Gazan approval of Hamas has consistently been in the high 70s and 80s%. A strong majority still support what Hamas did Oct 7. Pretending that Gazans know they made a bad mistake and have been regretting it ever since is hogwash.Redbrickbear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas.. .
Half the population of Gaza is under the age of 16.
Hamas won a single election 17 years ago and has refused to give up power.
Let's not act like the people in Gaza are re-electing Hamas on a yearly basis.
"Only a fraction of the territory's population today cast a ballot for Hamas. But the vote 17 years ago has been invoked as justification for ..."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/24/gaza-election-hamas-2006-palestine-israel/
Netanyahu said "we are at war,"
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6535 Replies |
Last: 1 hr ago by Sam Lowry
LOLOL No, the question is not what would I have done. The question is what will Russia do. And the answer to that, it is pretty clear, unless one intends to ignore history, geopolitical realities, and the Russian psyche.Sam Lowry said:You've dodged the question twice now.whiterock said:Sam Lowry said:Only hypothetically. So you admit you would have done the same as Russia if you were in their position.whiterock said:So now you accept the premise of the very scenario I've laid out as justification for why Ukraine matters?Sam Lowry said:So after Russia takes Ukraine, let's say Hungary starts drifting into the Russian orbit. Under pressure from the United States, however, it reverses course on some contentious issue (LGBT rights, Sweden in NATO, take your pick). Primed by Russian propaganda, Russian sympathizers and other reactionaries in Hungary overthrow the government. A low-level civil war breaks out. We support the pro-Western "freedom fighters," but the pro-Russian regime has the upper hand. With Russian help, Hungary masses a large army 200 miles from Vienna.whiterock said:LOL this is pure comedy. Russia arm-twists an elected Ukrainian president to renege on a campaign promise to sign a bill passed by the elected Ukrainian parliament to join the EU. (not intervention.) Mostly unarmed Ukrainian citizens erupt into spontaneous demonstrations and overwhelm police, causing said president to flee to Russia. (this is US meddling, of course). Ukraine then has new elections and proceeds on the widely popular path to the EU. (more US meddling, of course). Russia then starts a "little green men" destabilization operation in the Donbas. (which of course Russia is entitle to do because they're Russia. They can do anything they want and besides....US meddling!). Ukraine defends its territory. (how dare they, those fascists!) Then Russia outright invades sovereign Ukrainian territory to seize Crimea. (liberating the Crimeans from fascism). The US sputters in outrage but only sends non-lethal assistance. (typical US expansionism). Then Russia outright invades Ukraine to seize the capital and subsume Ukraine back into Russian polity. (US expansionism FORCED them to do it). Then the US/Nato responds with limited military assistance, dribbled/drabbed in over time. (more US expansionism). The Russian invasion of Ukraine causes the paragons of neutrality Finland and Sweden to flip on a dime and, due to a rapid change in widespread public opinion, join Nato (more Nato expansionism....will they never STOP!).Sam Lowry said:
You may have misunderstood my question. Aiding a new junta is analogous to what we did in Ukraine, so that's not the issue. It was Russia's intervention, or our hypothetical intervention in a NATO country, that would be a violation according to your reasoning.
Simply put, if we can accomplish regime change by unconventional means, we expect Russia to take it and like it. Apparently that's how things work under the "rules-based order." Why shouldn't they expect the same from us, or are there different rules for different people?
I mean, I could go on for a while, but we get your drift = Poor Russia is entitled to whatever it wants and if we lift a finger to oppose them, we are engaging in fascist expansionism.
Time to invade?
LOL LOL LOL
If you want to avoid the scenario we now both see as fraught with risk, the proper response is to win the war in Ukraine.
Rather a weak deflection. I've neither said nor suggested that's what I would do.
Rather, I've pointed to old and recent history applied to quite mainstream geopolitical realities to highlight the bloody friggin' obvious - that's what Russia will do.
What I would do is win the damned war in Ukraine, destroying the Russian war machine in the process, shaking the pillars of the Russian state to the breaking point, and past them if necessary.
We have no obligation to watch the wheel spin. We can break wheels if they continually run over other people.
It would be a very good thing for the entire world if Kiev replaced Moscow as the center of the eastern Slav world.
Yep.Osodecentx said:sombear said:
Note that I have not cited IDF #s. Has it even released numbers? I wouldn't trust those either.
The bottom line is that, in Gaza, even in peace time, there are few true journalists there. They're too afraid of being killed, and Hamas wouldn't allow most in any way. That is why it turned out so many "journalists" reporting on Oct 7 were affiliated with Hamas and in multiple cases, actually helped commit the atrocities.
In my view, however, it really does not matter in the bigger picture debate whether the # is 5000, 15,000, or 30,000. A lot of innocents are being killed, period. That has been the case in every major war. If you require Israel to respond proportionately and/or to place their own forces at greater risk, then all of those are far too many. If you believe Israel has the right to not only respond but eradicate Hamas, or force its surrender, and to protect Israel in the future, then 30,000 isn't too many.
That sounds harsh, but most folks aren't changing their minds either way based on number counts.
I find it interesting that those who tell Israel to pack up and go home aren't telling Putin to do the same thing. And those emphasizing the Hamas death estimates but saying nothing about Putin's massacres or indiscriminate bombings of apartments and other residential areas far away from the lines.
At least Israel has an argument that the way Hamas "fights" makes it impossible to avoid civilian casualties. Putin has no such dilemma. He's simply a butcher who gets off on killing people he believes are not a true people in the first place.
Excellent post
Have no patience with people who pick a war, lose it, then blame their opponent for the carnage. If you don't want your enemy to burn your cities, don't pick a war with your enemy.
sombear said:Gazan approval of Hamas has consistently been in the high 70s and 80s%. A strong majority still support what Hamas did Oct 7. Pretending that Gazans know they made a bad mistake and have been regretting it ever since is hogwash.Redbrickbear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas.. .
Half the population of Gaza is under the age of 16.
Hamas won a single election 17 years ago and has refused to give up power.
Let's not act like the people in Gaza are re-electing Hamas on a yearly basis.
"Only a fraction of the territory's population today cast a ballot for Hamas. But the vote 17 years ago has been invoked as justification for ..."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/24/gaza-election-hamas-2006-palestine-israel/
Leaving aside for a second that polls in that part of the world are often inaccurate.
Nearly half the population of Gaza is children.
It's very creepy to hold children guilty for a political system they did not choose.
(Not to mention blowing them up and starving them)
The Israeli's made corridors for them to leave. They told them what was coming and set a date. It is Hamas keeping them there to suit their purposes. Israel has many Arabs existing very nicely alongside Jews. Those people could have joined them at any time. They are true believers and are not as innocent as you say. They like Hamas and what they preach, they voted them in control. The only reason they are in the news is they are getting beat AGAIN.KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
You mean the children that are taught starting in pre-school to hate and kill jews?
But I've never argued we should hold citizens responsible for its government. Otherwise Bin Laden would have been right. I was just responding to your suggestion that Gazans no longer support Hamas. You are correct, polls there can be inaccurate, but that polling has been consistent for years and by numerus pollsters in and out of the region.
But I've never argued we should hold citizens responsible for its government. Otherwise Bin Laden would have been right. I was just responding to your suggestion that Gazans no longer support Hamas. You are correct, polls there can be inaccurate, but that polling has been consistent for years and by numerus pollsters in and out of the region.
[Biden tells Israel they can't carpet bomb Hamas like the US did with Germany because after WWII they created rules to stop that from happening again.]
"Hey ChatGPT: give me a quote that sounds presidential that I can use instead of the usual gibberish that comes out of Biden's mouth."Redbrickbear said:
[Biden tells Israel they can't carpet bomb Hamas like the US did with Germany because after WWII they created rules to stop that from happening again.]
whitetrash said:"Hey ChatGPT: give me a quote that sounds presidential that I can use instead of the usual gibberish that comes out of Biden's mouth."Redbrickbear said:
[Biden tells Israel they can't carpet bomb Hamas like the US did with Germany because after WWII they created rules to stop that from happening again.]
lol you do have to wonder how many of his "statements" are just created for him by a 25 year old on a laptop
Probably most of what is coherent.
“Incline my heart to your testimonies, and not to selfish gain!”
Psalm 119:36
Psalm 119:36
KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
ShooterTX
Redbrickbear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas.. .
Half the population of Gaza is under the age of 16.
Hamas won a single election 17 years ago and has refused to give up power.
Let's not act like the people in Gaza are re-electing Hamas on a yearly basis.
"Only a fraction of the territory's population today cast a ballot for Hamas. But the vote 17 years ago has been invoked as justification for ..."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/24/gaza-election-hamas-2006-palestine-israel/
Oh I see... so electing an internationally recognized terrorist group as your leaders is OK... so long as you only do it once?
What sick twisted world do you live in?
This wasn't some kind of "oopsie". Everyone knew exactly what they were doing when they voted for a group of evil, satanic butchers.
They are just lucky that Israel has far more civility and decency than Hamas. If Hamas had attacked another Muslim country in this horrific way... the result would be total genocide.
ShooterTX
ShooterTX
ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
LOL
You are kidding right ?
The Hindu's and Muslims has been slaughtering each other throughout India for centuries .
Read up what happened when the English pulled out.
Hundreds of thousands died .
And no one is defending Hamas.
But 25000 dead for 1500 is enough revenge .
Time for a cease fire.
KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
LOL
You are kidding right ?
The Hindu's and Muslims has been slaughtering each other throughout India for centuries .
When you think of India, what's the first thing that comes to mind?
When you hear the word Palestinians... what comes to mind?
Sorry pal, but only a fool would believe that India is famous for terrorism.
ShooterTX
ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
LOL
You are kidding right ?
The Hindu's and Muslims has been slaughtering each other throughout India for centuries .
When you think of India, what's the first thing that comes to mind?
When you hear the word Palestinians... what comes to mind?
Sorry pal, but only a fool would believe that India is famous for terrorism.
Dude you really need t get a grip.
Most Americans couldn't find India on an atlas much less keep up on events in the sub continent.
In fact each side has constantly committed acts of terrorism agonist the other .
With a total higher death count than anything involving Israel
KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
LOL
You are kidding right ?
The Hindu's and Muslims has been slaughtering each other throughout India for centuries .
Read up what happened when the English pulled out.
Hundreds of thousands died .
And no one is defending Hamas.
But 25000 dead for 1500 is enough revenge .
Time for a cease fire.
Gaza had a ceasefire on October 6. Hamas violated it. Israel will end this war on their terms, not on those of Hamas or any of their apologists.
It is Hamas to that is genocidal, not Israel. It's their primary reason to exist. It's in their charter.
“Incline my heart to your testimonies, and not to selfish gain!”
Psalm 119:36
Psalm 119:36
historian said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
LOL
You are kidding right ?
The Hindu's and Muslims has been slaughtering each other throughout India for centuries .
Read up what happened when the English pulled out.
Hundreds of thousands died .
And no one is defending Hamas.
But 25000 dead for 1500 is enough revenge .
Time for a cease fire.
Gaza had a ceasefire on October 6. Hamas violated it. Israel will end this war on their terms, not on those of Hamas or any of their apologists.
It is Hamas to that is genocidal, not Israel. It's their primary reason to exist. It's in their charter.
We just disagree.
25000 dead for 1500 is more than enough retribution.
Time to stop the killing .
KaiBear said:historian said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
LOL
You are kidding right ?
The Hindu's and Muslims has been slaughtering each other throughout India for centuries .
Read up what happened when the English pulled out.
Hundreds of thousands died .
And no one is defending Hamas.
But 25000 dead for 1500 is enough revenge .
Time for a cease fire.
Gaza had a ceasefire on October 6. Hamas violated it. Israel will end this war on their terms, not on those of Hamas or any of their apologists.
It is Hamas to that is genocidal, not Israel. It's their primary reason to exist. It's in their charter.
We just disagree.
25000 dead for 1500 is more than enough retribution.
Time to stop the killing .
How many died at Pearl Harbor vs how many died at Nagasaki and Hiroshima?
The war wasn't over until Japan surrendered. Revenge and numbers had nothing to do with it.
The war that Hamas started will not end until Israel has achieved all of its goals.
This is why people like you should NEVER be involved in major decisions. You think that some kind of equity should be a determining factor. Just pure idiocy.
Just lie the idiocy that believes poverty creates terrorism.
In that case, the Appalachian mountains and Reynosa must be overflowing with terrorists.
Idiot.
ShooterTX
ShooterTX said:Redbrickbear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas.. .
Half the population of Gaza is under the age of 16.
Hamas won a single election 17 years ago and has refused to give up power.
Let's not act like the people in Gaza are re-electing Hamas on a yearly basis.
"Only a fraction of the territory's population today cast a ballot for Hamas. But the vote 17 years ago has been invoked as justification for ..."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/24/gaza-election-hamas-2006-palestine-israel/
Oh I see... so electing an internationally recognized terrorist group as your leaders is OK... so long as you only do it once...
Well the Irish elected Sinn Fein (political wing of the IRA) and the Black South Africans elected the ANC (political wing of the uMkhonto we Sizwe-Spear of the Nation)
And unlike the Palestinians they have re-elected those parties multiple times.
The 2006 election was the only one the Palestinians had that Hamas won…and let's not act like they won big.
Its was by 3% of the vote....not a massive majority
That is the kind of thinking that sows the seeds of the next war with fertilizer.KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
LOL
You are kidding right ?
The Hindu's and Muslims has been slaughtering each other throughout India for centuries .
Read up what happened when the English pulled out.
Hundreds of thousands died .
And no one is defending Hamas.
But 25000 dead for 1500 is enough revenge .
Time for a cease fire.
"The purpose of war is to make a better peace."
--Basil Liddell-Hart
Israel cannot afford to go to war and leave in place any ability for any authority in Gaza to pose a military threat to Israel in a meaningful timeframe. That neither Egypt nor Saudi nor Jordan have lifted a finger to stop Israel should tell you that they understand Israel's position and believe they benefit from it as well. The destruction of Hamas has cost Iran decades of huge investment in a proxy army that destabilized the entire area.
Israel has handled its portion of WWIII like a boss.
whiterock said:That is the kind of thinking that sows the seeds of the next war with fertilizer.KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
LOL
You are kidding right ?
The Hindu's and Muslims has been slaughtering each other throughout India for centuries .
Read up what happened when the English pulled out.
Hundreds of thousands died .
And no one is defending Hamas.
But 25000 dead for 1500 is enough revenge .
Time for a cease fire.
"The purpose of war is to make a better peace."
--Basil Liddell-Hart
Israel cannot afford to go to war and leave in place any ability for any authority in Gaza to pose a military threat to Israel in a meaningful timeframe. That neither Egypt nor Saudi nor Jordan have lifted a finger to stop Israel should tell you that they understand Israel's position and believe they benefit from it as well. The destruction of Hamas has cost Iran decades of huge investment in a proxy army that destabilized the entire area.
Israel has handled its portion of WWIII like a boss.
Either
A. Thousands more civilians in Gaza are going to die of exposure, malnutrition, disease or air strikes.
Or
B. A cease fire will established
Those are the only 2 choices.
If 25,000 dead civilians isn't enough…..how many more are necessary ?
If 25,000 dead can't bring security to Israel ….why would an extra 50,000 dead do so ?
KaiBear said:whiterock said:That is the kind of thinking that sows the seeds of the next war with fertilizer.KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
LOL
You are kidding right ?
The Hindu's and Muslims has been slaughtering each other throughout India for centuries .
Read up what happened when the English pulled out.
Hundreds of thousands died .
And no one is defending Hamas.
But 25000 dead for 1500 is enough revenge .
Time for a cease fire.
"The purpose of war is to make a better peace."
--Basil Liddell-Hart
Israel cannot afford to go to war and leave in place any ability for any authority in Gaza to pose a military threat to Israel in a meaningful timeframe. That neither Egypt nor Saudi nor Jordan have lifted a finger to stop Israel should tell you that they understand Israel's position and believe they benefit from it as well. The destruction of Hamas has cost Iran decades of huge investment in a proxy army that destabilized the entire area.
Israel has handled its portion of WWIII like a boss.
Either
A. Thousands more civilians in Gaza are going to die of exposure, malnutrition, disease or air strikes.
Or
B. A cease fire will established
Those are the only 2 choices.
If 25,000 dead civilians isn't enough…..how many more are necessary ?
If 25,000 dead can't bring security to Israel ….why would an extra 50,000 dead do so ?
What was the magic number of dead civilians that finally created the end of WW2?
Moron... wars don't end because of the number of dead civilians. Only a fool thinks that wars are determined in such ways.
Hamas will never agree to a cease fire because they do not want peace. So if you truly think that those are the only two options... then get ready for thousands more dead... because Hamas doesn't give a **** about Palestinians... they only care about killing Jews.
If you want peace in Gaza, then you need to direct your attention towards Hamas not Israel.
ShooterTX
My dad, Attallah Amash, was born on this day in 1940. What a life he’s lived.
— Justin Amash (@justinamash) March 4, 2024
In 1948, Israeli forces expelled him and his extended family from their homes in Ramle and Lod. He was shot at, but he wasn’t afraid. “At that age, you don’t think of dying,” he once told me.
He had… pic.twitter.com/3RPGMKw2oZ
Actually it was based on your statement that Hamas is responsible for every single death. If that's true after 30,000 deaths, is it still true after a million? It's a perfectly fair question.historian said:
You are making ridiculous assumptions based upon the lies of terrorists
Not true.Osodecentx said:KaiBear said:historian said:KaiBear said:Effectively the same peace they've shared over the decades.sombear said:KaiBear said:sombear said:KaiBear said:sombear said:What is this peace of which you speak . . . .KaiBear said:historian said:KaiBear said:historian said:
Israel is defending itself against genocidal terrorists. Stop with the Hamas propaganda already.
Then our own Secretary of Defrnse is promoting Hamas propaganda.
Otherwise one cannot not reasonably support killing over 25,000 people to avenge the murder of 1400 .
Enough blood has been shed
Time to call for a ceasefire.
If Israel wishes to continue the war, let them do so without the complicity of US taxpayers.
Considering our own Secretaries of State & of Defense are more concerned with gender ideology than promoting American interests that might be the case. Biden himself has been trying to force Israel to accept a ceasefire, essentially to surrender to Hamas. So that unfortunate failure by our fascist leaders is quite possible.
Enough with the Islamofascist propaganda. It's a war between civilization & barbarism. The genocidal Hamas must be defeated. Israel must win this war for the sake of everyone.
Israel can not win this war.
They can only lose the peace.
And slaughtering an additional 50,000 people won't change anything.
Israel needs peace almost as badly as the people in what's left of Gaza. There military mobilization hurts their economy and religious tourism is way down. And everyone in that region needed tourism to return after 2 years of Covid restrictions.
Even a bad peace is better than the useless deaths of another 25.000 people.
But there was never peace.. Hamas plotted Oct 7 for years while pretending to work with Israel. Hamas not only is unapologetic but brags they will do it again and go even further. Israel cannot have that kind of enemy next door. So Israel sees this as either Hamas surrenders or is destroyed, even if that means destruction of most of Gaza and tens of thousands of deaths.
Israel has go choice but to have that kind of enemy' next door.
As they simply can't kill all the Muslims who hate them.
It is time to see things as they are and can't be changed .
Make peace while they still can .
They have solid Muslim relationships. It's only the nut jobs that want to destroy them. Again I ask, what does "peace" look like with Hamas still intact next door?Effect
A violent one.
That happens when your neighbors want to destroy your country and kill every last person. Hamas literally is genocidal.
If solders from another country forced you to remain in an incredibly small strip of land with 2 million other individuals , effectively controlled your ability for any kind of employment, then destroyed your hovel via air strikes killing your wife and children in the process………
wouldn't you want revenge ?
If your soldiers start a war you lose your right to complain about the consequences. See Dresden & Hiroshima
And…three times.whiterock said:LOLOL No, the question is not what would I have done. The question is what will Russia do. And the answer to that, it is pretty clear, unless one intends to ignore history, geopolitical realities, and the Russian psyche.Sam Lowry said:You've dodged the question twice now.whiterock said:Sam Lowry said:Only hypothetically. So you admit you would have done the same as Russia if you were in their position.whiterock said:So now you accept the premise of the very scenario I've laid out as justification for why Ukraine matters?Sam Lowry said:So after Russia takes Ukraine, let's say Hungary starts drifting into the Russian orbit. Under pressure from the United States, however, it reverses course on some contentious issue (LGBT rights, Sweden in NATO, take your pick). Primed by Russian propaganda, Russian sympathizers and other reactionaries in Hungary overthrow the government. A low-level civil war breaks out. We support the pro-Western "freedom fighters," but the pro-Russian regime has the upper hand. With Russian help, Hungary masses a large army 200 miles from Vienna.whiterock said:LOL this is pure comedy. Russia arm-twists an elected Ukrainian president to renege on a campaign promise to sign a bill passed by the elected Ukrainian parliament to join the EU. (not intervention.) Mostly unarmed Ukrainian citizens erupt into spontaneous demonstrations and overwhelm police, causing said president to flee to Russia. (this is US meddling, of course). Ukraine then has new elections and proceeds on the widely popular path to the EU. (more US meddling, of course). Russia then starts a "little green men" destabilization operation in the Donbas. (which of course Russia is entitle to do because they're Russia. They can do anything they want and besides....US meddling!). Ukraine defends its territory. (how dare they, those fascists!) Then Russia outright invades sovereign Ukrainian territory to seize Crimea. (liberating the Crimeans from fascism). The US sputters in outrage but only sends non-lethal assistance. (typical US expansionism). Then Russia outright invades Ukraine to seize the capital and subsume Ukraine back into Russian polity. (US expansionism FORCED them to do it). Then the US/Nato responds with limited military assistance, dribbled/drabbed in over time. (more US expansionism). The Russian invasion of Ukraine causes the paragons of neutrality Finland and Sweden to flip on a dime and, due to a rapid change in widespread public opinion, join Nato (more Nato expansionism....will they never STOP!).Sam Lowry said:
You may have misunderstood my question. Aiding a new junta is analogous to what we did in Ukraine, so that's not the issue. It was Russia's intervention, or our hypothetical intervention in a NATO country, that would be a violation according to your reasoning.
Simply put, if we can accomplish regime change by unconventional means, we expect Russia to take it and like it. Apparently that's how things work under the "rules-based order." Why shouldn't they expect the same from us, or are there different rules for different people?
I mean, I could go on for a while, but we get your drift = Poor Russia is entitled to whatever it wants and if we lift a finger to oppose them, we are engaging in fascist expansionism.
Time to invade?
LOL LOL LOL
If you want to avoid the scenario we now both see as fraught with risk, the proper response is to win the war in Ukraine.
Rather a weak deflection. I've neither said nor suggested that's what I would do.
Rather, I've pointed to old and recent history applied to quite mainstream geopolitical realities to highlight the bloody friggin' obvious - that's what Russia will do.
What I would do is win the damned war in Ukraine, destroying the Russian war machine in the process, shaking the pillars of the Russian state to the breaking point, and past them if necessary.
We have no obligation to watch the wheel spin. We can break wheels if they continually run over other people.
It would be a very good thing for the entire world if Kiev replaced Moscow as the center of the eastern Slav world.
Some just don't understand the concept of total war. Maybe the don't want to. It's easier to repeat the terrorists' propaganda over & over again. Maybe they will even begin to believe the lies. I cannot comprehend how someone could support something so evil.
“Incline my heart to your testimonies, and not to selfish gain!”
Psalm 119:36
Psalm 119:36
There is no body count metric in asymmetrical warfare, especially when the objective is the elimination of a threat. This is further complicated by the very nature of a threat that doesn't follow a traditional military engagement.
Think about the actual events of October 7th. These weren't soldiers that crossed a border and started a fight. These were mostly Gazan citizens armed with weapons and ideology who just started randomly murdering people. They weren't reporting to field officers, they were calling home bragging about their successful kills, and to cheers no less. Think about how broad of a threat pool that infers.
Think about the actual events of October 7th. These weren't soldiers that crossed a border and started a fight. These were mostly Gazan citizens armed with weapons and ideology who just started randomly murdering people. They weren't reporting to field officers, they were calling home bragging about their successful kills, and to cheers no less. Think about how broad of a threat pool that infers.
The definition of "every single death" doesn't change when the number changes. If it was true with Japan after Pearl Harbor it was true after Hiroshima & Nagasaki. Unfortunately, when fighting a fanatical, genocidal enemy such an approach is necessary.
It's total war. Too many don't understand that or don't care for whatever reasons: they are antisemites, the want Hamas to succeed, they hate all war (except the ones they start), etc. Whatever their reasons, they are wrong and have no right to judge. Israel is fighting for survival and must see it through to the end.
It's total war. Too many don't understand that or don't care for whatever reasons: they are antisemites, the want Hamas to succeed, they hate all war (except the ones they start), etc. Whatever their reasons, they are wrong and have no right to judge. Israel is fighting for survival and must see it through to the end.
“Incline my heart to your testimonies, and not to selfish gain!”
Psalm 119:36
Psalm 119:36
The current war against the Hamas is a grim affair. Israel knew this going into the war. The best thing is to let the war run its course and to root out as many Hamas from Gaza as possible and then establish a governing structure that does not allow the Hamas to have any control in Gaza. The pressure the USA is putting on Israel to go to a permanent cease fire, before the IDF completes rooting out the Hamas, is not supporting Israel during this tough time. War is a terrible thing. The Palestinians allowed the Hamas to bring this war on to Gaza.
ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:whiterock said:That is the kind of thinking that sows the seeds of the next war with fertilizer.KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
LOL
You are kidding right ?
The Hindu's and Muslims has been slaughtering each other throughout India for centuries .
Read up what happened when the English pulled out.
Hundreds of thousands died .
And no one is defending Hamas.
But 25000 dead for 1500 is enough revenge .
Time for a cease fire.
"The purpose of war is to make a better peace."
--Basil Liddell-Hart
Israel cannot afford to go to war and leave in place any ability for any authority in Gaza to pose a military threat to Israel in a meaningful timeframe. That neither Egypt nor Saudi nor Jordan have lifted a finger to stop Israel should tell you that they understand Israel's position and believe they benefit from it as well. The destruction of Hamas has cost Iran decades of huge investment in a proxy army that destabilized the entire area.
Israel has handled its portion of WWIII like a boss.
Either
A. Thousands more civilians in Gaza are going to die of exposure, malnutrition, disease or air strikes.
Or
B. A cease fire will established
Those are the only 2 choices.
If 25,000 dead civilians isn't enough…..how many more are necessary ?
If 25,000 dead can't bring security to Israel ….why would an extra 50,000 dead do so ?
What was the magic number of dead civilians that finally created the end of WW2?
Moron... wars don't end because of the number of dead civilians. Only a fool thinks that wars are determined in such ways.
Hamas will never agree to a cease fire because they do not want peace. So if you truly think that those are the only two options... then get ready for thousands more dead... because Hamas doesn't give a **** about Palestinians... they only care about killing Jews.
If you want peace in Gaza, then you need to direct your attention towards Hamas not Israel.
Amusing when a clod like you, who clearly doesn't know the first thing about history or geopolitics ; draws the exactly wrong conclusion.
Wars are greatly impacted by the death count of civilians.
And that has been the case from the beginning off WW2.
Yes, the mentally impaired enjoy playing Rambo from the safety of their desktop computer, but in the real world human suffering is an unforgivable nightmare.
Israel has made its point. There is nothing to be gained security wise killing another 25,000 to 50,000 women and children.
I expect a cease fire to be established within the month.
As it is in Israel interests to do so.
Concern about civilians?KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:whiterock said:That is the kind of thinking that sows the seeds of the next war with fertilizer.KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
LOL
You are kidding right ?
The Hindu's and Muslims has been slaughtering each other throughout India for centuries .
Read up what happened when the English pulled out.
Hundreds of thousands died .
And no one is defending Hamas.
But 25000 dead for 1500 is enough revenge .
Time for a cease fire.
"The purpose of war is to make a better peace."
--Basil Liddell-Hart
Israel cannot afford to go to war and leave in place any ability for any authority in Gaza to pose a military threat to Israel in a meaningful timeframe. That neither Egypt nor Saudi nor Jordan have lifted a finger to stop Israel should tell you that they understand Israel's position and believe they benefit from it as well. The destruction of Hamas has cost Iran decades of huge investment in a proxy army that destabilized the entire area.
Israel has handled its portion of WWIII like a boss.
Either
A. Thousands more civilians in Gaza are going to die of exposure, malnutrition, disease or air strikes.
Or
B. A cease fire will established
Those are the only 2 choices.
If 25,000 dead civilians isn't enough…..how many more are necessary ?
If 25,000 dead can't bring security to Israel ….why would an extra 50,000 dead do so ?
What was the magic number of dead civilians that finally created the end of WW2?
Moron... wars don't end because of the number of dead civilians. Only a fool thinks that wars are determined in such ways.
Hamas will never agree to a cease fire because they do not want peace. So if you truly think that those are the only two options... then get ready for thousands more dead... because Hamas doesn't give a **** about Palestinians... they only care about killing Jews.
If you want peace in Gaza, then you need to direct your attention towards Hamas not Israel.
Amusing when a clod like you, who clearly doesn't know the first thing about history or geopolitics ; draws the exactly wrong conclusion.
Wars are greatly impacted by the death count of civilians.
And that has been the case from the beginning off WW2.
Yes, the mentally impaired enjoy playing Rambo from the safety of their desktop computer, but in the real world human suffering is an unforgivable nightmare.
Israel has made its point. There is nothing to be gained security wise killing another 25,000 to 50,000 women and children.
I expect a cease fire to be established within the month.
As it is in Israel interests to do so.
- Oct 7. Murders, rape, mutilation, and kidnappings.
- Remaining over 100 hostages.
- Everything Hamas does is focused on killing civilians
- Every wasted dollar on tunnels and weapons
- Every rocket fired
- Its very credo about wiping Israel off the map and killing Jews.
- Its brainwashing kids from the start
Israel is not "making a point." Israel is fighting for long-term security, which it will never have with Hamas intact and in charge next door.
Wrong conclusionsombear said:Concern about civilians?KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:whiterock said:That is the kind of thinking that sows the seeds of the next war with fertilizer.KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
LOL
You are kidding right ?
The Hindu's and Muslims has been slaughtering each other throughout India for centuries .
Read up what happened when the English pulled out.
Hundreds of thousands died .
And no one is defending Hamas.
But 25000 dead for 1500 is enough revenge .
Time for a cease fire.
"The purpose of war is to make a better peace."
--Basil Liddell-Hart
Israel cannot afford to go to war and leave in place any ability for any authority in Gaza to pose a military threat to Israel in a meaningful timeframe. That neither Egypt nor Saudi nor Jordan have lifted a finger to stop Israel should tell you that they understand Israel's position and believe they benefit from it as well. The destruction of Hamas has cost Iran decades of huge investment in a proxy army that destabilized the entire area.
Israel has handled its portion of WWIII like a boss.
Either
A. Thousands more civilians in Gaza are going to die of exposure, malnutrition, disease or air strikes.
Or
B. A cease fire will established
Those are the only 2 choices.
If 25,000 dead civilians isn't enough…..how many more are necessary ?
If 25,000 dead can't bring security to Israel ….why would an extra 50,000 dead do so ?
What was the magic number of dead civilians that finally created the end of WW2?
Moron... wars don't end because of the number of dead civilians. Only a fool thinks that wars are determined in such ways.
Hamas will never agree to a cease fire because they do not want peace. So if you truly think that those are the only two options... then get ready for thousands more dead... because Hamas doesn't give a **** about Palestinians... they only care about killing Jews.
If you want peace in Gaza, then you need to direct your attention towards Hamas not Israel.
Amusing when a clod like you, who clearly doesn't know the first thing about history or geopolitics ; draws the exactly wrong conclusion.
Wars are greatly impacted by the death count of civilians.
And that has been the case from the beginning off WW2.
Yes, the mentally impaired enjoy playing Rambo from the safety of their desktop computer, but in the real world human suffering is an unforgivable nightmare.
Israel has made its point. There is nothing to be gained security wise killing another 25,000 to 50,000 women and children.
I expect a cease fire to be established within the month.
As it is in Israel interests to do so.
- Oct 7. Murders, rape, mutilation, and kidnappings.
- Remaining over 100 hostages.
- Everything Hamas does is focused on killing civilians
- Every wasted dollar on tunnels and weapons
- Every rocket fired
- Its very credo about wiping Israel off the map and killing Jews.
- Its brainwashing kids from the start
Israel is not "making a point." Israel is fighting for long-term security, which it will never have with Hamas intact and in charge next door.
Israel will never have long term security surrounded as it is by several Muslim countries.
So the only question at this pont is how many more Gaza women and children need to die ?
Well, Israel has managed to not only survive but flourish for 75 years, so I disagree.KaiBear said:Wrong conclusionsombear said:Concern about civilians?KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:whiterock said:That is the kind of thinking that sows the seeds of the next war with fertilizer.KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:FLBear5630 said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:ShooterTX said:KaiBear said:historian said:
It's not about revenge. It's about survival. Hamas exists to destroy Israel & murder Jews. They are the genocidal force in this conflict. They must be destroyed so that they can never threaten Israel again. Israel is totally justified in their conduct of the war.
It's an existential crisis for Israel and anyone chanting "From the river to the sea" is also genocidal and not to be trusted. Anyone calling for a ceasefire on any terms other then Israel's is the same. Antisemitism is rampant, on the rise, and NEVER justified. (Harvard anyone?)
It's uncivilized and unintelligent. It's a fraudulent argument. Can I be any more emphatic?
With respect
I don't believe killing the entire population of Gaza will insure everlasting peace for the Jewish State .
If Hamas isn't willing to reach a truce at this point ; killing another 20000-40,000 individuals probably won't matter either.
It's a fallacy to think that Hamas can be negotiated with, or will honor any negotiated agreement.
Hamas doesn't want to live in peace.
The only hope for any kind of peace is to eradicate them completely.
Then you must be willing to eradicate all the orphans in Gaza.
As many will certainly grow up seeking revenge for the deaths of their Mothers and Fathers.
That's not true. People have often made this claim that hardship creates terrorists... not true. Plenty of terrorists have come out of affluent households in Britain. It is just the evil that results from the demonic religion of Islam.
If those orphans are educated and raised in a civilized culture... they won't become terrorists.
It is currently exceedingly difficult to legally emigrate from Gaza.
The more people the Israelis kill the more Hamas recruits they are going to generate.
So either Israel needs to slaughter them all, somehow coerce Egypt to accept the survivors as legal refugees or make a peace treaty giving the Palestinians their own state.
And none of these options is likely to happen.
So the misery goes on.
Yet the Gaza population voted for Hamas, Hamas keeps attacking Israel and complains when they lose and Israel responds. Maybe these people need to not support Hamas .
Crowed, under employed, desperate people make desperate choices.
As long as the people can't legally escape from Gaza , in their misery they will continue to lash out.
So either commit genicide on every man, women and child in Gaza, give them their own state ( which is unlikely to bring a lasting peace ) or somehow convince the rest of the Muslim world to accept theim as refugees.
This is just bull*****
The people of Gaza have no where NEAR the levels of poverty as people in India... and yet the Indians are not known for terrorism.
Quit making excuses for evil. There is NO excuse for butchering babies and raping women in the hundreds.
Your defense of Hamas is disgusting.
LOL
You are kidding right ?
The Hindu's and Muslims has been slaughtering each other throughout India for centuries .
Read up what happened when the English pulled out.
Hundreds of thousands died .
And no one is defending Hamas.
But 25000 dead for 1500 is enough revenge .
Time for a cease fire.
"The purpose of war is to make a better peace."
--Basil Liddell-Hart
Israel cannot afford to go to war and leave in place any ability for any authority in Gaza to pose a military threat to Israel in a meaningful timeframe. That neither Egypt nor Saudi nor Jordan have lifted a finger to stop Israel should tell you that they understand Israel's position and believe they benefit from it as well. The destruction of Hamas has cost Iran decades of huge investment in a proxy army that destabilized the entire area.
Israel has handled its portion of WWIII like a boss.
Either
A. Thousands more civilians in Gaza are going to die of exposure, malnutrition, disease or air strikes.
Or
B. A cease fire will established
Those are the only 2 choices.
If 25,000 dead civilians isn't enough…..how many more are necessary ?
If 25,000 dead can't bring security to Israel ….why would an extra 50,000 dead do so ?
What was the magic number of dead civilians that finally created the end of WW2?
Moron... wars don't end because of the number of dead civilians. Only a fool thinks that wars are determined in such ways.
Hamas will never agree to a cease fire because they do not want peace. So if you truly think that those are the only two options... then get ready for thousands more dead... because Hamas doesn't give a **** about Palestinians... they only care about killing Jews.
If you want peace in Gaza, then you need to direct your attention towards Hamas not Israel.
Amusing when a clod like you, who clearly doesn't know the first thing about history or geopolitics ; draws the exactly wrong conclusion.
Wars are greatly impacted by the death count of civilians.
And that has been the case from the beginning off WW2.
Yes, the mentally impaired enjoy playing Rambo from the safety of their desktop computer, but in the real world human suffering is an unforgivable nightmare.
Israel has made its point. There is nothing to be gained security wise killing another 25,000 to 50,000 women and children.
I expect a cease fire to be established within the month.
As it is in Israel interests to do so.
- Oct 7. Murders, rape, mutilation, and kidnappings.
- Remaining over 100 hostages.
- Everything Hamas does is focused on killing civilians
- Every wasted dollar on tunnels and weapons
- Every rocket fired
- Its very credo about wiping Israel off the map and killing Jews.
- Its brainwashing kids from the start
Israel is not "making a point." Israel is fighting for long-term security, which it will never have with Hamas intact and in charge next door.
Israel will never have long term security surrounded as it is by several Muslim countries.
So the only question at this pont is how many more Gaza women and children need to die ?