100%. Great point. The U.S. will continue to increase defense spending, and every Euro country would increase defense spending at record levels.ATL Bear said:Russian victory in Ukraine would be more valuable to the defense industry than the trickle of relatively inexpensive weaponry we're sending now. A greater direct Russian threat would only lead to the justifiable necessity for the really expensive defensive and offensive armaments and positions.Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.
Why Are We in Ukraine?
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Last: 48 min ago by whiterock
LOL recto-cranial inversion at its finest!Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
The Russo-Ukrainian War is all about Russia getting Russian bases closer to Nato.
I mean, duh. We admitted 4 SSRs and 5 WP members to Nato.....but did NOT permanently base anything in those countries. Russia, on the other hand, wants to subsume Ukraine back into the Russian state. Published but not widely publicized: that NATO policy is changing. Germany is building a permanent base in Lithuania in the Sulwalki Gap and will station a brigade there, fully operational by 2027. THAT is a direct response to what Russia did in Ukraine. It's barely noted in press, but a huge policy shift.
Daughter (home now for holidays) was selected to represent our C&GS schools on a visit to Germany C&GS schools last month. Got to hear the DC/Nato (Dutch admiral) speak to the class (in English) escorted by German 3-star. Not an official or public meeting, so discussions were very frank, surprisingly so. When German 3* commented on likely need for conscription (and related complications of such) due to manpower shortages, Dutch ADM joked "you guys didn't have any problems with conscription in WWII so you'll figure it out." (class laughed nervously, but generals guffawed.) Both agreed that Trump started the reawakening in Nato (that US support would not go on forever without greater EUR participation), and Russian invasion of Ukraine was the clarion call. EUR powers are laser focused on exactly the threats I have laid out (and you & others have dismissed) about Russian intentions. Daughter pointed to Suwalki Gap base as example.
War is coming to Europe, gentlemen.
The only question is will we be ready for it.
If the critics of our Russo-Ukraine war policy get their way, we will not.
We are more ready than Russia, thanks to what's happened in UKR so far, but far below deterrence levels.
And policy critics are dead-set on teaching Russia that Nato does not have to will to win.
Quote:
War is coming to Europe, gentlemen.
When you start with a false premise, all your conclusions will be wrong. We managed to get through the decades of the cold war without it turning hot. If a hot war comes to Europe now - after the dissolution of the Warsaw pact and the abandonment of communism by those nations - it is a failure of our diplomacy that caused it.
Geez.Realitybites said:Quote:
War is coming to Europe, gentlemen.
When you start with a false premise, all your conclusions will be wrong. We managed to get through the decades of the cold war without it turning hot. If a hot war comes to Europe now - after the dissolution of the Warsaw pact and the abandonment of communism by those nations - it is a failure of our diplomacy that caused it.
I fought in the Cold War. You are a frickin' idiot on national security.
whiterock said:
I fought in the Cold War. You are a frickin' idiot on national security.
Hiroo Onoda, the last Imperial Japanese soldier in the Philippines surrendered in 1974, 29 years after V-J day.
You're at 32 years and counting...congratulations.
Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
Mr. Treehorn treats objects like women, man.
trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
There was a reality all around him and he could not see it, refused to see it. Just like you.Realitybites said:whiterock said:
I fought in the Cold War. You are a frickin' idiot on national security.
Hiroo Onoda, the last Imperial Japanese soldier in the Philippines surrendered in 1974, 29 years after V-J day.
You're at 32 years and counting...congratulations.
whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
Do you truly believe Putin invaded to prevent NATO membership?
If that was his main goal he could have got that deal anytime in exchange for giving Ukraine its land back. He could get that deal right now in fact.
And you're ignoring countless Putin and crony statements about Ukraine's illegitimacy and wanting to reconstitute old Soviet block.
NATO would never invade Russia, and Putin knows that.
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
Bottom line, zero chance this was about NATO.
sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
Do you truly believe Putin invaded to prevent NATO membership?
If that was his main goal he could have got that deal anytime in exchange for giving Ukraine its land back. He could get that deal right now in fact.
And you're ignoring countless Putin and crony statements about Ukraine's illegitimacy and wanting to reconstitute old Soviet block.
NATO would never invade Russia, and Putin knows that.
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
Bottom line, zero chance this was about NATO.
100% correct.
Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
1. Ukraine is not a democracy. In fact it's one of the most corrupt nations on earth. The most corrupt in Europe.
2. Would the Russian Federation be a geopolitical foe if we had not expanded a hostile military alliance up to its borders since 1992?
sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
Get ready for the usual pro-RU talking points.
Bear8084 said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
Get ready for the usual pro-RU talking points.
As opposed to the talking points directly out of the Biden State Department and NPR?
I would hope you would agree that both Moscow and DC can not be trusted to give anyone the truth.
Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
Get ready for the usual pro-RU talking points.
As opposed to the talking points directly out of the Biden State Department and NPR?
I would hope you would agree that both Moscow and DC can not be trusted to give anyone the truth.
Well you post all the Moscow talking points and boost every conspiracy theory idiot on Twitter out there....soooooooo.....
Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
Get ready for the usual pro-RU talking points.
As opposed to the talking points directly out of the Biden State Department and NPR?
I would hope you would agree that both Moscow and DC can not be trusted to give anyone the truth.
Well you post all the Moscow talking points and boost every conspiracy theory idiot on Twitter out there....soooooooo.....
Name them….especially the "conspiracy theories"
What "conspiracy theories" have I posted?
Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
Get ready for the usual pro-RU talking points.
As opposed to the talking points directly out of the Biden State Department and NPR?
I would hope you would agree that both Moscow and DC can not be trusted to give anyone the truth.
Well you post all the Moscow talking points and boost every conspiracy theory idiot on Twitter out there....soooooooo.....
Name them….especially the "conspiracy theories"
What "conspiracy theories" have I posted?
You're old enough to figure it out, or I'll call you out when you do.
Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
Get ready for the usual pro-RU talking points.
As opposed to the talking points directly out of the Biden State Department and NPR?
I would hope you would agree that both Moscow and DC can not be trusted to give anyone the truth.
Well you post all the Moscow talking points and boost every conspiracy theory idiot on Twitter out there....soooooooo.....
Name them….especially the "conspiracy theories"
What "conspiracy theories" have I posted?
You're old enough to figure it out, or I'll call you out when you do.
Is that your way of saying "I don't know and I am embarrassed that I can't think of any when he called my butt out"
Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
Get ready for the usual pro-RU talking points.
As opposed to the talking points directly out of the Biden State Department and NPR?
I would hope you would agree that both Moscow and DC can not be trusted to give anyone the truth.
Well you post all the Moscow talking points and boost every conspiracy theory idiot on Twitter out there....soooooooo.....
Name them….especially the "conspiracy theories"
What "conspiracy theories" have I posted?
You're old enough to figure it out, or I'll call you out when you do.
Is that your way of saying "I don't know and I am embarrassed that I can't think of any when he called my butt out"
Oh I do know and have called your idiot pro-RU butt out about it before.
Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
Get ready for the usual pro-RU talking points.
As opposed to the talking points directly out of the Biden State Department and NPR?
I would hope you would agree that both Moscow and DC can not be trusted to give anyone the truth.
Well you post all the Moscow talking points and boost every conspiracy theory idiot on Twitter out there....soooooooo.....
Name them….especially the "conspiracy theories"
What "conspiracy theories" have I posted?
You're old enough to figure it out, or I'll call you out when you do.
Is that your way of saying "I don't know and I am embarrassed that I can't think of any when he called my butt out"
Oh I do know and have called your idiot pro-RU butt out about it before.
Yea, you have really added a lot to this discussion forum.
Again, what "Conspiracy theories" did I post.
Just name one…surely you can name one little tiny conspiracy theory?
Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
Get ready for the usual pro-RU talking points.
As opposed to the talking points directly out of the Biden State Department and NPR?
I would hope you would agree that both Moscow and DC can not be trusted to give anyone the truth.
Well you post all the Moscow talking points and boost every conspiracy theory idiot on Twitter out there....soooooooo.....
Name them….especially the "conspiracy theories"
What "conspiracy theories" have I posted?
You're old enough to figure it out, or I'll call you out when you do.
Is that your way of saying "I don't know and I am embarrassed that I can't think of any when he called my butt out"
Oh I do know and have called your idiot pro-RU butt out about it before.
Yea, you have really added a lot to this discussion forum.
Again, what "Conspiracy theories" did I post.
Just name one…surely you can name one little tiny conspiracy theory?
That this was about Nazis. That Zelensky fled Kyiv. That we led a coup. That for us it is all about helping defense companies. That Zelensky is antisemitic.
sombear said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
Get ready for the usual pro-RU talking points.
As opposed to the talking points directly out of the Biden State Department and NPR?
I would hope you would agree that both Moscow and DC can not be trusted to give anyone the truth.
Well you post all the Moscow talking points and boost every conspiracy theory idiot on Twitter out there....soooooooo.....
Name them….especially the "conspiracy theories"
What "conspiracy theories" have I posted?
You're old enough to figure it out, or I'll call you out when you do.
Is that your way of saying "I don't know and I am embarrassed that I can't think of any when he called my butt out"
Oh I do know and have called your idiot pro-RU butt out about it before.
Yea, you have really added a lot to this discussion forum.
Again, what "Conspiracy theories" did I post.
Just name one…surely you can name one little tiny conspiracy theory?
That this was about Nazis. That Zelensky fled Kyiv. That we led a coup. That for us it is all about helping defense companies. That Zelensky is antisemitic.
lol I never said Zelensky is anti-Semitic…he is Jewish after all!
Where did you get that from lol?
I also never said the war was over Nazis….in fact I have said specifically that Putin's excuse of "de-Nazification" was propaganda. Though Ukraine does have neo-Nazi fighters (Azov, Right sector, ect.)
The CIA and State department role in the Maidan Revolution/coup is also open for debate…at the very least it's not a conspiracy theory it's a point of contention.
Anything else?
I'll discuss any and all with you
It may (like many countries) be a corrupt democracy, but it's a democracy nonetheless.
Yes, Russia would still very much be a primary geopolitical foe. Putin abhors everything about the U.S. and its allies. He's a dictator/tolitarianand wannabe socialist/communist who exerts international influence as much or more than we do and aligns with our worst enemies.
Yes, Russia would still very much be a primary geopolitical foe. Putin abhors everything about the U.S. and its allies. He's a dictator/tolitarianand wannabe socialist/communist who exerts international influence as much or more than we do and aligns with our worst enemies.
NATO will be a paper tiger after this war, and we'll all be better off. It's the biggest threat to stability in Europe if not the world.Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
Sam Lowry said:NATO will be a paper tiger after this war, and we'll all be better off. It's the biggest threat to stability in Europe if not the world.Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
Good Lord....speaking of idiots....#1 Putin puffer right there. I can at least see some, some of where Redbrick is coming from. But this is just straight up stupidity.
Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
Get ready for the usual pro-RU talking points.
As opposed to the talking points directly out of the Biden State Department and NPR?
I would hope you would agree that both Moscow and DC can not be trusted to give anyone the truth.
Well you post all the Moscow talking points and boost every conspiracy theory idiot on Twitter out there....soooooooo.....
Name them….especially the "conspiracy theories"
What "conspiracy theories" have I posted?
You're old enough to figure it out, or I'll call you out when you do.
Is that your way of saying "I don't know and I am embarrassed that I can't think of any when he called my butt out"
Oh I do know and have called your idiot pro-RU butt out about it before.
Yea, you have really added a lot to this discussion forum.
Again, what "Conspiracy theories" did I post.
Just name one…surely you can name one little tiny conspiracy theory?
That this was about Nazis. That Zelensky fled Kyiv. That we led a coup. That for us it is all about helping defense companies. That Zelensky is antisemitic.
lol I never said Zelensky is anti-Semitic…he is Jewish after all!
Where did you get this that lol?
I also never said the war was over Nazis….in fact I have made specifically said Putin's excuse of "de-Nazification" was propaganda. Thought Ukraine does have neo-Nazi fighters (Azov, Right sector, ect.)
The CIA and State department role in the Maidan Revolution/coup is also open for debate…at the very least it's not a conspiracy theory it's a point of contention.
Anything else?
You posted all of those things early on. For sake of accuracy, I'm not sure you said Zelensky himself was, but you said Ukraine and its gov was, and I responded that Ukrainian Jews are happier in Ukraine than any other Euro and that Zelensky was Jewish.
You also beat the nazi drum to death.
There is not a shred of evidence we led a coup. Even the BS about the superhero V Nuland took place well after the protests had started and after the government fired on protestors. There is nothing in dispute. It's a wild and reckless conspiracy theory first pushed by Russia on state tv.
sombear said:
Putin abhors everything about the U.S. and its allies. He's a dictator/tolitarianand wannabe socialist/communist who exerts international influence as much or more than we do and aligns with our worst enemies.
He is not a wanna be dictator…he essentially is one.
Not sure about the "hating everything the US and our allies". He has said some very positive stuff about the USA in the past.
He is also no communist or socialist. He was a KGB atheist at one point and now pretends to be a Russian orthodox Christian.
Pretty obvious he is a chameleon figure who will say whatever he needs to so that he can stay in power.
I don't think he has deep beliefs…and his regime is more oligarchy and kleptocracy than anything else.
Liberals in the USA call him a Nazi.
You seem to think he is a Communist.
If anything he larps as a Russian nationalist for domestic consumption.
sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:Redbrickbear said:Bear8084 said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
One, oppose and weaken a primary geopolitical foe without committing troops. Two, support a democracy that wants to align with us. Three, support our Euro allies.
Get ready for the usual pro-RU talking points.
As opposed to the talking points directly out of the Biden State Department and NPR?
I would hope you would agree that both Moscow and DC can not be trusted to give anyone the truth.
Well you post all the Moscow talking points and boost every conspiracy theory idiot on Twitter out there....soooooooo.....
Name them….especially the "conspiracy theories"
What "conspiracy theories" have I posted?
You're old enough to figure it out, or I'll call you out when you do.
Is that your way of saying "I don't know and I am embarrassed that I can't think of any when he called my butt out"
Oh I do know and have called your idiot pro-RU butt out about it before.
Yea, you have really added a lot to this discussion forum.
Again, what "Conspiracy theories" did I post.
Just name one…surely you can name one little tiny conspiracy theory?
That this was about Nazis. That Zelensky fled Kyiv. That we led a coup. That for us it is all about helping defense companies. That Zelensky is antisemitic.
lol I never said Zelensky is anti-Semitic…he is Jewish after all!
Where did you get this that lol?
I also never said the war was over Nazis….in fact I have made specifically said Putin's excuse of "de-Nazification" was propaganda. Thought Ukraine does have neo-Nazi fighters (Azov, Right sector, ect.)
The CIA and State department role in the Maidan Revolution/coup is also open for debate…at the very least it's not a conspiracy theory it's a point of contention.
Anything else?
You posted all of those things early on. For sake of accuracy, I'm not sure you said Zelensky himself was, but you said Ukraine and its gov was, and I responded that Ukrainian Jews are happier in Ukraine than any other Euro and that Zelensky was Jewish.
You also beat the nazi drum to death.
There is not a shred of evidence we led a coup. Even the BS about the superhero V Nuland took place well after the protests….
1. The Nazi thing was in response to how the ruling class in the USA is hyper sensitive to "Nazis"….always calling their domestic enemies at home Nazis. While ignoring that in Ukraine there are of course actual Nazis fighting for the government and supported (at least in weapons) by the same progressives.
Its an interesting piece of progressive and DC liberal hypocrisy.
I have said before Putin, who claims to be fighting those Nazis, would like them if they were Moscow supporters.
2. The coup remains debatable.
If you don't think Nuland, the CIA, and the State department had any role…fair enough that is your right.
But to say it's a "conspiracy theory" is ludicrous…it's actually a well debated issue in terms of what the Western involvement was in the revolution of dignity/coup in Kyiv.
Redbrickbear said:sombear said:
Putin abhors everything about the U.S. and its allies. He's a dictator/tolitarianand wannabe socialist/communist who exerts international influence as much or more than we do and aligns with our worst enemies.
He is not a wanna be dictator…he essentially is one.
Not sure about the "hating everything the US and our allies". He has said some very positive stuff about the USA in the past.
He is also no communist or socialist. He was a KGB atheist at one point and now pretends to be a Russian orthodox Christian.
Pretty obvious he is a chameleon figure who will say whatever he needs to so that he can stay in power.
I don't think he has deep beliefs…and his regime is more oligarchy and kleptocracy than anything else.
Liberals in the USA call him a Nazi.
You seem to think he is a Communist.
If anything he larps as a Russian nationalist for domestic consumption.
I didn't say wannabe dictator. He is one. I do believe he is a wannabe communist. That's based on decades of public statements, how his gov controls many industries, and personal conversations that my colleagues have had with him over the years.
And, yes, he despises us and our way of like to his core.
I'm sure you'll be right this time. Keep hoping for that Ukrainian birtzkrieg against Crimea. Meanwhile the Russians have taken the initiative. Ukes are falling back to defensive positions, which will not hold. The only question is how much more territory Russia will take. Kharkiv to be sure, and maybe Odessa as well.Bear8084 said:Sam Lowry said:NATO will be a paper tiger after this war, and we'll all be better off. It's the biggest threat to stability in Europe if not the world.Redbrickbear said:sombear said:Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:the excuses for what? What? What is Putin fighting for? Say it.Redbrickbear said:trey3216 said:Ironic you admit that quietly about fighting Nazis now considering earlier in this war you were making comments affirming how Russia was fighting real Nazis.Redbrickbear said:whiterock said:Doc Holliday said:White guilt is woke nonsense.trey3216 said:Your "Western Guilt" sounds exactly like the ultra-progressives "White Guilt". Go far enough one way and you're the exact same person you bltch about on the other side.Doc Holliday said:If the west couldn't capitalize on the situation then the west would be indifferent.whiterock said:so, again. you think the Ukrainian people are completely indifferent as to whether their government is in Kyiv or Moscow?Doc Holliday said:The motivation for all parties is profit. Imperial ambition is the same thing as seeking profit: capturing land, ownership, people.whiterock said:Dude. Are you seriously saying that the ONLY interests which benefit from supporting Ukrainian defense of their territory are western banks/corporations? That western banks/corporations start every war just to make money? No one in Russia makes a dime from war?Doc Holliday said:
Putting Ukrainians through the meat grinder = profit for western banks/corporations.
When are y'all going to learn that the last 70 years has been 100% about MONEY? People worship money, why is this news for y'all?
Western business interests forced Western governments to force Russia to invade Ukraine so that western business interests could make profit from war?
The Cold War was just a business model for western business interests and had nothing to do with Russian imperial ambitions?
Have you lost your ever-lovin' mind?
The Ukrainian government is making out like bandits while the Ukrainian people are getting hoodwinked.
It's not the Ukrainian people's land if they win, it will be either the west or Russia's land. The west will capture it through rebuild: blackrock with $411 BILLION on the table already.
Same situation is happening elsewhere and we don't give a damn.
Banks and mega corporations bankrolling politicians to benefit themselves is a FACT.
Putin got the 'Lord of War/Merchant of Death' Viktor Bout released in exchange for petty dope fiend basketball player Brittney Griner, We're not serious people my guy. Its embarrassing.
There's a reason why DC won't do anything about mass illegal immigration, healthcare costs, inflation and any of the other insane bs screwing the middle class. It has everything to do with who benefits financially from these problems. How can America help Ukraine when we can't even stop millions of illegals from crossing the border, can't stop fentanyl, lost in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and so on?
Ukraine is exhausting its young combatants and their injuries will be chronic/long lasting. Further they loses their labor productivity. They'll have a country of old men, also wounded, that have no positive economic yield. Taxes cant cover this cost.
Anybody who is actually familiar with the defense industry, listens to every earnings call and etc, knew the Ukraine war was gonna have a short shelf life and asymmetrical advantage to Russia once they got air cover and their defense industry ramped up.
Economics of war isn't new.a reminder what military aid to ukraine prevents:
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) December 19, 2023
if kyiv fell, projected military bases on the border with nato pic.twitter.com/Iz6sZER61i
So this war was always about getting NATO military bases closer to Russia?
Good to see people are dropping the charade that the war in Ukraine was being conducted by the US leadership to "save democracy".
About as ludicrous as Putin's "we are going into Ukraine to fight Nazis"
It was and is all about geo-strategic military power plays
I affirmed there were and are neo-Nazis fighting with the Ukrainian forces.
I didn't try to deny that inconvenient fact (like you did)
It's also just obvious that Putin does not care anymore about fighting against nazism than our ruling class cares about fighting for democracy….both are excuses
Keep Ukraine out of NATO.
Keep the Black Sea fleet at their current base.
What are we fighting for again? Why are we wasting billions?
And as another poster rightly stated, NATO will be stronger after this war.
NATO was strong before the war. Of course it would be strong after it. It's a military alliance of of 30 nations and 900 million people…and some of those are the most economically powerful countries on earth.
Same thing can't be said for Ukraine.
Again NATO does not need Ukraine….so why is the U.S. ruling class messing around in the country and helping to sponsor coups and proxy wars?
What the purpose of this interference in a country right on Russia's door step?
Good Lord....speaking of idiots....#1 Putin puffer right there. I can at least see some, some of where Redbrick is coming from. But this is just straight up stupidity.
sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:
Putin abhors everything about the U.S. and its allies. He's a dictator/tolitarianand wannabe socialist/communist who exerts international influence as much or more than we do and aligns with our worst enemies.
He is not a wanna be dictator…he essentially is one.
Not sure about the "hating everything the US and our allies". He has said some very positive stuff about the USA in the past.
He is also no communist or socialist. He was a KGB atheist at one point and now pretends to be a Russian orthodox Christian.
Pretty obvious he is a chameleon figure who will say whatever he needs to so that he can stay in power.
I don't think he has deep beliefs…and his regime is more oligarchy and kleptocracy than anything else.
Liberals in the USA call him a Nazi.
You seem to think he is a Communist.
If anything he larps as a Russian nationalist for domestic consumption.
I didn't say wannabe dictator. He is one. I do believe he is a wannabe communist. That's based on decades of….
You are confusing oligarchy and kleptocracy with communism.
There is an ideological component missing
Completely untrue. The one thing you can be sure of is that when someone says "just listen to Putin," there's a 99% chance they're not listening to anything except their own government propaganda.sombear said:Redbrickbear said:sombear said:
Putin abhors everything about the U.S. and its allies. He's a dictator/tolitarianand wannabe socialist/communist who exerts international influence as much or more than we do and aligns with our worst enemies.
He is not a wanna be dictator…he essentially is one.
Not sure about the "hating everything the US and our allies". He has said some very positive stuff about the USA in the past.
He is also no communist or socialist. He was a KGB atheist at one point and now pretends to be a Russian orthodox Christian.
Pretty obvious he is a chameleon figure who will say whatever he needs to so that he can stay in power.
I don't think he has deep beliefs…and his regime is more oligarchy and kleptocracy than anything else.
Liberals in the USA call him a Nazi.
You seem to think he is a Communist.
If anything he larps as a Russian nationalist for domestic consumption.
I didn't say wannabe dictator. He is one. I do believe he is a wannabe communist. That's based on decades of public statements, how his gov controls many industries, and personal conversations that my colleagues have had with him over the years.
And, yes, he despises us and our way of like to his core.