Flaming Moderate said:

---

jupiter said:

---

---

Exactly. Some were expressing concern over this a month and a half ago.

---

Out of everything that has happened, the two biggest errors were1) shutting off elective health care everywhere and (2) not separating Covid positive elderly from their facilities if at all possible

Jacques Strap said:

---

https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/infection-control/covid-19-does-not-easily-spread-via-contaminated-surfaces-cdc-says.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

The novel coronavirus "does not spread easily" on surfaces or objects, according to the CDC's updated website page.

Previously, the CDC said it "may be possible" to spread the virus via contaminated surfaces, but the agency now believes it is primarily spread through the respiratory droplets of people in close contact.

"COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning about how it spreads," the CDC webpage reads. "It may be possible for COVID-19 to spread in other ways, but these are not thought to be the main ways the virus spreads."

---

But, but, but... Judging by some of the reactions by posters on this board... I thought for sure that if I stepped outside, even for a nanosecond, that I would most definitely get the Kung Flu and quickly die - twice.

ATL Bear said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/infection-control/covid-19-does-not-easily-spread-via-contaminated-surfaces-cdc-says.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

The novel coronavirus "does not spread easily" on surfaces or objects, according to the CDC's updated website page.

Previously, the CDC said it "may be possible" to spread the virus via contaminated surfaces, but the agency now believes it is primarily spread through the respiratory droplets of people in close contact.

"COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning about how it spreads," the CDC webpage reads. "It may be possible for COVID-19 to spread in other ways, but these are not thought to be the main ways the virus spreads."

---

It's an earlier article making the rounds again. Truth is, meat packing plant outbreaks shows common object/touch spread, but very intense common touching. If you really want to peel back the onion, there is still no proof of asymptomatic spread. There is proof of presymptomatic spread, meaning spread during the 3-5 day incubation period, but nothing verified only speculated on someone infected who never manifested in symptoms. It's important because you can contact trace from a known infection but not an unknown one. And the latter has been the driver behind social distancing and masking.

---

The evidence for asymptomatic spread is a bit more than speculation. Tests have confirmed that infectious levels of the virus can exist in cases where symptoms never develop.

Sam Lowry said:

---

ATL Bear said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/infection-control/covid-19-does-not-easily-spread-via-contaminated-surfaces-cdc-says.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

The novel coronavirus "does not spread easily" on surfaces or objects, according to the CDC's updated website page.

Previously, the CDC said it "may be possible" to spread the virus via contaminated surfaces, but the agency now believes it is primarily spread through the respiratory droplets of people in close contact.

"COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning about how it spreads," the CDC webpage reads. "It may be possible for COVID-19 to spread in other ways, but these are not thought to be the main ways the virus spreads."

---

It's an earlier article making the rounds again. Truth is, meat packing plant outbreaks shows common object/touch spread, but very intense common touching. If you really want to peel back the onion, there is still no proof of asymptomatic spread. There is proof of presymptomatic spread, meaning spread during the 3-5 day incubation period, but nothing verified only speculated on someone infected who never manifested in symptoms. It's important because you can contact trace from a known infection but not an unknown one. And the latter has been the driver behind social distancing and masking.

---

The evidence for asymptomatic spread is a bit more than speculation. Tests have confirmed that infectious levels of the virus can exist in cases where symptoms never develop.

---

So, how do you feel about the upcoming president election?

Are you voting for Trump?

Sam Lowry said:

---

Florda_mike said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

ATL Bear said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/infection-control/covid-19-does-not-easily-spread-via-contaminated-surfaces-cdc-says.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

The novel coronavirus "does not spread easily" on surfaces or objects, according to the CDC's updated website page.

Previously, the CDC said it "may be possible" to spread the virus via contaminated surfaces, but the agency now believes it is primarily spread through the respiratory droplets of people in close contact.

"COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning about how it spreads," the CDC webpage reads. "It may be possible for COVID-19 to spread in other ways, but these are not thought to be the main ways the virus spreads."

---

It's an earlier article making the rounds again. Truth is, meat packing plant outbreaks shows common object/touch spread, but very intense common touching. If you really want to peel back the onion, there is still no proof of asymptomatic spread. There is proof of presymptomatic spread, meaning spread during the 3-5 day incubation period, but nothing verified only speculated on someone infected who never manifested in symptoms. It's important because you can contact trace from a known infection but not an unknown one. And the latter has been the driver behind social distancing and masking.

---

The evidence for asymptomatic spread is a bit more than speculation. Tests have confirmed that infectious levels of the virus can exist in cases where symptoms never develop.

---

So, how do you feel about the upcoming president election?

Are you voting for Trump?

---

Is that all you care about?

---

No, just doing a personal polling of those stoking the COVID fear as you're doing

So you qualify for my personal study/poll

So please, just give me a simple answer

Are you voting for Trump? Simple Y/N please

Florda_mike said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

Florda_mike said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

ATL Bear said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/infection-control/covid-19-does-not-easily-spread-via-contaminated-surfaces-cdc-says.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

The novel coronavirus "does not spread easily" on surfaces or objects, according to the CDC's updated website page.

Previously, the CDC said it "may be possible" to spread the virus via contaminated surfaces, but the agency now believes it is primarily spread through the respiratory droplets of people in close contact.

"COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning about how it spreads," the CDC webpage reads. "It may be possible for COVID-19 to spread in other ways, but these are not thought to be the main ways the virus spreads."

---

It's an earlier article making the rounds again. Truth is, meat packing plant outbreaks shows common object/touch spread, but very intense common touching. If you really want to peel back the onion, there is still no proof of asymptomatic spread. There is proof of presymptomatic spread, meaning spread during the 3-5 day incubation period, but nothing verified only speculated on someone infected who never manifested in symptoms. It's important because you can contact trace from a known infection but not an unknown one. And the latter has been the driver behind social distancing and masking.

---

The evidence for asymptomatic spread is a bit more than speculation. Tests have confirmed that infectious levels of the virus can exist in cases where symptoms never develop.

---

So, how do you feel about the upcoming president election?

Are you voting for Trump?

---

Is that all you care about?

---

No, just doing a personal polling of those stoking the COVID fear as you're doing

So you qualify for my personal study/poll

So please, just give me a simple answer

Are you voting for Trump? Simple Y/N please

---

I don't know yet. Won't vote for Biden in any case.

Sam Lowry said:

---

Florda_mike said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

Florda_mike said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

ATL Bear said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/infection-control/covid-19-does-not-easily-spread-via-contaminated-surfaces-cdc-says.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

The novel coronavirus "does not spread easily" on surfaces or objects, according to the CDC's updated website page.

Previously, the CDC said it "may be possible" to spread the virus via contaminated surfaces, but the agency now believes it is primarily spread through the respiratory droplets of people in close contact.

"COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning about how it spreads," the CDC webpage reads. "It may be possible for COVID-19 to spread in other ways, but these are not thought to be the main ways the virus spreads."

---

It's an earlier article making the rounds again. Truth is, meat packing plant outbreaks shows common object/touch spread, but very intense common touching. If you really want to peel back the onion, there is still no proof of asymptomatic spread. There is proof of presymptomatic spread, meaning spread during the 3-5 day incubation period, but nothing verified only speculated on someone infected who never manifested in symptoms. It's important because you can contact trace from a known infection but not an unknown one. And the latter has been the driver behind social distancing and masking.

---

The evidence for asymptomatic spread is a bit more than speculation. Tests have confirmed that infectious levels of the virus can exist in cases where symptoms never develop.

---

So, how do you feel about the upcoming president election?

Are you voting for Trump?

---

Is that all you care about?

---

No, just doing a personal polling of those stoking the COVID fear as you're doing

So you qualify for my personal study/poll

So please, just give me a simple answer

Are you voting for Trump? Simple Y/N please

---

I don't know yet. Won't vote for Biden in any case.

---

Figured such

Literally par for the course

HashTag said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/infection-control/covid-19-does-not-easily-spread-via-contaminated-surfaces-cdc-says.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

The novel coronavirus "does not spread easily" on surfaces or objects, according to the CDC's updated website page.

Previously, the CDC said it "may be possible" to spread the virus via contaminated surfaces, but the agency now believes it is primarily spread through the respiratory droplets of people in close contact.

"COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning about how it spreads," the CDC webpage reads. "It may be possible for COVID-19 to spread in other ways, but these are not thought to be the main ways the virus spreads."

---

But, but, but... Judging by some of the reactions by posters on this board... I thought for sure that if I stepped outside, even for a nanosecond, that I would most definitely get the Kung Flu and quickly die - twice.

---

Easy there snowflake, that's quite the overreaction or misjudgment. Covid-45 doesn't work the way you fear.

Canada2017 said:

---

Florda_mike said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

Florda_mike said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

ATL Bear said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/infection-control/covid-19-does-not-easily-spread-via-contaminated-surfaces-cdc-says.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

The novel coronavirus "does not spread easily" on surfaces or objects, according to the CDC's updated website page.

Previously, the CDC said it "may be possible" to spread the virus via contaminated surfaces, but the agency now believes it is primarily spread through the respiratory droplets of people in close contact.

"COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning about how it spreads," the CDC webpage reads. "It may be possible for COVID-19 to spread in other ways, but these are not thought to be the main ways the virus spreads."

---

It's an earlier article making the rounds again. Truth is, meat packing plant outbreaks shows common object/touch spread, but very intense common touching. If you really want to peel back the onion, there is still no proof of asymptomatic spread. There is proof of presymptomatic spread, meaning spread during the 3-5 day incubation period, but nothing verified only speculated on someone infected who never manifested in symptoms. It's important because you can contact trace from a known infection but not an unknown one. And the latter has been the driver behind social distancing and masking.

---

The evidence for asymptomatic spread is a bit more than speculation. Tests have confirmed that infectious levels of the virus can exist in cases where symptoms never develop.

---

So, how do you feel about the upcoming president election?

Are you voting for Trump?

---

Is that all you care about?

---

No, just doing a personal polling of those stoking the COVID fear as you're doing

So you qualify for my personal study/poll

So please, just give me a simple answer

Are you voting for Trump? Simple Y/N please

---

Voting for Trump.....but there are at least 6 Republicans and 3 Democrats I would prefer instead if their names were on the ballot.

---

We live in an imperfect world. A very imperfect world.

quash said:

---

HashTag said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/infection-control/covid-19-does-not-easily-spread-via-contaminated-surfaces-cdc-says.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

The novel coronavirus "does not spread easily" on surfaces or objects, according to the CDC's updated website page.

Previously, the CDC said it "may be possible" to spread the virus via contaminated surfaces, but the agency now believes it is primarily spread through the respiratory droplets of people in close contact.

"COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning about how it spreads," the CDC webpage reads. "It may be possible for COVID-19 to spread in other ways, but these are not thought to be the main ways the virus spreads."

---

But, but, but... Judging by some of the reactions by posters on this board... I thought for sure that if I stepped outside, even for a nanosecond, that I would most definitely get the Kung Flu and quickly die - twice.

---

Easy there snowflake, that's quite the overreaction or misjudgment. Covid-45 doesn't work the way you fear.

---

Oh crap! We're up to "45" on the Covid now? This is awful, extremely awful. I just need one favor; please make sure that on my tombstone, they get my pronoun right.

HashTag said:

---

quash said:

---

HashTag said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/infection-control/covid-19-does-not-easily-spread-via-contaminated-surfaces-cdc-says.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

The novel coronavirus "does not spread easily" on surfaces or objects, according to the CDC's updated website page.

Previously, the CDC said it "may be possible" to spread the virus via contaminated surfaces, but the agency now believes it is primarily spread through the respiratory droplets of people in close contact.

"COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning about how it spreads," the CDC webpage reads. "It may be possible for COVID-19 to spread in other ways, but these are not thought to be the main ways the virus spreads."

---

But, but, but... Judging by some of the reactions by posters on this board... I thought for sure that if I stepped outside, even for a nanosecond, that I would most definitely get the Kung Flu and quickly die - twice.

---

Easy there snowflake, that's quite the overreaction or misjudgment. Covid-45 doesn't work the way you fear.

---

Oh crap! We're up to "45" on the Covid now? This is awful, extremely awful. I just need one favor; please make sure that on my tombstone, they get my pronoun right.

---

"They found their safe space"

HashTag said:

---

quash said:

---

HashTag said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/infection-control/covid-19-does-not-easily-spread-via-contaminated-surfaces-cdc-says.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

The novel coronavirus "does not spread easily" on surfaces or objects, according to the CDC's updated website page.

Previously, the CDC said it "may be possible" to spread the virus via contaminated surfaces, but the agency now believes it is primarily spread through the respiratory droplets of people in close contact.

"COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning about how it spreads," the CDC webpage reads. "It may be possible for COVID-19 to spread in other ways, but these are not thought to be the main ways the virus spreads."

---

But, but, but... Judging by some of the reactions by posters on this board... I thought for sure that if I stepped outside, even for a nanosecond, that I would most definitely get the Kung Flu and quickly die - twice.

---

Easy there snowflake, that's quite the overreaction or misjudgment. Covid-45 doesn't work the way you fear.

---

Oh crap! We're up to "45" on the Covid now? This is awful, extremely awful. I just need one favor; please make sure that on my tombstone, they get my pronoun right.

---

2020 Social Distancing Champion
Now permanently 6 ft away from everyone

jupiter said:

---

---

Very interesting! Do you have a link to the source document?

Sam Lowry said:

---

ATL Bear said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/infection-control/covid-19-does-not-easily-spread-via-contaminated-surfaces-cdc-says.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

The novel coronavirus "does not spread easily" on surfaces or objects, according to the CDC's updated website page.

Previously, the CDC said it "may be possible" to spread the virus via contaminated surfaces, but the agency now believes it is primarily spread through the respiratory droplets of people in close contact.

"COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning about how it spreads," the CDC webpage reads. "It may be possible for COVID-19 to spread in other ways, but these are not thought to be the main ways the virus spreads."

---

It's an earlier article making the rounds again. Truth is, meat packing plant outbreaks shows common object/touch spread, but very intense common touching. If you really want to peel back the onion, there is still no proof of asymptomatic spread. There is proof of presymptomatic spread, meaning spread during the 3-5 day incubation period, but nothing verified only speculated on someone infected who never manifested in symptoms. It's important because you can contact trace from a known infection but not an unknown one. And the latter has been the driver behind social distancing and masking.

---

The evidence for asymptomatic spread is a bit more than speculation. Tests have confirmed that infectious levels of the virus can exist in cases where symptoms never develop.

---

It isn't so much about infection level, but how much is in the lungs that can aerosolize into the upper respiratory tracts to come out while coughing or sneezing. Not to mention how much coughing does an asymptomatic person do in the first place. There's been no affirmation of transfer except from presymptomatic.

Check out this article from USA TODAY:

US pledges up to $1.2 billion to access 300 million doses of experimental COVID-19 vaccine

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2020/05/21/coronavirus-covid-19-vaccine-astrozeneca-1-billion-us-300-million-doses/5237320002/

Canada2017 said:

---

quash said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

quash said:

---

Jack and DP said:

---

Doc who discovered HIV, says coronavirus is man made

https://www.gilmorehealth.com/chinese-coronavirus-is-a-man-made-virus-according-to-luc-montagnier-the-man-who-discovered-hiv/

---

The weight of evidence so far is against him.

What should not weigh in the balance at all is a desire to make this a political point with which to punish China.

---

You think China has clean hands?

---

In regard to what?

If you mean "Did China create the coronavirus in a lab?" then the evidence so far says their hands are clean. Keeping misinformation in play without better proof just for political points is counter-productive.

Not so much if you are referring to their handling of the flow of information. That was predicated on politics and is a valid tool against them.

But at this point in the thread we are talking about the creation of the virus.

---

Wet market or inadvertent release from a lab.... China unleashed the C-19 virus resulting in the deaths of thousands of people and catastrophic economic damage throughout the world .

There is no point wasting resources in 'punishing' China as it is not possible or practical to do so .

But acknowledging China's culpability isn't wrong either .

---

"Unleash" implies a conscious effort on China's part.
Unleash to release from or as if from a leash; set loose to pursue or run at will.
Is that hat your intent with word?

People who struggle with English ought not lecture others on what English words mean.

quash said:

---

HashTag said:

---

quash said:

---

HashTag said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/infection-control/covid-19-does-not-easily-spread-via-contaminated-surfaces-cdc-says.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

The novel coronavirus "does not spread easily" on surfaces or objects, according to the CDC's updated website page.

Previously, the CDC said it "may be possible" to spread the virus via contaminated surfaces, but the agency now believes it is primarily spread through the respiratory droplets of people in close contact.

"COVID-19 is a new disease and we are still learning about how it spreads," the CDC webpage reads. "It may be possible for COVID-19 to spread in other ways, but these are not thought to be the main ways the virus spreads."

---

But, but, but... Judging by some of the reactions by posters on this board... I thought for sure that if I stepped outside, even for a nanosecond, that I would most definitely get the Kung Flu and quickly die - twice.

---

Easy there snowflake, that's quite the overreaction or misjudgment. Covid-45 doesn't work the way you fear.

---

Oh crap! We're up to "45" on the Covid now? This is awful, extremely awful. I just need one favor; please make sure that on my tombstone, they get my pronoun right.

---

"They found their safe space"

---

Okay, that's actually pretty damn funny

Waco1947 said:

---

Canada2017 said:

---

quash said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

quash said:

---

Jack and DP said:

---

Doc who discovered HIV, says coronavirus is man made

https://www.gilmorehealth.com/chinese-coronavirus-is-a-man-made-virus-according-to-luc-montagnier-the-man-who-discovered-hiv/

---

The weight of evidence so far is against him.

What should not weigh in the balance at all is a desire to make this a political point with which to punish China.

---

You think China has clean hands?

---

In regard to what?

If you mean "Did China create the coronavirus in a lab?" then the evidence so far says their hands are clean. Keeping misinformation in play without better proof just for political points is counter-productive.

Not so much if you are referring to their handling of the flow of information. That was predicated on politics and is a valid tool against them.

But at this point in the thread we are talking about the creation of the virus.

---

Wet market or inadvertent release from a lab.... China unleashed the C-19 virus resulting in the deaths of thousands of people and catastrophic economic damage throughout the world .

There is no point wasting resources in 'punishing' China as it is not possible or practical to do so .

But acknowledging China's culpability isn't wrong either .

---

"Unleash" implies a conscious effort on China's part.
Unleash to release from or as if from a leash; set loose to pursue or run at will.
Is that hat your intent with word?

---

You should unleash your well-anchored racist thoughts. Free your mind a bit

trey3216 said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

Canada2017 said:

---

quash said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

quash said:

---

Jack and DP said:

---

Doc who discovered HIV, says coronavirus is man made

https://www.gilmorehealth.com/chinese-coronavirus-is-a-man-made-virus-according-to-luc-montagnier-the-man-who-discovered-hiv/

---

The weight of evidence so far is against him.

What should not weigh in the balance at all is a desire to make this a political point with which to punish China.

---

You think China has clean hands?

---

In regard to what?

If you mean "Did China create the coronavirus in a lab?" then the evidence so far says their hands are clean. Keeping misinformation in play without better proof just for political points is counter-productive.

Not so much if you are referring to their handling of the flow of information. That was predicated on politics and is a valid tool against them.

But at this point in the thread we are talking about the creation of the virus.

---

Wet market or inadvertent release from a lab.... China unleashed the C-19 virus resulting in the deaths of thousands of people and catastrophic economic damage throughout the world .

There is no point wasting resources in 'punishing' China as it is not possible or practical to do so .

But acknowledging China's culpability isn't wrong either .

---

"Unleash" implies a conscious effort on China's part.
Unleash to release from or as if from a leash; set loose to pursue or run at will.
Is that hat your intent with word?

---

You should unleash your well-anchored racist thoughts. Free your mind a bit

---

His argument draws a conclusion(unleashed) that is stated more strongly than the actual observations would support.

Current "Best Estimate" Scenario 5 Fatality Rates from the CDC are very low

Click and then scroll link below to see the full chart

Scenario 5: Current Best Estimate
Symptomatic Case Fatality Ratio, stratified by age in years
Source: Preliminary COVID-19 estimates, CDC

0-49: 0.0005
50-64: 0.002
65+: 0.013
Overall: 0.004

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/planning-scenarios.html

That does not jibe with 100,000 dead already, would like to see if this CDC model is for solely causing a death or being a contributing cause of death.

If followed though, this is the number of infections v. expected death toll:

(Total infections x 65%) x 0.004

2,000,000 infection-5,200 deaths
5,000,000 infections-13,000 deaths
10,000,000 infections-26,000 deaths
25,000,000 infections-65,000 deaths
50,000,000 infections-130,000 deaths
100,000,000 infections-260,000 deaths
150,000,000 infections-390,000 deaths

I would guess all of the above assume a workable health care system. It would also suggest that if the death numbers are right, we have already had 36,500,000 infections

14% rise in fatality rates per miles driven in March. Less traffic, higher death rate, probably due to speeds on "open roads".

"Reduced traffic as the result of COVID-19 lockdowns may have been a boon to truckers who found it much easier navigating normally crowded highways, but for others the open roads proved to be too much of a temptation, often with fatal consequences.
The National Safety Council released statistics this week that showed a significant increase in fatalities per miles driven in March of this year compared to March 2019 14 percent more.
"Per mile traveled, our roads are less safe than they were prior to COVID-19," said Ken Kolosh, the safety council's manager of statistics, attributing the increase in fatal accidents to reckless driving and speeding.
Many states told how law enforcement officials have noticed dramatic increases in speeding. Los Angeles, for example, saw speeds as much as 30 percent faster, and officials in states like Colorado, Indiana, Nebraska and Utah said drivers have been clocked at going more than 100 mph.
And Kolosh noted that "something very different" is happening during this COVID-19 period compared to other recessionary times. "A lot of drivers are taking the open roads as an invitation for an open season on speeding and other dangerous behaviors."
Despite the jump in March fatalities, safety council members estimate of 366 people dying on U.S. roadways during the Memorial Day weekend is the lowest number of deaths for Memorial weekend in the past six years."

truckingtruth.com

Waco1947 said:

---

trey3216 said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

Canada2017 said:

---

quash said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

quash said:

---

Jack and DP said:

---

Doc who discovered HIV, says coronavirus is man made

https://www.gilmorehealth.com/chinese-coronavirus-is-a-man-made-virus-according-to-luc-montagnier-the-man-who-discovered-hiv/

---

The weight of evidence so far is against him.

What should not weigh in the balance at all is a desire to make this a political point with which to punish China.

---

You think China has clean hands?

---

In regard to what?

If you mean "Did China create the coronavirus in a lab?" then the evidence so far says their hands are clean. Keeping misinformation in play without better proof just for political points is counter-productive.

Not so much if you are referring to their handling of the flow of information. That was predicated on politics and is a valid tool against them.

But at this point in the thread we are talking about the creation of the virus.

---

Wet market or inadvertent release from a lab.... China unleashed the C-19 virus resulting in the deaths of thousands of people and catastrophic economic damage throughout the world .

There is no point wasting resources in 'punishing' China as it is not possible or practical to do so .

But acknowledging China's culpability isn't wrong either .

---

"Unleash" implies a conscious effort on China's part.
Unleash to release from or as if from a leash; set loose to pursue or run at will.
Is that hat your intent with word?

---

You should unleash your well-anchored racist thoughts. Free your mind a bit

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His argument draws a conclusion(unleashed) that is stated more strongly than the actual observations would support.

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Not really

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2020-opinion-coronavirus-europe-lockdown-excess-deaths-recession/

The Results of Europe's Lockdown Experiment Are In

Quote:

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While not a gauge of whether the decisions taken were the right ones, nor of how strictly they were followed, the analysis gives a clear sense of each government's strategy for containing the virus. Some above all Italy and Spain enforced prolonged and strict lockdowns after infections took off. Others especially Sweden preferred a much more relaxed approach. Portugal and Greece chose to close down while cases were relatively low. France and the U.K. took longer before deciding to impose the most restrictive measures.

But, as our next chart shows, there's little correlation between the severity of a nation's restrictions and whether it managed to curb excess fatalities a measure that looks at the overall number of deaths compared with normal trends.

In Europe, roughly three groups of countries emerge in terms of fatalities. One group, including the U.K., the Netherlands and Spain, experienced extremely high excess mortality. Another, encompassing Sweden and Switzerland, suffered many more deaths than usual, but significantly less than the first group. Finally, there were countries where deaths remained within a normal range such as Greece and Germany.

Yet the data show that the relative strictness of a country's containment measures had little bearing on its membership in any of the three groups above. While Germany had milder restrictions than Italy, it has been much more successful in containing the virus.

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Booray said:

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That does not jibe with 100,000 dead already, would like to see if this CDC model is for solely causing a death or being a contributing cause of death.

If followed though, this is the number of infections v. expected death toll:

(Total infections x 65%) x 0.004

2,000,000 infection-5,200 deaths
5,000,000 infections-13,000 deaths
10,000,000 infections-26,000 deaths
25,000,000 infections-65,000 deaths
50,000,000 infections-130,000 deaths
100,000,000 infections-260,000 deaths
150,000,000 infections-390,000 deaths

I would guess all of the above assume a workable health care system. It would also suggest that if the death numbers are right, we have already had 36,500,000 infections

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The death numbers are soft based on things I have posted, read and heard from MDs I know. When you get more money for coding COVID as cause of death you will get more COVID deaths. That's a data issue we may never overcome.

Also 35% of cases are estimated to be asymptomatic and the .004 number is fatality rate for symptomatic cases. So take 80,000 deaths / .0026 to get the total case estimate of 30,760,000 that would result in 80,000 deaths. That's a lot of cases given the current 1.6 million positive cases listed on the Johns Hopkis site.

Anyway the interesting thing is the fatality rate just keeps on keep dropping.

Not sure how much more, the Medicare payment for Covid deaths is less than half the cost of a 14 day stay in ICU.

https://www.star-telegram.com/news/local/crime/article242943966.html

https://abc7news.com/amp/suicide-covid-19-coronavirus-rates-during-pandemic-death-by/6201962/?__twitter_impression=true

SUICIDES ON THE RISE AMID STAY-AT-HOME ORDER, BAY AREA MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS SAY

WALNUT CREEK, Calif. (KGO) -- Doctors at John Muir Medical Center in Walnut Creek say they have seen more deaths by suicide during this quarantine period than deaths from the COVID-19 virus.

"We've never seen numbers like this, in such a short period of time," he said. "I mean we've seen a year's worth of suicide attempts in the last four weeks."

Jacques Strap said:

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https://abc7news.com/amp/suicide-covid-19-coronavirus-rates-during-pandemic-death-by/6201962/?__twitter_impression=true

SUICIDES ON THE RISE AMID STAY-AT-HOME ORDER, BAY AREA MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS SAY

WALNUT CREEK, Calif. (KGO) -- Doctors at John Muir Medical Center in Walnut Creek say they have seen more deaths by suicide during this quarantine period than deaths from the COVID-19 virus.

"We've never seen numbers like this, in such a short period of time," he said. "I mean we've seen a year's worth of suicide attempts in the last four weeks."

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Just as I predicted.

This was my first concern of overly extreme lockdown measures instead of targeting vulnerable groups.

The majority of people that work (Age 25-44) have an astronomically low chance of death by C19.

We've just increased it by destroying millions of lives through economic turmoil.

Hysteria kills.

When this is all said and done, well intentioned people are going to feel guilty for going too far.