Osodecentx said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

Has Ukraine won already ?


Millions of dead Russian troops.
The embargo reducing the Russian economy to that of Haiti.
Thousands of square miles of Russian territory occupied by Ukrainian soldiers.


Time to give another 100 billion dollars while the treasury still has enough ink left

---

Ninety percent of the money expended on Ukraine goes to American companies, primarily for arms.

---

which gets sent back to our congress people thru lobby work and campaign contributions and 100k per plate dinner party speeches

Osodecentx said:

---

4th and Inches said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

Has Ukraine won already ?


Millions of dead Russian troops.
The embargo reducing the Russian economy to that of Haiti.
Thousands of square miles of Russian territory occupied by Ukrainian soldiers.


Time to give another 100 billion dollars while the treasury still has enough ink left

---

Ninety percent of the money expended on Ukraine goes to American companies, primarily for arms.

---

which gets sent back to our congress people thru lobby work and campaign contributions and 100k per plate dinner party speeches

---

Some of it. Probably.
Also gets back to American workers and companies

---

So the ole trickle down philosophy....but for endless government spending.

And we wonder how we got into Trillions of dollars into debt.

https://www.truthinaccounting.org/about/our_national_debt?gclid=Cj0KCQiA7OqrBhD9ARIsAK3UXh0MWMaPA_CitJM-nlxB-zkpFcKGPMIODBlGGeDlSjrT3Fk5d-7_NMQaAtE7EALw_wcB

Osodecentx said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

Russia Has Suffered Staggeringly High Losses, U.S. Report Says

---

I've got some oceanfront property in Arizona to sell you.

Quote:

---

At the start of the war the Russian army stood at 360,000 troops. Russia has lost 315,000 of those troops

---

Nobody believes this outside the beltway.

---

I mean we have no reason to think the U.S. intelligence community would lie to the American people…right?

---

This was a sorry and embarrassing episode. Each of the people pictured lost credibility and should be ashamed.

That said, what number of Russian soldiers do you think have been killed or wounded? Who is your source? Please cite. Is it more credible than US intel?

---

I would try to find a sources that does not have a 100% interest in rooting on either side.

People say good things about the DPCR at Uppsala University in Sweden

[Ukrainian estimates of Russian military losses tended to be high, while Russian estimates of their own losses tended to be low. Combat deaths can be inferred from a variety of sources, including satellite imagery and video image of military actions. According to a researcher at the Department of Peace and Conflict Research at Uppsala University in Sweden, regarding Russian military losses, Ukraine engaged in a misinformation campaign to boost morale and Western media were generally happy to accept its claims, while Russia was downplaying its own casualties.]

https://www.uu.se/en/news/archive/2023-06-13-number-of-deaths-in-armed-conflicts-has-doubled

[Together, the wars in Ethiopia and Ukraine resulted in at least 180,000 battle-related deaths in 2022. This is a low estimate as information from these conflicts is scarce and subject to extensive propaganda. The numbers are likely to be significantly revised as more information becomes available. Even so, the data shows that more people died in those two conflicts in 2022 than in the whole world the year before.]

Osodecentx said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

Has Ukraine won already ?


Millions of dead Russian troops.
The embargo reducing the Russian economy to that of Haiti.
Thousands of square miles of Russian territory occupied by Ukrainian soldiers.


Time to give another 100 billion dollars while the treasury still has enough ink left

---

Ninety percent of the money expended on Ukraine goes to American companies, primarily for arms.

---

What a relief !

Was worried all those billions were being wasted on US border security, our homeless, the mentally ill, reduction of our national debt and job creation.

Redbrickbear said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

4th and Inches said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

Has Ukraine won already ?


Millions of dead Russian troops.
The embargo reducing the Russian economy to that of Haiti.
Thousands of square miles of Russian territory occupied by Ukrainian soldiers.


Time to give another 100 billion dollars while the treasury still has enough ink left

---

Ninety percent of the money expended on Ukraine goes to American companies, primarily for arms.

---

which gets sent back to our congress people thru lobby work and campaign contributions and 100k per plate dinner party speeches

---

Some of it. Probably.
Also gets back to American workers and companies

---

So the ole trickle down philosophy....but for endless government spending.

And we wonder how we got into Trillions of dollars into debt.

https://www.truthinaccounting.org/about/our_national_debt?gclid=Cj0KCQiA7OqrBhD9ARIsAK3UXh0MWMaPA_CitJM-nlxB-zkpFcKGPMIODBlGGeDlSjrT3Fk5d-7_NMQaAtE7EALw_wcB

---

I guess we should just gut every industry. I agree, there is bloat aplenty. But gut 'em all. See where we are then. Luckily, that'll break other countries faster than it'll break us (lookin' at you China).

The defense industry didn't get us into inescapable debt. That actually adds back to society via employment.

trey3216 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

4th and Inches said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

Has Ukraine won already ?


Millions of dead Russian troops.
The embargo reducing the Russian economy to that of Haiti.
Thousands of square miles of Russian territory occupied by Ukrainian soldiers.


Time to give another 100 billion dollars while the treasury still has enough ink left

---

Ninety percent of the money expended on Ukraine goes to American companies, primarily for arms.

---

which gets sent back to our congress people thru lobby work and campaign contributions and 100k per plate dinner party speeches

---

Some of it. Probably.
Also gets back to American workers and companies

---

So the ole trickle down philosophy....but for endless government spending.

And we wonder how we got into Trillions of dollars into debt.

https://www.truthinaccounting.org/about/our_national_debt?gclid=Cj0KCQiA7OqrBhD9ARIsAK3UXh0MWMaPA_CitJM-nlxB-zkpFcKGPMIODBlGGeDlSjrT3Fk5d-7_NMQaAtE7EALw_wcB

---

I guess we should just gut every industry.

---

How many of our industries rely completely on government spending?

If its more than a few limited sectors then the USA is starting to look more like the old USSR and less like a true free market system with a dynamic economy.

And if we are talking about military spending...I don't think people are against defense spending...they are just against foolish wasteful proxy wars that do very little for our own real defense.

We spent about $2.313 trillion on the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan...for very little if any benefit.

Redbrickbear said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

Russia Has Suffered Staggeringly High Losses, U.S. Report Says

---

I've got some oceanfront property in Arizona to sell you.

Quote:

---

At the start of the war the Russian army stood at 360,000 troops. Russia has lost 315,000 of those troops

---

Nobody believes this outside the beltway.

---

I mean we have no reason to think the U.S. intelligence community would lie to the American people…right?

---

This was a sorry and embarrassing episode. Each of the people pictured lost credibility and should be ashamed.

That said, what number of Russian soldiers do you think have been killed or wounded? Who is your source? Please cite. Is it more credible than US intel?

---

I would try to find a sources that does not have a 100% interest in rooting on either side.

People say good things about the DPCR at Uppsala University in Sweden

[Ukrainian estimates of Russian military losses tended to be high, while Russian estimates of their own losses tended to be low. Combat deaths can be inferred from a variety of sources, including satellite imagery and video image of military actions. According to a researcher at the Department of Peace and Conflict Research at Uppsala University in Sweden, regarding Russian military losses, Ukraine engaged in a misinformation campaign to boost morale and Western media were generally happy to accept its claims, while Russia was downplaying its own casualties.]

https://www.uu.se/en/news/archive/2023-06-13-number-of-deaths-in-armed-conflicts-has-doubled

[Together, the wars in Ethiopia and Ukraine resulted in at least 180,000 battle-related deaths in 2022. This is a low estimate as information from these conflicts is scarce and subject to extensive propaganda. The numbers are likely to be significantly revised as more information becomes available. Even so, the data shows that more people died in those two conflicts in 2022 than in the whole world the year before.]

---

Universities never have an agenda.

I'll stick with the IC

Redbrickbear said:

---

trey3216 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

4th and Inches said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

Has Ukraine won already ?


Millions of dead Russian troops.
The embargo reducing the Russian economy to that of Haiti.
Thousands of square miles of Russian territory occupied by Ukrainian soldiers.


Time to give another 100 billion dollars while the treasury still has enough ink left

---

Ninety percent of the money expended on Ukraine goes to American companies, primarily for arms.

---

which gets sent back to our congress people thru lobby work and campaign contributions and 100k per plate dinner party speeches

---

Some of it. Probably.
Also gets back to American workers and companies

---

So the ole trickle down philosophy....but for endless government spending.

And we wonder how we got into Trillions of dollars into debt.

https://www.truthinaccounting.org/about/our_national_debt?gclid=Cj0KCQiA7OqrBhD9ARIsAK3UXh0MWMaPA_CitJM-nlxB-zkpFcKGPMIODBlGGeDlSjrT3Fk5d-7_NMQaAtE7EALw_wcB

---

I guess we should just gut every industry.

---

How many of our industries rely completely on government spending? Uppsala University is state funded.

If its more than a few limited sectors then the USA is starting to look more like the old USSR and less like a true free market system with a dynamic economy.

---

I don't disagree with the second sentence. Would you purchase arms from the private sector or prefer a government agency?

Osodecentx said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

Russia Has Suffered Staggeringly High Losses, U.S. Report Says

---

I've got some oceanfront property in Arizona to sell you.

Quote:

---

At the start of the war the Russian army stood at 360,000 troops. Russia has lost 315,000 of those troops

---

Nobody believes this outside the beltway.

---

I mean we have no reason to think the U.S. intelligence community would lie to the American people…right?

---

This was a sorry and embarrassing episode. Each of the people pictured lost credibility and should be ashamed.

That said, what number of Russian soldiers do you think have been killed or wounded? Who is your source? Please cite. Is it more credible than US intel?

---

I would try to find a sources that does not have a 100% interest in rooting on either side.

People say good things about the DPCR at Uppsala University in Sweden

[Ukrainian estimates of Russian military losses tended to be high, while Russian estimates of their own losses tended to be low. Combat deaths can be inferred from a variety of sources, including satellite imagery and video image of military actions. According to a researcher at the Department of Peace and Conflict Research at Uppsala University in Sweden, regarding Russian military losses, Ukraine engaged in a misinformation campaign to boost morale and Western media were generally happy to accept its claims, while Russia was downplaying its own casualties.]

https://www.uu.se/en/news/archive/2023-06-13-number-of-deaths-in-armed-conflicts-has-doubled

[Together, the wars in Ethiopia and Ukraine resulted in at least 180,000 battle-related deaths in 2022. This is a low estimate as information from these conflicts is scarce and subject to extensive propaganda. The numbers are likely to be significantly revised as more information becomes available. Even so, the data shows that more people died in those two conflicts in 2022 than in the whole world the year before.]

---

Universities never have an agenda.

I'll stick with the IC

---

You are sticking with US intelligence agencies....who just came out with these massive Russian death figures right as Congressional Republicans are asking why we should be funding this Ukraine proxy war.

Very convenient timing

"Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy made a last-ditch plea for more military aid to U.S. lawmakers on Capitol Hill, where he faced a skeptical reception from key Republicans"

Someone might almost think the US intelligence community was trying to selectively release info to put pressure on the Republicans in Congress.....

Info that we can't confim if its accurate or just more propaganda

Osodecentx said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

Osodecentx said:

---

Russia Has Suffered Staggeringly High Losses, U.S. Report Says

---

I've got some oceanfront property in Arizona to sell you.

Quote:

---

At the start of the war the Russian army stood at 360,000 troops. Russia has lost 315,000 of those troops

---

Nobody believes this outside the beltway.

---

I mean we have no reason to think the U.S. intelligence community would lie to the American people…right?

---

This was a sorry and embarrassing episode. Each of the people pictured lost credibility and should be ashamed.

That said, what number of Russian soldiers do you think have been killed or wounded? Who is your source? Please cite. Is it more credible than US intel?

---

I would try to find a sources that does not have a 100% interest in rooting on either side.

People say good things about the DPCR at Uppsala University in Sweden

[Ukrainian estimates of Russian military losses tended to be high, while Russian estimates of their own losses tended to be low. Combat deaths can be inferred from a variety of sources, including satellite imagery and video image of military actions. According to a researcher at the Department of Peace and Conflict Research at Uppsala University in Sweden, regarding Russian military losses, Ukraine engaged in a misinformation campaign to boost morale and Western media were generally happy to accept its claims, while Russia was downplaying its own casualties.]

https://www.uu.se/en/news/archive/2023-06-13-number-of-deaths-in-armed-conflicts-has-doubled

[Together, the wars in Ethiopia and Ukraine resulted in at least 180,000 battle-related deaths in 2022. This is a low estimate as information from these conflicts is scarce and subject to extensive propaganda. The numbers are likely to be significantly revised as more information becomes available. Even so, the data shows that more people died in those two conflicts in 2022 than in the whole world the year before.]

---

I'll stick with the IC

---

As you should with this.

ATL Bear said:

---

$2 Trillion in direct transfer payments every year and the hill to die on is the defense industry? Good grief…

---

No one is dying on any hill and no spending (anywhere) is being cut from the bloated Federal government spending.

But we still as Americans citizens have the right to complain.

Redbrickbear said:

---

ATL Bear said:

---

$2 Trillion in direct transfer payments every year and the hill to die on is the defense industry? Good grief…

---

No one is dying on any hill and no spending (anywhere) is being cut from the bloated Federal government spending.

But we still as Americans citizens have the right to complain.

---

Your numbers need an update. An over $2.5 Trillion increase (70%) in 7 years. Feel free to complain all you want, I just prefer to focus on the elephant and not the dancing bear.

ATL Bear said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

ATL Bear said:

---

$2 Trillion in direct transfer payments every year and the hill to die on is the defense industry? Good grief…

---

No one is dying on any hill and no spending (anywhere) is being cut from the bloated Federal government spending.

But we still as Americans citizens have the right to complain.

---

Your numbers need an update. An over $2.5 Trillion increase (70%) in 7 years. Feel free to complain all you want, I just prefer to focus on the elephant and not the dancing bear.

---

So the spending is even more insane….


But God forbid we don't spend $200 billion more on a proxy war in Eastern Europe.


And to think there are people in DC still upset we pulled out of the trillion dollar boondoggles of Iraq and Afghanistan

About that Ukrainian bridgehead (from the BBC)

""The entire river crossing is under constant fire. I've seen boats with my comrades on board just disappear into the water after being hit, lost forever to the Dnipro river."We must carry everything with us - generators, fuel and food. When you're setting up a bridgehead you need a lot of everything, but supplies weren't planned for this area."We thought after we made it there the enemy would flee and then we could calmly transport everything we needed, but it didn't turn out that way."When we arrived on the [eastern] bank, the enemy were waiting.They threw everything at us - artillery, mortars and flame thrower systems. I thought I'd never get out.""Every day we sat in the forest taking incoming fire. We were trapped - the roads and paths are all riddled with mines. The Russians cannot control everything, and we use it. But their drones are constantly buzzing in the air, ready to strike as soon as they see movement."Supplies were the weakest link. The Russians monitored our supply lines, so it became more difficult - there was a real lack of drinking water, despite our deliveries by boat and drone."We paid for a lot of our own kit - buying generators, power banks and warm clothes ourselves. Now the frosts are coming, things will only get worse - the real situation is being hushed up, so no-one will change anything."

Realitybites said:

---

About that Ukrainian bridgehead (from the BBC)

""The entire river crossing is under constant fire. I've seen boats with my comrades on board just disappear into the water after being hit, lost forever to the Dnipro river."We must carry everything with us - generators, fuel and food. When you're setting up a bridgehead you need a lot of everything, but supplies weren't planned for this area."We thought after we made it there the enemy would flee and then we could calmly transport everything we needed, but it didn't turn out that way."When we arrived on the [eastern] bank, the enemy were waiting.They threw everything at us - artillery, mortars and flame thrower systems. I thought I'd never get out.""Every day we sat in the forest taking incoming fire. We were trapped - the roads and paths are all riddled with mines. The Russians cannot control everything, and we use it. But their drones are constantly buzzing in the air, ready to strike as soon as they see movement."Supplies were the weakest link. The Russians monitored our supply lines, so it became more difficult - there was a real lack of drinking water, despite our deliveries by boat and drone."We paid for a lot of our own kit - buying generators, power banks and warm clothes ourselves. Now the frosts are coming, things will only get worse - the real situation is being hushed up, so no-one will change anything."

---

About those VDV orcs trying to dislodge them:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidaxe/2023/12/06/russia-formed-a-fifth-airborne-brigade-it-wasnt-ready-for-the-drone-and-artillery-apocalyse/?sh=a509ad13ad78

"Russia Formed A Fifth Airborne Division. It Wasn't Ready For The Drone and Artillery Apocalypse."

🚨BREAKING: UKRAINE DEPUTY DETONATES GRENADE IN COUNCIL MEETING | 1 DEAD, 26 INJURED pic.twitter.com/2KYTAdxYEh

— Mario Nawfal (@MarioNawfal) December 15, 2023

This is HUGE! This puts US troops within close striking distance of Moscow, and within sight of St. Petersburg. This is going to drive Putin up the damned wall! https://t.co/7ed3SLmSh7

— Texas Paul Schroder (@Paultx890) December 15, 2023

boognish_bear said:

---

This is HUGE! This puts US troops within close striking distance of Moscow, and within sight of St. Petersburg. This is going to drive Putin up the damned wall! https://t.co/7ed3SLmSh7

— Texas Paul Schroder (@Paultx890) December 15, 2023

---

Finland is in NATO now due to Russian aggression. This is not super shocking.

boognish_bear said:

---

This is HUGE! This puts US troops within close striking distance of Moscow, and within sight of St. Petersburg. This is going to drive Putin up the damned wall! https://t.co/7ed3SLmSh7

— Texas Paul Schroder (@Paultx890) December 15, 2023

---

Unnecessarily provocative actions by Finland.

And in the past Finland has paid dearly for poking the bear.

whiterock said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

They are resurrecting the “domino” theory that was used to justify our disaster in Vietnam. https://t.co/4QaP0TFr5R

— RAMZPAUL (@ramzpaul) December 9, 2023

---

not resurrecting it at all. Just noting the bloody flippin' obvious - that moving Russian armies 600mi closer to NATO armies increases risk of direct contact between Nato/Russia.

---

The obvious is that Russia considered NATO an existential threat and putting Ukraine in NATO upped the ante

Duh

Realitybites said:

---

About that Ukrainian bridgehead (from the BBC)

""The entire river crossing is under constant fire. I've seen boats with my comrades on board just disappear into the water after being hit, lost forever to the Dnipro river."We must carry everything with us - generators, fuel and food. When you're setting up a bridgehead you need a lot of everything, but supplies weren't planned for this area."We thought after we made it there the enemy would flee and then we could calmly transport everything we needed, but it didn't turn out that way."When we arrived on the [eastern] bank, the enemy were waiting.They threw everything at us - artillery, mortars and flame thrower systems. I thought I'd never get out.""Every day we sat in the forest taking incoming fire. We were trapped - the roads and paths are all riddled with mines. The Russians cannot control everything, and we use it. But their drones are constantly buzzing in the air, ready to strike as soon as they see movement."Supplies were the weakest link. The Russians monitored our supply lines, so it became more difficult - there was a real lack of drinking water, despite our deliveries by boat and drone."We paid for a lot of our own kit - buying generators, power banks and warm clothes ourselves. Now the frosts are coming, things will only get worse - the real situation is being hushed up, so no-one will change anything."

---

The good news is that thousands of additional Ukrainian troops will arrive at the Dnieper by springtime. The bad news is that they'll be coming from the east and they won't stop to say hello.

Sam Lowry said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

About that Ukrainian bridgehead (from the BBC)

""The entire river crossing is under constant fire. I've seen boats with my comrades on board just disappear into the water after being hit, lost forever to the Dnipro river."We must carry everything with us - generators, fuel and food. When you're setting up a bridgehead you need a lot of everything, but supplies weren't planned for this area."We thought after we made it there the enemy would flee and then we could calmly transport everything we needed, but it didn't turn out that way."When we arrived on the [eastern] bank, the enemy were waiting.They threw everything at us - artillery, mortars and flame thrower systems. I thought I'd never get out.""Every day we sat in the forest taking incoming fire. We were trapped - the roads and paths are all riddled with mines. The Russians cannot control everything, and we use it. But their drones are constantly buzzing in the air, ready to strike as soon as they see movement."Supplies were the weakest link. The Russians monitored our supply lines, so it became more difficult - there was a real lack of drinking water, despite our deliveries by boat and drone."We paid for a lot of our own kit - buying generators, power banks and warm clothes ourselves. Now the frosts are coming, things will only get worse - the real situation is being hushed up, so no-one will change anything."

---

The good news is that thousands of additional Ukrainian troops will arrive at the Dnieper by springtime. The bad news is that they'll be coming from the east and they won't stop to say hello.

---

False, vatnik.

President Biden BLOCKED A PEACE DEAL. War was the plan the whole time. 20 bloody months later, who has benefited? Not the Ukranians. Not the American taxpayer. Only the defense contractors. #Kennedy24 https://t.co/FuYiSMPZjF

— Robert F. Kennedy Jr (@RobertKennedyJr) December 13, 2023

I have spoken to numerous Ukrainian government officials during my 18 months in Kyiv and not one has ever indicated there was a "peace deal on the table", nor is there any evidence one ever existed; it's a simple lie. https://t.co/Udj5cOLI5e

— Jimmy Rushton (@JimmySecUK) December 15, 2023

Bear8084 said:

---

I have spoken to numerous Ukrainian government officials during my 18 months in Kyiv and not one has ever indicated there was a "peace deal on the table", nor is there any evidence one ever existed; it's a simple lie. https://t.co/Udj5cOLI5e

— Jimmy Rushton (@JimmySecUK) December 15, 2023

---

1. Ukraine had a peace deal in Budapest. Russia ignored it. A piece of paper means nothign to them.
2. Putin has recently repudiated negotiations and wants to take over the entire country and purge it, like the genocide he has done in occupied territories.
3. No one sabotaged a…

— Randy Mott (@randymot4) December 15, 2023

Bear8084 said:

---

I have spoken to numerous Ukrainian government officials during my 18 months in Kyiv and not one has ever indicated there was a "peace deal on the table", nor is there any evidence one ever existed; it's a simple lie. https://t.co/Udj5cOLI5e

— Jimmy Rushton (@JimmySecUK) December 15, 2023

---

https://responsiblestatecraft.org/2022/09/02/diplomacy-watch-why-did-the-west-stop-a-peace-deal-in-ukraine/

https://www.businessinsider.com/israel-bennett-walks-back-claim-west-blocked-ukraine-russia-peace-deal-2023-2

https://www.thebulwark.com/no-the-united-states-and-its-allies-did-not-blow-up-a-ukraine-russia-peace-deal/

Putin reiterated his maximalist objectives for the Russian war in Ukraine during his annual press conference & “Direct Line” forum on Dec. 14, which he’s left somewhat vague to let him add more demands now or later. 🧵(1/6) https://t.co/agZyda8EMD pic.twitter.com/dHNcMJPtd3

— Institute for the Study of War (@TheStudyofWar) December 15, 2023