Mothra said:BigGameBaylorBear said:Mothra said:BigGameBaylorBear said:Mothra said:BigGameBaylorBear said:Mothra said:BigGameBaylorBear said:
Well, she is a mother and her name is Mary. Not sure what's funny?
She's not my mother.
Oof! John 26:27 "When Jesus saw his mother and the disciple whom he loved standing nearby, he said to his mother, 'Woman, behold, your son!' Then he said to the disciple, 'Behold, your mother!' And from that hour the disciple took her into his own home."
Oof indeed! Christ is telling His disciple John to take care of his mother after his passing. He's not telling you, me or anyone else we have a new spiritual mother. Such an interpretation would be pretty tortured (though I know that won't stop the Catholics).
SMH.
That verse is widely accepted as establishing a spiritual family in the Catholic and (to a lesser extent) Orthodox traditions, but not among the Protestants. It's not a mistranslation either, the Greek meaning is consistent.
It's a shame you reject your Mother but embrace Bibi as your daddy
FIFY.
I would be happy to debate your position, but so far, you've done nothing to support it, other than claiming some faith traditions claim that it means Mary is now our spiritual mother.
But let's take a look at the plain language of the verses, shall we?
First, nobody said it was a mistranslation. The question isn't what the Greek says. The question is what the text actually teaches. And the text says Jesus told John (i.e. the disciple whom Jesus loved) to take care of His mother and told Mary to accept John's care. That's it. It's a private instruction to two specific people standing at the foot of the cross. There is nothing else suggested in the plain language of the text.
Feel free to point to evidence that is not what the text says or means, and that it instead creates some sort of "spiritual family," or was an instruction to ALL Christianity - concepts unmentioned in the text.
Mary is a mortal that was blessed among women. She's not my mama, nor yours for that matter.
As for Bibi, my dad will be surprised to hear it.
Speak for yourself. I'm a Christian and she's my spiritual Mother.
Christ tells John, "Behold, your mother", and tells Mary, "Woman, behold your son". John represents all of the disciples. Thus, Jesus is establishing the spiritual family.
Revelation 12:17 "Then the dragon was enraged at the woman and went off to wage war against the rest of her offspringthose who keep God's commands and hold fast their testimony about Jesus."
The offspring of this unnamed woman, are followers of Christ, aka Christians.
Earlier in the chapter, this same woman is mentioned giving birth to Jesus.
Revelation 12:5 "She gave birth to a son, a male child, who "will rule all the nations with an iron scepter."
This woman is Mary, and her children are Christians.
The author of Revelation is believed to be John the Apostle.
"John represents all disciples" is not in the text. It's the bridge your argument requires, but simply asserting it doesn't prove it. John 19 says Jesus spoke to Mary and John. It then says John took her into his home. Nothing about that passage tells the reader that John is a stand-in for all future Christians.
Likewise, Revelation 12 is heavily symbolic and has been understood by many Christians as referring to Israel, God's people, or the covenant community, not merely Mary as an individual. Citing a disputed interpretation of Revelation to prove a disputed interpretation of John doesn't really advance the argument.
You're certainly free to believe Mary is your spiritual mother. But that's different from showing that Scripture clearly teaches it. The texts you've certainly don't state as such. The conclusion is theological, not the plain meaning of the passages themselves.
You say "the woman" refers to Israel but the text does not say that. That's the bridge your argument requires. Not to mention, the writer, John, already refers to Israel by name in Revelation, yet he never refers to the unnamed woman as Israel.
Jesus could've told John to simply take care of Mary, but he never explicitly said that. He only says "behold, your mother" and "Woman, behold, your son" Jesus is establishing a mother-son relationship.
And John doesn't use his own name, he refers to himself as "The Disciple whom he loved", symbolic for all Christians.
Jesus makes Mary the mother to the disciple.