GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Assassin said:

---

---

So if true, once again not a release of documents just a speculation that because Biden didn't show something it must not exist, just release the documents. If he is not in there release? Why the coy assumptions and logic jumps?

---

I could see your point of view if it was just Biden didn't release. However, Biden not releasing Trump/Epstein documents is only a nominal point considering what was done to Trump to keep him from winning a second term. Lawfare, shoot to kill searches of his home, assignation attempts, ballot removal, January 6th commission, two impeachments - among others.

Do you really believe if the left had a good Epstein connection, it would not have been leaked prior to half of their other shenanigans? The left always leaks damaging information about republicans - consider the leak of the Dobbs decision.

As such, there are only three logical conclusions:

1. The information in the Epstein files is so damaging to leftists that anything related to Trump will not outweigh that damage.

2. The information is so damaging to US interests that Trump cannot release anything meaningful - leaving the left only the innuendo card to play.

3. There is nothing damaging to Trump in the Epstein files - leaving nothing for him to release to clear his name.

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Assassin said:

---

---

So if true, once again not a release of documents just a speculation that because Biden didn't show something it must not exist, just release the documents. If he is not in there release? Why the coy assumptions and logic jumps?

---

I could see your point of view if it was just Biden didn't release. However, Biden not releasing Trump/Epstein documents is only a nominal point considering what was done to Trump to keep him from winning a second term. Lawfare, shoot to kill searches of his home, assignation attempts, ballot removal, January 6th commission, two impeachments - among others.

Do you really believe if the left had a good Epstein connection, it would not have been leaked prior to half of their other shenanigans? The left always leaks damaging information about republicans - consider the leak of the Dobbs decision.

As such, there are only three logical conclusions:

1. The information in the Epstein files is so damaging to leftists that anything related to Trump will not outweigh that damage.

2. The information is so damaging to US interests that Trump cannot release anything meaningful - leaving the left only the innuendo card to play.

3. There is nothing damaging to Trump in the Epstein files - leaving nothing for him to release to clear his name.

---

I will take Door #1 Monte...

There is so much for both sides to lose, that it is in neither's side best interest to reveal. For either side the only thing worse than nailing the other side is being voted out of office. They are ALL addicted to power. Just look who these people were when they got into power and what they are now, all sides. And it is not just the men - Noem, MTG, Boebert, AOC, Gabbard, etc... They hate each other, but all agree only thing worse is having to be normal again.

I don't buy the Mossad thing, that would give them BOTH a rally cry. If it were Israel you would see a different reaction.

No this is pure self-preservation by both sides. If they are not in there, there money people are. Trump is in their, too many pictures of the two pal-ing around. Did Trump do anything illegal? I doubt it, that is not his style. He hasn't ever shown a liking for young girls.

---

Assassin said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Assassin said:

---

---

So if true, once again not a release of documents just a speculation that because Biden didn't show something it must not exist, just release the documents. If he is not in there release? Why the coy assumptions and logic jumps?

---

I could see your point of view if it was just Biden didn't release. However, Biden not releasing Trump/Epstein documents is only a nominal point considering what was done to Trump to keep him from winning a second term. Lawfare, shoot to kill searches of his home, assignation attempts, ballot removal, January 6th commission, two impeachments - among others.

Do you really believe if the left had a good Epstein connection, it would not have been leaked prior to half of their other shenanigans? The left always leaks damaging information about republicans - consider the leak of the Dobbs decision.

As such, there are only three logical conclusions:

1. The information in the Epstein files is so damaging to leftists that anything related to Trump will not outweigh that damage.

2. The information is so damaging to US interests that Trump cannot release anything meaningful - leaving the left only the innuendo card to play.

3. There is nothing damaging to Trump in the Epstein files - leaving nothing for him to release to clear his name.

---

I will take Door #1 Monte...

There is so much for both sides to lose, that it is in neither's side best interest to reveal. For either side the only thing worse than nailing the other side is being voted out of office. They are ALL addicted to power. Just look who these people were when they got into power and what they are now, all sides. And it is not just the men - Noem, MTG, Boebert, AOC, Gabbard, etc... They hate each other, but all agree only thing worse is having to be normal again.

I don't buy the Mossad thing, that would give them BOTH a rally cry. If it were Israel you would see a different reaction.

No this is pure self-preservation by both sides. If they are not in there, there money people are. Trump is in their, too many pictures of the two pal-ing around. Did Trump do anything illegal? I doubt it, that is not his style. He hasn't ever shown a liking for young girls.

---

Just mature, absolute knockouts. A lot of folks are simply jealous.

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Assassin said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Assassin said:

---

---

So if true, once again not a release of documents just a speculation that because Biden didn't show something it must not exist, just release the documents. If he is not in there release? Why the coy assumptions and logic jumps?

---

I could see your point of view if it was just Biden didn't release. However, Biden not releasing Trump/Epstein documents is only a nominal point considering what was done to Trump to keep him from winning a second term. Lawfare, shoot to kill searches of his home, assignation attempts, ballot removal, January 6th commission, two impeachments - among others.

Do you really believe if the left had a good Epstein connection, it would not have been leaked prior to half of their other shenanigans? The left always leaks damaging information about republicans - consider the leak of the Dobbs decision.

As such, there are only three logical conclusions:

1. The information in the Epstein files is so damaging to leftists that anything related to Trump will not outweigh that damage.

2. The information is so damaging to US interests that Trump cannot release anything meaningful - leaving the left only the innuendo card to play.

3. There is nothing damaging to Trump in the Epstein files - leaving nothing for him to release to clear his name.

---

I will take Door #1 Monte...

There is so much for both sides to lose, that it is in neither's side best interest to reveal. For either side the only thing worse than nailing the other side is being voted out of office. They are ALL addicted to power. Just look who these people were when they got into power and what they are now, all sides. And it is not just the men - Noem, MTG, Boebert, AOC, Gabbard, etc... They hate each other, but all agree only thing worse is having to be normal again.

I don't buy the Mossad thing, that would give them BOTH a rally cry. If it were Israel you would see a different reaction.

No this is pure self-preservation by both sides. If they are not in there, there money people are. Trump is in their, too many pictures of the two pal-ing around. Did Trump do anything illegal? I doubt it, that is not his style. He hasn't ever shown a liking for young girls.

---

Just mature, absolute knockouts. A lot of folks are simply jealous.

---

I stuck up for Trump there... He likes women, not girls.

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

that notorious Maga rag USA Today says - mixed results.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2025/08/12/cpi-report-data-inflation-july/85618971007/

Mixed results is what one would reasonably expect with massive policy changes looming, most of which have only been in place 4-6 weeks.

Cutting interest rates lowers the federal deficit.

• Inflationary pressure: Artificially low interest rates for prolonged periods could risk igniting or re-igniting inflation, especially in a near-full employment economy, according to Reuters. Higher inflation could negate any savings on debt service costs by eroding the purchasing power of the dollar and potentially leading to higher future interest rates if the Federal Reserve is forced to act to bring inflation under control.
• Investor confidence: Maintaining interest rates at levels perceived as too low or politically driven could erode investor confidence in the long-term stability of the economy, Reuters says. This could make it more difficult or expensive for the government to borrow in the future, negating the benefits of initial rate cuts.
• Underlying fiscal imbalances: Even with lower interest rates, if the government's underlying spending and revenue policies create a structural deficit, the positive effect of lower rates might only be temporary.

Lowering the federal deficit reduces inflation pressures from deficit spending.
think it thru.....

---

---

The Federal Deficit is tracked by the Treasury. You keep looking a models, I am looking at the actual deficit. Everything you have been saying is what could be... I am talking what is.
Make up your mind on timeframe. TRACKING actual deficits is a rear view mirror. PROJECTING what future deficits might look like in response to policy is windshield work.

You make a point, is the budget surplus a positive thing? First is it real? I guess it is reported by CBO, correct? The same models you can't trust. So. let's say it is real.
LOL you simply do not understand how all of this stuff works. You said above (correctly) that the Treasury reports actual outcomes at the end of each month, then suggest (incorrectly) that CBO also reports them. CBO does not report them. They simply plug the Treasury numbers into their projection models as baseline data.

The question on whether that is positive or not is how is it used? Did it lower the deficit? If so, than is it a great thing. Or did we pump it into more Government spending, only spending you like. Maybe Defense, we will need more National Guard monies now that they are Federalized. Than no, it is not a good thing. It is more of the same.

---

Month by month numbers matter, but they are not determinative for long term impacts. We had a (substantial and very rare) surplus in June. We had a larger than expected deficit in July. Only fools would argue that one number or the other is instructive as to the impact of Trump policies. The sober mind would average the two out to get a better idea of what they might tell us, and then remember that Trump's BBB did not get passed until the end of July. Anyone making any serious attempt to get a handle on where we might be headed would have to note that the spending which occurred in June/July is, by law, a Biden budget mitigated by Trump's payroll RIF, agency closures, etc...... Trump critics are not trying to do any of that. They're just engaging in insanity, squealing that he is cratering the federal government agency by agency yet not saving a dime.

Reality is, any impact the BBB might have, plus/minus, cannot be reasonably imputed because it was not actually signed into law until the two periods had elapsed. But you just gotta gotta complain about Trump very day because you hate his schtick so much, so here we are.....

---

Keep saying it. Maybe it will come true or closer to what I think you want is just for people to believe it is true. So far, we are seeing no indications of debt relief or lower spending that will get us to not havng to deficit spend. But, you will get the sheep to listen because you use big words...

---

lol

We actually did see an indication of lower spending in June...... (surplus).
We actually do see indications of lower spending in USG - reducing workforce an agency at a time.
We actually do see implementation of reforms that will lower operating costs (Invida ERP govt-wide, etc....).
-clawback efforts are inviting furious legal challenges.
-recissions packages are working their way thru Congress, billions of dollars at a time.
If none of that was real or consequential, why all the lawsuits to stop him from doing it?
Do you seriously mean to suggest that double digit cuts to discretionary spending will not have any impact on spending?


Other facts that are inconvenient to your argument:
-Trump inherited Biden's budget.
-it took 6 months for Congress to amend it (with the BBB) - Dems in lock-step to kill it.
-new budget negotiations (for FY2026) are just now starting (and Dems are apoplectic).

...and on and on and on....

Your suggestion that there have been no positive changes, no signs of improvement is simply disconnected from reality. Your suggestion that we go from a $1.9T deficit to balance in a single cycle is utterly unserious. The plan has been stated - to cut $1T out of spending, then grow the economy (and tax revenues) to cover the rest. There is a wide array of evidence that progress is being made on both.

but neverTrumpers gonna neverTrump........

---

What direction is that deficit going? Tell me when that is showing down, not up... Until then, it is all rhetoric, which you love pontificating.

National Deficit | U.S. Treasury Fiscal Data

---

well, you didn't post a terribly good data set to support your point, given that the link stops in 2024.

But if we look (at link below) at those CBO numbers you are so fond of, we see at the bottom of the first graphic, an estimate that 2025 will end up below 2024 AS A PERCENTAGE OF GDP. (remember, that is the goal as stated in detail by Bessent (and posted here)...to grow the economy faster than the debt.) And the raw dollar totals are down: 2025 below 2024, 2026 below 2025. Not by significant amounts, for sure, but, then it's CBO numbers and they are usually worst-case.

So what we actually see if we look AND understand the data, is that Trump's plan, less than 30 days after passage into law, actually does appear to be moving us in a positive direction. Yet, here you sit, inventing out of whole cloth "no change at all."

Your posts are like the kids in the back who keep asking "are we there yet."

https://www.cbo.gov/publication/61172

---

It's the Treasury Department.

---

from 2024.

You can't talk about trend lines in 2025 using only 2024 data.

All I did was grab a document from a source you have quoted that has 2025 data and future projections to show you that your statement of "no improvement" is factually refutable.

---

I am done doing this with you anymore. I get it, you understand at a higher level than the rest of us. EVERYTHING Donald does is good, we will take your word for it. You will not see anything but a positive because you like him. There is always an excuse to why Trump is right...

---

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

that notorious Maga rag USA Today says - mixed results.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2025/08/12/cpi-report-data-inflation-july/85618971007/

Mixed results is what one would reasonably expect with massive policy changes looming, most of which have only been in place 4-6 weeks.

Cutting interest rates lowers the federal deficit.

• Inflationary pressure: Artificially low interest rates for prolonged periods could risk igniting or re-igniting inflation, especially in a near-full employment economy, according to Reuters. Higher inflation could negate any savings on debt service costs by eroding the purchasing power of the dollar and potentially leading to higher future interest rates if the Federal Reserve is forced to act to bring inflation under control.
• Investor confidence: Maintaining interest rates at levels perceived as too low or politically driven could erode investor confidence in the long-term stability of the economy, Reuters says. This could make it more difficult or expensive for the government to borrow in the future, negating the benefits of initial rate cuts.
• Underlying fiscal imbalances: Even with lower interest rates, if the government's underlying spending and revenue policies create a structural deficit, the positive effect of lower rates might only be temporary.

Lowering the federal deficit reduces inflation pressures from deficit spending.
think it thru.....

---

---

The Federal Deficit is tracked by the Treasury. You keep looking a models, I am looking at the actual deficit. Everything you have been saying is what could be... I am talking what is.
Make up your mind on timeframe. TRACKING actual deficits is a rear view mirror. PROJECTING what future deficits might look like in response to policy is windshield work.

You make a point, is the budget surplus a positive thing? First is it real? I guess it is reported by CBO, correct? The same models you can't trust. So. let's say it is real.
LOL you simply do not understand how all of this stuff works. You said above (correctly) that the Treasury reports actual outcomes at the end of each month, then suggest (incorrectly) that CBO also reports them. CBO does not report them. They simply plug the Treasury numbers into their projection models as baseline data.

The question on whether that is positive or not is how is it used? Did it lower the deficit? If so, than is it a great thing. Or did we pump it into more Government spending, only spending you like. Maybe Defense, we will need more National Guard monies now that they are Federalized. Than no, it is not a good thing. It is more of the same.

---

Month by month numbers matter, but they are not determinative for long term impacts. We had a (substantial and very rare) surplus in June. We had a larger than expected deficit in July. Only fools would argue that one number or the other is instructive as to the impact of Trump policies. The sober mind would average the two out to get a better idea of what they might tell us, and then remember that Trump's BBB did not get passed until the end of July. Anyone making any serious attempt to get a handle on where we might be headed would have to note that the spending which occurred in June/July is, by law, a Biden budget mitigated by Trump's payroll RIF, agency closures, etc...... Trump critics are not trying to do any of that. They're just engaging in insanity, squealing that he is cratering the federal government agency by agency yet not saving a dime.

Reality is, any impact the BBB might have, plus/minus, cannot be reasonably imputed because it was not actually signed into law until the two periods had elapsed. But you just gotta gotta complain about Trump very day because you hate his schtick so much, so here we are.....

---

Keep saying it. Maybe it will come true or closer to what I think you want is just for people to believe it is true. So far, we are seeing no indications of debt relief or lower spending that will get us to not havng to deficit spend. But, you will get the sheep to listen because you use big words...

---

lol

We actually did see an indication of lower spending in June...... (surplus).
We actually do see indications of lower spending in USG - reducing workforce an agency at a time.
We actually do see implementation of reforms that will lower operating costs (Invida ERP govt-wide, etc....).
-clawback efforts are inviting furious legal challenges.
-recissions packages are working their way thru Congress, billions of dollars at a time.
If none of that was real or consequential, why all the lawsuits to stop him from doing it?
Do you seriously mean to suggest that double digit cuts to discretionary spending will not have any impact on spending?


Other facts that are inconvenient to your argument:
-Trump inherited Biden's budget.
-it took 6 months for Congress to amend it (with the BBB) - Dems in lock-step to kill it.
-new budget negotiations (for FY2026) are just now starting (and Dems are apoplectic).

...and on and on and on....

Your suggestion that there have been no positive changes, no signs of improvement is simply disconnected from reality. Your suggestion that we go from a $1.9T deficit to balance in a single cycle is utterly unserious. The plan has been stated - to cut $1T out of spending, then grow the economy (and tax revenues) to cover the rest. There is a wide array of evidence that progress is being made on both.

but neverTrumpers gonna neverTrump........

---

What direction is that deficit going? Tell me when that is showing down, not up... Until then, it is all rhetoric, which you love pontificating.

National Deficit | U.S. Treasury Fiscal Data

---

well, you didn't post a terribly good data set to support your point, given that the link stops in 2024.

But if we look (at link below) at those CBO numbers you are so fond of, we see at the bottom of the first graphic, an estimate that 2025 will end up below 2024 AS A PERCENTAGE OF GDP. (remember, that is the goal as stated in detail by Bessent (and posted here)...to grow the economy faster than the debt.) And the raw dollar totals are down: 2025 below 2024, 2026 below 2025. Not by significant amounts, for sure, but, then it's CBO numbers and they are usually worst-case.

So what we actually see if we look AND understand the data, is that Trump's plan, less than 30 days after passage into law, actually does appear to be moving us in a positive direction. Yet, here you sit, inventing out of whole cloth "no change at all."

Your posts are like the kids in the back who keep asking "are we there yet."

https://www.cbo.gov/publication/61172

---

It's the Treasury Department.

---

from 2024.

You can't talk about trend lines in 2025 using only 2024 data.

All I did was grab a document from a source you have quoted that has 2025 data and future projections to show you that your statement of "no improvement" is factually refutable.

---

I am done doing this with you anymore. I get it, you understand at a higher level than the rest of us. EVERYTHING Donald does is good, we will take your word for it. You will not see anything but a positive because you like him. There is always an excuse to why Trump is right...

---

LOL. You make an elementary error in posting data which does not support your point, and it's Trump's fault.

NeverTrumpism on parade. It absolutely corrupts the mind.

---

whiterock said:

---

And you are whining about style rather than substance, one of several pathologies that have gotten the country into our current predicament.

I don't care HOW he does it. As long as he's doing what needs to be done, I'm going to help him accomplish it. The whining doesn't actually bother me much. It means he is accomplishing something.

"If you ain't taking flak, you ain't over the Target."
https://www.theleadermaker.com/if-youre-taking-flak/

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

And you are whining about style rather than substance, one of several pathologies that have gotten the country into our current predicament.

I don't care HOW he does it. As long as he's doing what needs to be done, I'm going to help him accomplish it. The whining doesn't actually bother me much. It means he is accomplishing something.

"If you ain't taking flak, you ain't over the Target."
https://www.theleadermaker.com/if-youre-taking-flak/

---

If you are a bomber pilot, I agree style means nothing. As with hundreds of other professions. Sorry, but you are the President of the United States, style means a lot. Just like the opposite with Biden, you need more than style you need to be effective.

This is POTUS, the toughest job in the world. The highest bar, not the lowest. Or it should be...

His 2 am tweets matter. His Musk escipates matter. Would I prefer Trump to Biden of course. Just want Trump to raise his game.

---

KaiBear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

Interesting


For all the people ( including me ) screaming at Trump to reveal the files ……apparently he can't due to the judges ruling.

A. Wonder why the judge did this ?
B Why isn't the media explaining this set of circumstances to the country ?

---

Assassin said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Assassin said:

---

---

So if true, once again not a release of documents just a speculation that because Biden didn't show something it must not exist, just release the documents. If he is not in there release? Why the coy assumptions and logic jumps?

---

My guess, First, were thousands of pages, Second, you HAVE TO PROTECT THE INNOCENT girls and boys that were abused, Third, some of the dignitaries may be connected to what is going on worldwide right now and I would agree, let them suffer, I would also say that holding off a few weeks or months until world deeds are done is okay (Israel maybe?). The names will come out eventually. We are in a society that says, 'Do it, let the chips fall where they may'. Only in this case, we get to say WHEN the chips fall

Add: Pretty sure Clinton is on the list. Not sure that Trump wants to taint the POTUS office with Bill's shenanigans simply because Hillary was ice cold

---

KaiBear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

Interesting


For all the people ( including me ) screaming at Trump to reveal the files ……apparently he can't due to the judges ruling.

A. Wonder why the judge did this ?
B Why isn't the media explaining this set of circumstances to the country ?

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

Interesting


For all the people ( including me ) screaming at Trump to reveal the files ……apparently he can't due to the judges ruling.

A. Wonder why the judge did this ?
B Why isn't the media explaining this set of circumstances to the country ?

---

That's not what this ruling says. The ruling said that the grand jury filing was 70 pages. The government has thousands of pages of evidence not in the grand jury filing. The judge asked, why is the government asking the court for anything?

Here's what was written.

U.S. District Judge Richard Berman sharply criticized the Trump administration for seeking to unseal the grand jury records when the DOJ already has hundreds of thousands of pages of files related to Epstein in its possession.

"The instant grand jury motion appears to be a 'diversion' from the breadth and scope of the Epstein files in the Government's possession. The grand jury testimony is merely a hearsay snippet of Jeffrey Epstein's alleged conduct," he wrote.

"The Government's complete information trove would better inform the public about the Epstein case," Berman added.

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

And you are whining about style rather than substance, one of several pathologies that have gotten the country into our current predicament.

I don't care HOW he does it. As long as he's doing what needs to be done, I'm going to help him accomplish it. The whining doesn't actually bother me much. It means he is accomplishing something.

"If you ain't taking flak, you ain't over the Target."
https://www.theleadermaker.com/if-youre-taking-flak/

---

If you are a bomber pilot, I agree style means nothing. As with hundreds of other professions. Sorry, but you are the President of the United States, style means a lot. Just like the opposite with Biden, you need more than style you need to be effective.

This is POTUS, the toughest job in the world. The highest bar, not the lowest. Or it should be...

His 2 am tweets matter. His Musk escipates matter. Would I prefer Trump to Biden of course. Just want Trump to raise his game.

---

We opened 2025 with an economy in recession, $37T in debt, a structural $100B trade deficit, funding an interminable foreign war, facing mounting Chinese preparations for an invasion of Taiwan, a federal bureaucracy preparing for open rebellion against a popularly elected President, a mainstream media functioning openly as the PR arm of the Democrat Party, judicial activism on steroids, +20m illegal aliens, rampant crime in major cities, men competing with women in professional sports, boys showering with girls in public school......dogs and cats sleeping together....MASS HYSTERIA...!

And look where we are today.

The style thing doesn't work, bro. If we are lucky, he will keep doing what he's doing. It's working. If it wasn't we wouldn't be taking so much flack.

---

KaiBear said:

---

Trump is presiding over the biggest ; most influential and dangerous reality show the planet has to offer.

So far his 'ratings' have been pretty good.

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Sorry, there is a level of decorum the office demands.

---

Realitybites said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Sorry, there is a level of decorum the office demands.

---

Decorum has brought us to the place in our history where 10% of the country are illegal aliens and this is happening within our borders.



To hell with Decorum. It's time to fight and win. That's assuming if you want to have anything resembling the America we once had left.

---

KaiBear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

Interesting


For all the people ( including me ) screaming at Trump to reveal the files ……apparently he can't due to the judges ruling.

A. Wonder why the judge did this ?
B Why isn't the media explaining this set of circumstances to the country ?

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

Interesting


For all the people ( including me ) screaming at Trump to reveal the files ……apparently he can't due to the judges ruling.

A. Wonder why the judge did this ?
B Why isn't the media explaining this set of circumstances to the country ?

---

That's not what this ruling says. The ruling said that the grand jury filing was 70 pages. The government has thousands of pages of evidence not in the grand jury filing. The judge asked, why is the government asking the court for anything?

Here's what was written.

U.S. District Judge Richard Berman sharply criticized the Trump administration for seeking to unseal the grand jury records when the DOJ already has hundreds of thousands of pages of files related to Epstein in its possession.

"The instant grand jury motion appears to be a 'diversion' from the breadth and scope of the Epstein files in the Government's possession. The grand jury testimony is merely a hearsay snippet of Jeffrey Epstein's alleged conduct," he wrote.

"The Government's complete information trove would better inform the public about the Epstein case," Berman added.

---

Assassin said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

Interesting


For all the people ( including me ) screaming at Trump to reveal the files ……apparently he can't due to the judges ruling.

A. Wonder why the judge did this ?
B Why isn't the media explaining this set of circumstances to the country ?

---

That's not what this ruling says. The ruling said that the grand jury filing was 70 pages. The government has thousands of pages of evidence not in the grand jury filing. The judge asked, why is the government asking the court for anything?

Here's what was written.

U.S. District Judge Richard Berman sharply criticized the Trump administration for seeking to unseal the grand jury records when the DOJ already has hundreds of thousands of pages of files related to Epstein in its possession.

"The instant grand jury motion appears to be a 'diversion' from the breadth and scope of the Epstein files in the Government's possession. The grand jury testimony is merely a hearsay snippet of Jeffrey Epstein's alleged conduct," he wrote.

"The Government's complete information trove would better inform the public about the Epstein case," Berman added.

---

That doesnt explain why he didn't release the Grand Jury pages. GJ tends to summarize, would have been beneficial. There must be something in there. He is protecting someone

Berman is a Clinton appointee from the state of New York, NY Judges tend to be the worst towards America First.

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Assassin said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

Interesting


For all the people ( including me ) screaming at Trump to reveal the files ……apparently he can't due to the judges ruling.

A. Wonder why the judge did this ?
B Why isn't the media explaining this set of circumstances to the country ?

---

That's not what this ruling says. The ruling said that the grand jury filing was 70 pages. The government has thousands of pages of evidence not in the grand jury filing. The judge asked, why is the government asking the court for anything?

Here's what was written.

U.S. District Judge Richard Berman sharply criticized the Trump administration for seeking to unseal the grand jury records when the DOJ already has hundreds of thousands of pages of files related to Epstein in its possession.

"The instant grand jury motion appears to be a 'diversion' from the breadth and scope of the Epstein files in the Government's possession. The grand jury testimony is merely a hearsay snippet of Jeffrey Epstein's alleged conduct," he wrote.

"The Government's complete information trove would better inform the public about the Epstein case," Berman added.

---

That doesnt explain why he didn't release the Grand Jury pages. GJ tends to summarize, would have been beneficial. There must be something in there. He is protecting someone

Berman is a Clinton appointee from the state of New York, NY Judges tend to be the worst towards America First.

---

I guess the modus operandi is to disagree first. Not use logic.

The GJ was presented 70 pages of evidence. The DOJ has thousands of pages of evidence that neither the judge or GJ have authority of. The DOJ can scrub names of victims and release that information.

I think they have a responsibility to innocent but they don't need a Fed Judge to authorize that. Or explain why they will not.

They (per the judge) appear to be using the court as a diversion. He's the second judge to say so.

Do you think DOJ should at least be transparent about why they are. It releasing information not in the GJ control?

---

Assassin said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Assassin said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

Interesting


For all the people ( including me ) screaming at Trump to reveal the files ……apparently he can't due to the judges ruling.

A. Wonder why the judge did this ?
B Why isn't the media explaining this set of circumstances to the country ?

---

That's not what this ruling says. The ruling said that the grand jury filing was 70 pages. The government has thousands of pages of evidence not in the grand jury filing. The judge asked, why is the government asking the court for anything?

Here's what was written.

U.S. District Judge Richard Berman sharply criticized the Trump administration for seeking to unseal the grand jury records when the DOJ already has hundreds of thousands of pages of files related to Epstein in its possession.

"The instant grand jury motion appears to be a 'diversion' from the breadth and scope of the Epstein files in the Government's possession. The grand jury testimony is merely a hearsay snippet of Jeffrey Epstein's alleged conduct," he wrote.

"The Government's complete information trove would better inform the public about the Epstein case," Berman added.

---

That doesnt explain why he didn't release the Grand Jury pages. GJ tends to summarize, would have been beneficial. There must be something in there. He is protecting someone

Berman is a Clinton appointee from the state of New York, NY Judges tend to be the worst towards America First.

---

I guess the modus operandi is to disagree first. Not use logic.

The GJ was presented 70 pages of evidence. The DOJ has thousands of pages of evidence that neither the judge or GJ have authority of. The DOJ can scrub names of victims and release that information.

I think they have a responsibility to innocent but they don't need a Fed Judge to authorize that. Or explain why they will not.

They (per the judge) appear to be using the court as a diversion. He's the second judge to say so.

Do you think DOJ should at least be transparent about why they are. It releasing information not in the GJ control?

---

No Mitch, you are trying to re-route this thread. I gave you the logic. He is protecting someone. Remember he is a Clinton appointee and speculation puts Bill at the top of the list

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Assassin said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Assassin said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

Interesting


For all the people ( including me ) screaming at Trump to reveal the files ……apparently he can't due to the judges ruling.

A. Wonder why the judge did this ?
B Why isn't the media explaining this set of circumstances to the country ?

---

That's not what this ruling says. The ruling said that the grand jury filing was 70 pages. The government has thousands of pages of evidence not in the grand jury filing. The judge asked, why is the government asking the court for anything?

Here's what was written.

U.S. District Judge Richard Berman sharply criticized the Trump administration for seeking to unseal the grand jury records when the DOJ already has hundreds of thousands of pages of files related to Epstein in its possession.

"The instant grand jury motion appears to be a 'diversion' from the breadth and scope of the Epstein files in the Government's possession. The grand jury testimony is merely a hearsay snippet of Jeffrey Epstein's alleged conduct," he wrote.

"The Government's complete information trove would better inform the public about the Epstein case," Berman added.

---

That doesnt explain why he didn't release the Grand Jury pages. GJ tends to summarize, would have been beneficial. There must be something in there. He is protecting someone

Berman is a Clinton appointee from the state of New York, NY Judges tend to be the worst towards America First.

---

I guess the modus operandi is to disagree first. Not use logic.

The GJ was presented 70 pages of evidence. The DOJ has thousands of pages of evidence that neither the judge or GJ have authority of. The DOJ can scrub names of victims and release that information.

I think they have a responsibility to innocent but they don't need a Fed Judge to authorize that. Or explain why they will not.

They (per the judge) appear to be using the court as a diversion. He's the second judge to say so.

Do you think DOJ should at least be transparent about why they are. It releasing information not in the GJ control?

---

No Mitch, you are trying to re-route this thread. I gave you the logic. He is protecting someone. Remember he is a Clinton appointee and speculation puts Bill at the top of the list

---

You hope. Epstein didn't call Clinton his "best friend". I can tell you, without a doubt, my "best friend" will never be a notorious pedophile and I'd have not seen it.

---

Assassin said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Assassin said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Assassin said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

Interesting


For all the people ( including me ) screaming at Trump to reveal the files ……apparently he can't due to the judges ruling.

A. Wonder why the judge did this ?
B Why isn't the media explaining this set of circumstances to the country ?

---

That's not what this ruling says. The ruling said that the grand jury filing was 70 pages. The government has thousands of pages of evidence not in the grand jury filing. The judge asked, why is the government asking the court for anything?

Here's what was written.

U.S. District Judge Richard Berman sharply criticized the Trump administration for seeking to unseal the grand jury records when the DOJ already has hundreds of thousands of pages of files related to Epstein in its possession.

"The instant grand jury motion appears to be a 'diversion' from the breadth and scope of the Epstein files in the Government's possession. The grand jury testimony is merely a hearsay snippet of Jeffrey Epstein's alleged conduct," he wrote.

"The Government's complete information trove would better inform the public about the Epstein case," Berman added.

---

That doesnt explain why he didn't release the Grand Jury pages. GJ tends to summarize, would have been beneficial. There must be something in there. He is protecting someone

Berman is a Clinton appointee from the state of New York, NY Judges tend to be the worst towards America First.

---

I guess the modus operandi is to disagree first. Not use logic.

The GJ was presented 70 pages of evidence. The DOJ has thousands of pages of evidence that neither the judge or GJ have authority of. The DOJ can scrub names of victims and release that information.

I think they have a responsibility to innocent but they don't need a Fed Judge to authorize that. Or explain why they will not.

They (per the judge) appear to be using the court as a diversion. He's the second judge to say so.

Do you think DOJ should at least be transparent about why they are. It releasing information not in the GJ control?

---

No Mitch, you are trying to re-route this thread. I gave you the logic. He is protecting someone. Remember he is a Clinton appointee and speculation puts Bill at the top of the list

---

You hope. Epstein didn't call Clinton his "best friend". I can tell you, without a doubt, my "best friend" will never be a notorious pedophile and I'd have not seen it.

---

There is zero need to protect the Grand Jury files unless the Clinton-appointed liberal judge knows that there is something in there that goes against the Democrats

---

ScottS said:

---

Assassin said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Assassin said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Assassin said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

Interesting


For all the people ( including me ) screaming at Trump to reveal the files ……apparently he can't due to the judges ruling.

A. Wonder why the judge did this ?
B Why isn't the media explaining this set of circumstances to the country ?

---

That's not what this ruling says. The ruling said that the grand jury filing was 70 pages. The government has thousands of pages of evidence not in the grand jury filing. The judge asked, why is the government asking the court for anything?

Here's what was written.

U.S. District Judge Richard Berman sharply criticized the Trump administration for seeking to unseal the grand jury records when the DOJ already has hundreds of thousands of pages of files related to Epstein in its possession.

"The instant grand jury motion appears to be a 'diversion' from the breadth and scope of the Epstein files in the Government's possession. The grand jury testimony is merely a hearsay snippet of Jeffrey Epstein's alleged conduct," he wrote.

"The Government's complete information trove would better inform the public about the Epstein case," Berman added.

---

That doesnt explain why he didn't release the Grand Jury pages. GJ tends to summarize, would have been beneficial. There must be something in there. He is protecting someone

Berman is a Clinton appointee from the state of New York, NY Judges tend to be the worst towards America First.

---

I guess the modus operandi is to disagree first. Not use logic.

The GJ was presented 70 pages of evidence. The DOJ has thousands of pages of evidence that neither the judge or GJ have authority of. The DOJ can scrub names of victims and release that information.

I think they have a responsibility to innocent but they don't need a Fed Judge to authorize that. Or explain why they will not.

They (per the judge) appear to be using the court as a diversion. He's the second judge to say so.

Do you think DOJ should at least be transparent about why they are. It releasing information not in the GJ control?

---

No Mitch, you are trying to re-route this thread. I gave you the logic. He is protecting someone. Remember he is a Clinton appointee and speculation puts Bill at the top of the list

---

You hope. Epstein didn't call Clinton his "best friend". I can tell you, without a doubt, my "best friend" will never be a notorious pedophile and I'd have not seen it.

---

There is zero need to protect the Grand Jury files unless the Clinton-appointed liberal judge knows that there is something in there that goes against the Democrats

---

Think Slick Willie is in those files?

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

Interesting


For all the people ( including me ) screaming at Trump to reveal the files ……apparently he can't due to the judges ruling.

A. Wonder why the judge did this ?
B Why isn't the media explaining this set of circumstances to the country ?

---

That's not what this ruling says. The ruling said that the grand jury filing was 70 pages. The government has thousands of pages of evidence not in the grand jury filing. The judge asked, why is the government asking the court for anything?

Here's what was written.

U.S. District Judge Richard Berman sharply criticized the Trump administration for seeking to unseal the grand jury records when the DOJ already has hundreds of thousands of pages of files related to Epstein in its possession.

"The instant grand jury motion appears to be a 'diversion' from the breadth and scope of the Epstein files in the Government's possession. The grand jury testimony is merely a hearsay snippet of Jeffrey Epstein's alleged conduct," he wrote.

"The Government's complete information trove would better inform the public about the Epstein case," Berman added.

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

whiterock said:

---

And you are whining about style rather than substance, one of several pathologies that have gotten the country into our current predicament.

I don't care HOW he does it. As long as he's doing what needs to be done, I'm going to help him accomplish it. The whining doesn't actually bother me much. It means he is accomplishing something.

"If you ain't taking flak, you ain't over the Target."
https://www.theleadermaker.com/if-youre-taking-flak/

---

If you are a bomber pilot, I agree style means nothing. As with hundreds of other professions. Sorry, but you are the President of the United States, style means a lot. Just like the opposite with Biden, you need more than style you need to be effective.

This is POTUS, the toughest job in the world. The highest bar, not the lowest. Or it should be...

His 2 am tweets matter. His Musk escipates matter. Would I prefer Trump to Biden of course. Just want Trump to raise his game.

---

We opened 2025 with an economy in recession, $37T in debt, a structural $100B trade deficit, funding an interminable foreign war, facing mounting Chinese preparations for an invasion of Taiwan, a federal bureaucracy preparing for open rebellion against a popularly elected President, a mainstream media functioning openly as the PR arm of the Democrat Party, judicial activism on steroids, +20m illegal aliens, rampant crime in major cities, men competing with women in professional sports, boys showering with girls in public school......dogs and cats sleeping together....MASS HYSTERIA...!

And look where we are today.

The style thing doesn't work, bro. If we are lucky, he will keep doing what he's doing. It's working. If it wasn't we wouldn't be taking so much flack.

---

The job requires more than "The Apprentice" in real time. Sorry, there is a level of decorum the office demands.

But, I will concede that there were no better choices in the General Election since, geez Bob Dole? Respected man by all sides, knew his stuff and even endorsed Trump. Did not have the charisma to make the jump as his campaign showed. But we are talking 30 years of not good choices???

For all I know, we may be witnessing a paradigm shift. Because against Hilary, Biden, Harris? Trump is the best option. Wish he would tone down the superflous **** and realize he is not in a Reality Show...

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

Trump is presiding over the biggest ; most influential and dangerous reality show the planet has to offer.

So far his 'ratings' have been pretty good.

---

Can't deny that...


Just hope he realizes the ramifications are real in this show and he is more than just worried about making sure he has a soft landing.

---

KaiBear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

Trump is presiding over the biggest ; most influential and dangerous reality show the planet has to offer.

So far his 'ratings' have been pretty good.

---

Can't deny that...


Just hope he realizes the ramifications are real in this show and he is more than just worried about making sure he has a soft landing.

---

Strongly doubt a 79 year old multi billionaire who has come within a half inch of having has brains blown out on national television ......is only now concerned about working for a safe and ' soft ' landing.

---

whiterock said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

I think we knew this was coming

BREAKING: A federal judge has denied the Trump administration's request to unseal Jeffrey Epstein grand jury transcripts and exhibits. https://t.co/8PzfZ0dlW1

— Axios (@axios) August 20, 2025

---

Interesting


For all the people ( including me ) screaming at Trump to reveal the files ……apparently he can't due to the judges ruling.

A. Wonder why the judge did this ?
B Why isn't the media explaining this set of circumstances to the country ?

---

That's not what this ruling says. The ruling said that the grand jury filing was 70 pages. The government has thousands of pages of evidence not in the grand jury filing. The judge asked, why is the government asking the court for anything?

Here's what was written.

U.S. District Judge Richard Berman sharply criticized the Trump administration for seeking to unseal the grand jury records when the DOJ already has hundreds of thousands of pages of files related to Epstein in its possession.

"The instant grand jury motion appears to be a 'diversion' from the breadth and scope of the Epstein files in the Government's possession. The grand jury testimony is merely a hearsay snippet of Jeffrey Epstein's alleged conduct," he wrote.

"The Government's complete information trove would better inform the public about the Epstein case," Berman added.

---

the judge is correct. The request to release the GJ was an effort by the admin to change the narrative and make the (blue) DC courts look like the obstacle. It was a good play.

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

Trump is presiding over the biggest ; most influential and dangerous reality show the planet has to offer.

So far his 'ratings' have been pretty good.

---

Can't deny that...


Just hope he realizes the ramifications are real in this show and he is more than just worried about making sure he has a soft landing.

---

Strongly doubt a 79 year old multi billionaire who has come within a half inch of having has brains blown out on national television ......is only now concerned about working for a safe and ' soft ' landing.

---

He went in to this in 2016 with an exaggerated wealth of 600M and highly leveraged. Now, he is worth 5B. You were saying that he hasn't been worried about making sure he has a soft landing?

Sorry, don't have the warm fuzzies some of you have. Maybe it was growing up in NY and watching him operate. Not the most altruistic sort...

---