NEWSY: Scalise is expected to officially announce his bid for speaker later today, a source familiar tells me
— Olivia Beavers (@Olivia_Beavers) October 4, 2023
House Removes Kevin McCarthy as Speaker
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359 Replies |
Last: 2 yr ago by Redbrickbear
Keep passing 4000-page budget bills with $2 trillion deficits and see how strong the US stays in the world.FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.
Just curious who you think is the "GOP candidate that can win AND Govern"? Hard to be encouraged that such a person exists at this point.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
Tough to govern in a responsible way when about half the country is at the trough.curtpenn said:Just curious who you think is the "GOP candidate that can win AND Govern"? Hard to be encouraged that such a person exists at this point.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Oh, I am with you.curtpenn said:Just curious who you think is the "GOP candidate that can win AND Govern"? Hard to be encouraged that such a person exists at this point.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Whoever it is has to know HOW to use the system and want to reform the system.
For the Executive, I am a fan of DeSantis because he know how to use the system to get his changes done. He has managed it very well as Governor. His charisma is 0...
Haley I am confident could do it. Christie has shown he is capable, if unlikable.
HOR, geez. Tough. Anyone that has a big enough image is a far right. Which is why McCarthy finishing out was best case. Nothing is getting done under Biden Admin. So, just hold serve is enough.
I think Scalise will get it, but then you may as well as kept McCarthy.
It is reported that Trump was encouraging Republicans to go ahead and let the government shut down if they didn't get cuts. Where was this priority of cutting spending when Trump was in the White House?
Trump is one of the causes of the division in the Republican Party. Cut him loose. He is only in the race for self aggrandizement.
Trump is one of the causes of the division in the Republican Party. Cut him loose. He is only in the race for self aggrandizement.
He has no interest in being Speaker. He wants to be Governor.Mothra said:Make no mistake - Gaetz will NEVER be speaker. He's largely a pariah among the rank and file, whether that's justified or not.FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.
Of which State???Frank Galvin said:He has no interest in being Speaker. He wants to be Governor.Mothra said:Make no mistake - Gaetz will NEVER be speaker. He's largely a pariah among the rank and file, whether that's justified or not.FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.
Frank Galvin said:He has no interest in being Speaker. He wants to be Governor.Mothra said:Make no mistake - Gaetz will NEVER be speaker. He's largely a pariah among the rank and file, whether that's justified or not.FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.
You think so? I think he understands being a contrarian is easier than being a problem solver.
He will have a tough time in Florida winning Gov. He is from a low population part of the State and the south is very blue before the Cuban red area. Gaetz is not DeSantis. DeSantis was not a contrarian far-right radical.Mitch Blood Green said:Frank Galvin said:He has no interest in being Speaker. He wants to be Governor.Mothra said:Make no mistake - Gaetz will NEVER be speaker. He's largely a pariah among the rank and file, whether that's justified or not.FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.
You think so? I think he understands being a contrarian is easier than being a problem solver.
GOP retaining power and setting cruise control on the status quo is bad. Not having radical change is bad. The normalization of what GOP has done for decades is bad.FLBear5630 said:They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
McCarthy:
- Blocked the subpoena to Hunter Biden
- Sold us out on the debt ceiling
- Didn't secure the border
- Didn't release the Jan6 tapes
- Kept 87,000 New IRS Agents
- Refuses to hold anyone accountable
- Keeps voting with Democrats
This is unacceptable behavior and removing him is a step against the above.
With a 4-vote majority, that can't vote for ANYTHING in block, who and how are they going to accomplish those things?Doc Holliday said:GOP retaining power and setting cruise control on the status quo is bad. Not having radical change is bad. The normalization of what GOP has done for decades is bad.FLBear5630 said:They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
McCarthy:
- Blocked the subpoena to Hunter Biden
- Sold us out on the debt ceiling
- Didn't secure the border
- Didn't release the Jan6 tapes
- Kept 87,000 New IRS Agents
- Refuses to hold anyone accountable
- Keeps voting with Democrats
This is unacceptable behavior and removing him is a step against the above.
They already weren't accomplishing things…FLBear5630 said:With a 4-vote majority, that can't vote for ANYTHING in block, who and how are they going to accomplish those things?Doc Holliday said:GOP retaining power and setting cruise control on the status quo is bad. Not having radical change is bad. The normalization of what GOP has done for decades is bad.FLBear5630 said:They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
McCarthy:
- Blocked the subpoena to Hunter Biden
- Sold us out on the debt ceiling
- Didn't secure the border
- Didn't release the Jan6 tapes
- Kept 87,000 New IRS Agents
- Refuses to hold anyone accountable
- Keeps voting with Democrats
This is unacceptable behavior and removing him is a step against the above.
If this jams up Congress for a year and they can't get their anti-American agenda done then what's the problem?
Maybe the new speaker furthers the goals of the GOP whose fed up with the system, or maybe it furthers the system, either way, you need to put your cards down to at least try: that's better than accepting defeat.
Because it stops way more than their "anti-American" agenda. Closing the Govt is a nuclear option, not a surgical one.Doc Holliday said:They already weren't accomplishing things…FLBear5630 said:With a 4-vote majority, that can't vote for ANYTHING in block, who and how are they going to accomplish those things?Doc Holliday said:GOP retaining power and setting cruise control on the status quo is bad. Not having radical change is bad. The normalization of what GOP has done for decades is bad.FLBear5630 said:They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
McCarthy:
- Blocked the subpoena to Hunter Biden
- Sold us out on the debt ceiling
- Didn't secure the border
- Didn't release the Jan6 tapes
- Kept 87,000 New IRS Agents
- Refuses to hold anyone accountable
- Keeps voting with Democrats
This is unacceptable behavior and removing him is a step against the above.
If this jams up Congress for a year and they can't get their anti-American agenda done then what's the problem?
Maybe the new speaker furthers the goals of the GOP whose fed up with the system, or maybe it furthers the system, either way, you need to put your cards down to at least try: that's better than accepting defeat.
They are there to come to consensus and move the Nation forward, not just throw a tantrum and stop everything. They need to compromise, the Dems won the White House and Senate they will set the agenda. There may be some things that the HOR can get, but they are not getting done what you want.
Stunts like this only hurt the Party doing it in the long run. Following Gaetz, is not a smart move.
From WSJ:FLBear5630 said:Because it stops way more than their "anti-American" agenda. Closing the Govt is a nuclear option, not a surgical one.Doc Holliday said:They already weren't accomplishing things…FLBear5630 said:With a 4-vote majority, that can't vote for ANYTHING in block, who and how are they going to accomplish those things?Doc Holliday said:GOP retaining power and setting cruise control on the status quo is bad. Not having radical change is bad. The normalization of what GOP has done for decades is bad.FLBear5630 said:They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
McCarthy:
- Blocked the subpoena to Hunter Biden
- Sold us out on the debt ceiling
- Didn't secure the border
- Didn't release the Jan6 tapes
- Kept 87,000 New IRS Agents
- Refuses to hold anyone accountable
- Keeps voting with Democrats
This is unacceptable behavior and removing him is a step against the above.
If this jams up Congress for a year and they can't get their anti-American agenda done then what's the problem?
Maybe the new speaker furthers the goals of the GOP whose fed up with the system, or maybe it furthers the system, either way, you need to put your cards down to at least try: that's better than accepting defeat.
They are there to come to consensus and move the Nation forward, not just throw a tantrum and stop everything. They need to compromise, the Dems won the White House and Senate they will set the agenda. There may be some things that the HOR can get, but they are not getting done what you want.
Stunts like this only hurt the Party doing it in the long run. Following Gaetz, is not a smart move.
Meanwhile, the House is essentially frozen. The putative GOP majority is weaker, and its ability to gain any policy victories has been undermined. Oversight of the Biden Administration will slow or stop. Republicans in swing districts who are vulnerable in 2024 will be especially wary of trusting the Gaetz faction, and regaining any unity of purpose will be that much harder. The crazy left and right are cheering, but no one else is.
Very short sighted...Osodecentx said:From WSJ:FLBear5630 said:Because it stops way more than their "anti-American" agenda. Closing the Govt is a nuclear option, not a surgical one.Doc Holliday said:They already weren't accomplishing things…FLBear5630 said:With a 4-vote majority, that can't vote for ANYTHING in block, who and how are they going to accomplish those things?Doc Holliday said:GOP retaining power and setting cruise control on the status quo is bad. Not having radical change is bad. The normalization of what GOP has done for decades is bad.FLBear5630 said:They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
McCarthy:
- Blocked the subpoena to Hunter Biden
- Sold us out on the debt ceiling
- Didn't secure the border
- Didn't release the Jan6 tapes
- Kept 87,000 New IRS Agents
- Refuses to hold anyone accountable
- Keeps voting with Democrats
This is unacceptable behavior and removing him is a step against the above.
If this jams up Congress for a year and they can't get their anti-American agenda done then what's the problem?
Maybe the new speaker furthers the goals of the GOP whose fed up with the system, or maybe it furthers the system, either way, you need to put your cards down to at least try: that's better than accepting defeat.
They are there to come to consensus and move the Nation forward, not just throw a tantrum and stop everything. They need to compromise, the Dems won the White House and Senate they will set the agenda. There may be some things that the HOR can get, but they are not getting done what you want.
Stunts like this only hurt the Party doing it in the long run. Following Gaetz, is not a smart move.
Meanwhile, the House is essentially frozen. The putative GOP majority is weaker, and its ability to gain any policy victories has been undermined. Oversight of the Biden Administration will slow or stop. Republicans in swing districts who are vulnerable in 2024 will be especially wary of trusting the Gaetz faction, and regaining any unity of purpose will be that much harder. The crazy left and right are cheering, but no one else is.
Republicans can't govern and aren't happy in the majorityFLBear5630 said:Very short sighted...Osodecentx said:From WSJ:FLBear5630 said:Because it stops way more than their "anti-American" agenda. Closing the Govt is a nuclear option, not a surgical one.Doc Holliday said:They already weren't accomplishing things…FLBear5630 said:With a 4-vote majority, that can't vote for ANYTHING in block, who and how are they going to accomplish those things?Doc Holliday said:GOP retaining power and setting cruise control on the status quo is bad. Not having radical change is bad. The normalization of what GOP has done for decades is bad.FLBear5630 said:They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
McCarthy:
- Blocked the subpoena to Hunter Biden
- Sold us out on the debt ceiling
- Didn't secure the border
- Didn't release the Jan6 tapes
- Kept 87,000 New IRS Agents
- Refuses to hold anyone accountable
- Keeps voting with Democrats
This is unacceptable behavior and removing him is a step against the above.
If this jams up Congress for a year and they can't get their anti-American agenda done then what's the problem?
Maybe the new speaker furthers the goals of the GOP whose fed up with the system, or maybe it furthers the system, either way, you need to put your cards down to at least try: that's better than accepting defeat.
They are there to come to consensus and move the Nation forward, not just throw a tantrum and stop everything. They need to compromise, the Dems won the White House and Senate they will set the agenda. There may be some things that the HOR can get, but they are not getting done what you want.
Stunts like this only hurt the Party doing it in the long run. Following Gaetz, is not a smart move.
Meanwhile, the House is essentially frozen. The putative GOP majority is weaker, and its ability to gain any policy victories has been undermined. Oversight of the Biden Administration will slow or stop. Republicans in swing districts who are vulnerable in 2024 will be especially wary of trusting the Gaetz faction, and regaining any unity of purpose will be that much harder. The crazy left and right are cheering, but no one else is.
We were discussing at work. This is bad for financial markets, we need stability and peace.Osodecentx said:Republicans can't govern and aren't happy in the majorityFLBear5630 said:Very short sighted...Osodecentx said:From WSJ:FLBear5630 said:Because it stops way more than their "anti-American" agenda. Closing the Govt is a nuclear option, not a surgical one.Doc Holliday said:They already weren't accomplishing things…FLBear5630 said:With a 4-vote majority, that can't vote for ANYTHING in block, who and how are they going to accomplish those things?Doc Holliday said:GOP retaining power and setting cruise control on the status quo is bad. Not having radical change is bad. The normalization of what GOP has done for decades is bad.FLBear5630 said:They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
McCarthy:
- Blocked the subpoena to Hunter Biden
- Sold us out on the debt ceiling
- Didn't secure the border
- Didn't release the Jan6 tapes
- Kept 87,000 New IRS Agents
- Refuses to hold anyone accountable
- Keeps voting with Democrats
This is unacceptable behavior and removing him is a step against the above.
If this jams up Congress for a year and they can't get their anti-American agenda done then what's the problem?
Maybe the new speaker furthers the goals of the GOP whose fed up with the system, or maybe it furthers the system, either way, you need to put your cards down to at least try: that's better than accepting defeat.
They are there to come to consensus and move the Nation forward, not just throw a tantrum and stop everything. They need to compromise, the Dems won the White House and Senate they will set the agenda. There may be some things that the HOR can get, but they are not getting done what you want.
Stunts like this only hurt the Party doing it in the long run. Following Gaetz, is not a smart move.
Meanwhile, the House is essentially frozen. The putative GOP majority is weaker, and its ability to gain any policy victories has been undermined. Oversight of the Biden Administration will slow or stop. Republicans in swing districts who are vulnerable in 2024 will be especially wary of trusting the Gaetz faction, and regaining any unity of purpose will be that much harder. The crazy left and right are cheering, but no one else is.
They haven't been coming to a consensus and moving the nation forward...FLBear5630 said:Because it stops way more than their "anti-American" agenda. Closing the Govt is a nuclear option, not a surgical one.Doc Holliday said:They already weren't accomplishing things…FLBear5630 said:With a 4-vote majority, that can't vote for ANYTHING in block, who and how are they going to accomplish those things?Doc Holliday said:GOP retaining power and setting cruise control on the status quo is bad. Not having radical change is bad. The normalization of what GOP has done for decades is bad.FLBear5630 said:They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
McCarthy:
- Blocked the subpoena to Hunter Biden
- Sold us out on the debt ceiling
- Didn't secure the border
- Didn't release the Jan6 tapes
- Kept 87,000 New IRS Agents
- Refuses to hold anyone accountable
- Keeps voting with Democrats
This is unacceptable behavior and removing him is a step against the above.
If this jams up Congress for a year and they can't get their anti-American agenda done then what's the problem?
Maybe the new speaker furthers the goals of the GOP whose fed up with the system, or maybe it furthers the system, either way, you need to put your cards down to at least try: that's better than accepting defeat.
They are there to come to consensus and move the Nation forward, not just throw a tantrum and stop everything. They need to compromise, the Dems won the White House and Senate they will set the agenda. There may be some things that the HOR can get, but they are not getting done what you want.
Stunts like this only hurt the Party doing it in the long run. Following Gaetz, is not a smart move.
We're not ceding any progress whatsoever.
RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:The good news is Trump will clean this mess up and take out the trash. Not sure anyone else other than DeSantis has the balls to do it. I do not like Trump, but The Revenge Tour will be fun to watch. The rats will be scurrying and running for cover.HuMcK said:
"The GOP is a joke and refuses to even symbolically support it's voter base."
Confederate slave owners? Because those were the four portraits she had taken down. Sure says a lot about who you think the GOP base is.
It's interesting how the mask slips sometimes when one of you says the quiet part out loud.
Trump is this mess.
Osodecentx said:From WSJ:FLBear5630 said:Because it stops way more than their "anti-American" agenda. Closing the Govt is a nuclear option, not a surgical one.Doc Holliday said:They already weren't accomplishing things…FLBear5630 said:With a 4-vote majority, that can't vote for ANYTHING in block, who and how are they going to accomplish those things?Doc Holliday said:GOP retaining power and setting cruise control on the status quo is bad. Not having radical change is bad. The normalization of what GOP has done for decades is bad.FLBear5630 said:They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
McCarthy:
- Blocked the subpoena to Hunter Biden
- Sold us out on the debt ceiling
- Didn't secure the border
- Didn't release the Jan6 tapes
- Kept 87,000 New IRS Agents
- Refuses to hold anyone accountable
- Keeps voting with Democrats
This is unacceptable behavior and removing him is a step against the above.
If this jams up Congress for a year and they can't get their anti-American agenda done then what's the problem?
Maybe the new speaker furthers the goals of the GOP whose fed up with the system, or maybe it furthers the system, either way, you need to put your cards down to at least try: that's better than accepting defeat.
They are there to come to consensus and move the Nation forward, not just throw a tantrum and stop everything. They need to compromise, the Dems won the White House and Senate they will set the agenda. There may be some things that the HOR can get, but they are not getting done what you want.
Stunts like this only hurt the Party doing it in the long run. Following Gaetz, is not a smart move.
Meanwhile, the House is essentially frozen. The putative GOP majority is weaker, and its ability to gain any policy victories has been undermined. Oversight of the Biden Administration will slow or stop. Republicans in swing districts who are vulnerable in 2024 will be especially wary of trusting the Gaetz faction, and regaining any unity of purpose will be that much harder. The crazy left and right are cheering, but no one else is.
Yep. Biden has to be delighted that his corruption will not be investigated.
The American people don’t want Ukraine funded.
— Cernovich (@Cernovich) October 3, 2023
Republicans in Congress don’t care, they are betraying voters.
I don’t mind if Matt Gaetz “slows down” the “important work” of stealing taxpayer money and shipping it to money launderers.
FLBear5630 said:Of which State???Frank Galvin said:He has no interest in being Speaker. He wants to be Governor.Mothra said:Make no mistake - Gaetz will NEVER be speaker. He's largely a pariah among the rank and file, whether that's justified or not.FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.
Florida. It has the highest concentration of crazy people so he has a large base to work with.
Doc Holliday said:They already weren't accomplishing things…FLBear5630 said:With a 4-vote majority, that can't vote for ANYTHING in block, who and how are they going to accomplish those things?Doc Holliday said:GOP retaining power and setting cruise control on the status quo is bad. Not having radical change is bad. The normalization of what GOP has done for decades is bad.FLBear5630 said:They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
McCarthy:
- Blocked the subpoena to Hunter Biden
- Sold us out on the debt ceiling
- Didn't secure the border
- Didn't release the Jan6 tapes
- Kept 87,000 New IRS Agents
- Refuses to hold anyone accountable
- Keeps voting with Democrats
This is unacceptable behavior and removing him is a step against the above.
If this jams up Congress for a year and they can't get their anti-American agenda done then what's the problem?
Maybe the new speaker furthers the goals of the GOP whose fed up with the system, or maybe it furthers the system, either way, you need to put your cards down to at least try: that's better than accepting defeat.
Policies I don't agree with="Anti-American Agenda."
Have you not been to California?Frank Galvin said:FLBear5630 said:Of which State???Frank Galvin said:He has no interest in being Speaker. He wants to be Governor.Mothra said:Make no mistake - Gaetz will NEVER be speaker. He's largely a pariah among the rank and file, whether that's justified or not.FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.
Florida. It has the highest concentration of crazy people so he has a large base to work with.
As McCarthy tumbled toward defeat, Trump did not defend his speakership
Trump's limited support for the man he famously called 'my Kevin' encapsulated a relationship that has ebbed and flowed over the years
As Kevin McCarthy battled this week to keep the job he would eventually lose, one very powerful ally did not come to his rescue: Donald Trump.
For years, McCarthy (R-Calif.) prided himself on his close relationship with Trump, defending the former president through countless controversies and cajoling him to support the former speaker's own political priorities. He challenged Trump's 2020 election defeat and swallowed his objections to Trump's conduct in the lead-up to the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol. He navigated around some of the former president's congressional endorsements even when those candidates appeared destined for defeat. Within the past few months, he helped Trump's team secure coveted changes to the California GOP's primary rules. And in recent weeks, he had all but endorsed Trump's nomination for the 2024 presidential race, an unusual move for a top congressional leader this early in a contested primary.
But as McCarthy's speakership teetered on the brink Tuesday, Trump stayed resolutely on the sidelines as his acolyte, Rep. Matt Gaetz (R-Fla.), engineered a vote that ultimately ejected McCarthy from his leadership post. Trump's biggest contribution to the debate came in the form of a mildly worded social media post that simply asked: "Why is it that Republicans are always fighting among themselves, why aren't they fighting the Radical Left Democrats who are destroying our country?"
McCarthy's ouster capped a tumultuous tenure as speaker that ended less than nine months after it started. Trump's limited support for the man he famously called "my Kevin" on the eve of his inauguration encapsulated a relationship that has ebbed and flowed over the years. And it reflected the caution Trump typically exercises in contested situations where weighing in more forcefully as he often does on a range of issues carries political risks.
Yet, it's not clear that a Trump intervention into the House chaos would have saved McCarthy's gavel. Of the eight Republicans who voted against McCarthy, only three have endorsed Trump for 2024. Rep. Bob Good (R-Va.) has endorsed Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis; Rep. Ken Buck (R-Colo.) is a Trump critic; and Rep. Nancy Mace (R-S.C.) defeated a Trump-backed primary challenger.
On Tuesday night, Trump's campaign did not comment on McCarthy's defeat and instead pointed to his social media post. One person close to Trump, who, like others, spoke on the condition of anonymity to comment candidly, suggested that the outcome might have been different if McCarthy had endorsed Trump early on in the former president's quest for the 2024 nomination.
After McCarthy was removed in the historic vote, Gaetz suggested that Trump was on his side: "I would say that my conversations with the former president leave me with great confidence that I'm doing the right thing." McCarthy disputed that notion in a news conference. "I doubt if that's true," McCarthy said when asked about Gaetz's assertion.
Gaetz told reporters Monday he had spoken to Trump but did not disclose the details of their conversation. One Trump ally said the former president was upset about efforts by some House Republicans seeking to expel Gaetz from the GOP conference.
Trump also was angered by some of McCarthy's comments. In a June interview with CNBC, McCarthy suggested that his support for his old governing partner was in doubt. "Is he the strongest to win the election? I don't know that answer,"
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/10/04/trump-mccarthy-relationship/
Trump's limited support for the man he famously called 'my Kevin' encapsulated a relationship that has ebbed and flowed over the years
As Kevin McCarthy battled this week to keep the job he would eventually lose, one very powerful ally did not come to his rescue: Donald Trump.
For years, McCarthy (R-Calif.) prided himself on his close relationship with Trump, defending the former president through countless controversies and cajoling him to support the former speaker's own political priorities. He challenged Trump's 2020 election defeat and swallowed his objections to Trump's conduct in the lead-up to the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol. He navigated around some of the former president's congressional endorsements even when those candidates appeared destined for defeat. Within the past few months, he helped Trump's team secure coveted changes to the California GOP's primary rules. And in recent weeks, he had all but endorsed Trump's nomination for the 2024 presidential race, an unusual move for a top congressional leader this early in a contested primary.
But as McCarthy's speakership teetered on the brink Tuesday, Trump stayed resolutely on the sidelines as his acolyte, Rep. Matt Gaetz (R-Fla.), engineered a vote that ultimately ejected McCarthy from his leadership post. Trump's biggest contribution to the debate came in the form of a mildly worded social media post that simply asked: "Why is it that Republicans are always fighting among themselves, why aren't they fighting the Radical Left Democrats who are destroying our country?"
McCarthy's ouster capped a tumultuous tenure as speaker that ended less than nine months after it started. Trump's limited support for the man he famously called "my Kevin" on the eve of his inauguration encapsulated a relationship that has ebbed and flowed over the years. And it reflected the caution Trump typically exercises in contested situations where weighing in more forcefully as he often does on a range of issues carries political risks.
Yet, it's not clear that a Trump intervention into the House chaos would have saved McCarthy's gavel. Of the eight Republicans who voted against McCarthy, only three have endorsed Trump for 2024. Rep. Bob Good (R-Va.) has endorsed Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis; Rep. Ken Buck (R-Colo.) is a Trump critic; and Rep. Nancy Mace (R-S.C.) defeated a Trump-backed primary challenger.
On Tuesday night, Trump's campaign did not comment on McCarthy's defeat and instead pointed to his social media post. One person close to Trump, who, like others, spoke on the condition of anonymity to comment candidly, suggested that the outcome might have been different if McCarthy had endorsed Trump early on in the former president's quest for the 2024 nomination.
After McCarthy was removed in the historic vote, Gaetz suggested that Trump was on his side: "I would say that my conversations with the former president leave me with great confidence that I'm doing the right thing." McCarthy disputed that notion in a news conference. "I doubt if that's true," McCarthy said when asked about Gaetz's assertion.
Gaetz told reporters Monday he had spoken to Trump but did not disclose the details of their conversation. One Trump ally said the former president was upset about efforts by some House Republicans seeking to expel Gaetz from the GOP conference.
Trump also was angered by some of McCarthy's comments. In a June interview with CNBC, McCarthy suggested that his support for his old governing partner was in doubt. "Is he the strongest to win the election? I don't know that answer,"
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/10/04/trump-mccarthy-relationship/
You are anti-American. Not a single policy you support has ever worked or benefited the country. So the opposite of the policies you champion would, by definition be American.Frank Galvin said:Doc Holliday said:They already weren't accomplishing things…FLBear5630 said:With a 4-vote majority, that can't vote for ANYTHING in block, who and how are they going to accomplish those things?Doc Holliday said:GOP retaining power and setting cruise control on the status quo is bad. Not having radical change is bad. The normalization of what GOP has done for decades is bad.FLBear5630 said:They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
McCarthy:
- Blocked the subpoena to Hunter Biden
- Sold us out on the debt ceiling
- Didn't secure the border
- Didn't release the Jan6 tapes
- Kept 87,000 New IRS Agents
- Refuses to hold anyone accountable
- Keeps voting with Democrats
This is unacceptable behavior and removing him is a step against the above.
If this jams up Congress for a year and they can't get their anti-American agenda done then what's the problem?
Maybe the new speaker furthers the goals of the GOP whose fed up with the system, or maybe it furthers the system, either way, you need to put your cards down to at least try: that's better than accepting defeat.
Policies I don't agree with="Anti-American Agenda."
Love a good cut and paste.Osodecentx said:
As McCarthy tumbled toward defeat, Trump did not defend his speakership
Trump's limited support for the man he famously called 'my Kevin' encapsulated a relationship that has ebbed and flowed over the years
As Kevin McCarthy battled this week to keep the job he would eventually lose, one very powerful ally did not come to his rescue: Donald Trump.
For years, McCarthy (R-Calif.) prided himself on his close relationship with Trump, defending the former president through countless controversies and cajoling him to support the former speaker's own political priorities. He challenged Trump's 2020 election defeat and swallowed his objections to Trump's conduct in the lead-up to the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol. He navigated around some of the former president's congressional endorsements even when those candidates appeared destined for defeat. Within the past few months, he helped Trump's team secure coveted changes to the California GOP's primary rules. And in recent weeks, he had all but endorsed Trump's nomination for the 2024 presidential race, an unusual move for a top congressional leader this early in a contested primary.
But as McCarthy's speakership teetered on the brink Tuesday, Trump stayed resolutely on the sidelines as his acolyte, Rep. Matt Gaetz (R-Fla.), engineered a vote that ultimately ejected McCarthy from his leadership post. Trump's biggest contribution to the debate came in the form of a mildly worded social media post that simply asked: "Why is it that Republicans are always fighting among themselves, why aren't they fighting the Radical Left Democrats who are destroying our country?"
McCarthy's ouster capped a tumultuous tenure as speaker that ended less than nine months after it started. Trump's limited support for the man he famously called "my Kevin" on the eve of his inauguration encapsulated a relationship that has ebbed and flowed over the years. And it reflected the caution Trump typically exercises in contested situations where weighing in more forcefully as he often does on a range of issues carries political risks.
Yet, it's not clear that a Trump intervention into the House chaos would have saved McCarthy's gavel. Of the eight Republicans who voted against McCarthy, only three have endorsed Trump for 2024. Rep. Bob Good (R-Va.) has endorsed Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis; Rep. Ken Buck (R-Colo.) is a Trump critic; and Rep. Nancy Mace (R-S.C.) defeated a Trump-backed primary challenger.
On Tuesday night, Trump's campaign did not comment on McCarthy's defeat and instead pointed to his social media post. One person close to Trump, who, like others, spoke on the condition of anonymity to comment candidly, suggested that the outcome might have been different if McCarthy had endorsed Trump early on in the former president's quest for the 2024 nomination.
After McCarthy was removed in the historic vote, Gaetz suggested that Trump was on his side: "I would say that my conversations with the former president leave me with great confidence that I'm doing the right thing." McCarthy disputed that notion in a news conference. "I doubt if that's true," McCarthy said when asked about Gaetz's assertion.
Gaetz told reporters Monday he had spoken to Trump but did not disclose the details of their conversation. One Trump ally said the former president was upset about efforts by some House Republicans seeking to expel Gaetz from the GOP conference.
Trump also was angered by some of McCarthy's comments. In a June interview with CNBC, McCarthy suggested that his support for his old governing partner was in doubt. "Is he the strongest to win the election? I don't know that answer,"
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/10/04/trump-mccarthy-relationship/
[Ross Douthat has an astute analysis of this debacle, saying that Gaetz is what you get when you are governed by a gerontocracy. In this excerpt, Douthat talks about the GOP's political paralysis, needing to produce wise and talented figures who can lead the way out of the looming fiscal crisis:
What they have instead is Matt Gaetz. Who is, in his way, telling the truth when he criticizes the can-kicking style in which McCarthy has tried to negotiate between his own members and the Democrats, or when he tells the reporters gathered for his performances that the leaders of both parties are custodians of American decline. But Gaetz has, of course, no politically plausible vision of his own neither a means of selling his own party's voters on entitlement reform nor a willingness to strike a difficult bargain with Democrats even if such a thing were possible. He's just using our fiscal crisis as a ladder; the worse the problems, the easier the climb.
To grow in age is supposedly to grow in wisdom, and in theory one might imagine that what an aging society lacked in dynamism and innovation, it would make up for in the sobriety and seriousness of its leaders.
Instead in our would-be presidents we see the weaknesses of age the debilitation of Joe Biden, the instability of Donald Trump, even the paranoia of their potential third-party challenger, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. (who if elected would be the second-oldest American to begin a first presidential term).
While in our younger leaders, instead of counteracting virtues, we have chaotic vices that threaten to make everything ungovernable the Republican Party, the House of Representatives, the country as a whole.]
What they have instead is Matt Gaetz. Who is, in his way, telling the truth when he criticizes the can-kicking style in which McCarthy has tried to negotiate between his own members and the Democrats, or when he tells the reporters gathered for his performances that the leaders of both parties are custodians of American decline. But Gaetz has, of course, no politically plausible vision of his own neither a means of selling his own party's voters on entitlement reform nor a willingness to strike a difficult bargain with Democrats even if such a thing were possible. He's just using our fiscal crisis as a ladder; the worse the problems, the easier the climb.
To grow in age is supposedly to grow in wisdom, and in theory one might imagine that what an aging society lacked in dynamism and innovation, it would make up for in the sobriety and seriousness of its leaders.
Instead in our would-be presidents we see the weaknesses of age the debilitation of Joe Biden, the instability of Donald Trump, even the paranoia of their potential third-party challenger, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. (who if elected would be the second-oldest American to begin a first presidential term).
While in our younger leaders, instead of counteracting virtues, we have chaotic vices that threaten to make everything ungovernable the Republican Party, the House of Representatives, the country as a whole.]
How is a refusal to represent voters a policy and how is that not anti-American?Frank Galvin said:Policies I don't agree with="Anti-American Agenda."Doc Holliday said:They already weren't accomplishing things…FLBear5630 said:With a 4-vote majority, that can't vote for ANYTHING in block, who and how are they going to accomplish those things?Doc Holliday said:GOP retaining power and setting cruise control on the status quo is bad. Not having radical change is bad. The normalization of what GOP has done for decades is bad.FLBear5630 said:They keep shooting themselves in the feet! Sort of hard not to as they have screwed up every step of the road since 2016! McConnell holding SCOUS slot was highlight!GrowlTowel said:On one hand you criticize the GOP for its infighting and eating their own and on the other, you participate in the same endeavor.FLBear5630 said:It changes when the GOP controls the Executive Branch again and set the direction. We are running that buffoon Trump again! Even if he wins nothing gets done because he will be defending from attacks and churning through Staff. He may get some Executive Orders through after they end up in Court.muddybrazos said:FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.The US added - checks notes - $275 billion in debt in, uh, ONE DAY
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) October 3, 2023
Total US debt is now $33.442 trillion, hit $33 trillion just 2 weeks ago, and on pace to rise by $1 trillion in 1 month.
WTF is going onhttps://t.co/tOrhqmkFXL pic.twitter.com/w3qnBAIfLh
When does this change? IF Mccarthey had done single item bills or even denied some Ukraine funding to get the border closed he would still be speaker.
You want to break the cycle, get a GOP candidate that can win AND Govern. Trump and the Freedom Caucus ain't it.
As for the debt, Trump played just as much a role in it than the Dems.
Trump - Had both houses and didn't get anything done
Ryan - Didn't work with Trump
Trump - Screwing up and being impeached twice!
Trump - COVID giving in and closing the Nation
Jan 6th
Now, removing their own Speaker
It has been a clown show of individuals who are more interested in PodCasts and making points than Governing.
McCarthy:
- Blocked the subpoena to Hunter Biden
- Sold us out on the debt ceiling
- Didn't secure the border
- Didn't release the Jan6 tapes
- Kept 87,000 New IRS Agents
- Refuses to hold anyone accountable
- Keeps voting with Democrats
This is unacceptable behavior and removing him is a step against the above.
If this jams up Congress for a year and they can't get their anti-American agenda done then what's the problem?
Maybe the new speaker furthers the goals of the GOP whose fed up with the system, or maybe it furthers the system, either way, you need to put your cards down to at least try: that's better than accepting defeat.
RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:
How hilarious would it be if the Republicans elected Donald Trump to be Speaker of the House? It is a possibility. Liberal heads would explode across the country! It would be beautiful. Blue states might declare a State of Emergency and collapse to the fetal position. FEMA would be called in to help them recover from the tsunami of tears from Leftist grief and Conservative laughter.
GOP rules says he's ineligible.
Mitch Blood Green said:RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:
How hilarious would it be if the Republicans elected Donald Trump to be Speaker of the House? It is a possibility. Liberal heads would explode across the country! It would be beautiful. Blue states might declare a State of Emergency and collapse to the fetal position. FEMA would be called in to help them recover from the tsunami of tears from Leftist grief and Conservative laughter.
GOP rules says he's ineligible.
To hell with the rules. They can't contain Trump
Republicans embrace freedom of individual thought and values. Democrats embrace forcing others to be obedientMothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Florida pales in comparison to California in that regard.Frank Galvin said:FLBear5630 said:Of which State???Frank Galvin said:He has no interest in being Speaker. He wants to be Governor.Mothra said:Make no mistake - Gaetz will NEVER be speaker. He's largely a pariah among the rank and file, whether that's justified or not.FLBear5630 said:You think it's going to change??? Even if Gaetz is the Speaker, it doesn't change a thing. He will still have to work with the Dems (who control Exec and Senate) with a 4 seat advantage, with the factions in the GOP is no advantage. There is ZERO chance of change and decapitating your Party mid-stream set the GOP back this whole cycle. Dems are going to run rampant.muddybrazos said:Gaetz did do something good. IF Gaetz doesnt do this then nothing ever changes. Rinos like Mccarthey need to realize that the voters have had enough of this say one thing then do same old business as usual crap. Status quo republicanism is not an option any more.FLBear5630 said:They get it. They do a better job of knowing how to play the system and convincing all their members. GOP gets caught up in making Statements, as they are losing the Nation to the Dems. Gaetz actually thinks he did something good.Mothra said:True. The Dems are much better at enforcing conformity than the Repubs. Always have been.Mitch Blood Green said:whiterock said:LOL (gasp) O Lord, please help me! (can't breathe)....Mitch Blood Green said:
The real issue is that had McCarthy been "Speaker of the House," not "Speaker of the Republican House", he'd still have the job. 8 Republicans is not enough to expel him but it is enough for 212 or so Republicans to see they don't have a voice unless they take back control in a bipartisan fashion.
I see "Trump for Speaker" folks. Are there 217 Republicans for this? I don't see it. I can see 10 Republicans + Dems for Jeffries or Dems + 35 Republicans for someone like Lawler.
I can see a discharge petition that brings a budget to the floor that gets Ukraine funding and a bipartisan budget without far right representatives.
All this glee only works if Republicans remain nonpartisan. As soon as some start working with their countrymen, all this goes away.
I agree with Gaetz that McCarthy isn't trustworthy. But he removed him without a plan.
on what issue, pray tell, was Nancy Pelosi the speaker of the WHOLE house?
So, Rock, help me understand why there wasn't more than 8 Republicans voting to remove McCarthy. You're in the civil war, why is the winning side significantly smaller than the losing side?
I sense Nancy would have never had this problem.
Who is going to get the Speakership? Who has the votes? Emmer has cancer. Scalise? He is McCarthy 2.
Jordan? Yeah, a far right Freedom Caucus person will get the votes??? McHenry, he is too busy making seating charts, he won't get the votes. That idiot Greene is calling for Trump.
Gaetz and his cronies decapitated the GOP with no alternative or plan. You guys who think this is good have no idea how it works and have idealistic dreams of no Government in a connected small world. Shut it down and see how strong the US stays in the world.
Florida. It has the highest concentration of crazy people so he has a large base to work with.