President Trump announces military strikes on Iran: Operation Epic Fury

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Porteroso
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In reply to historian • 1:59p, 3/17/26
historian said:
boognish_bear said:

It's not unreasonable to expect every country that depends on oil from the Gulf to help escort their tankers through the Gulf. We don't get oil from there anymore because of our large volume of domestic production. In defending Gulf shipping, we are acting on behalf of everyone else.

I disagree. It might be reasonable to ask, but it is also reasonable for them to refuse. To accept is to involve their nation in a war, and I do not think it is reasonable for Europe to follow the United States into every war we start or choose.

Many of these countries have way more Muslim immigrants than we do, so I would imagine that the risk of domestic terrorism would be a much bigger factor than for the U.S.
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Osodecentx
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In reply to Mitch Blood Green • 2:23p, 3/17/26
Mitch Blood Green said:
Osodecentx said:
Mitch Blood Green said:
National Counterterrorism Center resigns over Iran war


And you know what that means….


It means I don't post the link.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/national-counterterrorism-center-resigns-iran-war-rcna263692


What does his resignation mean? I don't know
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Redbrickbear
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In reply to BearFan33 • 2:23p, 3/17/26
BearFan33 said:
Kent did this correctly. If your boss is going in directions you can't support and won't listen to your advice, you resign. You don't resist..

Iran is like if we are going down, we are going to make everyone feel the pain…

This is going to really strain relations within NATO and the Ukraine war. Next time Ukraine comes with its hand out, I suspect Trump is going to send them to Europe and rightfully so.


1. Yep, Kent has every right to resign…but not to do the "resistance" nonsense of undermining the President you serve by staying on and doing what you personally want.

2. And on Iran…Trump is right to be mad

We have been doing the heavy lifting on the Ukraine conflict (something that Europeans benefit from having a Ukraine free and aligned with them and a Russia weakened…far more benefit for them…than we would get honestly since it's less important to American security)

And of course there was this little thing called the former-Yugoslavia wars that Europe wanted us to intervene in…something we did for their sake…since we had almost nothing on the line in the balkans. But we led NATO into a military intervention since they wanted the area pacified.

And we have supported them time and again with money & men even when they would not meet basic low levels of NATO spending commitments.

Now Iran tries to choke off the worlds oil supply (all while being a Islamo-fascist regime that has funded terrorism for 40 years and desires a nuclear weapon) and yet now Europe tells us "no luck…sorry we can't help"

Pathetic
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william
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2:43p, 3/17/26
There's also the 'When In doubt Whip It Out' (WIDWIO) school* of military thought.....

- UF

* The LFS Military Doctrine.

D!

{ sipping AZ Iced tea }

Go Bears!!

Suelten los perros, amigos!!!
pro ecclesia, pro javelina
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D. C. Bear
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In reply to FLBear5630 • 2:48p, 3/17/26
FLBear5630 said:
Doc Holliday said:


Yeah, I would say. Some idiots think these guys know and do nothing. Guy just dedicated his life to working on protecting American since 9/11. His resignation letter is linked below. You may not agree with all his politics, I don't, but he knows war and intel.

It amazes me that otherwise intelligent people believe that all Government employees do nothing of value.



Joe Kent resignation as posted to Twitter - Joe Kent - Wikipedia

In a real quagmire here, it is a mess now that it is on and finishing Iran seems only logical move, but the cost is going to be too high for little return.


The operation has lasted less than a month so far. It may be a little early to characterize it as being a "real quagmire."

Do you know which war he lost his wife in? I am wondering whether he blames Israel for us removing Saddam from Kuwait or for removing Saddam from Baghdad, or maybe it was some other war he attributes to Israel? Perhaps Afghanistan?

Trump has never done diplomacy properly.
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Mitch Blood Green
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In reply to Osodecentx • 2:48p, 3/17/26
Osodecentx said:
Mitch Blood Green said:
Osodecentx said:
Mitch Blood Green said:
National Counterterrorism Center resigns over Iran war


And you know what that means….


It means I don't post the link.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/national-counterterrorism-center-resigns-iran-war-rcna263692


What does his resignation mean? I don't know

Embarrassment in the near term. Probably not enough authority to impact the agency.
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Osodecentx
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In reply to Mitch Blood Green • 2:52p, 3/17/26
Mitch Blood Green said:
Osodecentx said:
Mitch Blood Green said:
Osodecentx said:
Mitch Blood Green said:
National Counterterrorism Center resigns over Iran war


And you know what that means….


It means I don't post the link.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/national-counterterrorism-center-resigns-iran-war-rcna263692


What does his resignation mean? I don't know

Embarrassment in the near term. Probably not enough authority to impact the agency.


Another perspective:

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/good-riddance/

At first blush, the resignation of America's Director of the National Counterterrorism Center in wartime indeed, in protest against a war with the world's foremost exporter of Islamist terror is an unnerving development. Fortunately, the former director, Joe Kent, authored an open letter explaining the thinking that led him to abandon his post. A cursory survey of his deliberative process should reassure trepidatious Americans that they're better off without him.
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Wangchung
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In reply to Porteroso • 2:54p, 3/17/26
Porteroso said:
historian said:
boognish_bear said:

It's not unreasonable to expect every country that depends on oil from the Gulf to help escort their tankers through the Gulf. We don't get oil from there anymore because of our large volume of domestic production. In defending Gulf shipping, we are acting on behalf of everyone else.

I disagree. It might be reasonable to ask, but it is also reasonable for them to refuse. To accept is to involve their nation in a war, and I do not think it is reasonable for Europe to follow the United States into every war we start or choose.

Many of these countries have way more Muslim immigrants than we do, so I would imagine that the risk of domestic terrorism would be a much bigger factor than for the U.S.
That is true. Trump is right to get the countries that actually get their oil from the strait to deal with it and leave them to their own devices if they don't want to help now, but they absolutely have the right to not help now.
As far as not helping out of fear of the Muslims acting like Muslims in their countries, that's a crazy level of heckler's veto that should lead to civil war in any first world civilization.
Our vibrations were getting nasty. But why? I was puzzled, frustrated... Had we deteriorated to the level of dumb beasts?

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william
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In reply to Wangchung • 2:56p, 3/17/26
Wangchung said:
Porteroso said:
historian said:
boognish_bear said:

It's not unreasonable to expect every country that depends on oil from the Gulf to help escort their tankers through the Gulf. We don't get oil from there anymore because of our large volume of domestic production. In defending Gulf shipping, we are acting on behalf of everyone else.

I disagree. It might be reasonable to ask, but it is also reasonable for them to refuse. To accept is to involve their nation in a war, and I do not think it is reasonable for Europe to follow the United States into every war we start or choose.

Many of these countries have way more Muslim immigrants than we do, so I would imagine that the risk of domestic terrorism would be a much bigger factor than for the U.S.

That is true. Trump is right to let the countries that actually get their oil from the strait to deal with it and leave them to their own devices if they don't want to help now, but they absolutely have the right to not help now.
As far as not helping out of fear of the Muslims acting like Muslims in their countries, that's a crazy level of heckler's veto that should lead to civil war in any first world civilization.

They can refuse to assist - fine by them -

BUT No more Funding of NATO.....

They need to feel the consequences of their 20 years of Stupidity.

- UF

D!

pro ecclesia, pro javelina
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EatMoreSalmon
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In reply to boognish_bear • 2:58p, 3/17/26
boognish_bear said:

Misleading post. The "no threat" mentioned in the cited post was clearly only about an imminent threat to the west coast from drone strikes. It was not a claim that Iran "posed no threat" to the US.

A big reach, and intentional it appears.
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william
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In reply to Mitch Blood Green • 3:00p, 3/17/26
Mitch Blood Green said:
Osodecentx said:
Mitch Blood Green said:
Osodecentx said:
Mitch Blood Green said:
National Counterterrorism Center resigns over Iran war


And you know what that means….


It means I don't post the link.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/national-counterterrorism-center-resigns-iran-war-rcna263692


What does his resignation mean? I don't know

Embarrassment in the near term. Probably not enough authority to impact the agency.

I respect the man's service and his right to protest ........

BUT the facts on the ground belie literally everything he said.

So there is likely something else going on......

- UF

The good news is - the US and ISR are well along in meeting goals / objectives.

In fact, soon we could realistically dramatically scale back operations.



pro ecclesia, pro javelina
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Wangchung
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In reply to william • 3:03p, 3/17/26
william said:
Wangchung said:
Porteroso said:
historian said:
boognish_bear said:

It's not unreasonable to expect every country that depends on oil from the Gulf to help escort their tankers through the Gulf. We don't get oil from there anymore because of our large volume of domestic production. In defending Gulf shipping, we are acting on behalf of everyone else.

I disagree. It might be reasonable to ask, but it is also reasonable for them to refuse. To accept is to involve their nation in a war, and I do not think it is reasonable for Europe to follow the United States into every war we start or choose.

Many of these countries have way more Muslim immigrants than we do, so I would imagine that the risk of domestic terrorism would be a much bigger factor than for the U.S.

That is true. Trump is right to let the countries that actually get their oil from the strait to deal with it and leave them to their own devices if they don't want to help now, but they absolutely have the right to not help now.
As far as not helping out of fear of the Muslims acting like Muslims in their countries, that's a crazy level of heckler's veto that should lead to civil war in any first world civilization.

They can refuse to assist - fine by them -

BUT No more Funding of NATO.....

They need to feel the consequences of their 20 years of Stupidity.

- UF

D!

I say we tell them that, pretend it's our new policy but of course we would help if they were attacked. Can't leave their citizens vulnerable due to idiotic, suicidal globalists running their governments. IMMHOO
Our vibrations were getting nasty. But why? I was puzzled, frustrated... Had we deteriorated to the level of dumb beasts?

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FLBear5630
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In reply to D. C. Bear • 3:03p, 3/17/26
D. C. Bear said:
FLBear5630 said:
Doc Holliday said:


Yeah, I would say. Some idiots think these guys know and do nothing. Guy just dedicated his life to working on protecting American since 9/11. His resignation letter is linked below. You may not agree with all his politics, I don't, but he knows war and intel.

It amazes me that otherwise intelligent people believe that all Government employees do nothing of value.



Joe Kent resignation as posted to Twitter - Joe Kent - Wikipedia

In a real quagmire here, it is a mess now that it is on and finishing Iran seems only logical move, but the cost is going to be too high for little return.


The operation has lasted less than a month so far. It may be a little early to characterize it as being a "real quagmire."

Do you know which war he lost his wife in? I am wondering whether he blames Israel for us removing Saddam from Kuwait or for removing Saddam from Baghdad, or maybe it was some other war he attributes to Israel? Perhaps Afghanistan?

Trump has never done diplomacy properly.

Yeah, I agree on the diplomacy side.

As for quagmire, it is a month as you say, and he is begging other Nations to send ships. What was going to be an air attack is now at a minimum 2500 Marines on their way. Ground troops are now being reported as on the table as the CIA is reporting the regime will survive. So, I would say it is looking like a quagmire - an awkward, complex, or hazardous situation.

What would you call that? He has not prepped the American people or Congress for sending in troops or a long stay. I guess we just leave and Trump calls it a win...
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william
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In reply to william • 3:04p, 3/17/26
william said:
Wangchung said:
Porteroso said:
historian said:
boognish_bear said:

It's not unreasonable to expect every country that depends on oil from the Gulf to help escort their tankers through the Gulf. We don't get oil from there anymore because of our large volume of domestic production. In defending Gulf shipping, we are acting on behalf of everyone else.

I disagree. It might be reasonable to ask, but it is also reasonable for them to refuse. To accept is to involve their nation in a war, and I do not think it is reasonable for Europe to follow the United States into every war we start or choose.

Many of these countries have way more Muslim immigrants than we do, so I would imagine that the risk of domestic terrorism would be a much bigger factor than for the U.S.

That is true. Trump is right to let the countries that actually get their oil from the strait to deal with it and leave them to their own devices if they don't want to help now, but they absolutely have the right to not help now.
As far as not helping out of fear of the Muslims acting like Muslims in their countries, that's a crazy level of heckler's veto that should lead to civil war in any first world civilization.

They can refuse to assist - fine by them -

BUT No more Funding of NATO.....

They need to feel the consequences of their 20 years of Stupidity.

- UF

D!


... and the fact that's isn't an Arby's in ALL of Europe*.

Kultural Decay.

- UF

* banned preservatives, schmervatives.

D!
pro ecclesia, pro javelina
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Porteroso
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In reply to Wangchung • 3:08p, 3/17/26
Wangchung said:
Porteroso said:
historian said:
boognish_bear said:

It's not unreasonable to expect every country that depends on oil from the Gulf to help escort their tankers through the Gulf. We don't get oil from there anymore because of our large volume of domestic production. In defending Gulf shipping, we are acting on behalf of everyone else.

I disagree. It might be reasonable to ask, but it is also reasonable for them to refuse. To accept is to involve their nation in a war, and I do not think it is reasonable for Europe to follow the United States into every war we start or choose.

Many of these countries have way more Muslim immigrants than we do, so I would imagine that the risk of domestic terrorism would be a much bigger factor than for the U.S.
That is true. Trump is right to let the countries that actually get their oil from the strait to deal with it and leave them to their own devices if they don't want to help now, but they absolutely have the right to not help now.
As far as not helping out of fear of the Muslims acting like Muslims in their countries, that's a crazy level of heckler's veto that should lead to civil war in any first world civilization.

For better or worse it is something they have to think about. I don't think the US has really justified the war to its citizens, so how could Sweden for example justify piling on, to its citizens?

Once again, the sole reason we entered this war was because Israel said they wanted war, and invited us along. If Rubio can be believed.
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boognish_bear
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3:12p, 3/17/26
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D. C. Bear
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In reply to FLBear5630 • 3:20p, 3/17/26
FLBear5630 said:
D. C. Bear said:
FLBear5630 said:
Doc Holliday said:


Yeah, I would say. Some idiots think these guys know and do nothing. Guy just dedicated his life to working on protecting American since 9/11. His resignation letter is linked below. You may not agree with all his politics, I don't, but he knows war and intel.

It amazes me that otherwise intelligent people believe that all Government employees do nothing of value.



Joe Kent resignation as posted to Twitter - Joe Kent - Wikipedia

In a real quagmire here, it is a mess now that it is on and finishing Iran seems only logical move, but the cost is going to be too high for little return.


The operation has lasted less than a month so far. It may be a little early to characterize it as being a "real quagmire."

Do you know which war he lost his wife in? I am wondering whether he blames Israel for us removing Saddam from Kuwait or for removing Saddam from Baghdad, or maybe it was some other war he attributes to Israel? Perhaps Afghanistan?

Trump has never done diplomacy properly.

Yeah, I agree on the diplomacy side.

As for quagmire, it is a month as you say, and he is begging other Nations to send ships. What was going to be an air attack is now at a minimum 2500 Marines on their way. Ground troops are now being reported as on the table as the CIA is reporting the regime will survive. So, I would say it is looking like a quagmire - an awkward, complex, or hazardous situation.

What would you call that? He has not prepped the American people or Congress for sending in troops or a long stay. I guess we just leave and Trump calls it a win...



17 days. Too soon to say what will happen in the next 17 days.

I would not automatically trust the CIA's analysis. They don't have the best track record.

As for Trump not preparing the American people or Congress, that's kind of been his M.O. from day one, and day one of his presidency, not day one of this particular conflict.
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william
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In reply to william • 3:23p, 3/17/26
william said:
Mitch Blood Green said:
Osodecentx said:
Mitch Blood Green said:
Osodecentx said:
Mitch Blood Green said:
National Counterterrorism Center resigns over Iran war


And you know what that means….


It means I don't post the link.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/national-counterterrorism-center-resigns-iran-war-rcna263692


What does his resignation mean? I don't know

Embarrassment in the near term. Probably not enough authority to impact the agency.

I respect the man's service and his right to protest .........

BUT the facts on the ground belie literally everything he said.

So there is likely something else going on......

- UF

The good news is - the US and ISR are well along in meeting goals / objectives.

In fact, soon we could realistically dramatically scale back operations.


Joe Kent Previously Argued Iran Was Threat to the USA, Pushed for Wiping Out Nuclear, Missile Capabilities!

- UF

DEVELOPING!!
pro ecclesia, pro javelina
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boognish_bear
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In reply to D. C. Bear • 3:30p, 3/17/26
D. C. Bear said:
FLBear5630 said:
Doc Holliday said:


Yeah, I would say. Some idiots think these guys know and do nothing. Guy just dedicated his life to working on protecting American since 9/11. His resignation letter is linked below. You may not agree with all his politics, I don't, but he knows war and intel.

It amazes me that otherwise intelligent people believe that all Government employees do nothing of value.



Joe Kent resignation as posted to Twitter - Joe Kent - Wikipedia

In a real quagmire here, it is a mess now that it is on and finishing Iran seems only logical move, but the cost is going to be too high for little return.


Do you know which war he lost his wife in? I am wondering whether he blames Israel for us removing Saddam from Kuwait or for removing Saddam from Baghdad, or maybe it was some other war he attributes to Israel? Perhaps Afghanistan?



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Wangchung
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In reply to Porteroso • 3:33p, 3/17/26
Porteroso said:
Wangchung said:
Porteroso said:
historian said:
boognish_bear said:

It's not unreasonable to expect every country that depends on oil from the Gulf to help escort their tankers through the Gulf. We don't get oil from there anymore because of our large volume of domestic production. In defending Gulf shipping, we are acting on behalf of everyone else.

I disagree. It might be reasonable to ask, but it is also reasonable for them to refuse. To accept is to involve their nation in a war, and I do not think it is reasonable for Europe to follow the United States into every war we start or choose.

Many of these countries have way more Muslim immigrants than we do, so I would imagine that the risk of domestic terrorism would be a much bigger factor than for the U.S.
That is true. Trump is right to let the countries that actually get their oil from the strait to deal with it and leave them to their own devices if they don't want to help now, but they absolutely have the right to not help now.
As far as not helping out of fear of the Muslims acting like Muslims in their countries, that's a crazy level of heckler's veto that should lead to civil war in any first world civilization.

For better or worse it is something they have to think about. I don't think the US has really justified the war to its citizens, so how could Sweden for example justify piling on, to its citizens?

Once again, the sole reason we entered this war was because Israel said they wanted war, and invited us along. If Rubio can be believed.
Well, we entered the war because our history with Iran, Iran's history of terror across the world and because Israel knew Trump doesn't care about being liked politically if he thinks what he is doing is the right thing.
Trump didn't sell the war, but imagine being a salesman who has to have his pitch filtered by his enemy before his intended audience gets to hear it.
Our vibrations were getting nasty. But why? I was puzzled, frustrated... Had we deteriorated to the level of dumb beasts?

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The_barBEARian
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In reply to D. C. Bear • 3:41p, 3/17/26
D. C. Bear said:
FLBear5630 said:
Doc Holliday said:


Yeah, I would say. Some idiots think these guys know and do nothing. Guy just dedicated his life to working on protecting American since 9/11. His resignation letter is linked below. You may not agree with all his politics, I don't, but he knows war and intel.

It amazes me that otherwise intelligent people believe that all Government employees do nothing of value.



Joe Kent resignation as posted to Twitter - Joe Kent - Wikipedia

In a real quagmire here, it is a mess now that it is on and finishing Iran seems only logical move, but the cost is going to be too high for little return.


The operation has lasted less than a month so far. It may be a little early to characterize it as being a "real quagmire."

Do you know which war he lost his wife in? I am wondering whether he blames Israel for us removing Saddam from Kuwait or for removing Saddam from Baghdad, or maybe it was some other war he attributes to Israel? Perhaps Afghanistan?

Trump has never done diplomacy properly.


You still support the decision to remove Saddam?

Easily the most counter-productive and destructive move by any President in my lifetime.

It did nothing to benefit America. It did, however, benefit Israel as they thrive on chaos and instability.
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boognish_bear
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3:46p, 3/17/26
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The_barBEARian
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In reply to Osodecentx • 3:47p, 3/17/26
Osodecentx said:
Mitch Blood Green said:
Osodecentx said:
Mitch Blood Green said:
Osodecentx said:
Mitch Blood Green said:
National Counterterrorism Center resigns over Iran war


And you know what that means….


It means I don't post the link.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/national-counterterrorism-center-resigns-iran-war-rcna263692


What does his resignation mean? I don't know

Embarrassment in the near term. Probably not enough authority to impact the agency.


Another perspective:

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/good-riddance/

At first blush, the resignation of America's Director of the National Counterterrorism Center in wartime indeed, in protest against a war with the world's foremost exporter of Islamist terror is an unnerving development. Fortunately, the former director, Joe Kent, authored an open letter explaining the thinking that led him to abandon his post. A cursory survey of his deliberative process should reassure trepidatious Americans that they're better off without him.


Thank you for reposting this hasbara slop.

If I have to choose between Noah Rothman and Joe Kent... Bye Noah!
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boognish_bear
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3:51p, 3/17/26
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boognish_bear
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3:52p, 3/17/26
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KaiBear
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In reply to Redbrickbear • 3:59p, 3/17/26
Redbrickbear said:
BearFan33 said:
Kent did this correctly. If your boss is going in directions you can't support and won't listen to your advice, you resign. You don't resist..

Iran is like if we are going down, we are going to make everyone feel the pain…

This is going to really strain relations within NATO and the Ukraine war. Next time Ukraine comes with its hand out, I suspect Trump is going to send them to Europe and rightfully so.


1. Yep, Kent has every right to resign…but not to do the "resistance" nonsense of undermining the President you serve by staying on and doing what you personally want.

2. And on Iran…Trump is right to be mad

We have been doing the heavy lifting on the Ukraine conflict (something that Europeans benefit from having a Ukraine free and aligned with them and a Russia weakened…far more benefit for them…than we would get honestly since it's less important to American security)

And of course there was this little thing called the former-Yugoslavia wars that Europe wanted us to intervene in…something we did for their sake…since we had almost nothing on the line in the balkans. But we led NATO into a military intervention since they wanted the area pacified.

And we have supported them time and again with money & men even when they would not meet basic low levels of NATO spending commitments.

Now Iran tries to choke off the worlds oil supply (all while being a Islamo-fascist regime that has funded terrorism for 40 years and desires a nuclear weapon) and yet now Europe tells us "no luck…sorry we can't help"

Pathetic


Get out of NATO…..yesterday.
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The_barBEARian
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In reply to boognish_bear • 4:04p, 3/17/26
boognish_bear said:


He almost said dont worry Mike, you are on the good goy list....

Based on his sardonic tone and the fact that he gleefully walks around with a kill list... are we suppose to be happy Benjamin Netanyahu is alive at the end of this video?
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EatMoreSalmon
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In reply to boognish_bear • 4:13p, 3/17/26
boognish_bear said:
D. C. Bear said:
FLBear5630 said:
Doc Holliday said:


Yeah, I would say. Some idiots think these guys know and do nothing. Guy just dedicated his life to working on protecting American since 9/11. His resignation letter is linked below. You may not agree with all his politics, I don't, but he knows war and intel.

It amazes me that otherwise intelligent people believe that all Government employees do nothing of value.



Joe Kent resignation as posted to Twitter - Joe Kent - Wikipedia

In a real quagmire here, it is a mess now that it is on and finishing Iran seems only logical move, but the cost is going to be too high for little return.


Do you know which war he lost his wife in? I am wondering whether he blames Israel for us removing Saddam from Kuwait or for removing Saddam from Baghdad, or maybe it was some other war he attributes to Israel? Perhaps Afghanistan?




Very sad and difficult for him and family. Respect for both of them for their service. Honor for their great loss.
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The_barBEARian
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In reply to Wangchung • 4:20p, 3/17/26
Wangchung said:
Porteroso said:
Wangchung said:
Porteroso said:
historian said:
boognish_bear said:

It's not unreasonable to expect every country that depends on oil from the Gulf to help escort their tankers through the Gulf. We don't get oil from there anymore because of our large volume of domestic production. In defending Gulf shipping, we are acting on behalf of everyone else.

I disagree. It might be reasonable to ask, but it is also reasonable for them to refuse. To accept is to involve their nation in a war, and I do not think it is reasonable for Europe to follow the United States into every war we start or choose.

Many of these countries have way more Muslim immigrants than we do, so I would imagine that the risk of domestic terrorism would be a much bigger factor than for the U.S.

That is true. Trump is right to let the countries that actually get their oil from the strait to deal with it and leave them to their own devices if they don't want to help now, but they absolutely have the right to not help now.
As far as not helping out of fear of the Muslims acting like Muslims in their countries, that's a crazy level of heckler's veto that should lead to civil war in any first world civilization.

For better or worse it is something they have to think about. I don't think the US has really justified the war to its citizens, so how could Sweden for example justify piling on, to its citizens?

Once again, the sole reason we entered this war was because Israel said they wanted war, and invited us along. If Rubio can be believed.

Well, we entered the war because our history with Iran, Iran's history of terror across the world and because Israel knew Trump doesn't care about being liked politically if he thinks what he is doing is the right thing.
Trump didn't sell the war, but imagine being a salesman who has to have his pitch filtered by his enemy before his intended audience gets to hear it.


The problem is Trump isn't doing what's best for the American people.

He is running around the white house telling reporters that high gas prices (which determines the price of all other goods) are not a big deal and **** whoever complains about it.
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RD2WINAGNBEAR86
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In reply to The_barBEARian • 4:38p, 3/17/26
The_barBEARian said:
Wangchung said:
Porteroso said:
Wangchung said:
Porteroso said:
historian said:
boognish_bear said:

It's not unreasonable to expect every country that depends on oil from the Gulf to help escort their tankers through the Gulf. We don't get oil from there anymore because of our large volume of domestic production. In defending Gulf shipping, we are acting on behalf of everyone else.

I disagree. It might be reasonable to ask, but it is also reasonable for them to refuse. To accept is to involve their nation in a war, and I do not think it is reasonable for Europe to follow the United States into every war we start or choose.

Many of these countries have way more Muslim immigrants than we do, so I would imagine that the risk of domestic terrorism would be a much bigger factor than for the U.S.

That is true. Trump is right to let the countries that actually get their oil from the strait to deal with it and leave them to their own devices if they don't want to help now, but they absolutely have the right to not help now.
As far as not helping out of fear of the Muslims acting like Muslims in their countries, that's a crazy level of heckler's veto that should lead to civil war in any first world civilization.

For better or worse it is something they have to think about. I don't think the US has really justified the war to its citizens, so how could Sweden for example justify piling on, to its citizens?

Once again, the sole reason we entered this war was because Israel said they wanted war, and invited us along. If Rubio can be believed.

Well, we entered the war because our history with Iran, Iran's history of terror across the world and because Israel knew Trump doesn't care about being liked politically if he thinks what he is doing is the right thing.
Trump didn't sell the war, but imagine being a salesman who has to have his pitch filtered by his enemy before his intended audience gets to hear it.


The problem is Trump isn't doing what's best for the American people.

He is running around the white house telling reporters that high gas prices (which determines the price of all other goods) are not a big deal and **** whoever complains about it.

Good post, barBEARian.

Trump now seems surprised he has no allies when one of his first acts when entering the office was to start a trade war with the world and give the finger to our best allies. He should not be surprised he is not getting much cooperation. As the old saying goes, the chickens have come home to roost.
Call it a tax, the people are outraged! Call it a tariff, the people get out their checkbooks and wave their American flags!!!
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D. C. Bear
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In reply to The_barBEARian • 5:00p, 3/17/26
The_barBEARian said:
D. C. Bear said:
FLBear5630 said:
Doc Holliday said:


Yeah, I would say. Some idiots think these guys know and do nothing. Guy just dedicated his life to working on protecting American since 9/11. His resignation letter is linked below. You may not agree with all his politics, I don't, but he knows war and intel.

It amazes me that otherwise intelligent people believe that all Government employees do nothing of value.



Joe Kent resignation as posted to Twitter - Joe Kent - Wikipedia

In a real quagmire here, it is a mess now that it is on and finishing Iran seems only logical move, but the cost is going to be too high for little return.


The operation has lasted less than a month so far. It may be a little early to characterize it as being a "real quagmire."

Do you know which war he lost his wife in? I am wondering whether he blames Israel for us removing Saddam from Kuwait or for removing Saddam from Baghdad, or maybe it was some other war he attributes to Israel? Perhaps Afghanistan?

Trump has never done diplomacy properly.


You still support the decision to remove Saddam?

Easily the most counter-productive and destructive move by any President in my lifetime.

It did nothing to benefit America. It did, however, benefit Israel as they thrive on chaos and instability.


We should have removed him promptly after he invaded Kuwait. Could have been in and out in a matter of months.

Israel does not thrive on chaos and instability.
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Realitybites
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In reply to KaiBear • 5:17p, 3/17/26
KaiBear said:

Get out of NATO…..yesterday.


Well, yes, but I would have preferred we do that because our NATO allies are slowly turning into -stans allied in a facist political union run from Brussels.

Not because Israel dragged us into another stupid war.
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Realitybites
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In reply to Osodecentx • 5:21p, 3/17/26
Osodecentx said:


Another perspective:

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/good-riddance/

At first blush, the resignation of America's Director of the National Counterterrorism Center in wartime indeed, in protest against a war with the world's foremost exporter of Islamist terror is an unnerving development. Fortunately, the former director, Joe Kent, authored an open letter explaining the thinking that led him to abandon his post. A cursory survey of his deliberative process should reassure trepidatious Americans that they're better off without him.


National Review is part of the problem, not the solution.
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The_barBEARian
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In reply to D. C. Bear • 5:26p, 3/17/26
D. C. Bear said:
The_barBEARian said:
D. C. Bear said:
FLBear5630 said:
Doc Holliday said:


Yeah, I would say. Some idiots think these guys know and do nothing. Guy just dedicated his life to working on protecting American since 9/11. His resignation letter is linked below. You may not agree with all his politics, I don't, but he knows war and intel.

It amazes me that otherwise intelligent people believe that all Government employees do nothing of value.



Joe Kent resignation as posted to Twitter - Joe Kent - Wikipedia

In a real quagmire here, it is a mess now that it is on and finishing Iran seems only logical move, but the cost is going to be too high for little return.


The operation has lasted less than a month so far. It may be a little early to characterize it as being a "real quagmire."

Do you know which war he lost his wife in? I am wondering whether he blames Israel for us removing Saddam from Kuwait or for removing Saddam from Baghdad, or maybe it was some other war he attributes to Israel? Perhaps Afghanistan?

Trump has never done diplomacy properly.


You still support the decision to remove Saddam?

Easily the most counter-productive and destructive move by any President in my lifetime.

It did nothing to benefit America. It did, however, benefit Israel as they thrive on chaos and instability.


We should have removed him promptly after he invaded Kuwait. Could have been in and out in a matter of months.

Israel does not thrive on chaos and instability.


They absolutely do.

They took back the Golan Heights after the Syrian regime feel.

They are now using seizing this moment to take 20% of Lebanon.

And no. We never should have never removed Saddam. He was an oppositional force to Iran. After we removed him, Iranian backed Shia militias took over Iraq. America wasted $8 trillion dollars and ended with nothing to show for it.

Not to mention the Iraq civil war was the prelude to horde of refugee migrants getting displaced from the middle east and invading all of Europe.

I have to assume anyone who says removing Saddam was the right move works for the MIC and personally profit from endless wars.
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Realitybites
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5:32p, 3/17/26
And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, Come and see. And I beheld, and lo a black horse; and he that sat on him had a pair of balances in his hand. And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say, A measure of wheat for a penny, and three measures of barley for a penny; and see thou hurt not the oil and the wine. (Revelation 6:5-7)

Trump Admin Seeks Alternative Fertilizer Supplies

The Trump administration is working on securing alternative fertilizer supplies for U.S. farmers as conflict with Iran threatens shipping through the Gulf, White House economic adviser Kevin Hassett said on March 17.

Fertilizer is critical to crop yields and the global food supply. Most fertilizers contain nitrogen, phosphorus, and potassium, the three primary nutrients needed for plant growth, according to the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency.

A March 11 report by the Center for Strategic and International Studies said that 20 to 30 percent of global fertilizer exports, including about 35 percent, of urea shipments, transited the Strait of Hormuz in 2023.

European Union foreign policy chief Kaja Kallas warned on March 16 that shortages could have long-term consequences.

"If there is a lack of fertilizers this year, there's going to be also food deprivation next year," she said.
German Foreign Minister Johann Wadephul also cautioned on March 16 that shipping disruptions in the Gulf could drive up global food prices because fertilizers move through the region.

Hassett acknowledged disruptions could not be fully eliminated.

Mountain House Meals (no affiliation with this company other than having a year's worth of their product in the survival closet).

Also canned fruit/citrus. An orange a day keeps the Scurvey away.

You're welcome.
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