Bidens Pressured Burisma Founder into Paying $10 Million Bribe

99,466 Views | 786 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by Doc Holliday
Big12Bear
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Jack Bauer
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Sure, Dan.

Jack Bauer
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Fact Check: FALSE - Joe Biden is "the Big Guy", not "the Big Man"

Jack Bauer
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1) This is not happening
2) This is being misconstrued by the RWNJs about what is really happening
3) This is happening and it's a good thing - <--- NY Times - you are here
4) This is happening and if you oppose it, then you are a Nazi



Jack Bauer
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"Nothing shady is going on with Hunter Biden and his overseas business."

"Hunter's laptop is Russian disinformation."

"Okay, the laptop is real but it doesn't prove anything."

"There is no proof who 'the Big Guy' is."

"Okay, the Big Guy is Joe Biden but he still didn't do anything wrong."

"Joe Biden never got paid for Hunter's overseas business dealings."

"Okay, Hunter Biden said Joe got paid but there is no proof."

"Joe Biden had no knowledge of his son's business dealings."

"Okay, Joe knew about the dealings but he didn't partake in them."

"Okay, Joe took business calls with Hunter but they were just talking about the weather!" <---You are here
Jack Bauer
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AYFKM?

Cobretti
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Cobretti
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Cobretti
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HuMcK
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I just found all of these sources that pre-date that email, all saying Shokin was refusing to investigate corruption. Biden must have a time machine or something.

Quote:

The arrests triggered a scandal when evidence emerged that Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin and his deputies Volodymyr Huzyr and Yury Stolyarchuk were trying to pressure Sakvarelidze's investigators to halt the case against Korniyets and Shapakin.
https://archive.kyivpost.com/kyiv-post-plus/release-of-diamond-prosecutor-shows-fatal-flaws-of-law-enforcement-394791.html

Quote:

He called for an investigation of officials within the Prosecutor-General's Office who he says stymied efforts to pursue tens of millions of dollars in "illicit assets" that former Ukrainian official Mykola Zlochevskiy held in Britain.

Zlochevskiy served as environment and natural resources minister under former President Viktor Yanukovych, a Kremlin ally whose ouster amid mass street protests in 2014 triggered events that led to Russia's annexation of Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula and a bloody war with Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine.

Zlochevskiy, who earned a reputation for lavishness, was placed on Ukraine's most-wanted list in December for a host of alleged economic crimes.

Pyatt said that "those responsible for subverting the case" against Zlochevskiy "should -- at a minimum -- be summarily terminated."

Since his appointment by Poroshenko in February, Prosecutor-General Viktor Shokin has faced accusations of stalling high-profile corruption cases against allies of Yanukovych.
https://www.rferl.org/a/us-ambassador-upbraids-ukraine-over-corruption-efforts/27271294.html

Quote:

The current imbroglio centers on Shokin, a Poroshenko ally and protector of the country's corrupt old guard. Ukrainian reformers, including prominent civil society organizations and more than 100 members of the Verkhovna Rada, have demanded that Poroshenko fire Shokina request Poroshenko has ignored.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-poroshenko-s-support-for-shokin-is-dangerous/
Cobretti
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Cobretti
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GrowlTowel
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HuMcK said:

I just found all of these sources that pre-date that email, all saying Shokin was refusing to investigate corruption. Biden must have a time machine or something.

Quote:

The arrests triggered a scandal when evidence emerged that Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin and his deputies Volodymyr Huzyr and Yury Stolyarchuk were trying to pressure Sakvarelidze's investigators to halt the case against Korniyets and Shapakin.
https://archive.kyivpost.com/kyiv-post-plus/release-of-diamond-prosecutor-shows-fatal-flaws-of-law-enforcement-394791.html

Quote:

He called for an investigation of officials within the Prosecutor-General's Office who he says stymied efforts to pursue tens of millions of dollars in "illicit assets" that former Ukrainian official Mykola Zlochevskiy held in Britain.

Zlochevskiy served as environment and natural resources minister under former President Viktor Yanukovych, a Kremlin ally whose ouster amid mass street protests in 2014 triggered events that led to Russia's annexation of Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula and a bloody war with Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine.

Zlochevskiy, who earned a reputation for lavishness, was placed on Ukraine's most-wanted list in December for a host of alleged economic crimes.

Pyatt said that "those responsible for subverting the case" against Zlochevskiy "should -- at a minimum -- be summarily terminated."

Since his appointment by Poroshenko in February, Prosecutor-General Viktor Shokin has faced accusations of stalling high-profile corruption cases against allies of Yanukovych.
https://www.rferl.org/a/us-ambassador-upbraids-ukraine-over-corruption-efforts/27271294.html

Quote:

The current imbroglio centers on Shokin, a Poroshenko ally and protector of the country's corrupt old guard. Ukrainian reformers, including prominent civil society organizations and more than 100 members of the Verkhovna Rada, have demanded that Poroshenko fire Shokina request Poroshenko has ignored.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-poroshenko-s-support-for-shokin-is-dangerous/
Doc Holliday
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HuMcK said:

I just found all of these sources that pre-date that email, all saying Shokin was refusing to investigate corruption. Biden must have a time machine or something.

Quote:

The arrests triggered a scandal when evidence emerged that Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin and his deputies Volodymyr Huzyr and Yury Stolyarchuk were trying to pressure Sakvarelidze's investigators to halt the case against Korniyets and Shapakin.
https://archive.kyivpost.com/kyiv-post-plus/release-of-diamond-prosecutor-shows-fatal-flaws-of-law-enforcement-394791.html

Quote:

He called for an investigation of officials within the Prosecutor-General's Office who he says stymied efforts to pursue tens of millions of dollars in "illicit assets" that former Ukrainian official Mykola Zlochevskiy held in Britain.

Zlochevskiy served as environment and natural resources minister under former President Viktor Yanukovych, a Kremlin ally whose ouster amid mass street protests in 2014 triggered events that led to Russia's annexation of Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula and a bloody war with Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine.

Zlochevskiy, who earned a reputation for lavishness, was placed on Ukraine's most-wanted list in December for a host of alleged economic crimes.

Pyatt said that "those responsible for subverting the case" against Zlochevskiy "should -- at a minimum -- be summarily terminated."

Since his appointment by Poroshenko in February, Prosecutor-General Viktor Shokin has faced accusations of stalling high-profile corruption cases against allies of Yanukovych.
https://www.rferl.org/a/us-ambassador-upbraids-ukraine-over-corruption-efforts/27271294.html

Quote:

The current imbroglio centers on Shokin, a Poroshenko ally and protector of the country's corrupt old guard. Ukrainian reformers, including prominent civil society organizations and more than 100 members of the Verkhovna Rada, have demanded that Poroshenko fire Shokina request Poroshenko has ignored.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-poroshenko-s-support-for-shokin-is-dangerous/
Nah

Shokin began seizing Zlochevsky's property as part of his inevestigation in Feb of 2016:

https://www.kyivpost.com/post/10691

A month later is when Biden threatened to withold aid unless Shokin was fired or taken off the case. The new prosecutor closed the case.

This in addition to money wired to their shell companies.
Jack Bauer
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Cobretti said:



"Hello, person who I would like to get a lot of money from. Here is my father, the VP of the USA. He would like to talk to you about the weather"

HuMcK
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Doc Holliday said:

HuMcK said:

I just found all of these sources that pre-date that email, all saying Shokin was refusing to investigate corruption. Biden must have a time machine or something.

Quote:

The arrests triggered a scandal when evidence emerged that Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin and his deputies Volodymyr Huzyr and Yury Stolyarchuk were trying to pressure Sakvarelidze's investigators to halt the case against Korniyets and Shapakin.
https://archive.kyivpost.com/kyiv-post-plus/release-of-diamond-prosecutor-shows-fatal-flaws-of-law-enforcement-394791.html

Quote:

He called for an investigation of officials within the Prosecutor-General's Office who he says stymied efforts to pursue tens of millions of dollars in "illicit assets" that former Ukrainian official Mykola Zlochevskiy held in Britain.

Zlochevskiy served as environment and natural resources minister under former President Viktor Yanukovych, a Kremlin ally whose ouster amid mass street protests in 2014 triggered events that led to Russia's annexation of Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula and a bloody war with Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine.

Zlochevskiy, who earned a reputation for lavishness, was placed on Ukraine's most-wanted list in December for a host of alleged economic crimes.

Pyatt said that "those responsible for subverting the case" against Zlochevskiy "should -- at a minimum -- be summarily terminated."

Since his appointment by Poroshenko in February, Prosecutor-General Viktor Shokin has faced accusations of stalling high-profile corruption cases against allies of Yanukovych.
https://www.rferl.org/a/us-ambassador-upbraids-ukraine-over-corruption-efforts/27271294.html

Quote:

The current imbroglio centers on Shokin, a Poroshenko ally and protector of the country's corrupt old guard. Ukrainian reformers, including prominent civil society organizations and more than 100 members of the Verkhovna Rada, have demanded that Poroshenko fire Shokina request Poroshenko has ignored.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-poroshenko-s-support-for-shokin-is-dangerous/
Nah

Shokin began seizing Zlochevsky's property as part of his inevestigation in Feb of 2016:

https://www.kyivpost.com/post/10691
February of 2016, eh? That would have been at least three months after Biden demanded his firing (which was actually in December 2015, your edit is incorrect and I have no idea where your date came from), and about six months after then-US Ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyatt publicly called for him to be fired (meaning it wasn't actually Biden making the demand, it was the US Government). Shokin was ultimately fired in March 2016, after taking office in February of 2015.

That means Shokin sat on the case and took no actions for a full year, even though he was being publicly called out for not investigating Zlochevsky in particular, and only made a move once it became clear how obvious his obstruction was and after we had already demanded his removal.

Nobody in here will care, but the timeline is not your friend. It directly contradicts the foundational premise of the allegation against Joe Biden.
Jack Bauer
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If Hunter Biden was just selling the "illusion" of access...

Why did Joe Biden use a US taxpayer-funded $1 billion loan guarantee as leverage to get Viktor Shokin fired while investigation Burisma corruption?

Why did Burisma owner, Mykola Zlochevsky, claim he sent a $10 million in bribe money to the Bidens?

Why did the CCP-linked energy executive send the money immediately after Hunter threatened him while saying he was sitting with his father?

Why did the mayor of Moscow's wife, Elena Baturina, send Hunter $3.5 million shortly after meeting with Joe and Hunter in 2014?

Why did Elena Baturina somehow avoid sweeping Russian sanctions by Biden?

Why have multiple witnesses confirmed that the "Big Guy" who Hunter was holding 10% for, was in fact Joe Biden?
Wangchung
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HuMcK said:

Doc Holliday said:

HuMcK said:

I just found all of these sources that pre-date that email, all saying Shokin was refusing to investigate corruption. Biden must have a time machine or something.

Quote:

The arrests triggered a scandal when evidence emerged that Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin and his deputies Volodymyr Huzyr and Yury Stolyarchuk were trying to pressure Sakvarelidze's investigators to halt the case against Korniyets and Shapakin.
https://archive.kyivpost.com/kyiv-post-plus/release-of-diamond-prosecutor-shows-fatal-flaws-of-law-enforcement-394791.html

Quote:

He called for an investigation of officials within the Prosecutor-General's Office who he says stymied efforts to pursue tens of millions of dollars in "illicit assets" that former Ukrainian official Mykola Zlochevskiy held in Britain.

Zlochevskiy served as environment and natural resources minister under former President Viktor Yanukovych, a Kremlin ally whose ouster amid mass street protests in 2014 triggered events that led to Russia's annexation of Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula and a bloody war with Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine.

Zlochevskiy, who earned a reputation for lavishness, was placed on Ukraine's most-wanted list in December for a host of alleged economic crimes.

Pyatt said that "those responsible for subverting the case" against Zlochevskiy "should -- at a minimum -- be summarily terminated."

Since his appointment by Poroshenko in February, Prosecutor-General Viktor Shokin has faced accusations of stalling high-profile corruption cases against allies of Yanukovych.
https://www.rferl.org/a/us-ambassador-upbraids-ukraine-over-corruption-efforts/27271294.html

Quote:

The current imbroglio centers on Shokin, a Poroshenko ally and protector of the country's corrupt old guard. Ukrainian reformers, including prominent civil society organizations and more than 100 members of the Verkhovna Rada, have demanded that Poroshenko fire Shokina request Poroshenko has ignored.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-poroshenko-s-support-for-shokin-is-dangerous/
Nah

Shokin began seizing Zlochevsky's property as part of his inevestigation in Feb of 2016:

https://www.kyivpost.com/post/10691
February of 2016, eh? That would have been at least three months after Biden demanded his firing (which was actually in December 2015, your edit is incorrect and I have no idea where your date came from), and about six months after then-US Ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyatt publicly called for him to be fired (meaning it wasn't actually Biden making the demand, it was the US Government). Shokin was ultimately fired in March 2016, after taking office in February of 2015.

That means Shokin sat on the case and took no actions for a full year, even though he was being publicly called out for not investigating Zlochevsky in particular, and only made a move once it became clear how obvious his obstruction was and after we had already demanded his removal.

Nobody in here will care, but the timeline is not your friend. It directly contradicts the foundational premise of the allegation against Joe Biden.
No, it means no public moves were documented by your preferred sources. You're getting desperate.
Our vibrations were getting nasty. But why? I was puzzled, frustrated... Had we deteriorated to the level of dumb beasts?

Doc Holliday
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HuMcK said:

Doc Holliday said:

HuMcK said:

I just found all of these sources that pre-date that email, all saying Shokin was refusing to investigate corruption. Biden must have a time machine or something.

Quote:

The arrests triggered a scandal when evidence emerged that Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin and his deputies Volodymyr Huzyr and Yury Stolyarchuk were trying to pressure Sakvarelidze's investigators to halt the case against Korniyets and Shapakin.
https://archive.kyivpost.com/kyiv-post-plus/release-of-diamond-prosecutor-shows-fatal-flaws-of-law-enforcement-394791.html

Quote:

He called for an investigation of officials within the Prosecutor-General's Office who he says stymied efforts to pursue tens of millions of dollars in "illicit assets" that former Ukrainian official Mykola Zlochevskiy held in Britain.

Zlochevskiy served as environment and natural resources minister under former President Viktor Yanukovych, a Kremlin ally whose ouster amid mass street protests in 2014 triggered events that led to Russia's annexation of Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula and a bloody war with Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine.

Zlochevskiy, who earned a reputation for lavishness, was placed on Ukraine's most-wanted list in December for a host of alleged economic crimes.

Pyatt said that "those responsible for subverting the case" against Zlochevskiy "should -- at a minimum -- be summarily terminated."

Since his appointment by Poroshenko in February, Prosecutor-General Viktor Shokin has faced accusations of stalling high-profile corruption cases against allies of Yanukovych.
https://www.rferl.org/a/us-ambassador-upbraids-ukraine-over-corruption-efforts/27271294.html

Quote:

The current imbroglio centers on Shokin, a Poroshenko ally and protector of the country's corrupt old guard. Ukrainian reformers, including prominent civil society organizations and more than 100 members of the Verkhovna Rada, have demanded that Poroshenko fire Shokina request Poroshenko has ignored.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-poroshenko-s-support-for-shokin-is-dangerous/
Nah

Shokin began seizing Zlochevsky's property as part of his inevestigation in Feb of 2016:

https://www.kyivpost.com/post/10691
February of 2016, eh? That would have been at least three months after Biden demanded his firing (which was actually in December 2015, your edit is incorrect and I have no idea where your date came from), and about six months after then-US Ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyatt publicly called for him to be fired (meaning it wasn't actually Biden making the demand, it was the US Government). Shokin was ultimately fired in March 2016, after taking office in February of 2015.

That means Shokin sat on the case and took no actions for a full year, even though he was being publicly called out for not investigating Zlochevsky in particular, and only made a move once it became clear how obvious his obstruction was and after we had already demanded his removal.

Nobody in here will care, but the timeline is not your friend. It directly contradicts the foundational premise of the allegation against Joe Biden.
The timeline isn't the problem.

Can you identify anything of value the Biden family had to offer a Ukrainian natural gas company other than government favors?
Osodecentx
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HuMcK said:

Doc Holliday said:

HuMcK said:

I just found all of these sources that pre-date that email, all saying Shokin was refusing to investigate corruption. Biden must have a time machine or something.

Quote:

The arrests triggered a scandal when evidence emerged that Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin and his deputies Volodymyr Huzyr and Yury Stolyarchuk were trying to pressure Sakvarelidze's investigators to halt the case against Korniyets and Shapakin.
https://archive.kyivpost.com/kyiv-post-plus/release-of-diamond-prosecutor-shows-fatal-flaws-of-law-enforcement-394791.html

Quote:

He called for an investigation of officials within the Prosecutor-General's Office who he says stymied efforts to pursue tens of millions of dollars in "illicit assets" that former Ukrainian official Mykola Zlochevskiy held in Britain.

Zlochevskiy served as environment and natural resources minister under former President Viktor Yanukovych, a Kremlin ally whose ouster amid mass street protests in 2014 triggered events that led to Russia's annexation of Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula and a bloody war with Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine.

Zlochevskiy, who earned a reputation for lavishness, was placed on Ukraine's most-wanted list in December for a host of alleged economic crimes.

Pyatt said that "those responsible for subverting the case" against Zlochevskiy "should -- at a minimum -- be summarily terminated."

Since his appointment by Poroshenko in February, Prosecutor-General Viktor Shokin has faced accusations of stalling high-profile corruption cases against allies of Yanukovych.
https://www.rferl.org/a/us-ambassador-upbraids-ukraine-over-corruption-efforts/27271294.html

Quote:

The current imbroglio centers on Shokin, a Poroshenko ally and protector of the country's corrupt old guard. Ukrainian reformers, including prominent civil society organizations and more than 100 members of the Verkhovna Rada, have demanded that Poroshenko fire Shokina request Poroshenko has ignored.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-poroshenko-s-support-for-shokin-is-dangerous/
Nah

Shokin began seizing Zlochevsky's property as part of his inevestigation in Feb of 2016:

https://www.kyivpost.com/post/10691
February of 2016, eh? That would have been at least three months after Biden demanded his firing (which was actually in December 2015, your edit is incorrect and I have no idea where your date came from), and about six months after then-US Ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyatt publicly called for him to be fired (meaning it wasn't actually Biden making the demand, it was the US Government). Shokin was ultimately fired in March 2016, after taking office in February of 2015.

That means Shokin sat on the case and took no actions for a full year, even though he was being publicly called out for not investigating Zlochevsky in particular, and only made a move once it became clear how obvious his obstruction was and after we had already demanded his removal.

Nobody in here will care, but the timeline is not your friend. It directly contradicts the foundational premise of the allegation against Joe Biden.
The VP got on the phone 20 times? Shokin was fired? Millions of dollars paid to H Biden's company?

Do you think we're all stupid?
Jacques Strap
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Jacques Strap
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HuMcK
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Cobretti was helpful enough to provide an email further up that numerically lists the services and expertise they were offering, you should read it. Believe it or not, in the business world, connections do have value as well. Just ask Jared Kushner and his wife.

Of course you don't want to dwell on the timeline, because it hurts your argument, and I won't let you get by with blatantly misrepresenting it. You cared about the timing when you thought Biden asked for Shokin to be fired after finally making a move, but after learning that you were wrong you just want to move on.

I provided contemprary primary source documents that support my position and irrefutably show there were widespread calls for Shokin's removal way before Joe Biden ever did. You are relying on some stale and uncorroborated hearsay that even Bill Barr's DoJ wouldn't pursue.
Cobretti
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Cobretti
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HuMcK
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Osodecentx said:

HuMcK said:

Doc Holliday said:

HuMcK said:

I just found all of these sources that pre-date that email, all saying Shokin was refusing to investigate corruption. Biden must have a time machine or something.

Quote:

The arrests triggered a scandal when evidence emerged that Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin and his deputies Volodymyr Huzyr and Yury Stolyarchuk were trying to pressure Sakvarelidze's investigators to halt the case against Korniyets and Shapakin.
https://archive.kyivpost.com/kyiv-post-plus/release-of-diamond-prosecutor-shows-fatal-flaws-of-law-enforcement-394791.html

Quote:

He called for an investigation of officials within the Prosecutor-General's Office who he says stymied efforts to pursue tens of millions of dollars in "illicit assets" that former Ukrainian official Mykola Zlochevskiy held in Britain.

Zlochevskiy served as environment and natural resources minister under former President Viktor Yanukovych, a Kremlin ally whose ouster amid mass street protests in 2014 triggered events that led to Russia's annexation of Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula and a bloody war with Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine.

Zlochevskiy, who earned a reputation for lavishness, was placed on Ukraine's most-wanted list in December for a host of alleged economic crimes.

Pyatt said that "those responsible for subverting the case" against Zlochevskiy "should -- at a minimum -- be summarily terminated."

Since his appointment by Poroshenko in February, Prosecutor-General Viktor Shokin has faced accusations of stalling high-profile corruption cases against allies of Yanukovych.
https://www.rferl.org/a/us-ambassador-upbraids-ukraine-over-corruption-efforts/27271294.html

Quote:

The current imbroglio centers on Shokin, a Poroshenko ally and protector of the country's corrupt old guard. Ukrainian reformers, including prominent civil society organizations and more than 100 members of the Verkhovna Rada, have demanded that Poroshenko fire Shokina request Poroshenko has ignored.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-poroshenko-s-support-for-shokin-is-dangerous/
Nah

Shokin began seizing Zlochevsky's property as part of his inevestigation in Feb of 2016:

https://www.kyivpost.com/post/10691
February of 2016, eh? That would have been at least three months after Biden demanded his firing (which was actually in December 2015, your edit is incorrect and I have no idea where your date came from), and about six months after then-US Ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyatt publicly called for him to be fired (meaning it wasn't actually Biden making the demand, it was the US Government). Shokin was ultimately fired in March 2016, after taking office in February of 2015.

That means Shokin sat on the case and took no actions for a full year, even though he was being publicly called out for not investigating Zlochevsky in particular, and only made a move once it became clear how obvious his obstruction was and after we had already demanded his removal.

Nobody in here will care, but the timeline is not your friend. It directly contradicts the foundational premise of the allegation against Joe Biden.
The VP got on the phone 20 times? Shokin was fired? Millions of dollars paid to H Biden's company?

Do you think we're all stupid?

Kind of, yeah. But that's beside the point.

Were the EU, IMF, and domestic anti corruption groups all gunning for Shokin just to do Hunter Biden a solid? If Shokin really was after Zlochevsky, then why did he wait until after people were publicly calling for his removal before doing anything? The narrative hasn't even stayed consistent: first Joe was supposedly protecting Hunter from investigation, but that went bust so now it's about protecting someone else.

Zlochevsky's right hand man says Shokin was actually shaking them down for money, in exchange for not investigating them. The US Ambassador to Ukraine literally called out Shokin for protecting Zlochevsky. Not some vague reference, he named Shokin and Zlochevsky directly, and called for Shokin to be fired in September 2015 (Joe followed up on behalf of the Obama administration in December). So did Ron fcking Johnson for god's sake!

I don't really care if Joe Biden talked to his son on the phone. Seriously, that is scraping the bottom of the barrel if we are supposed to get outraged that Joe answered the phone when his son called. By the way, the guy who says those calls happened also testified that he didn't hear any discussions related to Hunter's business on those calls.
Cobretti
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Cobretti
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Cobretti
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Osodecentx
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HuMcK said:

Osodecentx said:

HuMcK said:

Doc Holliday said:

HuMcK said:

I just found all of these sources that pre-date that email, all saying Shokin was refusing to investigate corruption. Biden must have a time machine or something.

Quote:

The arrests triggered a scandal when evidence emerged that Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin and his deputies Volodymyr Huzyr and Yury Stolyarchuk were trying to pressure Sakvarelidze's investigators to halt the case against Korniyets and Shapakin.
https://archive.kyivpost.com/kyiv-post-plus/release-of-diamond-prosecutor-shows-fatal-flaws-of-law-enforcement-394791.html

Quote:

He called for an investigation of officials within the Prosecutor-General's Office who he says stymied efforts to pursue tens of millions of dollars in "illicit assets" that former Ukrainian official Mykola Zlochevskiy held in Britain.

Zlochevskiy served as environment and natural resources minister under former President Viktor Yanukovych, a Kremlin ally whose ouster amid mass street protests in 2014 triggered events that led to Russia's annexation of Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula and a bloody war with Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine.

Zlochevskiy, who earned a reputation for lavishness, was placed on Ukraine's most-wanted list in December for a host of alleged economic crimes.

Pyatt said that "those responsible for subverting the case" against Zlochevskiy "should -- at a minimum -- be summarily terminated."

Since his appointment by Poroshenko in February, Prosecutor-General Viktor Shokin has faced accusations of stalling high-profile corruption cases against allies of Yanukovych.
https://www.rferl.org/a/us-ambassador-upbraids-ukraine-over-corruption-efforts/27271294.html

Quote:

The current imbroglio centers on Shokin, a Poroshenko ally and protector of the country's corrupt old guard. Ukrainian reformers, including prominent civil society organizations and more than 100 members of the Verkhovna Rada, have demanded that Poroshenko fire Shokina request Poroshenko has ignored.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-poroshenko-s-support-for-shokin-is-dangerous/
Nah

Shokin began seizing Zlochevsky's property as part of his inevestigation in Feb of 2016:

https://www.kyivpost.com/post/10691
February of 2016, eh? That would have been at least three months after Biden demanded his firing (which was actually in December 2015, your edit is incorrect and I have no idea where your date came from), and about six months after then-US Ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyatt publicly called for him to be fired (meaning it wasn't actually Biden making the demand, it was the US Government). Shokin was ultimately fired in March 2016, after taking office in February of 2015.

That means Shokin sat on the case and took no actions for a full year, even though he was being publicly called out for not investigating Zlochevsky in particular, and only made a move once it became clear how obvious his obstruction was and after we had already demanded his removal.

Nobody in here will care, but the timeline is not your friend. It directly contradicts the foundational premise of the allegation against Joe Biden.
The VP got on the phone 20 times? Shokin was fired? Millions of dollars paid to H Biden's company?

Do you think we're all stupid?

Kind of, yeah. But that's beside the point.

Were the EU, IMF, and domestic anti corruption groups all gunning for Shokin just to do Hunter Biden a solid? If Shokin really was after Zlochevsky, then why did he wait until after people were publicly calling for his removal before doing anything? The narrative hasn't even stayed consistent: first Joe was supposedly protecting Hunter from investigation, but that went bust so now it's about protecting someone else.

Zlochevsky's right hand man says Shokin was actually shaking them down for money, in exchange for not investigating them. The US Ambassador to Ukraine literally called out Shokin for protecting Zlochevsky. Not some vague reference, he named Shokin and Zlochevsky directly, and called for Shokin to be fired in September 2015 (Joe followed up on behalf of the Obama administration in December). So did Ron fcking Johnson for god's sake!

I don't really care if Joe Biden talked to his son on the phone. Seriously, that is scraping the bottom of the barrel if we are supposed to get outraged that Joe answered the phone when his son called. By the way, the guy who says those calls happened also testified that he didn't hear any discussions related to Hunter's business on those calls.
The VP got on the phone 20 times? Shokin was fired? Millions of dollars paid to H Biden's company?

Above is undisputed
Cobretti
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HuMcK
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Osodecentx said:

HuMcK said:

Osodecentx said:

HuMcK said:

Doc Holliday said:

HuMcK said:

I just found all of these sources that pre-date that email, all saying Shokin was refusing to investigate corruption. Biden must have a time machine or something.

Quote:

The arrests triggered a scandal when evidence emerged that Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin and his deputies Volodymyr Huzyr and Yury Stolyarchuk were trying to pressure Sakvarelidze's investigators to halt the case against Korniyets and Shapakin.
https://archive.kyivpost.com/kyiv-post-plus/release-of-diamond-prosecutor-shows-fatal-flaws-of-law-enforcement-394791.html

Quote:

He called for an investigation of officials within the Prosecutor-General's Office who he says stymied efforts to pursue tens of millions of dollars in "illicit assets" that former Ukrainian official Mykola Zlochevskiy held in Britain.

Zlochevskiy served as environment and natural resources minister under former President Viktor Yanukovych, a Kremlin ally whose ouster amid mass street protests in 2014 triggered events that led to Russia's annexation of Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula and a bloody war with Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine.

Zlochevskiy, who earned a reputation for lavishness, was placed on Ukraine's most-wanted list in December for a host of alleged economic crimes.

Pyatt said that "those responsible for subverting the case" against Zlochevskiy "should -- at a minimum -- be summarily terminated."

Since his appointment by Poroshenko in February, Prosecutor-General Viktor Shokin has faced accusations of stalling high-profile corruption cases against allies of Yanukovych.
https://www.rferl.org/a/us-ambassador-upbraids-ukraine-over-corruption-efforts/27271294.html

Quote:

The current imbroglio centers on Shokin, a Poroshenko ally and protector of the country's corrupt old guard. Ukrainian reformers, including prominent civil society organizations and more than 100 members of the Verkhovna Rada, have demanded that Poroshenko fire Shokina request Poroshenko has ignored.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-poroshenko-s-support-for-shokin-is-dangerous/
Nah

Shokin began seizing Zlochevsky's property as part of his inevestigation in Feb of 2016:

https://www.kyivpost.com/post/10691
February of 2016, eh? That would have been at least three months after Biden demanded his firing (which was actually in December 2015, your edit is incorrect and I have no idea where your date came from), and about six months after then-US Ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyatt publicly called for him to be fired (meaning it wasn't actually Biden making the demand, it was the US Government). Shokin was ultimately fired in March 2016, after taking office in February of 2015.

That means Shokin sat on the case and took no actions for a full year, even though he was being publicly called out for not investigating Zlochevsky in particular, and only made a move once it became clear how obvious his obstruction was and after we had already demanded his removal.

Nobody in here will care, but the timeline is not your friend. It directly contradicts the foundational premise of the allegation against Joe Biden.
The VP got on the phone 20 times? Shokin was fired? Millions of dollars paid to H Biden's company?

Do you think we're all stupid?

Kind of, yeah. But that's beside the point.

Were the EU, IMF, and domestic anti corruption groups all gunning for Shokin just to do Hunter Biden a solid? If Shokin really was after Zlochevsky, then why did he wait until after people were publicly calling for his removal before doing anything? The narrative hasn't even stayed consistent: first Joe was supposedly protecting Hunter from investigation, but that went bust so now it's about protecting someone else.

Zlochevsky's right hand man says Shokin was actually shaking them down for money, in exchange for not investigating them. The US Ambassador to Ukraine literally called out Shokin for protecting Zlochevsky. Not some vague reference, he named Shokin and Zlochevsky directly, and called for Shokin to be fired in September 2015 (Joe followed up on behalf of the Obama administration in December). So did Ron fcking Johnson for god's sake!

I don't really care if Joe Biden talked to his son on the phone. Seriously, that is scraping the bottom of the barrel if we are supposed to get outraged that Joe answered the phone when his son called. By the way, the guy who says those calls happened also testified that he didn't hear any discussions related to Hunter's business on those calls.
The VP got on the phone 20 times? Shokin was fired? Millions of dollars paid to H Biden's company?

Above is undisputed

And? What is the connection, if any, of those 20 phone calls to Ukraine, because I'm not awre that they were even said to be? Hunter Biden got paid?? The horror! Wait until you learn how much money Biden's opponent made from foreign sources...

I've already provided numerous contemporary sources in this thread of multiple disparate groups calling for Shokin to be fired. Our Ambassador to Ukraine even said publicly that Shokin was protecting Zlochevsky, and that's why he should be fired. For whatever reason, you seem to be pretending those sources don't exist.

This is all based on far more vague "evidence" than what we had in the Trump/Russia affair, and you called that a "hoax". Why the double standard now??
Doc Holliday
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HuMcK said:

Cobretti was helpful enough to provide an email further up that numerically lists the services and expertise they were offering, you should read it. Believe it or not, in the business world, connections do have value as well. Just ask Jared Kushner and his wife.

Of course you don't want to dwell on the timeline, because it hurts your argument, and I won't let you get by with blatantly misrepresenting it. You cared about the timing when you thought Biden asked for Shokin to be fired after finally making a move, but after learning that you were wrong you just want to move on.

I provided contemprary primary source documents that support my position and irrefutably show there were widespread calls for Shokin's removal way before Joe Biden ever did. You are relying on some stale and uncorroborated hearsay that even Bill Barr's DoJ wouldn't pursue.
lol



Osodecentx
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HuMcK said:

Osodecentx said:

HuMcK said:

Osodecentx said:

HuMcK said:

Doc Holliday said:

HuMcK said:

I just found all of these sources that pre-date that email, all saying Shokin was refusing to investigate corruption. Biden must have a time machine or something.

Quote:

The arrests triggered a scandal when evidence emerged that Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin and his deputies Volodymyr Huzyr and Yury Stolyarchuk were trying to pressure Sakvarelidze's investigators to halt the case against Korniyets and Shapakin.
https://archive.kyivpost.com/kyiv-post-plus/release-of-diamond-prosecutor-shows-fatal-flaws-of-law-enforcement-394791.html

Quote:

He called for an investigation of officials within the Prosecutor-General's Office who he says stymied efforts to pursue tens of millions of dollars in "illicit assets" that former Ukrainian official Mykola Zlochevskiy held in Britain.

Zlochevskiy served as environment and natural resources minister under former President Viktor Yanukovych, a Kremlin ally whose ouster amid mass street protests in 2014 triggered events that led to Russia's annexation of Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula and a bloody war with Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine.

Zlochevskiy, who earned a reputation for lavishness, was placed on Ukraine's most-wanted list in December for a host of alleged economic crimes.

Pyatt said that "those responsible for subverting the case" against Zlochevskiy "should -- at a minimum -- be summarily terminated."

Since his appointment by Poroshenko in February, Prosecutor-General Viktor Shokin has faced accusations of stalling high-profile corruption cases against allies of Yanukovych.
https://www.rferl.org/a/us-ambassador-upbraids-ukraine-over-corruption-efforts/27271294.html

Quote:

The current imbroglio centers on Shokin, a Poroshenko ally and protector of the country's corrupt old guard. Ukrainian reformers, including prominent civil society organizations and more than 100 members of the Verkhovna Rada, have demanded that Poroshenko fire Shokina request Poroshenko has ignored.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-poroshenko-s-support-for-shokin-is-dangerous/
Nah

Shokin began seizing Zlochevsky's property as part of his inevestigation in Feb of 2016:

https://www.kyivpost.com/post/10691
February of 2016, eh? That would have been at least three months after Biden demanded his firing (which was actually in December 2015, your edit is incorrect and I have no idea where your date came from), and about six months after then-US Ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyatt publicly called for him to be fired (meaning it wasn't actually Biden making the demand, it was the US Government). Shokin was ultimately fired in March 2016, after taking office in February of 2015.

That means Shokin sat on the case and took no actions for a full year, even though he was being publicly called out for not investigating Zlochevsky in particular, and only made a move once it became clear how obvious his obstruction was and after we had already demanded his removal.

Nobody in here will care, but the timeline is not your friend. It directly contradicts the foundational premise of the allegation against Joe Biden.
The VP got on the phone 20 times? Shokin was fired? Millions of dollars paid to H Biden's company?

Do you think we're all stupid?

Kind of, yeah. But that's beside the point.

Were the EU, IMF, and domestic anti corruption groups all gunning for Shokin just to do Hunter Biden a solid? If Shokin really was after Zlochevsky, then why did he wait until after people were publicly calling for his removal before doing anything? The narrative hasn't even stayed consistent: first Joe was supposedly protecting Hunter from investigation, but that went bust so now it's about protecting someone else.

Zlochevsky's right hand man says Shokin was actually shaking them down for money, in exchange for not investigating them. The US Ambassador to Ukraine literally called out Shokin for protecting Zlochevsky. Not some vague reference, he named Shokin and Zlochevsky directly, and called for Shokin to be fired in September 2015 (Joe followed up on behalf of the Obama administration in December). So did Ron fcking Johnson for god's sake!

I don't really care if Joe Biden talked to his son on the phone. Seriously, that is scraping the bottom of the barrel if we are supposed to get outraged that Joe answered the phone when his son called. By the way, the guy who says those calls happened also testified that he didn't hear any discussions related to Hunter's business on those calls.
The VP got on the phone 20 times? Shokin was fired? Millions of dollars paid to H Biden's company?

Above is undisputed

And? What is the connection, if any, of those 20 phone calls to Ukraine, because I'm not awre that they were even said to be? Hunter Biden got paid?? The horror! Wait until you learn how much money Biden's opponent made from foreign sources...

I've already provided numerous contemporary sources in this thread of multiple disparate groups calling for Shokin to be fired. Our Ambassador to Ukraine even said publicly that Shokin was protecting Zlochevsky, and that's why he should be fired. For whatever reason, you seem to be pretending those sources don't exist.

This is all based on far more vague "evidence" than what we had in the Trump/Russia affair, and you called that a "hoax". Why the double standard now??
Nixon wishes you had been the editor of WaPo in summer of 72
HuMcK
How long do you want to ignore this user?
A) that's not "to" Hunter Biden, he's just CCd, and B) clearly, they were just discussing adoptions.
 
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