How does a Regent's Diploma compare to a high school education in New Dime Box, Texas?FormerFlash said:I have a regent's diploma from a New York high school, meaning I passed all course affiliated state regents exams with a score of 85 or higher. I'm not sure how well recognized the validity of a regent's diploma is outside of the state, however, I will say undergrad in Ohio was somewhat of a breeze while my best friends in college, who went to high school in Iowa, struggled mightily.FLBear5630 said:I think we modeled ours after theirs and the Iroquois.historian said:
Some of the tribes in what is now the U.S. had relatively advanced cultures but at the time the British colonies were founded none, to my knowledge, were as advanced as the Maya or Inca. Later, after the U.S. was well established, the five civilized tribes of the southeast were more advanced. For example, the Cherokee had a written constitution modeled after our own.
I grew up in New York in the 60's and 70's. One of the great things about attending school there was the education system at the time. First, they had Regent's courses which were high academic courses and you had to pass a Regent's exam to get credit. Second, was the Social Science education. We learned a lot about the Iroquois. The Iroquois Confederation played a role in the development of the US Constitution as well. We learned a lot about the relationships. I think I got through HS and the first 2 years of college on what my Regent's classes!
The Native American Government That Helped Inspire the US Constitution | HISTORY
Netanyahu said "we are at war,"
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It required effort. The education I got in NY was very good. They were also very culture oriented. Every school had orchestra and band. I say 2 Broadway plays for English class field trips. Went to Germantown in NYC every semester for German class. Played 3 sports a year. It was a very well rounded education. Back then you paid taxes, but the services were there. Now, not so much. Have a cousin in Levittown, kids had to go to Private school.FormerFlash said:I have a regent's diploma from a New York high school, meaning I passed all course affiliated state regents exams with a score of 85 or higher. I'm not sure how well recognized the validity of a regent's diploma is outside of the state, however, I will say undergrad in Ohio was somewhat of a breeze while my best friends in college, who went to high school in Iowa, struggled mightily.FLBear5630 said:I think we modeled ours after theirs and the Iroquois.historian said:
Some of the tribes in what is now the U.S. had relatively advanced cultures but at the time the British colonies were founded none, to my knowledge, were as advanced as the Maya or Inca. Later, after the U.S. was well established, the five civilized tribes of the southeast were more advanced. For example, the Cherokee had a written constitution modeled after our own.
I grew up in New York in the 60's and 70's. One of the great things about attending school there was the education system at the time. First, they had Regent's courses which were high academic courses and you had to pass a Regent's exam to get credit. Second, was the Social Science education. We learned a lot about the Iroquois. The Iroquois Confederation played a role in the development of the US Constitution as well. We learned a lot about the relationships. I think I got through HS and the first 2 years of college on what my Regent's classes!
The Native American Government That Helped Inspire the US Constitution | HISTORY
Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
"Never underestimate Joe's ability to **** things up!"
-- Barack Obama
-- Barack Obama
https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/child-casualties-gaza-growing-stain-our-collective-conscienceRD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
yeah "Great Restraint"
I'm the English Guy
How does this article show a lack of restraint?cms186 said:https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/child-casualties-gaza-growing-stain-our-collective-conscienceRD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
yeah "Great Restraint"
Are you demanding no civilian casualties?
Do you acknowledge Hamas uses school, places of worship, and hospitals as shields?
What would you do if you were Israel?
historian said:
They did not need a working model beyond the history of republics in general (which was not stellar). America was a great experiment: could they make a republic work in this vast land? They really did not have a clear idea of that success until the "Revolution of 1800": Thomas Jefferson defeated John Adams in the election (while his party swept both houses of Congress) for the first peaceful transfer of power in human history.
The Iroquois system was not very similar to the American constitution. The Founders rejected the idea of a confederation & chose a republic. The Iroquois wasn't exactly a great model of success either: they survived but did not manage crises very well. They were divided during the French & Indian War, for example.
I like the post...but that might be a little extreme of a statement.
The Roman Republic had a long line of peaceful Consular elections from 509 BC all the way until Gen. Sulla and the Gracchi brothers when the Romans started infighting.
And of course we had the more recent Dutch Republic
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_Republic
HBO Adams had a great clip on that.
"The Netherlands was a republic long before America was even an idea"
nearly 2.5k children killed shows a "Lack of Restraint", yes, Hamas using Human Shields as a tactic is utterly despicable, but Israel just saying "**** it, who gives a **** about civilians, fire the missiles at them anyway" is just as bad.sombear said:How does this article show a lack of restraint?cms186 said:https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/child-casualties-gaza-growing-stain-our-collective-conscienceRD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
yeah "Great Restraint"
Are you demanding no civilian casualties?
Do you acknowledge Hamas uses school, places of worship, and hospitals as shields?
What would you do if you were Israel?
If I were Israel? i dunno, maybe not treat Palestinians like 2nd class citizens? Not seize their homes just to give to Jewish citizens? at times it seems like Israel has its own version of apartheid
I'm the English Guy
The last Jew was forced out of Gush Katif [near Rafah and Khan Younis / Gaza] by the IDF in 2005. Israel actually gave Jewish homes, synagogues, business buildings, green homes, and infrastructure to the Gazans.cms186 said:sombear said:How does this article show a lack of restraint?cms186 said:https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/child-casualties-gaza-growing-stain-our-collective-conscienceRD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
yeah "Great Restraint"
Are you demanding no civilian casualties?
Do you acknowledge Hamas uses school, places of worship, and hospitals as shields?
What would you do if you were Israel?
If I were Israel? i dunno, maybe not treat Palestinians like 2nd class citizens? Not seize their homes just to give to Jewish citizens? at times it seems like Israel has its own version of apartheid
Wrecks Quan Dough said:The last Jew was forced out of Gush Katif by the IDF in 2005. Israel actually gave Jewish homes, synagogues, business buildings, green homes, and infrastructure to the Gazans.cms186 said:sombear said:How does this article show a lack of restraint?cms186 said:https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/child-casualties-gaza-growing-stain-our-collective-conscienceRD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
yeah "Great Restraint"
Are you demanding no civilian casualties?
Do you acknowledge Hamas uses school, places of worship, and hospitals as shields?
What would you do if you were Israel?
If I were Israel? i dunno, maybe not treat Palestinians like 2nd class citizens? Not seize their homes just to give to Jewish citizens? at times it seems like Israel has its own version of apartheid
Sharon's decision to pull the settlers out of Gaza was the smart call. They could not continue to militarily occupy the area so that a paltry small number of settlers could try and claim the land.
2 million Palestinians in Gaza vs 6,000 Israeli settlers
The math just did not work.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_disengagement_from_Gaza
p.s.
They actually demolished almost everything rather than turn it over...completely their call on that since it was there Israeli government property (they bought it from the settlers)...but for the record they did not just turn over all the homes, synagogues, or business buildings to the Palestinians in Gaza
[15 August 2005 deadline were evicted by Israeli security forces over a period of several days.[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_disengagement_from_Gaza#cite_note-DemocracyNow-2][2][/url] The eviction of all residents, demolition of the residential buildings and evacuation of associated security personnel from the Gaza Strip was completed by 12 September 2005]
[When Israel left Gaza, competing claims emerged about the fate of greenhouses left behind by settlers. Some sources claimed that large numbers of greenhouses had been handed over to assist economic regrowth, but were destroyed by the Palestinians. A New York Times investigation revealed that... greenhouses had actually been destroyed by Israeli settlers before they left. Two months prior to the withdrawal, half of the 21 settlements' greenhouses, spread over 400 hectares (1,000 acres), had been dismantled by their owners, leaving the remainder on 200 hectares (500 acres), placing its business viability on a weak footing. International bodies, and pressure from James Wolfensohn, Middle East envoy of the Quartet, who gave $500,000 of his own money, offered incentives for the rest to be left to the Palestinians of Gaza. An agreement was reached with Israel under international law to destroy the settlers' houses and shift the rubble to Egypt. The disposal of asbestos presented a particular problem: some 60,000 truckloads of rubble required passage to Egypt.]
Also keep in mind, while there are tragically civilian casualties, Hamas runs the health ministry releasing Gaza casualty numbers. Saying hundreds die in each airstrike is in their favor.
You and your fellow English men and women should open your homes to these poor, sweet, innocent Palestinians.cms186 said:https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/child-casualties-gaza-growing-stain-our-collective-conscienceRD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
yeah "Great Restraint"
Wish the UK would take them all.
"Never underestimate Joe's ability to **** things up!"
-- Barack Obama
-- Barack Obama
The more Biden opens his mouth, the more I am convinced he is in support of the terrorists, - not Israel. Absolutely pathetic. We are so screwed as a country. The extremists have hijacked the Democrat Party.
"Never underestimate Joe's ability to **** things up!"
-- Barack Obama
-- Barack Obama
First of all, nobody knows the number of casualties. Idiot media sources rely on Hamas' figures, as they did in the hospital debacle. In any event, numbers alone shows a lack of restraint? What is the magic number? Is one civilian too many? 100? 1000? Should the allies not have conquered Germany given all the civilian deaths and destruction?cms186 said:nearly 2.5k children killed shows a "Lack of Restraint", yes, Hamas using Human Shields as a tactic is utterly despicable, but Israel just saying "**** it, who gives a **** about civilians, fire the missiles at them anyway" is just as bad.sombear said:How does this article show a lack of restraint?cms186 said:https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/child-casualties-gaza-growing-stain-our-collective-conscienceRD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
yeah "Great Restraint"
Are you demanding no civilian casualties?
Do you acknowledge Hamas uses school, places of worship, and hospitals as shields?
What would you do if you were Israel?
If I were Israel? i dunno, maybe not treat Palestinians like 2nd class citizens? Not seize their homes just to give to Jewish citizens? at times it seems like Israel has its own version of apartheid
Second, where is the evidence of indiscriminate bombing? Israel releases evidence of its targets, often including videos. If Israel hits a rocket launch site and civilians are killed, should they not have taken out the rockets?
Finally, the history is debatable. I certainly disagree with your version, but regardless, I don't think that is relevant to how Israel today should respond to a horrific invasion and attack that resulted in the heinous murders of 40,000 U.S. equivalent.
sombear said:First of all, nobody knows the number of casualties. Idiot media sources rely on Hamas' figures, as they did in the hospital debacle. In any event, numbers alone shows a lack of restraint? What is the magic number? Is one civilian too many? 100? 1000? Should the allies not have conquered Germany given all the civilian deaths and destruction?cms186 said:nearly 2.5k children killed shows a "Lack of Restraint", yes, Hamas using Human Shields as a tactic is utterly despicable, but Israel just saying "**** it, who gives a **** about civilians, fire the missiles at them anyway" is just as bad.sombear said:How does this article show a lack of restraint?cms186 said:https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/child-casualties-gaza-growing-stain-our-collective-conscienceRD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
yeah "Great Restraint"
Are you demanding no civilian casualties?
Do you acknowledge Hamas uses school, places of worship, and hospitals as shields?
What would you do if you were Israel?
If I were Israel? i dunno, maybe not treat Palestinians like 2nd class citizens? Not seize their homes just to give to Jewish citizens? at times it seems like Israel has its own version of apartheid
Second, where is the evidence of indiscriminate bombing? Israel releases evidence of its targets, often including videos. If Israel hits a rocket launch site and civilians are killed, should they not have taken out the rockets?
Finally, the history is debatable. I certainly disagree with your version, but regardless, I don't think that is relevant to how Israel today should respond to a horrific invasion and attack that resulted in the heinous murders of 40,000 U.S. equivalent.
There is a major difference between this attack (yes terrible and unjustified to target women and children) and the long term occupation of land meant to be a Palestinian State (also terrible)
Joe Rogan has talked about this on his show and had guests on who have been there... "just in 2018 there were 35 kids killed by the IDF...900 shot...we are talking children"
sombear said:First of all, nobody knows the number of casualties.cms186 said:nearly 2.5k children killed shows a "Lack of Restraint", yes, Hamas using Human Shields as a tactic is utterly despicable, but Israel just saying "**** it, who gives a **** about civilians, fire the missiles at them anyway" is just as bad.sombear said:How does this article show a lack of restraint?cms186 said:https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/child-casualties-gaza-growing-stain-our-collective-conscienceRD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
yeah "Great Restraint"
Are you demanding no civilian casualties?
Do you acknowledge Hamas uses school, places of worship, and hospitals as shields?
What would you do if you were Israel?
If I were Israel? i dunno, maybe not treat Palestinians like 2nd class citizens? Not seize their homes just to give to Jewish citizens? at times it seems like Israel has its own version of apartheid
Second, where is the evidence of indiscriminate bombing?
That all comes down to who you believe.
If you take a pro-Israel line you think there have been no civilian casualties and that all those Arabs killed in Gaza are seasoned Hamas fighters. And that there has never been any indiscriminate bombing.
If you take a more pro-Palestinian line then you think many thousands of civilians have been killed and that the IDF is laying waste to large parts of Gaza.
Most of the World (and on this forum) has already chosen a side on the trust issue.
I tend to think that in most savage ethnic conflicts like this one... that the answer is somewhere in the middle.
I doubt Israel goes out on a mission to destroy only arab civilian homes...and I also doubt they check that hard to make sure its just Hamas commanders they are bombing. And I think the mutual feelings of hate and mistrust have poisoned any trust between the two sides and they both assume the worst about the other.
I stand corrected . . . .
Hamas Crisis Actor pretends to be a victim of an Israeli air strike- appearing in a hospital bed while pretending to be in a critical condition as two supporting actors hold his hand.
— Oli London (@OliLondonTV) October 25, 2023
In reality, the man is a Hamas musician and actor who has been appearing in various videos for… pic.twitter.com/PQmPipAC3R
sombear said:
I stand corrected . . . .Hamas Crisis Actor pretends to be a victim of an Israeli air strike- appearing in a hospital bed while pretending to be in a critical condition as two supporting actors hold his hand.
— Oli London (@OliLondonTV) October 25, 2023
In reality, the man is a Hamas musician and actor who has been appearing in various videos for… pic.twitter.com/PQmPipAC3R
The U.S. retains the ability to defend itself and hasn't ruled out retaliatory operations after the Pentagon said American forces were attacked by Iran-backed militants at least 13 times in the Middle East in the last week, Pres. Biden said Wednesday. https://t.co/N14DDmwURS
— ABC News (@ABC) October 25, 2023
412-10, House passes resolution affirming support for Israel.
— Manu Raju (@mkraju) October 25, 2023
9 Democrats voted NO: Tlaib, Bush, Bowman, Carson, Green of Texas, AOC, Lee of PA, Ramirez, Omar
1 Republican NO: Massie
6 “present” votes: Jayapal, Castro, Velazquez, Casar, Garcia of IL, Pressley, per @ckmarie
My cousin's wife taught in Massachusetts and on Long Island from 1959-1964. She was originally from Kansas and taught there before going up north while my cousin was in law school. She was absolutely blown away by how advanced the schools in NY and Mass were compared to her previouse teaching experiences. She returned to Missouri and won a seat on the school board in St Louis. She attempted to implement the changes she learned up there from her experiences in education but could not overcome ignorant resistence.FormerFlash said:
I have a regent's diploma from a New York high school, meaning I passed all course affiliated state regents exams with a score of 85 or higher. I'm not sure how well recognized the validity of a regent's diploma is outside of the state, however, I will say undergrad in Ohio was somewhat of a breeze while my best friends in college, who went to high school in Iowa, struggled mightily.
Astros in Home Stretch Geaux Texans
I've not seen any Israelis or Israel supporters argue there are no civilian casualties. What they argue, me included, is that by and large Israel tries to limit civilian casualties while knowing it will still happen. It is impossible to fight Hamas in Gaza without substantial civilian casualties, and it is largely based on where Hamas resides and locates their weapons.Redbrickbear said:sombear said:First of all, nobody knows the number of casualties.cms186 said:nearly 2.5k children killed shows a "Lack of Restraint", yes, Hamas using Human Shields as a tactic is utterly despicable, but Israel just saying "**** it, who gives a **** about civilians, fire the missiles at them anyway" is just as bad.sombear said:How does this article show a lack of restraint?cms186 said:https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/child-casualties-gaza-growing-stain-our-collective-conscienceRD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
yeah "Great Restraint"
Are you demanding no civilian casualties?
Do you acknowledge Hamas uses school, places of worship, and hospitals as shields?
What would you do if you were Israel?
If I were Israel? i dunno, maybe not treat Palestinians like 2nd class citizens? Not seize their homes just to give to Jewish citizens? at times it seems like Israel has its own version of apartheid
Second, where is the evidence of indiscriminate bombing?
That all comes down to who you believe.
If you take a pro-Israel line you think there have been no civilian casualties and that all those Arabs killed in Gaza are seasoned Hamas fighters. And that there has never been any indiscriminate bombing.
If you take a more pro-Palestinian line then you think many thousands of civilians have been killed and that the IDF is laying waste to large parts of Gaza.
Most of the World (and on this forum) has already chosen a side on the trust issue.
I tend to think that in most savage ethnic conflicts like this one... that the answer is somewhere in the middle.
I doubt Israel goes out on a mission to destroy only arab civilian homes...and I also doubt they check that hard to make sure its just Hamas commanders they are bombing. And I think the mutual feelings of hate and mistrust have poisoned any trust between the two sides and they both assume the worst about the other.
And even with that, Israel has no doubt made mistakes. Unlike Hamas, however, Israel has a history of admitting mistakes.
Ever ask yourself why Jordan, Egypt, Lebanon and Syria don't each accept a few hundred thousand of Palestinians refugees ?cms186 said:sombear said:How does this article show a lack of restraint?cms186 said:https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/child-casualties-gaza-growing-stain-our-collective-conscienceRD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
yeah "Great Restraint"
Are you demanding no civilian casualties?
Do you acknowledge Hamas uses school, places of worship, and hospitals as shields?
What would you do if you were Israel?
If I were Israel? i dunno, maybe not treat Palestinians like 2nd class citizens? Not seize their homes just to give to Jewish citizens? at times it seems like Israel has its own version of apartheid
KaiBear said:Ever ask yourself why Jordan, Egypt, Lebanon and Syria don't each accept a few hundred thousand of Palestinians refugees ?cms186 said:sombear said:How does this article show a lack of restraint?cms186 said:https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/child-casualties-gaza-growing-stain-our-collective-conscienceRD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
yeah "Great Restraint"
Are you demanding no civilian casualties?
Do you acknowledge Hamas uses school, places of worship, and hospitals as shields?
What would you do if you were Israel?
If I were Israel? i dunno, maybe not treat Palestinians like 2nd class citizens? Not seize their homes just to give to Jewish citizens? at times it seems like Israel has its own version of apartheid
Why would they accept a bunch of poor people with no job skills that will just compete against native workers for work and drive up housing costs?
Only Western governments like the USA do stupid (and evil) things like that to their own citizens
It is appalling that this point is difficult to understand. But Redbrickbear gonna Redbrickbear.sombear said:I've not seen any Israelis or Israel supporters argue there are no civilian casualties. What they argue, me included, is that by and large Israel tries to limit civilian casualties while knowing it will still happen. It is impossible to fight Hamas in Gaza without substantial civilian casualties, and it is largely based on where Hamas resides and locates their weapons.Redbrickbear said:sombear said:First of all, nobody knows the number of casualties.cms186 said:nearly 2.5k children killed shows a "Lack of Restraint", yes, Hamas using Human Shields as a tactic is utterly despicable, but Israel just saying "**** it, who gives a **** about civilians, fire the missiles at them anyway" is just as bad.sombear said:How does this article show a lack of restraint?cms186 said:https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/child-casualties-gaza-growing-stain-our-collective-conscienceRD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:Palestine is a terrorist state not actually recognized by the United States. The Israelis are showing great restraint. Way past time turning Gaza into a s h I t stain.Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:Redbrickbear said:KaiBear said:
Millions more just like these filing pigs.
Israel is doomed .
They have at least 400 nukes and a 1st world economy and military.
Why would they be doomed?
Their largest neighbor Egypt (who is about as militarily competent as Mexico) even has a peace treaty with them that they have honored since 1979
Not only that....but fertility rates are a major sign of if your nation has a future. And Israel has a fertility rate of 3.0 (while most of the Europe and N. America are below replacement).
Israel's population is growing...with ultra-orthodox growing very fast.
[Israel's population will surge by 70 percent, to almost 16 million, by 2050, with the ultra-Orthodox accounting for about a third of all Israeli Jews]
How are they doomed? Can you name a European country that is going to have 70% population growth over the next 30 years and a 3.0 fertility rate? Its all the countries in Europe that you should be worried about...not Israel.
Israel does not have anything approaching 400 nukes.
And what nukes they do have are unusable for all practical purposes due to their country's small size and vulnerability to nuclear retaliation.
Israel remains surrounded by Muslim populations who hate them irregardless what treaties their leadership signs.
Muslim populations in the region are expanding far more rapidly than Jewish populations.
And Israel's own people are racked by increasing division.
You are not making an argument for the defense of Israel.
You are making an argument that Israel will never be safe in that part of the world.
So it either has to up and move to Madagascar or its has to genocide the entire Muslim population of the middle east and obliterate 18 sovereign countries over there?
After all...nukes, advanced economy, great & growing demographics, powerful military, ultra powerful USA ally....none of these things are still enough for Israel to be safe.
The anti-Zionist Jews I guess were right then.....trying to turn European Jewry into Levant farm peasants in the middle east was a mistake from the get go.
yeah "Great Restraint"
Are you demanding no civilian casualties?
Do you acknowledge Hamas uses school, places of worship, and hospitals as shields?
What would you do if you were Israel?
If I were Israel? i dunno, maybe not treat Palestinians like 2nd class citizens? Not seize their homes just to give to Jewish citizens? at times it seems like Israel has its own version of apartheid
Second, where is the evidence of indiscriminate bombing?
That all comes down to who you believe.
If you take a pro-Israel line you think there have been no civilian casualties and that all those Arabs killed in Gaza are seasoned Hamas fighters. And that there has never been any indiscriminate bombing.
If you take a more pro-Palestinian line then you think many thousands of civilians have been killed and that the IDF is laying waste to large parts of Gaza.
Most of the World (and on this forum) has already chosen a side on the trust issue.
I tend to think that in most savage ethnic conflicts like this one... that the answer is somewhere in the middle.
I doubt Israel goes out on a mission to destroy only arab civilian homes...and I also doubt they check that hard to make sure its just Hamas commanders they are bombing. And I think the mutual feelings of hate and mistrust have poisoned any trust between the two sides and they both assume the worst about the other.
And even with that, Israel has no doubt made mistakes. Unlike Hamas, however, Israel has a history of admitting mistakes.
This place is toxic. Unsubscribing
-Bono/Chitwood/Norman Dale/Sunny Ortiz/John Galt/and soon to be The Toxic Avenger
-Bono/Chitwood/Norman Dale/Sunny Ortiz/John Galt/and soon to be The Toxic Avenger
KaiBear said:100% correcthistorian said:
They did not need a working model beyond the history of republics in general (which was not stellar). America was a great experiment: could they make a republic work in this vast land? They really did not have a clear idea of that success until the "Revolution of 1800": Thomas Jefferson defeated John Adams in the election (while his party swept both houses of Congress) for the first peaceful transfer of power in human history.
The Iroquois system was not very similar to the American constitution. The Founders rejected the idea of a confederation & chose a republic. The Iroquois wasn't exactly a great model of success either: they survived but did not manage crises very well. They were divided during the French & Indian War, for example.
Well done sir.
I do know some things about history!
That's a rural high school!
All good points. The Roman Republic, however, was marred by much violence and ended in civil war and a monarchy. If memory serves (it's been a long time since I've studied Ancient Rome), assassination became a political staple in the later years of the republic. Caesar & the Ides of March was just a later example. I don't expect the Dutch Republic was as violent.
I'd like to note again that the theory advanced here - that there's no such thing as an innocent Palestinian, or no difference between Palestinians and Hamas, because they elected Hamas (back in 2007) - was bin Laden's view for why all Americans are legitimate military targets: https://t.co/FDy3sd473c
— Glenn Greenwald (@ggreenwald) October 25, 2023
You are quoting Hamas & Marxist propaganda. Israel's policies towards Arabs is nothing like apartheid. They have legal rights, are generally treated as equals (obviously not the terrorists), & are represented in the Knesset (their parliament).
The issues there are very complicated & the Israelis are not 100% innocent in everything but false attempts of moral equivalency do not achieve anything. They are based on lies.
The issues there are very complicated & the Israelis are not 100% innocent in everything but false attempts of moral equivalency do not achieve anything. They are based on lies.
RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:
The more Biden opens his mouth, the more I am convinced he is in support of the terrorists, - not Israel. Absolutely pathetic. We are so screwed as a country. The extremists have hijacked the Democrat Party.
Radical Marxists began taking over the Democrat party in 1968. It has only gotten steadily worse since then.
Show me a war with no civilian casualties. Jesus some of you are out of touch with reality. Look especially closely at conflicts in the ME where children are often firing RPGs and civilians used as shields, nevermind that this is non conventional warfare where not all combatants are wearing uniforms.
War is brutal, it's messy and it's one of the few places you might find actual equity in that rockets don't give an F if you're a civilian.
You cannot think that Hamas killing women and children and the elderly and infirm and the family dog is going to lead to retaliation whereby no civilians are killed. Some justice is restorative and some is punitive.
I also cannot believe that an Englishman would struggle with this concept unless he is very young as the IRA/UVF/UDA routinely killed civilians less than 30 years ago. It's what terrorists and terrorist armies do in the name of whatever cause they have (though almost all are really about power and/or money).
War is brutal, it's messy and it's one of the few places you might find actual equity in that rockets don't give an F if you're a civilian.
You cannot think that Hamas killing women and children and the elderly and infirm and the family dog is going to lead to retaliation whereby no civilians are killed. Some justice is restorative and some is punitive.
I also cannot believe that an Englishman would struggle with this concept unless he is very young as the IRA/UVF/UDA routinely killed civilians less than 30 years ago. It's what terrorists and terrorist armies do in the name of whatever cause they have (though almost all are really about power and/or money).
Who has made this argument?
I've seen it as a retort to pro-Palestine arguments that most Palestinians do not support Hamas. But I've not seen one person argue that, because they voted for Hamas, civilians are fair game and should be targeted.
GG is better than that tweet. He's not known for straw man arguments, but maybe he's trying to emulate other twitter keyboard warriors.
Hamas has CB plenty of rockets:
https://twitchy.com/amy-curtis/2023/10/25/after-un-aid-warning-redsteeze-notices-one-supply-not-running-low-in-gaza-n2388959
https://twitchy.com/amy-curtis/2023/10/25/after-un-aid-warning-redsteeze-notices-one-supply-not-running-low-in-gaza-n2388959
sombear said:
Who has made this argument?
I've seen it as a retort to pro-Palestine arguments that most Palestinians do not support Hamas. But I've not seen one person argue that, because they voted for Hamas, civilians are fair game and should be targeted.
GG is better than that tweet. He's not known for straw man arguments, but maybe he's trying to emulate other twitter keyboard warriors.
He ignored the real reason bin Laden felt justified in attacking American civilians. We reside in Dar al-Harb.
historian said:
All good points. The Roman Republic, however, was marred by much violence and ended in civil war and a monarchy. If memory serves (it's been a long time since I've studied Ancient Rome), assassination became a political staple in the later years of the republic. Caesar & the Ides of March was just a later example. I don't expect the Dutch Republic was as violent.
Yea, they had a good 250 year run before things began to break down into violence.
The Dutch were always more interested in trade and making money.
But they did eat their prime minister one time though
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johan_de_Witt
