Oldbear83 said:

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There is one in the Bible who always attacks and accuses.

Might not be a good plan to copy his style, brother.

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Like what you're doing right now?

You really aren't the one to hand out judgements as you're doing. You really aren't.

You continue to do you.

I was told to warn you, and did so.

Peace unto you, then.

Oldbear83 said:

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You continue to do you.

I was told to warn you, and did so.

Peace unto you, then.

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Yes, I will continue to argue for the truth with substance. And you will continue to oppose me without substance, attacking me for whatever motivations you think I have, which are clear projections of your own psyche. You will also continue to cower from calling out clear idolatry and heresy as you promote the mentality that Christians should not be standing for the truth against false beliefs because it's "pride" to do so.

"I was told to warn you... " - as wrong as you've been, maybe you shouldn't be listening to this voice.

I listen to the Holy Spirit. The voice you heed tells you to insult and assault.

Oldbear83 said:

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I listen to the Holy Spirit. The voice you heed tells you to insult and assault.

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Says the guy who has made a living here insulting and assaulting others in his constant and petty back and forths in virtually every thread he engages in. The guy who constantly lodges personal attacks on me for simply asking him questions and challenging his views and calling him out for dodging them. The guy who literally called me Satan, directly and indirectly, many times.

And regarding your views - you are steeped in just as much deception as the RC's and Orthodox are. This has been clearlly revealed by the many things you've said. I truly, truly doubt that it was the Holy Spirit who caused you to:

• continuously cower from calling out clear Marian idolatry and heresy and other clearly false Roman Catholic or Orthodox beliefs;
• shame Christians from standing for the truth against false teaching;
• constantly project your own selfish motivations and pride onto others and then criticize them for it;
• fail to discern that a person who rejects the Bible as God's word, who believes the church should validate homosexual couples, and who believes that Islam is one of the "many paths to the narrow gate" is NOT a Christian (you fully believe he is a "brother in Christ");
• believe that it was God acting behind the Lady of Guadalupe - the apparition who said to build a church in HER honor, and who is the object of idolatrous worship for many Roman Catholics in Central and South America.
• and so many more utterly, utterly wrong beliefs....

Anyone can claim that they're listening to the Holy Spirit. But you are revealed by your fruits.

Your spirit is venom.

You prove it over and over.

God help you

Oldbear83 said:

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Your spirit is venom.

You prove it over and over.

God help you

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My spirit is to uphold the truth and fight against what's evil and false.

You frequently espouse false beleifs and take utterly wrong stances.

And when you're called out, you constantly play the victim and refuse to humble yourself and acknowledge your error. Rather, you go in the completely opposite direction and play holy and righteous, and cast judgements from your high position.

It's a very problematic pattern. You are essentially immunizing yourself against any correction. The result is you are stuck in a mindtrap and in a mire of false views. This is most definitely NOT from the Holy Spirit.

You only post to attack and insult.

That's an established fact.

The Holy Spirit speaks of a spirit and character which never shows up in your posts.

I am not perfect, but I try to respect where possible, disagree peaceably, and for the most part if disagreement cannot be undone, I move on without looking for a fight.

You have chosen a course that is neither Christian in character nor effective in purpose.

You make every discussion about your opinion, not seeking to serve our Lord.

Oldbear83 said:

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You only post to attack and insult.

That's an established fact.

The Holy Spirit speaks of a spirit and character which never shows up in your posts.

I am not perfect, but I try to respect where possible, disagree peaceably, and for the most part if disagreement cannot be undone, I move on without looking for a fight.

You have chosen a course that is neither Christian in character nor effective in purpose.

You make every discussion about your opinion, not seeking to serve our Lord.

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Show us exactly where I was the one who first "attacked and insulted" you in this latest back and forth. Go ahead, point it out. Show us who it was who began the passive aggressive casting of judgements from his lofty positiion.

We'll be waiting...

Oldbear83 said:

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You only post to attack and insult.

That's an established fact.

The Holy Spirit speaks of a spirit and character which never shows up in your posts.

I am not perfect, but I try to respect where possible, disagree peaceably, and for the most part if disagreement cannot be undone, I move on without looking for a fight.

You have chosen a course that is neither Christian in character nor effective in purpose.

You make every discussion about your opinion, not seeking to serve our Lord.

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You really need to stop claiming you know what is of the Holy Spirit and what isn't, and that you're the one imbued with it while others lack it.

You really do not have the discernment associated with the Holy Spirit. It's plainly obvious from what you have said and stood for, examples of which I clearly laid out above.

Oldbear83 said:

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You have chosen a course that is neither Christian in character nor effective in purpose.

You make every discussion about your opinion, not seeking to serve our Lord.

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You obviously have no idea what Christian character entails. Christians are not all supposed to be warm and fuzzy, but also stand for what's true at the expense of being hated and being called names (sound familiar?)

As for my "effectiveness" - just because you don't see it, doesn't mean that I haven't been effective. In fact, I'm encouraged that you don't see it.

I make every discussion about MY opinion? What an outright lie. I engage others' opinions, and invite their arguments against mine. I tried doing that many times with you, but you always end up dodging the argument and playing the victim, calling me a "Pharisee" and "bully" for holding you to your argument. It's a very tiring and pathetic pattern. Everyone has seen it and knows this is what you do.

What is "serving the Lord"? I'll tell you, I sure don't think it's cowering from identifying Marian idolatry and heresy when dealing with Catholics. I sure don't think it's making Catholics or others comfortable in their beliefs which are leading them to Hell. Once again, you'd be better off worrying about the plank in your own eye.

More attacks from a man who has no other mode.

BusyTarpDuster2017 said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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You only post to attack and insult.

That's an established fact.

The Holy Spirit speaks of a spirit and character which never shows up in your posts.

I am not perfect, but I try to respect where possible, disagree peaceably, and for the most part if disagreement cannot be undone, I move on without looking for a fight.

You have chosen a course that is neither Christian in character nor effective in purpose.

You make every discussion about your opinion, not seeking to serve our Lord.

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Show us exactly where I was the one who first "attacked and insulted" you in this latest back and forth. Go ahead, point it out. Show us who it was who began the passive aggressive casting of judgements from his lofty positiion.

We'll be waiting...

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Still waiting, OldBear.

It's dangerous for anyone to pretend they are morally above everyone else in the room as you always do, BTD.

I gave you insight, you refuse to heed it.

Sadly the same as ever, your opposition to changing course.

Oldbear83 said:

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It's dangerous for anyone to pretend they are morally above everyone else in the room as you always do, BTD.

I gave you insight, you refuse to heed it.

Sadly the same as ever, your opposition to changing course.

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What a joke. You are the one who acts "morally above" everyone else. You were the one first doling out personal moral judgements. It's all there in this thread for all to see.

I challenged you to specifically point out where I first "attacked" you, and as usual you came up empty. Probably because, as everyone can see for themself, you were the one who attacked first.

This is your pattern: you make a wrong statement; you get corrected; your pride gets hurt, so you "retaliate" by attacking that person's behavior as un-Christian, even satanic; you get called out for that; then you play the victim and holier-than-thou, insisting that you "have the Holy Spirit" and the other person doesn't so that person should listen to you.

Pathetic.

As far as your "insight" is concerned, no thank you. I've shown just how badly flawed your "insight" is. No one should be heeding your "insight" at all.

The one that needs to change course is you. You're the one who is holding to really bad views. You're the one who always conducts himself poorly and in bad faith. NO TRUE CHRISTIAN would EVER fail or refuse to identify the crediting and glorifying of Mary for salvation as pure heresy and idolatry, as you continually fail and refuse to do. This is NOT from the Holy Spirit. There is something really, really wrong going on here with you.

Still nothing of the Holy Spirit in BTD's posts.

Only anger and attacks.

Oldbear83 said:

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Still nothing of the Holy Spirit in BTD's posts.

Only anger and attacks.

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I call out ALL bs, not just from Roman Catholicism and Orthodoxy. And you are one of the most prolific dispensers of it.

And if you don't recognize the Holy Spirit in me, then I consider that a really good sign.

"We destroy arguments and every lofty opinion raised against the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ" - 2 Corinthians 10:5

Soooooooooooooo much anger, so little attention to Christ's example.

Oldbear83 said:

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Soooooooooooooo much anger, so little attention to Christ's example.

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You've already said that. That's all you know to say. You can't defend your views or your behavior, and you are one-dimensional. You don't even know Christ's example. He overturned the money changers' tables and drove them out of the temple with a whip.

It's views and behavior like yours that taints Christianity, much like how the money changers tainted the temple. Jesus was defending his Father's house against that nonsense. You similarly need to be driven out with the metaphorical whip.

As long as you continue to show none of the signs of the Spirit, my replies to you will necessarily stay focused on that problem you have.

10:57p
Have a great Labor Day weekemd everyone

Oldbear83 said:

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As long as you continue to show none of the signs of the Spirit, my replies to you will necessarily stay focused on that problem you have.

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Someone who is as badly wrong as you are as often as you are, I take it as a really good sign that you don't see the same spirit in me as you see in yourself. So thank you.

It's ok to disagree, but there is no reason to be rude to each other.

xfrodobagginsx said:

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It's ok to disagree, but there is no reason to be rude to each other.

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Read through BTD's posts. The man is about as Christian as was Caiaphas or Herod.

Oldbear83 said:

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xfrodobagginsx said:

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It's ok to disagree, but there is no reason to be rude to each other.

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Read through BTD's posts. The man is about as Christian as was Caiaphas or Herod.

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Some of the rudest people I have encountered claim to be Christians, but I can't judge their Salvation.

Oldbear83 said:

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xfrodobagginsx said:

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It's ok to disagree, but there is no reason to be rude to each other.

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Read through BTD's posts. The man is about as Christian as was Caiaphas or Herod.

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And again... clearly, as I have laid out, your discernment over what is a "Christian" is highly suspect. I am encouraged that we do not resonate.

xfrodobagginsx said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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xfrodobagginsx said:

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It's ok to disagree, but there is no reason to be rude to each other.

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Read through BTD's posts. The man is about as Christian as was Caiaphas or Herod.

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Some of the rudest people I have encountered claim to be Christians, but I can't judge their Salvation.

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Don't confuse telling the truth that someone needs to hear as being "rude". He is following his usual playbook of attacking someone's "Christianity" every time he gets called out and corrected. I reminded him that due to his past statements and assessments that have been very faulty to say the least, that perhaps he is not in the position to judge.

BusyTarpDuster vs Oldbear83:

Let's see who really practices true Biblical Christianity:

I ask you both, How Exactly Does A Man Get To Heaven When He Dies?

xfrodobagginsx said:

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BusyTarpDuster vs Oldbear83:

Let's see who really practices true Biblical Christianity:

I ask you both, How Exactly Does A Man Get To Heaven When He Dies?

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Well first, interesting choice of Capitalization. But two things occurred to me as I read your question:

I found it odd that you seemed to phrase this as a contest to see who is, what, the better Christian or the 'real' Christian? I think that even though we disagree on many points, BusyTarpDuster would agree that spreading the Gospel is not a competition, nor are we to focus on personal scoreboards. Our Lord desires that everyone who can be saved, will be so, and each of us serve according to God's will and our obedience.

Next, I must say it's odd to hear a Christian talk about Heaven as a 'someday' destination, when Christ plainly told us,

"Once, on being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, Jesus replied, "The coming of the kingdom of God is not something that can be observed, nor will people say, 'Here it is,' or 'There it is,' because the kingdom of God is in your midst." Luke 17:20-21

So often people seem to miss that the blessings of being a follower of Christ start as soon as you accept Him. God hears prayers and answers them, and having the counsel of the Holy Spirit is a resource beyond price.

Having said that, I believe your curiosity was about Salvation. I think we can trust the Bible to tell us what someone is like, who walks rightly with God.

"But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you"

Matthew 5:44

"Jesus replied: "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.' "This is the first and greatest commandment. "And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbor as yourself'."

Matthew 22:37-39


"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law"

Galatians 5:22-23

"Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you"

Ephesians 4:32

The way is made clear.

Besides, once we come to know who Christ is, wouldn't we all want to become more like Him as best we may?

.

Oldbear83 said:

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xfrodobagginsx said:

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BusyTarpDuster vs Oldbear83:

Let's see who really practices true Biblical Christianity:

I ask you both, How Exactly Does A Man Get To Heaven When He Dies?

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Well first, interesting choice of Capitalization. But two things occurred to me as I read your question:

I found it odd that you seemed to phrase this as a contest to see who is, what, the better Christian or the 'real' Christian? I think that even though we disagree on many points, BusyTarpDuster would agree that spreading the Gospel is not a competition, nor are we to focus on personal scoreboards. Our Lord desires that everyone who can be saved, will be so, and each of us serve according to God's will and our obedience.

Next, I must say it's odd to hear a Christian talk about Heaven as a 'someday' destination, when Christ plainly told us,

"Once, on being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, Jesus replied, "The coming of the kingdom of God is not something that can be observed, nor will people say, 'Here it is,' or 'There it is,' because the kingdom of God is in your midst." Luke 17:20-21

So often people seem to miss that the blessings of being a follower of Christ start as soon as you accept Him. God hears prayers and answers them, and having the counsel of the Holy Spirit is a resource beyond price.

Having said that, I believe your curiosity was about Salvation. I think we can trust the Bible to tell us what someone is like, who walks rightly with God.

"But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you"

Matthew 5:44

"Jesus replied: "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.' "This is the first and greatest commandment. "And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbor as yourself'."

Matthew 22:37-39


"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law"

Galatians 5:22-23

"Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you"

Ephesians 4:32

The way is made clear.

Besides, once we come to know who Christ is, wouldn't we all want to become more like Him as best we may?

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-When a Christian dies, they go to heaven.
-The reason that Jesus said that the Kingdom of Heaven is in your midst is because Christ was in our midst.
-Since Christ went back to heaven, He is no longer in our midst.
-When He returns after the great Trubulation period ends, He will set up His Kindmgdkm.
-Those instructions Christ gave are not instructions for us to get to heaven. They are for those living in the Kingdom age after He returns.

-Paul receieved the instructuons from the risen Christ about how to be saved as one living in the Church age of grace as we are.

Romans 10:9-10, 13 KJV
[9] that if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. [10] For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
[13] For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Read this first post.

xfrodobagginsx said:

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BusyTarpDuster vs Oldbear83:

Let's see who really practices true Biblical Christianity:

I ask you both, How Exactly Does A Man Get To Heaven When He Dies?

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Sorry, frodo, I missed this post. Here's my late reply:

A person goes to heaven when they die, if in their heart they believe in the testimony of the gospel, given to us through the inspired word of God - that Jesus was sent by God, that he was crucified and died for our sins, that he was truly dead and buried, and that he was raised from the dead and now is alive for all eternity with the authority as Lord; and that they place their faith and trust in Jesus' promise that if they believe in him and in what he did, he Jesus will raise them to eternal life as well, to be with God forever.

Jesus is still on our midst. The difference is that His presence is not physical. It's spiritual. He promised to be with us until the end of the age.