BearTruth13 said:

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syme said:

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Hypothetical comparisons of how a 5 loss team would do in another conference Does Not Matter. Because It didn't happen. Actually being in the playoff picture in real life and playing in nationally televised prime time games is what matters, it's what makes for memorable seasons, and it's what's fun for the fan base. You really seem to be struggling with the big picture here.

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With that argument, we should just drop to the AAC and go 12-0! Then we will have memorable seasons every year!

Clearly we are not a top 15 team. I'll take 11 wins but I'll always remember it was against mainly terrible opponents. And that we lost the only games we played against good teams.

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No, that's not clear at all. We lost three games to two top-10 teams by a combined 22 points. This is certainly a top-15 team. We're not a top-10 team yet, but this is absolutely a top-15 team.

Based on what I've seen from bowl season, we lose to:

5 SEC teams - Florida, Auburn, Bama, LSU and clearly Georgia
5/6 Big 10 schools - OSU, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Penn State and probably Michigan
1 ACC school - Clemson
1 PAC school - Oregon
1 Big 12 school - OU
1 Independent - Notre Dame

So you are right. We are probably around 15/16. I just don't want to be proud that we lost to OU and Georgia. OU got ROCKED by LSU. I think they are probably a fringe top 10 team. And Georgia benched half their team tonight.

Our offense is so awful that I'm just not confident in our ability to beat quality teams. Our defense can only do so much.

BearTruth13 said:

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syme said:

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Hypothetical comparisons of how a 5 loss team would do in another conference Does Not Matter. Because It didn't happen. Actually being in the playoff picture in real life and playing in nationally televised prime time games is what matters, it's what makes for memorable seasons, and it's what's fun for the fan base. You really seem to be struggling with the big picture here.

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Quote:

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With that argument, we should just drop to the AAC and go 12-0! Then we will have memorable seasons every year!

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Way to be intentionally obtuse..

Quote:

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Clearly we are not a top 15 team. I'll take 11 wins but I'll always remember it was against mainly terrible opponents. And that we lost the only games we played against good teams.

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I've no doubt you will. Some people just can't enjoy things.

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BearTruth13 said:

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Based on what I've seen from bowl season, we lose to:

5 SEC teams - Florida, Auburn, Bama, LSU and clearly Georgia
5/6 Big 10 schools - OSU, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Penn State and probably Michigan
1 ACC school - Clemson
1 PAC school - Oregon
1 Big 12 school - OU
1 Independent - Notre Dame

So you are right. We are probably around 15/16. I just don't want to be proud that we lost to OU and Georgia. OU got ROCKED by LSU. I think they are probably a fringe top 10 team. And Georgia benched half their team tonight.

Our offense is so awful that I'm just not confident in our ability to beat quality teams. Our defense can only do so much.

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I think there are at least 5 teams you named that we would beat

humdinger05 said:

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BearTruth13 said:

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Based on what I've seen from bowl season, we lose to:

5 SEC teams - Florida, Auburn, Bama, LSU and clearly Georgia
5/6 Big 10 schools - OSU, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Penn State and probably Michigan
1 ACC school - Clemson
1 PAC school - Oregon
1 Big 12 school - OU
1 Independent - Notre Dame

So you are right. We are probably around 15/16. I just don't want to be proud that we lost to OU and Georgia. OU got ROCKED by LSU. I think they are probably a fringe top 10 team. And Georgia benched half their team tonight.

Our offense is so awful that I'm just not confident in our ability to beat quality teams. Our defense can only do so much.

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I think there are at least 5 teams you named that we would beat

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... Or that we could beat anyway.

This idea that we couldn't compete with the majority of the names on that list is absurd and underrates the talent level of the two teams we lost to. Oklahoma and Georgia aren't LSU, but neither is anyone else in the country. Those two teams are as good as or better than any team not named Clemson and Ohio State, and we were competitive with both.

bear2be2 said:

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humdinger05 said:

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BearTruth13 said:

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Based on what I've seen from bowl season, we lose to:

5 SEC teams - Florida, Auburn, Bama, LSU and clearly Georgia
5/6 Big 10 schools - OSU, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Penn State and probably Michigan
1 ACC school - Clemson
1 PAC school - Oregon
1 Big 12 school - OU
1 Independent - Notre Dame

So you are right. We are probably around 15/16. I just don't want to be proud that we lost to OU and Georgia. OU got ROCKED by LSU. I think they are probably a fringe top 10 team. And Georgia benched half their team tonight.

Our offense is so awful that I'm just not confident in our ability to beat quality teams. Our defense can only do so much.

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I think there are at least 5 teams you named that we would beat

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... Or that we could beat anyway.

This idea that we couldn't compete with the majority of the names on that list is absurd and underrates the talent level of the two teams we lost to. Oklahoma and Georgia aren't LSU, but neither is anyone else in the country. Those two teams are as good as or better than any team not named Clemson and Ohio State, and we were competitive with both.

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We were "competitive" with Georgia by losing by 12? To a team with most of their stars benched? Based on that I don't think we could hang with the SEC teams I listed. I just don't think OU is that good. Based on bowl performance, I don't think we hang with those Big 10 schools. Clemson is in another league. Notre Dame killed an ISU team we struggled with. I think Oregon is better than OU.

BearTruth13 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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humdinger05 said:

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BearTruth13 said:

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Based on what I've seen from bowl season, we lose to:

5 SEC teams - Florida, Auburn, Bama, LSU and clearly Georgia
5/6 Big 10 schools - OSU, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Penn State and probably Michigan
1 ACC school - Clemson
1 PAC school - Oregon
1 Big 12 school - OU
1 Independent - Notre Dame

So you are right. We are probably around 15/16. I just don't want to be proud that we lost to OU and Georgia. OU got ROCKED by LSU. I think they are probably a fringe top 10 team. And Georgia benched half their team tonight.

Our offense is so awful that I'm just not confident in our ability to beat quality teams. Our defense can only do so much.

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I think there are at least 5 teams you named that we would beat

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... Or that we could beat anyway.

This idea that we couldn't compete with the majority of the names on that list is absurd and underrates the talent level of the two teams we lost to. Oklahoma and Georgia aren't LSU, but neither is anyone else in the country. Those two teams are as good as or better than any team not named Clemson and Ohio State, and we were competitive with both.

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We were "competitive" with Georgia by losing by 12? To a team with most of their stars benched? Based on that I don't think we could hang with the SEC teams I listed. I just don't think OU is that good. Based on bowl performance, I don't think we hang with those Big 10 schools. Clemson is in another league. Notre Dame killed an ISU team we struggled with. I think Oregon is better than OU.

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Yes, we were competitive. We outgained them by double in the second half and were a couple of drops from putting a serious scare in them down the stretch. They had more talent than we do, and we struggled early. But once we settled in and made some adjustments, we proved we were more than worthy to share the field with them.

And when you recruit like Georgia does, you're replacing current stars with future ones. So I don't lend any credence to missing player excuses. Injuries are a part of the game and suspensions/game-skipping speak to the character of a team. You either have the depth to overcome those things or you don't.

bear2be2 said:

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BearTruth13 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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humdinger05 said:

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BearTruth13 said:

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Based on what I've seen from bowl season, we lose to:

5 SEC teams - Florida, Auburn, Bama, LSU and clearly Georgia
5/6 Big 10 schools - OSU, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Penn State and probably Michigan
1 ACC school - Clemson
1 PAC school - Oregon
1 Big 12 school - OU
1 Independent - Notre Dame

So you are right. We are probably around 15/16. I just don't want to be proud that we lost to OU and Georgia. OU got ROCKED by LSU. I think they are probably a fringe top 10 team. And Georgia benched half their team tonight.

Our offense is so awful that I'm just not confident in our ability to beat quality teams. Our defense can only do so much.

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I think there are at least 5 teams you named that we would beat

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... Or that we could beat anyway.

This idea that we couldn't compete with the majority of the names on that list is absurd and underrates the talent level of the two teams we lost to. Oklahoma and Georgia aren't LSU, but neither is anyone else in the country. Those two teams are as good as or better than any team not named Clemson and Ohio State, and we were competitive with both.

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We were "competitive" with Georgia by losing by 12? To a team with most of their stars benched? Based on that I don't think we could hang with the SEC teams I listed. I just don't think OU is that good. Based on bowl performance, I don't think we hang with those Big 10 schools. Clemson is in another league. Notre Dame killed an ISU team we struggled with. I think Oregon is better than OU.

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Yes, we were competitive. We outgained them by double in the second half and were a couple of drops from putting a serious scare in them down the stretch. They had more talent than we do, and we struggled early. But once we settled in and made some adjustments, we proved we were more than worthy to share the field with them.

And when you recruit like Georgia does, you're replacing current stars with future ones. So I don't lend any credence to missing player excuses. Injuries are a part of the game and suspensions/game-skipping speak to the character of a team. You either have the depth to overcome those things or you don't.

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Outside of LSU, Ohio State, Clemson, Alabama, and OU/Georgia we should be favored or at least near a pick em against anyone else. You're not watching the same team if you disagree with that.

humdinger05 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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BearTruth13 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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humdinger05 said:

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BearTruth13 said:

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Based on what I've seen from bowl season, we lose to:

5 SEC teams - Florida, Auburn, Bama, LSU and clearly Georgia
5/6 Big 10 schools - OSU, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Penn State and probably Michigan
1 ACC school - Clemson
1 PAC school - Oregon
1 Big 12 school - OU
1 Independent - Notre Dame

So you are right. We are probably around 15/16. I just don't want to be proud that we lost to OU and Georgia. OU got ROCKED by LSU. I think they are probably a fringe top 10 team. And Georgia benched half their team tonight.

Our offense is so awful that I'm just not confident in our ability to beat quality teams. Our defense can only do so much.

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I think there are at least 5 teams you named that we would beat

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... Or that we could beat anyway.

This idea that we couldn't compete with the majority of the names on that list is absurd and underrates the talent level of the two teams we lost to. Oklahoma and Georgia aren't LSU, but neither is anyone else in the country. Those two teams are as good as or better than any team not named Clemson and Ohio State, and we were competitive with both.

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We were "competitive" with Georgia by losing by 12? To a team with most of their stars benched? Based on that I don't think we could hang with the SEC teams I listed. I just don't think OU is that good. Based on bowl performance, I don't think we hang with those Big 10 schools. Clemson is in another league. Notre Dame killed an ISU team we struggled with. I think Oregon is better than OU.

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Yes, we were competitive. We outgained them by double in the second half and were a couple of drops from putting a serious scare in them down the stretch. They had more talent than we do, and we struggled early. But once we settled in and made some adjustments, we proved we were more than worthy to share the field with them.

And when you recruit like Georgia does, you're replacing current stars with future ones. So I don't lend any credence to missing player excuses. Injuries are a part of the game and suspensions/game-skipping speak to the character of a team. You either have the depth to overcome those things or you don't.

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Outside of LSU, Ohio State, Clemson, Alabama, and OU/Georgia we should be favored or at least near a pick em against anyone else. You're not watching the same team if you disagree with that.

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I agree. I wouldn't argue that we'd beat everyone else. But we'd compete like hell with them and have a chance to win at the end.

bear2be2 said:

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humdinger05 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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BearTruth13 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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humdinger05 said:

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BearTruth13 said:

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Based on what I've seen from bowl season, we lose to:

5 SEC teams - Florida, Auburn, Bama, LSU and clearly Georgia
5/6 Big 10 schools - OSU, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Penn State and probably Michigan
1 ACC school - Clemson
1 PAC school - Oregon
1 Big 12 school - OU
1 Independent - Notre Dame

So you are right. We are probably around 15/16. I just don't want to be proud that we lost to OU and Georgia. OU got ROCKED by LSU. I think they are probably a fringe top 10 team. And Georgia benched half their team tonight.

Our offense is so awful that I'm just not confident in our ability to beat quality teams. Our defense can only do so much.

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I think there are at least 5 teams you named that we would beat

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... Or that we could beat anyway.

This idea that we couldn't compete with the majority of the names on that list is absurd and underrates the talent level of the two teams we lost to. Oklahoma and Georgia aren't LSU, but neither is anyone else in the country. Those two teams are as good as or better than any team not named Clemson and Ohio State, and we were competitive with both.

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We were "competitive" with Georgia by losing by 12? To a team with most of their stars benched? Based on that I don't think we could hang with the SEC teams I listed. I just don't think OU is that good. Based on bowl performance, I don't think we hang with those Big 10 schools. Clemson is in another league. Notre Dame killed an ISU team we struggled with. I think Oregon is better than OU.

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Yes, we were competitive. We outgained them by double in the second half and were a couple of drops from putting a serious scare in them down the stretch. They had more talent than we do, and we struggled early. But once we settled in and made some adjustments, we proved we were more than worthy to share the field with them.

And when you recruit like Georgia does, you're replacing current stars with future ones. So I don't lend any credence to missing player excuses. Injuries are a part of the game and suspensions/game-skipping speak to the character of a team. You either have the depth to overcome those things or you don't.

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Outside of LSU, Ohio State, Clemson, Alabama, and OU/Georgia we should be favored or at least near a pick em against anyone else. You're not watching the same team if you disagree with that.

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I agree. I wouldn't argue that we'd beat everyone else. But we'd compete like hell with them and have a chance to win at the end.

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I'm not arguing if we would have a chance. Or compete. We had a chance vs OU. I'm arguing that those teams are better than Baylor. That if we played 10 times they would win 6. I just don't think with our offense, we can claim to be that good.

bear2be2 said:

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humdinger05 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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BearTruth13 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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humdinger05 said:

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BearTruth13 said:

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Based on what I've seen from bowl season, we lose to:

5 SEC teams - Florida, Auburn, Bama, LSU and clearly Georgia
5/6 Big 10 schools - OSU, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Penn State and probably Michigan
1 ACC school - Clemson
1 PAC school - Oregon
1 Big 12 school - OU
1 Independent - Notre Dame

So you are right. We are probably around 15/16. I just don't want to be proud that we lost to OU and Georgia. OU got ROCKED by LSU. I think they are probably a fringe top 10 team. And Georgia benched half their team tonight.

Our offense is so awful that I'm just not confident in our ability to beat quality teams. Our defense can only do so much.

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I think there are at least 5 teams you named that we would beat

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... Or that we could beat anyway.

This idea that we couldn't compete with the majority of the names on that list is absurd and underrates the talent level of the two teams we lost to. Oklahoma and Georgia aren't LSU, but neither is anyone else in the country. Those two teams are as good as or better than any team not named Clemson and Ohio State, and we were competitive with both.

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We were "competitive" with Georgia by losing by 12? To a team with most of their stars benched? Based on that I don't think we could hang with the SEC teams I listed. I just don't think OU is that good. Based on bowl performance, I don't think we hang with those Big 10 schools. Clemson is in another league. Notre Dame killed an ISU team we struggled with. I think Oregon is better than OU.

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Yes, we were competitive. We outgained them by double in the second half and were a couple of drops from putting a serious scare in them down the stretch. They had more talent than we do, and we struggled early. But once we settled in and made some adjustments, we proved we were more than worthy to share the field with them.

And when you recruit like Georgia does, you're replacing current stars with future ones. So I don't lend any credence to missing player excuses. Injuries are a part of the game and suspensions/game-skipping speak to the character of a team. You either have the depth to overcome those things or you don't.

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Outside of LSU, Ohio State, Clemson, Alabama, and OU/Georgia we should be favored or at least near a pick em against anyone else. You're not watching the same team if you disagree with that.

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I agree. I wouldn't argue that we'd beat everyone else. But we'd compete like hell with them and have a chance to win at the end.

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I'm not saying we would definitely lose all of those games, but I do think we would be an underdog in all of those games and probably to a few other teams not listed.

Chuckroast said:

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bear2be2 said:

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humdinger05 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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BearTruth13 said:

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bear2be2 said:

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humdinger05 said:

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BearTruth13 said:

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Based on what I've seen from bowl season, we lose to:

5 SEC teams - Florida, Auburn, Bama, LSU and clearly Georgia
5/6 Big 10 schools - OSU, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Penn State and probably Michigan
1 ACC school - Clemson
1 PAC school - Oregon
1 Big 12 school - OU
1 Independent - Notre Dame

So you are right. We are probably around 15/16. I just don't want to be proud that we lost to OU and Georgia. OU got ROCKED by LSU. I think they are probably a fringe top 10 team. And Georgia benched half their team tonight.

Our offense is so awful that I'm just not confident in our ability to beat quality teams. Our defense can only do so much.

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I think there are at least 5 teams you named that we would beat

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... Or that we could beat anyway.

This idea that we couldn't compete with the majority of the names on that list is absurd and underrates the talent level of the two teams we lost to. Oklahoma and Georgia aren't LSU, but neither is anyone else in the country. Those two teams are as good as or better than any team not named Clemson and Ohio State, and we were competitive with both.

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We were "competitive" with Georgia by losing by 12? To a team with most of their stars benched? Based on that I don't think we could hang with the SEC teams I listed. I just don't think OU is that good. Based on bowl performance, I don't think we hang with those Big 10 schools. Clemson is in another league. Notre Dame killed an ISU team we struggled with. I think Oregon is better than OU.

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Yes, we were competitive. We outgained them by double in the second half and were a couple of drops from putting a serious scare in them down the stretch. They had more talent than we do, and we struggled early. But once we settled in and made some adjustments, we proved we were more than worthy to share the field with them.

And when you recruit like Georgia does, you're replacing current stars with future ones. So I don't lend any credence to missing player excuses. Injuries are a part of the game and suspensions/game-skipping speak to the character of a team. You either have the depth to overcome those things or you don't.

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Outside of LSU, Ohio State, Clemson, Alabama, and OU/Georgia we should be favored or at least near a pick em against anyone else. You're not watching the same team if you disagree with that.

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I agree. I wouldn't argue that we'd beat everyone else. But we'd compete like hell with them and have a chance to win at the end.

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I'm not saying we would definitely lose all of those games, but I do think we would be an underdog in all of those games and probably to a few other teams not listed.

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I think a lot of those games would be pick 'ems or field goal spreads one way or the other. Minnesota, Iowa, Auburn, Michigan and Notre Dame all have their flaws, and I'd like to see how we'd fare against Oregon, Penn State and Wisconsin. None of those teams are substantially more talented than the Oklahoma and Georgia teams we played right with for halves at a time.

Those would all be tough games, for sure. But I don't think any of that first group of teams are definitively better than ours.

That list for me would be confined to LSU, Clemson, Ohio State, Georgia, Alabama and Oklahoma with probablies on Oregon, Penn State and Wisconsin.

It's a shame we don't get more decent nonconference matchups and/or a real playoff system to determine these things on the field.

bear2be2 said:

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tallman1 said:

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But they would be in the top 3 of the Big12 and if Baylor was in the SEC, I could see them being where A&M is currently. I believe Baylor takes care of a depleted Georgia team and continues its ascension on the national scene.

I'm not taking a away from what Baylor has accomplished, we haven't faced anywhere near what A&M has faced. The Aggies had to play the Alabama Crimson Tide, Auburn Tigers and LSU Tigers in the SEC West, the Georgia Bulldogs in a SEC crossover and the Clemson Tigers in nonconference action. Have you Doug deeper into the games A&M played and checked out their injuries? They have missed guys throughout the year. Heck, they loss their top 2 running backs early in the season and had to rely on a freshman all year. Spiller was the only scholarship RB on the roster against OKST and had to us a converted QB for his backup. The Aggies also were without star defensive tackle Justin Madubuike, who declared for the NFL draft against OKST. Don't highlight one team, not being at full strength and not the other.

You'd have to do a little more research vs throwing out margin of victories on couple of games because the consensus, outside of our fan base is pretty much along the lines of what I'm saying. Most of what I read are true fans, talking with their heart, not their head or just trolling.

We don't have the depth or offensive line to take on a schedule like that yet. I'm hoping we get there, but let's not get ahead of ourselves. I'm with you on one thing, I want Baylor to win all the games on their schedule!

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Based on what exactly? Their thoroughly unimpressive win over a shorthanded Oklahoma State team or their blowout wins over ****ty teams from Mississippi State and South Carolina? Or was it their one-score wins over Arkansas and Ole Miss?

A&M might be the third best team in the Big 12. I think it far more likely that they'd fall somewhere in that mid-tier mashup with Texas, Oklahoma State, Kansas State and Iowa State.

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You know which top 10 team USC beat this year?

Crap in the woods bear said:

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bear2be2 said:

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tallman1 said:

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But they would be in the top 3 of the Big12 and if Baylor was in the SEC, I could see them being where A&M is currently. I believe Baylor takes care of a depleted Georgia team and continues its ascension on the national scene.

I'm not taking a away from what Baylor has accomplished, we haven't faced anywhere near what A&M has faced. The Aggies had to play the Alabama Crimson Tide, Auburn Tigers and LSU Tigers in the SEC West, the Georgia Bulldogs in a SEC crossover and the Clemson Tigers in nonconference action. Have you Doug deeper into the games A&M played and checked out their injuries? They have missed guys throughout the year. Heck, they loss their top 2 running backs early in the season and had to rely on a freshman all year. Spiller was the only scholarship RB on the roster against OKST and had to us a converted QB for his backup. The Aggies also were without star defensive tackle Justin Madubuike, who declared for the NFL draft against OKST. Don't highlight one team, not being at full strength and not the other.

You'd have to do a little more research vs throwing out margin of victories on couple of games because the consensus, outside of our fan base is pretty much along the lines of what I'm saying. Most of what I read are true fans, talking with their heart, not their head or just trolling.

We don't have the depth or offensive line to take on a schedule like that yet. I'm hoping we get there, but let's not get ahead of ourselves. I'm with you on one thing, I want Baylor to win all the games on their schedule!

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Based on what exactly? Their thoroughly unimpressive win over a shorthanded Oklahoma State team or their blowout wins over ****ty teams from Mississippi State and South Carolina? Or was it their one-score wins over Arkansas and Ole Miss?

A&M might be the third best team in the Big 12. I think it far more likely that they'd fall somewhere in that mid-tier mashup with Texas, Oklahoma State, Kansas State and Iowa State.

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You know which top 10 team USC beat this year?

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That was one of four wins for the Gamecocks. That game said a lot more about Georgia's effort/performance on that particular day than the strength of this South Carolina team.