cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

Doc Holliday said:

---

Everyone is lost on the fact that abortion is more common than you can imagine.

Planned Parenthood Killed 321,384 Babies Last Year Bringing Total Killed to Over 7.6 Million!

According to its annual report, Planned Parenthood provided just 3,889 adoption referrals while performing 321,384 abortions. That's nearly 83 abortions for every adoption referral. Planned Parenthood's prenatal services decreased from 9,419 last year to 7,762 this year.For every prenatal service given, Planned Parenthood performed 41 abortions.

http://www.californiafamily.org/2018/planned-parenthood-killed-321384-babies-last-year-bringing-total-killed-to-over-7-6-million/

---

Im not completely familiar with Planned Parenthood, but i was under the impression it mainly catered to Reproductive Health, including Abortions, I would have though, if you were planning on giving up a Baby for adoption, they wouldnt be your first port of call, is that wrong?

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Everyone is lost on the fact that abortion is more common than you can imagine.

Planned Parenthood Killed 321,384 Babies Last Year Bringing Total Killed to Over 7.6 Million!

According to its annual report, Planned Parenthood provided just 3,889 adoption referrals while performing 321,384 abortions. That's nearly 83 abortions for every adoption referral. Planned Parenthood's prenatal services decreased from 9,419 last year to 7,762 this year.For every prenatal service given, Planned Parenthood performed 41 abortions.

http://www.californiafamily.org/2018/planned-parenthood-killed-321384-babies-last-year-bringing-total-killed-to-over-7-6-million/

---

Im not completely familiar with Planned Parenthood, but i was under the impression it mainly catered to Reproductive Health, including Abortions, I would have though, if you were planning on giving up a Baby for adoption, they wouldnt be your first port of call, is that wrong?

---

Their name is highly decieving. It should be called Unplanning Parenthood.

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Everyone is lost on the fact that abortion is more common than you can imagine.

Planned Parenthood Killed 321,384 Babies Last Year Bringing Total Killed to Over 7.6 Million!

According to its annual report, Planned Parenthood provided just 3,889 adoption referrals while performing 321,384 abortions. That's nearly 83 abortions for every adoption referral. Planned Parenthood's prenatal services decreased from 9,419 last year to 7,762 this year.For every prenatal service given, Planned Parenthood performed 41 abortions.

http://www.californiafamily.org/2018/planned-parenthood-killed-321384-babies-last-year-bringing-total-killed-to-over-7-6-million/

---

Im not completely familiar with Planned Parenthood, but i was under the impression it mainly catered to Reproductive Health, including Abortions, I would have though, if you were planning on giving up a Baby for adoption, they wouldnt be your first port of call, is that wrong?

---

Their name is highly decieving. It should be called Unplanning Parenthood.

---

thats not really answering my question

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Everyone is lost on the fact that abortion is more common than you can imagine.

Planned Parenthood Killed 321,384 Babies Last Year Bringing Total Killed to Over 7.6 Million!

According to its annual report, Planned Parenthood provided just 3,889 adoption referrals while performing 321,384 abortions. That's nearly 83 abortions for every adoption referral. Planned Parenthood's prenatal services decreased from 9,419 last year to 7,762 this year.For every prenatal service given, Planned Parenthood performed 41 abortions.

http://www.californiafamily.org/2018/planned-parenthood-killed-321384-babies-last-year-bringing-total-killed-to-over-7-6-million/

---

Im not completely familiar with Planned Parenthood, but i was under the impression it mainly catered to Reproductive Health, including Abortions, I would have though, if you were planning on giving up a Baby for adoption, they wouldnt be your first port of call, is that wrong?

---

Their name is highly decieving. It should be called Unplanning Parenthood.

---

thats not really answering my question

---

Oh yeah...hell no, nobody goes to PP to give up their babies for adoption. They try and talk you into abortion over adoption.

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

Polycarp said:

---

47, Jinx made a good argument on your behalf concerning advocacy with a good example. Your refusal to answer questions and make curt responses detract from discussion. It's sad.

---

. My curt responses is because your lead premise is generally a straw man - such as "You are pro abortion; therefore,....". Why read any further when you mischaracterized my position from the start?

cms186 said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

If we're making this about semantics, isn't "unborn fetus" redundant?

What we call them doesn't change what they are. Tiny, defenseless human beings. Or do you also object to the notion they are human?

---

i suppose it is redundant, i apologise.

No, they are unborn humans, i dont agree with late term abortions, but i do think that Abortion is a choice a Woman should be able to make.

To take the argument you are trying to make further, you clearly dont agree with Abortion, correct? even if its within the first month or so of Gestation when the Fetus wouldnt be able to survive outside the womb and isnt even fully formed? Do you agree with people using Birth Control?

---

I am fine with people preventing pregnancy. I am not ok with people killing the unborn human after pregnancy has occurred.

Viability is a weak argument and a moving target. If I'm going to err on when a human "starts" and when a soul exists, I'll err on the side that doesn't involve murdering it, rather than on the one that does. That means not drawing an arbitrary line, but rather going to the actual start.

Also, if you believe it's "a choice a woman should be able to make" . . . when does that choice stop? The moment it passes thru her vaginal canal? Does it still apply if she chooses after it's 3 weeks old? What about 3 weeks before the birth?

---

ok, so why is it ok to prevent an Egg from being fertilized then? each egg is a potential Human Life, is it not? what about the Morning After Pill? you can take that up to 5 days after unprotected Sex (or Contraception has failed) and before any Medical tests could possibly detect whether or not you are actually Pregnant. I mean, in the first month, its not even a fetus, its just a mainly formless clump of cells without any of the basic main organs.or features of a human.

I know its a favoured term of the Pre-Life lobby, but Murder is a legal term and as Aboprtion has been held to be legal, its plainly not murder, regrdless of your opinion on the matter.

If you had read my previous post, ive already stated im opposed to Late Term Abortions.

---

Let''s say that I am hunting on public land. I set up in a great area overlooking a game trail. Ive seen a couple of animals come by but, they aren't what I'm looking for. It's getting late and I'm running out of daylight when at the head of the game trail there's a pretty big size shape rustling behind the brush. It's late and this is going to be my last opportunity to get something. I aim center mass and squeeze. Down it goes ! Let's go see what I got.

I head up the trail and look behind the brush to find that I've shot and killed another hunter! I didn't even know he was there. Am I guilty of negligent homicide? If so why when it was an accident? That's the answer to the morning after pill question.

Regarding an unfertilized egg or sperm that never finds an egg: neither of these will ever become a person on their own. Absolutely nothing in the Christian faith or cecular world says otherwise. Nobody mourns over what's dried on the sheets or tossed out on a tampon because we all know it was never going to be a person

---

The little story is totally irrelevant to the Morning After Pill.

This isnt about Religion, surely you're capable of making up your own mind without being told what to think by the Church? Also, a Fertilised egg cant become a Person on its own, it needs the womb of its Mother to grow in.

---

for some, it is about life and where that life comes from (read religion if you like). However, my prior statement was about nothing more than logic SLED (Size, Level of Development, Environment, Degree of Dependancy). I mentioned religion once but posted paragraphs using logic that anyone can agree with.

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

---

Why is everything after the first Trimester not fine?

bearassnekkid said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

If we're making this about semantics, isn't "unborn fetus" redundant?

What we call them doesn't change what they are. Tiny, defenseless human beings. Or do you also object to the notion they are human?

---

i suppose it is redundant, i apologise.

No, they are unborn humans, i dont agree with late term abortions, but i do think that Abortion is a choice a Woman should be able to make.

To take the argument you are trying to make further, you clearly dont agree with Abortion, correct? even if its within the first month or so of Gestation when the Fetus wouldnt be able to survive outside the womb and isnt even fully formed? Do you agree with people using Birth Control?

---

I am fine with people preventing pregnancy. I am not ok with people killing the unborn human after pregnancy has occurred.

Viability is a weak argument and a moving target. If I'm going to err on when a human "starts" and when a soul exists, I'll err on the side that doesn't involve murdering it, rather than on the one that does. That means not drawing an arbitrary line, but rather going to the actual start.

Also, if you believe it's "a choice a woman should be able to make" . . . when does that choice stop? The moment it passes thru her vaginal canal? Does it still apply if she chooses after it's 3 weeks old? What about 3 weeks before the birth?

---

ok, so why is it ok to prevent an Egg from being fertilized then? each egg is a potential Human Life, is it not? what about the Morning After Pill? you can take that up to 5 days after unprotected Sex (or Contraception has failed) and before any Medical tests could possibly detect whether or not you are actually Pregnant.


If you had read my previous post, ive already stated im opposed to Late Term Abortions.

---

Contraception is ok because preventing fertilization isn't terminating a human life. And an egg isn't a human being.

Also, though I never gave an opinion about morning-after pills, your post indicates that you suffer from a common misconception about them. They don't terminate an already fertilized egg. They prevent ovulation. Read here if you're interested.
https://www.mayoclinic.org/tests-procedures/morning-after-pill/about/pac-20394730

Lastly, why are you opposed to late term abortions? For what reason?

---

its not terminating a life, no, but it is preventing one from being possible.

Fair enough, learn something new every day!

As for why im opposed to Late Term Abortions, thats just the way i feel, I dont consider Late Term Abortions to be Murder, i just dont agree with them.

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

---

Why is everything after the first Trimester not fine?

---

Because thats the way i feel about the issue

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

---

Why is everything after the first Trimester not fine?

---

Because thats the way i feel about the issue

---

But why do you feel that way?

Waco1947 said:

---

Polycarp said:

---

47, Jinx made a good argument on your behalf concerning advocacy with a good example. Your refusal to answer questions and make curt responses detract from discussion. It's sad.

---

. My curt responses is because your lead premise is generally a straw man - such as "You are pro abortion; therefore,....". Why read any further when you mischaracterized my position from the start?

---

You are pro-abortion.

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

---

Why is everything after the first Trimester not fine?

---

Because thats the way i feel about the issue

---

But why do you feel that way?

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

---

Why is everything after the first Trimester not fine?

---

Because thats the way i feel about the issue

---

But why do you feel that way?

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

---

Why is everything after the first Trimester not fine?

---

Because thats the way i feel about the issue

---

But why do you feel that way?

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

There has to be a reason you feel that way. What's the different between the two time periods that makes you feel that way?

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

---

Why is everything after the first Trimester not fine?

---

Because thats the way i feel about the issue

---

But why do you feel that way?

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

There has to be a reason you feel that way. What's the different between the two time periods that makes you feel that way?

---

there probably is, just not one that i can describe

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

---

Why is everything after the first Trimester not fine?

---

Because thats the way i feel about the issue

---

But why do you feel that way?

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

There has to be a reason you feel that way. What's the different between the two time periods that makes you feel that way?

---

there probably is, just not one that i can describe

---

I can't make policy decisions based on feelings. Can you please provide a reason? Catholics have a reason they feel the way about when life begins, you may disagree with it, but it is more than just a "feeling". Personally, I feel we can call it human when it resembles a human, it has a heart beat and active brain function. This is more than just a "feeling", it is science. What changes from the last day of the first trimester to the first day of the 2nd trimester that is significant in your mind?

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

---

Why is everything after the first Trimester not fine?

---

Because thats the way i feel about the issue

---

But why do you feel that way?

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

There has to be a reason you feel that way. What's the different between the two time periods that makes you feel that way?

---

there probably is, just not one that i can describe

---

Is it because after the first trimester you think they're officially babies and abortion would be equivalent to murder?

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

---

Why is everything after the first Trimester not fine?

---

Because thats the way i feel about the issue

---

But why do you feel that way?

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

There has to be a reason you feel that way. What's the different between the two time periods that makes you feel that way?

---

there probably is, just not one that i can describe

---

Is it because after the first trimester you think they're officially babies and abortion would be equivalent to murder?

---

nope, i dont consider Abortion of any kind to be Murder

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

---

Why is everything after the first Trimester not fine?

---

Because thats the way i feel about the issue

---

But why do you feel that way?

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

There has to be a reason you feel that way. What's the different between the two time periods that makes you feel that way?

---

there probably is, just not one that i can describe

---

I can't make policy decisions based on feelings. Can you please provide a reason? Catholics have a reason they feel the way about when life begins, you may disagree with it, but it is more than just a "feeling". Personally, I feel we can call it human when it resembles a human, it has a heart beat and active brain function. This is more than just a "feeling", it is science. What changes from the last day of the first trimester to the first day of the 2nd trimester that is significant in your mind?

---

how many different ways do you want me to answer this question, if you arent happy with my answer, thats fine, but im not suddenly going to provide a different one just because you keep asking the same question using a different method.

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

---

Why is everything after the first Trimester not fine?

---

Because thats the way i feel about the issue

---

But why do you feel that way?

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

There has to be a reason you feel that way. What's the different between the two time periods that makes you feel that way?

---

there probably is, just not one that i can describe

---

Is it because after the first trimester you think they're officially babies and abortion would be equivalent to murder?

---

nope, i dont consider Abortion of any kind to be Murder

---

So if I go up to a pregnant woman and abort the baby with my own hands without her consent...that's not murder?

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

There has to be a reason you feel that way. What's the different between the two time periods that makes you feel that way?

---

there probably is, just not one that i can describe

---

Is it because after the first trimester you think they're officially babies and abortion would be equivalent to murder?

---

nope, i dont consider Abortion of any kind to be Murder

---

So if I go up to a pregnant woman and abort the baby with my own hands...that's not murder?

---

how do you plan on doing that?

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

There has to be a reason you feel that way. What's the different between the two time periods that makes you feel that way?

---

there probably is, just not one that i can describe

---

Is it because after the first trimester you think they're officially babies and abortion would be equivalent to murder?

---

nope, i dont consider Abortion of any kind to be Murder

---

So if I go up to a pregnant woman and abort the baby with my own hands...that's not murder?

---

how do you plan on doing that?

---

Just answer the question dude. I don't want to get into gross details about how that would happen.

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

There has to be a reason you feel that way. What's the different between the two time periods that makes you feel that way?

---

there probably is, just not one that i can describe

---

Is it because after the first trimester you think they're officially babies and abortion would be equivalent to murder?

---

nope, i dont consider Abortion of any kind to be Murder

---

So if I go up to a pregnant woman and abort the baby with my own hands...that's not murder?

---

how do you plan on doing that?

---

Just answer the question dude. I don't want to get into gross details about how that would happen.

---

well it kinda colours the answer on whether you plan on slipping an abortion pill in her drink or just stabbing her in the womb

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

There has to be a reason you feel that way. What's the different between the two time periods that makes you feel that way?

---

there probably is, just not one that i can describe

---

Is it because after the first trimester you think they're officially babies and abortion would be equivalent to murder?

---

nope, i dont consider Abortion of any kind to be Murder

---

So if I go up to a pregnant woman and abort the baby with my own hands...that's not murder?

---

how do you plan on doing that?

---

Just answer the question dude. I don't want to get into gross details about how that would happen.

---

well it kinda colours the answer on whether you plan on slipping an abortion pill in her drink or just stabbing her in the womb

---

Well answer for both of those scenarios.

Is it only murder if the mother wants to have the baby?

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

bearassnekkid said:

---

fadskier said:

---

Waco1947 said:

---

If the premise is indeed a your pro life belief then I refer you to the dilemma of who to save in the clinic fire - a 5 year life or a 1,000 lives.

---

There's no dilemma

---

He knows that. He defeated his own point when he admitted in my hypothetcial that he's save one boy's life instead of two women. Obviously that doesn't mean the two women aren't human, or aren't alive. So the entire "gotcha" in his hypothetical is meaningless. But he's still desperately trying to hang onto it. Anything to justify killing babies.

---

Unborn Fetuses arent Babies, just fyi, it may sensationalise your POV to call abortion "Baby Murder" but it is inaccurate

---

So one day before birth it is a fetus but it magically becomes a baby the second it is born? You are smarter than this Chris. The terminology used to defend the use of abortions doesn't change what the object of the discussion is.

---

sure, im just correcting people, Abortion isnt "Baby Murder" (a definition that is wrong twice!), what you described is completely true (except there is no magic involved) an unborn Baby is called a Fetus and a Fetus that has been Born is called a Baby.

I have also, repeatedly said that i am opposed to Late term abortions.

---

Where on this chart is preventing life OK?

---

Personally, for an Abortion purely for Lifestyle reasons (for want of a better term), I think a first Trimester Abortion is fine.

If a Mother medically needs an abortion for Health reasons, she needs an abortion.regardless of which stage the baby is at (though i would assume if it was at a late stage, they would just induce birth or give the Mother a C-section)

---

Why is everything after the first Trimester not fine?

---

Because thats the way i feel about the issue

---

But why do you feel that way?

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

There has to be a reason you feel that way. What's the different between the two time periods that makes you feel that way?

---

there probably is, just not one that i can describe

---

I can't make policy decisions based on feelings. Can you please provide a reason? Catholics have a reason they feel the way about when life begins, you may disagree with it, but it is more than just a "feeling". Personally, I feel we can call it human when it resembles a human, it has a heart beat and active brain function. This is more than just a "feeling", it is science. What changes from the last day of the first trimester to the first day of the 2nd trimester that is significant in your mind?

---

how many different ways do you want me to answer this question, if you arent happy with my answer, thats fine, but im not suddenly going to provide a different one just because you keep asking the same question using a different method.

---

Ok, so we are just going to have discussions and make policy based on feelings now. No support for those feelings are needed, the feelings are enough. Great. What if one's feelings are incongruent with another's, what do we do then? What if one's feelings are contradictory to science or reason, what do we do then?

What do you call terminating a life one day after birth? Murder. So what is different than terminating a life one day before birth? Again, you said you never call an abortion murder, so I'm just trying to determine where we draw the line. Because as a society, we have to define these things for the good of society. Most people would he appalled if a one day old baby was terminated and it would he called a murder. Even though your feelings tell you late term abortions should not be permitted (for some obscure unknown reason), yet you don't call any abortions murder. So what happens in the hours and minutes before birth and the hours and minutes after birth that you can distinguish between the two situations and call one simply an abortion and the other one murder?

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

because thats the way i feel, i dont know why i feel that way, i just do.

---

There has to be a reason you feel that way. What's the different between the two time periods that makes you feel that way?

---

there probably is, just not one that i can describe

---

Is it because after the first trimester you think they're officially babies and abortion would be equivalent to murder?

---

nope, i dont consider Abortion of any kind to be Murder

---

So if I go up to a pregnant woman and abort the baby with my own hands...that's not murder?

---

how do you plan on doing that?

---

Just answer the question dude. I don't want to get into gross details about how that would happen.

---

well it kinda colours the answer on whether you plan on slipping an abortion pill in her drink or just stabbing her in the womb

---

Well answer for both of those scenarios.

Is it only murder if the mother wants to have the baby?

---

Well to answer you original question then, you wouldnt be Aborting the Baby, thats a completely different act, whether its Murder or not would depend on the State you were in it seems

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

I can't make policy decisions based on feelings. Can you please provide a reason? Catholics have a reason they feel the way about when life begins, you may disagree with it, but it is more than just a "feeling". Personally, I feel we can call it human when it resembles a human, it has a heart beat and active brain function. This is more than just a "feeling", it is science. What changes from the last day of the first trimester to the first day of the 2nd trimester that is significant in your mind?

---

how many different ways do you want me to answer this question, if you arent happy with my answer, thats fine, but im not suddenly going to provide a different one just because you keep asking the same question using a different method.

---

Ok, so we are just going to have discussions and make policy based on feelings now. No support for those feelings are needed, the feelings are enough. Great. What if one's feelings are incongruent with another's, what do we do then? What if one's feelings are contradictory to science or reason, what do we do then?

What do you call terminating a life one day after birth? Murder. So what is different than terminating a life one day before birth? Again, you said you never call an abortion murder, so I'm just trying to determine where we draw the line. Because as a society, we have to define these things for the good of society. Most people would he appalled if a one day old baby was terminated and it would he called a murder. Even though your feelings tell you late term abortions should not be permitted (for some obscure unknown reason), yet you don't call any abortions murder. So what happens in the hours and minutes before birth and the hours and minutes after birth that you can distinguish between the two situations and call one simply an abortion and the other one murder?

---

Its a clearly stated Legal definition, it is not mine, this is not complicated

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

cms186 said:

---

contrario said:

---

I can't make policy decisions based on feelings. Can you please provide a reason? Catholics have a reason they feel the way about when life begins, you may disagree with it, but it is more than just a "feeling". Personally, I feel we can call it human when it resembles a human, it has a heart beat and active brain function. This is more than just a "feeling", it is science. What changes from the last day of the first trimester to the first day of the 2nd trimester that is significant in your mind?

---

how many different ways do you want me to answer this question, if you arent happy with my answer, thats fine, but im not suddenly going to provide a different one just because you keep asking the same question using a different method.

---

Ok, so we are just going to have discussions and make policy based on feelings now. No support for those feelings are needed, the feelings are enough. Great. What if one's feelings are incongruent with another's, what do we do then? What if one's feelings are contradictory to science or reason, what do we do then?

What do you call terminating a life one day after birth? Murder. So what is different than terminating a life one day before birth? Again, you said you never call an abortion murder, so I'm just trying to determine where we draw the line. Because as a society, we have to define these things for the good of society. Most people would he appalled if a one day old baby was terminated and it would he called a murder. Even though your feelings tell you late term abortions should not be permitted (for some obscure unknown reason), yet you don't call any abortions murder. So what happens in the hours and minutes before birth and the hours and minutes after birth that you can distinguish between the two situations and call one simply an abortion and the other one murder?

---

Its a clearly stated Legal definition, it is not mine, this is not complicated

---

And legal definitions change over time and differ from country to country and jurisdiction to jurisdiction.

There was a time that the laws in the US were racist and did not treat African Americans as equal citizens; are you ok with the argument that the laws that were on the books at the time clearly "defined" what percentage of human African Americans were? Because I wouldn't be ok with that argument, and thankfully, thousands of Americans at the time were not ok with sticking to the legal definition of the time.

As citizens, it is our duty to make sure we have laws that provide justice for all in order to maintain a civilized society. So, regardless of the laws that are on the books and how the law defines it, do you think there is a difference between terminating a life one day after birth (murder by every reasonable person) and terminating a life one day before birth (not considered murder according to you)? If there is a difference, what is the difference?

So the OP is "Conception = Life = Human? Is this equation right? Think carefully."

Waco1947 said:

---

So the OP is "Conception = Life = Human? Is this equation right? Think carefully."

---

I asked you weeks ago to look up the definition of contraception. Have you done that yet?

Waco1947 said:

---

So the OP is "Conception = Life = Human? Is this equation right? Think carefully."

---

Waco1947 - As I said in the other post, "yes." I have thought carefully about this.

Please explain to me why this is not correct.