Abbott signs "anti-critical race theory" bill into law

9,673 Views | 292 Replies | Last: 3 mo ago by quash
BusyTarpDuster2017
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quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.

That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.
Have you considered that unlimited freedom might yield worse results than statism?

I have considered that freedom, and rights, are not unlimited. A free society is always better than an authoritarian idea-banning state.

Always.

You disagree, I get that.

So, you would support schools being able to teach the idea that slavery existed because of the genetic superiority of whites over blacks? The idea that violent islamofascism against the West and its citizens is a just recompense for the West's imperialist oppression? The ideas of NAMBLA which extols the merits of man-boy love?
HuMcK
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Lol "wrecking society"? I haven't seen any compelling evidence at all that it's being taught in public schools, or even college undergrad level history courses, certainly not widespread in any real sense of the word. Even you wouldn't have known what CRT stood for 2yrs ago, before your propaganda masters told you it was the next great racial threat to take up arms against. Just like crusades against creeping sharia and immigration animated the white conservative base for decades.

Now you've got people showing up to scream at unsuspecting teachers because some Facebook propaganda told them their kids were being fed "race-based marxism" or whatever. And the same (white) crowd that insisted on keeping confederate statues for the sake of "history" is passing laws to censor what concepts educators can talk about when it comes to history.
Doc Holliday
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HuMcK said:

Lol "wrecking society"? I haven't seen any compelling evidence at all that it's being taught in public schools, or even college undergrad level history courses, certainly not widespread in any real sense of the word. Even you wouldn't have known what CRT stood for 2yrs ago, before your propaganda masters told you it was the next great racial threat to take up arms against. Just like crusades against creeping sharia and immigration animated the white conservative base for decades.

Now you've got people showing up to scream at unsuspecting teachers because some Facebook propaganda told them their kids were being fed "race-based marxism" or whatever. And the same (white) crowd that insisted on keeping confederate statues for the sake of "history" is passing laws to censor what concepts educators can talk about when it comes to history.
If you don't buy into CRT, then what's your problem with people who are actively against it?
Canon
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quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.


That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.





Yes, and it does operate with free speech by individuals and private entities.


But, these ideas should not be sanctioned and taught by government institutions, any more than a religion should be taught by government institutions.

That is where the line should be drawn.

Teaching this garbage in schools is not drawing that line.


Let Canon come in and tell the students why CRT is bad. Or have the teacher explain what it is and what it isn't. Don't have the state issue a ban on an idea.

I don't understand why this is so hard.



The ban would be on all other, truthful, narratives. CRT, when taught by the state, is the thought that stops thought. It declares opposition to its own intrinsic racism is the worst kind of racism. It tells children their skin makes them evil and then, via Kafka trap, tells them their objection to that is proof they are evil. CRT ends thought. CRT ends debate. CRT is a hateful, false and destructive narrative intended to tribalize and fracture. It's disgusting and should only be discussed in the same context as National Socialism and Soviet Socialism.....as thoroughly discredited and false ideologies fit for the bin.
HuMcK
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Those people are systematically expanding the definition of "CRT" to further their political interests. They've got their followers supporting literal speech censorship laws banning the discussion of concepts the state views as undesirable in public education. It's the same group of people who advocate for overturning democratic election results to install a (white) authoritarian leader under the pretense of fraud.
Rawhide
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Waco1947 said:

Replying to @GimmeNature1976 and @KurtSchlichter and muddybrazos
@KurtSchlichter, what's the title of the session?
1) CRT is not about individual behavior, it is about systems & policies.
2) CRT is a way to dig down to foundation of our systems & social structures & analyze the role race has played, continues to play in society.
@wrestlejammer
So what extra rights do I have today that any black doesn't have?
D. C. Bear
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Canon said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.


That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.





Yes, and it does operate with free speech by individuals and private entities.


But, these ideas should not be sanctioned and taught by government institutions, any more than a religion should be taught by government institutions.

That is where the line should be drawn.

Teaching this garbage in schools is not drawing that line.


Let Canon come in and tell the students why CRT is bad. Or have the teacher explain what it is and what it isn't. Don't have the state issue a ban on an idea.

I don't understand why this is so hard.



The ban would be on all other, truthful, narratives. CRT, when taught by the state, is the thought that stops thought. It declares opposition to its own intrinsic racism is the worst kind of racism. It tells children their skin makes them evil and then, via Kafka trap, tells them their objection to that is proof they are evil. CRT ends thought. CRT ends debate. CRT is a hateful, false and destructive narrative intended to tribalize and fracture. It's disgusting and should only be discussed in the same context as National Socialism and Soviet Socialism.....as thoroughly discredited and false ideologies fit for the bin.


Yep. You are just in denial if you object. Like something out of the old Soviet Union or Mao's China.

It also tells black kids that they are defined primarily by their race and that their race inevitably drives arc of their life. In that sense, it shares common cause with white supremacy.
Forest Bueller_bf
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Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.

That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.
Have you considered that unlimited freedom might yield worse results than statism?

I have considered that freedom, and rights, are not unlimited. A free society is always better than an authoritarian idea-banning state.

Always.

You disagree, I get that.

I don't believe the argument is framed correctly.

CRT negates other race based teaching concepts. Allowing it bans other ideas. You can't teach MLK and CRT because they invalidate each other.

It's replacement.
I think we all frame things to make our side of an argument look better no doubt about that.

Sure in a free society people should be free to come up with incredibly bad ideas even theories of how our society operates.

When those theories become the operating system where our government classrooms teach young impressionable minds, those theories have no place being taught as the status quo by our government schools.

quash
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Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.

That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.
Have you considered that unlimited freedom might yield worse results than statism?

I have considered that freedom, and rights, are not unlimited. A free society is always better than an authoritarian idea-banning state.

Always.

You disagree, I get that.

I don't believe the argument is framed correctly.

CRT negates other race based teaching concepts. Allowing it bans other ideas. You can't teach MLK and CRT because they invalidate each other.

It's replacement.

You can narrow down and redefine all you want to make yourself comfortable with banning an idea. I will never be comfortable with that.

“Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” (The Law, p.6) Frederic Bastiat
quash
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BusyTarpDuster2017 said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.

That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.
Have you considered that unlimited freedom might yield worse results than statism?

I have considered that freedom, and rights, are not unlimited. A free society is always better than an authoritarian idea-banning state.

Always.

You disagree, I get that.

So, you would support schools being able to teach the idea that slavery existed because of the genetic superiority of whites over blacks? The idea that violent islamofascism against the West and its citizens is a just recompense for the West's imperialist oppression? The ideas of NAMBLA which extols the merits of man-boy love?

Sigh. I don't support banning ideas.

What is it with this mindset that says "being for the freedom to do a thing is the same thing as supporting that thing"?

The LP is full of people who join because we support their freedom to do whatever it is that gets them tossed from polite company, from the company of people like you. Too many of them then get pissed at some other variant of freely expressed humanity and either try to run Them off or leave because we are too accepting of Them. Crazy because freedom is not just for me and what I believe in but also freedom for you and your freak flag.

If you need the force of government to win your argument maybe you need a better argument.

“Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” (The Law, p.6) Frederic Bastiat
quash
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HuMcK said:

Lol "wrecking society"? I haven't seen any compelling evidence at all that it's being taught in public schools, or even college undergrad level history courses, certainly not widespread in any real sense of the word. Even you wouldn't have known what CRT stood for 2yrs ago, before your propaganda masters told you it was the next great racial threat to take up arms against. Just like crusades against creeping sharia and immigration animated the white conservative base for decades.

Now you've got people showing up to scream at unsuspecting teachers because some Facebook propaganda told them their kids were being fed "race-based marxism" or whatever. And the same (white) crowd that insisted on keeping confederate statues for the sake of "history" is passing laws to censor what concepts educators can talk about when it comes to history.

More than 2 years, and it is absolutely being taught on campus.
“Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” (The Law, p.6) Frederic Bastiat
Sam Lowry
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HuMcK said:

It's the same group of people who advocate for overturning democratic election results to install a (white) authoritarian leader under the pretense of fraud.
That's not true. Liberals have every reason to be concerned, and many are. The same goes for conservatives who don't support the Big Lie.
Sam Lowry
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quash said:

BusyTarpDuster2017 said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.

That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.
Have you considered that unlimited freedom might yield worse results than statism?

I have considered that freedom, and rights, are not unlimited. A free society is always better than an authoritarian idea-banning state.

Always.

You disagree, I get that.

So, you would support schools being able to teach the idea that slavery existed because of the genetic superiority of whites over blacks? The idea that violent islamofascism against the West and its citizens is a just recompense for the West's imperialist oppression? The ideas of NAMBLA which extols the merits of man-boy love?

Sigh. I don't support banning ideas.

What is it with this mindset that says "being for the freedom to do a thing is the same thing as supporting that thing"?

The LP is full of people who join because we support their freedom to do whatever it is that gets them tossed from polite company, from the company of people like you. Too many of them then get pissed at some other variant of freely expressed humanity and either try to run Them off or leave because we are too accepting of Them. Crazy because freedom is not just for me and what I believe in but also freedom for you and your freak flag.

If you need the force of government to win your argument maybe you need a better argument.


If we're going to have government schools, inevitably the government will set some standards. You can teach about religion, but you can't teach religion. The same should apply to CRT.

I don't see that as a ban. In libertarian terms, it's just saying feel free to push your agenda but don't expect to use state resources.
BusyTarpDuster2017
How long do you want to ignore this user?
quash said:

BusyTarpDuster2017 said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.

That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.
Have you considered that unlimited freedom might yield worse results than statism?

I have considered that freedom, and rights, are not unlimited. A free society is always better than an authoritarian idea-banning state.

Always.

You disagree, I get that.

So, you would support schools being able to teach the idea that slavery existed because of the genetic superiority of whites over blacks? The idea that violent islamofascism against the West and its citizens is a just recompense for the West's imperialist oppression? The ideas of NAMBLA which extols the merits of man-boy love?

Sigh. I don't support banning ideas.

What is it with this mindset that says "being for the freedom to do a thing is the same thing as supporting that thing"?

The LP is full of people who join because we support their freedom to do whatever it is that gets them tossed from polite company, from the company of people like you. Too many of them then get pissed at some other variant of freely expressed humanity and either try to run Them off or leave because we are too accepting of Them. Crazy because freedom is not just for me and what I believe in but also freedom for you and your freak flag.

If you need the force of government to win your argument maybe you need a better argument.


I didn't ask if you supported those things, guy who can't read. You really are SO bad at this.

I asked if you supported public schools being able to teach those freakishly bad ideas. What I'm getting is that you would support public schools being able to teach and promote white supremacy. Meaning, that it should NOT be prevented. Do I have that right?
Rawhide
How long do you want to ignore this user?
quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.

That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.
Have you considered that unlimited freedom might yield worse results than statism?

I have considered that freedom, and rights, are not unlimited. A free society is always better than an authoritarian idea-banning state.

Always.

You disagree, I get that.

I don't believe the argument is framed correctly.

CRT negates other race based teaching concepts. Allowing it bans other ideas. You can't teach MLK and CRT because they invalidate each other.

It's replacement.

You can narrow down and redefine all you want to make yourself comfortable with banning an idea. I will never be comfortable with that.


If the state gov't is banning this "idea" from being taught at a public gov't school... I don't have as much of an issue with it.

Now, if the state gov't wants to put the same restrictions on a private school, then I have a problem with it.

Much like the gov't telling private businesses that they can't discriminate for whatever reason they want, I take issue with. But if the gov't wants to make it illegal for other gov't entities like schools or DMVs or courthouses or gov't admins, etc... to discriminate. Not so much of an issue with it.

Mask mandate too... if the gov't wants to require masks in state parks, public parks, public buildings or the like... no issue. The state requiring George's Restaurant to require masks - big issue.
quash
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Sam Lowry said:

quash said:

BusyTarpDuster2017 said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.

That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.
Have you considered that unlimited freedom might yield worse results than statism?

I have considered that freedom, and rights, are not unlimited. A free society is always better than an authoritarian idea-banning state.

Always.

You disagree, I get that.

So, you would support schools being able to teach the idea that slavery existed because of the genetic superiority of whites over blacks? The idea that violent islamofascism against the West and its citizens is a just recompense for the West's imperialist oppression? The ideas of NAMBLA which extols the merits of man-boy love?

Sigh. I don't support banning ideas.

What is it with this mindset that says "being for the freedom to do a thing is the same thing as supporting that thing"?

The LP is full of people who join because we support their freedom to do whatever it is that gets them tossed from polite company, from the company of people like you. Too many of them then get pissed at some other variant of freely expressed humanity and either try to run Them off or leave because we are too accepting of Them. Crazy because freedom is not just for me and what I believe in but also freedom for you and your freak flag.

If you need the force of government to win your argument maybe you need a better argument.


If we're going to have government schools, inevitably the government will set some standards. You can teach about religion, but you can't teach religion. The same should apply to CRT.

I don't see that as a ban. In libertarian terms, it's just saying feel free to push your agenda but don't expect to use state resources.

This bill didn't make the distinction you are making. As a result, snowflakes like we have here will use the CRT ban to assail teachers/schools who teach anything that might get covered by CRT. Like slavery being a cause of the Civil War.
“Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” (The Law, p.6) Frederic Bastiat
Forest Bueller_bf
How long do you want to ignore this user?
BusyTarpDuster2017 said:

quash said:

BusyTarpDuster2017 said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.

That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.
Have you considered that unlimited freedom might yield worse results than statism?

I have considered that freedom, and rights, are not unlimited. A free society is always better than an authoritarian idea-banning state.

Always.

You disagree, I get that.

So, you would support schools being able to teach the idea that slavery existed because of the genetic superiority of whites over blacks? The idea that violent islamofascism against the West and its citizens is a just recompense for the West's imperialist oppression? The ideas of NAMBLA which extols the merits of man-boy love?

Sigh. I don't support banning ideas.

What is it with this mindset that says "being for the freedom to do a thing is the same thing as supporting that thing"?

The LP is full of people who join because we support their freedom to do whatever it is that gets them tossed from polite company, from the company of people like you. Too many of them then get pissed at some other variant of freely expressed humanity and either try to run Them off or leave because we are too accepting of Them. Crazy because freedom is not just for me and what I believe in but also freedom for you and your freak flag.

If you need the force of government to win your argument maybe you need a better argument.


I didn't ask if you supported those things, guy who can't read. You really are SO bad at this.

I asked if you supported public schools being able to teach those freakishly bad ideas. What I'm getting is that you would support public schools being able to teach and promote white supremacy. Meaning, that it should NOT be prevented. Do I have that right?
Well I will tell you if the government schools started teaching Christ as the only way to salvation, all other ways lead to hell, Many ok with CRT, would not be ok with that.

This is getting silly though. There is a teaching, an ideology, a religion, a theory that every single individual would have issue with it being forced taught in all government schools. That's kinda what the Nazi's did, used schools to indoctrinate and I will add were very proficient at it.
Sam Lowry
How long do you want to ignore this user?
quash said:

Sam Lowry said:

quash said:

BusyTarpDuster2017 said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.

That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.
Have you considered that unlimited freedom might yield worse results than statism?

I have considered that freedom, and rights, are not unlimited. A free society is always better than an authoritarian idea-banning state.

Always.

You disagree, I get that.

So, you would support schools being able to teach the idea that slavery existed because of the genetic superiority of whites over blacks? The idea that violent islamofascism against the West and its citizens is a just recompense for the West's imperialist oppression? The ideas of NAMBLA which extols the merits of man-boy love?

Sigh. I don't support banning ideas.

What is it with this mindset that says "being for the freedom to do a thing is the same thing as supporting that thing"?

The LP is full of people who join because we support their freedom to do whatever it is that gets them tossed from polite company, from the company of people like you. Too many of them then get pissed at some other variant of freely expressed humanity and either try to run Them off or leave because we are too accepting of Them. Crazy because freedom is not just for me and what I believe in but also freedom for you and your freak flag.

If you need the force of government to win your argument maybe you need a better argument.


If we're going to have government schools, inevitably the government will set some standards. You can teach about religion, but you can't teach religion. The same should apply to CRT.

I don't see that as a ban. In libertarian terms, it's just saying feel free to push your agenda but don't expect to use state resources.

This bill didn't make the distinction you are making. As a result, snowflakes like we have here will use the CRT ban to assail teachers/schools who teach anything that might get covered by CRT. Like slavery being a cause of the Civil War.

Why am I reminded of acorns?
BusyTarpDuster2017
How long do you want to ignore this user?
So, am I gonna get an answer? Do you support public schools being able to teach and promote ideas of white supremacy, or not?

C'mon man, you were the one who came on here like the high and mighty, principled libertarian and was against banning ideas in public schools. So don't run off like a coward when challenged. Man up, and stick to your guns. If you are against banning ideas in public schools, then you support schools being able to teach white supremacy without state interference. Is that correct?
Redbrickbear
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BusyTarpDuster2017 said:

So, am I gonna get an answer? Do you support public schools being able to teach and promote ideas of white supremacy, or not?

C'mon man, you were the one who came on here like the high and mighty, principled libertarian and was against banning ideas in public schools. So don't run off like a coward when challenged. Man up, and stick to your guns. If you are against banning ideas in public schools, then you support schools being able to teach white supremacy without state interference. Is that correct?
If the voters can't decide what their taxpayer money is spent on teaching in their local public schools....especially around issues of history/civics/national idenity...it becomes difficult to argue that America is no longer a democracy in any meaningful sense.

Federal government mandates in history by Howard Zinn & the Berkeley faculty.

Its also funny that libertarians are the ones defending leftist indoctrination as "market place of ideas"

And lets get this straight...there is no "market place of ideas" when dealing with 8 year olds in a public school setting away from their parents. They are not going to be in a position developmentally to push back against what their teachers are telling them...or take the heat and argue with a emotionally unstable blue haired obese teacho-potamus.

CRT isn't a subject that is taught. CRT is a pedagogical style of teaching, one where everything is viewed in terms of conflicting power structures between races. With whites of course always the oppressor/aggressor/victimizer. Conservatives aren't banning a subject. They're banning a pedagogy of education.
Redbrickbear
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Proud 1992 Alum said:

Booray said:

Proud 1992 Alum said:

An example of this CRT thinking is the new math guidelines that basically said that the idea that there is a correct answer to a mathematical equation is a product of white supremacy. Crazy sh*.


Link?


California Leftists Try to Cancel Math Class https://www.wsj.com/articles/california-leftists-try-to-cancel-math-class-11621355858

https://katu.com/news/local/debate-emerges-over-racism-and-white-supremacy-in-math-instruction

https://www.baltimoresun.com/maryland/carroll/opinion/cc-op-sprinkle-031321-20210313-m2lg4tomcndolfj5kebf6asike-story.html

Includes these gems:

The Oregon DOE states: "The concept of mathematics being purely objective is unequivocally false." Tracy Castro-Gill, the ethnic studies program manager of the Seattle Public School, suggests that the problem is "how math is used as a tool for oppression."

But the Oregon DOE is not alone in distributing its racist mathematics propaganda. Reported by David Freddoso of the Washington Examiner, Rochelle Gutierrez, education professor at the University of Illinois, stated, "On many levels, mathematics itself operates as Whiteness."

Another group known as the Mathematical Association of America released a statement on Oct. 2, declaring: "As mathematicians we see the pattern of science being ignored [speaking specifically of the federal response to COVID-19] and the pattern of violence against our colleagues that give rise to race and racism." The MMA continues, "It's time for all members of our profession to acknowledge that mathematics is created by humans and therefore inherently carries human biases."

Laurie Rubel, Brooklyn College Professor of Math Education, offered her words of wisdom on Twitter, writing that the 2+2=4 equation "reeks of white supremacist patriarchy."


This is just the Lysenko phase of America's slouching trend toward intellectual neo-Bolshevism.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysenkoism
Forest Bueller_bf
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I completely disagree with her. Mathematics was not "created" by humans.

Incredibly intelligent humans "discovered" the symmetry and incredible physical order "created" by God and
were able to put a mathematical equation to it. Nothing more.

It is totally objective. It always works when used in the right situation, always and it was not discovered by white folks.

I understand most academics will not credit God with creating that order, so ordered, that mathematic applications can be applied to it, but there it is.

Please don't let stupid people undo what brilliant minds have discovered.

How big of a moron do you have to be when you say 2+2=4 reeks of "white supremacy" or that it operates as "whiteness" when whites did not develop mathematics to start with.

Forest Bueller_bf
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Sam Lowry said:

quash said:

BusyTarpDuster2017 said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.

That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.
Have you considered that unlimited freedom might yield worse results than statism?

I have considered that freedom, and rights, are not unlimited. A free society is always better than an authoritarian idea-banning state.

Always.

You disagree, I get that.

So, you would support schools being able to teach the idea that slavery existed because of the genetic superiority of whites over blacks? The idea that violent islamofascism against the West and its citizens is a just recompense for the West's imperialist oppression? The ideas of NAMBLA which extols the merits of man-boy love?

Sigh. I don't support banning ideas.

What is it with this mindset that says "being for the freedom to do a thing is the same thing as supporting that thing"?

The LP is full of people who join because we support their freedom to do whatever it is that gets them tossed from polite company, from the company of people like you. Too many of them then get pissed at some other variant of freely expressed humanity and either try to run Them off or leave because we are too accepting of Them. Crazy because freedom is not just for me and what I believe in but also freedom for you and your freak flag.

If you need the force of government to win your argument maybe you need a better argument.


If we're going to have government schools, inevitably the government will set some standards. You can teach about religion, but you can't teach religion. The same should apply to CRT.

I don't see that as a ban. In libertarian terms, it's just saying feel free to push your agenda but don't expect to use state resources.
Agree with this, it is an idea, but it is not the standard. Heaven help us all if it ever is. It can be taught as what it is, a far left academic theory that has no practical application.
Redbrickbear
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Forest Bueller_bf said:

Sam Lowry said:

quash said:

BusyTarpDuster2017 said:

quash said:

Doc Holliday said:

quash said:

Forest Bueller said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.



Wished they could have banned the ideas of..

Slavery
Nazism
Marxism
Communism
etc.

before they became reality.

At some point, before they became reality, these realities were just ideas in some misguided persons mind.

That's not how free societies operate. That's how statists operate.
Have you considered that unlimited freedom might yield worse results than statism?

I have considered that freedom, and rights, are not unlimited. A free society is always better than an authoritarian idea-banning state.

Always.

You disagree, I get that.

So, you would support schools being able to teach the idea that slavery existed because of the genetic superiority of whites over blacks? The idea that violent islamofascism against the West and its citizens is a just recompense for the West's imperialist oppression? The ideas of NAMBLA which extols the merits of man-boy love?

Sigh. I don't support banning ideas.

What is it with this mindset that says "being for the freedom to do a thing is the same thing as supporting that thing"?

The LP is full of people who join because we support their freedom to do whatever it is that gets them tossed from polite company, from the company of people like you. Too many of them then get pissed at some other variant of freely expressed humanity and either try to run Them off or leave because we are too accepting of Them. Crazy because freedom is not just for me and what I believe in but also freedom for you and your freak flag.

If you need the force of government to win your argument maybe you need a better argument.


If we're going to have government schools, inevitably the government will set some standards. You can teach about religion, but you can't teach religion. The same should apply to CRT.

I don't see that as a ban. In libertarian terms, it's just saying feel free to push your agenda but don't expect to use state resources.
Agree with this, it is an idea, but it is not the standard. Heaven help us all if it ever is. It can be taught as what it is, a far left academic theory that has no practical application.
It's very useful in deconstructing national identity....also very useful in acquiring and keeping political power.
Doc Holliday
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HuMcK said:

Lol "wrecking society"? I haven't seen any compelling evidence at all that it's being taught in public schools, or even college undergrad level history courses, certainly not widespread in any real sense of the word.
What is preventing it from being widespread?
Redbrickbear
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Teaching CRT (or CRT allied ideology) as a factual description of the world should be banned in tax-funded schools, just as we shouldn't allow teaching of astrology or phrenology or homeopathy or creationism, and for the same reasons.
ShooterTX
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How about schools perfect the very basic concepts of math, science and history, BEFORE they attempt to teach something as complex as racism?

There is no way that the average K-12 school could have possibly taught everything in history, to the point where they have nothing left to teach, except for current events.
Teachers waste time on Jan 6th while they totally fail to cover the Founding Fathers, World War 1,...etc.

Why would we EVER allow an education system that fails in the basics, to branch out and tackle something controversial and unnecessary like race? There is NO excuse for K-12 to attempt to "teach" on topics like racism. Stick to the damn facts and leave the rest to the parents.
ShooterTX
Canon
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Redbrickbear said:

Proud 1992 Alum said:

Booray said:

Proud 1992 Alum said:

An example of this CRT thinking is the new math guidelines that basically said that the idea that there is a correct answer to a mathematical equation is a product of white supremacy. Crazy sh*.


Link?


California Leftists Try to Cancel Math Class https://www.wsj.com/articles/california-leftists-try-to-cancel-math-class-11621355858

https://katu.com/news/local/debate-emerges-over-racism-and-white-supremacy-in-math-instruction

https://www.baltimoresun.com/maryland/carroll/opinion/cc-op-sprinkle-031321-20210313-m2lg4tomcndolfj5kebf6asike-story.html

Includes these gems:

The Oregon DOE states: "The concept of mathematics being purely objective is unequivocally false." Tracy Castro-Gill, the ethnic studies program manager of the Seattle Public School, suggests that the problem is "how math is used as a tool for oppression."

But the Oregon DOE is not alone in distributing its racist mathematics propaganda. Reported by David Freddoso of the Washington Examiner, Rochelle Gutierrez, education professor at the University of Illinois, stated, "On many levels, mathematics itself operates as Whiteness."

Another group known as the Mathematical Association of America released a statement on Oct. 2, declaring: "As mathematicians we see the pattern of science being ignored [speaking specifically of the federal response to COVID-19] and the pattern of violence against our colleagues that give rise to race and racism." The MMA continues, "It's time for all members of our profession to acknowledge that mathematics is created by humans and therefore inherently carries human biases."

Laurie Rubel, Brooklyn College Professor of Math Education, offered her words of wisdom on Twitter, writing that the 2+2=4 equation "reeks of white supremacist patriarchy."


This is just the Lysenko phase of America's slouching trend toward intellectual neo-Bolshevism.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysenkoism


Today I learned about Lysenkoism. Thank you.
Proud 1992 Alum
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ShooterTX
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D. C. Bear said:

Forest Bueller_bf said:

muddybrazos said:

Waco1947 said:

Rawhide said:

Waco1947 said:

Rawhide said:

quash said:

Rawhide said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.

You mean, kind of like big tech censoring and banning many conservatives from their social networks?

No. I mean like the state outlawing discussion of an idea.


So more like schools should be allowed to teach creationism/intelligent design
creationism is not science but theology and bad theology because it relies in superstition of ideas.
Hate to break it to ya'.... Critical Race Theory is not science either; hence the name THEORY
You dragged in a red herring. I don't know enough about CRT to address whether it claims to be science.
I need to be educated on crt


here is what it's all about.
Yes, PAYPAL me, that is what this is all about.


That's got to be a photoshop job.
People can't be that stupid, can they?


I posted a link to that video earlier... it's real and even worse when you hear her actual words.
ShooterTX
D. C. Bear
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ShooterTX said:

D. C. Bear said:

Forest Bueller_bf said:

muddybrazos said:

Waco1947 said:

Rawhide said:

Waco1947 said:

Rawhide said:

quash said:

Rawhide said:

quash said:

Canon said:

quash said:


Stupid bill. Nobody wins by banning ideas.


"There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped." G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy

Marxism is that thought.


Nobody wins by banning ideas.

Maybe authoritarians.

You mean, kind of like big tech censoring and banning many conservatives from their social networks?

No. I mean like the state outlawing discussion of an idea.


So more like schools should be allowed to teach creationism/intelligent design
creationism is not science but theology and bad theology because it relies in superstition of ideas.
Hate to break it to ya'.... Critical Race Theory is not science either; hence the name THEORY
You dragged in a red herring. I don't know enough about CRT to address whether it claims to be science.
I need to be educated on crt


here is what it's all about.
Yes, PAYPAL me, that is what this is all about.


That's got to be a photoshop job.
People can't be that stupid, can they?


I posted a link to that video earlier... it's real and even worse when you hear her actual words.


Amazing.
HuMcK
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First is censorship of ideas, then the ideological purges. Republicans seem to simultaneously want to force social media to broadcast their propaganda, but also censor the dissemination of concepts they deem undesirable (whether those concepts are actually being taught...or not). At the intersection of that contradiction lies authoritarianism.

Canon
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Sounds good. We need to weed Marxists out of our country, particularly in positions where they can propagandize children and young people.

Marxism is the thought that stops thought.
HuMcK
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Canon said:

Sounds good. We need to weed Marxists out of our country, particularly in positions where they can propagandize children and young people.

Marxism is the thought that stops thought.

Amazing, responds to a comment about conservatives censoring thought by operation of law...to complain that some strawman version of liberalism is what actually stops thought...

Brings to mind the famous Hemmingway quote: "There are many who do not know they are fascists, but will find it out when the times comes". All it takes is a recitation of the magic words "marxism/bolshevism/communism", and from there you'll justify almost anything.
Canon
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HuMcK said:

Canon said:

Sounds good. We need to weed Marxists out of our country, particularly in positions where they can propagandize children and young people.

Marxism is the thought that stops thought.

Amazing, responds to a comment about conservatives censoring thought by operation of law...to complain that some strawman version of liberalism is what actually stops thought...

Brings to mind the famous Hemmingway quote: "There are many who do not know they are fascists, but will find it out when the times comes". All it takes is a recitation of the magic words "marxism/bolshevism/communism", and from there you'll justify almost anything.


I'll see your Hemingway and raise you G.K. Chesterton 'There is a thought that stops thought. That is the only thought that ought to be stopped.'

Marxism led to the murders and subjugation of over a hundred million people. It ought to be stopped.
 
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