TellMeYouLoveMe said:

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GG1234 said:

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xiledinok said:

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GG1234 said:

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and it's been documented that the athletic department did not have Title 9 training for the coaches on how to report sexual assault. Other than reporting any incedent to the AD.

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So, they cannot report to Judicial Affairs or use some common sense. Using poor judgement on par with a homeless camp doesn't impress people.

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Look at it closer you don't know what happened. A YEAR later the player tells Barnes what happened as she is leaving the school. She and her parents told him they did not want to report it. Barnes called JA to see what the victim needed to do to report. He repeatedly asked his AD what could be done. The answer was from Ian that if the victim and parents didn't want to report then a report can't be made. None of the players were still on the football team at this point. PH said Barnes went above and beyond what was expected.
Also, Barnes was quietly let go without any compensation. At that time Ian thought the rape info would not get out.

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You'lll have to forgive me, D.C. Bear thinks it's a valid defense for a person that shoots up their work place with an assault rifle to say that they didn't go to a company training where they were specifically told, "It's wrong to shoot up your workplace with an assault rifle."

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No, I don't, and you example is stupid. You should be ashamed of yourself for using it.

I think it scapegoating to frame a situation in such a way as to place responsibility for that particular situation on generic "athletics personnel' when there is a whole lot more to the story. If Barnes wasn't trained in what he was supposed to report, it was not because McCaw didn't implement Title IX training in the athletic department, that's because Baylor didn't implement Title IX training across the institution. Other schools did. It wasn't that complicated.

Keyser Soze said:

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You are putting way too much emphasis on a single incident. They have been very clear that Briles was not terminated for any one thing. I think it was a longshot a good presentation could have saved him like McCaw, but I do think it finalized things - he was not the man to lead football to a cultural change.

I find this interesting in that the possibility of not firing was clearly considered. They just believe termination was the correct decision.

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I am not making the argument that Briles shouldn't have been fired and the "single incident," is not one that I chose to emphasize. The "single incident," as described by Baylor, is a clear example of scapegoating on their part if Barnes was, in fact, not trained to know that McCaw was not in his reporting chain for Title IX.

You want everyone to believe that the Volleyball coach needed a Title IX training manual to tell him he reported to the Director of Athletics.

I can tell this will be a productive discussion.

TellMeYouLoveMe said:

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You want everyone to believe that the Volleyball coach needed a Title IX training manual to tell him he reported to the Director of Athletics.

I can tell this will be a productive discussion.

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No, I want you to believe he needed Title IX training to know that he was NOT supposed to report to the Director of Athletics, but to a designated Title IX officer who was outside his normal chain of command.

D. C. Bear said:

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Keyser Soze said:

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You are putting way too much emphasis on a single incident. They have been very clear that Briles was not terminated for any one thing. I think it was a longshot a good presentation could have saved him like McCaw, but I do think it finalized things - he was not the man to lead football to a cultural change.

I find this interesting in that the possibility of not firing was clearly considered. They just believe termination was the correct decision.

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I am not making the argument that Briles shouldn't have been fired and the "single incident," is not one that I chose to emphasize. The "single incident," as described by Baylor, is a clear example of scapegoating on their part if Barnes was, in fact, not trained to know that McCaw was not in his reporting chain for Title IX.

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If you had kept up with more of my post on this topic you would have read that Baylor believed both Briles and McCaw knew the correct procedure.

Barnes clearly did not. Lack of training was widespread and fully acknowledged.

This is from the finding of facts - a point made before the football section

Prior to the 2014-2015 academic year, Baylor failed to conduct adequate training

and education for its students and employees, and Baylor had not created an atmosphere that
fostered reporting and participation in the Title IX process.

Despite everything that's out now. Imagine If Keyser and the few remaining BoR apologists simply spent half the energy wanting true progress and accountability for our university, instead of blatant shilling for the BoR at their becon call. When does it become obvious to even them that they will be on the wrong side of history on the absurdity of this scandal? When the checks stop coming?

It's like watching that old tape of Bill Clinton try to spin/fool an entire nation on technicalities regarding what the definition of "is" is, knowing he himself doesn't believe the crap coming out of his mouth .....

Keyser Soze said:

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D. C. Bear said:

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Keyser Soze said:

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You are putting way too much emphasis on a single incident. They have been very clear that Briles was not terminated for any one thing. I think it was a longshot a good presentation could have saved him like McCaw, but I do think it finalized things - he was not the man to lead football to a cultural change.

I find this interesting in that the possibility of not firing was clearly considered. They just believe termination was the correct decision.

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I am not making the argument that Briles shouldn't have been fired and the "single incident," is not one that I chose to emphasize. The "single incident," as described by Baylor, is a clear example of scapegoating on their part if Barnes was, in fact, not trained to know that McCaw was not in his reporting chain for Title IX.

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If you had kept up with more of my post on this topic you would have read that Baylor believed both Briles and McCaw knew the correct procedure.

Barnes clearly did not. Lack of training was widespread and fully acknowledged.

This is from the finding of facts - a point made before the football section

Prior to the 2014-2015 academic year, Baylor failed to conduct adequate training

and education for its students and employees, and Baylor had not created an atmosphere that
fostered reporting and participation in the Title IX process.

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I did see where you said "Baylor believed" Briles and McCaw knew the correct procedure. What I didn't see was "McCaw and Briles were trained in Title IX compliance rules, but Barnes was not. McCaw decided to lie to Barnes about the rules that he knew."

Lack of training may have been widespread but appear to have been ignored in the discussion of the "single incident." What role did Baylor's failure to train before 2014-2015 have on Barnes knowledge of what he was supposed to do (NOT report to McCaw, but to report to another specifically designated person). It had some role, and failure to mention it in a discussion of the "single incident" is evidence for scapegoating about that incident.

D. C. Bear said:

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TellMeYouLoveMe said:

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You want everyone to believe that the Volleyball coach needed a Title IX training manual to tell him he reported to the Director of Athletics.

I can tell this will be a productive discussion.

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No, I want you to believe he needed Title IX training to know that he was NOT supposed to report to the Director of Athletics, but to a designated Title IX officer who was outside his normal chain of command.

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Keep saying it until he gets it.

Keyser Soze said:

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You are putting way too much emphasis on a single incident. They have been very clear that Briles was not terminated for any one thing. I think it was a longshot a good presentation could have saved him like McCaw, but I do think it finalized things - he was not the man to lead football to a cultural change.

I find this interesting in that the possibility of not firing was clearly considered. They just believe termination was the correct decision.

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And I think this is why we are here still talking about stuff...to the world CAB is the face of the problem whether by design,plan scheme or just unfortunate timing and circumstances. It is not necessarily ridiculous that becasue of outside circumstances a majority on the BOR felt it necessary to terminate CAB. I just wish they would be more upfront, that while mistakes were made across the Board (no pun intended) it was a campus wide problem and while making a change at head coach there is nothing specific in CAB's conduct that warranted termination for cause...

Wait...technically all that has happened...so why is CAB still the face of the problem and why does BU and more of its fans who appreciated everything good CAB did not be more supportive of his efforts to get back into coaching? Why does BU continue to allow the media to wrongly put CAB as the face of this problem?

I am not arguing right or wrong to sever CAB...I am just pointing out what everyone knows CAB was not and is not and should not be the face of this issue...he has been punished far beyond what is logical.

Eball said:

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Keyser Soze said:

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You are putting way too much emphasis on a single incident. They have been very clear that Briles was not terminated for any one thing. I think it was a longshot a good presentation could have saved him like McCaw, but I do think it finalized things - he was not the man to lead football to a cultural change.

I find this interesting in that the possibility of not firing was clearly considered. They just believe termination was the correct decision.

---

And I think this is why we are here still talking about stuff...to the world CAB is the face of the problem whether by design,plan scheme or just unfortunate timing and circumstances. It is not necessarily ridiculous that becasue of outside circumstances a majority on the BOR felt it necessary to terminate CAB. I just wish they would be more upfront, that while mistakes were made across the Board (no pun intended) it was a campus wide problem and while making a change at head coach there is nothing specific in CAB's conduct that warranted termination for cause...

Wait...technically all that has happened...so why is CAB still the face of the problem and why does BU and more of its fans who appreciated everything good CAB did not be more supportive of his efforts to get back into coaching? Why does BU continue to allow the media to wrongly put CAB as the face of this problem?

I am not arguing right or wrong to sever CAB...I am just pointing out what everyone knows CAB was not and is not and should not be the face of this issue...he has been punished far beyond what is logical.

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Agree with most of that.

Briles made a long series of poor moves post firing. These moves really escalated things. Finally he had Cannon sue individual regents for the unflattering statements in the WSJ. I don't see how anyone would expect these same people to throw him a lift raft when the press is too hard on him. I can not think of any example where a former employer came to rescue from a harsh press about their fired Coach, President, or anyone.

Keyser Soze said:

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Eball said:

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Keyser Soze said:

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You are putting way too much emphasis on a single incident. They have been very clear that Briles was not terminated for any one thing. I think it was a longshot a good presentation could have saved him like McCaw, but I do think it finalized things - he was not the man to lead football to a cultural change.

I find this interesting in that the possibility of not firing was clearly considered. They just believe termination was the correct decision.

---

And I think this is why we are here still talking about stuff...to the world CAB is the face of the problem whether by design,plan scheme or just unfortunate timing and circumstances. It is not necessarily ridiculous that becasue of outside circumstances a majority on the BOR felt it necessary to terminate CAB. I just wish they would be more upfront, that while mistakes were made across the Board (no pun intended) it was a campus wide problem and while making a change at head coach there is nothing specific in CAB's conduct that warranted termination for cause...

Wait...technically all that has happened...so why is CAB still the face of the problem and why does BU and more of its fans who appreciated everything good CAB did not be more supportive of his efforts to get back into coaching? Why does BU continue to allow the media to wrongly put CAB as the face of this problem?

I am not arguing right or wrong to sever CAB...I am just pointing out what everyone knows CAB was not and is not and should not be the face of this issue...he has been punished far beyond what is logical.

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Agree with most of that.

Briles made a long series of poor moves post firing. These moves really escalated things. Finally he had Cannon sue individual regents for the unflattering statements in the WSJ. I don't see how anyone would expect these same people to throw him a lift raft when the press is too hard on him. I can not think of any example where a former employer came to rescue from a harsh press about their fired Coach, President, or anyone.

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Perhaps more accurate to say that Briles' allowed his attorneys to make some moves that backfired on him. Briles never struck me as the kind of guy who would dictate legal strategy; he entrusted that to his trusted professionals, which was a bit of the same failing to which he admitted regarding discipline.

Suing individual board members might have been a bad idea; nevertheless, I have little doubt that those board members were happy to throw him under the bus to deflect scrutiny from the institution's larger failures.

Your beloved "CAB" driver deserves what he got. Wait..................no he doesn't. He did not deserve the payoff he got to keep quiet. I would have preferred that he give his payoff to the female victims of his element he brought onto campus.

All he had to do was keep his second chancers, rule breakers, short fuses and other problem children under control. All he had to do was be loyal to and understand completely the Baylor Mission Statement. How could he not, after even 1 year, realize and abide by the different rules under which BU operates and cloaks itself in the eyes of the world?

This fits squarely on the back of CAB driver and his in-bred staff. They, more than anyone, should have been held responsible for the implosion.

Some people just never are ready for the big stage. Just like Bushwood in Caddy Shack. Some people just don't belong.

Thee University said:

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Your beloved "CAB" driver deserves what he got. Wait..................no he doesn't. He did not deserve the payoff he got to keep quiet. I would have preferred that he give his payoff to the female victims of his element he brought onto campus.

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Wait...if he got paid off to be quite, doesn't that mean he has information that is damning for Baylor?

Are you against seeing all the facts?

Thee University said:

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He did not deserve the payoff he got to keep quiet. I would have preferred that he give his payoff to the female victims of his element he brought onto campus.

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Valid argument. Many people agree. And who made the decision to pay him off? And why did they do it? That's what we're getting at here.

There are still a few bitter-enders around who think Briles should be the coach today. But my sense is that most of them are gone, and you're basically tilting at a windmill.

All he had to do was be loyal to and understand completely the Baylor Mission Statement. How could he not, after even 1 year, realize and abide by the different rules under which BU operates and cloaks itself in the eyes of the world?

Alright now this sounds like a troll job.

The different rules BU operated and cloaked itself in the eyes of the world.

You mean like ignoring young women who had legitimate complaints about being assaulted. You mean turning them away and then, writing them up for getting drunk and or doing drugs because it was against student code. You mean like sweeping things under the rug, so to the "eyes of the world" Baylor could report things like 4 consecutive years without a single sexual assault.

Yea Baylor had a terrible system for handling sexual assaults, going back decades, if you listen to the voices of the women who were ignored over the years.

Not sure what Briles would get out of that,

Doc Holliday said:

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Thee University said:

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Your beloved "CAB" driver deserves what he got. Wait..................no he doesn't. He did not deserve the payoff he got to keep quiet. I would have preferred that he give his payoff to the female victims of his element he brought onto campus.

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Wait...if he got paid off to be quite, doesn't that mean he has information that is damning for Baylor?

Are you against seeing all the facts?

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Absolutely it does!

If this thing goes the distance I believe we are REALLY screwed. Baylor and Baylor Football.

There are skeletons buried every single year. The past couple of years we have enough skeletons to fill that cemetery across from McLane. We don't want to dig them all up.

Forest Bueller said:

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All he had to do was be loyal to and understand completely the Baylor Mission Statement. How could he not, after even 1 year, realize and abide by the different rules under which BU operates and cloaks itself in the eyes of the world?

Alright now this sounds like a troll job.

The different rules BU operated and cloaked itself in the eyes of the world.

You mean like ignoring young women who had legitimate complaints about being assaulted. You mean turning them away and then, writing them up for getting drunk and or doing drugs because it was against student code. You mean like sweeping things under the rug, so to the "eyes of the world" Baylor could report things like 4 consecutive years without a single sexual assault.

Yea Baylor had a terrible system for handling sexual assaults, going back decades, if you listen to the voices of the women who were ignored over the years.

Not sure what Briles would get out of that,

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Yes. That is exactly what I mean. Again, athletes at Baylor (all of them) should be held to a much higher standard than the student body. The student body WANTS to be there. Their parents WANT them to be there. The athletes have choices and when I signed on the dotted line to choose Baylor over UT I knew EXACTLY what I was getting into. I knew that Baylor standards were much higher and much more scrutinized than the state schools.

Thee University said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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Thee University said:

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Your beloved "CAB" driver deserves what he got. Wait..................no he doesn't. He did not deserve the payoff he got to keep quiet. I would have preferred that he give his payoff to the female victims of his element he brought onto campus.

---

Wait...if he got paid off to be quite, doesn't that mean he has information that is damning for Baylor?

Are you against seeing all the facts?

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Absolutely it does!

If this thing goes the distance I believe we are REALLY screwed. Baylor and Baylor Football.

There are skeletons buried every single year. The past couple of years we have enough skeletons to fill that cemetery across from McLane. We don't want to dig them all up.

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You are essentially in favor of covering up...which is what you accused Briles of doing.
Isn't that hypocritical?

Some of us are in favor of watching it all burn to uncover the entire truth. You can include me in that group.
We hit rock bottom. At this point, it makes no difference to me. We are already REALLY screwed dude. Seriously. I would have rather not had a football team at all then the embarrassment of last season.

If there's a cancer in Baylor, you get rid of that sh*t...you don't ignore it, or you will have another scandal in 10 years.

That's how this works. It comes from the top down.
If Briles was as bad as people say...then our higher ups had to be blind not to see the situation and negligent in not doing anything about it.

The only conclusion is to remove the BOR during the scandal. All of them.
But we both know that will never happen. You should expect a scandal in 10 years.

Thee University said:

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Your beloved "CAB" driver deserves what he got. Wait..................no he doesn't. He did not deserve the payoff he got to keep quiet. I would have preferred that he give his payoff to the female victims of his element he brought onto campus.

All he had to do was keep his second chancers, rule breakers, short fuses and other problem children under control. All he had to do was be loyal to and understand completely the Baylor Mission Statement. How could he not, after even 1 year, realize and abide by the different rules under which BU operates and cloaks itself in the eyes of the world?

This fits squarely on the back of CAB driver and his in-bred staff. They, more than anyone, should have been held responsible for the implosion.

Some people just never are ready for the big stage. Just like Bushwood in Caddy Shack. Some people just don't belong.

---

That's why he hasn't been hired elsewhere.

There isn't a university board member alive that will accept hearing how he ran in in house discipline system for his athletes where he prevented cases from going to judicial affairs.

that alone should have been grounds for termination.

Thee University said:

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Forest Bueller said:

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All he had to do was be loyal to and understand completely the Baylor Mission Statement. How could he not, after even 1 year, realize and abide by the different rules under which BU operates and cloaks itself in the eyes of the world?

Alright now this sounds like a troll job.

The different rules BU operated and cloaked itself in the eyes of the world.

You mean like ignoring young women who had legitimate complaints about being assaulted. You mean turning them away and then, writing them up for getting drunk and or doing drugs because it was against student code. You mean like sweeping things under the rug, so to the "eyes of the world" Baylor could report things like 4 consecutive years without a single sexual assault.

Yea Baylor had a terrible system for handling sexual assaults, going back decades, if you listen to the voices of the women who were ignored over the years.

Not sure what Briles would get out of that,

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Yes. That is exactly what I mean. Again, athletes at Baylor (all of them) should be held to a much higher standard than the student body. The student body WANTS to be there. Their parents WANT them to be there. The athletes have choices and when I signed on the dotted line to choose Baylor over UT I knew EXACTLY what I was getting into. I knew that Baylor standards were much higher and much more scrutinized than the state schools.

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I think that sums up this entire discussion and the entire scandal. Athletes are accountable for anything they do but the student body can sexually assault all the women they want without being held responsible for it.

Lets be realistic, this discuss is worthless because there are 5 or 6 posters that will always blame everything on the football team no matter what. They will also do their best to dominate any discuss that comes up.

So y'all win, Baylor's football team sucks and will for sometime. A good man got rich but can't work any longer and y'all are rejoicing. Victims received no justice but y'all could care less about them. No matter what comes out in the future, it won't change the past.

Baylor is destined to repeat what we just went through, because the same folks are still running the show.

Now for some football, can't wait for the season to start and hoping we actually beat someone other than Kansas. Our possible victories, ACU, UTSA, Kansas, wait I am thinking, well I guess that is about it unless we get lucky. Here is hoping for getting lucky.

Good luck Baylor football, can't wait to watch you play.

you can tell who played football and who did not by reading some of these responses. Thee speaks the truth.

TellMeYouLoveMe said:

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Thee University said:

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MYour beloved "CAB" driver deserves what he got. Wait..................no he doesn't. He did not deserve the payoff he got to keep quiet. I would have preferred that he give his payoff to the female victims of his element he brought onto campus.

All he had to do was keep his second chancers, rule breakers, short fuses and other problem children under control. All he had to do was be loyal to and understand completely the Baylor Mission Statement. How could he not, after even 1 year, realize and abide by the different rules under which BU operates and cloaks itself in the eyes of the world?

This fits squarely on the back of CAB driver and his in-bred staff. They, more than anyone, should have been held responsible for the implosion.

Some people just never are ready for the big stage. Just like Bushwood in Caddy Shack. Some people just don't belong.

---

That's why he hasn't been hired elsewhere.

There isn't a university board member alive that will accept hearing how he ran in in house discipline system for his athletes where he prevented cases from going to judicial affairs.

that alone should have been grounds for termination.

---

I don't believe for even a second that Coach Briles prevented any cases from going to Judicial Affairs because he is just not that kind of man. He didn't let any players play that were involved in wrong doing while things were being sorted out but didn't have the authority to kick them out of school due to allegations. He followed the logic that due process is important and he counted on JA and the school to do those types of investigations.

Baylor had about 14,000 students at the time the Title IX incidents took place on campus (Baylor had more students but play along).
Baylor football had 10 percent of the incidents at the time 10 percent of the student population was 1,400 students.
The team had 120-135 members (you tell me how many players, we know 85 were on scholarship).
Now, if football had created the media noise and seemed to be loose in the pants with things hanging out of the pants, why would any investigator start with the band, Christian sorority or Vietnamese Student Association before looking into why they were hired to begin their work?
You don't have to work for NASA, been on NASA's campus, graduated from Bumble Bee High, or tried to fight the Rice band because they trolled you to figure out that those nasty, sports hating, evil, even possibly liberal though those are normally stick it in ass conservative women were going to first head to the football field to find out what was going on to get them on the bottom of ESPN's crawl.

There is no need to worry but the numbers don't look good. It's the past and no one cares moving forward to really get exhausted knowing it was only 10 percent.

Amarillobear said:

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TellMeYouLoveMe said:

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Thee University said:

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MYour beloved "CAB" driver deserves what he got. Wait..................no he doesn't. He did not deserve the payoff he got to keep quiet. I would have preferred that he give his payoff to the female victims of his element he brought onto campus.

All he had to do was keep his second chancers, rule breakers, short fuses and other problem children under control. All he had to do was be loyal to and understand completely the Baylor Mission Statement. How could he not, after even 1 year, realize and abide by the different rules under which BU operates and cloaks itself in the eyes of the world?

This fits squarely on the back of CAB driver and his in-bred staff. They, more than anyone, should have been held responsible for the implosion.

Some people just never are ready for the big stage. Just like Bushwood in Caddy Shack. Some people just don't belong.

---

That's why he hasn't been hired elsewhere.

There isn't a university board member alive that will accept hearing how he ran in in house discipline system for his athletes where he prevented cases from going to judicial affairs.

that alone should have been grounds for termination.

---

I don't believe for even a second that Coach Briles prevented any cases from going to Judicial Affairs because he is just not that kind of man. He didn't let any players play that were involved in wrong doing while things were being sorted out but didn't have the authority to kick them out of school due to allegations. He followed the logic that due process is important and he counted on JA and the school to do those types of investigations.

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You sure?

On April 8, 2011, after a freshman defensive tackle was cited for illegal consumption of alcohol, Coach Briles sent a text message to an assistant coach: "Hopefully he's under radar enough they won't recognize name did he get ticket from Baylor police or Waco? Just trying to keep him away from our judicial affairs folks...."

On February 11, 2013, an assistant coach notified Coach Briles of a claim by a female student-athlete that a football player brandished a gun at her. Coach Briles responded: "what a fool she reporting to authorities" The assistant coach texted back: "She's acting traumatized Trying to talk her calm now Doesn't seem to want to report though." Coach Briles texted: "U gonna talk to [the player]." The assistant coach concluded: "Yes sir, just did. Caught him on the way to class Squeezed him pretty good." The matter was never reported to Judicial Affairs.

On September 20, 2013, after a player was arrested for assault and threatening to kill a non-athlete, a football operations staff official tried to talk the victim out of pressing criminal charges. Meanwhile, Coach Briles texted Athletics Director Ian McCaw: "Just talked to [the player] he said Waco PD was there said they were going to keep it quiet Wasn't a set up deal... I'll get shill (Shillinglaw) to ck on Sibley (local attorney Jonathan Sibley)." Athletics Director Ian McCaw replied: "That would be great if they kept it quiet!"

On May 14, 2014, after Coach Briles learned from an assistant coach that a player had been caught selling drugs, he texted: "I'm hoping it will take care of itself if not we can discuss best way to move on it." The offense was never reported to Judicial Affairs and Coach Briles arranged for the player to transfer to another school. The assistant coach texted: "Him just hanging around Waco scares me. [Another school] will take him. Knows baggage."

Apart from what Briles did do or didn't do, here's a question I've wondered about:

If you heard allegations about sexual assault and were concerned for the victims, why in the hell would you have bothered taking it to Judicial Affairs, where everybody knew the whole thing would just get buried, at best, and, at worst, it would get buried AND the victim would get blamed/shamed?

xiledinok said:

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Baylor had about 14,000 students at the time the Title IX incidents took place on campus (Baylor had more students but play along).
Baylor football had 10 percent of the incidents at the time 10 percent of the student population was 1,400 students.
The team had 120-135 members (you tell me how many players, we know 85 were on scholarship).
Now, if football had created the media noise and seemed to be loose in the pants with things hanging out of the pants, why would any investigator start would the band, the Christian sorority or the Vietnamese Student Association before looking into why they were hired to begin their work?
You don't have to work for NASA, been on NASA's campus, graduated from Bumble Bee High, or tried to fight the Rice band because they trolled you to figure out that those nasty, sports hating, evil, even possibly liberal though those are normally stick it in ass conservative women were going to first head to the football field to find out what was going on to get them on the bottom of ESPN's crawl.

There is no need to worry but the numbers don't look good.

---

Why is 10% always thrown out there, if it was thrown out by Baylor or the BOR or some Lawyers deposition, they have been proven to be unreliable sources of information. Patty Crawford said she has 300 or so complaints in 23 months, football had 17 incidents over 4-5 years. That would average about 4 a year, Baylor averaged about 156 complaints a year. Crawford is the one that said there isn't any unusual pattern coming from athletics.

To get to 10% they would have to around 14+ incidents per year times 4 years you are looking at 50 something. It seems as though someone is using that 10% from the Lawyer guy that said there were 50+ incidents. That was a bogus number.

With Baylor having 156 a year incidents, I am not thinking football had 15.6 incidents of sexual assault a year, but with 10% that is the number some people are trying to float. That is bogus.

bubbadog said:

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Apart from what Briles did do or didn't do, here's a question I've wondered about:

If you heard allegations about sexual assault and were concerned for the victims, why in the hell would you have bothered taking it to Judicial Affairs, where everybody knew the whole thing would just get buried, at best, and, at worst, it would get buried AND the victim would get blamed/shamed?

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You are conflating many different stories, some of which are just rumor. JA was said to have conducted a very "by the book approach" and treated all respondent equally. The complainant against them was a very rigid approach that was not trauma centered.

There has been absolutely nothing reported about thing getting buried once the got to JA.

So there is that - #2 it was your job to report to JA

Forest Bueller said:

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xiledinok said:

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Baylor had about 14,000 students at the time the Title IX incidents took place on campus (Baylor had more students but play along).
Baylor football had 10 percent of the incidents at the time 10 percent of the student population was 1,400 students.
The team had 120-135 members (you tell me how many players, we know 85 were on scholarship).
Now, if football had created the media noise and seemed to be loose in the pants with things hanging out of the pants, why would any investigator start would the band, the Christian sorority or the Vietnamese Student Association before looking into why they were hired to begin their work?
You don't have to work for NASA, been on NASA's campus, graduated from Bumble Bee High, or tried to fight the Rice band because they trolled you to figure out that those nasty, sports hating, evil, even possibly liberal though those are normally stick it in ass conservative women were going to first head to the football field to find out what was going on to get them on the bottom of ESPN's crawl.

There is no need to worry but the numbers don't look good.

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Why is 10% always thrown out there, if it was thrown out by Baylor or the BOR or some Lawyers deposition, they have been proven to be unreliable sources of information. Patty Crawford said she has 300 or so complaints in 23 months, football had 17 incidents over 4-5 years. That would average about 4 a year, Baylor averaged about 156 complaints a year. Crawford is the one that said there isn't any unusual pattern coming from athletics.

To get to 10% they would have to around 14+ incidents per year times 4 years you are looking at 50 something. It seems as though someone is using that 10% from the Lawyer guy that said there were 50+ incidents. That was a bogus number.

With Baylor having 156 a year incidents, I am not thinking football had 15.6 incidents of sexual assault a year, but with 10% that is the number some people are trying to float. That is bogus.

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Instead of running with zero issues, why not just tell all that there were a select few apples that ruined it for the others.

Doc Holliday said:

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Thee University said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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Thee University said:

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Your beloved "CAB" driver deserves what he got. Wait..................no he doesn't. He did not deserve the payoff he got to keep quiet. I would have preferred that he give his payoff to the female victims of his element he brought onto campus.

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Wait...if he got paid off to be quite, doesn't that mean he has information that is damning for Baylor?

Are you against seeing all the facts?

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Absolutely it does!

If this thing goes the distance I believe we are REALLY screwed. Baylor and Baylor Football.

There are skeletons buried every single year. The past couple of years we have enough skeletons to fill that cemetery across from McLane. We don't want to dig them all up.

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You are essentially in favor of covering up...which is what you accused Briles of doing.
Isn't that hypocritical?

Some of us are in favor of watching it all burn to uncover the entire truth. You can include me in that group.
We hit rock bottom. At this point, it makes no difference to me. We are already REALLY screwed dude. Seriously. I would have rather not had a football team at all then the embarrassment of last season.

If there's a cancer in Baylor, you get rid of that sh*t...you don't ignore it, or you will have another scandal in 10 years.

That's how this works. It comes from the top down.
If Briles was as bad as people say...then our higher ups had to be blind not to see the situation and negligent in not doing anything about it.

The only conclusion is to remove the BOR during the scandal. All of them.
But we both know that will never happen. You should expect a scandal in 10 years.

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From day 1, Thee has been all about firing Briles (mostly for lack of a defense), letting Pat Neff staff off the hook (RR, TLD, etc.), and trusting the wisdom of the BOFR; therefore, laying 100% of blame at Briles' feet covering up the decades of ****-shaming because he's afraid of what may be uncovered in total. Yeah. He's a hypocrite perfectly suited for the BOFR.

bubbadog said:

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Apart from what Briles did do or didn't do, here's a question I've wondered about:

If you heard allegations about sexual assault and were concerned for the victims, why in the hell would you have bothered taking it to Judicial Affairs, where everybody knew the whole thing would just get buried, at best, and, at worst, it would get buried AND the victim would get blamed/shamed?

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Valid question. Smart thinking.

Forest Bueller said:

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xiledinok said:

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Baylor had about 14,000 students at the time the Title IX incidents took place on campus (Baylor had more students but play along).
Baylor football had 10 percent of the incidents at the time 10 percent of the student population was 1,400 students.
The team had 120-135 members (you tell me how many players, we know 85 were on scholarship).
Now, if football had created the media noise and seemed to be loose in the pants with things hanging out of the pants, why would any investigator start would the band, the Christian sorority or the Vietnamese Student Association before looking into why they were hired to begin their work?
You don't have to work for NASA, been on NASA's campus, graduated from Bumble Bee High, or tried to fight the Rice band because they trolled you to figure out that those nasty, sports hating, evil, even possibly liberal though those are normally stick it in ass conservative women were going to first head to the football field to find out what was going on to get them on the bottom of ESPN's crawl.

There is no need to worry but the numbers don't look good.

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Why is 10% always thrown out there, if it was thrown out by Baylor or the BOR or some Lawyers deposition, they have been proven to be unreliable sources of information. Patty Crawford said she has 300 or so complaints in 23 months, football had 17 incidents over 4-5 years. That would average about 4 a year, Baylor averaged about 156 complaints a year. Crawford is the one that said there isn't any unusual pattern coming from athletics.

To get to 10% they would have to around 14+ incidents per year times 4 years you are looking at 50 something. It seems as though someone is using that 10% from the Lawyer guy that said there were 50+ incidents. That was a bogus number.

With Baylor having 156 a year incidents, I am not thinking football had 15.6 incidents of sexual assault a year, but with 10% that is the number some people are trying to float. That is bogus.

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10% is the number for athletics only that Patty Crawford threw out there in that recording. That stat, or any others, cannot be verified because Baylor refuses to release even numeric data because they claim student privacy.

YoakDaddy said:

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Forest Bueller said:

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xiledinok said:

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Baylor had about 14,000 students at the time the Title IX incidents took place on campus (Baylor had more students but play along).
Baylor football had 10 percent of the incidents at the time 10 percent of the student population was 1,400 students.
The team had 120-135 members (you tell me how many players, we know 85 were on scholarship).
Now, if football had created the media noise and seemed to be loose in the pants with things hanging out of the pants, why would any investigator start would the band, the Christian sorority or the Vietnamese Student Association before looking into why they were hired to begin their work?
You don't have to work for NASA, been on NASA's campus, graduated from Bumble Bee High, or tried to fight the Rice band because they trolled you to figure out that those nasty, sports hating, evil, even possibly liberal though those are normally stick it in ass conservative women were going to first head to the football field to find out what was going on to get them on the bottom of ESPN's crawl.

There is no need to worry but the numbers don't look good.

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Why is 10% always thrown out there, if it was thrown out by Baylor or the BOR or some Lawyers deposition, they have been proven to be unreliable sources of information. Patty Crawford said she has 300 or so complaints in 23 months, football had 17 incidents over 4-5 years. That would average about 4 a year, Baylor averaged about 156 complaints a year. Crawford is the one that said there isn't any unusual pattern coming from athletics.

To get to 10% they would have to around 14+ incidents per year times 4 years you are looking at 50 something. It seems as though someone is using that 10% from the Lawyer guy that said there were 50+ incidents. That was a bogus number.

With Baylor having 156 a year incidents, I am not thinking football had 15.6 incidents of sexual assault a year, but with 10% that is the number some people are trying to float. That is bogus.

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10% is the number for athletics only that Patty Crawford threw out there in that recording. That stat, or any others, cannot be verified because Baylor refuses to release even numeric data because they claim student privacy.

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So that would count all athletics I would assume. How many athletes are on the Baylor campus. I see there are 14 different NCAA sports played, then there are club sports like Rugby. And since she said there was no pattern that was unusual, could have just been a number thrown out to say the large majority of the issues are not from the athletic dept.

Crawford said 10% football

Michele Davis - a sexual assault nurse who handled many Baylor cases, said 25% of the accused were from athletics

I was under the impression both of these numbers were ballpark information and not hard stats being read

OldSchoolBU said:

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you can tell who played football and who did not by reading some of these responses. Thee speaks the truth.

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You can also tell who has ever worked in a corporation.

Listening to DC bear try and spin that you can hear about a CRIME and just keep it low without any responsibility is hilarious in its naivete.(sp, sorry)

That DCBEAR can't produce an example of a corporation that would allow that type of ethics says all you need to know.

TellMeYouLoveMe said:

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OldSchoolBU said:

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you can tell who played football and who did not by reading some of these responses. Thee speaks the truth.

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You can also tell who has ever worked in a corporation.

Listening to DC bear try and spin that you can hear about a CRIME and just keep it low without any responsibility is hilarious in its navet.

That DCBEAR can't produce an example of a corporation that would allow that type of ethics says all you need to know.

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The examples are practically legion. Where do you want to start? Enron?