jason_cook said:
Keep in mind Turek had zero contact with Baylor officials.
Interesting. I'm intrigued even more to hear his comments. I'm afraid that I'm gonna be disappointed in Frank.
Baylor grad, 'Bama dad
Frank Turek postponed at Baylor
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Last: 5 days ago by BaylorFTW
Interesting. I'm intrigued even more to hear his comments. I'm afraid that I'm gonna be disappointed in Frank.
When one side gives a very reasonable, facts-based explanation without sensationalizing anything or seeking undue attention, while the other promises a scathing podcast that they stand to make money off of, it's pretty easy for me to determine which side I come down on with regards to who is more believable.Redbrickbear said:Bestweekeverr said:Redbrickbear said:Bestweekeverr said:Mr. Sippi said:jason_cook said:
The Ratio Christi fall event was postponed by the student organization due to security costs, which per Baylor University policy are the responsibility of the hosting organization.
University policies for student-led events require submission of documentation well in advance to determine the support needed to ensure a safe, caring and educational environment for all students, faculty and staff. Ratio Christi did not submit this documentation as requested by University staff on several occasions. As a result, security costs associated with Waco Hall could not be determined until late in the planning process. Upon receipt of the full security estimate, the student organization decided to postpone, rather than work with campus leaders to identify a different and possibly less expensive location.
We understand this is a disappointing outcome for those who were scheduled to speak and attend, and campus leaders stand ready to support our Ratio Christi student leaders on another event in the future, provided appropriate info is shared in a timely manner.
As an academic institution, Baylor is committed to ensuring open dialogue and the robust exchange of ideas and perspectives. We hold this commitment along with an obligation to provide a safe and nurturing educational environment within a caring Christian community.
Thanks, Jason. I'm disappointed that the event was not able to be held as scheduled and maybe it will be at another time. I'm also disappointed that the blame is being assigned to a student organization whose purpose is to promote why we as Christians believe what we believe - which is exactly what I would think Baylor would want to promote. It's unfortunate that Baylor could not offer support to this group and help pull off the event.
I understand the need to appear being fair to all groups, but when Baylor University cannot find a way to share the gospel with those that need to hear it makes me sad.
I know that the world has changed a lot since I graduated from Baylor 40 years ago - it's a shame that Baylor has felt the need to change along with it.
I look forward to hearing Frank's side of the story on Friday.
Why is it Baylor's fault that the student org messed up and didn't submit the required documentation on time?
Sounds like he has more issues with the administration than just a misunderstanding about a time request on documents…
"There's too much information to share in this email or in a social media post, so I'll be revealing the full story, as well as exposing other corruption happening right now at Baylor, on Friday's podcast. So stay tuned
In the meantime, please note that this event has been postponed until further notice.
Blessings,
Dr. Frank Turek"
I'm sure he'll spin a tale about he's the victim in all this.
Seems harsh. Do you know him to be a dishonest person?
Or you just ready to discount anything he says before listening to it on Friday?
I don't know Frank Turek. I'm interested to hear what he has to say. But at first blush, it seems like he's butthurt about the event being postponed and is seizing the opportunity to do some old-fashioned political grifting. I guess we'll find out on Friday.
Redbrickbear said:Bestweekeverr said:Mr. Sippi said:jason_cook said:
The Ratio Christi fall event was postponed by the student organization due to security costs, which per Baylor University policy are the responsibility of the hosting organization.
University policies for student-led events require submission of documentation well in advance to determine the support needed to ensure a safe, caring and educational environment for all students, faculty and staff. Ratio Christi did not submit this documentation as requested by University staff on several occasions. As a result, security costs associated with Waco Hall could not be determined until late in the planning process. Upon receipt of the full security estimate, the student organization decided to postpone, rather than work with campus leaders to identify a different and possibly less expensive location.
We understand this is a disappointing outcome for those who were scheduled to speak and attend, and campus leaders stand ready to support our Ratio Christi student leaders on another event in the future, provided appropriate info is shared in a timely manner.
As an academic institution, Baylor is committed to ensuring open dialogue and the robust exchange of ideas and perspectives. We hold this commitment along with an obligation to provide a safe and nurturing educational environment within a caring Christian community.
Thanks, Jason. I'm disappointed that the event was not able to be held as scheduled and maybe it will be at another time. I'm also disappointed that the blame is being assigned to a student organization whose purpose is to promote why we as Christians believe what we believe - which is exactly what I would think Baylor would want to promote. It's unfortunate that Baylor could not offer support to this group and help pull off the event.
I understand the need to appear being fair to all groups, but when Baylor University cannot find a way to share the gospel with those that need to hear it makes me sad.
I know that the world has changed a lot since I graduated from Baylor 40 years ago - it's a shame that Baylor has felt the need to change along with it.
I look forward to hearing Frank's side of the story on Friday.
Why is it Baylor's fault that the student org messed up and didn't submit the required documentation on time?
Sounds like he has more issues with the administration than just a misunderstanding about a time request on documents…
"There's too much information to share in this email or in a social media post, so I'll be revealing the full story, as well as exposing other corruption happening right now at Baylor, on Friday's podcast. So stay tuned
In the meantime, please note that this event has been postponed until further notice.
Blessings,
Dr. Frank Turek"
What if he is correct?
Oldbear83 said:
In simple terms, this post is an excuse.
No greater victim than a conservative who wants rules for you but not for themselves.
Mitch Blood Green said:Oldbear83 said:
In simple terms, this post is an excuse.
No greater victim than a conservative who wants rules for you but not for themselves.
Wanting the same conditions for both progressives and conservatives is not at all what you posted there.
Oldbear83 said:Mitch Blood Green said:Oldbear83 said:
In simple terms, this post is an excuse.
No greater victim than a conservative who wants rules for you but not for themselves.
Wanting the same conditions for both progressives and conservatives is not at all what you posted there.
Can you verify that the university has different "security" requirements of progressives versus conservatives?
Mitch Blood Green said:Oldbear83 said:
In simple terms, this post is an excuse.
No greater victim than a conservative who wants rules for you but not for themselves.
Can you name a single instance of a radical regressive speaker or event being cancelled due to conservative violence or threats?
"What we have here is a failure to communicate." Who is supposed to be the "adult" in the conversation?
Harrison Bergeron said:Mitch Blood Green said:Oldbear83 said:
In simple terms, this post is an excuse.
No greater victim than a conservative who wants rules for you but not for themselves.
Can you name a single instance of a radical regressive speaker or event being cancelled due to conservative violence or threats?
So, a security plan is needed?
Harrison Bergeron said:Mitch Blood Green said:Oldbear83 said:
In simple terms, this post is an excuse.
No greater victim than a conservative who wants rules for you but not for themselves.
Can you name a single instance of a radical regressive speaker or event being cancelled due to conservative violence or threats?
If the security requirements were more than other similar type events in the same venue, then there could be an issue of perceived problems.
However, most large gatherings have a security requirement based on the size of the event and venue. Had to pay for two security officers being present for a choral concert event in a 1000 seat venue. Not an unusual thing even if the likelihood of a riot at a choir concert is pretty low.
If the student organization didn't plan for that, it might have busted their budget or the ability to hire security for the event.
Mitch Blood Green said:Harrison Bergeron said:Mitch Blood Green said:Oldbear83 said:
In simple terms, this post is an excuse.
No greater victim than a conservative who wants rules for you but not for themselves.
Can you name a single instance of a radical regressive speaker or event being cancelled due to conservative violence or threats?
So, a security plan is needed?
Yes … one of the speakers had a security rider. And Baylor regularly has security for all events hosted on campus.
Mitch Blood Green said:Harrison Bergeron said:Mitch Blood Green said:Oldbear83 said:
In simple terms, this post is an excuse.
No greater victim than a conservative who wants rules for you but not for themselves.
Can you name a single instance of a radical regressive speaker or event being cancelled due to conservative violence or threats?
So, a security plan is needed?
I cannot tell if Kim Klan Crawford is obtuse or illiterate.
EatMoreSalmon said:Harrison Bergeron said:Mitch Blood Green said:Oldbear83 said:
In simple terms, this post is an excuse.
No greater victim than a conservative who wants rules for you but not for themselves.
Can you name a single instance of a radical regressive speaker or event being cancelled due to conservative violence or threats?
If the security requirements were more than other similar type events in the same venue, then there could be an issue of perceived problems.
However, most large gatherings have a security requirement based on the size of the event and venue. Had to pay for two security officers being present for a choral concert event in a 1000 seat venue. Not an unusual thing even if the likelihood of a riot at a choir concert is pretty low.
If the student organization didn't plan for that, it might have busted their budget or the ability to hire security for the event.
Understand but to quote not fake Greggo - "that wasn't the question."
Bestweekeverr said:Redbrickbear said:Bestweekeverr said:Mr. Sippi said:jason_cook said:
The Ratio Christi fall event was postponed by the student organization due to security costs, which per Baylor University policy are the responsibility of the hosting organization.
University policies for student-led events require submission of documentation well in advance to determine the support needed to ensure a safe, caring and educational environment for all students, faculty and staff. Ratio Christi did not submit this documentation as requested by University staff on several occasions. As a result, security costs associated with Waco Hall could not be determined until late in the planning process. Upon receipt of the full security estimate, the student organization decided to postpone, rather than work with campus leaders to identify a different and possibly less expensive location.
We understand this is a disappointing outcome for those who were scheduled to speak and attend, and campus leaders stand ready to support our Ratio Christi student leaders on another event in the future, provided appropriate info is shared in a timely manner.
As an academic institution, Baylor is committed to ensuring open dialogue and the robust exchange of ideas and perspectives. We hold this commitment along with an obligation to provide a safe and nurturing educational environment within a caring Christian community.
Thanks, Jason. I'm disappointed that the event was not able to be held as scheduled and maybe it will be at another time. I'm also disappointed that the blame is being assigned to a student organization whose purpose is to promote why we as Christians believe what we believe - which is exactly what I would think Baylor would want to promote. It's unfortunate that Baylor could not offer support to this group and help pull off the event.
I understand the need to appear being fair to all groups, but when Baylor University cannot find a way to share the gospel with those that need to hear it makes me sad.
I know that the world has changed a lot since I graduated from Baylor 40 years ago - it's a shame that Baylor has felt the need to change along with it.
I look forward to hearing Frank's side of the story on Friday.
Why is it Baylor's fault that the student org messed up and didn't submit the required documentation on time?
Sounds like he has more issues with the administration than just a misunderstanding about a time request on documents…
"There's too much information to share in this email or in a social media post, so I'll be revealing the full story, as well as exposing other corruption happening right now at Baylor, on Friday's podcast. So stay tuned
In the meantime, please note that this event has been postponed until further notice.
Blessings,
Dr. Frank Turek"
I'm sure he'll spin a tale about he's the victim in all this. I'm trusting Jason over this guy I've never heard of.
You need to get out more. Frank Turek is well known in Christian apologetic circles so that makes you look really bad/ignorant to claim you've never heard of him.
Did Turek ever post his side of the story?
There was some talk about him having something to say Friday I believe.....
There was some talk about him having something to say Friday I believe.....
The wokie okie wont allow that
Yep, he posted his podcast today and tore Baylor a new one. He said in 20 years he's never felt extorted like at Baylor
He said at 4:57pm on Friday (event was Monday) they emailed his group and tripled their security costs. The limited the event size and prevented them from advertising on campus. He mentioned some other things too but pretty embarrassing on Baylor's part. Baylor should be begging Christian speakers like this to come to campus and encourage every student to engage, learn and ask questions.
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/i-dont-have-enough-faith-to-be-an-atheist/id1297439270?i=1000794443762
He said at 4:57pm on Friday (event was Monday) they emailed his group and tripled their security costs. The limited the event size and prevented them from advertising on campus. He mentioned some other things too but pretty embarrassing on Baylor's part. Baylor should be begging Christian speakers like this to come to campus and encourage every student to engage, learn and ask questions.
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/i-dont-have-enough-faith-to-be-an-atheist/id1297439270?i=1000794443762
And we're accepting what he says as 100% fact? No nuance allowed at all?BUpharm12 said:
Yep, he posted his podcast today and tore Baylor a new one. He said in 20 years he's never felt extorted like at Baylor
He said at 4:57pm on Friday (event was Monday) they emailed his group and tripled their security costs. The limited the event size and prevented them from advertising on campus. He mentioned some other things too but pretty embarrassing on Baylor's part. Baylor should be begging Christian speakers like this to come to campus and encourage every student to engage, learn and ask questions.
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/i-dont-have-enough-faith-to-be-an-atheist/id1297439270?i=1000794443762
BUpharm12 said:
Yep, he posted his podcast today and tore Baylor a new one. He said in 20 years he's never felt extorted like at Baylor
He said at 4:57pm on Friday (event was Monday) they emailed his group and tripled their security costs. The limited the event size and prevented them from advertising on campus. He mentioned some other things too but pretty embarrassing on Baylor's part. Baylor should be begging Christian speakers like this to come to campus and encourage every student to engage, learn and ask questions.
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/i-dont-have-enough-faith-to-be-an-atheist/id1297439270?i=1000794443762
So, on Friday at 5:00 pm, he hadn't advertised a Monday event?
His is one of the most well known Christian apologetics speakers right now and makes a living speaking on Christian and liberal campuses. What would be his incentive to make anything up? Sure, there was some miscommunication but Baylor didn't seem to handle it well
I'm paraphrasing, he lists the exact complaints within the first 10 minutes. One of the other speakers with him wasn't allowed to do any table events during the day to help advertise the event on campus
If it was a rainbow speaker none of these "mixups" would have occured. Yall know it , I know it, and God knows it .
Based on the bulletpoints of the podcast, it sounds like he was always planning to do a hitjob on Baylor.
Or maybe he legitimately feels disrespected and just decided to read the list of progressive-leaning actions Baylor has taken over the years. The questionable Christian actions of the university faculty/leadership are well documented even in this forum so it's a pretty easy list to read from
Bestweekeverr said:
Based on the bulletpoints of the podcast, it sounds like he was always planning to do a hitjob on Baylor.
The Baylor administration deserves to be challenged on all those points. And it might also explain why the Baylor admin decided to triple the fees and put on other restrictions because they were afraid of such criticism. Not a good look for them to be so thin skinned and afraid of dissenting opinions.
BUpharm12 said:
Yep, he posted his podcast today and tore Baylor a new one. He said in 20 years he's never felt extorted like at Baylor
He said at 4:57pm on Friday (event was Monday) they emailed his group and tripled their security costs. The limited the event size and prevented them from advertising on campus. He mentioned some other things too but pretty embarrassing on Baylor's part. Baylor should be begging Christian speakers like this to come to campus and encourage every student to engage, learn and ask questions.
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/i-dont-have-enough-faith-to-be-an-atheist/id1297439270?i=1000794443762
Thanks BUpharm
I will give it a listen when I have a few moments and see what he has to say on the matter
BaylorFTW said:Bestweekeverr said:
Based on the bulletpoints of the podcast, it sounds like he was always planning to do a hitjob on Baylor.
The Baylor administration deserves to be challenged on all those points. And it might also explain why the Baylor admin decided to triple the fees and put on other restrictions because they were afraid of such criticism. Not a good look for them to be so thin skinned and afraid of dissenting opinions.
Exactly right and pretty obvious
So I watched Turek's talk on Baylor. It sounds like he was just going to give his usual "I Don't Have Enough Faith To Be An Atheist" talk which goes through some arguments for justifying Christianity and then takes questions from students and other attendees. So it appears he did not intent to talk on the 6 bad acts by the Baylor administration.
Another problem is the timing where the Baylor admin allowed Talarico to come on (presumably unmolested) but put up unnecessary barriers on Frank who is a conservative Christian. This looks really bad with the election looming as it looks like the Baylor administration is playing favorites rather than creating the fair environment for all they claim to justify when they want to include liberal voices.
Another problem is the timing where the Baylor admin allowed Talarico to come on (presumably unmolested) but put up unnecessary barriers on Frank who is a conservative Christian. This looks really bad with the election looming as it looks like the Baylor administration is playing favorites rather than creating the fair environment for all they claim to justify when they want to include liberal voices.