Donald Trump on Ukraine:

“Ukrainian survival and strength (…) is also important to us!”

Looks like a major military aid package for Ukraine is about to be passed

🇺🇸 🇺🇦 pic.twitter.com/2HK9byh4sx

— Visegrád 24 (@visegrad24) April 20, 2024

The_barBEARian said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

The House and Senate will pass this to stand for democracy.

The lunatic fringe of both parties would betray our key allies and should be relegated to history as autocratic or theocratic apologists. pic.twitter.com/ffjiwnJ8nM

— Senator John Fetterman (@SenFettermanPA) April 20, 2024

---

Autocratic, Theocratic apologist?

Israel is a Autocratic Theocracy poorly disguised as a Democratic Republic.

In Israel a muslim man can not marry a jewish woman.

It is against the law.

---

From a wedding planner in Israel:

"Israeli marriages are a religious matter whether you are Jewish, Muslim, Christian, or Druze; the state only recognizes marriages performed by a religious body if you have one of these religio-national groups on your Israeli I.D. card or wish to be married by one of these authorities if you are coming from abroad. Couples of mixed religious background and tourists often get married abroad in order to obtain a marriage license and then hold a ceremony in Israel to solidify the union in the way they want without meeting all of the requirements for religious marriage in Israel."

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

---

Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

---

That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

---

They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

---

Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

---

I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

---

I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

---

If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

---

Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

---

Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

EatMoreSalmon said:

---

The_barBEARian said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

The House and Senate will pass this to stand for democracy.

The lunatic fringe of both parties would betray our key allies and should be relegated to history as autocratic or theocratic apologists. pic.twitter.com/ffjiwnJ8nM

— Senator John Fetterman (@SenFettermanPA) April 20, 2024

---

Autocratic, Theocratic apologist?

Israel is a Autocratic Theocracy poorly disguised as a Democratic Republic.

In Israel a muslim man can not marry a jewish woman.

It is against the law.

---

From a wedding planner in Israel:

"Israeli marriages are a religious matter whether you are Jewish, Muslim, Christian, or Druze; the state only recognizes marriages performed by a religious body if you have one of these religio-national groups on your Israeli I.D. card or wish to be married by one of these authorities if you are coming from abroad. Couples of mixed religious background and tourists often get married abroad in order to obtain a marriage license and then hold a ceremony in Israel to solidify the union in the way they want without meeting all of the requirements for religious marriage in Israel."

---

They even DNA test you to make sure you are racially Jewish before you can immigrate….

The_barBEARian said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

The House and Senate will pass this to stand for democracy.

The lunatic fringe of both parties would betray our key allies and should be relegated to history as autocratic or theocratic apologists. pic.twitter.com/ffjiwnJ8nM

— Senator John Fetterman (@SenFettermanPA) April 20, 2024

---

Autocratic, Theocratic apologist?

Israel is a Autocratic Theocracy poorly disguised as a Democratic Republic.

In Israel a muslim man can not marry a jewish woman.

It is against the law.

---

Name a better allie in that part of the world?

The_barBEARian said:

---

J.R. said:

---

I applaud the speaker for doing the right thing and risking his gig. About time the R's have someone with balls and principles. Screw the hard right crazies, like some on this board!

---

Hard right crazies = People with IQs above room temperature.

This is precisely why we need a national divorce.

Guys like you are dragging down the rest of us into the 3rd world, totalitarian abyss when we are just trying to preserve the quality of life and freedoms we got to experience for our children and grandchildren.

---

ok, MR. $100K in taxes. Can you please explain what you mean about "Guys like me" are dragging us into 3rd world, totalitarian abyss". I'm very, very curious just what you are implying . Please enlighten guys like me. Sounds a little disingenuous for someone who puts their tax bill on a message board. Let's hear it, big guy.

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

---

Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

---

That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

---

They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

---

Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

---

I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

---

I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

---

If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

---

Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

---

Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

---

Let's see where this goes. You guys are like kids, if it doesn't happen immediately "off with their heads".

The bigger question is will Trump allow it??? Or will he and the whack-job Greene force a poison pill so nothing gets done. Then, hang Johnson out, which would be a typical Trump move. To him, you MAGA are there for one reason - to fall on your sword at his order. Afterall, it is all about Donald.

Actually, Johnson IS holding a vote on Border Security today. You may not like it or the Senate might not pass it without Foreign Aid, but he is holding the Vote. Will Donald help protect the border? Or, put his own interest first? MAGA???

J.R. said:

---

The_barBEARian said:

---

J.R. said:

---

I applaud the speaker for doing the right thing and risking his gig. About time the R's have someone with balls and principles. Screw the hard right crazies, like some on this board!

---

Hard right crazies = People with IQs above room temperature.

This is precisely why we need a national divorce.

Guys like you are dragging down the rest of us into the 3rd world, totalitarian abyss when we are just trying to preserve the quality of life and freedoms we got to experience for our children and grandchildren.

---

ok, MR. $100K in taxes. Can you please explain what you mean about "Guys like me" are dragging us into 35rd world, totalitarian abyss". I'm very, very curious just what you are implying . Please enlighten guys like me. Sounds a little disingenuous for someone who puts their tax bill on a message board. Let's hear it, big guy.

---

100k in taxes isnt that big of a tax bill any more..

4th and Inches said:

---

J.R. said:

---

The_barBEARian said:

---

J.R. said:

---

I applaud the speaker for doing the right thing and risking his gig. About time the R's have someone with balls and principles. Screw the hard right crazies, like some on this board!

---

Hard right crazies = People with IQs above room temperature.

This is precisely why we need a national divorce.

Guys like you are dragging down the rest of us into the 3rd world, totalitarian abyss when we are just trying to preserve the quality of life and freedoms we got to experience for our children and grandchildren.

---

ok, MR. $100K in taxes. Can you please explain what you mean about "Guys like me" are dragging us into 35rd world, totalitarian abyss". I'm very, very curious just what you are implying . Please enlighten guys like me. Sounds a little disingenuous for someone who puts their tax bill on a message board. Let's hear it, big guy.

---

100k in taxes isnt that big of a tax bill any more..

---

really? huh. Seems like it to me. So, you had a $100K tax bill?

Redbrickbear said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

The Native Americans called and said they built this country way before you arrived

---

They did?

There was a United States before 1776? Silliness. Great civilizations were being built way before the West European nations arrived.

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

---

Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

---

That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

---

They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

---

Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

---

I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

---

I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

---

If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

---

Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

---

Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

---

Let's see where this goes. You guys are like kids, if it doesn't happen immediately "off with their heads".

---

Please the Senate Democratic leadership has said they have no interest in passing a border bill.

They will pass a Ukraine proxy war bill

This is not even a controversial take…no one expects the Senate Dems to do anything with a border bill but place it in a committee to die

Waco1947 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

The Native Americans called and said they built this country way before you arrived

---

They did?

There was a United States before 1776? Silliness. Great civilizations were being built way before the West European nations arrived.

---

---

So you are admitting the Indians did NOT build this country.

There were just civilizations in the western hemisphere.

Fair enough we can agree on that!

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

---

Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

---

That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

---

They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

---

Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

---

I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

---

I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

---

If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

---

Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

---

Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

---

Let's see where this goes. You guys are like kids, if it doesn't happen immediately "off with their heads".

The bigger question is will Trump allow it??? Or will he and the whack-job Greene force a poison pill so nothing gets done. Then, hang Johnson out, which would be a typical Trump move. To him, you MAGA are there for one reason - to fall on your sword at his order. Afterall, it is all about Donald.

Actually, Johnson IS holding a vote on Border Security today. You may not like it or the Senate might not pass it without Foreign Aid, but he is holding the Vote. Will Donald help protect the border? Or, put his own interest first? MAGA???

---

MAGA is really rolling the dice here. There is of course a chance they keep blocking border bills to allow Trump to gain votes over the border mess in November....but then Trump loses the election and we end up with no border deal at all when a bipartisan bill could have been had a month ago.

J.R. said:

---

4th and Inches said:

---

J.R. said:

---

The_barBEARian said:

---

J.R. said:

---

I applaud the speaker for doing the right thing and risking his gig. About time the R's have someone with balls and principles. Screw the hard right crazies, like some on this board!

---

Hard right crazies = People with IQs above room temperature.

This is precisely why we need a national divorce.

Guys like you are dragging down the rest of us into the 3rd world, totalitarian abyss when we are just trying to preserve the quality of life and freedoms we got to experience for our children and grandchildren.

---

ok, MR. $100K in taxes. Can you please explain what you mean about "Guys like me" are dragging us into 35rd world, totalitarian abyss". I'm very, very curious just what you are implying . Please enlighten guys like me. Sounds a little disingenuous for someone who puts their tax bill on a message board. Let's hear it, big guy.

---

100k in taxes isnt that big of a tax bill any more..

---

really? huh. Seems like it to me. So, you had a $100K tax bill?

---

yes, you didnt?

boognish_bear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

---

Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

---

That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

---

They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

---

Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

---

I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

---

I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

---

If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

---

Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

---

Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

---

Let's see where this goes. You guys are like kids, if it doesn't happen immediately "off with their heads".

The bigger question is will Trump allow it??? Or will he and the whack-job Greene force a poison pill so nothing gets done. Then, hang Johnson out, which would be a typical Trump move. To him, you MAGA are there for one reason - to fall on your sword at his order. Afterall, it is all about Donald.

Actually, Johnson IS holding a vote on Border Security today. You may not like it or the Senate might not pass it without Foreign Aid, but he is holding the Vote. Will Donald help protect the border? Or, put his own interest first? MAGA???

---

MAGA is really rolling the dice here. There is of course a chance they keep blocking border bills to allow Trump to gain votes over the border mess in November....but then Trump loses the election and we end up with no border deal at all when a bipartisan bill could have been had a month ago.

---

You are going to see more and more Dem advertising about that. Johnson is doing the right thing and if the Dems pull out he is defending Trump's flank. Those idiot MAGA Rep's don't get that. They think this thing is over when it has not even started yet.

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

---

Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

---

That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

---

They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

---

Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

---

I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

---

I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

---

If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

---

Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

---

Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

---

Let's see where this goes. You guys are like kids, if it doesn't happen immediately "off with their heads".

---

Please the Senate Democratic leadership has said they have no interest in passing a border bill.

They will pass a Ukraine proxy war bill

This is not even a controversial take…no one expects the Senate Dems to do anything with a border bill but place it in a committee to die

---

Let's face it, we disagree on Americas Role in the World. Normally, not a big deal.

You are more isolationist (as a term not that you said we should be by ourselves) than I am. Maybe the word is transactional? That there needs to be a direct benefit? Ukraine, Afghanistan and Iraq are more secondary benefits. I see Taiwan, Korea, NATO and Japan as direct benefits and secondary is worth it.

No big deal, different views is as old as Politics. What has changed seems to be that only one view is allowed or deemed to have any value. If you don't agree, you are not a Conservative, kicked out of the Party and called a Neo-Con, RINO idiot to boot. Trump seems to have brought that to a new level.

I see value in your position and can accept that. You and some others can't seem to recognize an other view.

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

---

Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

---

That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

---

They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

---

Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

---

I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

---

I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

---

If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

---

Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

---

Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

---

Let's see where this goes. You guys are like kids, if it doesn't happen immediately "off with their heads".

---

Please the Senate Democratic leadership has said they have no interest in passing a border bill.

They will pass a Ukraine proxy war bill

This is not even a controversial take…no one expects the Senate Dems to do anything with a border bill but place it in a committee to die

---

Let's face it, we disagree on Americas Role in the World. Normally, not a big deal.

You are more isolationist (as a term not that you said we should be by ourselves) than I am. Maybe the word is transactional? That there needs to be a direct benefit? Ukraine, Afghanistan and Iraq are more secondary benefits. I see Taiwan, Korea, NATO and Japan as direct benefits and secondary is worth it.

No big deal, different views is as old as Politics. What has changed seems to be that only one view is allowed or deemed to have any value. If you don't agree, you are not a Conservative, kicked out of the Party and called a Neo-Con, RINO idiot to boot. Trump seems to have brought that to a new level.

I see value in your position and can accept that. You and some others can't seem to recognize an other view.

---

That is why I have to keep so many people on ignore on the R&P boards. I've got no issue with people having differing world views/political views. Even when I don't agree I still like to listen to an opposing view and try to understand that point of view and sometimes even gain a new insight.

But so many people make it personal so quickly and basically respond with "you are a moronic dumb@ss" because you think this or that.....rather than just saying...."I don't agree with that and here's why."

Our politicians devolve in to personal attacks more and more as well. We can do better.

boognish_bear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

---

Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

---

That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

---

They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

---

Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

---

I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

---

I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

---

If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

---

Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

---

Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

---

Let's see where this goes. You guys are like kids, if it doesn't happen immediately "off with their heads".

---

Please the Senate Democratic leadership has said they have no interest in passing a border bill.

They will pass a Ukraine proxy war bill

This is not even a controversial take…no one expects the Senate Dems to do anything with a border bill but place it in a committee to die

---

Let's face it, we disagree on Americas Role in the World. Normally, not a big deal.

You are more isolationist (as a term not that you said we should be by ourselves) than I am. Maybe the word is transactional? That there needs to be a direct benefit? Ukraine, Afghanistan and Iraq are more secondary benefits. I see Taiwan, Korea, NATO and Japan as direct benefits and secondary is worth it.

No big deal, different views is as old as Politics. What has changed seems to be that only one view is allowed or deemed to have any value. If you don't agree, you are not a Conservative, kicked out of the Party and called a Neo-Con, RINO idiot to boot. Trump seems to have brought that to a new level.

I see value in your position and can accept that. You and some others can't seem to recognize an other view.

---

That is why I have to keep so many people on ignore on the R&P boards. I've got no issue with people having differing world views/political views. Even when I don't agree I still like to listen to an opposing view and try to understand that point of view and sometimes even gain a new insight.

But so many people make it personal so quickly and basically respond with "you are a moronic dumb@ss" because you think this or that.....rather than just saying...."I don't agree with that and here's why."

Our politicians devolve in to personal attacks more and more as well. We can do better.

---

We agree there. I actually think Johnson is doing a good job and it is refreshing to have someone that is doing what they think is right over what is personally best for him. I would vote for Johnson over Trump in a heartbeat.

By the way, when in a heated conversation I recognize that people say things. No problem, me and Whiterock have devolved into that in the past. It doesn't mean I think he is an ******* or has no value. State your position, argue, resolve, move on...

boognish_bear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

---

Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

---

That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

---

They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

---

Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

---

I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

---

I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

---

If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

---

Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

---

Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

---

Let's see where this goes. You guys are like kids, if it doesn't happen immediately "off with their heads".

The bigger question is will Trump allow it??? Or will he and the whack-job Greene force a poison pill so nothing gets done. Then, hang Johnson out, which would be a typical Trump move. To him, you MAGA are there for one reason - to fall on your sword at his order. Afterall, it is all about Donald.

Actually, Johnson IS holding a vote on Border Security today. You may not like it or the Senate might not pass it without Foreign Aid, but he is holding the Vote. Will Donald help protect the border? Or, put his own interest first? MAGA???

---

MAGA is really rolling the dice here. There is of course a chance they keep blocking border bills to allow Trump to gain votes over the border mess in November....but then Trump loses the election and we end up with no border deal at all when a bipartisan bill could have been had a month ago.

---

Dems don't want any border bills either

Not real border bills anyway…ones that would actually stop mass 3rd world immigration…the last one they floated was basically unlimited immigration as long as it did not hit more than 4,000 a day…children not even counted.

[new emergency authority could be activated only if border "encounters" reach a daily average of 4,000 over a period of seven days and would become only be mandatory once border encounters reach over 5,000 over a period of seven days or 8,500 over a single calendar day. However, there are several other rules governing the use of the emergency authority, rendering it much less straightforward than the simple mathematics of crossings… (for example, the so-called "discretionary" authority at the 4,000/day level would in fact not be mandatory…In addition, the bill defines "encounters" to exclude apprehensions of unaccompanied migrant children.]

The melodramatic pontificating continues with Rep. Gerry Connolly (D-VA). "Some say, well, we have to deal with our border first," bellows Connolly. "The Ukrainian Russian border is OUR border!"

Who knew?!? It's basically like the border between Virginia and Maryland pic.twitter.com/51rQcpdqOd

— Michael Tracey (@mtracey) April 20, 2024

FLBear5630 said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

---

Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

---

That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

---

They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

---

Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

---

I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

---

I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

---

If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

---

Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

---

Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

---

Let's see where this goes. You guys are like kids, if it doesn't happen immediately "off with their heads".

---

Please the Senate Democratic leadership has said they have no interest in passing a border bill.

They will pass a Ukraine proxy war bill

This is not even a controversial take…no one expects the Senate Dems to do anything with a border bill but place it in a committee to die

---

Let's face it, we disagree on Americas Role in the World. Normally, not a big deal.

You are more isolationist (as a term not that you said we should be by ourselves) than I am. Maybe the word is transactional? That there needs to be a direct benefit? Ukraine, Afghanistan and Iraq are more secondary benefits. I see Taiwan, Korea, NATO and Japan as direct benefits and secondary is worth it.

No big deal, different views is as old as Politics. What has changed seems to be that only one view is allowed or deemed to have any value. If you don't agree, you are not a Conservative, kicked out of the Party and called a Neo-Con, RINO idiot to boot. Trump seems to have brought that to a new level.

I see value in your position and can accept that. You and some others can't seem to recognize an other view.

---

That is why I have to keep so many people on ignore on the R&P boards. I've got no issue with people having differing world views/political views. Even when I don't agree I still like to listen to an opposing view and try to understand that point of view and sometimes even gain a new insight.

But so many people make it personal so quickly and basically respond with "you are a moronic dumb@ss" because you think this or that.....rather than just saying...."I don't agree with that and here's why."

Our politicians devolve in to personal attacks more and more as well. We can do better.

---

We agree there. I actually think Johnson is doing a good job and it is refreshing to have someone that is doing what they think is right over what is personally best for him....

---

Oh I think he is doing what is best for him.

Or at least his donors

He will he get some fat checks from the Defense industry.

And there is not much danger to him personally.

America 1st Republicans don't have the votes to remove him and more establishment Republicans and Democrats would join together to protect him.

He is not doing anything courageous

Ukrainian flags fly in the chamber of the UNITED STATES House of Representatives as they vote to send more of your hard-earned money to a corrupt foreign regime. And just like that they shout “UKRAINE! UKRAINE!”while happily working to secure Ukraine’s borders, not ours. pic.twitter.com/ZXZo1kliNl

— Rand Paul (@RandPaul) April 20, 2024

Speaker Johnson: “I don’t walk around this building being worried about a motion to vacate. I have to do my job. We did. I've done here what I believe to be the right thing”pic.twitter.com/L38ytTCMpR

— Republicans against Trump (@RpsAgainstTrump) April 20, 2024

Dear Normal Republicans,

We could have had today’s package along with a tough border bill. But Trump blew that up. So we ended up with today’s package and nothing on the border. That’s due to Trump. Vote Republican for Congress if you choose. But don’t vote for Trump.

Bill K

— Bill Kristol (@BillKristol) April 20, 2024

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

---

Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

---

That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

---

They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

---

Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

---

I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

---

I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

---

If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

---

Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

---

Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

---

Let's see where this goes. You guys are like kids, if it doesn't happen immediately "off with their heads".

---

Please the Senate Democratic leadership has said they have no interest in passing a border bill.

They will pass a Ukraine proxy war bill

This is not even a controversial take…no one expects the Senate Dems to do anything with a border bill but place it in a committee to die

---

Let's face it, we disagree on Americas Role in the World. Normally, not a big deal.

You are more isolationist (as a term not that you said we should be by ourselves) than I am. Maybe the word is transactional? That there needs to be a direct benefit? Ukraine, Afghanistan and Iraq are more secondary benefits. I see Taiwan, Korea, NATO and Japan as direct benefits and secondary is worth it.

No big deal, different views is as old as Politics. What has changed seems to be that only one view is allowed or deemed to have any value. If you don't agree, you are not a Conservative, kicked out of the Party and called a Neo-Con, RINO idiot to boot. Trump seems to have brought that to a new level.

I see value in your position and can accept that. You and some others can't seem to recognize an other view.

---

That is why I have to keep so many people on ignore on the R&P boards. I've got no issue with people having differing world views/political views. Even when I don't agree I still like to listen to an opposing view and try to understand that point of view and sometimes even gain a new insight.

But so many people make it personal so quickly and basically respond with "you are a moronic dumb@ss" because you think this or that.....rather than just saying...."I don't agree with that and here's why."

Our politicians devolve in to personal attacks more and more as well. We can do better.

---

We agree there. I actually think Johnson is doing a good job and it is refreshing to have someone that is doing what they think is right over what is personally best for him....

---

Oh I think he is doing what is best for him.

Or at least his donors

He will he get some fat checks from the Defense industry.

And there is not much danger to him personally.

America 1st Republicans don't have the votes to remove him and more establishment Republicans and Democrats would join together to protect him.

He is not doing anything courageous

---

He is taking some heat and may end up having to rely on Dems. That is not risk free. He also risks the wrath of Trump, which alot of GOP seems to think is a real thing. So, either it is real and he is doing what he thinks is right or it isn't and Trump is really toothless.

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

boognish_bear said:

---

House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

---

Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

---

That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

---

They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

---

Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

---

I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

---

I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

---

If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

---

Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

---

Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

---

Let's see where this goes. You guys are like kids, if it doesn't happen immediately "off with their heads".

---

Please the Senate Democratic leadership has said they have no interest in passing a border bill.

They will pass a Ukraine proxy war bill

This is not even a controversial take…no one expects the Senate Dems to do anything with a border bill but place it in a committee to die

---

Let's face it, we disagree on Americas Role in the World. Normally, not a big deal.

You are more isolationist (as a term not that you said we should be by ourselves) than I am. Maybe the word is transactional? That there needs to be a direct benefit? Ukraine, Afghanistan and Iraq are more secondary benefits. I see Taiwan, Korea, NATO and Japan as direct benefits and secondary is worth it.

No big deal, different views is as old as Politics. What has changed seems to be that only one view is allowed or deemed to have any value. If you don't agree, you are not a Conservative, kicked out of the Party and called a Neo-Con, RINO idiot to boot. Trump seems to have brought that to a new level.

I see value in your position and can accept that. You and some others can't seem to recognize an other view.

---

That is why I have to keep so many people on ignore on the R&P boards. I've got no issue with people having differing world views/political views. Even when I don't agree I still like to listen to an opposing view and try to understand that point of view and sometimes even gain a new insight.

But so many people make it personal so quickly and basically respond with "you are a moronic dumb@ss" because you think this or that.....rather than just saying...."I don't agree with that and here's why."

Our politicians devolve in to personal attacks more and more as well. We can do better.

---

We agree there. I actually think Johnson is doing a good job and it is refreshing to have someone that is doing what they think is right over what is personally best for him....

---

Oh I think he is doing what is best for him.

Or at least his donors

He will he get some fat checks from the Defense industry.

And there is not much danger to him personally.

America 1st Republicans don't have the votes to remove him and more establishment Republicans and Democrats would join together to protect him.

He is not doing anything courageous

---

He is taking some heat and may end up having to rely on Dems. That is not risk free. He also risks the wrath of Trump, which alot of GOP seems to think is a real thing. So, either it is real and he is doing what he thinks is right or it isn't and Trump is really toothless.

---

Was Trump not for the ukriane proxy war bill?

And he got more Republican votes and Republican opposition votes.

If you want to say Johnson believes in this war then fine…but let's not pretend it was some courageous stand

He is in no danger and the entire DC swamp and the media was supporting him in this…

More of Speaker Johnson's work paying off…

It’s over (for now). A majority of senators caved to the fearmongering and bush league tactics of the administration and surveillance hawks in Congress, and they sold out Americans’ civil liberties. Section 702 has been reauthorized, not just without any meaningful reforms… 1/10

— Elizabeth Goitein (@LizaGoitein) April 20, 2024

The provision effectively grants the NSA access to the communications equipment of almost any U.S. business, plus huge numbers of organizations and individuals. It’s a gift to any president who may wish to spy on political enemies, journalists, ideological opponents, etc. 3/10

— Elizabeth Goitein (@LizaGoitein) April 20, 2024

Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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boognish_bear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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Mitch Blood Green said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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boognish_bear said:

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House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

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Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

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That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

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They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

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Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

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I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

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I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

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If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

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Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

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Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

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Let's see where this goes. You guys are like kids, if it doesn't happen immediately "off with their heads".

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Please the Senate Democratic leadership has said they have no interest in passing a border bill.

They will pass a Ukraine proxy war bill

This is not even a controversial take…no one expects the Senate Dems to do anything with a border bill but place it in a committee to die

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Let's face it, we disagree on Americas Role in the World. Normally, not a big deal.

You are more isolationist (as a term not that you said we should be by ourselves) than I am. Maybe the word is transactional? That there needs to be a direct benefit? Ukraine, Afghanistan and Iraq are more secondary benefits. I see Taiwan, Korea, NATO and Japan as direct benefits and secondary is worth it.

No big deal, different views is as old as Politics. What has changed seems to be that only one view is allowed or deemed to have any value. If you don't agree, you are not a Conservative, kicked out of the Party and called a Neo-Con, RINO idiot to boot. Trump seems to have brought that to a new level.

I see value in your position and can accept that. You and some others can't seem to recognize an other view.

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That is why I have to keep so many people on ignore on the R&P boards. I've got no issue with people having differing world views/political views. Even when I don't agree I still like to listen to an opposing view and try to understand that point of view and sometimes even gain a new insight.

But so many people make it personal so quickly and basically respond with "you are a moronic dumb@ss" because you think this or that.....rather than just saying...."I don't agree with that and here's why."

Our politicians devolve in to personal attacks more and more as well. We can do better.

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We agree there. I actually think Johnson is doing a good job and it is refreshing to have someone that is doing what they think is right over what is personally best for him....

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Oh I think he is doing what is best for him.

Or at least his donors

He will he get some fat checks from the Defense industry.

And there is not much danger to him personally.

America 1st Republicans don't have the votes to remove him and more establishment Republicans and Democrats would join together to protect him.

He is not doing anything courageous

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He is taking some heat and may end up having to rely on Dems. That is not risk free. He also risks the wrath of Trump, which alot of GOP seems to think is a real thing. So, either it is real and he is doing what he thinks is right or it isn't and Trump is really toothless.

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Was Trump not for the ukriane proxy war bill?

And he got more Republican votes and Republican opposition votes.

If you want to say Johnson believes in this war then fine…but let's not pretend it was some courageous stand

He is in no danger and the entire DC swamp and the media was supporting him in this…

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I get it. I understand your view of some Uni-Party. I don't agree, seen too much in DC to believe that garbage.

FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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boognish_bear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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Mitch Blood Green said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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boognish_bear said:

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House Democrats' step to rescue Mike Johnson's foreign aid package is the starkest evidence to date that the GOP's fractured and tiny majority has effectively yielded to something resembling a bipartisan coalition. https://t.co/5KZNCWuqYx

— Axios (@axios) April 19, 2024

---

Absolutely,

Though of course they frame it as "bipartisan" instead of Uniparty consensus

But the point is the same.

The neo-con Republicans joined with the liberal interventionist Democrats to beat the America first Conservatives who did not want to fund this war.

DC gets paid....the America tax payers lose...business as usual.

---

That's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is they overplayed their hand.

---

They did not have much a hand to play.

They did not want to fund a proxy war...and their voters demanded they not do it.

But they are not a majority in the House.

Neo-con Republicans and Democrats have them outnumbered.

Thus another boondoggle bill was passed.

---

Johnson, Ryan, Boeshnor, McCarthy were all Conservatives until they got in that position. Then they magically shed their skin and revealed a Dem in GOP clothes? It is the position and how you get things done. Not the person.

---

I never said those guys are Democrats

I don't know who has

There are multiple factions inside the GOP

Those guys are just not on the populist Right.

And they are far more connected to the Defense industry…and believe in a far more aggressive foreign policy
The real question is why does the modern Democratic Party not have real ideological factions? Why is it so ideological uniform? Seems cultish no?

---

I don't know what you want them to do, the numbers reflect the Strategy. GOP wins a Super Majority in both Houses and the Presidency this is not an issue. The system from the beginning is set up to force compromise.

---

If the system was actually set up for compromise it would have a real multi-party system and the Senate would be elected by State legislatures

But I get your point.

The issue for me is that Johnson only got the Speakers position because of the America 1st Conservatives.

Instead of doing security first he joins the neo-con Republicans and the Democrats to push through a massive proxy war bill

A betrayal to say the least

---

Only if he doesn't get the Border bill...

He gave, now it is Dems turn to give. Let's see what happens.

---

Narrator:

"Mike Johnson in fact got no border bill…Senate Dems failed to pick up the border bill after they did pick up the Ukraine proxy war bill and passed that one"

---

Let's see where this goes. You guys are like kids, if it doesn't happen immediately "off with their heads".

---

Please the Senate Democratic leadership has said they have no interest in passing a border bill.

They will pass a Ukraine proxy war bill

This is not even a controversial take…no one expects the Senate Dems to do anything with a border bill but place it in a committee to die

---

Let's face it, we disagree on Americas Role in the World. Normally, not a big deal.

You are more isolationist (as a term not that you said we should be by ourselves) than I am. Maybe the word is transactional? That there needs to be a direct benefit? Ukraine, Afghanistan and Iraq are more secondary benefits. I see Taiwan, Korea, NATO and Japan as direct benefits and secondary is worth it.

No big deal, different views is as old as Politics. What has changed seems to be that only one view is allowed or deemed to have any value. If you don't agree, you are not a Conservative, kicked out of the Party and called a Neo-Con, RINO idiot to boot. Trump seems to have brought that to a new level.

I see value in your position and can accept that. You and some others can't seem to recognize an other view.

---

That is why I have to keep so many people on ignore on the R&P boards. I've got no issue with people having differing world views/political views. Even when I don't agree I still like to listen to an opposing view and try to understand that point of view and sometimes even gain a new insight.

But so many people make it personal so quickly and basically respond with "you are a moronic dumb@ss" because you think this or that.....rather than just saying...."I don't agree with that and here's why."

Our politicians devolve in to personal attacks more and more as well. We can do better.

---

We agree there. I actually think Johnson is doing a good job and it is refreshing to have someone that is doing what they think is right over what is personally best for him....

---

Oh I think he is doing what is best for him.

Or at least his donors

He will he get some fat checks from the Defense industry.

And there is not much danger to him personally.

America 1st Republicans don't have the votes to remove him and more establishment Republicans and Democrats would join together to protect him.

He is not doing anything courageous

---

He is taking some heat and may end up having to rely on Dems. That is not risk free. He also risks the wrath of Trump, which alot of GOP seems to think is a real thing. So, either it is real and he is doing what he thinks is right or it isn't and Trump is really toothless.

---

Was Trump not for the ukriane proxy war bill?

And he got more Republican votes and Republican opposition votes.

If you want to say Johnson believes in this war then fine…but let's not pretend it was some courageous stand

He is in no danger and the entire DC swamp and the media was supporting him in this…

---

I get it. I understand your view of some Uni-Party. I don't agree, seen too much in DC to believe that garbage.

---

You don't think consensus exists in the DC?

Especially around foreign policy issues?


Victoria Nuland for instance (an interventionist hawk) has worked for both Democratic and Republican administrations….

"I believe that Xi, Putin and Iran are truly the axis of evil. I think they are coordinating their actions. I'm willing to take personal risks for this because we have to do the right thing. And history will judge us",

- Speaker Johnson explains why he moved forward with aid pic.twitter.com/wR3ZdGa89D

— Visegrád 24 (@visegrad24) April 20, 2024

boognish_bear said:

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"I believe that Xi, Putin and Iran are truly the axis of evil. I think they are coordinating their actions. I'm willing to take personal risks for this because we have to do the right thing. And history will judge us",

- Speaker Johnson explains why he moved forward with aid pic.twitter.com/wR3ZdGa89D

— Visegrád 24 (@visegrad24) April 20, 2024

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So they just updated the old 2001 Axis of Evil with new members?


(More powerful ones at that)


Is this supposed to be a good thing?

boognish_bear said:

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"I believe that Xi, Putin and Iran are truly the axis of evil. I think they are coordinating their actions. I'm willing to take personal risks for this because we have to do the right thing. And history will judge us",

- Speaker Johnson explains why he moved forward with aid pic.twitter.com/wR3ZdGa89D

— Visegrád 24 (@visegrad24) April 20, 2024

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Hey Boog why do you spam these threads from the same two or three Twitter accounts? If people want to read uniparty talking points they can just follow those accounts. You post nearly every tweet they make without any commentary.

The_barBEARian said:

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boognish_bear said:

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"I believe that Xi, Putin and Iran are truly the axis of evil. I think they are coordinating their actions. I'm willing to take personal risks for this because we have to do the right thing. And history will judge us",

- Speaker Johnson explains why he moved forward with aid pic.twitter.com/wR3ZdGa89D

— Visegrád 24 (@visegrad24) April 20, 2024

---

Hey Boog why do you spam these threads from the same two or three Twitter accounts? If people want to read uniparty talking points they can just follow those accounts. You post nearly every tweet they make without any commentary.

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Just sharing stuff I find interesting that's germane to the thread.

I don't comment often because it feels useless getting into the back-and-forth in these threads where no one really listens to the other person.

I'd say just put me on ignore so I don't clutter your thread experience.

boognish_bear said:

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The_barBEARian said:

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boognish_bear said:

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"I believe that Xi, Putin and Iran are truly the axis of evil. I think they are coordinating their actions. I'm willing to take personal risks for this because we have to do the right thing. And history will judge us",

- Speaker Johnson explains why he moved forward with aid pic.twitter.com/wR3ZdGa89D

— Visegrád 24 (@visegrad24) April 20, 2024

---

Hey Boog why do you spam these threads from the same two or three Twitter accounts? If people want to read uniparty talking points they can just follow those accounts. You post nearly every tweet they make without any commentary.

---

Just sharing stuff I find interesting that's germane to the thread.

I don't comment often because it feels useless getting into the back-and-forth in these threads where no one really listens to the other person.

I'd say just put me on ignore so I don't clutter your thread experience.

---

I don't block people.

If you are going to have very strong opinions like I do you need thick skin.

Appreciate you sharing your thoughts.

This is the U.S. House of Representatives under the direction of Speaker Mike Johnson. Democrats are celebrating his total capitulation with no victory for securing our border. #MTV pic.twitter.com/TtaIgnX9eg

— Thomas Massie (@RepThomasMassie) April 20, 2024