news/2021/06/federal-foreknowledge-jan-6-unindicted-co-conspirators-raise-disturbing-questions/?_gl=1*z2an37*_ga*MTk1Mzc4NzE5NC4xNzIwNzEzODE4*_ga_XJ99YMQQS8*MTcyMDcxMzgxOC4xLjEuMTcyMDcxMzgzOS4wLjAuMA..

Its a long read but more and more its looking like an entrapment operation, done for political purposes. Much like the fake Gov Whitmer kidnap plot.

BearFan33 said:

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trey3216 said:

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4th and Inches said:

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Waco1947 said:

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I am awaiting the acknowledgment from trump supporters are gods with insurrectionist. We Al saw J6. Why are y'all not on board with his removal?

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"we" didnt see what you saw..

The sitting head of state cant overthrow the govt.

The people protested and it turned into a riot. There were multiple(more than 25) fed agents in the capital crowd. Pelosi acknowledged she messed up and understaffed the security. Social media blocked Trumps tweets to be peaceful.

You saw what they wanted you to see.. they immediately used J6 to get access to Trumps potus records ahead of normal time since Biden cant access unless active investigation going on..

The media has been lying for Biden and manipulating what you have been seeing for at least the last 10 years.

Trump is the result of the rot in govt and the resistance response by the people.

---

There are always more than 25 Federal Agents in a Capitol crowd. That's like making a statement that there are people watching cameras in the casino.

---

https://revolver.news/2021/06/federal-foreknowledge-jan-6-unindicted-co-conspirators-raise-disturbing-questions/?_gl=1*z2an37*_ga*MTk1Mzc4NzE5NC4xNzIwNzEzODE4*_ga_XJ99YMQQS8*MTcyMDcxMzgxOC4xLjEuMTcyMDcxMzgzOS4wLjAuMA..

Its a long read but more and more its looking like an entrapment operation, done for political purposes. Much like the fake Gov Whitmer kidnap plot.

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thats fine. But saying "there were Feds amongst the protesters" is a flat earth/birds aren't real argument. There are Feds in virtually every outdoor public gathering you've ever been to.