They restrained, attacked and killed the 17-year-old by stabbing him multiple times and "chopping" his body more than 100 times "with knives, machetes, and a pickaxe" before stuffing him into a pre-dug hole breaking one of the boy's legs in the process to fit his remains inside, according to the Justice Department.

The gang members also restrained, attacked and killed the 14-year-old boy by stabbing and chopping his body with the same weapons. Once the 14-year-old was dead, they broke both his legs and tied him with his own pajamas so he would fit into a pre-dug hole all of which they filmed and sent to gang leaders in both the U.S. and El Salvador to prove their rank, the DOJ said.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/5-ms-13-gang-members-194030761.html

They're just here to do the jobs you lazy Americans refuse to do, you racists.

quash said:

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OsoCoreyell said:

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quash said:

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whiterock said:

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Until the odds of failure become likely, illegals are not going to quit giving the cartels their life saving to carry them to the USA.

---

Better option: put the trafficking cartels out of business by opening the border to workers.

---

If there was an intelligent guest worker setup, I could see wide support. But you do have to recognize that (1) guest worker programs do tend to drive down real wages in many blue-collar job sectors, and (2) the guest worker programs in Europe have been very hard to enforce, with many, many guest workers overstaying. There are tradeoffs and costs.

---

I can't convince the KnowNothings on this board, but most of the illegals here are visa overstays, so that has always been a problem. But they had time limited visas from the start; the bracero approach lasted as long as the job did, so a reduced overstay (basically some of those who lose their job).

I'm willing to have a small increase in overstays to get rid of the cartels. But when push comes to shove most on this thread will balk at any solution that allows one illegal to commit one property crime. Just unrealistic.

---

Yes, a better guest worker program will help (we have one, so we're talking reform, not creation.).
Yes, in the past, most illegals are visa overstays (about 60/40, before border crisis of the last decade.)

But. And this is key:
Most illegals did not come here to work.
They came here for citizenship.
If they'll overstay a B1/B2 visitors visa, they'll overstay an H1 temporary work visa.

So the worker program has to think bigger than just worker permits.

Straight from Consular Commission training: The American People have never looked kindly on an expatriate class of worker living here without full citizenship rights. And policing that expatriate class will test law on civil liberties. Courts have always (rightly) considered Constitutional Rights to apply to everyone, not just citizens. Moreover, the more one polices expatriates in their society, the more citizens and families get ground up in the enforcement gears. Just comes with the territory. In that context, it's not likely a large class of guest workers (so incredibly logical in the abstract) will not likely retain public support (given traditional American views on such things.)

Amid all of that, the flow of immigrants (legal or not) solves a real problem of demography endemic to all developed societies - low birthrates, shortages of unskilled labor. (all those visa overstays are NOT unskilled labor, btw......) So if we are to slash the immigration, then we have to propel the growth rate. Propelling the growth rate will require us to reverse decades of policy. We will have to increase tax incentives for families to have children. We will have to radically rethink the cost of raising children - specifically....what we spend money on in education. We cannot afford to throw around money to teach social sciences like we do when we have such a shortage of skilled AND unskilled labor = cut back on college loans and increase technical school loans. This will have to be a thoroughgoing exercise. Was no-fault divorce really such a good idea? How can we ever expect to have more of the traditional family structures it take to create children when we are letting the children we have now be educated such rot on what is a man and what is a woman? Guys, we need lathe operators, electricians, plumbers, burger flippers and LOT more than we need another Gender Studies major who can't do anything but criticize capitalism as racism.

We are not at in a tweaking phase. We are in an "end of phase" moment, and societal establishments are going to fight the needed changes like hell. Public sentiment is turning against the very dynamic that has kept our society ahead of the demographic monsters that fell developed societies.

And what does polite society say about that?
It's all Trump's fault.

Wangchung said:

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Fre3dombear said:

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This blood is on the Mulecrats hands

---

Same people who have been fighting immigration control for decades.

---

The decade when president Reagan granted amnesty?

quash said:

---

Wangchung said:

---

Fre3dombear said:

---

This blood is on the Mulecrats hands

---

Same people who have been fighting immigration control for decades.

---

The decade when president Reagan granted amnesty?

---

As his part of a compromise with democrats, who then failed to uphold their end of the compromise?

The first article I posted states there are 2.8 million fewer Americans working. It goes on to discuss the labor shortage in America. One of the other posters talked about the declining population of workers in America. I gave stats. I included a personal experience of witnessing the labor shortage here in NC.

So when I want to make a point it doesnt matter if I give anecdotal evidence like you do or use statistics from the US Chamber of Commerce.

You asked a question and I showed you the answer. There are jobs. People (or invaders) wouldnt be risking their lives if there were no jobs to be found. They want to work and gain citizenship.

If you like the way America is headed lets just maintain the status quo.

Nixon started our war on drugs 50 years ago. I was 10.
So hows it going?

" Today, police make more than 1.5 million drug arrests each year, and about 550,000 of those are for cannabis offenses alone. Almost 500,000 people are incarcerated for nothing more than a drug law violation, and Black and brown people are disproportionately impacted by drug enforcement and sentencing practices. Rates of drug use and sales are similar across racial and ethnic lines, but Black and Latinx people are far more likely than white people to be stopped, searched, arrested, convicted, harshly sentenced, and saddled with a lifelong criminal record."

https://www.vera.org/news/fifty-years-ago-today-president-nixon-declared-the-war-on-drugs

Many other nations, including Germany. Australia. Canada and many others have decriminalized drugs to various degrees.

But lets keep on doing the same thing with miserable results.

The same thing can be said of our immigration policy. Its not working. But lets keep on blaming whatever side is sitting as president instead of trying to solve the problem.

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

The first article I posted states there are 2.8 million fewer Americans working. It goes on to discuss the labor shortage in America. One of the other posters talked about the declining population of workers in America. I gave stats. I included a personal experience .of witnessing the labor shortage here in NC.

So when I want to make a point it doesnt matter if I give anecdotal evidence like you do or use statistics from the US Chamber of Commerce.

You asked a question and I showed you the answer. There are jobs. People (or invaders) wouldnt be risking their lives if there were no jobs to be found. They want to work and gain citizenship.

---

You have traveled enough to know....first hand....... of the conditions throughout Mexico and central America .

You KNOW...without a doubt ...it is impossible for ANY country to employ the tens of millions under employed individuals throughout Mexico and central America . No country on earth could indefinitely employ the tens of millions reaching employment age throughout central America ...every single year.

So why you insist on playing this little game....I have never understood .

My farm was located ONE MILE from the international border ....and I never hired a single 'wet'.

You simply could not put a man worth 2 dollars an hour on a piece of machinery worth over 100k and expect things to work out .

Nothing has changed ....SKILLS are needed for employment .

Meanwhile these people do whatever is necessary to survive........including criminal activity . And no one knows this little piece of reality more than legal Mexican Americans living within 300 miles of the border.

Yeah, they want to work and gain citizenship just not by following our immigration laws. I want to be a billionaire but I'm not going to rob banks to make that goal.

Wangchung said:

---

Yeah, they want to work and gain citizenship just not by following our immigration laws. I want to be a billionaire but I'm not going to rob banks to make that goal.

---

So you've decided on politics then?

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Wangchung said:

---

Yeah, they want to work and gain citizenship just not by following our immigration laws. I want to be a billionaire but I'm not going to rob banks to make that goal.

---

So you've decided on politics then?

---

Maybe. I'm definitely dumb enough, but I may not have the looks. Otherwise I'll just invest in NFTs and Beanie Babies.

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

I am humbled that you only read my posts. I didnt answer because several other posters have addressed the need for low level wage earners.

Here in North Carolinas there are wanted signs all over for entry level jobs. We went to an Applenbees in Raleigh. When we entered we were told there were two groups ahead of us. Half the place was empty. He quicjly expl;ained there had only two waitresses so it wasnt a shortage of tables but labor.

Other posters went into more depth including lower birth rate and more demand for labor. The jobs are there. People can learn to speak English. Some the workers up here can barely speak proper English anyway.


https://www.uschamber.com/workforce/understanding-americas-labor-shortage
https://immigrationforum.org/article/americas-labor-shortage-how-low-immigration-levels-accentuated-the-problem-and-how-immigration-can-fix-it/

You are the poster that never posts stats or links. You often back your argument with:

I had lunch with two hispanic border agents yesterday and they told me.......

I have helped the people with family members that have drug problems and they told me...

I ran into several policeman yesterday and they told me...

You are one of my favorite two posters but its surprises me you were demanding data. I gave you a little and csn find more if you like. There are jobs in America to be filled by people that want to work.

---

Don't take this as a compliment. With his limitied IQ he thinks there are only two posters, you being the other one.

---

Limited is one of my favorite posters as well.

One of the very few contributors I would go out of my way to drink a beer with .

But we have a very different concept of reality .

Canada2017 said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

The first article I posted states there are 2.8 million fewer Americans working. It goes on to discuss the labor shortage in America. One of the other posters talked about the declining population of workers in America. I gave stats. I included a personal experience .of witnessing the labor shortage here in NC.

So when I want to make a point it doesnt matter if I give anecdotal evidence like you do or use statistics from the US Chamber of Commerce.

You asked a question and I showed you the answer. There are jobs. People (or invaders) wouldnt be risking their lives if there were no jobs to be found. They want to work and gain citizenship.

---

You have traveled enough to know....first hand....... of the conditions throughout Mexico and central America .

You KNOW...without a doubt ...it is impossible for ANY country to employ the tens of millions under employed individuals throughout Mexico and central America . No country on earth could indefinitely employ the tens of millions reaching employment age throughout central America ...every single year.

So why you insist on playing this little game....I have never understood .

My farm was located ONE MILE from the international border ....and I never hired a single 'wet'.

You simply could not put a man worth 2 dollars an hour on a piece of machinery worth over 100k and expect things to work out .

Nothing has changed ....SKILLS are needed for employment .

Meanwhile these people do whatever is necessary to survive........including criminal activity . And no one knows this little piece of reality more than legal Mexican Americans living within 300 miles of the border.

---

Jake Tucker (owner of West Lumber & Hardware) owned an old farm out near Penelope. Classic Centex farmstead....a quarter-mile of two track left the pavement and headed off to a square of mature shade trees surrounded by cotton fields. The old house was too far gone to be considered a fixer-upper for your just-married kids. No exterior paint left, old linoleum mostly gone showing bare pine lapboard on the floor, wallpaper sagging off the cloth backing they used to put up with tacks to allow them to glue up the paper. The old free-standing cast iron tub would have had some value if the porcelain wasn't so splotched up with rust. But Jake did keep the electricity going and the well did have water in it, so the toilet still worked. And the house still did turn the wind and rain, and the floor was strong enough you could walk on it without falling thru. It would sleep, if put in barracks configuration, about a dozen men. So if you did have a farm in northeast McLennan Co and needed some help building fence or working cattle, you knew where to go. About $8 per man per day was the going rate last I remembered. Just pull up & say how many you needed, and that number would hop up in the bed of the pick-up truck. No cellphones, of course, so there was always the chance you'd pull up & nobody would be there, but as consolation you could route back home via Leroy Grocery and get some Nemecek ring baloney, longhorn cheese, and saltine crackers for lunch. Mr. Hutyra kept that longhorn up on top of the refrigerator case. You could slice off as much as you wanted & he'd weight it & wrap it in wax paper for you. Add in a Dr. Pepper and it was a pretty damned nice front-seat lunch.

That was illegal immigration 1972.
That is not illegal immigration 2022.

When I graduated high school, Mrs. Nemecek came by the house to deliver my graduation present and gave me a set of brown towels that I used all the way thru grad school and took overseas with me. Underwhelming at the time, but definitely the most useful graduation present I got. Mr. Nemecek walked in behind her with a full ring of baloney on each arm. I whooped. I still love that stuff, and buy aplenty when I find it.

Of course, back when, the illegals were all Mexican. Today, they're nearly all Central American. Guys who hire illegals today lament about the good old days when the illegals were all Mexican. Because Mexican illegals were invariably literate. Central Americans mostly sign their name with an X.

Times change.

Thank you Whiterock. I enjoyed reading your post and I understand things have changed.

whiterock said:

---

Canada2017 said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

The first article I posted states there are 2.8 million fewer Americans working. It goes on to discuss the labor shortage in America. One of the other posters talked about the declining population of workers in America. I gave stats. I included a personal experience .of witnessing the labor shortage here in NC.

So when I want to make a point it doesnt matter if I give anecdotal evidence like you do or use statistics from the US Chamber of Commerce.

You asked a question and I showed you the answer. There are jobs. People (or invaders) wouldnt be risking their lives if there were no jobs to be found. They want to work and gain citizenship.

---

You have traveled enough to know....first hand....... of the conditions throughout Mexico and central America .

You KNOW...without a doubt ...it is impossible for ANY country to employ the tens of millions under employed individuals throughout Mexico and central America . No country on earth could indefinitely employ the tens of millions reaching employment age throughout central America ...every single year.

So why you insist on playing this little game....I have never understood .

My farm was located ONE MILE from the international border ....and I never hired a single 'wet'.

You simply could not put a man worth 2 dollars an hour on a piece of machinery worth over 100k and expect things to work out .

Nothing has changed ....SKILLS are needed for employment .

Meanwhile these people do whatever is necessary to survive........including criminal activity . And no one knows this little piece of reality more than legal Mexican Americans living within 300 miles of the border.

---

Jake Tucker (owner of West Lumber & Hardware) owned an old farm out near Penelope. Classic Centex farmstead....a quarter-mile of two track left the pavement and headed off to a square of mature shade trees surrounded by cotton fields. The old house was too far gone to be considered a fixer-upper for your just-married kids. No exterior paint left, old linoleum mostly gone showing bare pine lapboard on the floor, wallpaper sagging off the cloth backing they used to put up with tacks to allow them to glue up the paper. The old free-standing cast iron tub would have had some value if the porcelain wasn't so splotched up with rust. But Jake did keep the electricity going and the well did have water in it, so the toilet still worked. And the house still did turn the wind and rain, and the floor was strong enough you could walk on it without falling thru. It would sleep, if put in barracks configuration, about a dozen men. So if you did have a farm in northeast McLennan Co and needed some help building fence or working cattle, you knew where to go. About $8 per man per day was the going rate last I remembered. Just pull up & say how many you needed, and that number would hop up in the bed of the pick-up truck. No cellphones, of course, so there was always the chance you'd pull up & nobody would be there, but as consolation you could route back home via Leroy Grocery and get some Nemecek ring baloney, longhorn cheese, and saltine crackers for lunch. Mr. Hutyra kept that longhorn up on top of the refrigerator case. You could slice off as much as you wanted & he'd weight it & wrap it in wax paper for you. Add in a Dr. Pepper and it was a pretty damned nice front-seat lunch.

That was illegal immigration 1972.
That is not illegal immigration 2022.

When I graduated high school, Mrs. Nemecek came by the house to deliver my graduation present and gave me a set of brown towels that I used all the way thru grad school and took overseas with me. Underwhelming at the time, but definitely the most useful graduation present I got. Mr. Nemecek walked in behind her with a full ring of baloney on each arm. I whooped. I still love that stuff, and buy aplenty when I find it.

Of course, back when, the illegals were all Mexican. Today, they're nearly all Central American. Guys who hire illegals today lament about the good old days when the illegals were all Mexican. Because Mexican illegals were invariably literate. Central Americans mostly sign their name with an X.

Times change.

---

Times change, good ring bologna stays the same

I know the guy that bought West Lumber from Jake Tucker

Canada2017 said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

The first article I posted states there are 2.8 million fewer Americans working. It goes on to discuss the labor shortage in America. One of the other posters talked about the declining population of workers in America. I gave stats. I included a personal experience .of witnessing the labor shortage here in NC.

So when I want to make a point it doesnt matter if I give anecdotal evidence like you do or use statistics from the US Chamber of Commerce.

You asked a question and I showed you the answer. There are jobs. People (or invaders) wouldnt be risking their lives if there were no jobs to be found. They want to work and gain citizenship.

---

You have traveled enough to know....first hand....... of the conditions throughout Mexico and central America .

You KNOW...without a doubt ...it is impossible for ANY country to employ the tens of millions under employed individuals throughout Mexico and central America . No country on earth could indefinitely employ the tens of millions reaching employment age throughout central America ...every single year.

So why you insist on playing this little game....I have never understood .

My farm was located ONE MILE from the international border ....and I never hired a single 'wet'.

You simply could not put a man worth 2 dollars an hour on a piece of machinery worth over 100k and expect things to work out .

Nothing has changed ....SKILLS are needed for employment .

Meanwhile these people do whatever is necessary to survive........including criminal activity . And no one knows this little piece of reality more than legal Mexican Americans living within 300 miles of the border.

---

I dont remember saying America could or should try to hire 2 million or the more recent 10s of millions workers from foreign countries. I am saying we need immigration reform that makes it easier for people that want to work to come to America and work. Intake can be adjusted yearly depending on need. You have been around long enough to know you dont hire everyone that applies. You hire what you need. According to the articles I posted and a few other posters America needs more workers.

I probably have hired illegals. The leader of the fencing crew I usually used was an American but the men he hired were probably illegal. They worked There English was not very good. I have also hired 10 or 15 J1 workers. A few stayed and worked in America long enough to get their green card and then permanent residence.

I know its different but I worked for 8 years in 4 foreign countries (UAE China Thailand and Laos) without being able to sign my name in their language. If speaking proper English were a requirement for all jobs in America the Americans I saw at the WaffleHouse here in Rocky Mount NC yesterday would be in trouble.

Many of the jobs on President Trumps "essential workers" list are jobs often filled by illegal workers

Sam Lowry said:

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GrowlTowel said:

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Sam Lowry said:

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GrowlTowel said:

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Sam Lowry said:

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GrowlTowel said:

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Sam Lowry said:

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LIB,MR BEARS said:

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Golem said:

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LIB,MR BEARS said:

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Golem said:

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LIB,MR BEARS said:

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Golem said:

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LIB,MR BEARS said:

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Golem said:

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LIB,MR BEARS said:

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Golem said:

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A car thief dies in a car wreck%85zero sympathy.
A murderer accidentally shoots and kills himself%85zero sympathy.
A burglar falls from the window he's breaking into and dies%85zero sympathy.
An illegal violates our borders and sovereignty and dies committing that crime%85zero sympathy.

If you want to live with less risk, don't violate the law.

---

who is your neighbor?

---

The one who doesn't illegally invade my country, spreading his drug epidemics and gang warfare.

These people are the robbers, not the innocent traveler.

---

the Jews and Samaritans were enemies. When the priest and Levite walked past, did they do the right thing?

When a cop shoots and wounds someone that was just trying to harm them, is the right thing for them to let them lay there and bleed or to administer first aid?

If you were first on the scene at the trailer would you have administered some form of help to the handful that were still clinging to life like you would have if your neighbor was clinging to life?

Your the one that said "zero sympathy". I'm just wondering does that apply to the handful that didn't die before the discovery.

PS. the story of the Good Samaritan doesn't tell us if the traveler was a Jew or a Samaritan. Apparently, Jesus didn't think it mattered in the telling of the story.

---

Illegals are the violent robbers, not the traveler who was mugged in the parable. Your attempted analog falls flat. Invaders who storm a neighboring country in the tens of millions and bring violence and death generally receive a very just death, themselves. These people received justice. I have zero sympathy for invaders.

---

you didn't address the cop scenario or if you'd been the first on scene.

---

I would not save a murderer from his folly, no. I would not save a home invader from his folly, no. I would not save a car jacker from his folly, no. I would not save rapist from his folly, no. I would not save a criminal from his folly, no.

Everyone's life has a purpose. If you die in the course of committing a criminal act, your purpose is to serve as an example to others who would consider following in your footsteps. Every illegal invader to our country who dies in the process of breaking our laws and invading our country deserves the punishment countries have rendered to invaders since time immemorial.

---

There are certain parts of the Bible I struggle with and would prefer to ignore like I do asparagus at a buffet.

Many on here, including myself, have commented how those living a homosexual lifestyle and calling themselves Christian ignore the Bible in that aspect as though it is their asparagus.

I struggle with love your enemy as I guess you also do. %A0I guess that's our asparagus.

Actually, love your enemy is only a struggle if we treat is as scripture. When we treat it as asparagus it's no problem. Buffet Christian?

---

So your interpretation of scripture makes you a complete anti-war, anti-police, anti-prison, anti-self defense pacifist. Got it.

---

Not hardly. Someone earlier in the thread described what is going on with the boarder, immigration and the legal side and processing side of it (Whiterock maybe).

I'm all about enforcing the law or rewriting laws to something that serves an intelligent purpose and is enforceable.

The process is willingly broken, willingly unmanageable. We don't have to be. We can fix ourselves by showing grace as we have received grace, mercy as we have received mercy all while we work on fixing a broken immigration system.

---

True, and immigrants are a grace to us through the labor they provide.

---

What labor? %A0They can't legally work.

---

They can't legally cross the border, either%85yet here they are.

---

Great. %A0Send them home.

---

Great. Except that we need the labor.

---

Stop aborting the population. Send them back.

---

I snapped my fingers and it didn't happen. What's your backup plan?

---

Walls, guns, and planes. Get them the F out.

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

Canada2017 said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

The first article I posted states there are 2.8 million fewer Americans working. It goes on to discuss the labor shortage in America. One of the other posters talked about the declining population of workers in America. I gave stats. I included a personal experience .of witnessing the labor shortage here in NC.

So when I want to make a point it doesnt matter if I give anecdotal evidence like you do or use statistics from the US Chamber of Commerce.

You asked a question and I showed you the answer. There are jobs. People (or invaders) wouldnt be risking their lives if there were no jobs to be found. They want to work and gain citizenship.

---

You have traveled enough to know....first hand....... of the conditions throughout Mexico and central America .

You KNOW...without a doubt ...it is impossible for ANY country to employ the tens of millions under employed individuals throughout Mexico and central America . No country on earth could indefinitely employ the tens of millions reaching employment age throughout central America ...every single year.

So why you insist on playing this little game....I have never understood .

My farm was located ONE MILE from the international border ....and I never hired a single 'wet'.

You simply could not put a man worth 2 dollars an hour on a piece of machinery worth over 100k and expect things to work out .

Nothing has changed ....SKILLS are needed for employment .

Meanwhile these people do whatever is necessary to survive........including criminal activity . And no one knows this little piece of reality more than legal Mexican Americans living within 300 miles of the border.

---

I dont remember saying America could or should try to hire 2 million or the more recent 10s of millions workers from foreign countries. I am saying we need immigration reform that makes it easier for people that want to work to come to America and work. Intake can be adjusted yearly depending on need. You have been around long enough to know you dont hire everyone that applies. You hire what you need. According to the articles I posted and a few other posters America needs more workers.

I probably have hired illegals. The leader of the fencing crew I usually used was an American but the men he hired were probably illegal. They worked There English was not very good. I have also hired 10 or 15 J1 workers. A few stayed and worked in America long enough to get their green card and then permanent residence.

I know its different but I worked for 8 years in 4 foreign countries (UAE China Thailand and Laos) without being able to sign my name in their language. If speaking proper English were a requirement for all jobs in America the Americans I saw at the WaffleHouse here in Rocky Mount NC yesterday would be in trouble.

Many of the jobs on President Trumps "essential workers" list are jobs often filled by illegal workers

---

None of this addresses the realities of our border situation .

People who are unskilled ….are difficult to employ . Those who can't even read , write or speak English are even less employable .

There is no ' let them come here to work ' that is remotely feasible or even honest when there are millions unemployed throughout central and South America who are desperate to come to the United States where WORST CASE ….they will be fed and sheltered indefinitely.

Millions will continue to come for just for the freebies…..jobs ….would be a bonus .

What country on earth can feed and shelter such a continual flood of poor , unskilled millions ? The answer of course is none. No country has the resources to feed and shelter such numbers .

So again ….why your games ? Frankly it's getting tiresome .

Unless you somehow believe the ever growing populations of Mexico and the rest of Central America are going to magically decide to starve where they are……this flood of illegals is going to continue .

So either enforce EXISTING immigration laws or drown as a country in this flood of humanity.

Canada2017 said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

I am humbled that you only read my posts. I didnt answer because several other posters have addressed the need for low level wage earners.

Here in North Carolinas there are wanted signs all over for entry level jobs. We went to an Applenbees in Raleigh. When we entered we were told there were two groups ahead of us. Half the place was empty. He quicjly expl;ained there had only two waitresses so it wasnt a shortage of tables but labor.

Other posters went into more depth including lower birth rate and more demand for labor. The jobs are there. People can learn to speak English. Some the workers up here can barely speak proper English anyway.


https://www.uschamber.com/workforce/understanding-americas-labor-shortage
https://immigrationforum.org/article/americas-labor-shortage-how-low-immigration-levels-accentuated-the-problem-and-how-immigration-can-fix-it/

You are the poster that never posts stats or links. You often back your argument with:

I had lunch with two hispanic border agents yesterday and they told me.......

I have helped the people with family members that have drug problems and they told me...

I ran into several policeman yesterday and they told me...

You are one of my favorite two posters but its surprises me you were demanding data. I gave you a little and csn find more if you like. There are jobs in America to be filled by people that want to work.

---

chuckle


As usual no facts, just your biases . There is a minimal need for totally unskilled labor that can't even read and write English effectively . Certainly not 2 million job openings a year.....every year. Even agriculture has moved to more technical harvesting with less labor demands .

Now at some level you are certainly aware of this . But it pleases you to 'stand out'.

Suspect we agree that 'humble' is not a word that should ever be applied to you or your comments .

Yes, trust the words of experienced individuals that I meet face to face.........far more than internet 'experts'.

If I see a heroin addict die at the homeless shelter , attend the funeral of a child slaughtered by an illegal drunk driver , or see what's left of my friends house after illegals rob it..............

don't need any validation from the internet on what constitutes reality .

---

migrants code.

- kkm

GrowlTowel said:

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Sam Lowry said:

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GrowlTowel said:

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Sam Lowry said:

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GrowlTowel said:

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Sam Lowry said:

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GrowlTowel said:

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Sam Lowry said:

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LIB,MR BEARS said:

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Golem said:

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LIB,MR BEARS said:

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Golem said:

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LIB,MR BEARS said:

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Golem said:

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LIB,MR BEARS said:

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Golem said:

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LIB,MR BEARS said:

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Golem said:

---

A car thief dies in a car wreck%85zero sympathy.
A murderer accidentally shoots and kills himself%85zero sympathy.
A burglar falls from the window he's breaking into and dies%85zero sympathy.
An illegal violates our borders and sovereignty and dies committing that crime%85zero sympathy.

If you want to live with less risk, don't violate the law.

---

who is your neighbor?

---

The one who doesn't illegally invade my country, spreading his drug epidemics and gang warfare.

These people are the robbers, not the innocent traveler.

---

the Jews and Samaritans were enemies. When the priest and Levite walked past, did they do the right thing?

When a cop shoots and wounds someone that was just trying to harm them, is the right thing for them to let them lay there and bleed or to administer first aid?

If you were first on the scene at the trailer would you have administered some form of help to the handful that were still clinging to life like you would have if your neighbor was clinging to life?

Your the one that said "zero sympathy". I'm just wondering does that apply to the handful that didn't die before the discovery.

PS. the story of the Good Samaritan doesn't tell us if the traveler was a Jew or a Samaritan. Apparently, Jesus didn't think it mattered in the telling of the story.

---

Illegals are the violent robbers, not the traveler who was mugged in the parable. Your attempted analog falls flat. Invaders who storm a neighboring country in the tens of millions and bring violence and death generally receive a very just death, themselves. These people received justice. I have zero sympathy for invaders.

---

you didn't address the cop scenario or if you'd been the first on scene.

---

I would not save a murderer from his folly, no. I would not save a home invader from his folly, no. I would not save a car jacker from his folly, no. I would not save rapist from his folly, no. I would not save a criminal from his folly, no.

Everyone's life has a purpose. If you die in the course of committing a criminal act, your purpose is to serve as an example to others who would consider following in your footsteps. Every illegal invader to our country who dies in the process of breaking our laws and invading our country deserves the punishment countries have rendered to invaders since time immemorial.

---

There are certain parts of the Bible I struggle with and would prefer to ignore like I do asparagus at a buffet.

Many on here, including myself, have commented how those living a homosexual lifestyle and calling themselves Christian ignore the Bible in that aspect as though it is their asparagus.

I struggle with love your enemy as I guess you also do. %A0I guess that's our asparagus.

Actually, love your enemy is only a struggle if we treat is as scripture. When we treat it as asparagus it's no problem. Buffet Christian?

---

So your interpretation of scripture makes you a complete anti-war, anti-police, anti-prison, anti-self defense pacifist. Got it.

---

Not hardly. Someone earlier in the thread described what is going on with the boarder, immigration and the legal side and processing side of it (Whiterock maybe).

I'm all about enforcing the law or rewriting laws to something that serves an intelligent purpose and is enforceable.

The process is willingly broken, willingly unmanageable. We don't have to be. We can fix ourselves by showing grace as we have received grace, mercy as we have received mercy all while we work on fixing a broken immigration system.

---

True, and immigrants are a grace to us through the labor they provide.

---

What labor? %A0They can't legally work.

---

They can't legally cross the border, either%85yet here they are.

---

Great. %A0Send them home.

---

Great. Except that we need the labor.

---

Stop aborting the population. Send them back.

---

I snapped my fingers and it didn't happen. What's your backup plan?

---

Walls, guns, and planes. Get them the F out.

---

Are you donating to the wall building? I dont think Mexico is going to pay.

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

A car thief dies in a car wreck%85zero sympathy.
A murderer accidentally shoots and kills himself%85zero sympathy.
A burglar falls from the window he's breaking into and dies%85zero sympathy.
An illegal violates our borders and sovereignty and dies committing that crime%85zero sympathy.

If you want to live with less risk, don't violate the law.

---

who is your neighbor?

---

The one who doesn't illegally invade my country, spreading his drug epidemics and gang warfare.

These people are the robbers, not the innocent traveler.

---

the Jews and Samaritans were enemies. When the priest and Levite walked past, did they do the right thing?

When a cop shoots and wounds someone that was just trying to harm them, is the right thing for them to let them lay there and bleed or to administer first aid?

If you were first on the scene at the trailer would you have administered some form of help to the handful that were still clinging to life like you would have if your neighbor was clinging to life?

Your the one that said "zero sympathy". I'm just wondering does that apply to the handful that didn't die before the discovery.

PS. the story of the Good Samaritan doesn't tell us if the traveler was a Jew or a Samaritan. Apparently, Jesus didn't think it mattered in the telling of the story.

---

Illegals are the violent robbers, not the traveler who was mugged in the parable. Your attempted analog falls flat. Invaders who storm a neighboring country in the tens of millions and bring violence and death generally receive a very just death, themselves. These people received justice. I have zero sympathy for invaders.

---

you didn't address the cop scenario or if you'd been the first on scene.

---

I would not save a murderer from his folly, no. I would not save a home invader from his folly, no. I would not save a car jacker from his folly, no. I would not save rapist from his folly, no. I would not save a criminal from his folly, no.

Everyone's life has a purpose. If you die in the course of committing a criminal act, your purpose is to serve as an example to others who would consider following in your footsteps. Every illegal invader to our country who dies in the process of breaking our laws and invading our country deserves the punishment countries have rendered to invaders since time immemorial.

---

There are certain parts of the Bible I struggle with and would prefer to ignore like I do asparagus at a buffet.

Many on here, including myself, have commented how those living a homosexual lifestyle and calling themselves Christian ignore the Bible in that aspect as though it is their asparagus.

I struggle with love your enemy as I guess you also do. %A0I guess that's our asparagus.

Actually, love your enemy is only a struggle if we treat is as scripture. When we treat it as asparagus it's no problem. Buffet Christian?

---

So your interpretation of scripture makes you a complete anti-war, anti-police, anti-prison, anti-self defense pacifist. Got it.

---

Not hardly. Someone earlier in the thread described what is going on with the boarder, immigration and the legal side and processing side of it (Whiterock maybe).

I'm all about enforcing the law or rewriting laws to something that serves an intelligent purpose and is enforceable.

The process is willingly broken, willingly unmanageable. We don't have to be. We can fix ourselves by showing grace as we have received grace, mercy as we have received mercy all while we work on fixing a broken immigration system.

---

True, and immigrants are a grace to us through the labor they provide.

---

What labor? %A0They can't legally work.

---

They can't legally cross the border, either%85yet here they are.

---

Great. %A0Send them home.

---

Great. Except that we need the labor.

---

Stop aborting the population. Send them back.

---

I snapped my fingers and it didn't happen. What's your backup plan?

---

Walls, guns, and planes. Get them the F out.

---

Are you donating to the wall building? I dont think Mexico is going to pay.

---

We all are. 100k dead last year from drug overdose.

Get them the F out.

GrowlTowel said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

A car thief dies in a car wreck%85zero sympathy.
A murderer accidentally shoots and kills himself%85zero sympathy.
A burglar falls from the window he's breaking into and dies%85zero sympathy.
An illegal violates our borders and sovereignty and dies committing that crime%85zero sympathy.

If you want to live with less risk, don't violate the law.

---

who is your neighbor?

---

The one who doesn't illegally invade my country, spreading his drug epidemics and gang warfare.

These people are the robbers, not the innocent traveler.

---

the Jews and Samaritans were enemies. When the priest and Levite walked past, did they do the right thing?

When a cop shoots and wounds someone that was just trying to harm them, is the right thing for them to let them lay there and bleed or to administer first aid?

If you were first on the scene at the trailer would you have administered some form of help to the handful that were still clinging to life like you would have if your neighbor was clinging to life?

Your the one that said "zero sympathy". I'm just wondering does that apply to the handful that didn't die before the discovery.

PS. the story of the Good Samaritan doesn't tell us if the traveler was a Jew or a Samaritan. Apparently, Jesus didn't think it mattered in the telling of the story.

---

Illegals are the violent robbers, not the traveler who was mugged in the parable. Your attempted analog falls flat. Invaders who storm a neighboring country in the tens of millions and bring violence and death generally receive a very just death, themselves. These people received justice. I have zero sympathy for invaders.

---

you didn't address the cop scenario or if you'd been the first on scene.

---

I would not save a murderer from his folly, no. I would not save a home invader from his folly, no. I would not save a car jacker from his folly, no. I would not save rapist from his folly, no. I would not save a criminal from his folly, no.

Everyone's life has a purpose. If you die in the course of committing a criminal act, your purpose is to serve as an example to others who would consider following in your footsteps. Every illegal invader to our country who dies in the process of breaking our laws and invading our country deserves the punishment countries have rendered to invaders since time immemorial.

---

There are certain parts of the Bible I struggle with and would prefer to ignore like I do asparagus at a buffet.

Many on here, including myself, have commented how those living a homosexual lifestyle and calling themselves Christian ignore the Bible in that aspect as though it is their asparagus.

I struggle with love your enemy as I guess you also do. %A0I guess that's our asparagus.

Actually, love your enemy is only a struggle if we treat is as scripture. When we treat it as asparagus it's no problem. Buffet Christian?

---

So your interpretation of scripture makes you a complete anti-war, anti-police, anti-prison, anti-self defense pacifist. Got it.

---

Not hardly. Someone earlier in the thread described what is going on with the boarder, immigration and the legal side and processing side of it (Whiterock maybe).

I'm all about enforcing the law or rewriting laws to something that serves an intelligent purpose and is enforceable.

The process is willingly broken, willingly unmanageable. We don't have to be. We can fix ourselves by showing grace as we have received grace, mercy as we have received mercy all while we work on fixing a broken immigration system.

---

True, and immigrants are a grace to us through the labor they provide.

---

What labor? %A0They can't legally work.

---

They can't legally cross the border, either%85yet here they are.

---

Great. %A0Send them home.

---

Great. Except that we need the labor.

---

Stop aborting the population. Send them back.

---

I snapped my fingers and it didn't happen. What's your backup plan?

---

Walls, guns, and planes. Get them the F out.

---

Are you donating to the wall building? I dont think Mexico is going to pay.

---

We all are. 100k dead last year from drug overdose.

Get them the F out.

---

100%. Sam and LIQR don't think America belongs to Americans, or should. They want to import murderers, gangs, rapists, drug dealers, fentanyl laced death pills of all varieties, and unskilled illegal labor that drives down the wages of the multitude of unskilled citizens we already have too many of. They not only hate America, they hate Americans.

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

A car thief dies in a car wreck%85zero sympathy.
A murderer accidentally shoots and kills himself%85zero sympathy.
A burglar falls from the window he's breaking into and dies%85zero sympathy.
An illegal violates our borders and sovereignty and dies committing that crime%85zero sympathy.

If you want to live with less risk, don't violate the law.

---

who is your neighbor?

---

The one who doesn't illegally invade my country, spreading his drug epidemics and gang warfare.

These people are the robbers, not the innocent traveler.

---

the Jews and Samaritans were enemies. When the priest and Levite walked past, did they do the right thing?

When a cop shoots and wounds someone that was just trying to harm them, is the right thing for them to let them lay there and bleed or to administer first aid?

If you were first on the scene at the trailer would you have administered some form of help to the handful that were still clinging to life like you would have if your neighbor was clinging to life?

Your the one that said "zero sympathy". I'm just wondering does that apply to the handful that didn't die before the discovery.

PS. the story of the Good Samaritan doesn't tell us if the traveler was a Jew or a Samaritan. Apparently, Jesus didn't think it mattered in the telling of the story.

---

Illegals are the violent robbers, not the traveler who was mugged in the parable. Your attempted analog falls flat. Invaders who storm a neighboring country in the tens of millions and bring violence and death generally receive a very just death, themselves. These people received justice. I have zero sympathy for invaders.

---

you didn't address the cop scenario or if you'd been the first on scene.

---

I would not save a murderer from his folly, no. I would not save a home invader from his folly, no. I would not save a car jacker from his folly, no. I would not save rapist from his folly, no. I would not save a criminal from his folly, no.

Everyone's life has a purpose. If you die in the course of committing a criminal act, your purpose is to serve as an example to others who would consider following in your footsteps. Every illegal invader to our country who dies in the process of breaking our laws and invading our country deserves the punishment countries have rendered to invaders since time immemorial.

---

There are certain parts of the Bible I struggle with and would prefer to ignore like I do asparagus at a buffet.

Many on here, including myself, have commented how those living a homosexual lifestyle and calling themselves Christian ignore the Bible in that aspect as though it is their asparagus.

I struggle with love your enemy as I guess you also do. %A0I guess that's our asparagus.

Actually, love your enemy is only a struggle if we treat is as scripture. When we treat it as asparagus it's no problem. Buffet Christian?

---

So your interpretation of scripture makes you a complete anti-war, anti-police, anti-prison, anti-self defense pacifist. Got it.

---

Not hardly. Someone earlier in the thread described what is going on with the boarder, immigration and the legal side and processing side of it (Whiterock maybe).

I'm all about enforcing the law or rewriting laws to something that serves an intelligent purpose and is enforceable.

The process is willingly broken, willingly unmanageable. We don't have to be. We can fix ourselves by showing grace as we have received grace, mercy as we have received mercy all while we work on fixing a broken immigration system.

---

True, and immigrants are a grace to us through the labor they provide.

---

What labor? %A0They can't legally work.

---

They can't legally cross the border, either%85yet here they are.

---

Great. %A0Send them home.

---

Great. Except that we need the labor.

---

Stop aborting the population. Send them back.

---

I snapped my fingers and it didn't happen. What's your backup plan?

---

Walls, guns, and planes. Get them the F out.

---

Are you donating to the wall building? I dont think Mexico is going to pay.

---

Mexico wouldn't have to pay if your democrats had not blocked all other means of funding. But hey, that wall would have stopped deaths like these and we can't have that, right? What's a few hundred deaths every year if it means y'all get to virtue signal, right?

Heart disease caused around 695,000 deaths last year. Blame McDonalds and Krispy Kreme.

Alcohol caused 100,000 deaths. Damn Miller Lite and Bacardi.

A man gets fat eating too much so he blames the grocery storre.

Americans feed the cartels.

https://www.myshortlister.com/insights/the-labor-shortage-problem

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/immigration-jobs-workers-labor-shortage/

https://www.usnews.com/news/us/articles/2022-05-07/less-immigrant-labor-in-us-contributing-to-prices-hikes#:~:text=The%20U.S.%20has%2C%20by%20some,supply%20shortages%20and%20price%20increases.

No, the folks who spend their time and votes fighting against securing the border and supporting democrats caused this by luring them here. By blocking the wall and any decent legislation that would significantly address this problem that have killed. But sure, revert to orange man bad when faced with the results of leftist actions and rhetoric. All that matters is intent, right?

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

Heart disease caused around 695,000 deaths last year. Blame McDonalds and Krispy Kreme.

Alcohol caused 100,000 deaths. Damn Miller Lite and Bacardi.

A man gets fat eating too much so he blames the grocery storre.

Americans feed the cartels.

---

When your house is home to addicts, only a fool or an evil man would invite drug dealers to live in the spare bedroom.

You acknowledge Americans have problems and you demand we illegally import new problems to compound our existing problems.

It's long past time we stopped the invasion from the southern border.

GrowlTowel said:

---

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

A car thief dies in a car wreck%85zero sympathy.
A murderer accidentally shoots and kills himself%85zero sympathy.
A burglar falls from the window he's breaking into and dies%85zero sympathy.
An illegal violates our borders and sovereignty and dies committing that crime%85zero sympathy.

If you want to live with less risk, don't violate the law.

---

who is your neighbor?

---

The one who doesn't illegally invade my country, spreading his drug epidemics and gang warfare.

These people are the robbers, not the innocent traveler.

---

the Jews and Samaritans were enemies. When the priest and Levite walked past, did they do the right thing?

When a cop shoots and wounds someone that was just trying to harm them, is the right thing for them to let them lay there and bleed or to administer first aid?

If you were first on the scene at the trailer would you have administered some form of help to the handful that were still clinging to life like you would have if your neighbor was clinging to life?

Your the one that said "zero sympathy". I'm just wondering does that apply to the handful that didn't die before the discovery.

PS. the story of the Good Samaritan doesn't tell us if the traveler was a Jew or a Samaritan. Apparently, Jesus didn't think it mattered in the telling of the story.

---

Illegals are the violent robbers, not the traveler who was mugged in the parable. Your attempted analog falls flat. Invaders who storm a neighboring country in the tens of millions and bring violence and death generally receive a very just death, themselves. These people received justice. I have zero sympathy for invaders.

---

you didn't address the cop scenario or if you'd been the first on scene.

---

I would not save a murderer from his folly, no. I would not save a home invader from his folly, no. I would not save a car jacker from his folly, no. I would not save rapist from his folly, no. I would not save a criminal from his folly, no.

Everyone's life has a purpose. If you die in the course of committing a criminal act, your purpose is to serve as an example to others who would consider following in your footsteps. Every illegal invader to our country who dies in the process of breaking our laws and invading our country deserves the punishment countries have rendered to invaders since time immemorial.

---

There are certain parts of the Bible I struggle with and would prefer to ignore like I do asparagus at a buffet.

Many on here, including myself, have commented how those living a homosexual lifestyle and calling themselves Christian ignore the Bible in that aspect as though it is their asparagus.

I struggle with love your enemy as I guess you also do. %A0I guess that's our asparagus.

Actually, love your enemy is only a struggle if we treat is as scripture. When we treat it as asparagus it's no problem. Buffet Christian?

---

So your interpretation of scripture makes you a complete anti-war, anti-police, anti-prison, anti-self defense pacifist. Got it.

---

Not hardly. Someone earlier in the thread described what is going on with the boarder, immigration and the legal side and processing side of it (Whiterock maybe).

I'm all about enforcing the law or rewriting laws to something that serves an intelligent purpose and is enforceable.

The process is willingly broken, willingly unmanageable. We don't have to be. We can fix ourselves by showing grace as we have received grace, mercy as we have received mercy all while we work on fixing a broken immigration system.

---

True, and immigrants are a grace to us through the labor they provide.

---

What labor? %A0They can't legally work.

---

They can't legally cross the border, either%85yet here they are.

---

Great. %A0Send them home.

---

Great. Except that we need the labor.

---

Stop aborting the population. Send them back.

---

I snapped my fingers and it didn't happen. What's your backup plan?

---

Walls, guns, and planes. Get them the F out.

---

Are you donating to the wall building? I dont think Mexico is going to pay.

---

We all are. 100k dead last year from drug overdose.

Get them the F out.

---

75k were opioids.

Drugs come through ports of entry mostly.

But godd luck with that wall.

Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

---

Heart disease caused around 695,000 deaths last year. Blame McDonalds and Krispy Kreme.

Alcohol caused 100,000 deaths. Damn Miller Lite and Bacardi.

A man gets fat eating too much so he blames the grocery storre.

Americans feed the cartels.

---

typical dem. You call out MickyDs and fail to mention Arby's.

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

A car thief dies in a car wreck%85zero sympathy.
A murderer accidentally shoots and kills himself%85zero sympathy.
A burglar falls from the window he's breaking into and dies%85zero sympathy.
An illegal violates our borders and sovereignty and dies committing that crime%85zero sympathy.

If you want to live with less risk, don't violate the law.

---

who is your neighbor?

---

The one who doesn't illegally invade my country, spreading his drug epidemics and gang warfare.

These people are the robbers, not the innocent traveler.

---

the Jews and Samaritans were enemies. When the priest and Levite walked past, did they do the right thing?

When a cop shoots and wounds someone that was just trying to harm them, is the right thing for them to let them lay there and bleed or to administer first aid?

If you were first on the scene at the trailer would you have administered some form of help to the handful that were still clinging to life like you would have if your neighbor was clinging to life?

Your the one that said "zero sympathy". I'm just wondering does that apply to the handful that didn't die before the discovery.

PS. the story of the Good Samaritan doesn't tell us if the traveler was a Jew or a Samaritan. Apparently, Jesus didn't think it mattered in the telling of the story.

---

Illegals are the violent robbers, not the traveler who was mugged in the parable. Your attempted analog falls flat. Invaders who storm a neighboring country in the tens of millions and bring violence and death generally receive a very just death, themselves. These people received justice. I have zero sympathy for invaders.

---

you didn't address the cop scenario or if you'd been the first on scene.

---

I would not save a murderer from his folly, no. I would not save a home invader from his folly, no. I would not save a car jacker from his folly, no. I would not save rapist from his folly, no. I would not save a criminal from his folly, no.

Everyone's life has a purpose. If you die in the course of committing a criminal act, your purpose is to serve as an example to others who would consider following in your footsteps. Every illegal invader to our country who dies in the process of breaking our laws and invading our country deserves the punishment countries have rendered to invaders since time immemorial.

---

There are certain parts of the Bible I struggle with and would prefer to ignore like I do asparagus at a buffet.

Many on here, including myself, have commented how those living a homosexual lifestyle and calling themselves Christian ignore the Bible in that aspect as though it is their asparagus.

I struggle with love your enemy as I guess you also do. %A0I guess that's our asparagus.

Actually, love your enemy is only a struggle if we treat is as scripture. When we treat it as asparagus it's no problem. Buffet Christian?

---

So your interpretation of scripture makes you a complete anti-war, anti-police, anti-prison, anti-self defense pacifist. Got it.

---

Not hardly. Someone earlier in the thread described what is going on with the boarder, immigration and the legal side and processing side of it (Whiterock maybe).

I'm all about enforcing the law or rewriting laws to something that serves an intelligent purpose and is enforceable.

The process is willingly broken, willingly unmanageable. We don't have to be. We can fix ourselves by showing grace as we have received grace, mercy as we have received mercy all while we work on fixing a broken immigration system.

---

True, and immigrants are a grace to us through the labor they provide.

---

What labor? %A0They can't legally work.

---

They can't legally cross the border, either%85yet here they are.

---

Great. %A0Send them home.

---

Great. Except that we need the labor.

---

Stop aborting the population. Send them back.

---

I snapped my fingers and it didn't happen. What's your backup plan?

---

Walls, guns, and planes. Get them the F out.

---

I see you don't want to address the population issue. Unfortunately we can't gun our way to productivity.

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

A car thief dies in a car wreck%85zero sympathy.
A murderer accidentally shoots and kills himself%85zero sympathy.
A burglar falls from the window he's breaking into and dies%85zero sympathy.
An illegal violates our borders and sovereignty and dies committing that crime%85zero sympathy.

If you want to live with less risk, don't violate the law.

---

who is your neighbor?

---

The one who doesn't illegally invade my country, spreading his drug epidemics and gang warfare.

These people are the robbers, not the innocent traveler.

---

the Jews and Samaritans were enemies. When the priest and Levite walked past, did they do the right thing?

When a cop shoots and wounds someone that was just trying to harm them, is the right thing for them to let them lay there and bleed or to administer first aid?

If you were first on the scene at the trailer would you have administered some form of help to the handful that were still clinging to life like you would have if your neighbor was clinging to life?

Your the one that said "zero sympathy". I'm just wondering does that apply to the handful that didn't die before the discovery.

PS. the story of the Good Samaritan doesn't tell us if the traveler was a Jew or a Samaritan. Apparently, Jesus didn't think it mattered in the telling of the story.

---

Illegals are the violent robbers, not the traveler who was mugged in the parable. Your attempted analog falls flat. Invaders who storm a neighboring country in the tens of millions and bring violence and death generally receive a very just death, themselves. These people received justice. I have zero sympathy for invaders.

---

you didn't address the cop scenario or if you'd been the first on scene.

---

I would not save a murderer from his folly, no. I would not save a home invader from his folly, no. I would not save a car jacker from his folly, no. I would not save rapist from his folly, no. I would not save a criminal from his folly, no.

Everyone's life has a purpose. If you die in the course of committing a criminal act, your purpose is to serve as an example to others who would consider following in your footsteps. Every illegal invader to our country who dies in the process of breaking our laws and invading our country deserves the punishment countries have rendered to invaders since time immemorial.

---

There are certain parts of the Bible I struggle with and would prefer to ignore like I do asparagus at a buffet.

Many on here, including myself, have commented how those living a homosexual lifestyle and calling themselves Christian ignore the Bible in that aspect as though it is their asparagus.

I struggle with love your enemy as I guess you also do. %A0I guess that's our asparagus.

Actually, love your enemy is only a struggle if we treat is as scripture. When we treat it as asparagus it's no problem. Buffet Christian?

---

So your interpretation of scripture makes you a complete anti-war, anti-police, anti-prison, anti-self defense pacifist. Got it.

---

Not hardly. Someone earlier in the thread described what is going on with the boarder, immigration and the legal side and processing side of it (Whiterock maybe).

I'm all about enforcing the law or rewriting laws to something that serves an intelligent purpose and is enforceable.

The process is willingly broken, willingly unmanageable. We don't have to be. We can fix ourselves by showing grace as we have received grace, mercy as we have received mercy all while we work on fixing a broken immigration system.

---

True, and immigrants are a grace to us through the labor they provide.

---

What labor? %A0They can't legally work.

---

They can't legally cross the border, either%85yet here they are.

---

Great. %A0Send them home.

---

Great. Except that we need the labor.

---

Stop aborting the population. Send them back.

---

I snapped my fingers and it didn't happen. What's your backup plan?

---

Walls, guns, and planes. Get them the F out.

---

I see you don't want to address the population issue. Unfortunately we can't gun our way to productivity.

---

And there is that outright lie again that America needs an illegal invasion of UNSKILLED labor. You want to import educated, skilled labor, no one really bats an eye. It's your welcoming an illegal invasion to keep your fellow unskilled countrymen in poverty that people balk at. You hate Americans.

Golem said:

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Sam Lowry said:

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GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

A car thief dies in a car wreck%85zero sympathy.
A murderer accidentally shoots and kills himself%85zero sympathy.
A burglar falls from the window he's breaking into and dies%85zero sympathy.
An illegal violates our borders and sovereignty and dies committing that crime%85zero sympathy.

If you want to live with less risk, don't violate the law.

---

who is your neighbor?

---

The one who doesn't illegally invade my country, spreading his drug epidemics and gang warfare.

These people are the robbers, not the innocent traveler.

---

the Jews and Samaritans were enemies. When the priest and Levite walked past, did they do the right thing?

When a cop shoots and wounds someone that was just trying to harm them, is the right thing for them to let them lay there and bleed or to administer first aid?

If you were first on the scene at the trailer would you have administered some form of help to the handful that were still clinging to life like you would have if your neighbor was clinging to life?

Your the one that said "zero sympathy". I'm just wondering does that apply to the handful that didn't die before the discovery.

PS. the story of the Good Samaritan doesn't tell us if the traveler was a Jew or a Samaritan. Apparently, Jesus didn't think it mattered in the telling of the story.

---

Illegals are the violent robbers, not the traveler who was mugged in the parable. Your attempted analog falls flat. Invaders who storm a neighboring country in the tens of millions and bring violence and death generally receive a very just death, themselves. These people received justice. I have zero sympathy for invaders.

---

you didn't address the cop scenario or if you'd been the first on scene.

---

I would not save a murderer from his folly, no. I would not save a home invader from his folly, no. I would not save a car jacker from his folly, no. I would not save rapist from his folly, no. I would not save a criminal from his folly, no.

Everyone's life has a purpose. If you die in the course of committing a criminal act, your purpose is to serve as an example to others who would consider following in your footsteps. Every illegal invader to our country who dies in the process of breaking our laws and invading our country deserves the punishment countries have rendered to invaders since time immemorial.

---

There are certain parts of the Bible I struggle with and would prefer to ignore like I do asparagus at a buffet.

Many on here, including myself, have commented how those living a homosexual lifestyle and calling themselves Christian ignore the Bible in that aspect as though it is their asparagus.

I struggle with love your enemy as I guess you also do. %A0I guess that's our asparagus.

Actually, love your enemy is only a struggle if we treat is as scripture. When we treat it as asparagus it's no problem. Buffet Christian?

---

So your interpretation of scripture makes you a complete anti-war, anti-police, anti-prison, anti-self defense pacifist. Got it.

---

Not hardly. Someone earlier in the thread described what is going on with the boarder, immigration and the legal side and processing side of it (Whiterock maybe).

I'm all about enforcing the law or rewriting laws to something that serves an intelligent purpose and is enforceable.

The process is willingly broken, willingly unmanageable. We don't have to be. We can fix ourselves by showing grace as we have received grace, mercy as we have received mercy all while we work on fixing a broken immigration system.

---

True, and immigrants are a grace to us through the labor they provide.

---

What labor? %A0They can't legally work.

---

They can't legally cross the border, either%85yet here they are.

---

Great. %A0Send them home.

---

Great. Except that we need the labor.

---

Stop aborting the population. Send them back.

---

I snapped my fingers and it didn't happen. What's your backup plan?

---

Walls, guns, and planes. Get them the F out.

---

I see you don't want to address the population issue. Unfortunately we can't gun our way to productivity.

---

And there is that outright lie again that America needs an illegal invasion of UNSKILLED labor. You want to import educated, skilled labor, no one really bats an eye. It's your welcoming an illegal invasion to keep your fellow unskilled countrymen in poverty that people balk at. You hate Americans.

---

Certain posters choose to ignore the statistical impossibility of the United States providing food, shelter, and medical care for all of the millions of poor people throughout central and south America who desire to enter our country .

This wave of humanity is never going to stop....for the simple reason the vast majority of the countries throughout central and south America are totally incapable of providing employment for their growing populations .

So the US....with all its freebies.....will remain the continents 'escape valve ' for the foreseeable future .

How anyone with an university education can steadfastly ignore these obvious realities is beyond my comprehension .

Wangchung said:

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Sam Lowry said:

---

Wangchung said:

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I disagree. Only by creating a demand for workers can we raise wages. We cannot create that demand while cheap illegal labor is readily available.

---

You can't create wealth just by raising wages. It takes labor.

---

You cannot create demand by flooding the market with supply.

---

It's hardly flooded. We do need to raise wages, but that can only go so far.

Golem said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

Golem said:

---

A car thief dies in a car wreck%85zero sympathy.
A murderer accidentally shoots and kills himself%85zero sympathy.
A burglar falls from the window he's breaking into and dies%85zero sympathy.
An illegal violates our borders and sovereignty and dies committing that crime%85zero sympathy.

If you want to live with less risk, don't violate the law.

---

who is your neighbor?

---

The one who doesn't illegally invade my country, spreading his drug epidemics and gang warfare.

These people are the robbers, not the innocent traveler.

---

the Jews and Samaritans were enemies. When the priest and Levite walked past, did they do the right thing?

When a cop shoots and wounds someone that was just trying to harm them, is the right thing for them to let them lay there and bleed or to administer first aid?

If you were first on the scene at the trailer would you have administered some form of help to the handful that were still clinging to life like you would have if your neighbor was clinging to life?

Your the one that said "zero sympathy". I'm just wondering does that apply to the handful that didn't die before the discovery.

PS. the story of the Good Samaritan doesn't tell us if the traveler was a Jew or a Samaritan. Apparently, Jesus didn't think it mattered in the telling of the story.

---

Illegals are the violent robbers, not the traveler who was mugged in the parable. Your attempted analog falls flat. Invaders who storm a neighboring country in the tens of millions and bring violence and death generally receive a very just death, themselves. These people received justice. I have zero sympathy for invaders.

---

you didn't address the cop scenario or if you'd been the first on scene.

---

I would not save a murderer from his folly, no. I would not save a home invader from his folly, no. I would not save a car jacker from his folly, no. I would not save rapist from his folly, no. I would not save a criminal from his folly, no.

Everyone's life has a purpose. If you die in the course of committing a criminal act, your purpose is to serve as an example to others who would consider following in your footsteps. Every illegal invader to our country who dies in the process of breaking our laws and invading our country deserves the punishment countries have rendered to invaders since time immemorial.

---

There are certain parts of the Bible I struggle with and would prefer to ignore like I do asparagus at a buffet.

Many on here, including myself, have commented how those living a homosexual lifestyle and calling themselves Christian ignore the Bible in that aspect as though it is their asparagus.

I struggle with love your enemy as I guess you also do. %A0I guess that's our asparagus.

Actually, love your enemy is only a struggle if we treat is as scripture. When we treat it as asparagus it's no problem. Buffet Christian?

---

So your interpretation of scripture makes you a complete anti-war, anti-police, anti-prison, anti-self defense pacifist. Got it.

---

Not hardly. Someone earlier in the thread described what is going on with the boarder, immigration and the legal side and processing side of it (Whiterock maybe).

I'm all about enforcing the law or rewriting laws to something that serves an intelligent purpose and is enforceable.

The process is willingly broken, willingly unmanageable. We don't have to be. We can fix ourselves by showing grace as we have received grace, mercy as we have received mercy all while we work on fixing a broken immigration system.

---

True, and immigrants are a grace to us through the labor they provide.

---

What labor? %A0They can't legally work.

---

They can't legally cross the border, either%85yet here they are.

---

Great. %A0Send them home.

---

Great. Except that we need the labor.

---

Stop aborting the population. Send them back.

---

I snapped my fingers and it didn't happen. What's your backup plan?

---

Walls, guns, and planes. Get them the F out.

---

I see you don't want to address the population issue. Unfortunately we can't gun our way to productivity.

---

And there is that outright lie again that America needs an illegal invasion of UNSKILLED labor. You want to import educated, skilled labor, no one really bats an eye. It's your welcoming an illegal invasion to keep your fellow unskilled countrymen in poverty that people balk at. You hate Americans.

---

Employers disagree. Low-skilled workers are currently the most in demand.