Some movement toward McCarthy on the 12th vote, but he still will not get there

Osodecentx said:

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Some movement toward McCarthy on the 12th vote, but he still will not get there

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This is why the Dem's are kicking GOP ass. They support the larger movement, they would have had a Speaker on the 2nd vote.

RMF5630 said:

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Osodecentx said:

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Some movement toward McCarthy on the 12th vote, but he still will not get there

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This is why the Dem's are kicking GOP ass. They support the larger movement, they would have had a Speaker on the 2nd vote.

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There's a reason there is not dissent in authoritarian systems.

McCarthy got 213 votes. That leaves 7 Republican hold outs. McCarthy needs to pick up 3, maybe 4 (because there are some members not voting

HuMcK said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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HuMcK said:

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Some of those were absolutely bad men (I'm not aware of any allegations for Barny Frank other than he's gay, but that's enough for some types), especially Kennedy...but that guy was a dinosaur and he's been dead for over a decade.

More recently than that, Democrats ran Al Franken out of a Senate seat (far more valuable than a safe House seat) for a fraction of what Gaetz was credibly accused of. Honestly, the two men's allegations aren't even in the same ball park. Not only did they tolerate Gaetz, the GOP has allowed someone who should be relegated as an obscure back-bencher to instead become a leading voice in the party, who will almost unilaterally choose or hold sway over the next Speaker. Don't even get me started on Dennis Hastert, or the similarities between him and Jim Jordan, who is also a leading voice in the party.

I'm also not the one out here thumping bibles to justify banning any mention of undesirable "subversive" topics in books or education, that's y'all pretending to be on the moral high horse.

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The president of the United States faces a credible rape allegation from Tara Reid.

He also allegedly molested his daughter, according to Ashley Biden.

Do you think he should resign or do you not Believe All Women?

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Not that you actually cared about the accusation in the first place, your interest in it is only to potentially weaponize it.

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SO MUCH IRONY HERE...

Mothra said:

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HuMcK said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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HuMcK said:

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Some of those were absolutely bad men (I'm not aware of any allegations for Barny Frank other than he's gay, but that's enough for some types), especially Kennedy...but that guy was a dinosaur and he's been dead for over a decade.

More recently than that, Democrats ran Al Franken out of a Senate seat (far more valuable than a safe House seat) for a fraction of what Gaetz was credibly accused of. Honestly, the two men's allegations aren't even in the same ball park. Not only did they tolerate Gaetz, the GOP has allowed someone who should be relegated as an obscure back-bencher to instead become a leading voice in the party, who will almost unilaterally choose or hold sway over the next Speaker. Don't even get me started on Dennis Hastert, or the similarities between him and Jim Jordan, who is also a leading voice in the party.

I'm also not the one out here thumping bibles to justify banning any mention of undesirable "subversive" topics in books or education, that's y'all pretending to be on the moral high horse.

---

The president of the United States faces a credible rape allegation from Tara Reid.

He also allegedly molested his daughter, according to Ashley Biden.

Do you think he should resign or do you not Believe All Women?

---

Not that you actually cared about the accusation in the first place, your interest in it is only to potentially weaponize it.

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SO MUCH IRONY HERE...

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Some rapes are phony...

when a girl was sexually assaulted in a bathroom in a loudon county school, barack obama called that “phony trumped-up culture wars, this fake outrage.” a court found that there was sufficient evidence of sexual assault today.

honestly, just disgusted. #VApol #VAGov pic.twitter.com/S85z6Kf3zV

— kaitlin (@thefactualprep) October 25, 2021

Harrison Bergeron said:

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RMF5630 said:

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Osodecentx said:

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Some movement toward McCarthy on the 12th vote, but he still will not get there

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This is why the Dem's are kicking GOP ass. They support the larger movement, they would have had a Speaker on the 2nd vote.

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There's a reason there is not dissent in authoritarian systems.

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Great in theory, until you are facing one in a struggle. Same with China. At some point their has to be some unity to protect those individuals.

McCarthy: Now 0 for 13 at the plate

Jack Bauer said:

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McCarthy: Now 0 for 13 at the plate

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perfect record! Amazing!

4th and Inches said:

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Jack Bauer said:

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McCarthy: Now 0 for 13 at the plate

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perfect record! Amazing!

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You think he will get the hint? What else can he give away?

Jack Bauer said:

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McCarthy: Now 0 for 13 at the plate

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He can't hit a splitter.

Osodecentx said:

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whiterock said:

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Osodecentx said:

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whiterock said:

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Osodecentx said:

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Quote:

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Quote:

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Quote:

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Quote:

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Lol. From the guy whose preferred candidate for Speaker could not get the votes after three attempts.

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I don't have a preferred candidate. It's your party and your **** show.

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Then stop complaining that a handful of conservative insurgents are standing against Kevin McCarthy. Not your fight.
Our Andy McCarthy no relation to the aspiring speaker points out that if twelve House Republicans voted "present," New York Democrat Hakeem Jeffries could be elected speaker. That scenario is unlikely, but there was a report yesterday that "Reps. Matt Gaetz (R-FL), Lauren Boebert (R-CO) and Scott Perry (R-PA) told Rep. Kevin McCarthy (R-CA) that they don't mind if the speaker vote goes to plurality and Rep. Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY) is elected because they will fight him"

In other words, at least a handful of House Republicans are saying they're fine with a Democratic speaker and Democrats effectively controlling the House, despite the outcome of the 2022 midterm elections. Note that these are exactly the kinds of Republicans who call each other "RINO," contend that other Republicans aren't tough enough or smart enough, and simply believe that others aren't willing to do what it takes to win.
Right now, in the House, the GOP is a nominal or technical majority party with a large faction which has no interest in acting like a majority. They may well be happier being in the minority.
https://www.nationalreview.com/the-morning-jolt/what-the-speaker-fight-says-about-the-republican-party/

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I think I mentioned a scenario like this to you in another thread……just a scenario, at this point.

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I believe your concern was moderate Republicans cutting a deal that resulted in a Democrat Speaker. This scenario is the Gaetz/Boebert group doing a kamikazie which results in a Democrat Speaker

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That's not the way I read "goes to plurality." Far more likely that mods crossover to cut some kind of deal with Dems to get enough votes for McCarthy or some other moderate Republican, offering up rules more favorable to the minority, promised legislation, one or more committee chairmanships. There is a template for that kind of structure = the Texas legislature. The organizer of such effort is invariably.....the speaker.

Think about motive. The only viable reason to cross over to Dems is to gain the speakership........

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Motive would be to create chaos in which the dead enders prosper. Nobody knew who these people were 1 week ago. Now that there is chaos, they are getting hours of air time and notoriety.
The process would be to not vote for anyone, thus lowering the threshold vote necessary to be elected Speaker.

note they actually said it: That scenario is unlikely, but there was a report yesterday that "Reps. Matt Gaetz (R-FL), Lauren Boebert (R-CO) and Scott Perry (R-PA) told Rep. Kevin McCarthy (R-CA) that they don't mind if the speaker vote goes to plurality and Rep. Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY) is elected because they will fight him"

---

Jeffries would then clear the hurdle. So, in context, the holdouts are threatening to stand aside and let the will of the House prevail, not collude with the other side. It is moderates who will collude. It happens every session in the Tx legislature....Dems effectively pick the Speaker of the Tx House. And, as some posts above indicate (as I predicted), it is moderates who will do that same gambit in the US House.

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I'm betting your state rep voted for the prevailing Tx speaker, Mr republican board member

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Probably. It would be the sensible thing to do since it's fait accompli. What does that have to do with the topic we are discussing?

RMF5630 said:

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Osodecentx said:

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Some movement toward McCarthy on the 12th vote, but he still will not get there

---

This is why the Dem's are kicking GOP ass. They support the larger movement, they would have had a Speaker on the 2nd vote.

---

Dems never bring this to the floor. There have been 7 people against Pelosi. They work it out before it gets like this. (Republicans used to, too).

Mitch Blood Green said:

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RMF5630 said:

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Osodecentx said:

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Some movement toward McCarthy on the 12th vote, but he still will not get there

---

This is why the Dem's are kicking GOP ass. They support the larger movement, they would have had a Speaker on the 2nd vote.

---

Dems never bring this to the floor. There have been 7 people against Pelosi. They work it out before it gets like this. (Republicans used to, too).

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My point exactly. I remember one time where Pelosi had to meet with people, I thought it was the 2nd ballot but I may be wrong. GOP is messed up. This is not the way to slow up Biden's agenda, not being able to even stay together to get a Speaker?

whiterock said:

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Osodecentx said:

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whiterock said:

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Osodecentx said:

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whiterock said:

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Osodecentx said:

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Quote:

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Quote:

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Quote:

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Quote:

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Lol. From the guy whose preferred candidate for Speaker could not get the votes after three attempts.

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I don't have a preferred candidate. It's your party and your **** show.

---

Then stop complaining that a handful of conservative insurgents are standing against Kevin McCarthy. Not your fight.
Our Andy McCarthy no relation to the aspiring speaker points out that if twelve House Republicans voted "present," New York Democrat Hakeem Jeffries could be elected speaker. That scenario is unlikely, but there was a report yesterday that "Reps. Matt Gaetz (R-FL), Lauren Boebert (R-CO) and Scott Perry (R-PA) told Rep. Kevin McCarthy (R-CA) that they don't mind if the speaker vote goes to plurality and Rep. Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY) is elected because they will fight him"

In other words, at least a handful of House Republicans are saying they're fine with a Democratic speaker and Democrats effectively controlling the House, despite the outcome of the 2022 midterm elections. Note that these are exactly the kinds of Republicans who call each other "RINO," contend that other Republicans aren't tough enough or smart enough, and simply believe that others aren't willing to do what it takes to win.
Right now, in the House, the GOP is a nominal or technical majority party with a large faction which has no interest in acting like a majority. They may well be happier being in the minority.
https://www.nationalreview.com/the-morning-jolt/what-the-speaker-fight-says-about-the-republican-party/

---

I think I mentioned a scenario like this to you in another thread……just a scenario, at this point.

---

I believe your concern was moderate Republicans cutting a deal that resulted in a Democrat Speaker. This scenario is the Gaetz/Boebert group doing a kamikazie which results in a Democrat Speaker

---

That's not the way I read "goes to plurality." Far more likely that mods crossover to cut some kind of deal with Dems to get enough votes for McCarthy or some other moderate Republican, offering up rules more favorable to the minority, promised legislation, one or more committee chairmanships. There is a template for that kind of structure = the Texas legislature. The organizer of such effort is invariably.....the speaker.

Think about motive. The only viable reason to cross over to Dems is to gain the speakership........

---

Motive would be to create chaos in which the dead enders prosper. Nobody knew who these people were 1 week ago. Now that there is chaos, they are getting hours of air time and notoriety.
The process would be to not vote for anyone, thus lowering the threshold vote necessary to be elected Speaker.

note they actually said it: That scenario is unlikely, but there was a report yesterday that "Reps. Matt Gaetz (R-FL), Lauren Boebert (R-CO) and Scott Perry (R-PA) told Rep. Kevin McCarthy (R-CA) that they don't mind if the speaker vote goes to plurality and Rep. Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY) is elected because they will fight him"

---

Jeffries would then clear the hurdle. So, in context, the holdouts are threatening to stand aside and let the will of the House prevail, not collude with the other side. It is moderates who will collude. It happens every session in the Tx legislature....Dems effectively pick the Speaker of the Tx House. And, as some posts above indicate (as I predicted), it is moderates who will do that same gambit in the US House.

---

I'm betting your state rep voted for the prevailing Tx speaker, Mr republican board member

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Probably. It would be the sensible thing to do since it's fait accompli. What does that have to do with the topic we are discussing?

---

You referenced moderates who colluded. You also said Freedom Caucus members who voted in a manner that resulted in a Democrat Speaker were not colluding. Trying to figure out what the difference is. Both result in a Democrat speaker.

You said: So, in context, the holdouts are threatening to stand aside and let the will of the House prevail, not collude with the other side. It is moderates who will collude.

RMF5630 said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

RMF5630 said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

Some movement toward McCarthy on the 12th vote, but he still will not get there

---

This is why the Dem's are kicking GOP ass. They support the larger movement, they would have had a Speaker on the 2nd vote.

---

Dems never bring this to the floor. There have been 7 people against Pelosi. They work it out before it gets like this. (Republicans used to, too).

---

My point exactly. I remember one time where Pelosi had to meet with people, I thought it was the 2nd ballot but I may be wrong. GOP is messed up. This is not the way to slow up Biden's agenda, not being able to even stay together to get a Speaker?

---

The dissident Right's argument is that McCarthy is not gonna actually disrupt much of the Biden agenda.

At least not on anything but tax rates and judicial appointments.

McCarthy is not going to allow laws to be passed that secure the border, cut spending, end the expensive proxy war in Ukraine, or really do much else conservative at all.

Just lots of endless "investigations" into Hunter Biden.

Scoop: Emerging deal McCarthy is discussing would propose a roughly $75B cut in defense, sources tell ⁦@rtiron⁩ ⁦@JenniferJJacobs⁩ ⁦@DanielPFlatley⁩.

This won’t sit well with GOP defense hawks on armed services & appropriations panels. https://t.co/KZCX0P90IK

— annmarie hordern (@annmarie) January 6, 2023

Osodecentx said:

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whiterock said:

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Osodecentx said:

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whiterock said:

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Osodecentx said:

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whiterock said:

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Osodecentx said:

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Quote:

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Quote:

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Quote:

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Quote:

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Lol. From the guy whose preferred candidate for Speaker could not get the votes after three attempts.

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I don't have a preferred candidate. It's your party and your **** show.

---

Then stop complaining that a handful of conservative insurgents are standing against Kevin McCarthy. Not your fight.
Our Andy McCarthy no relation to the aspiring speaker points out that if twelve House Republicans voted "present," New York Democrat Hakeem Jeffries could be elected speaker. That scenario is unlikely, but there was a report yesterday that "Reps. Matt Gaetz (R-FL), Lauren Boebert (R-CO) and Scott Perry (R-PA) told Rep. Kevin McCarthy (R-CA) that they don't mind if the speaker vote goes to plurality and Rep. Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY) is elected because they will fight him"

In other words, at least a handful of House Republicans are saying they're fine with a Democratic speaker and Democrats effectively controlling the House, despite the outcome of the 2022 midterm elections. Note that these are exactly the kinds of Republicans who call each other "RINO," contend that other Republicans aren't tough enough or smart enough, and simply believe that others aren't willing to do what it takes to win.
Right now, in the House, the GOP is a nominal or technical majority party with a large faction which has no interest in acting like a majority. They may well be happier being in the minority.
https://www.nationalreview.com/the-morning-jolt/what-the-speaker-fight-says-about-the-republican-party/

---

I think I mentioned a scenario like this to you in another thread……just a scenario, at this point.

---

I believe your concern was moderate Republicans cutting a deal that resulted in a Democrat Speaker. This scenario is the Gaetz/Boebert group doing a kamikazie which results in a Democrat Speaker

---

That's not the way I read "goes to plurality." Far more likely that mods crossover to cut some kind of deal with Dems to get enough votes for McCarthy or some other moderate Republican, offering up rules more favorable to the minority, promised legislation, one or more committee chairmanships. There is a template for that kind of structure = the Texas legislature. The organizer of such effort is invariably.....the speaker.

Think about motive. The only viable reason to cross over to Dems is to gain the speakership........

---

Motive would be to create chaos in which the dead enders prosper. Nobody knew who these people were 1 week ago. Now that there is chaos, they are getting hours of air time and notoriety.
The process would be to not vote for anyone, thus lowering the threshold vote necessary to be elected Speaker.

note they actually said it: That scenario is unlikely, but there was a report yesterday that "Reps. Matt Gaetz (R-FL), Lauren Boebert (R-CO) and Scott Perry (R-PA) told Rep. Kevin McCarthy (R-CA) that they don't mind if the speaker vote goes to plurality and Rep. Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY) is elected because they will fight him"

---

Jeffries would then clear the hurdle. So, in context, the holdouts are threatening to stand aside and let the will of the House prevail, not collude with the other side. It is moderates who will collude. It happens every session in the Tx legislature....Dems effectively pick the Speaker of the Tx House. And, as some posts above indicate (as I predicted), it is moderates who will do that same gambit in the US House.

---

I'm betting your state rep voted for the prevailing Tx speaker, Mr republican board member

---

Probably. It would be the sensible thing to do since it's fait accompli. What does that have to do with the topic we are discussing?

---

You referenced moderates who colluded. You also said Freedom Caucus members who voted in a manner that resulted in a Democrat Speaker were not colluding. Trying to figure out what the difference is. Both result in a Democrat speaker.

You said: So, in context, the holdouts are threatening to stand aside and let the will of the House prevail, not collude with the other side. It is moderates who will collude.

---

If the GOP gives in to a coalition Government, I am done...

Redbrickbear said:

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RMF5630 said:

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Mitch Blood Green said:

---

RMF5630 said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

Some movement toward McCarthy on the 12th vote, but he still will not get there

---

This is why the Dem's are kicking GOP ass. They support the larger movement, they would have had a Speaker on the 2nd vote.

---

Dems never bring this to the floor. There have been 7 people against Pelosi. They work it out before it gets like this. (Republicans used to, too).

---

My point exactly. I remember one time where Pelosi had to meet with people, I thought it was the 2nd ballot but I may be wrong. GOP is messed up. This is not the way to slow up Biden's agenda, not being able to even stay together to get a Speaker?

---

The dissident Right's argument is that McCarthy is not gonna actually disrupt much of the Biden agenda.

At least not on anything but tax rates and judicial appointments.

McCarthy is not going to allow laws to be passed that secure the border, cut spending, end the expensive proxy war in Ukraine, or really do much else conservative at all.

Just lots of endless "investigations" into Hunter Biden.

---

McCarthy, like Trump, needs to go.

Those that say that Trump still has a shot at President, they can't even get the Speaker elected with a majority. This group needs to sit back, they are poison.

McCarthy just told me he has the votes to be elected speaker tonight

— Manu Raju (@mkraju) January 6, 2023

boognish_bear said:

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McCarthy just told me he has the votes to be elected speaker tonight

— Manu Raju (@mkraju) January 6, 2023

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Cause for celebration on the 14th vote? They are riding the GOP down the toilet.

Republicans tend to stand on principle. The Democrats always prioritize party. The former is better for the country, the latter better for the party.

RMF5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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RMF5630 said:

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Mitch Blood Green said:

---

RMF5630 said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

Some movement toward McCarthy on the 12th vote, but he still will not get there

---

This is why the Dem's are kicking GOP ass. They support the larger movement, they would have had a Speaker on the 2nd vote.

---

Dems never bring this to the floor. There have been 7 people against Pelosi. They work it out before it gets like this. (Republicans used to, too).

---

My point exactly. I remember one time where Pelosi had to meet with people, I thought it was the 2nd ballot but I may be wrong. GOP is messed up. This is not the way to slow up Biden's agenda, not being able to even stay together to get a Speaker?

---

The dissident Right's argument is that McCarthy is not gonna actually disrupt much of the Biden agenda.

At least not on anything but tax rates and judicial appointments.

McCarthy is not going to allow laws to be passed that secure the border, cut spending, end the expensive proxy war in Ukraine, or really do much else conservative at all.

Just lots of endless "investigations" into Hunter Biden.

---

McCarthy, like Trump, needs to go.

Those that say that Trump still has a shot at President, they can't even get the Speaker elected with a majority. This group needs to sit back, they are poison.

---

I would be happy to see Trump out of the picture if the GOP establishment would go away as well.

A source said that Crane is concerned about the politics of supporting McCarthy in his red district. Rosendale has positioned himself to the right of any potential primary foe if he decides to run for Senate in 2024. Fellow Montanan Ryan Zinke has backed McCarthy.

— Manu Raju (@mkraju) January 6, 2023

They aren't going to disrupt any judicial appointments mo matter who the Speaker is. In fact, with an opposing House not sending over anything viable, the Senate will have nothing to do except confirm judges. That's how and why Trump got so many appointed in his last 2yrs, Dems took the House so the Senate just focused on confirming appointments.

I'm glad they are working it out. It sounds like the hold outs are getting good concessions from him and he is slowly winning them over.

I read the GOP worked on harmony with McCarthy as speaker during the off season but as they were expecting a red wave, McCarthy told members of the holdout 20 to buzz off with their concerns. No red wave and their concerns were back in play.

One concern is he might start losing votes from loyal members if he gives away too much to the holdout 20. But so far that hasn't happened.

I'm a bit of a contrarian and I think the GOP will emerge more unified and stronger because of this. McCarthy may appreciate his position more having to work extra hard to get it.

boognish_bear said:

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A source said that Crane is concerned about the politics of supporting McCarthy in his red district. Rosendale has positioned himself to the right of any potential primary foe if he decides to run for Senate in 2024. Fellow Montanan Ryan Zinke has backed McCarthy.

— Manu Raju (@mkraju) January 6, 2023

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I am pretty sure < 5% of voters care about the internal Speaker vote.

boognish_bear said:

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McCarthy just told me he has the votes to be elected speaker tonight

— Manu Raju (@mkraju) January 6, 2023

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Checks must have cleared.

boognish_bear said:

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McCarthy just told me he has the votes to be elected speaker tonight

— Manu Raju (@mkraju) January 6, 2023

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be interesting to see where the votes come from..

HuMcK said:

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They aren't going to disrupt any judicial appointments mo matter who the Speaker is. In fact, with an opposing House not sending over anything viable, the Senate will have nothing to do except confirm judges. That's how and why Trump got so many appointed in his last 2yrs, Dems took the House so the Senate just focused on confirming appointments.

---

So even less of a reason to care if McCarthy gets his speakership.

McCarthy, what we'd call by all means Establishment, comes from that bygone era of Tea Party optimism in Republican Leadership, a policy focus where thsoe like Cantor or Ryan might lead the way, almost as if they wrote a book on it... pic.twitter.com/hcLvOCq3Zw

— The Prudentialist (@MrPrudentialist) January 6, 2023

We're seeing as somewhat accurately pointed out, a quasi-rebellion against the establishment, the uniparty by a minority of Republican members of the house for something different. Whether that's leverage for committee positions or a change in leadership, only time will tell. pic.twitter.com/tp5jx7YhFk

— The Prudentialist (@MrPrudentialist) January 6, 2023

While some say #NotHappening, which is definitely understandable, it does show that era of politics that many of us grew up with is long gone, and whatever comes next shows us where the fracture points may lie. pic.twitter.com/Fs9SS44tTT

— The Prudentialist (@MrPrudentialist) January 6, 2023

For the sake of the American people and the future of our country, Republicans must not settle for Kevin McCarthy.

— Congressman Bob Good (@RepBobGood) January 5, 2023

So close....back to the drawing board

Rep. Matt Gaetz (R-Fla.), the final GOP holdout to vote, has voted “present.”https://t.co/FNaMcwt294 pic.twitter.com/CJ36JK61j0

— The Hill (@thehill) January 7, 2023

Gaetz wanted to adjourn til Monday, sources tell me and @AnnieGrayerCNN

— Manu Raju (@mkraju) January 7, 2023