I don't how much more. I can't run the numbers. I am pointing out the hypocrisy "The poor are freeloaders." Well guess what the rich freeload.

YoakDaddy said:

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J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

Waco1947 said:

---

I don't how much more. I can't run the numbers. I am pointing out the hypocrisy "The poor are freeloaders." Well guess what the rich freeload.

---

please explain to me how so without cutting and pasting excerpts from biased sources. I gave you facts: the "rich" pay nearly 90% of the tax bill and their effective tax rate is the highest. Give me facts.

J.R. said:

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YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

Good luck with that line of reasoning.

Canada2017 said:

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YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

Good luck with that line of reasoning.

---

Solid reasoning demonstrated by the fact that if I don't pay my taxes, I go to jail. It's theft. Gangsters called it "protection"; the Rainbow Coalition called it a "shakedown" 30 years ago; our government calls it "taxation".

Waco1947 said:

---

I don't how much more. I can't run the numbers. I am pointing out the hypocrisy "The poor are freeloaders." Well guess what the rich freeload.

---

Why do you deserve to benefit from a greater portion of the Rich's taxes than they from yours?

Doc Holliday said:

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Waco1947 said:

---

I don't how much more. I can't run the numbers. I am pointing out the hypocrisy "The poor are freeloaders." Well guess what the rich freeload.

---

Why do you deserve to benefit from a greater portion of the Rich's taxes than they from yours?

---

You're obviously missing the point. 47 doesn't want to work harder or change careers to one that is more valued in the market. He just simply wants his outstretched hands to be filled. As 47 mentioned everyone who is "rich" is cheating the poor out of free money. The "rich" all scam, find loopholes and cheat the system by buying politicians and laws that only benefit them. Of course, we must all remember that there is no definition for "rich." "Rich" is simply everyone who earns more money than 47.

CSIBear said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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Waco1947 said:

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I don't how much more. I can't run the numbers. I am pointing out the hypocrisy "The poor are freeloaders." Well guess what the rich freeload.

---

Why do you deserve to benefit from a greater portion of the Rich's taxes than they from yours?

---

47 doesn't want to work harder or change careers to one that is more valued in the market. He just simply wants his outstretched hands to be filled.

Of course, we must all remember that there is no definition for "rich." "Rich" is simply everyone who earns more money than 47.

---

chuckle

Not sure how ol 47 can ignore or deflect the accuracy of your comments.

But reality does have a way of bouncing off his forehead.

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

You drive on roads that taxes pay for. You live in a society protected by police that taxes pay for. If your house catches fire, firefighters that taxes pay for will come help you. Every day you use a service or benefit from services that are part of being citizens of this great country. If you don't pay your share of taxes, you are stealing from everyone else that does.

I'm with you that taxes need to be controlled, but you almost seem to imply all taxes are theft. I don't think that's the case, just excessive taxes.

contrario said:

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YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

You drive on roads that taxes pay for. You live in a society protected by police that taxes pay for. If your house catches fire, firefighters that taxes pay for will come help you. Every day you use a service or benefit from services that are part of being citizens of this great country. If you don't pay your share of taxes, you are stealing from everyone else that does.

I'm with you that taxes need to be controlled, but you almost seem to imply all taxes are theft. I don't think that's the case, just excessive taxes.

---

Roads, police, firefighting, etc....the use of those services does not indicate that I agree with paying for them. I made no contract to use them. Did you sign a contract? In fact, the government forces you to pay for them regardless of use. Compulsory tax payments under threat of jail is theft.

"Forces you?" You're a damn citizen. Act like one.

Your home insurance company damn well wants a fire department and a water department and roads to get your your house. Geez what silliness. Contract? You are a damn citizen. Your neighbor's house catches fire and spreads to yours? Lord help us us.

Waco1947 said:

---

"Forces you?" You're a damn citizen. Act like one.

---

If local taxes aren't paid, the sheriff ends up with my house; if I don't pay federal income tax, the penalty is jail time. That's compulsory payment of taxes with consequences if they're not paid. That's theft of my private property. I wouldn't expect you understand that because you've got an entitlement mentality.

YoakDaddy said:

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contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

You drive on roads that taxes pay for. You live in a society protected by police that taxes pay for. If your house catches fire, firefighters that taxes pay for will come help you. Every day you use a service or benefit from services that are part of being citizens of this great country. If you don't pay your share of taxes, you are stealing from everyone else that does.

I'm with you that taxes need to be controlled, but you almost seem to imply all taxes are theft. I don't think that's the case, just excessive taxes.

---

Roads, police, firefighting, etc....the use of those services does not indicate that I agree with paying for them. I made no contract to use them. Did you sign a contract? In fact, the government forces you to pay for them regardless of use. Compulsory tax payments under threat of jail is theft.

---

But you do use the services. If you use them and don't pay for them, that is theft. If you don't want to enjoy the services the US offers to its citizens, move to another country. No one is forcing you to stay here. The fact that as an adult you continue to use and enjoy the benefits of being a US citizen is an implied acceptance of payment for those services. I agree the payments are forced on you, but if you don't want police protection, fire protection, good roads, some of the best infrastructure in the world and a free economy that benefits from all of those services, then move to a country that doesn't offer these basics. Seriously, no one is keeping you here. GTFO

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

You drive on roads that taxes pay for. You live in a society protected by police that taxes pay for. If your house catches fire, firefighters that taxes pay for will come help you. Every day you use a service or benefit from services that are part of being citizens of this great country. If you don't pay your share of taxes, you are stealing from everyone else that does.

I'm with you that taxes need to be controlled, but you almost seem to imply all taxes are theft. I don't think that's the case, just excessive taxes.

---

Roads, police, firefighting, etc....the use of those services does not indicate that I agree with paying for them. I made no contract to use them. Did you sign a contract? In fact, the government forces you to pay for them regardless of use. Compulsory tax payments under threat of jail is theft.

---

But you do use the services. If you use them and don't pay for them, that is theft. If you don't want to enjoy the services the US offers to its citizens, move to another country. No one is forcing you to stay here. The fact that as an adult you continue to use and enjoy the benefits of being a US citizen is an implied acceptance of payment for those services. I agree the payments are forced on you, but if you don't want police protection, fire protection, good roads, some of the best infrastructure in the world and a free economy that benefits from all of those services, then move to a country that doesn't offer these basics. Seriously, no one is keeping you here. GTFO

---

You act as if there's a financial or social contract for citizenship. I didn't sign one when I was born. Did you? The mere fact that you told me to GTFO is not a debate point and means you have zero comprehension as to the concept of private property.

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

You drive on roads that taxes pay for. You live in a society protected by police that taxes pay for. If your house catches fire, firefighters that taxes pay for will come help you. Every day you use a service or benefit from services that are part of being citizens of this great country. If you don't pay your share of taxes, you are stealing from everyone else that does.

I'm with you that taxes need to be controlled, but you almost seem to imply all taxes are theft. I don't think that's the case, just excessive taxes.

---

Roads, police, firefighting, etc....the use of those services does not indicate that I agree with paying for them. I made no contract to use them. Did you sign a contract? In fact, the government forces you to pay for them regardless of use. Compulsory tax payments under threat of jail is theft.

---

But you do use the services. If you use them and don't pay for them, that is theft. If you don't want to enjoy the services the US offers to its citizens, move to another country. No one is forcing you to stay here. The fact that as an adult you continue to use and enjoy the benefits of being a US citizen is an implied acceptance of payment for those services. I agree the payments are forced on you, but if you don't want police protection, fire protection, good roads, some of the best infrastructure in the world and a free economy that benefits from all of those services, then move to a country that doesn't offer these basics. Seriously, no one is keeping you here. GTFO

---

You act as if there's a financial or social contract for citizenship. I didn't sign one when I was born. Did you? The mere fact that you told me to GTFO is not a debate point and means you have zero comprehension as to the concept of private property.

---

There is an implied social contract. And if you don't agree with the terms, then leave. The fact that you think it's ok to freeload, use public services and you shouldn't have to pay for them means you have zero comprehension of personal responsibility or social responsibility that is needed to make a society work. If you don't want to pay for the services offered by a society, that is fine, but don't live under the roof of said society if you don't want to chip in.

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

You drive on roads that taxes pay for. You live in a society protected by police that taxes pay for. If your house catches fire, firefighters that taxes pay for will come help you. Every day you use a service or benefit from services that are part of being citizens of this great country. If you don't pay your share of taxes, you are stealing from everyone else that does.

I'm with you that taxes need to be controlled, but you almost seem to imply all taxes are theft. I don't think that's the case, just excessive taxes.

---

Roads, police, firefighting, etc....the use of those services does not indicate that I agree with paying for them. I made no contract to use them. Did you sign a contract? In fact, the government forces you to pay for them regardless of use. Compulsory tax payments under threat of jail is theft.

---

But you do use the services. If you use them and don't pay for them, that is theft. If you don't want to enjoy the services the US offers to its citizens, move to another country. No one is forcing you to stay here. The fact that as an adult you continue to use and enjoy the benefits of being a US citizen is an implied acceptance of payment for those services. I agree the payments are forced on you, but if you don't want police protection, fire protection, good roads, some of the best infrastructure in the world and a free economy that benefits from all of those services, then move to a country that doesn't offer these basics. Seriously, no one is keeping you here. GTFO

---

You act as if there's a financial or social contract for citizenship. I didn't sign one when I was born. Did you? The mere fact that you told me to GTFO is not a debate point and means you have zero comprehension as to the concept of private property.

---

There is an implied social contract. And if you don't agree with the terms, then leave. The fact that you think it's ok to freeload, use public services and you shouldn't have to pay for them means you have zero comprehension of personal responsibility or social responsibility that is needed to make a society work. If you don't want to pay for the services offered by a society, that is fine, but don't live under the roof of said society if you don't want to chip in.

---

There is no contract implied or otherwise because there is coercion. Did you negotiate and sign a social or any other contract at birth? The government forces citizens to pay taxes regardless of whether they use or do not use those services; therefore, the fact that you use government services does not indicate anything about an agreement to pay taxes. The resulting failure to pay is further confiscation of property thereby demonstrating coercion. The use of services might imply agreement to pay for those services if people who didn't use the services were not required to pay. Arguing that a social contract is legitimate because it is imposed on you which makes it legitimate is circular logic.

YoakDaddy said:

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Waco1947 said:

---

"Forces you?" You're a damn citizen. Act like one.

---

If local taxes aren't paid, the sheriff ends up with my house; if I don't pay federal income tax, the penalty is jail time. That's compulsory payment of taxes with consequences if they're not paid. That's theft of my private property. I wouldn't expect you understand that because you've got an entitlement mentality.

---

. Silliness. You are a citizen. Like somewhere else without taxes. But here we tax and I am thankful.

YoakDaddy said:

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contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

You drive on roads that taxes pay for. You live in a society protected by police that taxes pay for. If your house catches fire, firefighters that taxes pay for will come help you. Every day you use a service or benefit from services that are part of being citizens of this great country. If you don't pay your share of taxes, you are stealing from everyone else that does.

I'm with you that taxes need to be controlled, but you almost seem to imply all taxes are theft. I don't think that's the case, just excessive taxes.

---

Roads, police, firefighting, etc....the use of those services does not indicate that I agree with paying for them. I made no contract to use them. Did you sign a contract? In fact, the government forces you to pay for them regardless of use. Compulsory tax payments under threat of jail is theft.

---

We all did. Not us but those before us. Those we elected.

Your reasoning indicates you didn't sign on to taxes (17th amendment). You also didn't sign on to the first or second or third or any other Amendment (or the constitution).

I'd like to hear your reasoning to the "rights of property". Is that enforced by law? Is that law settled in a tax payer court? Is there a deed system?

YoakDaddy said:

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contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

You drive on roads that taxes pay for. You live in a society protected by police that taxes pay for. If your house catches fire, firefighters that taxes pay for will come help you. Every day you use a service or benefit from services that are part of being citizens of this great country. If you don't pay your share of taxes, you are stealing from everyone else that does.

I'm with you that taxes need to be controlled, but you almost seem to imply all taxes are theft. I don't think that's the case, just excessive taxes.

---

Roads, police, firefighting, etc....the use of those services does not indicate that I agree with paying for them. I made no contract to use them. Did you sign a contract? In fact, the government forces you to pay for them regardless of use. Compulsory tax payments under threat of jail is theft.

---

But you do use the services. If you use them and don't pay for them, that is theft. If you don't want to enjoy the services the US offers to its citizens, move to another country. No one is forcing you to stay here. The fact that as an adult you continue to use and enjoy the benefits of being a US citizen is an implied acceptance of payment for those services. I agree the payments are forced on you, but if you don't want police protection, fire protection, good roads, some of the best infrastructure in the world and a free economy that benefits from all of those services, then move to a country that doesn't offer these basics. Seriously, no one is keeping you here. GTFO

---

You act as if there's a financial or social contract for citizenship. I didn't sign one when I was born. Did you? The mere fact that you told me to GTFO is not a debate point and means you have zero comprehension as to the concept of private property.

---

There is an implied social contract. And if you don't agree with the terms, then leave. The fact that you think it's ok to freeload, use public services and you shouldn't have to pay for them means you have zero comprehension of personal responsibility or social responsibility that is needed to make a society work. If you don't want to pay for the services offered by a society, that is fine, but don't live under the roof of said society if you don't want to chip in.

---

There is no contract implied or otherwise because there is coercion. Did you negotiate and sign a social or any other contract at birth? The government forces citizens to pay taxes regardless of whether they use or do not use those services; therefore, the fact that you use government services does not indicate anything about an agreement to pay taxes. The resulting failure to pay is further confiscation of property thereby demonstrating coercion. The use of services might imply agreement to pay for those services if people who didn't use the services were not required to pay. Arguing that a social contract is legitimate because it is imposed on you which makes it legitimate is circular logic.

---

The fact that you think it's ok to enjoy the benefits of living in the US, which includes the protection of other rights that you didn't contractually agree to, indicates your ignorance of personal responsibility and it illustrates your disrespect for other's personal property.

Again, you may have been born into this and forced into this society, but you could have left this society at any point in your adult life to pursue a society that fits your values better. But you didn't. So you entered into an assumed contract by your actions.

contrario said:

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YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

You drive on roads that taxes pay for. You live in a society protected by police that taxes pay for. If your house catches fire, firefighters that taxes pay for will come help you. Every day you use a service or benefit from services that are part of being citizens of this great country. If you don't pay your share of taxes, you are stealing from everyone else that does.

I'm with you that taxes need to be controlled, but you almost seem to imply all taxes are theft. I don't think that's the case, just excessive taxes.

---

Roads, police, firefighting, etc....the use of those services does not indicate that I agree with paying for them. I made no contract to use them. Did you sign a contract? In fact, the government forces you to pay for them regardless of use. Compulsory tax payments under threat of jail is theft.

---

But you do use the services. If you use them and don't pay for them, that is theft. If you don't want to enjoy the services the US offers to its citizens, move to another country. No one is forcing you to stay here. The fact that as an adult you continue to use and enjoy the benefits of being a US citizen is an implied acceptance of payment for those services. I agree the payments are forced on you, but if you don't want police protection, fire protection, good roads, some of the best infrastructure in the world and a free economy that benefits from all of those services, then move to a country that doesn't offer these basics. Seriously, no one is keeping you here. GTFO

---

You act as if there's a financial or social contract for citizenship. I didn't sign one when I was born. Did you? The mere fact that you told me to GTFO is not a debate point and means you have zero comprehension as to the concept of private property.

---

There is an implied social contract. And if you don't agree with the terms, then leave. The fact that you think it's ok to freeload, use public services and you shouldn't have to pay for them means you have zero comprehension of personal responsibility or social responsibility that is needed to make a society work. If you don't want to pay for the services offered by a society, that is fine, but don't live under the roof of said society if you don't want to chip in.

---

There is no contract implied or otherwise because there is coercion. Did you negotiate and sign a social or any other contract at birth? The government forces citizens to pay taxes regardless of whether they use or do not use those services; therefore, the fact that you use government services does not indicate anything about an agreement to pay taxes. The resulting failure to pay is further confiscation of property thereby demonstrating coercion. The use of services might imply agreement to pay for those services if people who didn't use the services were not required to pay. Arguing that a social contract is legitimate because it is imposed on you which makes it legitimate is circular logic.

---

The fact that you think it's ok to enjoy the benefits of living in the US, which includes the protection of other rights that you didn't contractually agree to, indicates your ignorance of personal responsibility and it illustrates your disrespect for other's personal property.

Again, you may have been born into this and forced into this society, but you could have left this society at any point in your adult life to pursue a society that fits your values better. But you didn't. So you entered into an assumed contract by your actions.

---

So we pay for our rights? I didn't know we had to pay for the natural right of free speech, religion, etc. by paying taxes. Where did I state that it was ok to live in the US without paying taxes? Please quote that back to me. That is your assumption. I merely stated that taxation was theft then provided sound logic behind it and you went triggered. Which others' personal property did I disrespect? Have I used someone else's personal property and not reimbursed them? I've paid my taxes under our coercive system, yet merely stated that the payment is theft then provided sound logic behind it. Did I advocate not being responsible and not paying taxes? I never did that either, yet you assumed I did.

Your logic is circular once again because one cannot assume to enter into a contract social or otherwise merely by being born. How did you negotiate and agree to that when you could not yet speak or write? I'd tell you to read up on private property from Locke, but your comprehension of my statements is lacking so it's best you shouldn't.

YoakDaddy said:

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contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

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Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

You drive on roads that taxes pay for. You live in a society protected by police that taxes pay for. If your house catches fire, firefighters that taxes pay for will come help you. Every day you use a service or benefit from services that are part of being citizens of this great country. If you don't pay your share of taxes, you are stealing from everyone else that does.

I'm with you that taxes need to be controlled, but you almost seem to imply all taxes are theft. I don't think that's the case, just excessive taxes.

---

Roads, police, firefighting, etc....the use of those services does not indicate that I agree with paying for them. I made no contract to use them. Did you sign a contract? In fact, the government forces you to pay for them regardless of use. Compulsory tax payments under threat of jail is theft.

---

But you do use the services. If you use them and don't pay for them, that is theft. If you don't want to enjoy the services the US offers to its citizens, move to another country. No one is forcing you to stay here. The fact that as an adult you continue to use and enjoy the benefits of being a US citizen is an implied acceptance of payment for those services. I agree the payments are forced on you, but if you don't want police protection, fire protection, good roads, some of the best infrastructure in the world and a free economy that benefits from all of those services, then move to a country that doesn't offer these basics. Seriously, no one is keeping you here. GTFO

---

You act as if there's a financial or social contract for citizenship. I didn't sign one when I was born. Did you? The mere fact that you told me to GTFO is not a debate point and means you have zero comprehension as to the concept of private property.

---

There is an implied social contract. And if you don't agree with the terms, then leave. The fact that you think it's ok to freeload, use public services and you shouldn't have to pay for them means you have zero comprehension of personal responsibility or social responsibility that is needed to make a society work. If you don't want to pay for the services offered by a society, that is fine, but don't live under the roof of said society if you don't want to chip in.

---

There is no contract implied or otherwise because there is coercion. Did you negotiate and sign a social or any other contract at birth? The government forces citizens to pay taxes regardless of whether they use or do not use those services; therefore, the fact that you use government services does not indicate anything about an agreement to pay taxes. The resulting failure to pay is further confiscation of property thereby demonstrating coercion. The use of services might imply agreement to pay for those services if people who didn't use the services were not required to pay. Arguing that a social contract is legitimate because it is imposed on you which makes it legitimate is circular logic.

---

The fact that you think it's ok to enjoy the benefits of living in the US, which includes the protection of other rights that you didn't contractually agree to, indicates your ignorance of personal responsibility and it illustrates your disrespect for other's personal property.

Again, you may have been born into this and forced into this society, but you could have left this society at any point in your adult life to pursue a society that fits your values better. But you didn't. So you entered into an assumed contract by your actions.

---

So we pay for our rights? I didn't know we had to pay for the natural right of free speech, religion, etc. by paying taxes. Where did I state that it was ok to live in the US without paying taxes? Please quote that back to me. That is your assumption. I merely stated that taxation was theft then provided sound logic behind it and you went triggered. Which others' personal property did I disrespect? Have I used someone else's personal property and not reimbursed them? I've paid my taxes under our coercive system, yet merely stated that the payment is theft then provided sound logic behind it. Did I advocate not being responsible and not paying taxes? I never did that either, yet you assumed I did.

Your logic is circular once again because one cannot assume to enter into a contract social or otherwise merely by being born. How did you negotiate and agree to that when you could not yet speak or write? I'd tell you to read up on private property from Locke, but your comprehension of my statements is lacking so it's best you shouldn't.

---

I can play that game too. Where did I say you had to pay taxes in order to have those rights. Show me one place I said that. Show me one time I said you didn't pay taxes. Just one. Jeez, you and your strawman arguments.

My point, as part of being a citizen of the US, you are guaranteed the protection of certain rights. You didn't sign a contract to have those rights guaranteed, but they are there. Please show me the piece of paper that you signed when you were born that guaranteed your right to free speech. And the answer is you didn't. But it is still part of the implied contract that is part of being a citizen of the US. The same document and it's amenments that guarantee those rights also allow the US to tax you. If you don't agree with these assume contractual terms, leave. Because you can't pick and choose which provisions of the assumed contract you are going to follow. That isn't how a society works.

contrario said:

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YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

You drive on roads that taxes pay for. You live in a society protected by police that taxes pay for. If your house catches fire, firefighters that taxes pay for will come help you. Every day you use a service or benefit from services that are part of being citizens of this great country. If you don't pay your share of taxes, you are stealing from everyone else that does.

I'm with you that taxes need to be controlled, but you almost seem to imply all taxes are theft. I don't think that's the case, just excessive taxes.

---

Roads, police, firefighting, etc....the use of those services does not indicate that I agree with paying for them. I made no contract to use them. Did you sign a contract? In fact, the government forces you to pay for them regardless of use. Compulsory tax payments under threat of jail is theft.

---

But you do use the services. If you use them and don't pay for them, that is theft. If you don't want to enjoy the services the US offers to its citizens, move to another country. No one is forcing you to stay here. The fact that as an adult you continue to use and enjoy the benefits of being a US citizen is an implied acceptance of payment for those services. I agree the payments are forced on you, but if you don't want police protection, fire protection, good roads, some of the best infrastructure in the world and a free economy that benefits from all of those services, then move to a country that doesn't offer these basics. Seriously, no one is keeping you here. GTFO

---

You act as if there's a financial or social contract for citizenship. I didn't sign one when I was born. Did you? The mere fact that you told me to GTFO is not a debate point and means you have zero comprehension as to the concept of private property.

---

There is an implied social contract. And if you don't agree with the terms, then leave. The fact that you think it's ok to freeload, use public services and you shouldn't have to pay for them means you have zero comprehension of personal responsibility or social responsibility that is needed to make a society work. If you don't want to pay for the services offered by a society, that is fine, but don't live under the roof of said society if you don't want to chip in.

---

There is no contract implied or otherwise because there is coercion. Did you negotiate and sign a social or any other contract at birth? The government forces citizens to pay taxes regardless of whether they use or do not use those services; therefore, the fact that you use government services does not indicate anything about an agreement to pay taxes. The resulting failure to pay is further confiscation of property thereby demonstrating coercion. The use of services might imply agreement to pay for those services if people who didn't use the services were not required to pay. Arguing that a social contract is legitimate because it is imposed on you which makes it legitimate is circular logic.

---

The fact that you think it's ok to enjoy the benefits of living in the US, which includes the protection of other rights that you didn't contractually agree to, indicates your ignorance of personal responsibility and it illustrates your disrespect for other's personal property.

Again, you may have been born into this and forced into this society, but you could have left this society at any point in your adult life to pursue a society that fits your values better. But you didn't. So you entered into an assumed contract by your actions.

---

So we pay for our rights? I didn't know we had to pay for the natural right of free speech, religion, etc. by paying taxes. Where did I state that it was ok to live in the US without paying taxes? Please quote that back to me. That is your assumption. I merely stated that taxation was theft then provided sound logic behind it and you went triggered. Which others' personal property did I disrespect? Have I used someone else's personal property and not reimbursed them? I've paid my taxes under our coercive system, yet merely stated that the payment is theft then provided sound logic behind it. Did I advocate not being responsible and not paying taxes? I never did that either, yet you assumed I did.

Your logic is circular once again because one cannot assume to enter into a contract social or otherwise merely by being born. How did you negotiate and agree to that when you could not yet speak or write? I'd tell you to read up on private property from Locke, but your comprehension of my statements is lacking so it's best you shouldn't.

---

I can play that game too. Where did I say you had to pay taxes in order to have those rights. Show me one place I said that. Show me one time I said you didn't pay taxes. Just one. Jeez, you and your strawman arguments.

My point, as part of being a citizen of the US, you are guaranteed the protection of certain rights. You didn't sign a contract to have those rights guaranteed, but they are there. Please show me the piece of paper that you signed when you were born that guaranteed your right to free speech. And the answer is you didn't. But it is still part of the implied contract that is part of being a citizen of the US. The same document and it's amenments that guarantee those rights also allow the US to tax you. If you don't agree with these assume contractual terms, leave. Because you can't pick and choose which provisions of the assumed contract you are going to follow. That isn't how a society works.

---

You really don't understand the concept of natural rights, property rights. There is no piece of paper because our rights come naturally from God whereas your implied social contract originates from man. There is no paper contract with God for the natural rights given (I could make an argument for freedom as a believing Christian though) just like there is no implied social contract with government to pay taxes by virtue of simply being born here. The mere idea that an implied social contract is legitimate because it is imposed upon you is circular reasoning; therefore, taxation is theft.

BTW...I do love living here. It's a good trade despite the incorrect basis and ignorance of natural rights, property rights.

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

That wan't the question. Please answer.

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

You drive on roads that taxes pay for. You live in a society protected by police that taxes pay for. If your house catches fire, firefighters that taxes pay for will come help you. Every day you use a service or benefit from services that are part of being citizens of this great country. If you don't pay your share of taxes, you are stealing from everyone else that does.

I'm with you that taxes need to be controlled, but you almost seem to imply all taxes are theft. I don't think that's the case, just excessive taxes.

---

Roads, police, firefighting, etc....the use of those services does not indicate that I agree with paying for them. I made no contract to use them. Did you sign a contract? In fact, the government forces you to pay for them regardless of use. Compulsory tax payments under threat of jail is theft.

---

But you do use the services. If you use them and don't pay for them, that is theft. If you don't want to enjoy the services the US offers to its citizens, move to another country. No one is forcing you to stay here. The fact that as an adult you continue to use and enjoy the benefits of being a US citizen is an implied acceptance of payment for those services. I agree the payments are forced on you, but if you don't want police protection, fire protection, good roads, some of the best infrastructure in the world and a free economy that benefits from all of those services, then move to a country that doesn't offer these basics. Seriously, no one is keeping you here. GTFO

---

You act as if there's a financial or social contract for citizenship. I didn't sign one when I was born. Did you? The mere fact that you told me to GTFO is not a debate point and means you have zero comprehension as to the concept of private property.

---

There is an implied social contract. And if you don't agree with the terms, then leave. The fact that you think it's ok to freeload, use public services and you shouldn't have to pay for them means you have zero comprehension of personal responsibility or social responsibility that is needed to make a society work. If you don't want to pay for the services offered by a society, that is fine, but don't live under the roof of said society if you don't want to chip in.

---

There is no contract implied or otherwise because there is coercion. Did you negotiate and sign a social or any other contract at birth? The government forces citizens to pay taxes regardless of whether they use or do not use those services; therefore, the fact that you use government services does not indicate anything about an agreement to pay taxes. The resulting failure to pay is further confiscation of property thereby demonstrating coercion. The use of services might imply agreement to pay for those services if people who didn't use the services were not required to pay. Arguing that a social contract is legitimate because it is imposed on you which makes it legitimate is circular logic.

---

The fact that you think it's ok to enjoy the benefits of living in the US, which includes the protection of other rights that you didn't contractually agree to, indicates your ignorance of personal responsibility and it illustrates your disrespect for other's personal property.

Again, you may have been born into this and forced into this society, but you could have left this society at any point in your adult life to pursue a society that fits your values better. But you didn't. So you entered into an assumed contract by your actions.

---

So we pay for our rights? I didn't know we had to pay for the natural right of free speech, religion, etc. by paying taxes. Where did I state that it was ok to live in the US without paying taxes? Please quote that back to me. That is your assumption. I merely stated that taxation was theft then provided sound logic behind it and you went triggered. Which others' personal property did I disrespect? Have I used someone else's personal property and not reimbursed them? I've paid my taxes under our coercive system, yet merely stated that the payment is theft then provided sound logic behind it. Did I advocate not being responsible and not paying taxes? I never did that either, yet you assumed I did.

Your logic is circular once again because one cannot assume to enter into a contract social or otherwise merely by being born. How did you negotiate and agree to that when you could not yet speak or write? I'd tell you to read up on private property from Locke, but your comprehension of my statements is lacking so it's best you shouldn't.

---

I can play that game too. Where did I say you had to pay taxes in order to have those rights. Show me one place I said that. Show me one time I said you didn't pay taxes. Just one. Jeez, you and your strawman arguments.

My point, as part of being a citizen of the US, you are guaranteed the protection of certain rights. You didn't sign a contract to have those rights guaranteed, but they are there. Please show me the piece of paper that you signed when you were born that guaranteed your right to free speech. And the answer is you didn't. But it is still part of the implied contract that is part of being a citizen of the US. The same document and it's amenments that guarantee those rights also allow the US to tax you. If you don't agree with these assume contractual terms, leave. Because you can't pick and choose which provisions of the assumed contract you are going to follow. That isn't how a society works.

---

You really don't understand the concept of natural rights, property rights. There is no piece of paper because our rights come naturally from God whereas your implied social contract originates from man. There is no paper contract with God for the natural rights given (I could make an argument for freedom as a believing Christian though) just like there is no implied social contract with government to pay taxes by virtue of simply being born here. The mere idea that an implied social contract is legitimate because it is imposed upon you is circular reasoning; therefore, taxation is theft.

BTW...I do love living here. It's a good trade despite the incorrect basis and ignorance of natural rights, property rights.

---

You really are showing your lack of understanding of what the constitution does for the citizens. Go to a Middle-eastern country and tell me that your natural rights mean anything. In the US, your natural rights are protected by the constitution. And as part of the same document that protects your natural rights, there are responsibilities to the citizens to be part of this great nation. It's a two-way Street. You don't get to take from the country without giving back. Now we can have discussions on whether the government is excessively taxing and excessively taxing some people which could be considered theft since it is disproportionate, but paying for social services that are required to maintain a functioning society is not theft on its own.

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

That wan't the question. Please answer.

---

To answer your question, I'd be willing to forego police, fire, defense act. I already live in a remote part of my county without those services anyway. Any taxes I pay for those provide zero benefit to me.

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

contrario said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

J.R. said:

---

YoakDaddy said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

What? I pay my taxes according to law. The 1% - 10% have rigged the system to funnel more to themselves so they need to pay more

---

Taxation is theft.

---

That is just a dumb statement.

---

Nope. It's my money. I earned it. You have no right to it. Taxation is theft.

---

ok, so you would be willing to forfeit all govt services? Police, Fire, Instrastructure, Defense act? No, that is a dumb statement. We certainly can disagree about at what rate we all need to pay tax, but to say no taxation is necessary is absurd.

---

The compulsory taking of my private property that I worked for and earned is theft. You have no right to it. I signed no contract for services; therefore, no government has a right to take my property.

---

You drive on roads that taxes pay for. You live in a society protected by police that taxes pay for. If your house catches fire, firefighters that taxes pay for will come help you. Every day you use a service or benefit from services that are part of being citizens of this great country. If you don't pay your share of taxes, you are stealing from everyone else that does.

I'm with you that taxes need to be controlled, but you almost seem to imply all taxes are theft. I don't think that's the case, just excessive taxes.

---

Roads, police, firefighting, etc....the use of those services does not indicate that I agree with paying for them. I made no contract to use them. Did you sign a contract? In fact, the government forces you to pay for them regardless of use. Compulsory tax payments under threat of jail is theft.

---

But you do use the services. If you use them and don't pay for them, that is theft. If you don't want to enjoy the services the US offers to its citizens, move to another country. No one is forcing you to stay here. The fact that as an adult you continue to use and enjoy the benefits of being a US citizen is an implied acceptance of payment for those services. I agree the payments are forced on you, but if you don't want police protection, fire protection, good roads, some of the best infrastructure in the world and a free economy that benefits from all of those services, then move to a country that doesn't offer these basics. Seriously, no one is keeping you here. GTFO

---

You act as if there's a financial or social contract for citizenship. I didn't sign one when I was born. Did you? The mere fact that you told me to GTFO is not a debate point and means you have zero comprehension as to the concept of private property.

---

There is an implied social contract. And if you don't agree with the terms, then leave. The fact that you think it's ok to freeload, use public services and you shouldn't have to pay for them means you have zero comprehension of personal responsibility or social responsibility that is needed to make a society work. If you don't want to pay for the services offered by a society, that is fine, but don't live under the roof of said society if you don't want to chip in.

---

There is no contract implied or otherwise because there is coercion. Did you negotiate and sign a social or any other contract at birth? The government forces citizens to pay taxes regardless of whether they use or do not use those services; therefore, the fact that you use government services does not indicate anything about an agreement to pay taxes. The resulting failure to pay is further confiscation of property thereby demonstrating coercion. The use of services might imply agreement to pay for those services if people who didn't use the services were not required to pay. Arguing that a social contract is legitimate because it is imposed on you which makes it legitimate is circular logic.

---

The fact that you think it's ok to enjoy the benefits of living in the US, which includes the protection of other rights that you didn't contractually agree to, indicates your ignorance of personal responsibility and it illustrates your disrespect for other's personal property.

Again, you may have been born into this and forced into this society, but you could have left this society at any point in your adult life to pursue a society that fits your values better. But you didn't. So you entered into an assumed contract by your actions.

---

So we pay for our rights? I didn't know we had to pay for the natural right of free speech, religion, etc. by paying taxes. Where did I state that it was ok to live in the US without paying taxes? Please quote that back to me. That is your assumption. I merely stated that taxation was theft then provided sound logic behind it and you went triggered. Which others' personal property did I disrespect? Have I used someone else's personal property and not reimbursed them? I've paid my taxes under our coercive system, yet merely stated that the payment is theft then provided sound logic behind it. Did I advocate not being responsible and not paying taxes? I never did that either, yet you assumed I did.

Your logic is circular once again because one cannot assume to enter into a contract social or otherwise merely by being born. How did you negotiate and agree to that when you could not yet speak or write? I'd tell you to read up on private property from Locke, but your comprehension of my statements is lacking so it's best you shouldn't.

---

I can play that game too. Where did I say you had to pay taxes in order to have those rights. Show me one place I said that. Show me one time I said you didn't pay taxes. Just one. Jeez, you and your strawman arguments.

My point, as part of being a citizen of the US, you are guaranteed the protection of certain rights. You didn't sign a contract to have those rights guaranteed, but they are there. Please show me the piece of paper that you signed when you were born that guaranteed your right to free speech. And the answer is you didn't. But it is still part of the implied contract that is part of being a citizen of the US. The same document and it's amenments that guarantee those rights also allow the US to tax you. If you don't agree with these assume contractual terms, leave. Because you can't pick and choose which provisions of the assumed contract you are going to follow. That isn't how a society works.

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You really don't understand the concept of natural rights, property rights. There is no piece of paper because our rights come naturally from God whereas your implied social contract originates from man. There is no paper contract with God for the natural rights given (I could make an argument for freedom as a believing Christian though) just like there is no implied social contract with government to pay taxes by virtue of simply being born here. The mere idea that an implied social contract is legitimate because it is imposed upon you is circular reasoning; therefore, taxation is theft.

BTW...I do love living here. It's a good trade despite the incorrect basis and ignorance of natural rights, property rights.

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You really are showing your lack of understanding of what the constitution does for the citizens. Go to a Middle-eastern country and tell me that your natural rights mean anything. In the US, your natural rights are protected by the constitution. And as part of the same document that protects your natural rights, there are responsibilities to the citizens to be part of this great nation. It's a two-way Street. You don't get to take from the country without giving back. Now we can have discussions on whether the government is excessively taxing and excessively taxing some people which could be considered theft since it is disproportionate, but paying for social services that are required to maintain a functioning society is not theft on its own.

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I know what our Bill of Rights does and what things mean in it because I've read the ratification debates from the separate states of the late 1780s prior to ratification. Have you? (What specific delegates in the states thought about the 2A is amazing BTW) The Bill of Rights is intended to protect us from the government interfering in those natural rights. Our rights don't come from government, they are natural from God. Duh. I know. What you fail to comprehend is that in those natural rights (a right of property is a natural right) given by God is no social contract implied or otherwise between the parties. Our constitution does not state the first 10 amendments protecting your natural rights are applicable only if you pay your taxes does it? No it does not. (I can argue that voting does though.) Additionally, there is no contract implied or otherwise when one side is coerced into it. If you don't pay your taxes, what happens? You go to jail and/or the county sheriff confiscates your property. That's coercion because I guarantee they'll take your protected natural rights if you don't pay. Because there can be no contract if coerced into it, there is no social contract; therefore, taxation is theft.

BTW, I'll continue to pay my coerced taxes and live freely.

God that is short sighted. No one is an island. Who stores the records saying you own your property? When the enemy crosses your fence line who ya gonna call? Who launched the satellites for your cell phone? Who insects the feed for your catttle? Who protects me from your damaged or diseased products? Who delivers your mail? Who developed the internet for your email? Yoak you're clinging to silliness regardless of how many founders you read. And if I claim lay claim to your land and move on in who will you appeal to? If I shoot you dead who will prosecute on behalf of your descendants?

Waco1947 said:

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God that is short sighted. No one is an island. Who stores the records saying you own your property? When the enemy crosses your fence line who ya gonna call? Who launched the satellites for your cell phone? Who insects the feed for your catttle? Who protects me from your damaged or diseased products? Who delivers your mail? Who developed the internet for your email? Yoak you're clinging to silliness regardless of how many founders you read. And if I claim lay claim to your land and move on in who will you appeal to? If I shoot you dead who will prosecute on behalf of your descendants?

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You believe in infanticide and as someone in the ministry, that's unconscionable. Your opinion is garbage to me.

YoakDaddy said:

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Waco1947 said:

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God that is short sighted. No one is an island. Who stores the records saying you own your property? When the enemy crosses your fence line who ya gonna call? Who launched the satellites for your cell phone? Who insects the feed for your catttle? Who protects me from your damaged or diseased products? Who delivers your mail? Who developed the internet for your email? Yoak you're clinging to silliness regardless of how many founders you read. And if I claim lay claim to your land and move on in who will you appeal to? If I shoot you dead who will prosecute on behalf of your descendants?

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You believe in infanticide and as someone in the ministry, that's unconscionable. Your opinion is garbage to me.

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Stupid damn liar. Stupid because you can't comprehend a morally complex idea of the sanctity of a woman's body. And a liar because I am anti abortion, pro life beyond birth (unlike you) and pro choice for a decision that's none of your damn business. As soon as you allow for mandated vasectomies for men I just might pay attention to your stupid slander.

Waco1947 said:

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YoakDaddy said:

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Waco1947 said:

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God that is short sighted. No one is an island. Who stores the records saying you own your property? When the enemy crosses your fence line who ya gonna call? Who launched the satellites for your cell phone? Who insects the feed for your catttle? Who protects me from your damaged or diseased products? Who delivers your mail? Who developed the internet for your email? Yoak you're clinging to silliness regardless of how many founders you read. And if I claim lay claim to your land and move on in who will you appeal to? If I shoot you dead who will prosecute on behalf of your descendants?

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You believe in infanticide and as someone in the ministry, that's unconscionable. Your opinion is garbage to me.

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Stupid damn liar. Stupid because you can't comprehend a morally complex idea of the sanctity of a woman's body. And a liar because I am anti abortion, pro life beyond birth (unlike you) and pro choice for a decision that's none of your damn business. As soon as you allow for mandated vasectomies for men I just might pay attention to your stupid slander.

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Why do you see it solely as a woman's body and not two different individuals?
Or if you do see two individuals, baby and mother, why do you think the mother should be the only one making the decision?

I don't see how you as a Christian can see it that way.

She's a gift from God. She's a child of God. She is here with al it's trials and tribulations and and god/bad decisions in a complexity you cannot sort out for for her. Her life has consequences that you can never imagine. It's none of your businesss. You don't want her rummaging around in your life, marriage, browser history because it's none of her business so grant her the same right, please.

HuMcK said:

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This really isn't that surprising. A recession was going to happen around this time regardless of who was president. It's the natural economic cycle. It will be interesting to see how bad it is and long it lasts though. It seems like market fundamentals are better this time around, but we shall see.