Why Are We in Ukraine?

635,546 Views | 8139 Replies | Last: 2 min ago by Doc Holliday
Redbrickbear
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ATL Bear said:

We were brought to our knees by people living in caves from all purposes 4th world countries .


Not even close to being true

The USA was and remained the greatest military and economic power on earth after the 9/11 attacks.

America then easily crushed Al Qaeda in Afghanistan and drove the Taliban from power.

When even easily invaded a decent size country like Iraq and toppled its Baathist government

(The long decades insurgent war to remake Afghanistan & Iraq being a different issue)

You really do seem to think that the USA and America power is a fragile thing
FLBear5630
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Sam Lowry said:

Redbrickbear said:

ron.reagan said:

historian said:



It wouldn't be the first time Russia was completely ignorant of the battlefield

Your takes are always funny

Russia is incompetent on the battlefield (they are)...but are also going to run through Warsaw & Berlin on their way to conquer Paris.....lol
The Russian army is highly competent at what it's designed to do, which is to defend Russia and its bordering regions. It's not in a posture that would enable it to attack Europe, and if that ever changed we would know years in advance. It's not something they could prepare overnight.
Really? Ever heard of Fulda Gap? What do you think the Russian legendary artillery is for? The Russian Army is exactly built to invade Europe. They are not built to invade across oceans, but roll tanks from their border to their neighbors that is Russian doctrine. Everything they have and do is designed to take neighboring territory.
The_barBEARian
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Redbrickbear said:

ATL Bear said:

We were brought to our knees by people living in caves from all purposes 4th world countries .


Not even close to being true

The USA was and remained the greatest military and economic power on earth after the 9/11 attacks.

America then easily crushed Al Qaeda in Afghanistan and drove the Taliban from power.

When even easily invaded a decent size country like Iraq and toppled its Baathist government

(The long decades insurgent war to remake Afghanistan & Iraq being a different issue)

You really do seem to think that the USA and America power is a fragile thing

The only thing that has brought America to its knees is our own corrupt politicians working with foreign lobbyists to launder our tax dollars.
Redbrickbear
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FLBear5630 said:

Sam Lowry said:

Redbrickbear said:

ron.reagan said:

historian said:



It wouldn't be the first time Russia was completely ignorant of the battlefield

Your takes are always funny

Russia is incompetent on the battlefield (they are)...but are also going to run through Warsaw & Berlin on their way to conquer Paris.....lol
The Russian army is highly competent at what it's designed to do, which is to defend Russia and its bordering regions. It's not in a posture that would enable it to attack Europe, and if that ever changed we would know years in advance. It's not something they could prepare overnight.
Ever heard of Fulda Gap? What do you think the Russian legendary artillery is for? The Russian Army is exactly built to invade Europe...


Exactly why we have the massive NATO alliance

A huge group of nations that would easily crush Russia if they ever attacked a NATO State.

(Belarus, Ukraine, Georgia are not NATO members)
sombear
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KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

I did enjoy seeing the little French Guy (Macron) run circles around Trump yesterday. Charmed the crap out of him as Trump loves, then Macron punched him in the nose relative to the structure of the European "loan" as Trump said. Macron fact checked the Liar in Chief in real time on TV and set him straight. The look on Trump's fat face was priceless.
Amusing how we all look situations differently.

Often twisting realities to enhance our pre conceived notions.

I just want to see this war end and hopefully get some of the billions Biden gave away returned to benefit American taxpayers.
I think everyone want to see the war end, just like Israel /Gaza. The FACT that Trump continues to repeat that Ukraine was the aggressor and started the war. No one in their right mind could possibly believe that. For anyone who does, please let me know the specifics. Did Russia invade Ukraine or not? Unbelievable that our President can get people to believe it. Howdy Hitler.
Not everyone wants to see the war end on realistic terms.

Ukraine's military is clearly bleeding to death.

Her infrastructure blasted; the people worn out.

Trump is right to push for a settlement....Biden never had the juice to do so.

Don't agree with all of Trump's comments; however I suspect he is looking beyond a truce and attempting to build some long term business realationships with Russia as a way to have real security in Europe.
Russia has no more territory than it had in April 2022.

Russia, not Ukraine, has had to bring in tens of thousands of troops from North Korea, Yemen, and North Africa. And some estimates have half their new weapons and ammo coming from China, North Korea, and Iran.

While I've argued they should have done it much sooner, Ukraine is just now focusing on recruiting their younger populations. And they are setting equipment/weapon production records.

To be clear, I am not arguing all rosy for Ukraine or even that they're winning, but Russia is in a world of hurt also. And interest rates are really starting to do some damage.
Sam Lowry
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FLBear5630 said:

Sam Lowry said:

Redbrickbear said:

ron.reagan said:

historian said:



It wouldn't be the first time Russia was completely ignorant of the battlefield

Your takes are always funny

Russia is incompetent on the battlefield (they are)...but are also going to run through Warsaw & Berlin on their way to conquer Paris.....lol
The Russian army is highly competent at what it's designed to do, which is to defend Russia and its bordering regions. It's not in a posture that would enable it to attack Europe, and if that ever changed we would know years in advance. It's not something they could prepare overnight.
Really? Ever heard of Fulda Gap? What do you think the Russian legendary artillery is for? The Russian Army is exactly built to invade Europe. They are not built to invade across oceans, but roll tanks from their border to their neighbors that is Russian doctrine. Everything they have and do is designed to take neighboring territory.
That is the opposite of Russian doctrine since the Cold War, especially under Putin.
Assassin
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Facebook Groups at; Memories of: Dallas, Texas, Football in Texas, Texas Music, Through a Texas Lens and also Dallas History Guild. Come visit!
FLBear5630
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Redbrickbear said:

FLBear5630 said:

Sam Lowry said:

Redbrickbear said:

ron.reagan said:

historian said:



It wouldn't be the first time Russia was completely ignorant of the battlefield

Your takes are always funny

Russia is incompetent on the battlefield (they are)...but are also going to run through Warsaw & Berlin on their way to conquer Paris.....lol
The Russian army is highly competent at what it's designed to do, which is to defend Russia and its bordering regions. It's not in a posture that would enable it to attack Europe, and if that ever changed we would know years in advance. It's not something they could prepare overnight.
Ever heard of Fulda Gap? What do you think the Russian legendary artillery is for? The Russian Army is exactly built to invade Europe...


Exactly why we have the massive NATO alliance

A huge group of nations that would easily crush Russia if they ever attacked a NATO State.

(Belarus, Ukraine, Georgia are not NATO members)
I don't disagree with you.

But to say Russia is a "regional, defensive" force? That is a stretch.
Sam Lowry
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sombear said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

I did enjoy seeing the little French Guy (Macron) run circles around Trump yesterday. Charmed the crap out of him as Trump loves, then Macron punched him in the nose relative to the structure of the European "loan" as Trump said. Macron fact checked the Liar in Chief in real time on TV and set him straight. The look on Trump's fat face was priceless.
Amusing how we all look situations differently.

Often twisting realities to enhance our pre conceived notions.

I just want to see this war end and hopefully get some of the billions Biden gave away returned to benefit American taxpayers.
I think everyone want to see the war end, just like Israel /Gaza. The FACT that Trump continues to repeat that Ukraine was the aggressor and started the war. No one in their right mind could possibly believe that. For anyone who does, please let me know the specifics. Did Russia invade Ukraine or not? Unbelievable that our President can get people to believe it. Howdy Hitler.
Not everyone wants to see the war end on realistic terms.

Ukraine's military is clearly bleeding to death.

Her infrastructure blasted; the people worn out.

Trump is right to push for a settlement....Biden never had the juice to do so.

Don't agree with all of Trump's comments; however I suspect he is looking beyond a truce and attempting to build some long term business realationships with Russia as a way to have real security in Europe.
Russia has no more territory than it had in April 2022.

Russia, not Ukraine, has had to bring in tens of thousands of troops from North Korea, Yemen, and North Africa. And some estimates have half their new weapons and ammo coming from China, North Korea, and Iran.

While I've argued they should have done it much sooner, Ukraine is just now focusing on recruiting their younger populations. And they are setting equipment/weapon production records.

To be clear, I am not arguing all rosy for Ukraine or even that they're winning, but Russia is in a world of hurt also. And interest rates are really starting to do some damage.
Russia is in a much different and much better position than in 2022.

On a side note, those phantom Korean troops were mysteriously withdrawn last month, without ever having shown a sign of their existence.
Bear8084
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Sam Lowry said:

sombear said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

I did enjoy seeing the little French Guy (Macron) run circles around Trump yesterday. Charmed the crap out of him as Trump loves, then Macron punched him in the nose relative to the structure of the European "loan" as Trump said. Macron fact checked the Liar in Chief in real time on TV and set him straight. The look on Trump's fat face was priceless.
Amusing how we all look situations differently.

Often twisting realities to enhance our pre conceived notions.

I just want to see this war end and hopefully get some of the billions Biden gave away returned to benefit American taxpayers.
I think everyone want to see the war end, just like Israel /Gaza. The FACT that Trump continues to repeat that Ukraine was the aggressor and started the war. No one in their right mind could possibly believe that. For anyone who does, please let me know the specifics. Did Russia invade Ukraine or not? Unbelievable that our President can get people to believe it. Howdy Hitler.
Not everyone wants to see the war end on realistic terms.

Ukraine's military is clearly bleeding to death.

Her infrastructure blasted; the people worn out.

Trump is right to push for a settlement....Biden never had the juice to do so.

Don't agree with all of Trump's comments; however I suspect he is looking beyond a truce and attempting to build some long term business realationships with Russia as a way to have real security in Europe.
Russia has no more territory than it had in April 2022.

Russia, not Ukraine, has had to bring in tens of thousands of troops from North Korea, Yemen, and North Africa. And some estimates have half their new weapons and ammo coming from China, North Korea, and Iran.

While I've argued they should have done it much sooner, Ukraine is just now focusing on recruiting their younger populations. And they are setting equipment/weapon production records.

To be clear, I am not arguing all rosy for Ukraine or even that they're winning, but Russia is in a world of hurt also. And interest rates are really starting to do some damage.
Russia is in a much different and much better position than in 2022.

On a side note, those phantom Korean troops were mysteriously withdrawn last month, without ever having shown a sign of their existence.


LMAO. No, liar.
Sam Lowry
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FLBear5630 said:

Redbrickbear said:

FLBear5630 said:

Sam Lowry said:

Redbrickbear said:

ron.reagan said:

historian said:



It wouldn't be the first time Russia was completely ignorant of the battlefield

Your takes are always funny

Russia is incompetent on the battlefield (they are)...but are also going to run through Warsaw & Berlin on their way to conquer Paris.....lol
The Russian army is highly competent at what it's designed to do, which is to defend Russia and its bordering regions. It's not in a posture that would enable it to attack Europe, and if that ever changed we would know years in advance. It's not something they could prepare overnight.
Ever heard of Fulda Gap? What do you think the Russian legendary artillery is for? The Russian Army is exactly built to invade Europe...


Exactly why we have the massive NATO alliance

A huge group of nations that would easily crush Russia if they ever attacked a NATO State.

(Belarus, Ukraine, Georgia are not NATO members)
I don't disagree with you.

But to say Russia is a "regional, defensive" force? That is a stretch.
No stretch at all, it's common knowledge.
Redbrickbear
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sombear said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

I did enjoy seeing the little French Guy (Macron) run circles around Trump yesterday. Charmed the crap out of him as Trump loves, then Macron punched him in the nose relative to the structure of the European "loan" as Trump said. Macron fact checked the Liar in Chief in real time on TV and set him straight. The look on Trump's fat face was priceless.
Amusing how we all look situations differently.

Often twisting realities to enhance our pre conceived notions.

I just want to see this war end and hopefully get some of the billions Biden gave away returned to benefit American taxpayers.
I think everyone want to see the war end, just like Israel /Gaza. The FACT that Trump continues to repeat that Ukraine was the aggressor and started the war. No one in their right mind could possibly believe that. For anyone who does, please let me know the specifics. Did Russia invade Ukraine or not? Unbelievable that our President can get people to believe it. Howdy Hitler.
Not everyone wants to see the war end on realistic terms.

Ukraine's military is clearly bleeding to death.

Her infrastructure blasted; the people worn out.

Trump is right to push for a settlement....Biden never had the juice to do so.

Don't agree with all of Trump's comments; however I suspect he is looking beyond a truce and attempting to build some long term business realationships with Russia as a way to have real security in Europe.
Russia has no more territory than it had in April 2022.

Russia, not Ukraine, has had to bring in tens of thousands of troops from North Korea, Yemen, and North Africa. And some estimates have half their new weapons and ammo coming from China, North Korea, and Iran.



1. So the front line is static...Russia can't even advance past what it held 3 years ago

2. Russia has to rely on conscript forces from 2nd and 3rd world Nations

How do these facts change the narrative about how Russia is this great threat that the USA needs to confront in a bloody proxy war? Or else Russia will invade the rest of Europe....
TinFoilHatPreacherBear
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Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

I did enjoy seeing the little French Guy (Macron) run circles around Trump yesterday. Charmed the crap out of him as Trump loves, then Macron punched him in the nose relative to the structure of the European "loan" as Trump said. Macron fact checked the Liar in Chief in real time on TV and set him straight. The look on Trump's fat face was priceless.
Amusing how we all look situations differently.

Often twisting realities to enhance our pre conceived notions.

I just want to see this war end and hopefully get some of the billions Biden gave away returned to benefit American taxpayers.
I think everyone want to see the war end, just like Israel /Gaza. The FACT that Trump continues to repeat that Ukraine was the aggressor and started the war. No one in their right mind could possibly believe that. For anyone who does, please let me know the specifics. Did Russia invade Ukraine or not? Unbelievable that our President can get people to believe it. Howdy Hitler.
Not everyone wants to see the war end on realistic terms.

Ukraine's military is clearly bleeding to death.

Her infrastructure blasted; the people worn out.

Trump is right to push for a settlement....Biden never had the juice to do so.

Don't agree with all of Trump's comments; however I suspect he is looking beyond a truce and attempting to build some long term business realationships with Russia as a way to have real security in Europe.
Russia has no more territory than it had in April 2022.

Russia, not Ukraine, has had to bring in tens of thousands of troops from North Korea, Yemen, and North Africa. And some estimates have half their new weapons and ammo coming from China, North Korea, and Iran.



1. So the front line is static...Russia can't even advance past what it held 3 years ago

2. Russia has to rely on conscript forces from 2nd and 3rd world Nations

How do these facts change the narrative about how Russia is this great threat that the USA needs to confront in a bloody proxy war? Or else Russia will invade the rest of Europe....


Just curious, I don't know if Russia can or cannot advance, but do you all think that maybe Russia has achieved its objective. Meaning it doesn't need to advance, but instead dig in, while waiting out the Ukrainian and European will to fight?

Clearly, my gut would tell me that continuing to advance would serve Russia better, so maybe they can't or it's not worth the risk of going to far in and rousing up the entirety of Europe. Or maybe the Ukraine is that strong to keep them in place.

Logistics of this war are just counter intuitive to me. I'd have assumed that Russia could get as far as they want over years of grind. But it's looking like that was a wrong assumption, or so it seems.
Thee tinfoil hat couch-potato prognosticator, not a bible school preacher.


sombear
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Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

I did enjoy seeing the little French Guy (Macron) run circles around Trump yesterday. Charmed the crap out of him as Trump loves, then Macron punched him in the nose relative to the structure of the European "loan" as Trump said. Macron fact checked the Liar in Chief in real time on TV and set him straight. The look on Trump's fat face was priceless.
Amusing how we all look situations differently.

Often twisting realities to enhance our pre conceived notions.

I just want to see this war end and hopefully get some of the billions Biden gave away returned to benefit American taxpayers.
I think everyone want to see the war end, just like Israel /Gaza. The FACT that Trump continues to repeat that Ukraine was the aggressor and started the war. No one in their right mind could possibly believe that. For anyone who does, please let me know the specifics. Did Russia invade Ukraine or not? Unbelievable that our President can get people to believe it. Howdy Hitler.
Not everyone wants to see the war end on realistic terms.

Ukraine's military is clearly bleeding to death.

Her infrastructure blasted; the people worn out.

Trump is right to push for a settlement....Biden never had the juice to do so.

Don't agree with all of Trump's comments; however I suspect he is looking beyond a truce and attempting to build some long term business realationships with Russia as a way to have real security in Europe.
Russia has no more territory than it had in April 2022.

Russia, not Ukraine, has had to bring in tens of thousands of troops from North Korea, Yemen, and North Africa. And some estimates have half their new weapons and ammo coming from China, North Korea, and Iran.



1. So the front line is static...Russia can't even advance past what it held 3 years ago

2. Russia has to rely on conscript forces from 2nd and 3rd world Nations

How do these facts change the narrative about how Russia is this great threat that the USA needs to confront in a bloody proxy war? Or else Russia will invade the rest of Europe....
I've never argued that Russia is a threat to invade the rest of Europe.

But, yes, Russia is a threat to the U.S. geopolitically and in other significant ways simply virtue of being on the opposite side on most major world issues, trying to undermine us in every region of the world, and aligning with our worst enemies.

And I do not dismiss Russia invading additional Euro countries.

The biggest threat to me, and I hate to sound so nihilistic, is that some point we will go to war with China. It may be direct, it me direct but in another country, it may be aggressive proxy. But it will happen. And the more Russia supports China and vice versa, the worse off we are.

Finally, Russia's difficulties in Ukraine doesn't mean they are weak per se. Rather, most of the world strongly underestimate Ukraine's resolve and skill, and, of course, we cannot understate how much support the free world has given Ukraine.
The_barBEARian
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sombear said:

Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

I did enjoy seeing the little French Guy (Macron) run circles around Trump yesterday. Charmed the crap out of him as Trump loves, then Macron punched him in the nose relative to the structure of the European "loan" as Trump said. Macron fact checked the Liar in Chief in real time on TV and set him straight. The look on Trump's fat face was priceless.
Amusing how we all look situations differently.

Often twisting realities to enhance our pre conceived notions.

I just want to see this war end and hopefully get some of the billions Biden gave away returned to benefit American taxpayers.
I think everyone want to see the war end, just like Israel /Gaza. The FACT that Trump continues to repeat that Ukraine was the aggressor and started the war. No one in their right mind could possibly believe that. For anyone who does, please let me know the specifics. Did Russia invade Ukraine or not? Unbelievable that our President can get people to believe it. Howdy Hitler.
Not everyone wants to see the war end on realistic terms.

Ukraine's military is clearly bleeding to death.

Her infrastructure blasted; the people worn out.

Trump is right to push for a settlement....Biden never had the juice to do so.

Don't agree with all of Trump's comments; however I suspect he is looking beyond a truce and attempting to build some long term business realationships with Russia as a way to have real security in Europe.
Russia has no more territory than it had in April 2022.

Russia, not Ukraine, has had to bring in tens of thousands of troops from North Korea, Yemen, and North Africa. And some estimates have half their new weapons and ammo coming from China, North Korea, and Iran.



1. So the front line is static...Russia can't even advance past what it held 3 years ago

2. Russia has to rely on conscript forces from 2nd and 3rd world Nations

How do these facts change the narrative about how Russia is this great threat that the USA needs to confront in a bloody proxy war? Or else Russia will invade the rest of Europe....
I've never argued that Russia is a threat to invade the rest of Europe.

But, yes, Russia is a threat to the U.S. geopolitically and in other significant ways simply virtue of being on the opposite side on most major world issues, trying to undermine us in every region of the world, and aligning with our worst enemies.

And I do not dismiss Russia invading additional Euro countries.

The biggest threat to me, and I hate to sound so nihilistic, is that some point we will go to war with China. It may be direct, it me direct but in another country, it may be aggressive proxy. But it will happen. And the more Russia supports China and vice versa, the worse off we are.

Finally, Russia's difficulties in Ukraine doesn't mean they are weak per se. Rather, most of the world strongly underestimate Ukraine's resolve and skill, and, of course, we cannot understate how much support the free world has given Ukraine.

Most of us of founding American stock are also on the opposite side of our government on most major world issues... or at least we were until Trump got elected.

As a Serbian, dont you dream of a day Serbian flags fly high over Kosovo again?

A Russian/American alliance is the only chance that ever becomes a reality.
Redbrickbear
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sombear said:

Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

I did enjoy seeing the little French Guy (Macron) run circles around Trump yesterday. Charmed the crap out of him as Trump loves, then Macron punched him in the nose relative to the structure of the European "loan" as Trump said. Macron fact checked the Liar in Chief in real time on TV and set him straight. The look on Trump's fat face was priceless.
Amusing how we all look situations differently.

Often twisting realities to enhance our pre conceived notions.

I just want to see this war end and hopefully get some of the billions Biden gave away returned to benefit American taxpayers.
I think everyone want to see the war end, just like Israel /Gaza. The FACT that Trump continues to repeat that Ukraine was the aggressor and started the war. No one in their right mind could possibly believe that. For anyone who does, please let me know the specifics. Did Russia invade Ukraine or not? Unbelievable that our President can get people to believe it. Howdy Hitler.
Not everyone wants to see the war end on realistic terms.

Ukraine's military is clearly bleeding to death.

Her infrastructure blasted; the people worn out.

Trump is right to push for a settlement....Biden never had the juice to do so.

Don't agree with all of Trump's comments; however I suspect he is looking beyond a truce and attempting to build some long term business realationships with Russia as a way to have real security in Europe.
Russia has no more territory than it had in April 2022.

Russia, not Ukraine, has had to bring in tens of thousands of troops from North Korea, Yemen, and North Africa. And some estimates have half their new weapons and ammo coming from China, North Korea, and Iran.



1. So the front line is static...Russia can't even advance past what it held 3 years ago

2. Russia has to rely on conscript forces from 2nd and 3rd world Nations

How do these facts change the narrative about how Russia is this great threat that the USA needs to confront in a bloody proxy war? Or else Russia will invade the rest of Europe....


But, yes, Russia is a threat to the U.S. geopolitically and in other significant ways simply virtue of being on the opposite side on most major world issues, trying to undermine us in every region of the world, and aligning with our worst enemies.



How much of that opposition has come directly from DC-Brussels actions and how much of it was Russian actions?

After all Russia is a different civilization (Orthodox Civilization according to Huntington) but not that much different than the West. They could be partners and not enemies.

"Bluntly stated...expanding NATO would be the most fateful error of American policy in the entire post-Cold War era. Such a decision may be expected to inflame the nationalistic, anti-Western and militaristic tendencies in Russian opinion; to have an adverse effect on the development of Russian democracy; to restore the atmosphere of the cold war to East-West relations, and to impel Russian foreign policy in directions decidedly not to our liking … "- Excerpt from George F. Kennan, "A Fateful Error," New York Times, 05 Feb 1997

"I sometimes wonder if our leaders actually want to drive Russia into an angry, sullen isolation. Russians are proud and patriotic. They are as wounded by the loss of status and empire as we were in the Fifties. Why rub their noses in it, week by week, by keeping NATO alive years after it should have been wound up and by threatening to extend it into Ukraine and Georgia. It is by doing things such as this that we created Vladimir Putin. This alliance does not have the military strength to defend its overstretched frontiers and will look very silly if a future Kremlin decides to pressure its neighbors, who will then call on NATO for help and find that none comes." -Peter Hitchens


Redbrickbear
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TinFoilHatPreacherBear said:

Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

I did enjoy seeing the little French Guy (Macron) run circles around Trump yesterday. Charmed the crap out of him as Trump loves, then Macron punched him in the nose relative to the structure of the European "loan" as Trump said. Macron fact checked the Liar in Chief in real time on TV and set him straight. The look on Trump's fat face was priceless.
Amusing how we all look situations differently.

Often twisting realities to enhance our pre conceived notions.

I just want to see this war end and hopefully get some of the billions Biden gave away returned to benefit American taxpayers.
I think everyone want to see the war end, just like Israel /Gaza. The FACT that Trump continues to repeat that Ukraine was the aggressor and started the war. No one in their right mind could possibly believe that. For anyone who does, please let me know the specifics. Did Russia invade Ukraine or not? Unbelievable that our President can get people to believe it. Howdy Hitler.
Not everyone wants to see the war end on realistic terms.

Ukraine's military is clearly bleeding to death.

Her infrastructure blasted; the people worn out.

Trump is right to push for a settlement....Biden never had the juice to do so.

Don't agree with all of Trump's comments; however I suspect he is looking beyond a truce and attempting to build some long term business realationships with Russia as a way to have real security in Europe.
Russia has no more territory than it had in April 2022.

Russia, not Ukraine, has had to bring in tens of thousands of troops from North Korea, Yemen, and North Africa. And some estimates have half their new weapons and ammo coming from China, North Korea, and Iran.



1. So the front line is static...Russia can't even advance past what it held 3 years ago

2. Russia has to rely on conscript forces from 2nd and 3rd world Nations

How do these facts change the narrative about how Russia is this great threat that the USA needs to confront in a bloody proxy war? Or else Russia will invade the rest of Europe....


Just curious, I don't know if Russia can or cannot advance, but do you all think that maybe Russia has achieved its objective. Meaning it doesn't need to advance, but instead dig in, while waiting out the Ukrainian and European will to fight?



Maybe...but I doubt that.

I think they would love to meet their original military objective and get to Kyiv and install a new government to their likening.

Or at the very least advance farther in the ethnic russian inhabited areas of Southern Ukraine (all the way to Odessa) and thus give them an even bigger area of land to negotiate with the USA over....and more breathing room in terms of a buffer zone with the Ukrainian State (aka the West)

Pretty obvious they have been stopped because the Russian army is just not that good, not that effective, does not have great equipment, and does not have great commanders.....not to mention Russian soldiers just are not that motivated in this fight.
FLBear5630
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Sam Lowry said:

FLBear5630 said:

Redbrickbear said:

FLBear5630 said:

Sam Lowry said:

Redbrickbear said:

ron.reagan said:

historian said:



It wouldn't be the first time Russia was completely ignorant of the battlefield

Your takes are always funny

Russia is incompetent on the battlefield (they are)...but are also going to run through Warsaw & Berlin on their way to conquer Paris.....lol
The Russian army is highly competent at what it's designed to do, which is to defend Russia and its bordering regions. It's not in a posture that would enable it to attack Europe, and if that ever changed we would know years in advance. It's not something they could prepare overnight.
Ever heard of Fulda Gap? What do you think the Russian legendary artillery is for? The Russian Army is exactly built to invade Europe...


Exactly why we have the massive NATO alliance

A huge group of nations that would easily crush Russia if they ever attacked a NATO State.

(Belarus, Ukraine, Georgia are not NATO members)
I don't disagree with you.

But to say Russia is a "regional, defensive" force? That is a stretch.
No stretch at all, it's common knowledge.
Common knowledge?? Who the hell are you talking to? May want to revisit your sources.

The Russian military does not see itself, nor trains to be a regional defensive force. Tanks are offensive weapons, you don't build a corps of 12,600 tanks for defense. To put in perspective, the US has about 5500. Russia has 6000 self-propelled artillery. You don't build self-propelled artillery for defense. Russia is built for offensive operations in Europe.

But, you don't invade other Nations on defense, but you seem to not get that either.
ATL Bear
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Redbrickbear said:

ATL Bear said:

We were brought to our knees by people living in caves from all purposes 4th world countries .


Not even close to being true

The USA was and remained the greatest military and economic power on earth after the 9/11 attacks.

America then easily crushed Al Qaeda in Afghanistan and drove the Taliban from power.

When even easily invaded a decent size country like Iraq and toppled its Baathist government

(The long decades insurgent war to remake Afghanistan & Iraq being a different issue)

You really do seem to think that the USA and America power is a fragile thing
You are such a simpleton. We literally lost Trillions, have put significant restraints around our personal freedoms, built giant security apparatuses, not to mention lost lives and massive spending. And that's before we get to the wars and battles. We were knocked down. What we got up as is fodder for much debate, and we are in a continuous state of getting up if we're honest,
The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
ATL Bear said:

Redbrickbear said:

ATL Bear said:

We were brought to our knees by people living in caves from all purposes 4th world countries .


Not even close to being true

The USA was and remained the greatest military and economic power on earth after the 9/11 attacks.

America then easily crushed Al Qaeda in Afghanistan and drove the Taliban from power.

When even easily invaded a decent size country like Iraq and toppled its Baathist government

(The long decades insurgent war to remake Afghanistan & Iraq being a different issue)

You really do seem to think that the USA and America power is a fragile thing
You are such a simpleton. We literally lost Trillions, have put significant restraints around our personal freedoms, built giant security apparatuses, not to mention lost lives and massive spending. And that's before we get to the wars and battles. We were knocked down. What we got up as is fodder for much debate, and we are in a continuous state of getting up if we're honest,
This is all true... but you are pointing your finger at the cave dwellers when in reality its the people in DC who caused all this.
ATL Bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

Redbrickbear said:

ATL Bear said:

We were brought to our knees by people living in caves from all purposes 4th world countries .


Not even close to being true

The USA was and remained the greatest military and economic power on earth after the 9/11 attacks.

America then easily crushed Al Qaeda in Afghanistan and drove the Taliban from power.

When even easily invaded a decent size country like Iraq and toppled its Baathist government

(The long decades insurgent war to remake Afghanistan & Iraq being a different issue)

You really do seem to think that the USA and America power is a fragile thing
You are such a simpleton. We literally lost Trillions, have put significant restraints around our personal freedoms, built giant security apparatuses, not to mention lost lives and massive spending. And that's before we get to the wars and battles. We were knocked down. What we got up as is fodder for much debate, and we are in a continuous state of getting up if we're honest,
This is all true... but you are pointing your finger at the cave dwellers when in reality its the people in DC who caused all this.

Fear caused all of this, and we welcomed it. That's how terrorism works.
KaiBear
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Sam Lowry said:

Redbrickbear said:

ron.reagan said:

historian said:



It wouldn't be the first time Russia was completely ignorant of the battlefield

Your takes are always funny

Russia is incompetent on the battlefield (they are)...but are also going to run through Warsaw & Berlin on their way to conquer Paris.....lol
The Russian army is highly competent at what it's designed to do, which is to defend Russia and its bordering regions. It's not in a posture that would enable it to attack Europe, and if that ever changed we would know years in advance. It's not something they could prepare overnight.


Russia tank divisions were built to invade Europe.
The_barBEARian
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ATL Bear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

Redbrickbear said:

ATL Bear said:

We were brought to our knees by people living in caves from all purposes 4th world countries .


Not even close to being true

The USA was and remained the greatest military and economic power on earth after the 9/11 attacks.

America then easily crushed Al Qaeda in Afghanistan and drove the Taliban from power.

When even easily invaded a decent size country like Iraq and toppled its Baathist government

(The long decades insurgent war to remake Afghanistan & Iraq being a different issue)

You really do seem to think that the USA and America power is a fragile thing
You are such a simpleton. We literally lost Trillions, have put significant restraints around our personal freedoms, built giant security apparatuses, not to mention lost lives and massive spending. And that's before we get to the wars and battles. We were knocked down. What we got up as is fodder for much debate, and we are in a continuous state of getting up if we're honest,
This is all true... but you are pointing your finger at the cave dwellers when in reality its the people in DC who caused all this.

Fear caused all of this, and we welcomed it. That's how terrorism works.

Who was afraid after 9/11?

Pissed the **** off, sure... but afraid?

And what do you mean by "we welcomed it".... you did maybe and are now having buyers remorse.... but many did not welcome the nation building in the middle east... the renewing of the Patriot Act.... the unsustainable spending and inability to balance a budget.

I dont know why you feel the need to defend failed politicians who squandered the abundance we were left with by the end of the 90ties.
Sam Lowry
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KaiBear said:

Sam Lowry said:

Redbrickbear said:

ron.reagan said:

historian said:



It wouldn't be the first time Russia was completely ignorant of the battlefield

Your takes are always funny

Russia is incompetent on the battlefield (they are)...but are also going to run through Warsaw & Berlin on their way to conquer Paris.....lol
The Russian army is highly competent at what it's designed to do, which is to defend Russia and its bordering regions. It's not in a posture that would enable it to attack Europe, and if that ever changed we would know years in advance. It's not something they could prepare overnight.


Russia tank divisions were built to invade Europe.
Tanks are an essential part of the Russian defensive strategy. They use them for rapid counterattacks after drawing the enemy into prepared positions. This is one of the ways they've depleted Ukraine's manpower and equipment so successfully over the last three years.
ATL Bear
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The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

Redbrickbear said:

ATL Bear said:

We were brought to our knees by people living in caves from all purposes 4th world countries .


Not even close to being true

The USA was and remained the greatest military and economic power on earth after the 9/11 attacks.

America then easily crushed Al Qaeda in Afghanistan and drove the Taliban from power.

When even easily invaded a decent size country like Iraq and toppled its Baathist government

(The long decades insurgent war to remake Afghanistan & Iraq being a different issue)

You really do seem to think that the USA and America power is a fragile thing
You are such a simpleton. We literally lost Trillions, have put significant restraints around our personal freedoms, built giant security apparatuses, not to mention lost lives and massive spending. And that's before we get to the wars and battles. We were knocked down. What we got up as is fodder for much debate, and we are in a continuous state of getting up if we're honest,
This is all true... but you are pointing your finger at the cave dwellers when in reality its the people in DC who caused all this.

Fear caused all of this, and we welcomed it. That's how terrorism works.

Who was afraid after 9/11?

Pissed the **** off, sure... but afraid?

And what do you mean by "we welcomed it".... you did maybe and are now having buyers remorse.... but many did not welcome the nation building in the middle east... the renewing of the Patriot Act.... the unsustainable spending and inability to balance a budget.

I dont know why you feel the need to defend failed politicians who squandered the abundance we were left with by the end of the 90ties.
Your bravado is amusing, but you wouldn't support going back to pre-9/11 security approaches.
Redbrickbear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
ATL Bear said:

Redbrickbear said:

ATL Bear said:

We were brought to our knees by people living in caves from all purposes 4th world countries .


Not even close to being true

The USA was and remained the greatest military and economic power on earth after the 9/11 attacks.

America then easily crushed Al Qaeda in Afghanistan and drove the Taliban from power.

When even easily invaded a decent size country like Iraq and toppled its Baathist government

(The long decades insurgent war to remake Afghanistan & Iraq being a different issue)

You really do seem to think that the USA and America power is a fragile thing
You are such a simpleton. We literally lost Trillions, have put significant restraints around our personal freedoms, built giant security apparatuses,

And you are such a flip flopping jerk who loves wars aboard and the massive security State.....(as well as proxy wars with Russia) and then turns around dares complain about the cost!

Hypocrite you are!

And while I hate the trillions lost....as well as thousands of dead Americans in this wars....that was because of the long term wars of occupation and "nation-building" that your side loves.

That was not the direct result of 9/11....the initial conflicts were short and mostly inexpensive...(.the wars of occupation were part of utopian fantasies and a deliberate choice from our Neo-Con and Liberals elites who thought they could transform Middle Eastern Muslim tribal peoples in to Manhattan progressives )

And while our leaders in DC (who you trust now on the Ukraine war) led us into disaster in the long term occupations of Iraq and Afghanistan.....they did no fundamentally long term harm the USA

The United States in 2025....just as in 2001....remains the richest and most militarily powerful Nation on Earth.

Despite the failure of the Iraq and Afghan occupation/re-construction wars

Al Qaeda and its attacks no more changed that than did Sioux attacks on the frontier in the 1860s


The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
ATL Bear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

Redbrickbear said:

ATL Bear said:

We were brought to our knees by people living in caves from all purposes 4th world countries .


Not even close to being true

The USA was and remained the greatest military and economic power on earth after the 9/11 attacks.

America then easily crushed Al Qaeda in Afghanistan and drove the Taliban from power.

When even easily invaded a decent size country like Iraq and toppled its Baathist government

(The long decades insurgent war to remake Afghanistan & Iraq being a different issue)

You really do seem to think that the USA and America power is a fragile thing
You are such a simpleton. We literally lost Trillions, have put significant restraints around our personal freedoms, built giant security apparatuses, not to mention lost lives and massive spending. And that's before we get to the wars and battles. We were knocked down. What we got up as is fodder for much debate, and we are in a continuous state of getting up if we're honest,
This is all true... but you are pointing your finger at the cave dwellers when in reality its the people in DC who caused all this.

Fear caused all of this, and we welcomed it. That's how terrorism works.

Who was afraid after 9/11?

Pissed the **** off, sure... but afraid?

And what do you mean by "we welcomed it".... you did maybe and are now having buyers remorse.... but many did not welcome the nation building in the middle east... the renewing of the Patriot Act.... the unsustainable spending and inability to balance a budget.

I dont know why you feel the need to defend failed politicians who squandered the abundance we were left with by the end of the 90ties.
Your bravado is amusing, but you wouldn't support going back to pre-9/11 security approaches.

I could think of a lot of ways to loosen the security state around the vast majority but tighten it around the "usual suspects".... but that would be deemed racist and weak whites would be flailing around on the ground pissing themselves.
KaiBear
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Sam Lowry said:

KaiBear said:

Sam Lowry said:

Redbrickbear said:

ron.reagan said:

historian said:



It wouldn't be the first time Russia was completely ignorant of the battlefield

Your takes are always funny

Russia is incompetent on the battlefield (they are)...but are also going to run through Warsaw & Berlin on their way to conquer Paris.....lol
The Russian army is highly competent at what it's designed to do, which is to defend Russia and its bordering regions. It's not in a posture that would enable it to attack Europe, and if that ever changed we would know years in advance. It's not something they could prepare overnight.


Russia tank divisions were built to invade Europe.
Tanks are an essential part of the Russian defensive strategy. They use them for rapid counterattacks after drawing the enemy into prepared positions. This is one of the ways they've depleted Ukraine's manpower and equipment so successfully over the last three years.


Sorry Sam

Russian tank tactics were developed and designed to role through Poland and the Baltic States.

That has been an open secret for decades.
Redbrickbear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
KaiBear said:

Sam Lowry said:

Redbrickbear said:

ron.reagan said:

historian said:



It wouldn't be the first time Russia was completely ignorant of the battlefield

Your takes are always funny

Russia is incompetent on the battlefield (they are)...but are also going to run through Warsaw & Berlin on their way to conquer Paris.....lol
The Russian army is highly competent at what it's designed to do, which is to defend Russia and its bordering regions. It's not in a posture that would enable it to attack Europe, and if that ever changed we would know years in advance. It's not something they could prepare overnight.


Russia tank divisions were built to invade Europe

And the A-10 Thunderbolt II was designed to destroy them.

(and no matter what our lying military desk jockey brass says about the "threat of Russia"....they have stopped production on that anti-tank killer because they know there is no chance Russia invades Europe)
sombear
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Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

I did enjoy seeing the little French Guy (Macron) run circles around Trump yesterday. Charmed the crap out of him as Trump loves, then Macron punched him in the nose relative to the structure of the European "loan" as Trump said. Macron fact checked the Liar in Chief in real time on TV and set him straight. The look on Trump's fat face was priceless.
Amusing how we all look situations differently.

Often twisting realities to enhance our pre conceived notions.

I just want to see this war end and hopefully get some of the billions Biden gave away returned to benefit American taxpayers.
I think everyone want to see the war end, just like Israel /Gaza. The FACT that Trump continues to repeat that Ukraine was the aggressor and started the war. No one in their right mind could possibly believe that. For anyone who does, please let me know the specifics. Did Russia invade Ukraine or not? Unbelievable that our President can get people to believe it. Howdy Hitler.
Not everyone wants to see the war end on realistic terms.

Ukraine's military is clearly bleeding to death.

Her infrastructure blasted; the people worn out.

Trump is right to push for a settlement....Biden never had the juice to do so.

Don't agree with all of Trump's comments; however I suspect he is looking beyond a truce and attempting to build some long term business realationships with Russia as a way to have real security in Europe.
Russia has no more territory than it had in April 2022.

Russia, not Ukraine, has had to bring in tens of thousands of troops from North Korea, Yemen, and North Africa. And some estimates have half their new weapons and ammo coming from China, North Korea, and Iran.



1. So the front line is static...Russia can't even advance past what it held 3 years ago

2. Russia has to rely on conscript forces from 2nd and 3rd world Nations

How do these facts change the narrative about how Russia is this great threat that the USA needs to confront in a bloody proxy war? Or else Russia will invade the rest of Europe....


But, yes, Russia is a threat to the U.S. geopolitically and in other significant ways simply virtue of being on the opposite side on most major world issues, trying to undermine us in every region of the world, and aligning with our worst enemies.



How much of that opposition has come directly from DC-Brussels actions and how much of it was Russian actions?

After all Russia is a different civilization (Orthodox Civilization according to Huntington) but not that much different than the West. They could be partners and not enemies.

"Bluntly stated...expanding NATO would be the most fateful error of American policy in the entire post-Cold War era. Such a decision may be expected to inflame the nationalistic, anti-Western and militaristic tendencies in Russian opinion; to have an adverse effect on the development of Russian democracy; to restore the atmosphere of the cold war to East-West relations, and to impel Russian foreign policy in directions decidedly not to our liking … "- Excerpt from George F. Kennan, "A Fateful Error," New York Times, 05 Feb 1997

"I sometimes wonder if our leaders actually want to drive Russia into an angry, sullen isolation. Russians are proud and patriotic. They are as wounded by the loss of status and empire as we were in the Fifties. Why rub their noses in it, week by week, by keeping NATO alive years after it should have been wound up and by threatening to extend it into Ukraine and Georgia. It is by doing things such as this that we created Vladimir Putin. This alliance does not have the military strength to defend its overstretched frontiers and will look very silly if a future Kremlin decides to pressure its neighbors, who will then call on NATO for help and find that none comes." -Peter Hitchens



My answer might surprise you. It's both. We despise most things about Russia. Russia despises most things about us. It's really not too complex. Some tend to overthink it, others minimize it for some unknown reason. We just have diametrically opposed world views.

I know there are exceptions, but not too many people who have spent substantial time in Russia and truly studied it, disagree.

For example, as even Sachs acknowledges, Russia itself could have joined NATO. For such a significant entity, its membership requirements are straightforward. But Russia has no interest in satisfying even half of them. This is going to sound harsher than it's meant to be, but freedom, individual rights, individual over state, etc. just aren't on Putin's radar. And that's ok. That's a longstanding worldview of many countries and leaders.

Nobody created Putin. He is what he has always been. He's been consistent if nothing else. Read his writings. Read interviews of his friends and family. If anything, his actions have been less extreme than his core belief, and as much a detractor as anyone. He very openly yearns for the old Soviet Empire and what he has long called the Rome of this age.


Redbrickbear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
sombear said:

Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

I did enjoy seeing the little French Guy (Macron) run circles around Trump yesterday. Charmed the crap out of him as Trump loves, then Macron punched him in the nose relative to the structure of the European "loan" as Trump said. Macron fact checked the Liar in Chief in real time on TV and set him straight. The look on Trump's fat face was priceless.
Amusing how we all look situations differently.

Often twisting realities to enhance our pre conceived notions.

I just want to see this war end and hopefully get some of the billions Biden gave away returned to benefit American taxpayers.
I think everyone want to see the war end, just like Israel /Gaza. The FACT that Trump continues to repeat that Ukraine was the aggressor and started the war. No one in their right mind could possibly believe that. For anyone who does, please let me know the specifics. Did Russia invade Ukraine or not? Unbelievable that our President can get people to believe it. Howdy Hitler.
Not everyone wants to see the war end on realistic terms.

Ukraine's military is clearly bleeding to death.

Her infrastructure blasted; the people worn out.

Trump is right to push for a settlement....Biden never had the juice to do so.

Don't agree with all of Trump's comments; however I suspect he is looking beyond a truce and attempting to build some long term business realationships with Russia as a way to have real security in Europe.
Russia has no more territory than it had in April 2022.

Russia, not Ukraine, has had to bring in tens of thousands of troops from North Korea, Yemen, and North Africa. And some estimates have half their new weapons and ammo coming from China, North Korea, and Iran.



1. So the front line is static...Russia can't even advance past what it held 3 years ago

2. Russia has to rely on conscript forces from 2nd and 3rd world Nations

How do these facts change the narrative about how Russia is this great threat that the USA needs to confront in a bloody proxy war? Or else Russia will invade the rest of Europe....


But, yes, Russia is a threat to the U.S. geopolitically and in other significant ways simply virtue of being on the opposite side on most major world issues, trying to undermine us in every region of the world, and aligning with our worst enemies.



How much of that opposition has come directly from DC-Brussels actions and how much of it was Russian actions?

After all Russia is a different civilization (Orthodox Civilization according to Huntington) but not that much different than the West. They could be partners and not enemies.

"Bluntly stated...expanding NATO would be the most fateful error of American policy in the entire post-Cold War era. Such a decision may be expected to inflame the nationalistic, anti-Western and militaristic tendencies in Russian opinion; to have an adverse effect on the development of Russian democracy; to restore the atmosphere of the cold war to East-West relations, and to impel Russian foreign policy in directions decidedly not to our liking … "- Excerpt from George F. Kennan, "A Fateful Error," New York Times, 05 Feb 1997

"I sometimes wonder if our leaders actually want to drive Russia into an angry, sullen isolation. Russians are proud and patriotic. They are as wounded by the loss of status and empire as we were in the Fifties. Why rub their noses in it, week by week, by keeping NATO alive years after it should have been wound up and by threatening to extend it into Ukraine and Georgia. It is by doing things such as this that we created Vladimir Putin. This alliance does not have the military strength to defend its overstretched frontiers and will look very silly if a future Kremlin decides to pressure its neighbors, who will then call on NATO for help and find that none comes." -Peter Hitchens



My answer might surprise you. It's both. We despise most things about Russia. Russia despises most things about us. I

There is nothing inherent about the Russian character or Russian civilization that would make them at odds with the USA

(we have never even fought a war against them....are were allies in two world wars)

No, seems more likely this is the direct result of large scale geo-political games on both sides and a desire of the powers that be in DC and Brussels to push a military alliance network up the borders and harass them for not being sufficiently socially liberal/progressive on cultural matters
Bear8084
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Sam Lowry said:

KaiBear said:

Sam Lowry said:

Redbrickbear said:

ron.reagan said:

historian said:



It wouldn't be the first time Russia was completely ignorant of the battlefield

Your takes are always funny

Russia is incompetent on the battlefield (they are)...but are also going to run through Warsaw & Berlin on their way to conquer Paris.....lol
The Russian army is highly competent at what it's designed to do, which is to defend Russia and its bordering regions. It's not in a posture that would enable it to attack Europe, and if that ever changed we would know years in advance. It's not something they could prepare overnight.


Russia tank divisions were built to invade Europe.
Tanks are an essential part of the Russian defensive strategy. They use them for rapid counterattacks after drawing the enemy into prepared positions. This is one of the ways they've depleted Ukraine's manpower and equipment so successfully over the last three years.


Not really.
ron.reagan
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

I did enjoy seeing the little French Guy (Macron) run circles around Trump yesterday. Charmed the crap out of him as Trump loves, then Macron punched him in the nose relative to the structure of the European "loan" as Trump said. Macron fact checked the Liar in Chief in real time on TV and set him straight. The look on Trump's fat face was priceless.
Amusing how we all look situations differently.

Often twisting realities to enhance our pre conceived notions.

I just want to see this war end and hopefully get some of the billions Biden gave away returned to benefit American taxpayers.
I think everyone want to see the war end, just like Israel /Gaza. The FACT that Trump continues to repeat that Ukraine was the aggressor and started the war. No one in their right mind could possibly believe that. For anyone who does, please let me know the specifics. Did Russia invade Ukraine or not? Unbelievable that our President can get people to believe it. Howdy Hitler.
Not everyone wants to see the war end on realistic terms.

Ukraine's military is clearly bleeding to death.

Her infrastructure blasted; the people worn out.

Trump is right to push for a settlement....Biden never had the juice to do so.

Don't agree with all of Trump's comments; however I suspect he is looking beyond a truce and attempting to build some long term business realationships with Russia as a way to have real security in Europe.
Russia has no more territory than it had in April 2022.

Russia, not Ukraine, has had to bring in tens of thousands of troops from North Korea, Yemen, and North Africa. And some estimates have half their new weapons and ammo coming from China, North Korea, and Iran.



1. So the front line is static...Russia can't even advance past what it held 3 years ago

2. Russia has to rely on conscript forces from 2nd and 3rd world Nations

How do these facts change the narrative about how Russia is this great threat that the USA needs to confront in a bloody proxy war? Or else Russia will invade the rest of Europe....


But, yes, Russia is a threat to the U.S. geopolitically and in other significant ways simply virtue of being on the opposite side on most major world issues, trying to undermine us in every region of the world, and aligning with our worst enemies.



How much of that opposition has come directly from DC-Brussels actions and how much of it was Russian actions?

After all Russia is a different civilization (Orthodox Civilization according to Huntington) but not that much different than the West. They could be partners and not enemies.

"Bluntly stated...expanding NATO would be the most fateful error of American policy in the entire post-Cold War era. Such a decision may be expected to inflame the nationalistic, anti-Western and militaristic tendencies in Russian opinion; to have an adverse effect on the development of Russian democracy; to restore the atmosphere of the cold war to East-West relations, and to impel Russian foreign policy in directions decidedly not to our liking … "- Excerpt from George F. Kennan, "A Fateful Error," New York Times, 05 Feb 1997

"I sometimes wonder if our leaders actually want to drive Russia into an angry, sullen isolation. Russians are proud and patriotic. They are as wounded by the loss of status and empire as we were in the Fifties. Why rub their noses in it, week by week, by keeping NATO alive years after it should have been wound up and by threatening to extend it into Ukraine and Georgia. It is by doing things such as this that we created Vladimir Putin. This alliance does not have the military strength to defend its overstretched frontiers and will look very silly if a future Kremlin decides to pressure its neighbors, who will then call on NATO for help and find that none comes." -Peter Hitchens



My answer might surprise you. It's both. We despise most things about Russia. Russia despises most things about us. I

There is nothing inherent about the Russian character or Russian civilization that would make them at odds with the USA

(we have never even fought a war against them....are were allies in two world wars)

No, seems more likely this is the direct result of large scale geo-political games on both sides and a desire of the powers that be in DC and Brussels to push a military alliance network up the borders and harass them for not being sufficiently socially liberal/progressive on cultural matters
Yeah, Romney really hated that they didn't have enough trans people in Russia and Obama thought they had too many blacks
Redbrickbear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
ron.reagan said:

Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

Redbrickbear said:

sombear said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

KaiBear said:

J.R. said:

I did enjoy seeing the little French Guy (Macron) run circles around Trump yesterday. Charmed the crap out of him as Trump loves, then Macron punched him in the nose relative to the structure of the European "loan" as Trump said. Macron fact checked the Liar in Chief in real time on TV and set him straight. The look on Trump's fat face was priceless.
Amusing how we all look situations differently.

Often twisting realities to enhance our pre conceived notions.

I just want to see this war end and hopefully get some of the billions Biden gave away returned to benefit American taxpayers.
I think everyone want to see the war end, just like Israel /Gaza. The FACT that Trump continues to repeat that Ukraine was the aggressor and started the war. No one in their right mind could possibly believe that. For anyone who does, please let me know the specifics. Did Russia invade Ukraine or not? Unbelievable that our President can get people to believe it. Howdy Hitler.
Not everyone wants to see the war end on realistic terms.

Ukraine's military is clearly bleeding to death.

Her infrastructure blasted; the people worn out.

Trump is right to push for a settlement....Biden never had the juice to do so.

Don't agree with all of Trump's comments; however I suspect he is looking beyond a truce and attempting to build some long term business realationships with Russia as a way to have real security in Europe.
Russia has no more territory than it had in April 2022.

Russia, not Ukraine, has had to bring in tens of thousands of troops from North Korea, Yemen, and North Africa. And some estimates have half their new weapons and ammo coming from China, North Korea, and Iran.



1. So the front line is static...Russia can't even advance past what it held 3 years ago

2. Russia has to rely on conscript forces from 2nd and 3rd world Nations

How do these facts change the narrative about how Russia is this great threat that the USA needs to confront in a bloody proxy war? Or else Russia will invade the rest of Europe....


But, yes, Russia is a threat to the U.S. geopolitically and in other significant ways simply virtue of being on the opposite side on most major world issues, trying to undermine us in every region of the world, and aligning with our worst enemies.



How much of that opposition has come directly from DC-Brussels actions and how much of it was Russian actions?

After all Russia is a different civilization (Orthodox Civilization according to Huntington) but not that much different than the West. They could be partners and not enemies.

"Bluntly stated...expanding NATO would be the most fateful error of American policy in the entire post-Cold War era. Such a decision may be expected to inflame the nationalistic, anti-Western and militaristic tendencies in Russian opinion; to have an adverse effect on the development of Russian democracy; to restore the atmosphere of the cold war to East-West relations, and to impel Russian foreign policy in directions decidedly not to our liking … "- Excerpt from George F. Kennan, "A Fateful Error," New York Times, 05 Feb 1997

"I sometimes wonder if our leaders actually want to drive Russia into an angry, sullen isolation. Russians are proud and patriotic. They are as wounded by the loss of status and empire as we were in the Fifties. Why rub their noses in it, week by week, by keeping NATO alive years after it should have been wound up and by threatening to extend it into Ukraine and Georgia. It is by doing things such as this that we created Vladimir Putin. This alliance does not have the military strength to defend its overstretched frontiers and will look very silly if a future Kremlin decides to pressure its neighbors, who will then call on NATO for help and find that none comes." -Peter Hitchens



My answer might surprise you. It's both. We despise most things about Russia. Russia despises most things about us. I

There is nothing inherent about the Russian character or Russian civilization that would make them at odds with the USA

(we have never even fought a war against them....are were allies in two world wars)

No, seems more likely this is the direct result of large scale geo-political games on both sides and a desire of the powers that be in DC and Brussels to push a military alliance network up the borders and harass them for not being sufficiently socially liberal/progressive on cultural matters
Yeah, Romney really hated that they didn't have enough trans people in Russia

Despite your obsession with LGBTQ mental illness.....

The differences between our ruling class and Moscow on cultural issues is at least one part of the friction between the two sides.

(also geo-strategic and economic issues at play as well)
ron.reagan
How long do you want to ignore this user?
LGBTID=, religious people, you, all wetards that I don't mind engaging with . If you ever win bingo night at the trailer park you should travel the world a little
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