KaiBear said:

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historian said:

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KaiBear said:

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sombear said:

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KaiBear said:

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sombear said:

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KaiBear said:

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historian said:

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My family would never be involved in genocidal activity or support a terrorist organization determined to create a modern Holocaust.

I will not be disappointed because I take the long view of things and I know God will win in the end. I read the Bible & believe in it.

It's not about revenge. It's about destroying an enemy that must be destroyed.

Also, you keep repeating numbers, general or specific, that are based on Hamas propaganda. We have no reason to trust them.

---

The numbers come straight from the secretary of defense.

In fact US intelligence says the numbers involved may be even higher.

Enough is enough.


Time for a ceasefire .


Or the next 2000 to 10,000 lives lost might be Israelis .

---

If there is a ceasefire, the next thousands killed will definitely be Israelis.

---

Based on what scenario ?

---

Hamas. Hezbollah and friends will recover and do what they live to do

---

So you really believe these 2 organizations have the immediate capability to kill 'thousands' of Israelis in the event of a ceasefire ?

With what....AK 47's ?

---

Why "immediate"? They will continue to murder innocent people as long as Iran keeps providing them tickets, guns, ammo, etc. This has been their M.O. since they were founded. If they kill thousands over a few days or a few years what difference does it make? The victims are still dead and the genocidal maniacs will still celebrate, along with their soulmates in the west.

No ceasefire until they are destroyed.

---

You are in for a major disappointment.

There will be a ceasefire within the next 45 days.

As Biden is feeling increasing heat from his core constituents.

Women, young and minority voters.

So Israel will be forced to play along. Not only by Biden, but by the economic cost of their extensive military mobilization.

Hamas will survive , although in a much weaker condition.

---

You are in for a big disappointment. There is very little chance of any ceasefire unless it comes as a result of total Israeli victory. Biden is becoming increasingly irrelevant in this discussion and just about every other. When Biden tried to pressure Netanyahu to stop the war, Netanyahu told him to pound sand and rightfully so.

No one really knows what is going to happen. You can proclaim that something is going to happen in a certain time frame but you don't know either.

The bigger truth is that Hamas must be destroyed utterly.

historian said:

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KaiBear said:

---

historian said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

historian said:

---

My family would never be involved in genocidal activity or support a terrorist organization determined to create a modern Holocaust.

I will not be disappointed because I take the long view of things and I know God will win in the end. I read the Bible & believe in it.

It's not about revenge. It's about destroying an enemy that must be destroyed.

Also, you keep repeating numbers, general or specific, that are based on Hamas propaganda. We have no reason to trust them.

---

The numbers come straight from the secretary of defense.

In fact US intelligence says the numbers involved may be even higher.

Enough is enough.


Time for a ceasefire .


Or the next 2000 to 10,000 lives lost might be Israelis .

---

If there is a ceasefire, the next thousands killed will definitely be Israelis.

---

Based on what scenario ?

---

Hamas. Hezbollah and friends will recover and do what they live to do

---

So you really believe these 2 organizations have the immediate capability to kill 'thousands' of Israelis in the event of a ceasefire ?

With what....AK 47's ?

---

Why "immediate"? They will continue to murder innocent people as long as Iran keeps providing them tickets, guns, ammo, etc. This has been their M.O. since they were founded. If they kill thousands over a few days or a few years what difference does it make? The victims are still dead and the genocidal maniacs will still celebrate, along with their soulmates in the west.

No ceasefire until they are destroyed.

---

You are in for a major disappointment.

There will be a ceasefire within the next 45 days.

As Biden is feeling increasing heat from his core constituents.

Women, young and minority voters.

So Israel will be forced to play along. Not only by Biden, but by the economic cost of their extensive military mobilization.

Hamas will survive , although in a much weaker condition.

---

You are in for a big disappointment. There is very little chance of any ceasefire unless it comes as a result of total Israeli victory. Biden is becoming increasingly irrelevant ....

---

What does a total victory look like?

They have killed 30,000 Palestinians (half of them women and kids) taken 9,000 Hamas fighters as prisoners, killed 10,000 fighters.

Hamas never probably had more than 25,000 fighters at all in the first place.

IDF has now has destroyed about 70% of Gaza's buildings.

And they have total land, sea, and naval superiority.

Redbrickbear said:

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sombear said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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sombear said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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sombear said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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sombear said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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sombear said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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ATL Bear said:

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There is no body count metric in asymmetrical warfare, especially when the objective is the elimination of a threat. This is further complicated by the very nature of a threat that doesn't follow a traditional military engagement.

---

I guess normal people in the West...and the rest of the world want to know what the strategy is here.

Most reputable news sources say Hamas has about 30,000 fighters. (Israel has about 200,00 active troops and just called up about 360,000 reservists)

Israel says they have captured 9,000 Hamas fighters....the IDF claims to have killed another 12,000.

And they have blown up about 70% of the buildings in Gaza

Plus how many thousands of women and children they have killed.

There are two Million civilians in Gaza....how long do they have to suffer for this?

Its a small terrorist group with no chance of beating Israel...what's the end game? Destroy all the houses in Gaza? Kill 100,000 vs the 30,000 already killed.

Like us in Afghanistan a real question can be asked what is the end game and how is "victory" going to be defined in this situation?


https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/live-blog/israel-hamas-war-live-updates-rcna132421

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68387864

---

The end game is removing Hamas from power either through force or surrender.

---

How did that work out for us in Afghanistan with the Taliban?

---

Apple meet orange

---

I don't know.

Eventually the USA had to realize it could not hold a poor area filled with Muslims forever...an area with a long term Islamist insurgency...

How will Israel do it?

If ethnic cleansing is what they are planning...the "final solution to the Gaza Palestinian problem"?

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Hamas is not an ethnicity

---

Neither is the Taliban or the IRA

---

Your point is?

You're the one who referenced ethnic cleansing.I have accused nobody of that.

---

Well it's ethnic cleansing if they plan on expelling all the Palestinians from Gaza.

Something a few of their politicians have floated and a few posters on here have rooted on

Again what is the plan here? Hold 2 million Palestinians in Gaza under military rule forever? Along with 3.5 million more in the West Bank? Expel them to Europe?

---

One of your favorite tactics is to take something someone (usually on the fringe) said and suggest it is official policy.

Nobody is expelling 2 million Gazans.

...

---

Well again then…what is the long term plan?

If it's not to expel the Palestinians (fringe it might be up still floated by some of the more evil Israeli ultras) then the plan is an endless military occupation of the area?


How will that solve the problem?

---

I've posted this answer several times. It is far from a sure thing, but leaving Hamas intact and in power is a non-starter. Israeli troops steadily leave and are replaced by a joint Arab interim administration. If that goes well, then a 2-state solution.

Total Israeli victory looks like Hamas destroyed & no longer able to thresten the Jewish state.

By all means, continue parroting Hamas propaganda. It's as way to dismiss as it was the first dozen times. We know those numbers are lies. Not that it matters, Hamas is responsible for every last one of them. This has been explained multiple times.

Redbrickbear said:

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historian said:

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KaiBear said:

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historian said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

historian said:

---

My family would never be involved in genocidal activity or support a terrorist organization determined to create a modern Holocaust.

I will not be disappointed because I take the long view of things and I know God will win in the end. I read the Bible & believe in it.

It's not about revenge. It's about destroying an enemy that must be destroyed.

Also, you keep repeating numbers, general or specific, that are based on Hamas propaganda. We have no reason to trust them.

---

The numbers come straight from the secretary of defense.

In fact US intelligence says the numbers involved may be even higher.

Enough is enough.


Time for a ceasefire .


Or the next 2000 to 10,000 lives lost might be Israelis .

---

If there is a ceasefire, the next thousands killed will definitely be Israelis.

---

Based on what scenario ?

---

Hamas. Hezbollah and friends will recover and do what they live to do

---

So you really believe these 2 organizations have the immediate capability to kill 'thousands' of Israelis in the event of a ceasefire ?

With what....AK 47's ?

---

Why "immediate"? They will continue to murder innocent people as long as Iran keeps providing them tickets, guns, ammo, etc. This has been their M.O. since they were founded. If they kill thousands over a few days or a few years what difference does it make? The victims are still dead and the genocidal maniacs will still celebrate, along with their soulmates in the west.

No ceasefire until they are destroyed.

---

You are in for a major disappointment.

There will be a ceasefire within the next 45 days.

As Biden is feeling increasing heat from his core constituents.

Women, young and minority voters.

So Israel will be forced to play along. Not only by Biden, but by the economic cost of their extensive military mobilization.

Hamas will survive , although in a much weaker condition.

---

You are in for a big disappointment. There is very little chance of any ceasefire unless it comes as a result of total Israeli victory. Biden is becoming increasingly irrelevant ....

---

What does a total victory look like?

They have killed 30,000 Palestinians (half of them women and kids) taken 9,000 Hamas fighters as prisoners, killed 10,000 fighters.

Hamas never probably had more than 25,000 fighters at all in the first place.

IDF has now has destroyed about 70% of Gaza's buildings.

And they have total land, sea, and naval superiority.

---

Its a 2 part plan. The Zionists destroy Gaza and seize the land to create Greater Israel and the international Jewish NGO's move all the refugees to the west to destabilize Europe, the USA & Canada. It's Tkkun Olam except their vision of healing the world sucks for everyone but them.

Straight from a modern version of the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion". Sheesh! Antisemitic propaganda never ceases to amaze for it's stupidity.

historian said:

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Straight from a modern version of the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion". Sheesh! Antisemitic propaganda never ceases to amaze for it's stupidity.

---

Bbib said himself that Europe & the west should take the Gazans. Should we believe him?

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-11-14/ty-article/israeli-mks-publish-plan-to-transfer-gazans-to-europe-to-alleviate-humanitarian-crisis/0000018b-ce7c-d168-a3ef-dffeed320000

Maybe he was responding to western antisemites who were whining about Islamofascists experiencing the consequences of their actions.

At Auschwitz during peak operation they could kill over 20,000 per day. It's quite likely the Gazans could only dream of killing people at that rate. Many of them probably do dream if that.

It's barbarism vs civilization.

ATL Bear said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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historian said:

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KaiBear said:

---

historian said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

historian said:

---

My family would never be involved in genocidal activity or support a terrorist organization determined to create a modern Holocaust.

I will not be disappointed because I take the long view of things and I know God will win in the end. I read the Bible & believe in it.

It's not about revenge. It's about destroying an enemy that must be destroyed.

Also, you keep repeating numbers, general or specific, that are based on Hamas propaganda. We have no reason to trust them.

---

The numbers come straight from the secretary of defense.

In fact US intelligence says the numbers involved may be even higher.

Enough is enough.


Time for a ceasefire .


Or the next 2000 to 10,000 lives lost might be Israelis .

---

If there is a ceasefire, the next thousands killed will definitely be Israelis.

---

Based on what scenario ?

---

Hamas. Hezbollah and friends will recover and do what they live to do

---

So you really believe these 2 organizations have the immediate capability to kill 'thousands' of Israelis in the event of a ceasefire ?

With what....AK 47's ?

---

Why "immediate"? They will continue to murder innocent people as long as Iran keeps providing them tickets, guns, ammo, etc. This has been their M.O. since they were founded. If they kill thousands over a few days or a few years what difference does it make? The victims are still dead and the genocidal maniacs will still celebrate, along with their soulmates in the west.

No ceasefire until they are destroyed.

---

You are in for a major disappointment.

There will be a ceasefire within the next 45 days.

As Biden is feeling increasing heat from his core constituents.

Women, young and minority voters.

So Israel will be forced to play along. Not only by Biden, but by the economic cost of their extensive military mobilization.

Hamas will survive , although in a much weaker condition.

---

You are in for a big disappointment. There is very little chance of any ceasefire unless it comes as a result of total Israeli victory. Biden is becoming increasingly irrelevant ....

---

What does a total victory look like?

They have killed 30,000 Palestinians (half of them women and kids) taken 9,000 Hamas fighters as prisoners, killed 10,000 fighters.

Hamas never probably had more than 25,000 fighters at all in the first place.

IDF has now has destroyed about 70% of Gaza's buildings.

And they have total land, sea, and naval superiority.

---

We aren't even at serious numbers yet, especially given the type of conflict, battleground. and weapons used. The fact it's only 30,000 in 5 months is almost miraculous.

In Rwanda they were killing 50,000+ a week using small arms and machetes. That is what indiscriminate brutality looks like.

---

The numbers are kind of secondary to the strategy no?

30,000 or 60,000 dead….what's the long term plan?

Occupy the area forever? Rule over a people who don't want to be ruled?

historian said:

---

At Auschwitz during peak operation they could kill over 20,000 per day...

---

No to the get the thread off on a WWII tangent but how did the Germans dispose of 20,000 bodies a day?

Redbrickbear said:

---

historian said:

---

At Auschwitz during peak operation they could kill over 20,000 per day...

---

No to the get the thread off on a WWII tangent but how did the Germans dispose of 20,000 bodies a day?

---

This is a great question. The noted historian David Irving asked those questions and he is branded an anti semite but he has written dozens of books on WW2.

Redbrickbear said:

---

historian said:

---

At Auschwitz during peak operation they could kill over 20,000 per day...

---

No to the get the thread off on a WWII tangent but how did the Germans dispose of 20,000 bodies a day?

---

Ashes weigh approx 3.5% of body weight.

nein51 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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historian said:

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At Auschwitz during peak operation they could kill over 20,000 per day...

---

No to the get the thread off on a WWII tangent but how did the Germans dispose of 20,000 bodies a day?

---

Ashes weigh approx 3.5% of body weight.

---

Now long does it take to cremate a body? Does it take a long time? Does it take a lot of fuel?

Redbrickbear said:

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nein51 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

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historian said:

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At Auschwitz during peak operation they could kill over 20,000 per day...

---

No to the get the thread off on a WWII tangent but how did the Germans dispose of 20,000 bodies a day?

---

Ashes weigh approx 3.5% of body weight.

---

Now long does it take to cremate a body? Does it take a long time? Does it take a lot of fuel?

---

I googled that it says it would take 3-4 hours per body.

The crematoria were running 24-7. You redd as Lou should study some history.

muddybrazos said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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historian said:

---

At Auschwitz during peak operation they could kill over 20,000 per day...

---

No to the get the thread off on a WWII tangent but how did the Germans dispose of 20,000 bodies a day?

---

This is a great question. The noted historian David Irving asked those questions and he is branded an anti semite but he has written dozens of books on WW2.

---

David Irving is noted mostly for being a Holocaust denier & Nazi apologist. I would not rely upon him for anything historical.

muddybrazos said:

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Redbrickbear said:

---

nein51 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

historian said:

---

At Auschwitz during peak operation they could kill over 20,000 per day...

---

No to the get the thread off on a WWII tangent but how did the Germans dispose of 20,000 bodies a day?

---

Ashes weigh approx 3.5% of body weight.

---

Now long does it take to cremate a body? Does it take a long time? Does it take a lot of fuel?

---

I googled that it says it would take 3-4 hours per body.

---

Assuming 1 per space maybe.

Random aside: stop reading if you have a soft stomach.

My building used to be about 2 blocks from a crematorium. When they fired the ovens everyone knew it. Smells like burnt toast.

historian said:

---

The crematoria were running 24-7. You redd as Lou should study some history.

---

So 3-4 hours per body.

What 6 furnaces?

48 bodies a day?

Again, I'm just interested in logistic how did they get rid of 20,000 bodies a day?

Did they take them somewhere else?

Redbrickbear said:

---

historian said:

---

The crematoria were running 24-7. You redd as Lou should study some history.

---

So 3-4 hours per body.

What 6 furnaces?

48 bodies a day?

Again, I'm just interested in logistic how did they get rid of 20,000 bodies a day?

Did they take them somewhere else?

---

It wasn't particularly uncommon for 20% or more to die on the rail cars before even reaching the camps.

Aside from the well know camps there were around 40,000 sites Jews, Romani, Poles and others were held and killed.

27 million Russians died in WW2 as well. Unfathomable amount of dead people.

historian said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

historian said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

historian said:

---

My family would never be involved in genocidal activity or support a terrorist organization determined to create a modern Holocaust.

I will not be disappointed because I take the long view of things and I know God will win in the end. I read the Bible & believe in it.

It's not about revenge. It's about destroying an enemy that must be destroyed.

Also, you keep repeating numbers, general or specific, that are based on Hamas propaganda. We have no reason to trust them.

---

The numbers come straight from the secretary of defense.

In fact US intelligence says the numbers involved may be even higher.

Enough is enough.


Time for a ceasefire .


Or the next 2000 to 10,000 lives lost might be Israelis .

---

If there is a ceasefire, the next thousands killed will definitely be Israelis.

---

Based on what scenario ?

---

Hamas. Hezbollah and friends will recover and do what they live to do

---

So you really believe these 2 organizations have the immediate capability to kill 'thousands' of Israelis in the event of a ceasefire ?

With what....AK 47's ?

---

Why "immediate"? They will continue to murder innocent people as long as Iran keeps providing them tickets, guns, ammo, etc. This has been their M.O. since they were founded. If they kill thousands over a few days or a few years what difference does it make? The victims are still dead and the genocidal maniacs will still celebrate, along with their soulmates in the west.

No ceasefire until they are destroyed.

---

You are in for a major disappointment.

There will be a ceasefire within the next 45 days.

As Biden is feeling increasing heat from his core constituents.

Women, young and minority voters.

So Israel will be forced to play along. Not only by Biden, but by the economic cost of their extensive military mobilization.

Hamas will survive , although in a much weaker condition.

---

You are in for a big disappointment. There is very little chance of any ceasefire unless it comes as a result of total Israeli victory. Biden is becoming increasingly irrelevant in this discussion and just about every other. When Biden tried to pressure Netanyahu to stop the war, Netanyahu told him to pound sand and rightfully so.

No one really knows what is going to happen. You can proclaim that something is going to happen in a certain time frame but you don't know either.

The bigger truth is that Hamas must be destroyed utterly.

---

Biden is irrelevant but US financial and military aid is not.

Israel is fast approaching the time when a cease fire is in their best interests as well.

Your insistence on Hamas total destruction is absurd.

As long as there are millions of poor , hate filled Muslims nearby…..Israel will always be attacked .

Hamas is not the real threat .

Iran has a first rate army. Not just a bunch of teenagers running around with AK 47's.

If Iran decides to play….Israel will be in a real death struggle .

KaiBear said:

---

historian said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

historian said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

sombear said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

historian said:

---

My family would never be involved in genocidal activity or support a terrorist organization determined to create a modern Holocaust.

I will not be disappointed because I take the long view of things and I know God will win in the end. I read the Bible & believe in it.

It's not about revenge. It's about destroying an enemy that must be destroyed.

Also, you keep repeating numbers, general or specific, that are based on Hamas propaganda. We have no reason to trust them.

---

The numbers come straight from the secretary of defense.

In fact US intelligence says the numbers involved may be even higher.

Enough is enough.


Time for a ceasefire .


Or the next 2000 to 10,000 lives lost might be Israelis .

---

If there is a ceasefire, the next thousands killed will definitely be Israelis.

---

Based on what scenario ?

---

Hamas. Hezbollah and friends will recover and do what they live to do

---

So you really believe these 2 organizations have the immediate capability to kill 'thousands' of Israelis in the event of a ceasefire ?

With what....AK 47's ?

---

Why "immediate"? They will continue to murder innocent people as long as Iran keeps providing them tickets, guns, ammo, etc. This has been their M.O. since they were founded. If they kill thousands over a few days or a few years what difference does it make? The victims are still dead and the genocidal maniacs will still celebrate, along with their soulmates in the west.

No ceasefire until they are destroyed.

---

You are in for a major disappointment.

There will be a ceasefire within the next 45 days.

As Biden is feeling increasing heat from his core constituents.

Women, young and minority voters.

So Israel will be forced to play along. Not only by Biden, but by the economic cost of their extensive military mobilization.

Hamas will survive , although in a much weaker condition.

---

You are in for a big disappointment. There is very little chance of any ceasefire unless it comes as a result of total Israeli victory. Biden is becoming increasingly irrelevant in this discussion and just about every other. When Biden tried to pressure Netanyahu to stop the war, Netanyahu told him to pound sand and rightfully so.

No one really knows what is going to happen. You can proclaim that something is going to happen in a certain time frame but you don't know either.

The bigger truth is that Hamas must be destroyed utterly.

---

Biden is irrelevant but US financial and military aid is not.

Israel is fast approaching the time when a cease fire is in their best interests as well.

Your insistence on Hamas total destruction is absurd.

As long as there are millions of poor , hate filled Muslims nearby…..Israel will always be attacked .

Hamas is not the real threat .

Iran has a first rate army. Not just a bunch of teenagers running around with AK 47's.

If Iran decides to play….Israel will be in a real death struggle .

---

Hamas isn't a "bunch of teenagers with AK-47s". They have modern tandem RPGs, ATGMs, rockets, drones, and other kit from Iran. Hezbollah is even more equipped.

historian said:

---

muddybrazos said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

historian said:

---

At Auschwitz during peak operation they could kill over 20,000 per day...

---

No to the get the thread off on a WWII tangent but how did the Germans dispose of 20,000 bodies a day?

---

This is a great question. The noted historian David Irving asked those questions and he is branded an anti semite but he has written dozens of books on WW2.

---

David Irving is noted mostly for being a Holocaust denier & Nazi apologist. I would not rely upon him for anything historical.

---

Bingo.

Bear8084 said:

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historian said:

---

muddybrazos said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

historian said:

---

At Auschwitz during peak operation they could kill over 20,000 per day...

---

No to the get the thread off on a WWII tangent but how did the Germans dispose of 20,000 bodies a day?

---

This is a great question. The noted historian David Irving asked those questions and he is branded an anti semite but he has written dozens of books on WW2.

---

David Irving is noted mostly for being a Holocaust denier & Nazi apologist. I would not rely upon him for anything historical.

---

Bingo.

---

He was the worlds leading historian on WW2 until he committed some possible thought crimes and then the ADL/SPLC ruined him. Kinda exaclty what we see going oin today with the books about White Rage and how evil the patriotic white Christian is the biggest threat to "democracy".

Those "thought crimes" were denying the Holocaust and acting pro-Nazi.

historian said:

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Those "thought crimes" were denying the Holocaust and acting pro-Nazi.

---

But why is that a crime and questioning any other event in history is not? What if he denied the Holodomor and acted pro commie? Oh ya the media wouldnt care bc they;re all pro commie.

muddybrazos said:

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Bear8084 said:

---

historian said:

---

muddybrazos said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

historian said:

---

At Auschwitz during peak operation they could kill over 20,000 per day...

---

No to the get the thread off on a WWII tangent but how did the Germans dispose of 20,000 bodies a day?

---

This is a great question. The noted historian David Irving asked those questions and he is branded an anti semite but he has written dozens of books on WW2.

---

David Irving is noted mostly for being a Holocaust denier & Nazi apologist. I would not rely upon him for anything historical.

---

Bingo.

---

He was the worlds leading historian on WW2 until he committed some possible thought crimes and then the ADL/SPLC ruined him. Kinda exaclty what we see going oin today with the books about White Rage and how evil the patriotic white Christian is the biggest threat to "democracy".

---

He was not even close to the world's leading WW2 historian. It's been a while since I researched him, but pretty sure he had 2-3 books on fairly obscure issues before he started openly defending Hitler and denying the holocaust.

Because it's stupid, antisemitic and unprofessional. It would be like denying 9/11 and every terrorist attack since happened. You cannot compare it to one event because the Holocaust was systematic, well organized, and took place in several places over a few years.

It's not history. It's Nazi propaganda.

nein51 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

historian said:

---

The crematoria were running 24-7. You redd as Lou should study some history.

---

So 3-4 hours per body.

What 6 furnaces?

48 bodies a day?

Again, I'm just interested in logistic how did they get rid of 20,000 bodies a day?

Did they take them somewhere else?

---

It wasn't particularly uncommon for 20% or more to die on the rail cars before even reaching the camps.

Aside from the well know camps there were around 40,000 sites Jews, Romani, Poles and others were held and killed.

27 million Russians died in WW2 as well. Unfathomable amount of dead people.

---

the false dilemma of 45 minutes per corpse is highly amusing, but the question of logistics is well known.

The Nazis started the incineration program after they realized the opportunity cost of using millions of rounds of ammunition to execute Jews rather than to kill Russians, as well as the unnecessary overhead of using fuel, heavy equipment, and solders to dig mass graves rather than go support the fight on the Eastern Front.

Also, they didn't burn one body at a time. The ovens were large & each camp had more than one.

Think of what you know about Germany engineering: automobiles, optics, etc. Now apply that level of efficiency to mass murder. They planned it out at the Wansee Conference in early 1942 with high level figures from govt, industry, etc. it's scary how methodical & organized they were when contemplating genocide. Evil.

This is the mentality of Hamas without being quite as methodical or clever. Well, I guess some people might consider terrorists parasailing to kill people at a music festival to be clever.

Bear8084 said:

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KaiBear said:

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historian said:

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KaiBear said:

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historian said:

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KaiBear said:

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sombear said:

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KaiBear said:

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sombear said:

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KaiBear said:

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historian said:

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My family would never be involved in genocidal activity or support a terrorist organization determined to create a modern Holocaust.

I will not be disappointed because I take the long view of things and I know God will win in the end. I read the Bible & believe in it.

It's not about revenge. It's about destroying an enemy that must be destroyed.

Also, you keep repeating numbers, general or specific, that are based on Hamas propaganda. We have no reason to trust them.

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The numbers come straight from the secretary of defense.

In fact US intelligence says the numbers involved may be even higher.

Enough is enough.


Time for a ceasefire .


Or the next 2000 to 10,000 lives lost might be Israelis .

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If there is a ceasefire, the next thousands killed will definitely be Israelis.

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Based on what scenario ?

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Hamas. Hezbollah and friends will recover and do what they live to do

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So you really believe these 2 organizations have the immediate capability to kill 'thousands' of Israelis in the event of a ceasefire ?

With what....AK 47's ?

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Why "immediate"? They will continue to murder innocent people as long as Iran keeps providing them tickets, guns, ammo, etc. This has been their M.O. since they were founded. If they kill thousands over a few days or a few years what difference does it make? The victims are still dead and the genocidal maniacs will still celebrate, along with their soulmates in the west.

No ceasefire until they are destroyed.

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You are in for a major disappointment.

There will be a ceasefire within the next 45 days.

As Biden is feeling increasing heat from his core constituents.

Women, young and minority voters.

So Israel will be forced to play along. Not only by Biden, but by the economic cost of their extensive military mobilization.

Hamas will survive , although in a much weaker condition.

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You are in for a big disappointment. There is very little chance of any ceasefire unless it comes as a result of total Israeli victory. Biden is becoming increasingly irrelevant in this discussion and just about every other. When Biden tried to pressure Netanyahu to stop the war, Netanyahu told him to pound sand and rightfully so.

No one really knows what is going to happen. You can proclaim that something is going to happen in a certain time frame but you don't know either.

The bigger truth is that Hamas must be destroyed utterly.

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Biden is irrelevant but US financial and military aid is not.

Israel is fast approaching the time when a cease fire is in their best interests as well.

Your insistence on Hamas total destruction is absurd.

As long as there are millions of poor , hate filled Muslims nearby…..Israel will always be attacked .

Hamas is not the real threat .

Iran has a first rate army. Not just a bunch of teenagers running around with AK 47's.

If Iran decides to play….Israel will be in a real death struggle .

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Hamas isn't a "bunch of teenagers with AK-47s". They have modern tandem RPGs, ATGMs, rockets, drones, and other kit from Iran. Hezbollah is even more equipped.

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Compared to Iran or Turkey's military might ….Hamas is the minor leagues .

If Iran or Turkey decide to end the Gaza slaughter ; Israel is going to find out what a real war is all about .


A cease fire now is best for everyone.

Except the internet Rambo's of course.

Hamas must be destroyed

historian said:

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Hamas must be destroyed

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Ain't going to happen .

Got millions of potential recruits/ replacements coming up every generation

Might come up with a new name….but the attitude will be the same .

Maybe. But Israel will be stronger and their enemy weaker. They also won't necessarily be on their border.